Another Nail in Bike Week's Coffin ??

[GBGX2]

Can't be good news for vendors....(at least in Meredith)

http://www.nh1.com/news/town-to-char...torcycle-week/

[Winnisquamer]

You're expected to pay between 450-500$ for a permit to be allowed to sell goods to the public during the event week? Article made it seem like its only for people vending food too.

To be honest I would have expected that to be normal practice. You have to pay to play

[GBGX2]

Originally Posted by Winnisquamer

You're expected to pay between 450-500$ for a permit to be allowed to sell goods to the public during the event week? Article made it seem like its only for people vending food too.

To be honest I would have expected that to be normal practice. You have to pay to play

I would agree with you... I am surprised as you are that they didn't always charge but another perceived "negative" change and perhaps less participation.

[Woodsy]

Meredith is following in Laconia's footsteps! Unfortunately. I bet we see even more of the big vendors at NHIS next year....

Then again it also cost the local businesses to be part of the Laconia Bike Week Association...

people will still come to the Weirs even if the bigger vendors are at the track.

Woodsy

[Acrossamerica]

Can one then also assume that during the vastly attractive hockey tournament in the winter that all vendors will also be charged a similar fee. If not then the vendors shall have a fine court case for discriminatory fees which will cost the Town of Meredith more money than they will ever receive from the vendors.

Charging $500 for one week's worth of commerce is the same as charging a year round food vendor (read restaurant) a fee of $26,000 - pretty steep protection money. Even the mafia did not extract that large a sum from there
"clients"

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Acrossamerica

Can one then also assume that during the vastly attractive hockey tournament in the winter that all vendors will also be charged a similar fee. If not then the vendors shall have a fine court case for discriminatory fees which will cost the Town of Meredith more money than they will ever receive from the vendors.

Charging $500 for one week's worth of commerce is the same as charging a year round food vendor (read restaurant) a fee of $26,000 - pretty steep protection money. Even the mafia did not extract that large a sum from there
"clients"

Except that this event, Bike Week, requires a significant expenditure for public safety, DPW, Etc. It cannot fairly be compared to a permanent restaurant that may never require any services from the town.

I do not see the comparison to the hockey tournament for the same reason. It also has an insignificant impact on the town's budget.

It is more fair that the participants assume the cost than it would be to pass it on to the taxpayers.

[secondcurve]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Except that this event, Bike Week, requires a significant expenditure for public safety, DPW, Etc. It cannot fairly be compared to a permanent restaurant that may never require any services from the town.

I do not see the comparison to the hockey tournament for the same reason. It also has an insignificant impact on the town's budget.

It is more fair that the participants assume the cost than it would be to pass it on to the taxpayers.

Thanks for making the obvious point. It was the first thing that poped into my mind when I read Across America's post.

[Lakegeezer]

The vendors at the Meredith hockey tourny are on state property (the ice), not town property. That might also make a difference in the fees from bike week.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

The vendors at the Meredith hockey tourny are on state property (the ice), not town property. That might also make a difference in the fees from bike week.

The lake is not "state property". Every part of the lake is in whatever town it is in such as Laconia, Meredith Etc. If you look at the right chart you will see the town lines crossing the lake.

[wifi]

The $500 flat fee is unfair, the small hot dog stand pays the same as the big boys. Would have been better to have a prepared food tax, like the state does on restaurants. It is the number of people overloading the system, not the number of vendors. It is really knifing small business in the back.

Then again, maybe the small guys can get together and form a LLC, as one business, and divide the profits up later. Again, it is too many people, not too many vendors.

[Lake Fan]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

The lake is not "state property". Every part of the lake is in whatever town it is in such as Laconia, Meredith Etc. If you look at the right chart you will see the town lines crossing the lake.

The various towns own the islands in the lake but the state owns the water and holds it in trust for the public's use.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Lake Fan

The various towns own the islands in the lake but the state owns the water and holds it in trust for the public's use.

The towns do not own the islands. Most islands are owned by individuals or many individuals and the islands come under the jurisdiction of whatever town they are in. The rules and regulations, such as zoning, of the town that the islands are in are also in effect on the islands.

The exception to this is islands like Stonedam that are held in other manners such as conservation trusts.

[AC2717]

I think the difference might be that Labatt's sponsors the hockey tournament and the organizers and they dump a lot of money into the town to be able to do this and it is paid for in advance by those that are participating in the tournament and the vendors go to them for set up space
vs bike week where each one is on their own with the town itself and participants are not paying anything unless they purchase from the vendors

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by wifi

The $500 flat fee is unfair, the small hot dog stand pays the same as the big boys. Would have been better to have a prepared food tax, like the state does on restaurants. It is the number of people overloading the system, not the number of vendors. It is really knifing small business in the back.

Then again, maybe the small guys can get together and form a LLC, as one business, and divide the profits up later. Again, it is too many people, not too many vendors.

