Signage

[NHKathy]

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed an abundance of digital, multicolored, flashing, LED signs in front of businesses in the area? It seems as though, all of a sudden, we are competing with Las Vegas!
What ever happened to the simple, wooden signs of yesteryear that look so normal in this area?

[Argie's Wife]

Driven thru Alton Bay lately? I can't remember the name of the biz but someone has a bright red LED display that flashes and scrolls - just loud as heck... I'm not against the LED displays, but I'd like to see something a little less spastic than that, maybe

[SIKSUKR]

And there you have the attraction to these signs.They WORK!They got your attention didn't they?

[rander7823]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

Driven thru Alton Bay lately? I can't remember the name of the biz but someone has a bright red LED display that flashes and scrolls - just loud as heck... I'm not against the LED displays, but I'd like to see something a little less spastic than that, maybe

That is their freedom to advertise their business and best of all it doesn't hurt anybody.

[SeaBass]

Neon lights like Vegas? Before you know it, they will be paving our dirt parking roads and lots........oooops already done. Anytime now they will be implementing frivilous laws........

I actually got a letter last week from a lawyer because when my A/C tried to kick on this year, it was occasionally making a "loud" noise. In the old days, my neighbors would of just came over and asked if I could do something about it. It is only a $200 A/C unit that was 5 years old. Needless to say, I threw it out.

What have we become?

Not sure if the area is turning into Las Vegas or New Yorseyachusetts.

Unfortunately, I am still a country boy at heart.

[fatlazyless]

The new electric sign in front of the main office of the Meredith Village Savings Bank has lighted up a proposed zoning ban by the five member Meredith select board by a vote of 4-1. On Tuesday, July 31, a town vote to approve/disapprove electric moving signs in Meredith is scheduled.

Got this info from the LaDaSun, last week or so. The article said that the five selectmen/woman have received complaints about the new yellow and black electric sign at the bank. By a vote of four to one, the selectboard voted in favor of the zoning change proposal which stops any more signs to be installed between now and the proposal becoming a zoning rule, if it does. Selectman Peter Brothers was the only vote against the proposed new zoning rule which is understandable since I believe he works for the bank, according to his past campaign info.

It seems likely to pass according to the LaDaSun info so it will be interesting to see what the bank does with their then grandfathered sign. Time will tell, it always does!

[Mee-n-Mac]

Hey, maybe they'll get Laconia to wake up ... hmmmm ? I've seen that revised Weirs Beach sign and man is it "loud". Perhaps they can write to Boston and have them do something about that big advertising monstrosity. I say "Time for the Citgo to go!" And now that I think about it, I've noticed the new "neon" blue lights on the Alton (and other) PD cars. Man are they bright and blue or what ! They've got to be causing some accidents.


As for the red sign in Alton ... yup it's bright. I wonder if the owner has ever thought of turning it off past 10 pm or so. Somehow I don't see it contributing to many sales by being on after such hours. Who shops for loam after 10 pm, I don't.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by SeaBass

"...Neon lights like Vegas? Before you know it, they will be paving our dirt parking roads and lots...

"I actually got a letter last week from a lawyer because when my A/C tried to kick on this year, it was occasionally making a "loud" noise. In the old days, my neighbors would of just came over and asked if I could do something about it. It is only a $200 A/C unit that was 5 years old. Needless to say, I threw it out..."

Too bad: you could have invited the lawyer over to listen during "Bike Month".

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

"...They WORK!They got your attention didn't they...?

Argie's Wife says she can't remember the name of the business: if the business goes unrecalled, is that sign "working"?

I saw a new one near Tamworth Village yesterday. Trying to read all of its message (which wasn't much and now totally lost on me) caused distraction from the business of driving in heavy rain.

Tourist traps in the South (especially around Disney World) have them. Some obnoxious-sign saleman must have traipsed through the area.

[Weirs guy]

Laconia's got some ordinance about 1 sign per day or something. I noticed it last summer when the new digital sign in front of the trustworthy hardware on union ave said "Sorry, town says 1 sign per day" for a few days.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by rander7823

That is their freedom to advertise their business and best of all it doesn't hurt anybody.

If it did any good I would have remembered the name of the business...

All I remember is it was a garish sight at 10pm and very out of place in this one-horse town.

(And I don't know about "freedom" to advertise - it's not... Last time I checked there's ordinances about these things and exceptions have to be made through the planning board. The new high school still has no message board because of red tape and trying to make the best descision and even the sign for the school had to go before the board for approval...)

[Paugus Bay Resident]

Weirs Guy is right, Trustworthy (Moe / Union Ave) went through hoops last year to allow their sign to be "automated". After a number of hearings, it was the one change per day rule. City council said no; too distracting,etc from what I recall. I guess Union Ave is a lot more pristine than the Weirs since the Weirs signs can change 1 time per second

Maybe because they're in different wards?

Anyway, my biggest complaint is the lighting on the mini golf course in the Weirs. Its blinding when boating through the channel. At least after some complaints, they toned down the floodlights on Rte 3.

[rander7823]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

If it did any good I would have remembered the name of the business...

