It Figures....

[gtagrip]

Two trolls show up in the SL thread and it gets shut down. Where have I seen this before!

[Bearislandmoose]

Originally Posted by gtagrip

Two trolls show up

So the moderator shuts a thread down because of this very type of personal attacking, and you immediately open a new thread to resume the exact same personal attacking? And are you going to blame someone else when this thread gets shut down too? I think this entire sub-forum was a mistake that should be shut down. It is nothing but an attractant and meeting place for the most vulgar and offensive layer of the region (and of Vermont). Let these bullies take up residence on some national forum where it will not be a scar on NH. NH is too good to have ambassadors like this. Don, please admit that this was a mistake and make this website a beacon of civility once again.
Joe

[VtSteve]

You usually see it any time factual disclosure is involved

It seems fine to do drive by random attacks, posting completely false rumors continuously. But let anyone refute with out and out facts, and Boom... closure. Note: That's not my Opinion, it is what it is.

[VtSteve]

It's pretty useless to give the time of day to people that ridicule The Coast Guard Rules of Navigation, and tell people that they support drunken boating. So in that light, I will now simply ignore those that come up with these ridiculous taunts.

Now onward and upward.

The thing to do is simply put out the information, and let people decide for themselves what's going on. Those of us on the boater safety side, typically have agreed with Marine Patrol Director Barrett, as well as the United States Coast Guard navigational and safety rules.


There's a reason that many that only support speed limits do not discuss accidents on lakes that already have speed limits. Hint, in almost every case, the cause of the accident was BUI and/or a violation of the USCG rules.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by VtSteve

The thing to do is simply put out the information, and let people decide for themselves what's going on.

All righty:

"Thanks to the Speed Limit, we've never had such a safe and successful boating season on Lake Winnipesaukee in memory."

[BroadHopper]

Whose 'We' APS?

You surely don't represent the whole lake. There are hundreds of us who are sick and tired of a small group of people saying they represent everyone who use the lake. My family grew up on the lake since 1892 and we are upset when folks just move to the lake and tell us what to do.

If you don't like the lake the way it is. Move on. I like it the way it is.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by gtagrip

What about all the chaos in the BP area? I here it's not so safe there!

The "usual suspects" can't understand peaceful boaters, and can't even seem to keep to the topic!

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Whose 'We' APS?

You surely don't represent the whole lake. There are hundreds of us who are sick and tired of a small group of people saying they represent everyone who use the lake. My family grew up on the lake since 1892 and we are upset when folks just move to the lake and tell us what to do.

Sorry, Sir, I'll get my boats out of your way—right away.

[gtagrip]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

The "usual suspects" can't understand peaceful boaters, and can't even seem to keep to the topic!



Sorry, Sir, I'll get my boats out of your way—right away.

Just like all you're incoherant ramblings are always on topic. That's the pot calling the kettle black!

[sunset on the dock]

I read through our present SL law today and was happy to see that we ALREADY have safe and prudent...why do we need anything more?

X.(a) No person shall operate a vessel on Lake Winnipesaukee at a speed greater than is reasonable and prudent under existing conditions and without regard for the actual and potential hazards then existing. In all cases, speed shall be controlled so that the operator will be able to avoid endangering or colliding with any person, vessel, object, or shore.

Glad that's settled...we just needed to review the law we already had. We don't need any more feel good laws!!

[Skip]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

I read through our present SL law today and was happy to see that we ALREADY have safe and prudent...why do we need anything more?

X.(a) No person shall operate a vessel on Lake Winnipesaukee at a speed greater than is reasonable and prudent under existing conditions and without regard for the actual and potential hazards then existing. In all cases, speed shall be controlled so that the operator will be able to avoid endangering or colliding with any person, vessel, object, or shore.

Glad that's settled...we just needed to review the law we already had. We don't need any more feel good laws!!

You are correct....we have discussed this provision several times in the past on this site.

Right, wrong or indifferent it shows me two things...that the current sponsors have not carefully researched existing legislation, and this proposal is intended to do only one thing. Repeal the existing speed limits on Winnipesaukee.