Big reason why you don't see hot dog stands in Laconia. The vendor fees are imposed year round. It also affect health and craft fairs. You don't see them in Laconia. The state even hold their job fairs outside of Laconia at the Belknap Mall.

I have organized a number health fairs in NH. I organized one in Laconia a few years ago, but the city insist all the vendors buy a license. Since health fair vendors are non-profit and provide free service, they cannot afford the fees. Health Fair was called off.

I can see the effect in Meredith with Pond Hockey and the Fishing Derby.

[Woodsy]

I personally don't have a problem with vendor fees. But I do think $500 is a little unreasonable considering the only places vendors set up in Meredith are Laconia Harley & harts Turkey farm. I expect those places will struggle to fill the vendor spots as more of them go to Loudon or elsewhere.

That being said....

You can bet your bottom dollar Meredith will impose the same fees on the Pond Hockey vendors... they too require special coverage from the town in the form of traffic details, Police, Fire & EMS presence etc etc....

Woodsy

[swnoel]

The government needs to justify it's existence. Explain what additional cost it is to the city, for someone to own and struggle, attempting to make a living selling hot dogs!! Why do you need a $500 permit or for that matter any permit? Maybe it would be better to set up tolls into the city and charge people for using their streets! Just think... it might work to keep people out of the city, resulting in thousands of dollars in savings!

[WeirsBeachBoater]

Everyone is tripping over a $500 fee, no one is talking about the Thousands of dollars LHD charges for a vendors spot... Odd.

[Outdoorsman]

Originally Posted by WeirsBeachBoater

Everyone is tripping over a $500 fee, no one is talking about the Thousands of dollars LHD charges for a vendors spot... Odd.

If that is the case, LHD can add $450-$500 to each vendor spot or take that from their fee.

I too am surprised that Meredith did not already have a vendor fee.

BTW, from Laconia Daily Sun it is $500 for food vendors and $450 for others. Not that that plays in to this discussion.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by swnoel

The government needs to justify it's existence.

I read this rationale for the government's existence somewhere once, and thought it sounded good:

To form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by swnoel

The government needs to justify it's existence. Explain what additional cost it is to the city, for someone to own and struggle, attempting to make a living selling hot dogs!! Why do you need a $500 permit or for that matter any permit? Maybe it would be better to set up tolls into the city and charge people for using their streets! Just think... it might work to keep people out of the city, resulting in thousands of dollars in savings!

Well, Laconia has figured out what additional cost it is to the city and collects the fees to offset that cost. Bike Week has become basically a break even event for the city. It is now set up so that the taxpayers do not have to foot the bill. And don't forget, every business owner pays the city for a permit so that they can park cars or have vendors on their property.

If you object to vendor permits would it be your intention that the taxpayers foot the bill for the increase in city expenses that week?

City employees get more overtime, local businesses get some much needed revenue after a long winter, and many new people visit and enjoy the area.

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

I read this rationale for the government's existence somewhere once, and thought it sounded good:

To form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity.

Drink up my friend... drink up!

[brk-lnt]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Well, Laconia has figured out what additional cost it is to the city and collects the fees to offset that cost.

You could also say that Laconia has figured out how much they can extract from Bike Week, and has increased the city budget for police, fire, etc. by that same amount.

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

Well, Laconia has figured out what additional cost it is to the city and collects the fees to offset that cost. Bike Week has become basically a break even event for the city. It is now set up so that the taxpayers do not have to foot the bill. And don't forget, every business owner pays the city for a permit so that they can park cars or have vendors on their property.

If you object to vendor permits would it be your intention that the taxpayers foot the bill for the increase in city expenses that week?

City employees get more overtime, local businesses get some much needed revenue after a long winter, and many new people visit and enjoy the area.

Are you suggesting that the vendors are the reason the bikers come to Laconia? If so... then charge them, but something tells me it's the other way around! To even suggest they should pay for the additional cost to the community is ridiculous! Laconia happens to be on the lake which happens to be a summer tourist stop...it's not the vendors fault. It's just another way for government to extort money from businesses under the guise they here to help them!

https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...bc&oe=58528737

[thinkxingu]

Gee, I dunno fellas, but I sure do like clean water, public education, social security and Medicare, the national parks, and, well, a whole lot of what the government has provided, including the freedom to write this post right here while relaxing peacefully in my safe bed just a couple nice streets from the fire station.

Is government in the USA perfect? No. It never was and never will be because it's run by humans. But it's still pretty damn good.

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[SAMIAM]

Also...state of NH takes 9% rooms and meals tax from all food vendors.....add that to the $500 fee

[Pineedles]

Let's never forget that it is the people of the United States that employ the government. Also another fact to remember. The more money the government takes in taxes, fees, and fines, the more it spends!

[fatlazyless]

Does any of the 9% state sales tax on prepared food come back to the Town of Meredith?

I don't know if it does or not?


