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#1 | |
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Please don't get discouraged or scared away. Consider the source when you read criticism on these Anti Speed Limit threads. This is a very small cult of cowboys who think that boats should be able to go as fast as the driver wants on a crowded lake, any time he wants, day or night. They let their 6 year old kids pilot their 5-ton speed boats. They somehow contend that as long as they are drunk, it is ok to go really fast. They call run-abouts and canoes "speed bumps". They say smaller boats should be limited to "safer" lakes. They brag about their law-breaking escapades and give each other virtual high fives. They send PM's to inform you of the time they have spent in jail, and use screen names that tell you of their gun caliber preferences and social diseases. The word "maturity" has a whole different meaning to this small little gang. They dominate these threads because it is the only place where they fit in and appear normal. It is the only place that gives forum to law breakers and allows them to boast unlimited of their crimes, while limiting participation by the mainstream. Your views are spot-on. Keep them coming. And when you have some time, have a look on the internet and you will see what happens on lakes where the citizens have not organized to take back control. Simple searches reveal thousands of cases where boats like these, driven by cowboys like these, have killed people like you and me. Innocent boaters and bystanders, sometimes while asleep in their waterfront homes, are being killed all over the country and world by boaters like these with the "need for speed" who insist on showing off in their "look at me" boats driving at "look how fast I can go" speeds. Take comfort in the fact that Winnipesaukee used to have fatal accidents like these until we enacted a speed limit, and that our legislature (as much as I cringe at the other things that they have been doing) is not going to repeal a law that has worked so well. Here are examples of what was and would again be happening on Winnipesaukee if we eliminated the Speed limit; These two accidents in NY sound identical, except that 3 died in this one; http://www.newsday.com/long-island/n...tagh-1.1500143 and ONLY one died in this one; http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/o...Zdass6c9YR4HMO |
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#2 |
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Really? How many accidents that involved speed in excess of 45/25 were there on Lake Winni in the past 10 years? Please be specific and cite each one, with the specific cause.
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#3 |
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A couple of EL's points deserve emphasis. People from out of state sometimes comment to me when they hear of my Winni location about Winni's out of control reputation; it's something I've been trying to ignore for 2 decades now. I agree with EL on the safety issue too...and his links have shown speed is a problem needing to be addressed, both on Winni and elsewhere. I need to add that in addition to safety,there is the issue (as many have pointed out) of speed, noise, and the overall boating experience on the lake. We can't go back to the 1960's...there are just too many boats and the superfast boats on the lake in the 60's were few and far between. Tho only logical solution is a SL and so far it seems to be working. Most of the worst offenders call attention to themselves with major noise. Noise legislation hasn't worked, will not work (even with switchable exhaust) and the noise from these boats is just too loud for most people anyway.
We've heard from a few members about their sense from talking to others that no one (practically) supports the SL. As was mentioned earlier in one of the threads, this seems unusual given the number of people involved in the speed limit movement, people we talk to around the lake, the many organizations that supported Winnfabs and the SL as well as the many businesses that support the SL. I suppose those very vocal people on the forum who said they would never ever again support these businesses are frequenting those that were against limits and are therefore hearing the things they want and expect to hear. Clearly if I went to Murphy's Bar and asked people their opinions on alcohol in America the results would differ significantly from those I'd hear at an AA meeting. I find it ironic too that the face of the NHRBA will be frequently on the front page in a couple of months when the Sl debate is coming more and more into the headlines as well. Another good point is the attempted marginalization by the Sl opposition of smaller craft/kayaks/etc. and that some of these people are "stupid" if they would venture into the broads in such a craft. I know of many skilled kayakers who have sea kayaks and are capable of handling more than the broads can offer. To suggest that these craft need to "stay close to shore" is just a self serving example of the smoke and mirrors used by those who want no limits. As EL said a while back "wild horses don't like to be corralled". I applaud the efforts of NH citizens to take back the lake for a more equitable use for all and also feel it is unlikely that the state legislature will cause a reversal of the gains achieved for the lake, and 45/25 is a good compromise. |
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#4 | |
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#5 |
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I completely agree.. just don't know what it has to do with my head gasket.. LOL
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#6 | |
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As a good Samaritan, I would venture out and rescue these hapless folks. Only because I have a 'performance' boat capable enough to tackle the weather. Even the MP have trouble rescuing. if I call them, it takes a while for them to get there. I can imagine how many people would have drowned if my boat was 'outlawed' from the lake. I had many people thanks their lucky stars that there was a boat capable of fighting the weather.
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#7 |
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There is only one group of people IMHO that is blowing smoke regarding the speed limit and that is winnfabs and their supporters. Perhaps that is why your head gasket blew. LOL.