We can all agree or disagree or even discuss compromise over the existing speed limits, but first we need to be honest with what our intents truly are. In my opinion honesty and openess remains completely lacking in the proposed legislation. A very important reason why it will ultimately be ruled inexpedient to legislate.

Its too bad. I truly believe if SBONH had been honest and open and willing to sit down to the table then a true "modification" could have been brought forward, one that maybe opened up the Broads and looked at the existing limits. But by using the "throw the baby out with the bathwater" approach, SBONH is soon to find out the realities of politics in a small State like ours....

[melvin bay]

this letter in the sun seems a little different from the one in Sundays monitor:Letters
Republican mandate doesn't include repeal of boat speed limit
Dec 16, 2010 12:00 am
To the editor,

The concept of allowing boaters to decide for themselves how fast is “reasonable and prudent” is the only thing that can work on the ocean. Enforcing a set speed limit on the open seas is impossible. The best that can be done there is to have a law that can be applied after the fact, to decide whether an accident was the result of a crime. But Lake Winnipesaukee is not the ocean. It is a lake. Speed limits are enforceable here, they are working, and people have been obeying them. Allowing “thunder boaters” to decide for themselves how fast is “reasonable and prudent” is not necessary here, we can do much better than that, and we have been doing much better than that for three years. And with all the real issues our legislature has to worry about right now, is this something they should be mucking around with anyway?

Two years of a 45 MPH speed limit law after a one year Marine Patrol “informal test” have proven that those very few very aggressive cowboys who caused so much mayhem respect a black and white speed limit. Only twenty-some speeding tickets had to be issued over this period, proving what those that use the lake saw, what most people expected . . . how much more civil and “recreational” boating on Winnipesaukee was for all once again, and how people obey laws that are clear and unambiguous. Why even think about changing that? Especially with all the serious issues our legislators need to address.

The problem on Winnipesaukee has never been the responsible boater behind the helm of a fast boat . . . it has been the irresponsible cowboy who always wants to see what he can get away with. Cowboys are just big kids. Kids need to be given curfews and defined limits. . . 9 o'clock. . . four cookies. . . take a bath. They cannot decide from themselves. They are not mature or responsible enough. Telling a cowboy “Just go as fast as you feel is reasonable and prudent” is like telling a kid to just eat as much candy as he thinks he should. Kids have a different idea of what "reasonable and prudent" means than we do, Because we have adult minds, and they have adolescent minds.

Last summer, boating traffic on Winnipesaukee was as balanced and civil as we have seen for over 20 years. All of us got to enjoy our boats and enjoy the lake. Kids camps were sailing and canoeing again. Dealers were selling canoes and kayaks again. Waterside restaurants were struggling to find dock space again. Sailing clubs held regattas and sailing schools again. Rowers in skulls were out there in numbers never seen before. Fathers were taking their sons fishing again. And off-shore boats were still out there, going 45 MPH, which any boater knows is pretty darn fast on the water. No longer were the majority of family boaters being ruled by the aggressive boating of such a small minority, so why even think about going back? Especially with the real problems N.H. has for our elected officials to fix.

The election of Republicans to Concord in such a landslide was not a mandate to repeal such a functional law that even Republican voters favor so overwhelmingly. We elected Republicans to return fiscal responsibility to New Hampshire, not to return “thunder boating” to Winnipesaukee. Cowboys behind the wheels of thunder boats are not the “Republican” standard. That standard is embodied in the father who wants to get behind the wheel of his runabout to take his family for an ice cream, or take his kids tubing. Now he can do that again. Please don’t go back to the mayhem that so many hundreds of people described. . . the mayhem that the current law virtually eliminated.

Those who want Coast Guard rules should go to the ocean. Besides, there are important matters facing New Hampshire right now, and unleashing the “thunder boaters” to terrorize us once again is not one of them. That is not what we voted for.