And, how is the 9% state food tax money used by the State of New Hampshire? Is there a state website link that shows what happens with the 9% food tax?

So, when I go to Heath's in Center Harbor and spend 2.39 + .21 tax for 2.60-total on a breakfast bagel with bacon, egg, and cheese ..... like, how does the 21-cents tax revenue get used by the state? Where does the tax money go? Does any of it come back to Center Harbor?

[GBGX2]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Does any of the 9% state sales tax on prepared food come back to the Town of Meredith?

I don't know if it does or not?


And, how is the 9% state food tax money used by the State of New Hampshire? Is there a state website link that shows what happens with the 9% food tax?

See this link:

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/...TOC-V-78-A.htm

Section 78-A:26 Disposition of Revenue:

78-A:26 Disposition of Revenue. –
I. Beginning on July 1, 1995, and for each fiscal year thereafter, the department shall pay over all revenue, except revenues identified in paragraph III of this section, collected under this chapter to the state treasurer. On or before September 15 of each year, the department shall determine the cost of administration of this chapter for the fiscal year ending on the preceding June 30, and it shall notify the state treasurer of these costs by a report certified by them as to correctness. After deducting the cost of administration of the chapter from the total income, the state treasurer shall distribute the net income as follows:

(a) The amount necessary to provide payments of principal and interest on the bonds and notes authorized under RSA 198:15-a, II for the fiscal years ending June 30, 2009 through June 30, 2030;
[Paragraph I(b) suspended by 2015, 276:268 for the biennium ending June 30, 2017]


(b) An amount equal to 3.15 percent of the net income distributed under the introductory paragraph of paragraph I and subparagraph I(a) in the first year of the preceding fiscal biennium, which shall be credited to the department of resources and development, division of travel and tourism development;
(c) Forty percent of the net income under the introductory paragraph of paragraph I of the most recent fiscal year to the unincorporated towns, unorganized places, towns, and cities. The amount to be distributed to each such town, place, or city shall be determined by multiplying the amount to be distributed by a fraction, the numerator of which shall be the population of the unincorporated town, unorganized place, town or city and the denominator of which shall be the population of the state. The population figures shall be based on the latest resident population figures furnished by the office of energy and planning; and
(d) The remainder to the general fund.
II. Each fiscal year, the amount to be distributed shall be equal to the prior year's distribution plus an amount equal to 75 percent of any increase in the income received from the meals and rooms tax for the fiscal year ending on the preceding June 30, not to exceed $5,000,000, until such time as the total amount distributed annually is equal to the amount indicated in subparagraph I(c).
III. Beginning on July 1, 1999, and for each fiscal year thereafter, the department shall pay over all revenue collected pursuant to RSA 78-A:6, II-a to the state treasurer for deposit in the education trust fund established by RSA 198:39.

[fatlazyless]

So, how much of the 9% tax did Meredith get back from the State of NH in 2015.....if it got any money back? Do the individual towns get any tax money coming back?

[GBGX2]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

So, how much of the 9% tax did Meredith get back from the State of NH in 2015.....if it got any money back? Do the individual towns get any tax money coming back?

(c) Forty percent of the net income under the introductory paragraph of paragraph I of the most recent fiscal year to the unincorporated towns, unorganized places, towns, and cities. The amount to be distributed to each such town, place, or city shall be determined by multiplying the amount to be distributed by a fraction, the numerator of which shall be the population of the unincorporated town, unorganized place, town or city and the denominator of which shall be the population of the state. The population figures shall be based on the latest resident population figures furnished by the office of energy and planning;

[fatlazyless]

So, if I ask someone in Meredith Town Hall how much the town received from the state for 2015.....what's the actual amount?

Hate to just be asking questions without having an answer?

Is there a big long list of all the individual towns and cities in NH that shows how much is collected, and how much gets returned to each individual town?

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by swnoel

Drink up my friend... drink up!

I'll drink the Kool Aid that is the United States Constitution any day. The ideas and ideals that it describes are just as valid today as they were 229 years ago.

Think about this: every person who is and ever has been a member of our armed forces and protects your rights and freedoms took an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution. Have they all been drinking the Kool Aid too? How insulting if you believe that's the case.

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

I'll drink the Kool Aid that is the United States Constitution any day. The ideas and ideals that it describes are just as valid today as they were 229 years ago.

Think about this: every person who is and ever has been a member of our armed forces and protects your rights and freedoms took an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution. Have they all been drinking the Kool Aid too? How insulting if you believe that's the case.

As did the Commander in Chief. How has that worked out?

[GBGX2]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

So, if I ask someone in Meredith Town Hall how much the town received from the state for 2015.....what's the actual amount?

Hate to just be asking questions without having an answer?

Is there a big long list of all the individual towns and cities in NH that shows how much is collected, and how much gets returned to each individual town?