All I remember is it was a garish sight at 10pm and very out of place in this one-horse town.

(And I don't know about "freedom" to advertise - it's not... Last time I checked there's ordinances about these things and exceptions have to be made through the planning board. The new high school still has no message board because of red tape and trying to make the best descision and even the sign for the school had to go before the board for approval...)

So I get it now...these ordinances that impinge on their freedom of speech are okay but one's that don't allow smoking aren't okay.....hmmmmm

[Paugus Bay Resident]

So I get it now...these ordinances that impinge on their freedom of speech are okay but one's that don't allowing smoking aren't okay.....hmmmmm

I guess the main difference is that these are local ordinances by the planning and zoning boards and can be changed. You can get a variance which is something you can't do if you own a restaurant and want to allow smoking (unless you wanted to throw a ton of money and time at it).

I'm personally a little more "market driven" and would rather consumers (read $$$) take care of all this. I express my feelings to establishments that do things that bother me. If enough people do, hopefully they change. If I'm in the minority, I have to live with it.

BTW - personally I don't find these signs very effective (kind of like a loud commercial on TV) but that's me.

[wildwoodfam]

[QUOTE=SeaBass]

Not sure if the area is turning into Las Vegas or New Yorseyachusetts.

I know its mostly in good fun and humor - but it does get borish and tiresome.

Honestly - why is it we cannot seem to get through a thread without comparing New Hampshire to some other state - is it just possible that New Hampshire is just plain and simply - New Hampshire and does these things because it is New Hampshire? How does Neon signage and big box stores make it New York, New Jersey or Massachusetts problem or fault??

IT'S CALLED PROGRESS / MODERNIZATION / UPGRADING and KEEPING UP WITH THE JONES'!

I for one and glad to see that when I make the trip to New Hampshire - there are shopping centers now - because I used to hate having to drive for miles and mile for gas and a gallon of milk from the IGA.

There are still places in New Yorseyachusettavadafornia that are MORE rural than some places in NH.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by rander7823

So I get it now...these ordinances that impinge on their freedom of speech are okay but one's that don't allow smoking aren't okay.....hmmmmm

Tell me this, HOW does limiting the size of the sign and the wattage "impinge" on someone's freedom of speech?

And about the smoking comment - take your comments to the appropriate thread and debate them there, if you wish to go to task with me and the others who disagree with your logic there. I was kinder to you about your comment there than others were or could be and respectfully disagreed with you. The sign won't endanger anyone's health either - but could just be a blemish to the landscape. Big difference - if you think about it. Please tell me you're not really placing those on the same level? C'mon...

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

...Tell me this, HOW does limiting the size of the sign and the wattage "impinge" on someone's freedom of speech?...

You're right, it doesn't.

As far back as 1926 the courts have upheld zoning as a constitutional excercise of government's so called "police powers".

Anyway, the first real case that substantiated modern zoning regulations, including the eventual right to regulate signage, can be found in Euclid v. Amber Realty (272 US 365, 1926).

Methinks someone is honing their skills as a troll.....

Skip

[mcdude]

sorry NHKATHY!!!! I couldn't help it....I swear!

[fatlazyless]

Laconia Daily Sun, June 5 2007, by Micheal Kitch, starts at the bottom of the front page...

Selectmen defend need for special town meeting for sign amendment

MEREDITH - Although resident Phil McGowan said that he was "dumbfounded" and "miffed," the Board of Selectmen yesterday staunchly defended the decision to hold a special town meeting to present an amendment to the zoning ordinance that would outlaw all electronic signs througout the town to the voters.
McGowan told the board that he documented only three complaints - one written and two verbal - lodged with the Planning Department about the sign erected by Meredith Village Savings Bank, which sparked the call for the special town meeting. He alo alleged that "the business community was not well represented at the public hearing that was held on the matter."
"The way this is being handled is totally amazing," McGowan continued, asking the approximate cost of holding a special town meeting.
Selectman Bob Flanders countered that "all the selectmen and members of the Planning Board received complaints. It's just not factual to say the business community was not well represented," he said, reminding McGowan that the Mills Falls Association, Greater Meredith program and Hampshire Hospitality Holdings were all represented.
McGowan said that the complaints about electronic signs amounted to less than one-percent of the some 1000 commercial properties in town. "Less than one-percent shouldn't be enough to justify a special town meeting," he said. "If it was ten-percent, we'd have to give it some thought. But, I'm dumbfounded and I'm looking for answers."
Selectman Colette Worseman told McGowan that she shared his concern about the numbers, but said that "we're trying hard to be pro-active and protect the town. Our property values depend on how we appear," she remarked. "We saw something like a train coming down the track and picking up speed," she added, alluding to the growing number of applications for electronic signs.
"We'd take 30 years of hard work and flush it away by doing nothing," Flanders agreed.
Town Manager Carol Granfield assured McGowan that apart from the time of those involved in conducting the special town meeting, there are "no additional costs." She explained that there would be no deliberative session, only a vote by paper ballot on the proposed change to the zoning ordinance. By not using a machine ballot, Granfield said, the town spared itself $450. The special town meeting will be held on July 31.
.................................................. ...