Ed Chase

Meredith

[AllAbourdon]

Originally Posted by melvin bay

this letter in the sun seems a little different from the one in Sundays monitor:Letters
Republican mandate doesn't include repeal of boat speed limit
Dec 16, 2010 12:00 am
To the editor,

The concept of allowing boaters to decide for themselves how fast is “reasonable and prudent” is the only thing that can work on the ocean. Enforcing a set speed limit on the open seas is impossible. The best that can be done there is to have a law that can be applied after the fact, to decide whether an accident was the result of a crime. But Lake Winnipesaukee is not the ocean. It is a lake. Speed limits are enforceable here, they are working, and people have been obeying them. Allowing “thunder boaters” to decide for themselves how fast is “reasonable and prudent” is not necessary here, we can do much better than that, and we have been doing much better than that for three years. And with all the real issues our legislature has to worry about right now, is this something they should be mucking around with anyway?

Two years of a 45 MPH speed limit law after a one year Marine Patrol “informal test” have proven that those very few very aggressive cowboys who caused so much mayhem respect a black and white speed limit. Only twenty-some speeding tickets had to be issued over this period, proving what those that use the lake saw, what most people expected . . . how much more civil and “recreational” boating on Winnipesaukee was for all once again, and how people obey laws that are clear and unambiguous. Why even think about changing that? Especially with all the serious issues our legislators need to address.

The problem on Winnipesaukee has never been the responsible boater behind the helm of a fast boat . . . it has been the irresponsible cowboy who always wants to see what he can get away with. Cowboys are just big kids. Kids need to be given curfews and defined limits. . . 9 o'clock. . . four cookies. . . take a bath. They cannot decide from themselves. They are not mature or responsible enough. Telling a cowboy “Just go as fast as you feel is reasonable and prudent” is like telling a kid to just eat as much candy as he thinks he should. Kids have a different idea of what "reasonable and prudent" means than we do, Because we have adult minds, and they have adolescent minds.

Last summer, boating traffic on Winnipesaukee was as balanced and civil as we have seen for over 20 years. All of us got to enjoy our boats and enjoy the lake. Kids camps were sailing and canoeing again. Dealers were selling canoes and kayaks again. Waterside restaurants were struggling to find dock space again. Sailing clubs held regattas and sailing schools again. Rowers in skulls were out there in numbers never seen before. Fathers were taking their sons fishing again. And off-shore boats were still out there, going 45 MPH, which any boater knows is pretty darn fast on the water. No longer were the majority of family boaters being ruled by the aggressive boating of such a small minority, so why even think about going back? Especially with the real problems N.H. has for our elected officials to fix.

The election of Republicans to Concord in such a landslide was not a mandate to repeal such a functional law that even Republican voters favor so overwhelmingly. We elected Republicans to return fiscal responsibility to New Hampshire, not to return “thunder boating” to Winnipesaukee. Cowboys behind the wheels of thunder boats are not the “Republican” standard. That standard is embodied in the father who wants to get behind the wheel of his runabout to take his family for an ice cream, or take his kids tubing. Now he can do that again. Please don’t go back to the mayhem that so many hundreds of people described. . . the mayhem that the current law virtually eliminated.

Those who want Coast Guard rules should go to the ocean. Besides, there are important matters facing New Hampshire right now, and unleashing the “thunder boaters” to terrorize us once again is not one of them. That is not what we voted for.

Ed Chase

Meredith

Where's the facts? =( I guess it's just a letter to the editor but there are a lot of unsubstantiated claims in here.

[melvin bay]

Can anyone verify or hopefully refute these quotes from yesterdays Concord Monitor.I dont belong to off shoreonly forum.


There's no question reasonable and prudent does not apply to this crowd and the comment about "doubling the speed limit" is the tip of the iceberg. The head of SBONH, known as OCDACTIVE on some of the speed boat forums, writes on offshoreonly.com :
Regarding drinking: 1/25/10 OCDACTIVE writes : "I had started at noon and went to shots at 8 PM then forgot to eat".
1/25/10 "But you know one thing leads to another, things get a little crazy, you become forgetful and wake up on the floor in the dogs bed with a raging headache".
1/28/10, in response to a comment about the"poor stock " at Hooters: "Well if we are there from noon until 11 PM they are bound to look a little better".