Some of these links are "dated" but the information, I believe is still valid !

http://www.lfda.org/issues/meals-rooms-tax-revisions

http://www.seacoastonline.com/articl...news/150519288

http://www.seacoastonline.com/articl...NION/301220369

"Tourist mecca Hampton, for example, with a population of 15,000 residents, received slightly more than $672,000 in rooms and meals tax money from the state in 2011, while Derry, with a population of 34,000, received more than $1.5 million, despite the fact Derry generates far less in rooms and meals taxes.

While Derry has just 103 businesses paying rooms and meals tax, according to the New Hampshire Department of Revenue Administration, Portsmouth has 270, and Hampton and Hampton Beach have a combined total of 331.

The major flaw in the formula is it does not take into account the significant costs Portsmouth and Hampton incur providing increased police, fire and other services needed for the influx of tourists who pay rooms and meals taxes."

[ITD]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

Gee, I dunno fellas, but I sure do like clean water, public education, social security and Medicare, the national parks, and, well, a whole lot of what the government has provided, including the freedom to write this post right here while relaxing peacefully in my safe bed just a couple nice streets from the fire station.

Is government in the USA perfect? No. It never was and never will be because it's run by humans. But it's still pretty damn good.

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

You know, I generally agree with your sentiment here, but with a very important distinction. First, the government doesn't "provide" the freedom to express yourself via a post or any other manner, that is right granted by the "Creator" which the government is charged to protect and not impede. Second, the government does not "provide" infrastructure or programs, taxpayers do, the government administers those functions, usually not very efficiently.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

As did the Commander in Chief. How has that worked out?

If you care to be more specific, I will be happy to address whatever issue you feel there is. Otherwise, I can only guess at what you are referring to.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

As did the Commander in Chief. How has that worked out?

About as well as the last couple appointees to the supreme court ability to interpret it.

[Ms Molly McKever]

Originally Posted by maxum

about as well as the last couple appointees to the supreme court ability to interpret it.

the commander in chief ???

The supreme court ???

[swnoel]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

I'll drink the Kool Aid that is the United States Constitution any day. The ideas and ideals that it describes are just as valid today as they were 229 years ago.

Think about this: every person who is and ever has been a member of our armed forces and protects your rights and freedoms took an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution. Have they all been drinking the Kool Aid too? How insulting if you believe that's the case.

Are you talking about the same Constitution that's been ignored by the same corrupt individuals sworn to uphold it? Don't get me going about our corrupt government! I've taken that oath , so don't tell me about honor and integrity ... something sorrily missing by most government officials! You drink the kool-aid being offered by them, because our government and the Constitution are two separate things ! The sad part is how these elected people remain in these positions, continually doing what they do best... nothing constructive to protect individual rights and freedoms!! We all know how they stay in the positions of power, mandating and regulating every aspect of our lives under some pretext that they're saving us for us! It doesn't surprise me that town of Laconia will find anyway to extract money out of bikers week regardless of the impact to the businesses of the local community, even if it results with the ending of it, which by the way, I believe is what they want! That IS what they do well!

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by swnoel

Are you talking about the same Constitution that's been ignored by the same corrupt individuals sworn to uphold it? Don't get me going about our corrupt government! I've taken that oath , so don't tell me about honor and integrity ... something sorrily missing by most government officials! You drink the kool-aid being offered by them, because our government and the Constitution are two separate things ! The sad part is how these elected people remain in these positions, continually doing what they do best... nothing constructive to protect individual rights and freedoms!! We all know how they stay in the positions of power, mandating and regulating every aspect of our lives under some pretext that they're saving us for us! It doesn't surprise me that town of Laconia will find anyway to extract money out of bikers week regardless of the impact to the businesses of the local community, even if it results with the ending of it, which by the way, I believe is what they want! That IS what they do well!

Wow, so many exclamation points. I never passed judgment on "the government." I extolled the virtues of the Constitution of the United States. In a representative democracy, the people get the government that they deserve. You don't like the way that your elected representatives act? Fine, run for office yourself, form a new political party, support a candidate that holds your views, or start a movement. But to blame the Constitution for whatever problems you see in our current political system is absurd.

[Outdoorsman]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

Also...state of NH takes 9% rooms and meals tax from all food vendors.....add that to the $500 fee

As you are aware, the vendors are not out of pocket an additional 9%. That is collected from the customer for each purchase. Sure the vendors have some additional work to track that amount and pay the state, but I would assume that is factored in when pricing the food they sell. All (most?) states have a similar tax.

[songkrai]

Amazing.
Some just can't control their dipsomania with national politics.
Please, open a new thread on that subject.

As far as Meredith vendor fees go.

I read so much on how the Lakes Region wants more businesses.
Why hinder all of this?

Answer: "We" want the lake area to look "pretty".

Live Free of Die. Make sure to add all of the fees to that live free part.

