Boating Accident/Death off Diamond Island

Mink Islander · 06-17-2009, 12:32 PM

Failure to maintain a safe watch and going too fast for the conditions.

If you can't see something bearing dead ahead and consequently hit it with such force that you destroy the boat, kill a passenger and severely injure the two other individuals in the boat (including yourself), it's no simple error. It's reckless behavior by the operator and a clear violation of a number of fundamental boating laws. Seems to me, the only question here is whether she was legally impaired by alcohol and therefore compounded her legal problems that night. The rest appears pretty open and closed.

I think we all feel sympathy for the situation. It's a huge tragedy for all involved. No, she didn't head out that night planning to crash her boat and kill her friend. But she did operate the boat in a manner that was reckless given the conditions and CAUSED an major accident with a fatality as a result. Yes CAUSED it. It was entirely avoidable and she alone owns that. She needs to be held accountable for her actions and boaters need to learn from this so it doesn't happen again.

We can't just excuse this away as some random "could have happened to anyone" situation. If you think this could happen to you, then you should consider the possibility that you are taking extreme and unnecessary risks when you boat at night and are potentially a hazard to yourself and others. We should all believe we're operating in a manner where this type accident COULDN'T happen to us. Because it really shouldn't be possible if you are a competent, cautious and sober captain.

jrc · 06-17-2009, 12:51 PM

Wow its amazing, why even have a trial, just read a few newpaper articles, write a few forum posts, talk to some friends and then start building the gallows.

Mink Islander · 06-17-2009, 03:22 PM

Remember this?

I'm not saying that she is innocent, just that without evidence of intoxication, this is far from a slam dunk. My guess is if the BAC evidence is excluded she walks with no jail time. Probably will be a plea bargain.

You wrote it in this thread. I guess it's okay for YOU to have an opinion that she will walk based on your slant on the information, but everybody else is off base if they take an alternate view?

Little hypocritical, don't you think??

jrc · 06-17-2009, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mink Islander

...

Little hypocritical, don't you think??

Maybe, but I was guessing at an outcome, not declaring her guilty or innocent. Maybe a subtle difference.

I still think she will get off pretty easy, if the booze evidence is surpressed or if she wasn't drunk. I still think she will easily be convicted if she was drunk.

If she was drunk, she is pretty much automatically guilty in my opinion and in practice and in that case I hope she goes to jail.

If she was not drunk, then I would really like to hear all the evidence before I made an decision. It gets into degrees of negligence and visibilty and conditions and a whole bunch of other factors. Accidents do happen, even to competent, cautious and sober captains.

Mink Islander · 06-18-2009, 05:59 AM

I guess it's how the term is used. Accident that is. Preventable accident? Accident caused by reckless behavior? As I said earlier, I don't think this is a "could of happened to anyone" situation and the way we throw around "accident" makes it sound like it was just fate that caused this tragedy. No blame need be assigned.

The reality is that the accident happened because the captain made some terrible judgements -- and killed someone as a result. Had she followed even the most common sense rules of boating, this would never have happened. That's the real tragedy here. It highlights the dangers of boating at night and in bad weather and the heightened level of caution required by the captain in those situations.

Unless there's some new evidence (mechanical failure, etc.) that we haven't heard yet, then, yes, I am highly confident she will be convicted of the primary charges. What does she have as a defense?

It's the BWI charge that's more difficult to prove, though it sounds like the State has a much better case (stronger direct evidence) here than they did with Mr. Littlefield. Lose on that charge and the penalty will be much harsher.

I expect that the court will take into account her suffering, contrition, etc. but I'll be surprised if she walks with no jail time at all. Someone died as a direct result of her actions. Personal suffering or not, that's a pretty serious crime. Even some modest jail time will highlight for everyone that this wasn't "just an accident".

Mee-n-Mac · 06-17-2009, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mink Islander

Failure to maintain a safe watch and going too fast for the conditions.

If you can't see something bearing dead ahead and consequently hit it with such force that you destroy the boat, kill a passenger and severely injure the two other individuals in the boat (including yourself), it's no simple error. It's reckless behavior by the operator and a clear violation of a number of fundamental boating laws. Seems to me, the only question here is whether she was legally impaired by alcohol and therefore compounded her legal problems that night. The rest appears pretty open and closed.