Thanks very much to Laconia Daily Sun and Michael Kitch.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

And there you have the attraction to these signs.They WORK!They got your attention didn't they?

Child beating gets my attention too. Neither leaves a favorable impression.

ok, that may be a bit extreem, you get the point.

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by RI Swamp Yankee

Child beating gets my attention too. Neither leaves a favorable impression.

ok, that may be a bit extreem, you get the point.

I'm not taking either side on the issue,just pointing out that they get your attention which is what they are designed to do.If your trying to make a point about how offensive these signs are,your point gets lost because that has to be one of the worst analogies I have ever heard.

[Weirs guy]

I think the answer to your question PBR has less to do with wards and more to do with not getting caught yet. Then again, Laconia tends to forget about us until tax season...

Seems to me there are bigger fish for government to fry then this.

[NHKathy]

Originally Posted by mcdude

sorry NHKATHY!!!! I couldn't help it....I swear!

McDude - LOL!
I don't mind the Weirs Sign!! I love this sign!
I mean these digital "TV commercial" type signs that have been popping up all over.


Originally posted by:
PB Resident:
"BTW - personally I don't find these signs very effective
(kind of like a loud commercial on TV) but that's me."


I agree!!

[Gavia immer]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Honestly - why is it we cannot seem to get through a thread without comparing New Hampshire to some other state - is it just possible that New Hampshire is just plain and simply - New Hampshire and does these things because it is New Hampshire? How does Neon signage and big box stores make it New York, New Jersey or Massachusetts problem or fault??

IT'S CALLED PROGRESS / MODERNIZATION / UPGRADING and KEEPING UP WITH THE JONES'!

To get here, you followed the state road sign that reads, "New Hampshire Lakes and Mountains", right? New Hampshire doesn't need any more "honky-tonk" to insinuate onto its scenic lakes and mountains, that's all.

[ITD]

Personally I don't like these signs. Too honky tonk and definately out of place in an area like the Lakes Region. I find it funny that the businesses that benefit most from the quaintness and simplicity of the region, the real estate business, seem to be the most prolific with these signs. Drive up route 125 in Plaistow if you want to see these signs at their worst. I hope the towns surrounding the lakes zone these signs out of existence. If not, the Milky Way will slowly fade away from the night sky.

[fatlazyless]

Those were some pretty strong statements from two Meredith Selectmen-woman. "Let's not flush 30 years of hard work away" and " We saw a freight train coming at us down the track with other businesses lining up to get a moving message sign."

Good for the Selectmen-woman in getting in on this local sign disease at the outbreak, before it spreads too bad.

Reminds me of a takeoff on the lyrics from the The Music Man song, 'Ya got trouble.' Ya got trouble right here in Meredith, I tell ya, ya got trouble, and it's spelled M-O-V-I-N-G S-I-G-N-S and yes, we got them right here in this town I tell ya, and by God we got trouble with these here M-O-V-i-N-G S-I-G-N-S, yes sir!

....next verse?

[ITD]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Those were some pretty strong statements from two Meredith Selectmen-woman. "Let's not flush 30 years of hard work away" and " We saw a freight train coming at us down the track with other businesses lining up to get a moving message sign."

Good for the Selectmen-woman in getting in on this local sign disease at the outbreak, before it spreads too bad.

Reminds me of a takeoff on the lyrics from the The Music Man song, 'Ya got trouble.' Ya got trouble right here in Meredith, I tell ya, ya got trouble, and it's spelled M-O-V-I-N-G S-I-G-N-S and yes, we got them right here in this town I tell ya, and by God we got trouble with these here M-O-V-i-N-G S-I-G-N-S, yes sir!

....next verse?

Mothers of Meredith City!
Heed the warning before it's too late!
Watch for the tell-tale sign of Neon and Fluorescent!
The moment your son leaves the house,
Does he rebuckle his knickerbockers below the knee?
Is he blinded by the stream of marketing drib?

[ApS]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

"...I for one and glad to see that when I make the trip to New Hampshire - there are shopping centers now - because I used to hate having to drive for miles and mile for gas and a gallon of milk from the IGA.

Drive? For one gallon of milk? I stopped driving to the Post Office to buy one stamp decades ago!

Shopping centers (and worse—mini-storage centers) bring deforestation and uncontrolled petroleum-laden runoff to the Winnipesaukee Basin.

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

There are still places in New Yorseyachusettavadafornia that are MORE rural than some places in NH.

Only New Jersey is a smaller state (than New Hampshire) and has a population density greater than China!

Those states that are losing their native populations (like Massachusetts) shouldn't be allowed to affect New Hampshire to the point of diminishing any part of New Hampshire's natural beauty—including flashy signage. So I support zoning for limiting sign advertising.

Say...look at Wolfeboro!

Their sign ordinances have resulted in carved wood signs—including one with a highlighted gold-leaf motif over the front door of the downtown hardware store!

Classy.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

....,your point gets lost because that has to be one of the worst analogies I have ever heard.