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

If you care to be more specific, I will be happy to address whatever issue you feel there is. Otherwise, I can only guess at what you are referring to.

https://nworeport.me/2015/12/16/a-li...al-violations/

[Newbiesaukee]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

https://nworeport.me/2015/12/16/a-li...al-violations/

I do try to understand other peoples points of view so I checked this link. It is on a website whose masthead says:

NWO Report

NWO News,End Time,World News and Conspiracy News.

At least the site puts it up front, difficult to see anything objective here. I am not sure but I think that NWO is New World Order

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Newbiesaukee

I do try to understand other peoples points of view so I checked this link. It is on a website whose masthead says:

NWO Report

NWO News,End Time,World News and Conspiracy News.

At least the site puts it up front, difficult to see anything objective here. I am not sure but I think that NWO is New World Order

Exactly. Don't believe everything you read on the internet, especially if A) it's an opinion piece, and B) it's written at a fifth grade level (to include the expected grammatical errors).

Here's the bottom line: if the executive or legislative branch acts in an extra-constitutional manner, there's a remedy for that: the court system. Don't you think that if in fact a president was doing all sorts of crazy stuff in violation of the Constitution, that his political adversaries would be challenging him in court, and the judicial branch would be ruling against the president? Why isn't that happening on the grand scale that it should be if all these claims are true? Are we going to hear next that it's because of all the partisan judges that are on the bench? To be sure, some things that the president has done recently have been challenged in court, and some of those things have been ruled unconstitutional, but not to any greater degree than with other recent presidents. See, the system works.


Here's one example of debunking one of the claims in the link that was provided:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/crime/interpol.asp

[Acrossamerica]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Exactly. Don't believe everything you read on the internet, especially if A) it's an opinion piece, and B) it's written at a fifth grade level (to include the expected grammatical errors).

Here's the bottom line: if the executive or legislative branch acts in an extra-constitutional manner, there's a remedy for that: the court system. Don't you think that if in fact a president was doing all sorts of crazy stuff in violation of the Constitution, that his political adversaries would be challenging him in court, and the judicial branch would be ruling against the president? Why isn't that happening on the grand scale that it should be if all these claims are true? Are we going to hear next that it's because of all the partisan judges that are on the bench? To be sure, some things that the president has done recently have been challenged in court, and some of those things have been ruled unconstitutional, but not to any greater degree than with other recent presidents. See, the system works.


Here's one example of debunking one of the claims in the link that was provided:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/crime/interpol.asp

The reason why more has not been done to rein in this out of control president is the congress is afraid of being branded racist because of the color of the president. And because congress has not moved, that is why Trump is winning so many supporters and has a better than 50 - 50 chance of taking the White House come November. Many are outraged by the lack of concern by congress.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Acrossamerica

The reason why more has not been done to rein in this out of control president is the congress is afraid of being branded racist because of the color of the president.

Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan are telling people that they don't want to challenge the president in court because they are afraid of being perceived as racist? Really? What about when they challenge him on legislation, budget matters, same sex marriage, etc., etc., etc.? Why wouldn't that be perceived as racist, too? Your reasoning makes no sense.

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Exactly. Don't believe everything you read on the internet, especially if A) it's an opinion piece, and B) it's written at a fifth grade level (to include the expected grammatical errors).

Here's the bottom line: if the executive or legislative branch acts in an extra-constitutional manner, there's a remedy for that: the court system. Don't you think that if in fact a president was doing all sorts of crazy stuff in violation of the Constitution, that his political adversaries would be challenging him in court, and the judicial branch would be ruling against the president? Why isn't that happening on the grand scale that it should be if all these claims are true? Are we going to hear next that it's because of all the partisan judges that are on the bench? To be sure, some things that the president has done recently have been challenged in court, and some of those things have been ruled unconstitutional, but not to any greater degree than with other recent presidents. See, the system works.


Here's one example of debunking one of the claims in the link that was provided:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/crime/interpol.asp

http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/17/fa...beral-blogger/

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

Snopes is a joke

This is a classic example of attacking the messenger and ignoring the message. If the Snopes link I posted that discusses the Interpol executive order is somehow factually incorrect, then by all means, take issue with what it says. But to simply say that it lacks credibility because it might have been written by someone that a conservative website is calling out as a liberal, without actually addressing the information presented, is ridiculous.

The Snopes article provides the source for its content. If you question Snopes, you could start there.

[Boater]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

The Snopes article provides the source for its content. If you question Snopes, you could start there.

There is lots of evidence that Snopes has a liberal bias. Just Google "is snopes liberal biased" for many opinions and examples. I am very skeptical of what they say. I assume you'd be skeptical of a conservative run fact checker that had been repeatedly accused of conservative bias.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Boater

There is lots of evidence that Snopes has a liberal bias. Just Google "is snopes liberal biased" for many opinions and examples. I am very skeptical of what they say. I assume you'd be skeptical of a conservative run fact checker that had been repeatedly accused of conservative bias.

You're assuming that I'm a "liberal," when in fact I am strongly independent. What I am for is transparent, constructive government that isn't dominated by idealogues who make getting things done nearly impossible.