This is not the kind of talk that gives one the impression that the head of a safe boating organization has a clue about reasonable and prudent. Should this group be lecturing us about boating safety and what laws we should enact? My concern after reading these comments was that this person was in danger of (figuratively) crashing and burning in a manner similar to Ms. Blizzard. And the new and former state reps. who have been linked with SBONH and have attended their events...they need to take a fresh look at what an association with this group really represents.
People on the lake are tired of this kind of behavior from a small minority of immature men who wish to race their oversized overpowered boats all around the lake and that's why they pushed for speed limits. Today's article in the Monitor is a clear example of how reasonable and prudent will not work for this crowd. I don't trust SBONH!

[DEJ]

Melvin, it is unfortunate that you didn't read the next comment immediately following that refutes the quotes and questions the intent of the comments to begin with. I hope that this was just an oversight on your part and not just an attempt to stir the pot and try to misdirect the true debate.

Another case of if you cant win the arguement go personalBy bobf - 12/22/2010 - 8:38 pm
Millie your reply is just one in a string of "when you cant win the arguement go personal"
You and your fellow supports of speed limits have nothing to stand on with regards to speed limits on the lake, nothing, no facts no figures ....no nothing, so when you cant win the battle of whats right and wrong here, you go personal. Taking some old posts from a web forum, snipping them up so they read out of context is not very honest now is it. Any one who knows the president of SBONH, KNOWS that he does not drink and drive ANYTHING, not ever, not even maybe. ITs NEVER. So lets move on here shall we.....

[VtSteve]

As I recall, he's pretty famous for having O'Douls and any other non-alcoholic beverage. Whichever troll you are Melvin, you really barked up the wrong tree there. You have to be quite a person to put something like that in a paper.

And for instigators worried about who's being an adult, where are you now?

Relentless personal attacks and lies, quite a group you have there. It's enough to make anyone wonder if anything you guys say has any degree of truth to it. Amazingly weak cases when you have to resort to things like that, simply amazing.

[ishoot308]

Well Melvin, all I can say is I invited the President of SBONH over to my camp on Winni for a beer and a meet and greet last year. He informed me at that time that he never drinks anything not even one beer before or while operating his boat but would gladly have an O'douls (non alcoholic) if I had any. That meeting never happened because of the weather that day but I can assure you he was dead serious about no alcohol!

Your post is B.S. and is only here to stir the pot. Sorry, but I'm not biting. I only posted this because I know the facts not the fiction like you!

Dan

[hazelnut]

Add me to the list of people that has offered OCD a beer at my camp on Cow Island and he flat out refused stating:

"It's O'Douls for me when I'm behind the wheel of anything, There's plenty of time for a beer after the OCDACTIVE is tied up safely at my dock."

Scott is EXTREMELY sensitive to this matter and has a self enforced ZERO tolerance policy when it comes to alcohol and operation of his vessel. What a sad, sad state of affairs that these people have slumped to this level.

[chipj29]

Hi melvin,
Just one question: Do you feel it is OK to drink alcohol (and possibly become impaired) when you are not driving?

[gtagrip]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

All righty:

What about all the chaos in the BP area? I here it's not so safe there!

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by gtagrip

What about all the chaos in the BP area? I here it's not so safe there!

Be careful gta you're using logic. These folks want their cake AND they want to eat it too.

The Speed Limit is working but only in select areas where they want you to believe it is working. The Barbers Pole is a drag strip where cowboys drive at WOT! It's the only place on the lake where this occurs.

-------> Watch the above comment as it will be snipped and re-posted by APS as an admission by me that the BP needs a NWZ. <--------

[gtagrip]

Originally Posted by hazelnut

Be careful gta you're using logic. These folks want their cake AND they want to eat it too.

The Speed Limit is working but only in select areas where they want you to believe it is working. The Barbers Pole is a drag strip where cowboys drive at WOT! It's the only place on the lake where this occurs.

-------> Watch the above comment as it will be snipped and re-posted by APS as an admission by me that the BP needs a NWZ. <--------

Sorry, I lost my head there for a moment!

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by hazelnut

Be careful gta you're using logic. These folks want their cake AND they want to eat it too.

The Speed Limit is working but only in select areas where they want you to believe it is working. The Barbers Pole is a drag strip where cowboys drive at WOT! It's the only place on the lake where this occurs.

-------> Watch the above comment as it will be snipped and re-posted by APS as an admission by me that the BP needs a NWZ. <--------

A drag strip...that's a good one HN! You can re-name the Barber's Pole to: "New Hampshire Motorboat Speedway". Might as well give Loudon a run for their money.