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#8 | |
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#9 | |
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#10 |
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Just a thought but - kayaks in the broads go beyond the operators or vessels capabilities. Most days it's rough enough out there where a kayak - that sits maybe a foot off the water? - becomes hard to see. As the waves generate "peaks and valleys" (or troughs) the kayak will be in and out of view on a repeated basis. I have never looked at the position of the kayak and paddler as not "belonging" in the broads, so much as it may not the best choice from a safety standpoint? I happen to thoroughly enjoy kayaking and exploring all the places you can't go in a big boat. I consider myself very capable in such a vessel, I have kayaked all over the western hemisphere, fresh and salt water in the US, Mexico, Caribbean, etc... I never really considered putting myself out into open water in these cases, not for fear of anything other than not being visible enough to a larger boat. All boats have conditions that they are suited (designed and built) for, and ones that the operator knows they are pushing the limit, and beyond. I've been there - as a kid, took a 13' Whaler out many a times in water that was beyond what Whaler had in mind I'm sure, but I loved it - and survived just fine. However, I never ventured into the broads on a windy day with it... just didn't seem smart. I pushed the limits of that boat, but never to the point that I felt there could be catastrophic results.
Point is - forget what the boat and operator is capable of, are the conditions and prevailing circumstances conducive to being there? Could the factors that are out of your control have a negative effect on your actions? Example - you read about people going out in a paddle boat or canoe at night, no lights, etc... and they are thinking... well, not sure WHAT they are thinking, but they do it. ![]() |
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#11 |
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I think reasonable and prudent use of any watercraft promotes safety. If you read some of the USCG rules (Rule 6, 8 etc.), it is all about safe handling of a water craft. I think that is what NH should put on her books. A kayaker being out on the broads without the proper equipment should be just as guilty as a motorboater speeding out of control through the Weirs Channel. 'Cowboys' can be on any watercraft. Death can happen in a kayak, canoe, rowboat and sailboat, just as much as death can happen on a motorboat. Putting arbitrary limits on motorboats won't cure the lake ills. But putting 'reasonable and prudent operation' of all water vessels will go a long way in the name of safety. That will be a great compromise. Everyone will be responsible for their intentions as skipper on the lake.
I vote that we should adopt the federal rules and make them mandatory on all bodies of water in NH. Not just the ocean. Your turn.
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#12 | |
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#13 |
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I see the SL supporters are completely ignoring this compromise. What tick me off that SL Opposers are willing to compromise in the name of safety for all boaters. SL Supporters don't give a squat about those boneheads that are not performance boaters. They are the real problem that needs to be addressed.
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#14 |
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OCD,
Scott, without getting into too many details I'm sure you'll figure out who this is. I haven't seen or talked to you since you got the AT, congrats! I now how long you've been waiting for that. Your father-in-law has been keeping me mostly up to date on your problems, considering all the problems I've been having with my Checkmate (even since you drove it!) My problems are resolved and I couldn't be happier. Great news on the head gasket (all things considered). If you need help with anything, let me or Steve know, I'll be glad to help any way I can. The engine builder I used is about 200 yards away from me at the lake! He did great work (and has a full in-house machine shop) and I got a lot of help from Bob Madara at Marine Kinetics (custom ground cam/matching Morel lifters, Isky Springs setup, etc.). If you are still interested in paint, the guy who did my boat has his shop right over in Gilford, let me know if your interested and I can get you hooked up. We will definitely have to hook up on the water next summer! |
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#15 | |
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I appreciate it. I don't know he told you but the boat is being stored down in VA and should be all fixed within a month. I called steve about the painter, he said he wasn't in business. It is fine though because I decided to go vinyl. A lot less $$$ and it is better for resale then to have my name on the side. Not that I ever plan on selling but you have to be prepared for the worst case scenario. We absolutely have to meet up. I am trying to convince Steve to bring his boat down for Jammin on the James next year. There are a few checkmates doing that run. Actually there are two boats identical to you and steve's except for paint jobs. But we definately need to hook up on the lake. I hope to see you before that and I will bring the video of last years run. Great hearing from you. Stay on the boards and I will keep you updated as to the progress. Should be some good accesories coming as well. Take care!
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#16 | |
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#17 |
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I have this vision of a lone man in a hallway screaming and rantng to nobody. It's becoming more than a little comical now.
If a tree falls in the woods and nobody is around.... Yada yada yada ![]() |
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#18 |
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Looks from the gasket failure like she was leaning out,I'm sure your mechanic will but check injectors,and fuel pump volume. Great news no big failure and big buck repair.
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#19 |
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Exactly..... I am replacing the injectors with the stock ones after they are pressure tested as well..... From what I have been reading and have heard this happens a lot with procharged / whippled engines.
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#20 |
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I must say, turns out you're much more adventurous than myself
![]() My car's speedo goes to 160 mph, I however, do not ![]() I used to be more live and let live. Now? Sometimes I say Cut the crap cowboy and grow up! to those that live recklessly, and worst of all, In the midst of those that are not ![]() There's a fine line between compromise and overreaching. At some point, reality and common sense has to factor into the decision-making process. Many times, I think you overshoot your obstacle, perhaps it's due to a need for more solitude than your surroundings can offer. But I do feel you want to eliminate as much of your surroundings as possible, unless they mesh with your particular lifestyle or visions thereof. Perhaps I'm wrong. I have no need for 100 mph plus boats, nor the loud noises, nor the danger. But I have no tolerance for cowboys in any boat, regardless of noise or propulsion. But I have no plans that involve eradicating vessels from lakes anytime soon. Many of us agree on the safety proposition, good place to start. |
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#22 | |
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#23 | |||
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![]() I am really confused, all that experience and these are your examples. Quote:
And speaking of that picture, I wonder if you would take responsibility for causing an accident on the water? If your signaling device were to impair the vision of the operator to cause an incident with another boat other than yourself, or triggered an epileptic event in the operator or an occupant of that boat. APS, why do your posts take hours to show up in these threads, it seems odd that after reading through these forums, the conversation shifts a little and then these posts just pop out up. This may be out of your control (connection, whatever), just did not know if you knew that was happening. Last edited by jmen24; 11-03-2009 at 04:43 PM. |
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#24 |
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He deserves an Emmy for the "stories" he has told over the years.
