Can I put out my own marker???

[codeman671]

After another frustrating weekend of people cutting the corner too close to our property, I am wondering of the legality of putting up my own caution marker, or something else that will either push traffic out a bit or give me a solid idea of the exact location of 150' out so that I have something to prove my gripe with.

Has anyone tried this before or looked into it? Our moorings are 90'+/- out and I have had boats come INSIDE them. I am afraid to leave a boat on my mooring all night as I am confident that someone would nail it.

[Little Bear]

Originally Posted by codeman671

After another frustrating weekend of people cutting the corner too close to our property, I am wondering of the legality of putting up my own caution marker, or something else that will either push traffic out a bit or give me a solid idea of the exact location of 150' out so that I have something to prove my gripe with.

Has anyone tried this before or looked into it? Our moorings are 90'+/- out and I have had boats come INSIDE them. I am afraid to leave a boat on my mooring all night as I am confident that someone would nail it.

Put out a swim raft. Production Trailer in Meredith and Center Harbor Dock & Pier both have the bright yellow, plastic rafts. The good thing about the raft (vs a marker) is that by law, boats have to stay 150' from the raft itself. No permit required, but it cannot be a hazard to navigation.

[kjbathe]

From the water sports page of the classifieds, I just saw the following...

"Please come and pick up your new (old) raft any time FOR FREE!! It is moored in front of 194 Rattlesnake Island and ready to be towed away. "

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by kjbathe

From the water sports page of the classifieds, I just saw the following...

"Please come and pick up your new (old) raft any time FOR FREE!! It is moored in front of 194 Rattlesnake Island and ready to be towed away. "

I wonder if this is a neighbor mad at another and is playing a really bad joke on them

[kjbathe]

Hard to tell, but the details in the remainder of the ad made it seem legit.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Little Bear

Put out a swim raft. Production Trailer in Meredith and Center Harbor Dock & Pier both have the bright yellow, plastic rafts. The good thing about the raft (vs a marker) is that by law, boats have to stay 150' from the raft itself. No permit required, but it cannot be a hazard to navigation.

Yep - that is exactly what we did a few years ago. We put a wooden swim raft out 135' or so from our shoreline, about 75' off the end and to the left of our boat dock. The swim raft pushed the boats way away from our dock and, more imporatantly, from our little swimmers, and the kids love it. We now have an Aquajump too, and that is even better, since it is large and colorful, like the swim rafts suggested above.

- Frank

[Mink Islander]

What seems to happen there is that boats heading East to West through there often leave little room for boats exiting the Mark Island channel heading West to East. Most of the time the West to East boaters will try to hug the shore closer to your place to maintain maximum separation from the oncoming traffic rather than come off plane like they're supposed to to adhere to the 150 ft rule. Of course the oncoming traffic will rarely slow down either. I'm a little incredulous that some bonehead would cut inside your moorings, but not atypical behavior these days, sadly. I definitely agree that a boat moored there overnight would be at risk of getting hit particularly if the wind was blowing the stern out. Not sure a raft would be the best solution either from a pure safety perspective at night, but you'd be within your rights, I suppose.

I have long thought that a NWZ through that channel is the best and most practical solution. It's not even 150 ft wide anyway and boats fly past each other through there. Add weekend congestion and you see bad behavior constantly with the crush of boats looking to pass through there on a nice day. With a NWZ, seems to me there'd be no need to hug the shore so close to your place anymore.

The beauty of a NWZ is that it's easy to understand, and easy to enforce and affects all boaters the same. It would add a minute or two to my and everyone else's travel time. Small price to pay to just calm things down a bit in one of the busier pinch points in the lake.

It would take petitioning from island residents to make that a reality -- that's what happened between Pine and Bear Islands some years back and the gap between those islands is 10X that of the Mark Island channel. Good idea? I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

[Resident 2B]

Originally Posted by Mink Islander

What seems to happen there is that boats heading East to West through there often leave little room for boats exiting the Mark Island channel heading West to East. Most of the time the West to East boaters will try to hug the shore closer to your place to maintain maximum separation from the oncoming traffic rather than come off plane like they're supposed to to adhere to the 150 ft rule. Of course the oncoming traffic will rarely slow down either. I'm a little incredulous that some bonehead would cut inside your moorings, but not atypical behavior these days, sadly. I definitely agree that a boat moored there overnight would be at risk of getting hit particularly if the wind was blowing the stern out. Not sure a raft would be the best solution either from a pure safety perspective at night, but you'd be within your rights, I suppose.