Honestly, I think the drag strip should be relocated to Winter Harbor.

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

"Seriously" Dhuberty24?......As far as I'm concerned the president of The Safe Boaters of New Hampshire (SBONH) should be squeaky clean.

I would think that you would be disgusted that all this information has been found about the leader of such an important function.

Drinking and boating do not mix and it really doesn't matter that it happened in 2006 or 2010.

Oh my god! And this is the problem. Wake up! YS don't get mixed up in this you actually seem to have character. At least o thought so. Scott has a zero tolerance boating and or driving under the influence policy. I can tell you that he won't even sniff a beer and drive. FACT! These losers that are trying to infer that he does do not deserve your acknowledgement. Don't get dragged into this. You are above it. It's sad really really sad that these people have zero lives and I know Sam you are better than this.

I for one would trust Scott behind the wheel of any vehicle vessel etc with mine and the lives of my children. I've never seen him consume even one beverage of adult nature ever and drive. He refuses emphatically. What he does when not driving is none of my concern. Who here is all of a sudden high and mighty because a guy likes to drink and NOT drive??? This is a joke of a thread.

[hazelnut]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

No....there is just one individual. His name is Sunset on the Rusty Yosemite Turtle who Chases over the many Acres off Bear Island and Skips across Melvin Bay. There, isn't it much easier on the psyche thinking there is just one person in opposition to the speeed limit?

Sunset. Don't make light of this. You'll end up looking silly. There really and truly is one person that keeps making new screen names. Ask the webmaster. It's true. It's sad. But it is true. I mean it doesn't mean anything but don't get into this one because you might regret it.

[Rusty]

On the Lakeshoreonly forum "Mike61965" told "wananewboat" that he got a "RUSH" when two boats on Lake Winni came within 25 ft from him. He said they must have been going "a hundred".
Then "wananewboat" says: "And they wonder why they are putting a speed limit on the lake."

The orignal post from "Mike61965" is missing. There has been a lot of editing and removal of posts that deal with speed and drinking. It's hard to get the whole conversation because of this.

Here it is:

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Rusty

On the Lakeshoreonly forum "Mike61965" told "wananewboat" that he got a "RUSH" when two boats on Lake Winni came within 25 ft from him. He said they must have been going "a hundred".
Then "wananewboat" says: "And they wonder why they are putting a speed limit on the lake."

The orignal post from "Mike61965" is missing. There has been a lot of editing and removal of posts that deal with speed and drinking. It's hard to get the whole conversation because of this.

Here it is:

Reminds me of the time when ElChase almost got run over on the lake while fishing with his son. Of course, they only got a good laugh out of it because it was not a thunder boat (cue APS for a lesson on kinetic energy).

Now I know why Google is posting record profit #s.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Reminds me of the time when ElChase almost got run over on the lake while fishing with his son. Of course, they only got a good laugh out of it because it was not a thunder boat (cue APS for a lesson on kinetic energy).

Now I know why Google is posting record profit #s.

So in your view a Thunder Boat (your words) going 100 MPH within 25 feet of another boater is funny.

I really hope that all the NH State Legislators read this forum so they can see what a member of the SBONH thinks is funny.

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Rusty

So in your view a Thunder Boat (your words) going 100 MPH within 25 feet of another boater is funny.

I really hope that all the NH State Legislators read this forum so they can see what a member of the SBONH thinks is funny.

Rusty, Can you tell me where I said anything about a performance boat doing anything?? Anywhere?? Please find it and post it. Please find and post anything you can find about me that does not support safety regarding anything I partake in. Or laughing about it?

I merely pointed out the absurdity of the post. If you need, you can search back into past posts from your hero, ElChase, regarding the story he told on this forum about nearly being run over and laughing about it.

Skip, If you have an issue with me please let me know what it is. This thank you was directed at me. Can you find where I laughed at anything to do with these boats that were referenced above? If you have something to say, then say it, instead of dropping a little thank you in here and there.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

Rusty, Can you tell me where I said anything about a performance boat doing anything?? Anywhere?? Please find it and post it. Please find and post anything you can find about me that does not support safety regarding anything I partake in. Or laughing about it?