You are quite right, it is one of the worst.

The point being that while it may get my attention, the impression of the displayer is usually not favorable, ie. I would probably do business elsewhere. .... on the other hand, if someone were to put an airplane on the roof ....

[Pepper]

I have to admit that personally I hate these new high-powered changeable signs. Although I understand a business needing to get their message out, I find it truly impossible to "get the message" while I'm focusing on driving! For the horrendous expense of these signs I think they're not necessarily getting the best bang for that buck!

WG and PBR - there is apparently a difference in zoning between Weirs Beach and Union Avenue, which allows the businesses in the Weirs to have their messages change in rotation, while the businesses on Union Ave. like Trustworthy Hardware, Mike's Quality Car Care, and Belknap Tire must limit themselves to one message per day. In all honesty I think the folks on Union Avenue probably get their message seen by far more people purely by virture of the fact that it's there long enough to absorb it while you're driving by. As proof, I can recall that Trustworthy has Cow Manure Fertilizer on sale, and that they were closed last Monday in honor of Memorial Day; Mike's Quality Car Care will help you out even if you don't have an appointment - just drive up the hill; and Belknap Tire is soon to welcome VanWorks Car Audio! (plus they had a really nice message on their board for Easter - Kudo's to them!) Conversely, I cannot tell you a single message that I remember from any of the flashing signs I've passed recently.

So in the end, perhaps we'll begin to see these wildly expensive signs be reduced to slower messages - if for no other reason than to give the passers-by a chance to see it.

Meanwhile, Gene might just be onto something ... it has been pretty effective!

[Nauset]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Those states that are losing their native populations (like Massachusetts) shouldn't be allowed to affect New Hampshire to the point of diminishing any part of New Hampshire's natural beauty—including flashy signage. So I support zoning for limiting sign advertising.

Acres, I have lived in Massachusetts for 45 years and been driving to the lakes region for decades and have never seen one of those obnoxious signs till I cross into New Hampshire. I’m not sure how Massachusetts is affecting New Hampshire’s natural beauty.

Turning off the highway into Tilton at night is like driving through a carnival. I personally think those flashing signs greatly reduce the beauty of the state and are a form of pollution in the area. The next thing will be loud speakers with pre-recorded messages to get your attention. I’m all for freedom to advertise but if I choose to look the other way I can still see the light reflecting off everything around. We spend nights on the Weirs Channel and can see the two flashing signs from Thurston’s and Channel Marine flashing all night reflecting off everything in the area. Often times when looking out a window at night my first thought is there is an accident on the bridge, then I realize it is just the flashing signs.

[Weirs guy]

As a follow up to Peppers statement, people at the Weirs I would imagine have more time to read more info on these signs (walking the boardwalk, stopped in traffic, ect.) then those driving by on Union Ave., hence more messages allowed? I'm not in love with the signs, but I'm not in love with the non-electric-flashing versions either. Of course, if I owned a business and didn't feel like paying someone to change a sign.....

The modernization of the area is a double edged sword. Yes, we're getting that urban sprawl feel. But, I don't have to drive 45 minutes to go to Lowes or Wal-Mart either. Those of us here year round must find that appealing even if we have to deal with the other inconvenices they bring.

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by Gavia immer

To get here, you followed the state road sign that reads, "New Hampshire Lakes and Mountains", right? New Hampshire doesn't need any more "honky-tonk" to insinuate onto its scenic lakes and mountains, that's all.

I live in Mass - yes - been here all my life - and have spent almost every summer at Winnipesaukee. I have to say the ONLY place I see HONKY TONK is Hampton Beach and Weirs Beach...hmmm....BOTH IN NH! Only place I see these gawd awful neon flashing signs and the new video signage is in - yes indeed DING DING DING --- NH!!

Honky Tonk - can I pull an Obi Wan moment please - "Now thats a name I havent heard in a long long time...." In fact my Dad uses it when he describes - yep right again - WEIRS BEACH ... "Hey dad we are taking the boat over to the Weirs." His reply - "That honky tonk place?! You can have it."

Anyway - I have yet to see these signs that folks in NH are complaining about in MASS.

As for my drive to the lake - no signs saying Lakes and Mountains, thats route 95 - on 93 its signs for: Manchester - Boston Airport, Verizon Center, Steeplechase Mall, etc etc etc until I get the "quiet" village of TILTON and its famous traditional New England SHOPPING OUTLETS - nope no signs for Lakes and Mountains when I come up - my friend - but at night I just follow the lights - glowing on the horizon - sadly - I can see more stars here at home in Haverhill than I can when I venture to parts of the lake....

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

Drive? For one gallon of milk? I stopped driving to the Post Office to buy one stamp decades ago!

Not sure what Milk and one stamp have to do with each other.

Shopping centers (and worse—mini-storage centers) bring deforestation and uncontrolled petroleum-laden runoff to the Winnipesaukee Basin.

Actually much of the deforestation around the lake is CONDO and McMansion building - I am not sure i have seen ANY shopping centers right on the lake or mini storage centers for that matter.

Only New Jersey is a smaller state (than New Hampshire) and has a population density greater than China!