I think we all feel sympathy for the situation. It's a huge tragedy for all involved. No, she didn't head out that night planning to crash her boat and kill her friend. But she did operate the boat in a manner that was reckless given the conditions and CAUSED an major accident with a fatality as a result. Yes CAUSED it. It was entirely avoidable and she alone owns that. She needs to be held accountable for her actions and boaters need to learn from this so it doesn't happen again.

We can't just excuse this away as some random "could have happened to anyone" situation. If you think this could happen to you, then you should consider the possibility that you are taking extreme and unnecessary risks when you boat at night and are potentially a hazard to yourself and others. We should all believe we're operating in a manner where this type accident COULDN'T happen to us. Because it really shouldn't be possible if you are a competent, cautious and sober captain.

Out of curiousity, what charges should have been brought against the person mentioned in JustSold's recent post ? Sure there wasn't a death and I don't believe any alcohol was involved but still he hit Rattlesnake hard enough to break bones (if that matters).

06-17-2009, 12:32 PM	#1
Mink Islander Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 753 Thanks: 59 Thanked 271 Times in 129 Posts	Simple Error --- not! Failure to maintain a safe watch and going too fast for the conditions. If you can't see something bearing dead ahead and consequently hit it with such force that you destroy the boat, kill a passenger and severely injure the two other individuals in the boat (including yourself), it's no simple error. It's reckless behavior by the operator and a clear violation of a number of fundamental boating laws. Seems to me, the only question here is whether she was legally impaired by alcohol and therefore compounded her legal problems that night. The rest appears pretty open and closed. I think we all feel sympathy for the situation. It's a huge tragedy for all involved. No, she didn't head out that night planning to crash her boat and kill her friend. But she did operate the boat in a manner that was reckless given the conditions and CAUSED an major accident with a fatality as a result. Yes CAUSED it. It was entirely avoidable and she alone owns that. She needs to be held accountable for her actions and boaters need to learn from this so it doesn't happen again. We can't just excuse this away as some random "could have happened to anyone" situation. If you think this could happen to you, then you should consider the possibility that you are taking extreme and unnecessary risks when you boat at night and are potentially a hazard to yourself and others. We should all believe we're operating in a manner where this type accident COULDN'T happen to us. Because it really shouldn't be possible if you are a competent, cautious and sober captain.

06-17-2009, 03:22 PM	#3
Mink Islander Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 753 Thanks: 59 Thanked 271 Times in 129 Posts	Short Memory? Remember this? I'm not saying that she is innocent, just that without evidence of intoxication, this is far from a slam dunk. My guess is if the BAC evidence is excluded she walks with no jail time. Probably will be a plea bargain. You wrote it in this thread. I guess it's okay for YOU to have an opinion that she will walk based on your slant on the information, but everybody else is off base if they take an alternate view? Little hypocritical, don't you think??

06-18-2009, 05:59 AM	#5
Mink Islander Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 753 Thanks: 59 Thanked 271 Times in 129 Posts	Accidents I guess it's how the term is used. Accident that is. Preventable accident? Accident caused by reckless behavior? As I said earlier, I don't think this is a "could of happened to anyone" situation and the way we throw around "accident" makes it sound like it was just fate that caused this tragedy. No blame need be assigned. The reality is that the accident happened because the captain made some terrible judgements -- and killed someone as a result. Had she followed even the most common sense rules of boating, this would never have happened. That's the real tragedy here. It highlights the dangers of boating at night and in bad weather and the heightened level of caution required by the captain in those situations. Unless there's some new evidence (mechanical failure, etc.) that we haven't heard yet, then, yes, I am highly confident she will be convicted of the primary charges. What does she have as a defense? It's the BWI charge that's more difficult to prove, though it sounds like the State has a much better case (stronger direct evidence) here than they did with Mr. Littlefield. Lose on that charge and the penalty will be much harsher. I expect that the court will take into account her suffering, contrition, etc. but I'll be surprised if she walks with no jail time at all. Someone died as a direct result of her actions. Personal suffering or not, that's a pretty serious crime. Even some modest jail time will highlight for everyone that this wasn't "just an accident".

06-17-2009, 12:51 PM	#2
jrc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NH Posts: 2,689 Thanks: 33 Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts	Wow its amazing, why even have a trial, just read a few newpaper articles, write a few forum posts, talk to some friends and then start building the gallows.