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#25 | |||
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A fair question regarding my CD warning-signals.
A bright flash of sunlight can cause a migraine "aura". That "aura" can—after a few minutes—temporarily blind those who are afflicted with that particular cousin of epilepsy. (Like myself). The flash from a CD is much less (and much "briefer") than the sun's flash off a flat windshield, say, of a Formula performance boat. Quote:
![]() ![]() My rev-limiter has been disabled on my "M-engine" (BMW-Motorsport Division). Concerned about missing a shift (and hitting 9500-RPMs) I relayed that concern to my tuner. My tuner replied: Quote:
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#26 | |
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As I am sure you are aware running WOT with a load applied (such as exiting a corner) and running WOT at redline (such as entering a corner or missing a shift) are two completely different animals and the damage to the vehicle is different (in most cases). |
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#27 | |
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I was told not to be too concerned with over revving in marine applications because of steady load. the rev limiters installed by the factory is only for warranty purpose and can be overrided with a reprogram of the ECU. Using the correct pitch prop to get WOT 'in the zone' A good rev limiter cuts out the spark one cylinder at a time to avoid a total shut down which could cause a mechanical shock and early parts failure. My last look at these products are good examples of rev limiters. The MSD and the Jacobs line.
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#28 |
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OCD Engine Update.
Just heard from down south........... And everything with the heads and block are fine. The heads were magnafluxed and they are allset. The Block was pressure tested and its good to go. Wow is that a relief!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So things should be coming together soon. Will keep you updated!
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#29 |
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24" Revolution 4 4 blade. Best prop so far.
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#30 |
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That's a mean prop BH. My little 5.0 couldn't turn the Rev4 I tried into a winner. My boat is far lighter than yours, but without the big block for torque. I really wanted the Rev 4 to work, because I heard it was a delight for fixing the Alpha Ones propensity for poor slow speed steering, particularly in reverse.
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#31 |
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My previous boat was a Liberator 211 with 350 Magnum. Originally came with a Michgan 19" SS prop. That was the best for that boat after trying tons of props. A 21" Laser was the best speed prop but it was subject to 'blow outs'. It also got the boat up to the point it will 'chine walk' at about 53 mph. Scary! The Liberator was a great boat for the 350. Highly recomend it.
The current Formula f 223 LS with 454 Magnum came with a 19" SS Mercury prop. It was hitting the rev limiter all the time. Swap for a 21" Bravo and again, hitting the rev limiter. Swap for a 23" Bravo and it appears to be a great all around prop. But I still hit the rev limiter. I tried the 25" Bravo solid hub and the boat flies! It was 400 rpm below the rev limiter, but 'blows out' easily in corners or if I try to do a hole shot. The current 24" prop is a delight. No blow outs. Less vibration. Same max rpm. Less speed but love the all around performance. I want to thank Ron at Lakeport Landing for the prop swaps. I also want to thank Eddie at Winnisquam Marine for swapping the 4 blade. I use EBay as well to buy and sell SS props. I have a 23" Bravo and a 25" Bravo solid hub for sale. Both 3 blades. I will accept any reasonable offer. I have a 23" aluminum. I keep that when I go on a body of water that I am not familiar with. ![]()
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#32 |
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#33 | ||
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TB, thanks for the support. Keep the faith. Don't let the phony KAing lull you. Here's a case where the driver admits to both drinking and speeding, leading to this accident that KILLED THREE. By the cult's logic of "two negatives make a positive", he did nothing wrong. "But he was intoxicated too!" they will shout. Doesn't say whether the dead were his innocent passengers or innocent people sitting on the dock he smashed into at 50MPH. "But he would have been breaking the 150 rule too!" they will shout. Perhaps his boat would have also violated our noise statute, rendering this accident "proof" that our SL should be repealed..."But his boat was too loud too!" ![]() http://www.13wham.com/news/local/sto...m2wijlbZQ.cspx |
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#35 | |
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Most of us own and use those things you refer to as speed bumps, however, we do know there is a time and place for everything (I for example choose not to run on Rt 109 even though it is legal). The only PM I have sent you is to offer condolences on your mother's passing (unacknowledged BTW but according to Emily Post you have a year to do so) Where did anyone say it was OK to drink and boat?? I bet my 14 year old son can out boat you any day of the week- he learned from a young age, from watching, from sitting on my lap, from listening. |
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