Still has some pretty rural areas - which was my point, not population.

Those states that are losing their native populations (like Massachusetts) shouldn't be allowed to affect New Hampshire to the point of diminishing any part of New Hampshire's natural beauty—including flashy signage. So I support zoning for limiting sign advertising.

Again - as stated in my previous post - haven't seen any of these INFAMOUS and NOTORIOUS signs in Mass ONLY IN NH. SO How does that make it MA's fault? As far as native fleeing Mass - Join Vermont and cede from the union - then put up a fence! They are having a sale in Texas on fencing!!

Say...look at Wolfeboro! Say - Look at Andover MA, North Andover MA, Concord MA, Belmont MA, Chatham MA, Haverhill MA, no neon signage here!!

Their sign ordinances have resulted in carved wood signs—including one with a highlighted gold-leaf motif over the front door of the downtown hardware store!

Classy.

SASSY

[ApS]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Not sure what Milk and one stamp have to do with each other.

Buy two gallons. Buy fifty stamps.

Prior to the gas price increases, driving the family car costs $.50 per mile, average. Today, Mom and Pop stores aren't a bad deal—they offer next-door convenience and keep the cozy New Hampshire character that brought many of us here in the first place.

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Actually much of the deforestation around the lake is CONDO and McMansion building - I am not sure i have seen ANY shopping centers right on the lake or mini storage centers for that matter

Hence the word basin. Everything in the Winnipesaukee Basin drains into our lakes and aquifers.

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Still has some pretty rural areas - which was my point, not population

New Jersey isn't "all I-95 and refineries"—I agree; but compare NJ's "wild" areas with NH's "wild" areas.

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

SO How does that make it MA's fault?

...and...

Originally Posted by Nauset

Acres, I have lived in Massachusetts for 45 years and been driving to the lakes region for decades and have never seen one of those obnoxious signs till I cross into New Hampshire. I’m not sure how Massachusetts is affecting New Hampshire’s natural beauty.

1) That Weirs sign (a Winnipesaukee-welcome for many folks, I understand ) went up before I-93 went in. Massachusetts was a far, far, bigger player before the Interstates.

2) The obnoxious signs (and honky-tonk) are designed to attract the attention of new customers: license plates from which state are most commonly seen?

(Besides Florida, that is. )

[fatlazyless]

Golly-gee-willikers, Barlo Signs has a large pickup truck with a large moving electric sign board positioned at the Meredith Town Docks that does all sorts of moving graphics.....wow! It was touting Progressive Insurance when I drove past. Hopefully, the police will not shoo it away, and it stays there all week. It really looks out of place. Compared to this, the bank's sign, which has not been a mover-groover-shaker, is very tame and well mannered. For bike week, what the heck...

If you google 'Barlo signs free speech' you see that Barlo likes to litigate their business interests in regard to commercial free speech in New Hampshire.

[DREAMS]

That takes the cake! Since when have the minimal parking spaces for residents, visitors and vacationers dedicated to local commercial business using these spots to advertising their business for free on town property?
Many times the lack of spaces force people to move on and prevent their ability to stop and enjoy the lakeside area and support local businesses depending on these customers. Barlo Sign or any other company should not be taking put village parking spaces designated to "paying customers" who help support our tourism and recreational markets!

[Lakegeezer]

Rumor has it that sensors 100 yards from the signs can read your EZPass ID and tap into your Internet searching to pick an appropriate ad as you drive by.

[wildwoodfam]

2) The obnoxious signs (and honky-tonk) are designed to attract the attention of new customers: license plates from which state are most commonly seen?

[B]If all you do is complain once we get there![B] I dont disagree that there are a lot of tourists from Mass in NH - thats why they call them TOURISTS!!! Its good for your economy - makes up for your lack of a state income tax! An aside - I see as many NH plates on 93 in the morning and afternoon making their way to and from employment in Boston, as I do MASS plates at the Weirs.

Bottom line - I don't see how you can point fingers at Mass and other states for NH's bad judgement when it comes to ZONING laws and ordinance shortsightedness!! Thats why you have ugly signs, mini-storage units - shopping centers, etc etc etc...has NOTHING to do with MASS. As a matter of fact - here in Haverhill MASS we have an ordinance on signage - perhaps that might be something NH WOULD WANT TO COPY!

[SteveA]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

Rumor has it that sensors 100 yards from the signs can read your EZPass ID and tap into your Internet searching to pick an appropriate ad as you drive by.

LG may have not be too way out with his attempt at humor... check this out

http://www.engadget.com/2007/06/10/g...ite-marketers/

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

I live in Mass - yes - been here all my life - and have spent almost every summer at Winnipesaukee. I have to say the ONLY place I see HONKY TONK is Hampton Beach and Weirs Beach...hmmm....BOTH IN NH!

You must be joking.Have you been to Salsbury beach?

Only place I see these gawd awful neon flashing signs and the new video signage is in - yes indeed DING DING DING --- NH!!

Your kidding again right?Only in NH?Have you never been on Rt 1 in Saugus?Maybe living in the border town of Haverhill you spend most of your time in NH.