I merely pointed out the absurdity of the post. If you need, you can search back into past posts from your hero, ElChase, regarding the story he told on this forum about nearly being run over and laughing about it.

Skip, If you have an issue with me please let me know what it is. This thank you was directed at me. Can you find where I laughed at anything to do with these boats that were referenced above? If you have something to say, then say it, instead of dropping a little thank you in here and there.

My hero "Elchase"??? Who is "Elchase"?

What I post has nothing to do with any other forum members comments or thoughts.

You said that the 100 MPH Boat comment reminded you of a post by forum member “Elchase” who thought something was funny. Therefore I took it that you think my post was just as funny as his.

Why do you and other SBONH members make a joke out of everything that is posted about someone speeding or drinking alcohol on Lake Winni? Is it the wrong data that you want to here?

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Rusty

My hero "Elchase"??? Who is "Elchase"?

What I post has nothing to do with any other forum members comments or thoughts.

You said that the 100 MPH Boat comment reminded you of a post by forum member “Elchase” who thought something was funny. Therefore I took it that you think my post was just as funny as his.

Why do you and other SBONH members make a joke out of everything that is posted about someone speeding or drinking alcohol on Lake Winni? Is it the wrong data that you want to here?

You took my comment and tried to twist it but failed miserably. That was the biggest leap to a conclusion I have seen in a while.

How do you know what I think is or is not funny? Have you been reading past posts? If so, you are fully aware of who ElChase/BearIslandMoose is and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

For the record, I have been consistent in my messages on this forum and others about what I believe. I have never joked about speeding or drinking (while boating) on the lake.

I suggest you spend a few hours reading every post I have ever made on this forum (or any other one you may try to find) and find out how I truly feel about this lake. Read and find out how I feel about BWI, Erica Blizzard, speed or any other topic and then come back and report in.

Have a good day, while you are doing that I will be out snowmobiling!

What was discouraging was you got a guy that I had respect for to thank you for your obtuse attempt to smear me. Skip, you are welcome!

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

You took my comment and tried to twist it but failed miserably. That was the biggest leap to a conclusion I have seen in a while.

How do you know what I think is or is not funny? Have you been reading past posts? If so, you are fully aware of who ElChase/BearIslandMoose is and it is disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

For the record, I have been consistent in my messages on this forum and others about what I believe. I have never joked about speeding or drinking (while boating) on the lake.

I suggest you spend a few hours reading every post I have ever made on this forum (or any other one you may try to find) and find out how I truly feel about this lake. Read and find out how I feel about BWI, Erica Blizzard, speed or any other topic and then come back and report in.

Have a good day, while you are doing that I will be out snowmobiling!

What was discouraging was you got a guy that I had respect for to thank you for your obtuse attempt to smear me. Skip, you are welcome!

I hope that Skip thanked me for agreeing with my post rather than to get you upset. It really doesn’t matter because I don’t post something just to get a Thank You.

Please don’t think that I am trying to smear you, I just don’t understand why you compared my post with another forum members post that was laughable.

I guess I’ll never really know what you meant by your original post.

Anyway have a good day snowmobiling!

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by Rusty

I hope that Skip thanked me for agreeing with my post rather than to get you upset. It really doesn’t matter because I don’t post something just to get a Thank You.

Please don’t think that I am trying to smear you, I just don’t understand why you compared my post with another forum members post that was laughable.

I guess I’ll never really know what you meant by your original post.

Anyway have a good day snowmobiling!

You all have fun at you next gathering. Don;t forget to tear up the liquor receipts Rusty, never can be too careful.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by VtSteve

You all have fun at you next gathering. Don;t forget to tear up the liquor receipts Rusty, never can be too careful.

"Rusty"???? Who is "Rusty"?

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by Rusty

"Rusty"???? Who is "Rusty"?

Apparently, your current screen name?

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by VtSteve

Apparently, your current screen name?

I said that as a joke because Yankee stated that I have "Dissociative Identity Disorder". I tried to be funny and I guess it failed.

I am Rusty and only Rusty.

I read some of Elchase's comments and I really don't want to be him.