I have long thought that a NWZ through that channel is the best and most practical solution. It's not even 150 ft wide anyway and boats fly past each other through there. Add weekend congestion and you see bad behavior constantly with the crush of boats looking to pass through there on a nice day. With a NWZ, seems to me there'd be no need to hug the shore so close to your place anymore.

The beauty of a NWZ is that it's easy to understand, and easy to enforce and affects all boaters the same. It would add a minute or two to my and everyone else's travel time. Small price to pay to just calm things down a bit in one of the busier pinch points in the lake.

It would take petitioning from island residents to make that a reality -- that's what happened between Pine and Bear Islands some years back and the gap between those islands is 10X that of the Mark Island channel. Good idea? I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

In this case a new NWZ makes sense to me as well. This seems to be in the best interest of all boaters and the shore front owners.

R2B

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Mink Islander

It would take petitioning from island residents to make that a reality -- that's what happened between Pine and Bear Islands some years back and the gap between those islands is 10X that of the Mark Island channel. Good idea? I'd sign up in a heartbeat.

I had mentioned just that on a different thread, particularly in discussion of safety for Camp Lawrence. I just put a call into MP and started a formal inquiry into it. I'll keep interested parties informed as I hear more.

I think that by putting a swim raft out there it would be definite trouble.

[Island Life]

We put bleach bottles out to mark some huge rocks that are within 150' of our shoreline but are scarred from the many boats that have hit them over the years. Boats see the bottles and veer out - as they should. Our kids swim out to those rocks often, so it's always frightening to see a boat barrel through at full speed. We wave them out and they wave back at us, like we're just being friendly or something. Well, it's their propellor!

[John A. Birdsall]

a neighbor trying to teach his kids the distance of 150' put a clorox bottle 150' from shore. They got a ticket for going to close to the bottle (within 150')

Markers are nice. My morings winter marker was found this weekend on the bottom of the lake where some nice propellar found it prior to 10 May but after Ice out. sure hope his propellar wasn't damaged. No excuse for hitting it as it was florecent orange.

[nightrider]

A fair amount of people have winter markers for their moorings just UNDER the surface of the water which, to me, is not only a navigational hazard but a hazard to those fisher persons who troll just after ice out and before therse twirps get their mooring balls on them. They are a danger to props, outdrives and fishing lures. Is there any law regulating just-under-the-water winter moorings????

[Lakegeezer]

Originally Posted by John A. Birdsall

a neighbor trying to teach his kids the distance of 150' put a clorox bottle 150' from shore. They got a ticket for going to close to the bottle (within 150')

What law says you have to stay 150 feet from a clorox bottle?

[NightWing]

Originally Posted by Little Bear

Put out a swim raft. Production Trailer in Meredith and Center Harbor Dock & Pier both have the bright yellow, plastic rafts. The good thing about the raft (vs a marker) is that by law, boats have to stay 150' from the raft itself. No permit required, but it cannot be a hazard to navigation.

Be careful with that one. You just can't put rafts out to make people maintain distance from your property. A swim raft is supposed to be located far enough out to allow diving and swimming. If you have deep water 50 feet out from shore, that is where the raft should go. Shallow all the way to 150 feet? It goes there. Stick one out in deep water just to keep boats away? Nope. Asking for trouble.

[NightWing]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

What law says you have to stay 150 feet from a clorox bottle?

None. The statement is strange. Who is "they" who got the ticket?

[Kamper]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

What law says you have to stay 150 feet from a clorox bottle?

Nothing says a swim safety line has to have more than one marker. That's probably what the MP would have said if pressed. Just guessing though.

[Mashugana]

Originally Posted by Kamper

Nothing says a swim safety line has to have more than one marker. That's probably what the MP would have said if pressed. Just guessing though.

You need the proper permits to have a swim line. I think the position and distance from shore are outlined in the permit process. Other conditions may apply. One bleach bottle does not qualify as a swim marker IMHO.

I don't know about permits for rafts. I thought there was a formula about depth and distance from shore. Someone must know and will post it.

[KonaChick]

As far as I know you do not need a permit for a swim raft.

[Little Bear]

Originally Posted by NightWing

Be careful with that one. You just can't put rafts out to make people maintain distance from your property. A swim raft is supposed to be located far enough out to allow diving and swimming. If you have deep water 50 feet out from shore, that is where the raft should go. Shallow all the way to 150 feet? It goes there. Stick one out in deep water just to keep boats away? Nope. Asking for trouble.