Having a liberal or conservative bias doesn't mean that you can't still conduct a rational analysis and come to conclusions that are based on facts. The main point in my last post was that dismissing an argument simply because the author might be predisposed to a liberal (or conservative) bias is dumb.

The contention in the NWO Report that Executive Order 13524 gives INTERPOL jurisdiction on American soil beyond law enforcement agencies, including the FBI, is completely unsupported by any facts, not to mention any kind of analysis that seeks to explain why this is the case. Snopes provides analysis, supported by facts, to refute the assertion.

[MAXUM]

A few things to point out here - not that I am trying to continue this conversation as usually it's taboo here since many on this forum do not appreciate political discourse of any kind.

First any information on the internet is pretty much suspect these days. Many things that are published contain bits of information that may be factually correct but are selective in their presentation thus give the appearance of something may not accurate in totality. Even the good old fact checkers are notorious for doing this - yes including snopes which does have a political leaning.

Many who read this stuff have no basis or foundation in understanding constitutional law or even how to interpret it against an action that is taken by congress or the president. It should never be assumed that just because either take action and a bill is signed doesn't mean it's not in violation of the law. I continue to be amazed at the number of so called "rights" that have been completely fabricated lately.

The judicial system is also not necessarily dependable when it comes to handing down just rulings either. Many of the district courts are stacked with activist judges who in and of themselves are making decisions based on a political philosophy versus interpreting the validitiy of a law. It's interesting to see how that plays out when judges can come to opposite opinions on things when they are all looking at the same case.

Far as congress and their inability to act, much of that comes down to their desire to keep their jobs and not rail against things that could create political fallout and ultimately their own demise. Much of that can be said from those who happen to oppose the current administration, there is clearly a double standard considering that any dissention is met with political backlash that is played out by the 24X7 news cycle on TV where the major media outlets also have a political sway to them as well depending on what they choose to report and how they report it.

If you are ignorant enough to think that the people acutally have control over the situation from a voter stand point consider this: The RNC does not like Trump, has never really accepted the fact he has won the primary and the power players on that side have gone out of their way to undermind his campaign. Why? He has not adopted the party lines and as such has been critical of his own party. The DNC on the other hand was in the bag for Hillary since day one actively underminding Bernie to ensure that whever outcome they decided was best would happen. The fact that he probably would have won if he had been as well connected as Hillary shows just how much power these parties are.

We as a country are in big trouble for one reason and one reason only. Not enough people are paying attention to what is going on and to many are not fully engaged in looking at candidates at the local, state and federal level by educating themselves on what is going on and what these people will do once they get into office. I can tell you right now that as little as 20 years ago neither of these candidates running for president would have had a snow ball's chance in hell of being the nominee of a major political party for president. Trump would have been scoffed at and Hillary would be in jail.

Make no mistake about it - these folks in DC may talk about how much they care and understand the plight of the American people, but in action they are doing something completely different that is self serving. That is why all of them mysteriously end up with fat bank accounts and lavish benefits regardless of their repeated dismal performance.

[P-3 Guy]

Interestingly enough, Maxum, I agree with a lot of what you have to say (including the part about political discussions on this forum), although I'm probably not as cynical about the current situation as you are.

I do not agree, however, with your claim that people are "ignorant" if they think that they actually have control over the situation from a voter standpoint. In fact, you go on to immediately show why this isn't the case: the Republican establishment does not like Trump, yet he is the party's nominee. He ran as a Republican, he got the votes, and he won the nomination. Voters were clearly in the driver's seat when it came to choosing the Republican nominee, despite the desires of the party insiders.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Interestingly enough, Maxum, I agree with a lot of what you have to say (including the part about political discussions on this forum), although I'm probably not as cynical about the current situation as you are.

I do not agree, however, with your claim that people are "ignorant" if they think that they actually have control over the situation from a voter standpoint. In fact, you go on to immediately show why this isn't the case: the Republican establishment does not like Trump, yet he is the party's nominee. He ran as a Republican, he got the votes, and he won the nomination. Voters were clearly in the driver's seat when it came to choosing the Republican nominee, despite the desires of the party insiders.

The voters still have the power in this country and that scares the living daylights out of the career pols. Unfortunately voters give up that power by not educating themselves to issues but rather relying on soundbites, comedy shows and biased news for information, or voting with no information at all.

Listening to news reports on what Trump says versus listening to what Trump says shows how inaccurate reports can be. It is also extremely important to look existing pols records, how they vote versus what they say. For some there is a huge gulf between words and deeds. Actions are important also, everyone makes mistakes, some acknowledge them, some blame others for their misdeeds.

[noreast]

The funniest thing I ever read may be that Trump has a "Better than 50-50 chance to win" Even wishful thinking should have a little reality. I'll be voting Libertarian so please don't call me a liberal. Always funny when you argue with an Ideologue, They either call you a liberal or fascist, How about A realist, or Independent? Can't I be anti both?

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by noreast

The funniest thing I ever read may be that Trump has a "Better than 50-50 chance to win" Even wishful thinking should have a little reality. I'll be voting Libertarian so please don't call me a liberal. Always funny when you argue with an Ideologue, They either call you a liberal or fascist, How about A realist, or Independent? Can't I be anti both?

anti both, oh the horror!

Just busting your chops... know what anyone that resorts to labeling you as something ridiculous simply is not informed or to intellectually lazy to defend their own way of thinking.

[wifi]

It is the mass of illegal alien voters, and inner city people that are (trying to) live off "free stuff" (including free dental work, chuckle). which don't understand the principles that (used to) make this country work. That is the pendulum which could sway this into a total train wreck. One of my friends said he always votes for who will do him the most good (ie looking for what he can get personally). He is now waking up to the fact of how short sighted that is, and where we really are, not where we are painted as by the media and government redefining what is good and the bleak, if any, future.

It is personal greed by the voters, not what the main stream is leading you to believe, which has put ua to where we are.

6-2 and even, over and out.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by wifi

It is the mass of illegal alien voters, and inner city people that are (trying to) live off "free stuff" (including free dental work, chuckle). which don't understand the principles that (used to) make this country work.

Interesting; I haven't heard about the "mass of illegal alien voters..." Do you have a link or reference so that I can educate myself about this problem?

[wifi]

Left up to the reader, I state my position, and stay out of the fray. I certainly read and respect others positions as well.

[fatlazyless]

About three years ago, there was a 'Business for Sale' listing for the Laconia Harley Davidson in Meredith ....... anyone know if it got sold, or if it is still for sale? Someone have a link to their 'for sale' listing?

[BrownstoneNorth]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

Interesting; I haven't heard about the "mass of illegal alien voters..." Do you have a link or reference so that I can educate myself about this problem?

He must mean this -- surprised you've never heard of it:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_Ar...Are_from_Venus

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by wifi

Left up to the reader, I state my position, and stay out of the fray. I certainly read and respect others positions as well.

I got it -- chuckin' hand grenades and running away.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by ITD

The voters still have the power in this country and that scares the living daylights out of the career pols. Unfortunately voters give up that power by not educating themselves to issues but rather relying on soundbites, comedy shows and biased news for information, or voting with no information at all.

Listening to news reports on what Trump says versus listening to what Trump says shows how inaccurate reports can be. It is also extremely important to look existing pols records, how they vote versus what they say. For some there is a huge gulf between words and deeds. Actions are important also, everyone makes mistakes, some acknowledge them, some blame others for their misdeeds.

• Why are we getting news reports from Britain that we don't see here in the USA?

• One famous quote—a familiar media name from the past—sums it up...:



.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by GBGX2

Can't be good news for vendors....(at least in Meredith)

http://www.nh1.com/news/town-to-char...torcycle-week/

Back to the main topic of this thread if I may.
Was there any opposition to this ordinance when the town held their public meetings on it?

[ursa minor]

I think I'm gonna get a vendor license to sell tin foil hats at Bike Week next year....

Seriously, I think there's enough politics floating around everywhere else to satisfy everyone's needs. How we got from a topic of vendor fees for Bike Week to debating Constitutional law is beyond me. Not seeing how it relates to the lake.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by Rusty

Back to the main topic of this thread if I may.
Was there any opposition to this ordinance when the town held their public meetings on it?

Meredith has posted a video of the select board meeting from August 15th where they discuss these fees. You can view the videos here:

http://meredithtownnh.iqm2.com/Citizens/Default.aspx

The discussion is towards the end of the meeting. If you open the agenda and click on the motorcycle week item it will take you to the start of the discussion in the video.

[TiltonBB]

City shows $3,114 net income from Motorcycle Week as it closes books.


http://laconiadailysun.com/newsx/loc...k-books-closed

[Rich]

I have to ask, why do people want bike week killed?

I know many people don't like the crowds, the traffic, the noise, etc. But if instead of "Bike Week" this was "Boat Week", with people walking around in bathing suits and bikini's made of fabric instead of leather, would you be happier?

It reminds me of the old saying "Be careful what you ask for, as you may get it!" and often you get more than you expected!

So if bike week disappeared, it would mean a lot of lost tourism, and therefore a lot of money lost to the region during the summer.

Would this mean a lot of businesses could end up closing or do very poorly and end up running with on a fiscally fragile shoestring?

Alternatively do you think that businesses and property owners near the Weirs would finally see the light and decide that a facelift is needed to the area to attract more summer tourists? IMHO, the Weirs looks very run down and neglected vs other lake destination towns like Meridith, Alton, Wolfboro, etc.