Anyway - I have yet to see these signs that folks in NH are complaining about in MASS.


rolleye2:

I think you need to look around your own state.

[Skip]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

I think you need to look around your own state.

Kind of got a good chuckle when I read your retort this morning.

Why?

When I went in to work this morning there were several Sunday papers still kicking around the office. The first one on the top of the pile quickly caught my eye. The above the fold story on the front page?

Why, it was a full article deploring the tacky signs covering a City and the apparent lack of enforcement of current sign policies.

New Hampshire community, New Hampshire paper?

Nope....

It was the Sunday Eagle-Tribune and the community was the City of Haverhill, MA !!!!

It appears tacky signage is indeed an interstate problem!

[SAMIAM]

I'm surprised at the "outrage" over these signs.It is simply a matter of improving technology just as tv's phones ,computers,automobiles etc. improve over the years.I'm sure that the same people would have been horrified when electricity was invented and the first sign was lit up at night.Then came the dreaded internally lit signs back in the 1920's and sometime later neon signs came along to ruin our lives.
Relax everybody....take a deep breath....business' need signs.They are all in commercially zoned areas.If one shows up next to your lake house....you have a good reason to complain.
I know it would be nice if every business had a 12"X12" carved wood sign but they just don't seem to work very well in the highly competitive world of business.

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

I think you need to look around your own state.

SAUGUS?!? I hardly consider there to be a link between Saugus and Lake Winnipesaukee. Though come to think of it - Weirs Beach and Laconia do sort of remind me of Saugus! HA! If you want to do a comparison - lets look at some of our resort locations in MASS - The Berkshires of course - no neon out there! Then there are the towns like Chatham, Dennis, Hyannis, etc...anywhere on Cape really, Salisbury Beach since someone brought it up - is in its final stages of its arcade/honky tonk life - and is becoming "wooden signed" to its death. There is only ONE road with any kind of flashing lights - right in the center - and that will be gone within a couple years, much like its counterparts along the coast. Nantasket Beach - Gone - Revere Beach - gone - Mass is becoming "Wood Carved" while our neighbor to the north goes NEON!!

As for Haverhill - the problem in Haverhill is not NEON signs - its paper signs being posted on more than 25% of their window space in convenience store windows - again - APPLES AND ORANGES - and if you read the article instead of skimming it you will see there is an ordinance in place that the council wants enforced. No NEON or FLASHY Signs - even the Starbucks on 125 has a Wooden Carved sign - NOW drive 100 yards north and cross into NH and thats a different story!

Get back to the main and original point - since we have drifted so far away from it....Signage in NH is not the fault of any other community - which was my original post. It is the fault of those who serve NH on councils and chambers. Lets face it - those are the facts. If you dont like the changes - go to Town Meetings, vote city councilmen off the boards and complain to the Chambers of Commerce.

As for me spending time in NH - of course I do - what with all the conveniences and SERVICES in lower taxed Haverhill with the tax free shopping a stones throw away - who wouldn't do that!

[Skip]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

...As for Haverhill - the problem in Haverhill is not NEON signs - its paper signs being posted on more than 25% of their window space in convenience store windows - again - APPLES AND ORANGES - and if you read the article instead of skimming it you will see there is an ordinance in place that the council wants enforced. No NEON or FLASHY Signs - even the Starbucks on 125 has a Wooden Carved sign - NOW drive 100 yards north and cross into NH and thats a different story!...

Actually I did read the entire store. And I will reiterate that I find it extremely humorous to be lectured about tacky signage from a resident of a community that is struggling with tacky signage!

You tell us that we have created our own problem by lacking theforesight to have the proper ordinances in effect to discourage what you deem as inappropriate, yet your own home town which has such ordinances fails to enforce same!

I am not a fan of the LED signs in question, but if they are legal in the communities in question then so be it. But I did find the photo that I "skimmed" over in the Eagle Tribune of an offending Haverhill storefront to be much more offensive then any LED sign I have recently come across in New Hampshire.

But then again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder!

Best of luck in getting your sign ordinances enforced down in Haverhill and getting all those nasty store fronts cleaned up!

[Weirs guy]

Just for the record the Weirs itself (Laconia doesn't count in this vote, or any other for me) has a total of 4 of those "horrible, baby-seal-clubbing neon signs" (Funspot, Logs o` Fun, Thurstons and the Weirs Beach sign itself). The rest of the honky tonk is nicely wooden signed.

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by Skip

Actually I did read the entire store. And I will reiterate that I find it extremely humorous to be lectured who is lecturing who?about tacky signage from a resident of a community that is struggling with tacky signage! Not a community - a neighborhood. Haverhill as a community is not struggling with tacky signage - one city councilor - ONE - city councilor has taken issue with it - and it is in ONE district neighborhood. Not a tourist haven by any stretch. Those areas have signage regulation enforcement because Haverhill wants to attract outsiders! End of that topic.

I am not a fan of the LED signs in question, but if they are legal in the communities in question then so be it. But I did find the photo that I "skimmed" over in the Eagle Tribune of an offending Haverhill storefront to be much more offensive then any LED sign I have recently come across in New Hampshire.

Then you have never driven through Laconia or Rochester or even your hometown of Dover lately! Just drive up route 11 from 16 to Alton Bay - and you'll see plenty of convenience stores with tacky signage and cheesey advertising like the store pictured in the Tribune.

But then again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder!

[B]This beholder tends to avoid THAT section of Haverhill - as it is a neighborhood. Not a tourist attraction like Lake Winnipesaukee. Speaking of Lake Winnipesaukee - The point of the original post was the corruption of the LAKES REGION due to LED Signage!B]

Best of luck in getting your sign ordinances enforced down in Haverhill and getting all those nasty store fronts cleaned up!

Again, it's one neighborhood and one city councilor's rallying cry - not a city wide dillema nor is it a concern for me or my neighbors in this community.

Lets go back to the original post --- about LED signs in the LAKES REGION....and my concern that there was blame being laid at the foot of "other states" which I found unfounded, unnecessary and unproductive.

[mets3007]

The LED signs dont bother me when I visit there each summer, they do their job as attention getters for the tourists and thats why they are there.I remember the Funspot one was changed 2 yrs ago I remember reading that the LED sign is cheaper to run than the old digital sign energy cost wise ( this was in one of the papers could have been Bob Lawton's own Weirs Times I dont remember). Other signs have been added to businesses ( Patricks, Logs Of Fun. Thurston's Marina) their purpose is to get the attnetion of the tourist to the business and thats the future of the area is going to be, since the use of modern technolgy is going to be the future wave of business, they save energy costs and no bulbs have to be replaced. I do indeed look at the signs when I pass by them and thats the purpose of them, is to attract tourists to that location and by having the signs that are bright and move people will look and therefore some people might go there because they like what they see, but some people might not, but they will indeed look. This is an annoyance for people who live there and have to see them everyday, but I can also see the business side of it, as in Field of Dreams " If you build it they will come" this motto is " If you attract them they will come" as the people will be attracted by the signs that move more than old wooden signs because the movement and the brightness of the colors is more attractive than words on a wooden sign, I can see why they are being used to bring in more customers which is the number one job for a business. I am neutral on it because they can being annoying but also do their job as attacting businesses.

ps sry for long post

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Weirs guy

Just for the record the Weirs itself (Laconia doesn't count in this vote, or any other for me) has a total of 4 of those "horrible, baby-seal-clubbing neon signs" (Funspot, Logs o` Fun, Thurstons and the Weirs Beach sign itself). The rest of the honky tonk is nicely wooden signed.

I think Channel marine has one too, next to Thurstons on the main drag.

[Ropetow]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

SAUGUS?!? Then there are the towns like Chatham, Dennis, Hyannis, etc...anywhere on Cape really,

Have you been down Route 28 or 132 lately in the Yamouth / Hyannis area? Not tacky?????

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by Ropetow

Have you been down Route 28 or 132 lately in the Yamouth / Hyannis area? Not tacky?????

not really - not tacky anyway - overbuilt for sure - but there is a difference - I would not consider it "honky tonk" - nothing like the Lynn - Saugus stretch of route 1!! But I tend to avoid that section of Hyannis anyway - I prefer to hang around the compound!

Besides - whats a Republican like yourself doing driving around in Hyannis?!

[Ropetow]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Besides - whats a Republican like yourself doing driving around in Hyannis?!

Slumming!
Or, opposition-research
As they say in Hyannisport, "We'll drive off that bridge when we get to it..."

[wildwoodfam]

[QUOTE=Ropetow]Slumming!

in Kennebunkport!

And as they say in Maine - "the only bushes we like in Maine are the sea-rose bushes!"

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

SAUGUS?!? I hardly consider there to be a link between Saugus and Lake Winnipesaukee.

That was in reference to YOUR statement which was as follows "Anyway - I have yet to see these signs that folks in NH are complaining about in MASS"

I hardly consider Saugus part of any other state.I'm done posting to an obvious troller.

[wildwoodfam]

Always nice to see words get twisted to fit arguments on the forum. Anyway - I would have been done with this a long time agao - but needed to keep trying to bring the conversation back to its original points - LED signs at the Lake and how that WASN'T Massachusetts or any other states problem.

You are correct - Saugus is certainly in Mass - I don't get to Saugus - nothing to see there - and thus - my statement - "I have yet to see these signs...in Mass." Also - Saugus is certainly NOT a tourist destination - which is why I stated there was no connection to what Saugus does and what Winnipesaukee does - if that were the case - one would not have to look much further than Manchester NH or Concord NH to draw observable comparisons to the signage issue. Anyway - having been called a troll - - which is disappointing considering my length of time posting to this forum, I have to question the objectivity of some of you folks on this site.

Certainly is friendly - so long as you agree on the issues!

[Weirs guy]

Originally Posted by ITD

I think Channel marine has one too, next to Thurstons on the main drag.

I can't count the 2 as 1? Dang it! Thanks ITD, its 5.

I think I'm installing one next week on the house though that will scroll through each forum thread here with a few roman candles mounted to it!

[SIKSUKR]

Whatever .

[jellybean]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

All I remember is it was a garish sight at 10pm and very out of place in this one-horse town.

(... Last time I checked there's ordinances about these things and exceptions have to be made through the planning board. The new high school still has no message board because of red tape and trying to make the best descision and even the sign for the school had to go before the board for approval...)

Argie's, I could be wrong, but I believe that sign belongs to Scott Williams, a new member of the PLANNING BOARD! I have also noticed it, as it is really out of place in our town, particularly in the Bay. And I think we do have a sign ordinance of some kind, but perhaps it applies only to new construction/structures and not to existing signposts.

[Argie's Wife]

For real?

Interesting...

I have a business in my home and when I checked into placing a simple shingle up, I was told "no way!" because I wasn't in zoning for a business. Yet, there's many, many people up the street from me (within 0.25 miles of my front door) who are within the same zoninig and yet they do have a sign up. They are most certainly residences with businesses - like mine. I never said "boo" about it - it wasn't worth the battle.

Silly me... I shoulda just put the sign up and said nothing because apparently they don't enforce the laws once the deed is done...

[fatlazyless]

Well, maybe after the Meredith special town meeting and July 31 vote, the selectmen-woman will create a new ordinance to regulate the electric moving signs.

And maybe, the NH sign business group will try to stop a proposed ordinance as an infringement on commercial free speech.

To see how it played out earlier this year. enter Barlo Signs Concord NH into a search engine.

....maybe, maybe, maybe!

[wildwoodfam]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

Silly me... I shoulda just put the sign up and said nothing because apparently they don't enforce the laws once the deed is done...

This is one of those moments where ... "It is better to do the deed and have to then apologize for it than to ask and be told NO!"

[SIKSUKR]

I'm in total agreement with you on that post Wildwood.

[Skipper of the Sea Que]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

SAUGUS?!? I hardly consider there to be a link between Saugus and Lake Winnipesaukee. Though come to think of it - Weirs Beach and Laconia do sort of remind me of Saugus! HA!

Come on now. There's no neon cactus or plastic cows around Winnie are there? Route 1 Saugus has really exploded since I was a youngster but it is still special. Home to the Kowloon Restaurant, Leaning Tower of Pizza, Kelly's Roast Beef (the Saugus store was built to be the Taj Mahal of Fast Food), the former Adventure Car Hop and so much more.

There are many of us former Saugonians on the forum and around the Lake but there is more. I do believe there is a real connection between the two places. I vaguely remember a discussion on the forum regarding Cannonballs manufactured around the Lake made from Iron from the Saugus Ironworks. Hopefully one of our historians can find some info on that connection.

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

Also - Saugus is certainly NOT a tourist destination - which is why I stated there was no connection to what Saugus does and what Winnipesaukee does -

Not a tourist destination?
Historic Parks, Saugus
Or see what the National Park Service has to say about that: Saugus
Or teach your children about the Saugus Natural Treasure with this course: P U B

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Skipper of the Sea Que

Come on now... Not a tourist destination?
Historic Parks, Saugus
Or see what the National Park Service has to say about that: Saugus
Or teach your children about the Saugus Natural Treasure with this course: P U B

Come on now yourself Al!

Who are you to interrupt this friendly debate with the facts???!!!

[wildwoodfam]

Sorry Skip (and Skipper) - could not resist pointing out the irony of the posted picture!

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by wildwoodfam

This is one of those moments where ... "It is better to do the deed and have to then apologize for it than to ask and be told NO!"

i know... i know.... i was TRYING to be a good little citizen... HONEST!

[Weirs guy]

Originally Posted by Skipper of the Sea Que

There's no neon cactus or plastic cows around Winnie are there?

Only because Karl took his with him. I miss that cow tail...

[tis]

That brings back memories. We had an old family friend from Saugus who use to make costumes, I believe it was for the Saugus Iron Works. Does that sound right to you Saugonians? If not, what else in Saugus might she have made costumes for? I was young and can't remember if it was for some certain celebration or what.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by tis

That brings back memories. We had an old family friend from Saugus who use to make costumes, I believe it was for the Saugus Iron Works. Does that sound right to you Saugonians? If not, what else in Saugus might she have made costumes for? I was young and can't remember if it was for some certain celebration or what.

Just adding some humor here..
was it for the Hilltop Cows out in front of the restaurant on Route 1

[fatlazyless]

Now that the NH Supreme Court reversed a local superior court in an electric sign case of Concord vs Barlo Signs. The court decided that Concord may not allow moving signs because they are too distracting to passing motorists, or something. Non-moving signs which show just the time and temperature were given the green light by the supremes.

This had to be a big loss for the sign business. Those moving signs have been popping up all over.

What will happen to the moving electric sign on Rt 3-25, in Centre Harbor that belongs to the sign business there. If I remember correct, the town had tried to get the sign company to remove it, the sign company refused, and the town was waiting to see what happened with this pending court case.

[Weirs guy]

Good lord, theres so many bigger fish to fry....