Nightwing, I never suggested that he put the raft further than practical (although I have yet to see the specific rule that you infer reference to, except that it cannot be a hazard to navigation). However, even if he put it 50' out, that would technically give him another 150' buffer from the raft location - perfectly within his legal rights.

[NightWing]

Originally Posted by Little Bear

Nightwing, I never suggested that he put the raft further than practical (although I have yet to see the specific rule that you infer reference to, except that it cannot be a hazard to navigation). However, even if he put it 50' out, that would technically give him another 150' buffer from the raft location - perfectly within his legal rights.

I agree with the effective buffer zone. My cautionary note was intended to enlighten anyone who believed they could extend their "shorefront rights" (LOL) and keep boats away just by putting a swim raft or two out as a deterrent to boat traffic. That, of course, is commandeering part of a public body of water for private interests and it is not allowed.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

I am trying to remember if I have ever actually seen a human being on a swim platform. Nope can't remember a single one. Many must be for traffic control.

[Mink Islander]

Originally Posted by NightWing

I agree with the effective buffer zone. My cautionary note was intended to enlighten anyone who believed they could extend their "shorefront rights" (LOL) and keep boats away just by putting a swim raft or two out as a deterrent to boat traffic. That, of course, is commandeering part of a public body of water for private interests and it is not allowed.

Commandeering a public body of water? Are you kidding? Everytime someone puts in a legal dock, mooring or raft into the lake, they create a "150 ft rule" buffer in the lake that wasn't there before. That's all. They didn't take it away from you; they altered its use ever so slightly. So what if you have to stay a little further out from shore for safety's sake when you're speeding along. You have issues with that? You're concerned that shore front owners might put moorings and rafts in front of their houses to "commandere" the lake from you? Some sneaky effort to privatize the lake shoreline? My eyes well up just thinking about what a horrible stripping of your "rights" this constitutes.

Is it lost on you that you can still troll by at headway speed in this buffer zone? -- even between the raft and shore -- fishermen do that all the time. You can still do everything you always could in a public body of water except you can't go screaming by on plane within 150 ft of an area clearly identifiable as somewhere people frequently swim. Again, my eyes dampen at the unbearable hardship this must create for you...those selfish landowners, tsk tsk

It's hardly "extending shoreline rights" to put a raft in the lake even if the true motive is to push fast boat traffic a little further off-shore. It's our right as shorefront land owners to put in rafts (and moorings) so long as we're not creating a navigation hazard and otherwise meet the state's requirements. It makes good safety sense too. I'm hoping you agree.

[SBC]

Guess Mink didn't see the humor, ie the LOL in your reply there Nightwing. Geez Louise some folks it mighty riled.

Here's a note of interest:
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/...270/270-26.htm and then this one too: http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/...0/270-26-b.htm

[John A. Birdsall]

The people that got a ticket was a neighbor and perhaps it was when the law was new, and the cop needed his "quota" I do not know if they went to court or just paid the ticket.

As for bouy marker in the winter, I do not put it just under the water, it is above the water and is painted florecent orange. We used to use a yellow anti-freeze bottle. Is it legal? I have not idea, but is something that must be grandfathered in as I believe my grandfather did it. hmm.

[Bear Islander]

A Marine Patrol Officer spoke at an association meeting on Bear Island a few years ago. He answered quite a few questions about the Marine Patrol.

He was asked about the practice of using bleach bottles as markers for rocks, shallows etc. His answer was more practical than legal. He indicated that if they thought it was a good idea they would leave it, otherwise they would remove it.

Perhaps there is a "common law" right to identify hazards in front of your property.

[Newbiesaukee]

This seemed to be the case, at least yesterday. The MP came by yesterday to replace a marker which had disappeared over the winter. He noted my neighbor's bleach bottles which he puts out in a particularly bad area, and just proceeded to replace the "official" marker about 30 feet away.

[Kamper]

Just a thought... Iif you are markng an obstruction, write that on the bleach bottle as large as you can.

eg: ROCKS, SHALLOW, LEDGE, WATER-INLET, PILE, MOORING, EX-WIFE.



I believe you are also supposed to put your name and address on any bouy you install and they are supposed to be consisently shaped with the official bouy system (Back-top/Red-top, channel markers, hazard). I doubt you will get hassled over a bleach bottle though. Since private markers seldom make it onto a chart the bottles are a lot safer to hit than a spar or can.

Putting a little sand in the bottle will help it float upright and be a little more visible.

[Bear Islander]

I would think making a private marker look like an official marker was a bad idea. It could be confused for the real thing.



There is no size minimum for a swim raft. I once made one by lasing a couple of inner tubes to a door. It was great for "king of the raft"