![]() |
![]() |
|
Home | Forums | Gallery | Webcams | Blogs | YouTube Channel | Classifieds | Calendar | Register | FAQ | Donate | Members List | Today's Posts | Search |
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
![]() |
#1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Weirs Beach, NH
Posts: 1,067
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
![]()
Snipped from APS's quote:
...as he piloted his boat with dual 435-horsepower engines down the lake... Its all in the spin baby! My point was more that we should not lay blame for this at the feet of the kind of vessel being operated in the dark by the drunk. Would the victims families feel better had Mr. LaPointe killed their loved ones with a 20' bow rider (thats still capable of 45 MPH without the dual 435-horsepower engines) going to fast and drunk? I doubt it.
__________________
Is it bikeweek yet? Now? |
![]() |
![]() |
#2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: I'm right here!
Posts: 1,153
Thanks: 9
Thanked 102 Times in 37 Posts
|
![]()
The latest on the Maine accident from the Sunjournal:
http://www.sunjournal.com/storyupdat...be3f407301#384 |
![]() |
![]() |
#3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 140
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
|
![]()
that link didn't work. here's the latest article on that from the sun journal.
http://www.sunjournal.com/search/story.php?ID=224592
__________________
"You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know" |
![]() |
![]() |
#4 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro
Posts: 5,938
Thanks: 2,205
Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
Would a human being with a 32-foot 90-MPH boat go for a spin only to kill two innocent boaters, toss a friend's teenaged daughter into pitch-black lake waters 1000 feet from shore, and have a driverless boat penetrate 132 feet into a shoreline lined with cabins? Maine law describes this boat as "a Deadly Weapon". Why would they allow such boats to operate on inland protected waters by sober operators? Quote:
Statistics...Production of Grieving Families by Boat Type in Local Collisions: Ocean-racers = 3 Bow riders = Zero |
||
![]() |
![]() |
#5 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,495
Thanks: 221
Thanked 812 Times in 488 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
The boat is an 80mph boat, not a 90mph boat. Having driven a few just like it, and quite possibly the same boat when it was at the dealer new, it is capable of 80-81mph under optimal conditions. Shall I dare ask where you pulled 90mph from??? Probably the same place many of your other stretches of the truth come from. ![]() The accident happened at 45mph according to the article I read, so why do you need to spin this further? Cars are capable of doing over 100mph, yet if an accident happens at 45mph does it get brought up that it is a 100mph car? Nope, just your spin on the situation. The guy was drinking and should not have been behind the wheel. The boat did not do it, the driver did. Boats do not drive themselves last time I checked. And had he been wearing his lanyard the kill switch would have shut the boat down when he was ejected which at least would have prevented the boat from continuing down the lake by itself. Another driver error. The "dead man" as they are called are there for a reason. I once slipped on a wet deck after hitting a wave and hit the floor, had I hit my head and not been wearing my lanyard my boat could have kept going in its path and killed someone. STOP BLAMING THE BOAT!!!!!!!! If I swerve into another car on the way home at 45mph and killed someone is it my SUV's fault? Unless there was a mechanical malfunction that caused it, it was my fault not the vehicle. If I was drinking? Still the driver. My 8600lb gvw behemoth can touch 100mph, should we bring it up that it is a deadly weapon and should be banned from the road??? Come on... |
|
![]() |
Sponsored Links |
|
![]() |
#6 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,985
Thanks: 246
Thanked 744 Times in 444 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
#7 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Gilmanton, NH
Posts: 754
Thanks: 136
Thanked 93 Times in 51 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
#8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Maynard, MA & Paugus Bay
Posts: 2,575
Thanks: 753
Thanked 354 Times in 266 Posts
|
![]()
Could not agree more with Codeman, it is not the boat it is the driver!
EVen if the boat was traveling at 10mph it coudl kill someone and not as far, but still runa ashore causing damage to cabins and the shoreline or possible hitting someone on a beach not paying attention. Probably going to start an argument here, but same with guns, guns do not kill people they are a weapon used by a person to kill something or anotehr person, something has to or be set up to pull a trigger! (by the way I do nto own a gun and thinks fights shoudl be settled with fists not weapons) So I guess the sailboat which does not really have a rated speed is a dealy weapon at least this boat had a kill switch(even though it was not used) to stop the boat in an emergency, if a sailboat captain gets thrown, what is there to stop the sailboat? THe "weapon" as it were called is not at fault, no those using the weapon, that is anotehr story, in your case blaming the boat would mean placing the actual thign behind bars or banning them because of a couple of boneheads, on all these threads I have read abotu how bad Go Fasts are, I never see teh research or numbers to back people arguments up. It is a simple case of I do not like them and think they are ridiculous therefore they should not be around. (another point - I do nto have a Go Fast boat nor do I want one, but I do not care what others do with their money, I have a 20 year old bow rider that I enjoy just as much as a Go Fast owner) |
![]() |
![]() |
#9 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Weirs Beach, NH
Posts: 1,067
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
![]() Quote:
Quote:
OK APS, lets say that capt drunkie didn't bring his horrible instrument of death to this little lake in Maine, but instead brought it off shore (where you claim it belongs anyway) and did the exact same thing (got drunk, operated too fast for the conditions and hit a smaller vessel killing 2 people and launching the boat onto shore). Do you feel better now that it happen on the ocean where this boat belongs? Or how about this. He leaves his horrible instrument of death home, borrows a buddies 20' bow rider on this small Maine lake, gets drunk and runs over a smaller vessel killing 2 people. Only this time, thanks to the smaller less powerful boat, the boat does not end up on shore. Still feel better? Or are you so entrenched in this mentality that these GFBL boats don't belong on YOUR lake that no argument will change your mind?
__________________
Is it bikeweek yet? Now? |
||
![]() |
![]() |
#10 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Pitman , NJ
Posts: 627
Thanks: 40
Thanked 21 Times in 12 Posts
|
![]()
For those who are narrow minded , with tunnel vision , keep in mind it's ALL this type of boats fault. We all know that a 20' bowrider won't operate at night at 45 mph with a drunk behind the wheel
![]() Anyone with half a mind can see through these twisted figures people are posting for their own agendas. Of course the half a mind part may eliminate a number of politicians ![]() ![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#11 | |||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro
Posts: 5,938
Thanks: 2,205
Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
Did anybody make a note that the accident-reporting law had changed the requirement from $500 damage to a new $2000 threshold in 2004? ![]() Now there's one sure-fire technique for New Hampshire—and the Coast Guard, using NH's statistics—to decrease the accident rate! What a great way to support "Unlimited Speeds"! ![]() Who quoted Mark Twain back then? ![]() Quote:
![]() Quote:
Big waves make for "stuffs", "hooks" and "flips". It's too salty, too many big things to collide with, makes the anchor dirty, there's toothy things to step on, the graphics get spotted, the salt causes unsightly deposits on the drive coolers, and you have to get knowledgeable about all that navigation stuff. Quote:
Quote:
The same 70-MPH maximum-speed zones are linked with a minimum speed—usually 45-MPH: this is to allow the driver time to brake to avoid a collision at high speed. Boats don't have brakes. There is no minimum speed for boats. Indeed, Maine invites boaters to anchor on Maine waters at night. What were they thinking? ![]()
__________________
Is it ![]() ![]() |
|||||
![]() |
![]() |
#12 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Weirs Beach, NH
Posts: 1,067
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
![]() Quote:
Drunk operator + ANY TYPE OF VESSEL (or car, or bike, or skateboard for that matter) = very bad things. Don't blame the boat.
__________________
Is it bikeweek yet? Now? |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#13 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,985
Thanks: 246
Thanked 744 Times in 444 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
Was the boat at fault in that story, or was it the skipper? ![]() I have a friend that was aboard a big sailboat that ran aground at night due to a gross navigational error and a crew member died in the accident. I have another friend who capsized a Daysailer on Squam Lake in October and came very close to dying of hypothermia before he and his buddies were rescued. People do dumb and dangerous things in sailboats too, I know I'm guilty of pushing sailboats too hard, bet you have done it too, it's fun, but it is dangerous. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#14 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dover, NH
Posts: 1,615
Thanks: 256
Thanked 514 Times in 182 Posts
|
![]()
If I just use this one particular story, from of all places Lake George, could I statistically declare "bow riders 1, ocean racers 0?".