[MAXUM]

Maybe the answer is simply that bike week is not as big a boom to the local economy as it may appear. If it is that important you can bet that local businesses and town governments will work to keep it alive, however if it turn out that it is revenue neutral or costing towns/tax payers money to logistically support it why would there be any reason to keep it going? With Laconia reporting a mere 3K in overall revenue it's tough to justify the work and effort when that same amount of money can be made in a day whacking people launching boats 20 bucks a pop minus all the bike week drama many probably just as soon not deal with.

There has been plenty of discussion on here about revitalizing weirs beach... whether anything happens really comes down to if anyone with deep pockets sees an investment opportunity. As you say local businesses operating on a show string don't have that kind of capitol to play with so don't count on them to do much, they can't really. Thus far nobody with the wherewithal has stepped forward to spruce the place up, maybe because shrewd investors don't see a ROI worth the effort.

[webmaster]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

There has been plenty of discussion on here about revitalizing weirs beach...

http://www.citizen.com/news/2016-08-..._to_Weirs.html

[webmaster]

If I can jump in: I always thought that eliminating bike week might stop every building at the Weirs from turning into a parking lot that would earn enough during bike week to survive for the full year.

Then last week I was listening to an interview on 1490 with a Laconia official who said that most buildings sold recently in Laconia are now empty lots and that this was a serious problem for the city. I guess it's not just the Weirs.

[noreast]

though I'm in agreement with MAXUM. I would caution against using the towns figure to call it revenue neutral. We all know that a town can spend the hell out of what there given, so a local boondoggle Is more likely what happens. It's been a long time since I've seen a body spend less than it takes in. But I do think there would be a massive clean up and rejuvenation If It went away. Out of a feeling of necessity, the city may go against all It's Instincts and approach business with some incentive.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by webmaster

http://www.citizen.com/news/2016-08-..._to_Weirs.html

From that link:

stamped, colored sidewalks estimated to be $60,000 that Dunleavy said is a coloring embedded into a concrete material throughout the thickness of the crosswalk; $17,000 for brick pavers in curb bump outs, with 66 percent brick and 34 percent concrete, designed for pedestrian safety and aesthetics;

My town did that a few years ago. Looked great for a few years. They even repainted some of the areas once or twice. Now a lot of it looks like paint that wasn't kept fresh every year, in other words, a bit worn out.

I guess people think this is a good option for the money at the time of installation and everyone will say "This looks great!", but then a few years later they decide not to keep up with the maintenance costs and it starts to look like crap. At least true brick pavers age and patina nicely over time. Stamped and colored things just look worn out over time!

If anyone is a Laconia resident, you may want to point this out to those that think it's a great idea, have them visit other towns where this was done several years ago.

[ursa minor]

Originally Posted by Maxum

There has been plenty of discussion on here about revitalizing weirs beach... whether anything happens really comes down to if anyone with deep pockets sees an investment opportunity. As you say local businesses operating on a show string don't have that kind of capitol to play with so don't count on them to do much, they can't really. Thus far nobody with the wherewithal has stepped forward to spruce the place up, maybe because shrewd investors don't see a ROI worth the effort.

Having seen the Meredith of the 1970's / 80's vs. what it's become today, I'd have to say anything is possible. I think it's only a matter of time before the property value / potential of the Weirs lakefront area brings a large scale redevelopment. Some will welcome it, many will be upset to see the area change from what they remember from growing up.

Bike week could benefit greatly from some renewal in the Weirs, there seems to be plenty of bike traffic in the other towns around the lake, particularly Meredith. Time will tell, I don't see any sign of real estate devaluation any where in the lakes region much less anywhere in the northeast.

[TiltonBB]

Originally Posted by Rich

From that link:



My town did that a few years ago. Looked great for a few years. They even repainted some of the areas once or twice. Now a lot of it looks like paint that wasn't kept fresh every year, in other words, a bit worn out.

I guess people think this is a good option for the money at the time of installation and everyone will say "This looks great!", but then a few years later they decide not to keep up with the maintenance costs and it starts to look like crap. At least true brick pavers age and patina nicely over time. Stamped and colored things just look worn out over time!

If anyone is a Laconia resident, you may want to point this out to those that think it's a great idea, have them visit other towns where this was done several years ago.

The concrete is colored. No paint is needed. There are no maintenance costs.

The dye is put into the mixer in a regular load of concrete to achieve the desired color so that even if there is a chip in the concrete it is still the same color. The stamping is to put a pattern on the surface of the concrete such as a cobblestone or brick pattern. It looks nice when done right and is very durable.

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by TiltonBB

The concrete is colored. No paint is needed. There are no maintenance costs.

The dye is put into the mixer in a regular load of concrete to achieve the desired color so that even if there is a chip in the concrete it is still the same color. The stamping is to put a pattern on the surface of the concrete such as a cobblestone or brick pattern. It looks nice when done right and is very durable.

I have a stamped patio as a main entrance at my commercial building. I had it installed 10 years ago and it still looks great. It should however be resealed so there is some maintenance.