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by Rusty

I said that as a joke because Yankee stated that I have "Dissociative Identity Disorder". I tried to be funny and I guess it failed.

I am Rusty and only Rusty.

I read some of Elchase's comments and I really don't want to be him.

I don't think he does either, neither does BearIslandMoose, or any other name he uses. But El's not even his real name. (Neither is Ed).

Now That's a real Identity Disorder. But it's his anyway.

So Rusty, you in the restaurant biz?

[BroadHopper]

To clear things up. The Great Rusty Maclear, the guy who is turning Meredith into a company town, joined WINFABS to take the heat off his losing evidence in a felony case. Looks like it did as everyone seems to forget his bad intentions. I also caught his landscaper using fertilizer loaded with phosphate on his lakefront property.

And the great Sandy, another WINFABS founder loves to flaunt her Prius. Whose carbon footprint is a heck of a lot bigger than my old '69 Power Wagon. She also likes the fact that her cobalt batteries support mass genocide in Africa. The precious metal cobalt is expensive for that reason.

I don't consider WINFABS to be squeaky clean.

[VtSteve]

There are WINNFAB people here that are anonymous, some with more than one name, some several. They love secrecy. There were two now infamous accidents on Winni, one of which happened after the skipper that caused it became totally sloshed when drinking at a certain establishment. The Court documents contained testimony as to his inebriation, his wild actions, and his going down to get in his boat. He was so sloshed, he first forgot to untie the boat before leaving

Shortly after that, people got together to try an get a speed limit passed. One person that was very helpful and supportive of these actions, was the owner of the restaurant where the skipper that caused the accident drank himself silly. Mysteriously, no receipts were available for the jury to see just how much and how often. The testimony was clearly evident. IMO, I think the same accident would have occurred if that area had been a NWZ. I also think that the same accident, which in testimony given was at 28 mph, still would have happened today.

IMNSHO, that accident would NOT have occurred if the restaurant in question had not so blatantly over-served the inebriated skipper. Perhaps proper training was given to employees AFTER this took place, and BEFORE the owner became so preoccupied with a personal vendetta? Who knows, nobody discusses this.

There are people that have

What I do know is what almost every law enforcement officer on the planet knows.

1) Most accidents occur at night, and most are alcohol-related.

(nice of the WINNFAB folks to start taking an interest in BUI lately)

2) The common cause of daytime accidents is inattention, too fast for conditions, too close to other boaters. Also, outright arrogance, selfish behavior and all that.

3) The VAST majority of all accidents on the lake have been at speeds lower than the current speed limits.

4) Give the MP a mission to combat BUI, and reckless behavior that endangers people, and the situation will only improve.

Warning: No facts have been killed, nor is this a cowardly drive-by random attack on anyone's character. If any of this is offensive to anyone, feel free to thank me below. Feel free to add some facts that I might have omitted. If you think #1 through #4 are not true, feel free to pass them by any Law Enforcement Officer or agency for review.

There are those that continue to think safe waterways can happen with public support, and with OPEN, honest public discussions. Safety can happen if everyone is upfront, and involved. It can happen only if the MP is given both the mission and the resources to do just that. Sadly, those promoting speed limits never worked with the MP, and had an antagonistic relationship with them. Sadly, safety is not in their agenda.

[VtSteve]

Speed Enforcement Statistics for Lake Winnipesaukee


2009 2010
Summons Warnings Summons Warnings
NWZ Violations
9 41 17 72


Speed Under Bridge
0 0 3 1


Speed Limit Violations
1 26 8 12


It certainly looks like the MP was busy at NWZ's.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by VtSteve

"IMNSHO, that accident would NOT have occurred if the restaurant in question had not so blatantly over-served the inebriated skipper..."

The inebriated skipper had enough wits about him to run from the scene of the fatality, and he wasn't alone. So how can one tell that the skipper was "blatantly over-served"?

Yup...The Solution is to blame the waitress!

Originally Posted by VtSteve

What I do know is what almost every law enforcement officer on the planet knows.

1) Most accidents occur at night, and most are alcohol-related...Feel free to add some facts that I might have omitted.