Timesunion.com Section: Capital Region Page: B5 Date: Wednesday, May 31, 2006 Lake George boater dies from injuries in accident Ryan D. Winslow, 24, of Warrensburg, was piloting boat that hit diving board By LEIGH HORNBECK Staff writer Caption: Winslow A former high school football star from Warrensburg died Monday from injuries he suffered in a boat accident on Lake George over the weekend. Ryan D. Winslow, 24, had been piloting a 21-foot boat near Bolton Landing just before 2:30 a.m. Sunday when the boat struck a diving board extending from a dock, police said. The impact broke off a piece of the boat's metal tubing, which struck Winslow in the head. The vessel then ran aground. Winslow was a 1999 graduate of Warrensburg High School and hoped to return there as a football coach, said Mike Welch, his foot ball coach at Ithaca College. "I just sent in a recommendation to help him," Welch said. Winslow played defense at Ithaca. He would have made a good coach because his attitude was, "team comes first," Welch said. Winslow graduated summa cum laude in 2003 with a bachelor's of science degree in business. He worked for a while after college as a manager and recruiter at Abercrombie & Fitch in Manhattan and last year took a job in sales at Champlain Stone Ltd. in Warrensburg. "He was a beautiful young man," said Vandra Dagles, director of human resources at the quarrier. At the time of his death, Winslow worked in the projects department. Warren County Sheriff Larry Cleveland said he knows the Winslow family from growing up in Warrensburg. Winslow's father, Bryan Winslow, is a uniformed court officer in Warren County. "It's a wonderful family, they are nice people," Cleveland said. Police ruled Winslow's death an accident Tuesday after an autopsy found he suffered skull fractures and brain injuries due to blunt force trauma, Trooper Maureen Tuffey said. Three other people were in the boat with Winslow. A woman, who wasn't identified by authorities, suffered minor injuries. Tuffey also said State Police believe speed and alcohol led to Winslow's death because of evidence found at the accident scene and witnesses' statements. No arrests are expected, she said. Nah, I wouldn't do that...... |
![]() |
![]() |
#15 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Maynard, MA & Paugus Bay
Posts: 2,575
Thanks: 753
Thanked 354 Times in 266 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
And as far as the kayakers go last time I checked a person in a kayak in two feet swell is very easily not seen at night or in the day. The problem is it is not the boat it is the driver and that is the point trying to be made. I have a better change of being able to avoid a accident or anything at 45 than a sailboat does at the same speed. And please you speak about the close calls and accidents, Please show the stats! Lets not get into how a kayak or canoe that does not have lights on it should be on the lake in the first place at night. Granted two wrongs do not make a right. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#16 | |||||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro
Posts: 5,938
Thanks: 2,205
Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
![]() Quote:
Last line? "He died doing what he loved" For the victims of these two non-collisions, I'm saying "Live Free or Die", although Shane's family—and Ryan's—might not agree. It's when innocents get injured or killed that communities of families can be expected to express their outrage. Indeed, it is a citizen's duty to change things that go so wrong. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
Is it ![]() ![]() Last edited by ApS; 10-22-2007 at 04:33 PM. Reason: Tidy, and add missing URL which went AWOL. |
|||||
![]() |
![]() |
#17 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Weirs Beach, NH
Posts: 1,067
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
![]() Quote:
__________________
Is it bikeweek yet? Now? |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#18 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Eastern MA & Frye Island/Sebago Lake, Maine
Posts: 951
Thanks: 252
Thanked 351 Times in 158 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
http://pressherald.mainetoday.com/st...42600&ac=PHnws BT
__________________
" Live for today because yesterday is gone and tomorrow may never come" |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#19 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: I'm right here!
Posts: 1,153
Thanks: 9
Thanked 102 Times in 37 Posts
|
![]()
codeman671 wrote in response to APS
Quote:
HOWEVER... The link was NOT to a media site, it was to another forum and the poster quoted a media source but did not provide a link. Given what passes as fact on this forum I suspect that the original poster may have left out some facts and had an agenda of his/her own. The accident happened in KENTUCKY! So once again APS has to travel far and wide to find something to make his point. And since the Baja involved was a 23 foot boat, it would be hard for even APS to classify that boat as an "Ocean Racer"! And once again I will point out there are NO, ZERO, NONE, NADA Ocean Racers on Lake Winnipesaukee! APS wrote: Quote:
Second, Lovel Island is in Boston Harbor, not Center Harbor. Last I looked Lovel Island was about 100 miles away. (again APS has to travel afar to try to make a point) So are you know saying that everyone operating a Go Fast boat on Lake Winnipesaukee is a drug dealer and high on heroin? Regarding a possible speed limit on Lake Winnipesaukee. The Marine Patrol has issued it's report and that report repeatedly showed that the use of radar on the water, in a court of law, would not pass the muster. So at this point I say to the NH legislature, go ahead and pass the 45/25 law. It is unenforceable since the evidence needed to bring a case to trial (radar gun readings) will not and can not be admitted as true and factual! Of course this is an UNFUNDED MANDATE so that while radar boat crews of two or more MP officers are on each radar vessel, other boats will be tied up and unmanned and other patrol functions of the MP will be ignored. That means slower response time to calls about rafting in front of island property, slower reponse time to calls about cruisers making large wakes near shore and oh yeah, slower response time to ACTUAL EMERGENCY CALLS...but hey, they got their speed limit law and maybe over the course of an entire season, it might catch one or two boats going more than 45! Yay for them! |
||
![]() |
![]() |
#20 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,495
Thanks: 221
Thanked 812 Times in 488 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
The original post was in the morning and the edit was later in the day after my post. "Last edited by Acres per Second : 10-22-2007 at 05:33 PM. Reason: Tidy, and add missing URL which went AWOL." |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#21 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dover, NH
Posts: 1,615
Thanks: 256
Thanked 514 Times in 182 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#22 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Weirs Beach
Posts: 1,966
Thanks: 80
Thanked 980 Times in 440 Posts
|
![]()
This was in todays Boston Globe...
http://www.boston.com/news/local/mai..._deadly_crash/ Definitely going to be an interesting trial... I am very surprised the BAC was .11! Woodsy
__________________
The only way to eliminate ignorant behavior is through education. You can't fix stupid. |
![]() |
![]() |
#23 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Gilford
Posts: 148
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
#24 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 160
Thanks: 13
Thanked 25 Times in 20 Posts
|
![]()
From Fosters.com:
http://fosters.com/apps/pbcs.dll/art...S_01/100209781 I like the last sentence of the article. |
![]() |
![]() |
#25 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hopkinton NH
Posts: 395
Thanks: 88
Thanked 80 Times in 46 Posts
|
![]()
From the article linked above;
Quote:
__________________
Cancer SUCKS! ![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#26 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,495
Thanks: 221
Thanked 812 Times in 488 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
![]() |
#27 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Dover, NH
Posts: 1,615
Thanks: 256
Thanked 514 Times in 182 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
For an interesting explanation and pertinent examples of this, go to this wikipedia link and scroll down to the particular paragraphs explaining Data Manipulation. Thaks ApS for this text book example of Mark Twains often quoted observation: "There are lies, damn lies and then there are statistics!" ![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#28 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 5,075
Thanks: 215
Thanked 903 Times in 509 Posts
|
![]()
I guess it was time to "stir up the pot" again.Wonder what will be brewing in the next APS stew.I'm sure it will not be to my tastebuds liking.
__________________
SIKSUKR Last edited by SIKSUKR; 10-18-2007 at 02:08 PM. |
![]() |
![]() |
#29 | ||
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro
Posts: 5,938
Thanks: 2,205
Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
Quote:
The only possible control we—as boaters and responsible citizens—can exercise over drug and alcohol users is to threaten Lake Winnipesaukee users... 1) with increased insurance premiums (but too many remain afloat). 2) with jail (ineffective..."Call 1-800-DUI-LYRS-Free Case Review"). 3) by restricting those boats that have demonstrated low survivability rates whenever traumatically encountered (made necessary by their increasing frequency on protected inland waters). The Coasties have found heroin used by boaters on waters nearby. •Gather in groups of four or five. •Discuss the defense of impaired boaters behind the wheel of 4˝ ton ocean-racers. ![]() |
||
![]() |
![]() |
#30 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: NH
Posts: 2,689
Thanks: 33
Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts
|
![]()
So your proposed solution to drunk boaters is removal of boats that are dangerous when driven drunk?
And this will also help with heroin impaired boaters? Did you send this to MADD? They've been barking up the wrong tree all along. Instead of preventing drunk driving, all they had to do is get rid of cars that are dangerous when driven drunk. Do you think this will work with airplane pilots as well? How about astronauts? |
![]() |
![]() |
#31 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Gilmanton, NH
Posts: 754
Thanks: 136
Thanked 93 Times in 51 Posts
|
![]() Quote:
![]() |
|
![]() |
![]() |
#32 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Weirs Beach, NH
Posts: 1,067
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
|
![]() Quote:
![]() Here's a good idea. I am not a boater, don't own one or want one. I am however a swimmer. My right to swim anywhere I want to in your, err, our lake is seriously threatened by all the boats out there, regardless of size and horsepower. Therefore, I think its a good idea to ban boats from Winni altogether. After all, the first person in the lake didn't have a boat either....
__________________
Is it bikeweek yet? Now? |
|
![]() |
Bookmarks |
|
|