Look Again:

http://www.google.com/search?sourcei...ght%2C+boating

BoatTEST magazine:

After Dark Speed Limit

"The fact is, there ought to be a speed limit for operating boats at night on inland and coastal waters. As regular readers of BoatTEST know, we bridle at government imposed regulation, but when we read about the tragedies that occur at night because someone was thoughtlessly going 50 mph instead of 10 mph, we reconsider.

We urge you simply to set your own speed limit when operating your boat at night. 8 to 10 mph seems about right to us. That’s right; off plane and mushing along if you are in a hurry, and at fast idle if you are not. This prudence only has to pay off once in your lifetime to make it well worth it.

—http://www.boattest.com/resources/vi...spx?NewsID=974

BoatTEST on ejected passengers:

Death By Jumping

"...was last seen about 6:15 PM Sunday May 25th when he jumped from a boat traveling 35-40 mph...The boat was traveling 35-40 mph when Gruber jumped into the lake. Witnesses said Gruber went under the water and never resurfaced. The water is about 60 ft. deep where the incident occurred...People usually think of water as “soft.” But when an object – a boat’s hull or a person’s body – is hurtling at it at 40 mph, is more like concrete."

—http://www.boattest.com/resources/vi...spx?NewsID=974

So, BoatTEST magazine says, 40-MPH is a very fast speed on water.

You may quote me today, as being the very first member at this forum to say the following:

"Forty-MPH is a very fast speed on water."

[gtagrip]

Originally Posted by VitaBene

What was discouraging was you got a guy that I had respect for to thank you for your obtuse attempt to smear me. Skip, you are welcome!

For someone, i.e. Skip who was so disgusted when this whole sub forum was created is acting like a 3 year old like the other trolls and peaking around the corner to through in "Thank Yous" here and there to "stir the pot". Skip, I thought you didn't follow this sub forum? If you have something to say, why don't you say it since you feel so strongly on the subject. Others here at least who post "Thank Yous" post something to say after the fact. Talk about a child. I really did at one point value what you had to say, now, not so much.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Rusty

My hero "Elchase"??? Who is "Elchase"?

What I post has nothing to do with any other forum members comments or thoughts.

You said that the 100 MPH Boat comment reminded you of a post by forum member “Elchase” who thought something was funny. Therefore I took it that you think my post was just as funny as his.

Why do you and other SBONH members make a joke out of everything that is posted about someone speeding or drinking alcohol on Lake Winni? Is it the wrong data that you want to here?

The NHMP stats would indicate that speeding and alcohol are not the primary violations on NH waters. But of course that doesn't matter to you.

[Yankee]

Originally Posted by Rusty

My hero "Elchase"??? Who is "Elchase"?

I think that Dissociative Identity Disorder is a sad, tragic disease.

[Yankee]

Originally Posted by Yankee

I think that Dissociative Identity Disorder is a sad, tragic disease.

I appreciate the "thanks for the useful post" Rusty. Apparently your arrogance does not allow you to realize that your sarcasm is construed as an admission that you and Elchase are one and the same. Which of course means that you are also melvin bay, bearislandmoose et al...

In the final analysis it allows me to once again call you out as a liar.

That is twice in one thread that I have shown you to be a liar. The sad part is it that was not at all difficult. And yes I am keeping a tally. Please keep it up, your are doing wonders to show all concerned the kind and type of individual that you are, and what your position has degenerated into.

Carry on.

[Rusty]

Originally Posted by Yankee

I appreciate the "thanks for the useful post" Rusty. Apparently your arrogance does not allow you to realize that your sarcasm is construed as an admission that you and Elchase are one and the same. Which of course means that you are also melvin bay, bearislandmoose et al...

In the final analysis it allows me to once again call you out as a liar.

That is twice in one thread that I have shown you to be a liar. The sad part is it that was not at all difficult. And yes I am keeping a tally. Please keep it up, your are doing wonders to show all concerned the kind and type of individual that you are, and what your position has degenerated into.

Carry on.

I think you better be careful who you call a "liar"..and I mean it! I am not Elchase...period!

But if you think I am (which you do) why did you say this:

"Please ignore this EL" and "do not feed the troll".


What has changed your mind young fella?

Is it hard to not practice what you preach?

Below is what you said: