Just what defines a Flatlander

[LIforrelaxin]

So the term flatlander gets thrown around from time to time. Some people get there tail feathers all in a bunch when they here it because they think it describes them when maybe it doesn't. Or they feel unjustly lumped into the group because of where they live.

Well let me start by saying this... A flatlander is not defined by where they live. But rather by their behaviors. There need to force their beliefs and what they feel life should be like on others.

There are many qualities that make up a flatlander, here is our chance to discuss what those qualities truely are.

I personally am not a flatlander, nor am I a northern NH'ite or Mainer, or a Vermonter.... I am however a Redneck.... who just stuck up here in the north do to work and family......

[NoBozo]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

So the term flatlander gets thrown around from time to time. Some people get there tail feathers all in a bunch when they here it because they think it describes them when maybe it doesn't. Or they feel unjustly lumped into the group because of where they live.

Well let me start by saying this... A flatlander is not defined by where they live. But rather by their behaviors. There need to force their beliefs and what they feel life should be like on others.

There are many qualities that make up a flatlander, here is our chance to discuss what those qualities truely are.

I personally am not a flatlander, nor am I a northern NH'ite or Mainer, or a Vermonter.... I am however a Redneck.... who just stuck up here in the north do to work and family......

A Flatlander is an Outsider...(Non Native) Nothing more complicated than that. NB

[WinnDixie]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

A Flatlander is an Outsider...(Non Native) Nothing more complicated than that. NB

Hmmm, my husband and I are natives who spent most of our lives in NH, but have ended up going "outside". Hopefully we still retain our "native status", or are we "nueveau" flatlanders"?

[Pineedles]

I object to any pigeon hole classification for anyone. I have fought my own prejudices throughout the years to come to this point. If we must place people into any holes, then let's make sure that we include a rope so they can climb out. And after they climb out let's throw the folks who placed them in the hole initially with a used rope.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

.... I am however a Redneck....

I always thought a redneck was someone that stayed in the sun too long. (sunburned neck)

I figured a flatlander was a Swamp Yankee from Rhode Island, 'cause we don't got no big hills here like New Hampshire.

[Merrymeeting]

My mother is from Rutland, Vt.

My dad is from CT.

We settled in and I grew up in MA

But we moved to the Lakes Region every summer since the 60's.

My parents were residents of New Durham for 35 years, and my dad is buried there.

My mother continues to live there.

I own a home and pay taxes there. But I still live and work in MA (for a few more years until I can retire to NH)

My in-laws live in Biddeford, ME

What am I?

[Flylady]

If you are looking for a label, how about a "New Englander?
That's what I refer to myself when people ask why I bought my place in NH.

[RailroadJoe]

Why not the best. I'm an American!

[SteveA]

Looks like it's a term used all over the country.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...erm=flatlander

I really like the old "saying", orginally from Vermont when a relatively new resident said,

"I know I'll never be a a native Vermonter, but our children were born here so at least they will be Vermonters"

To which the reply from a "native" was... "If your cat had her kittens in the oven, you wouldn't call them muffins, would you?"

I think the only folks that can make any sort of claim of "native" status would
be the folks that were here when the first europeans showed up. But even that has been challenged.

http://americanhistory.suite101.com/...irst_americans

I'll go with Railroad Joe... I'm an American that currently lives in and loves New Hampshire.

[Slickcraft]

When we lived in southern NH, those from south of the state border were often considered flatlanders. Now in central NH, flatlanders may include those from southern NH and south. I suppose that up in Woodstock flatlanders include may those in central NH and south especially those that once moved here like us.

But I tend to believe that behavior is the real issue. If you are comfortable splitting at least some wood and running a wood stove, hammering at least a few nails, dealing easily with a foot of snow, operating at least a small chain saw efficiently, know which side of the road is the south side so you don't reply "is that the right or left side", you don't stop and gawk if there is a deer or a moose on the side of the road, and so on, then you are on the way to avoiding a flatlander label.

[Argie's Wife]

So this discussion begs the question: "At what point are you an NH Native?"

Here's the answer (and for full disclosure - I did not write this... but find it oh, so true!)


Ready?





For those in New Hampshire - laugh; for those who are no longer in NH - reminisce; and for those of you who are just lucky enough to know someone in NH -- maybe this will help you better understand them.


Your idea of a traffic jam is 10 cars waiting to pass a tractor on the highway.

Vacation means going up north to Pittsburg for the weekend.

You measure distance in hours.

You know several people that have hit deer more than once.

You often switch from "heat" to "A/C" in the same day and back again.

You use a down comforter in the summer.

You drive at 65 mph through 2 feet of snow during a raging blizzard, without flinching.

You see people wearing hunting clothes at social events or church.

You install security lights on your house and garage and leave both unlocked.

You think of the major food groups as venison, cider, fish, and berries.

You carry jumper cables in your car and your girlfriend/wife knows how to use them. (This one is for Angela!)

There are 7 empty cars running in the parking lot at Cricenti's Market at any given time.

Your Grammie's birthday party was in the town hall and the whole town showed up.

You design your kids Halloween costume to fit over their snowsuit.

Driving is better in winter because all the potholes are filled with snow.

You know at least one person who has hit a moose.

You know all four seasons: almost winter, winter, still winter, and road construction. (and maybe a 5th -- mud!) (Or -- tourist, foliage, skiing and mud)

It takes you 3 hours to go to the store for milk even when you're in a hurry because you have to stop and talk to everyone in town.

Your uncle mows the town common.

You buy your Christmas presents at the feed and grain store.

You've pulled over to let a flock of wild turkeys (or pheasants) cross the road.

You define summer as three months of bad sledding.

Snow tires come standard on all your cars and trucks.

You can't go barefoot until the snow is gone from the top of Mt. Moosilauke.

You refer to the Patriots as "we".

You can identify a Massachusetts accent.

You keep your potatoes and onions "down cella", and your canned goods on shelves in the "cella-way".

You know what cow-tipping is.

"Down South" to you means Boston.

You consider Manchester exotic.

You can actually pronounce "Kancamagus" and know what it is.

You know what a bubbler is.

Your neighbor throws a party to celebrate his new machine shed.

You can recognize someone from Massachusetts from their driving.

You drink soda and refer to your dad or grandpa as "Pop".

You ride your ski-doo to meet your friends at a restaurant for dinner, and that's how they get there too!

You can actually pronounce and spell "Winnipesauke".
(Yeeesssss! My fav!)

You know where Contoocook is, and how to pronounce it.

You can visit Berlin, New London, Bethlehem, Lisbon, Lebanon and Dublin all in one afternoon.

You only know three spices: salt, pepper, and ketchup.

You're proud of the only NH President, though he's not remembered for much.

You've visited the homestead of Franklin Pierce, because he's the only President from New Hampshire.

You've seen mosquitoes with landing lights.

The local paper covers major headlines on one page, but requires four pages for local sports.

At least twice a year, your kitchen doubles as a meat processing plant.

Your snow blower gets stuck on the roof.

You think the start of deer season is a national holiday.

You find 0 degrees a little chilly.

You actually understand these jokes, and you just cut, pasted, and forwarded them to all your New Hampshire friends!

[BroadHopper]

My grandfather who is from VT calls 'outsiders', flatlanders. My dad follows suit. I do too. As a true NH native, I was able to live with a 'Tom Sawyer / Huck Finn' mentality. NH was a true 'Live free or die' state until recently.

I think a flatlander are those that move into the state with the hope of bringing the state up to their 'level of ideology and mentality'. They call it progress.

Thank You for letting us be aware of what you think is right and wrong. I am happy the way things were. Now the NH natives have a big mess to fix.

My Guess is to call 'flatlanders', 'Southern Democrats'.

[jmen24]

AW,
YES, that list hits the nail directly on the head and the funny thing is the only thing that is not accurate on that list for me is that it was my grandfather that mowed the town lawns, not my uncle!

The one about mileage in hours is with out a doubt the funniest one up there and is so true. I know its 45 min door to door to my folks place, but have no idea how many miles it is. This one is true NH, no one tells you how far, just how long.

I'll add a few more.

I drive all week and do not pass through a single traffic light. (about 350 miles per week)

You show up to help hay the field on a 90 degree day in July in long pants, boots and a long sleeved shirt.

Your tractor is worth more than your truck.

You have more than one person you can call if you get stuck in anything up to a skidder and none of them own a tow truck.

Going for a hike consists of walking to the back boundary of your property.

The block and tackle stays on the ridge pole all year long, because you will never know when you might need it.

You do not turn down the chance to take home a deer that someone else hit with their car.

You laugh when you are stuck behind someone that slows down for a frost heave and then drives straight into the center of it.

When you pronounce Berlin the emphasis is on the E not the I, we are not in Germany.

I have more but I will leave it at that.

[Lakesrider]

"Flatlander" is basically discriminatory in nature. If your not one of us, you are one of them. Sayings like that should have passed into oblivion by now, but we are a still a bigoted country. You might not think so but when you call someone a "Flatlander" look at the reaction you get. People feel hurt, left out or unwanted. Perfect description of Discrimination still alive and well in our America!

[ApS]

You MAY be a Flatlander if you know:

...what "drivin' in the BDL" means...

Originally Posted by RI Swamp Yankee

I always thought a redneck was someone that stayed in the sun too long. (sunburned neck)

I figured a flatlander was a Swamp Yankee from Rhode Island, 'cause we don't got no big hills here like New Hampshire.

That's a double-negative, so to correct your grammar—it's actually:

"...we ain't got no big hills here like New Hampshire...."

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

"...When you pronounce Berlin the emphasis is on the E not the I, we are not in Germany..."

And not far-off Interstate highways you'll hear, VERmont.

[SAMIAM]

I see it a little differently, Lakesrider. I'm a native but many of my good friends are "flatlanders"........I don't think of it as derogatory at all. I believe most locals think of flatlanders just as people from south of NH such as Mass, NY, Conn and NJ......I've never heard that term to describe someone who moves here from Vermont or Maine.
Anyone who is nice to others seems to blend right in and most people don't even think about it. Just my $.02.

[jmen24]

Here is a quick list of things that may make you a flatlander.

Your garbage bags constantly get attacked by animals and you have no idea how to fix the problem.

You pay someone else to take your garbage to the dump. (does not include a dumpster)

You will not allow you dog to go to the bathroom on your own property, but have no problem walking it down the street to go on your neighbors.

You slow down for a frost heave and then make no effort to steer away from the worst part of it.

You worry about what other folks think of your yard and therefore make it completely unusable for you and your family.

You have called the cops on someone you do not know for doing something you should not care about.

You move into an area that has been the same way for 50 years or more and complain about the things that are wrong with it.

You have to call a friend to borrow a truck for the weekend.

Your hammer, screw drivers and power tools are all as clean as the day you bought them, 6 years ago.

You get your car washed right after a snow storm when the weather is predicted to warm up.

When you lose power in the winter, you actually have food that is in your frig, spoil by just leaving it in there. Or, you go to the grocery store the day before the storm and buy more than 1 gallon of milk in case you lose power.

If you actually took the time to read the above lines to see if any apply, you might be a flatlander.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by Lakesrider

"Flatlander" is basically discriminatory in nature. If your not one of us, you are one of them. Sayings like that should have passed into oblivion by now, but we are a still a bigoted country. You might not think so but when you call someone a "Flatlander" look at the reaction you get. People feel hurt, left out or unwanted. Perfect description of Discrimination still alive and well in our America!

I wouldn't go so far as to call it discrimination and don't see Flatlander Rights being violated or a Flatlander Pride march going on...

...I see it as the intent of the word...

Any word can become offensive - if you let it - and use it as a weapon - either by the intent in which you use it or a special meaning you give it.


I had my oldest Argelet drop a little verbal bomb on me the other day. I think he was trying a new word just to see the effect it would have. I told him that he couldn't shock me and his words had no power over me but that he could expect to get in trouble for using it at school, if he wished to find that out on his own. Funny how that just took the wind outta his sails...

[TOAD]

Flatlanders don't know how to play a banjo! It's a dead giveaway.

[Lakesrider]

Sorry I should have said when used in the context of describing someone in say a patronizing way....

Such as "Oh he doesn't belong here. He is a Flatlander...
My point is instead of saying oh he is new in town...it is oh he is a Flatlander.

Just tips my boat the wrong way to describe anyone as different.....

I did not mean to preach.

[LadyJane]

I lived for several years in a beautiful little town in the northwest hills of Ct. I loved it ! But my family had not lived there for several generations, streets were not named after my ancestors, I was not part of the history of the town....so I was a "flatlander". I always felt a little "out of the loop"....like I didn't truly belong. You're right....it is basically a descriminatory label.

[jmen24]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

I see it a little differently, Lakesrider. I'm a native but many of my good friends are "flatlanders"........I don't think of it as derogatory at all. I believe most locals think of flatlanders just as people from south of NH such as Mass, NY, Conn and NJ......I've never heard that term to describe someone who moves here from Vermont or Maine.
Anyone who is nice to others seems to blend right in and most people don't even think about it. Just my $.02.

You have hit is right on the head, it is more of a joke. But, you can in fact be from NH and be a flatlander and live north of Concord as well.

I have not known anyone to call someone a flatlander to there face in a way to make them feel bad.

[LIforrelaxin]

So as I read this thread I see many of the great post I thought I would see. But I also see some of the post I knew I would see but hoped I wouldn't. People please don't take this thread the wrong way. I don't mean to entitle the word "Flatlander" to be a discriminatory, or derogatory term. I meant this thread to give it some definition. What kinds of things remind some one of a flatlander. Much the way driving a beat-up old pickup, with a can of skoal, and a cowboy hat, make people think of the term Redneck.

In my mind everyone, even the most native of native NH'ites is capable of pulling a "flatlander" move....

[CrawfordCentury]

Originally Posted by jmen24

AW,

When you pronounce Berlin the emphasis is on the E not the I, we are not in Germany.

I'm old school. Pronounce it like the capital of Germany - the way it was originally before we entered WWI.

They were gonna change the name of the city after we got involved in the fight. But then they realized they'd have to print up all new letter head, invest in new signage, etc. Pretty spendy when the beancounters went into green visor mode and tallied things up. So some inventive soul suggested they put the emphasis on the other syllable to differentiate NH's Berlin from the Hun.

Honest to golly, that's a true story. Don't know what kinda bee the folks in Milan have in their bonnets.

[jmen24]

I have one more.

When you are out hunting and you get a big deer. When you buddy asks you how far you have to drag back to the truck you reply, "About three blocks."

I actually own a video that the man says this exact phrase.

Crawford, you remind me of a buddy of mine that owns a farm in Hill. When we go golfing, he wears overalls, a flannel shirt, spiked golf sandals with wool socks and a straw hat. But he talks with the same style that you type with, thanks.

[Gearhead]

I used to live in Pittsburg (NH) and they think EVERYONE is a "flatlanda".

[tis]

Originally Posted by jmen24

You have hit is right on the head, it is more of a joke. But, you can in fact be from NH and be a flatlander and live north of Concord as well.

I have not known anyone to call someone a flatlander to there face in a way to make them feel bad.

This IS an interesting thread. I always wondered what the definition of a flatlander actually was. I think to me it is someone who lives south of us and as Sam said it can be in NH, but I think generally it would be very southern NH, where most of the people were from Mass. originally. And yet, I don't think people from NJ, NY, PA. etc are flatlanders, so it seems mostly to be New England. Or not?? It was always mostly a joke with us, living on the lake we always had lots of friends from south of us. But then there were those other flatlanders that weren't so nice---- .
The one thing I really don't like is those (mentioned by others here) who MOVE here because they like a way it is, and then take over and change it. They act like they know more than we natives do. They spoil our towns.

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Gearhead

I used to live in Pittsburg (NH) and they think EVERYONE is a "flatlanda".

I was going to chime in and say that everyone in Colorado would get a real kick out of reading this thread.




But I'm not gonna do that ... nope.




So what's the difference between a hill and a mountain ?

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

I was going to chime in and say that everyone in Colorado would get a real kick out of reading this thread.

But I'm not gonna do that ... nope.

So what's the difference between a hill and a mountain ?

I spend my winters in Summit County CO. I know where this will lead to!

NE mountains are definitely hills.

John Denver reign supreme over the radio waves of the Rockies.

Joints are legal in the old coal towns.

Rockie Mountain High!

[jmen24]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

You can actually pronounce and spell "Winnipesauke".
(Yeeesssss! My fav!)

Alright AW, no else picked up on it so I will have to. Here is your sign.

It is a good thing you said you did not write this.

[jmen24]

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

I was going to chime in and say that everyone in Colorado would get a real kick out of reading this thread.




But I'm not gonna do that ... nope.




So what's the difference between a hill and a mountain ?

Depends on which half of the state of Colorado you ask!

We definately have hills out this way. No question.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by Argie's Wife

....
You drink soda and refer to your dad or grandpa as "Pop".

Not Soda - Tonic is what you drink.

[CrawfordCentury]

Originally Posted by jmen24

Crawford, you remind me of a buddy of mine that owns a farm in Hill. When we go golfing, he wears overalls, a flannel shirt, spiked golf sandals with wool socks and a straw hat. But he talks with the same style that you type with, thanks.

Sounds like an interesting fella.

Not a golfer myself. To wit, up until a few years back, I thought a Mulligan was Gilligan's younger brother. Or else a kind of stew.

From what little I've gleaned of golf, I'm led to believe that both of my reckonings are incorrect.

No straw hat, neither. The ladies tell me it's a crime against humanity to be coveren up my luxuriant wavey amber locks.

[John A. Birdsall]

Well, today I might have learned something. I have heard the term flatlander and I always thought that was a boat that landed flat on it keel when it fell off the trailer. and now you say its about where people come from? Well, I looked on the map of New Hampshire, and I see no town or hamlett named flatlander.

[Natt]

This is up for interprutation as there are many different views. When I think flatlander, I think of someone with a suburban state of mind, who is hopefully here to slide into a more rural culture and appreciate what's around us. Doesn't always work out that way. And it certainly is not specificly a geographic reference because I know enough of my fellow natives who fit in quite well with the same visitors they are critical off. It's often meant as a derogatory term and is best not used.

[MAXUM]

Flatlander - the complete opposite of a redneck.

[wifi]

Originally Posted by MAXUM

Flatlander - the complete opposite of a redneck.

Not bad

[NoRegrets]

Originally Posted by Merrymeeting

My mother is from Rutland, Vt.

My dad is from CT.

We settled in and I grew up in MA

But we moved to the Lakes Region every summer since the 60's.

My parents were residents of New Durham for 35 years, and my dad is buried there.

My mother continues to live there.

I own a home and pay taxes there. But I still live and work in MA (for a few more years until I can retire to NH)

My in-laws live in Biddeford, ME

What am I?

You are a fortunate American that has a rich history built in New England with the fortune to participate on the Winni Forum.

[StephenB]

Reading this thread reminded me of something I read from Country Living, by Lewis Hill of Greensboro, VT: (Rodale Press, 1987)

There's a story of a family that moved from a small town in New Hampshire, on one side of the Connecticut River, to a town on the Vermont side, just six miles away. Their baby girl was six months old at the time. Although she lived the rest of her 93 years in the Vermont home, the minister said at her funeral, "We loved her, even though she wasn't one of us."

Is "flatlander" a derogatory term? I don't know, but the thing I took away from Lewis' story above is that we might want to check our attitudes somewhat, just the same.

By the way, I'm from Mass., and I thought the official spelling was Winnipesaukee. (No, I didn't have to look it up.)

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by StephenB

By the way, I'm from Mass., and I thought the official spelling was Winnipesaukee. (No, I didn't have to look it up.)

Like I said at the beginning of my post with the big list - I didn't write the list - it make the email joke rounds a few years back. I just copied and pasted the thing 'cuz I thought it might lighten up the tone of things... Life is too short to grumble.


------

Okay and the soda/tonic/pop thing.... I grew up in Maine... my mom is from Maine but my dad was from Holderness/Sanbornton area... we called it soda when we were at restaurants or when we had folks over, but mainly it was called MOXIE.

[jmen24]

Moxie, that is a Maniac thing. My wife is fifth generation Downeaster and they love the stuff. Personally I think it tastes like you bit your tongue.

Now I have never been called it so I cannot speak for how to take being called a flatlander, but I know from my point of view it is not said in a derogatory way. More of a "you ain't from around here, are you fella?" type of thing. I am sure that when I drive in Boston I get a similar label from the locals down there. It is similar to the Maine saying of "you can't get there from heya." You really can get there from heya, we are just not going to tell you how, you'll have to figure that out on your own.

There are however derogatory terms that exist, but they are more state specific and those quotes are the ones that truely describe the bad apples that most natives do not like to see coming down the street.

I could understand why someone would not want to be called out for not having the same "wood" smarts as say a local, but really that is all it boils down to. Maybe instead of studyin so much, you should have spent some time tippin cows and chasin chickens.

Anyway, I would not read into it anymore than face value. Some of our backgrounds are very different. Just think about what comes to your mind when you see someone walk into the store in front of you looking like they just crawled out from under the hen house.

[kjbathe]

Originally Posted by Merrymeeting

My mother is from Rutland, Vt.

My dad is from CT.

We settled in and I grew up in MA

But we moved to the Lakes Region every summer since the 60's.

My parents were residents of New Durham for 35 years, and my dad is buried there.

My mother continues to live there.

I own a home and pay taxes there. But I still live and work in MA (for a few more years until I can retire to NH)

My in-laws live in Biddeford, ME

What am I?

A: Tourist.

I still chuckle at a conversation I overhead in a waiting room one day... Two ladies, one local, one not, engaged in idle chatter until the topic turned to "native or not?" The visitor became enraged at the suggestion she wasn't a native. "Well we're natives, too. We've been coming up here for years!"

Personally, I don't care where you're from. Just stop trying to change "here" to look like "there". It kind of defeats the purpose of you wanting to be "here".

[CrawfordCentury]

Originally Posted by jmen24

Moxie, that is a Maniac thing. My wife is fifth generation Downeaster and they love the stuff. Personally I think it tastes like you bit your tongue.

Sorta right on the first count. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off base on the second count.

Part two first. Moxie's is delicious. Period. True, it's an acquired taste not everyone has the good sense to acquire. Sorta like feta cheese, black liquorice, or the vocal stylings of Tom Waits. Purely for the initiated.

As far as it being a Mainer thing, that's more a matter of cultural appropriation.



Originally, it was called Moxie Nerve Food. It was a brain stimulant, one amongst many of the ole tyme patent medicines of the gad light era. Think along the lines of Dr. Hofstetters Celebrated Stomach Bitters or Dr. Kilmer's Swamp Root Cure for Liver, Kidney and Bladder Woes and you've got the idea. (As an aside, the aqua bottles were manufactured at the Lyndeborough Glass Works, which was over near Peterborough).

But with the passage of the FDA in 1906, Moxie, Coke, various sarsaparillas, and others sought to rebrand themselves as soft drinks. Maken the transition from brain tonic to "soda pop."

Which is why us of a geezerly mindset still call carbonated softdrinks "tonic." It's what they once was.

[WinnDixie]

Well, this thread draws me right out of my little corner! Another geezer here (geezette??? can a lady be a geezer?). My question is answered: definitely NOT flatlanders--we: my husband LOVES Moxie...always some waiting for him when we come up...trust me-- you do NOT get it here!! Me ,not so much, but I'm with you on feta cheese and black licorice! Anyhow, Moxie is seriously a New England thing...and that is an awesome bottle you have! We also remember when we were kids it was always "tonic"! Tonic was always "wicked good" on a hot day!

[Lucky1]

I would think that "Flatlander" might be those from the flat or mostly flat states near here such as MA, CT, RI as opposed to the mountainous states such as NH, VT, ME. Not that there are not mountains in the flatlander states such as the Berkshires in MA etc.

[MAXUM]

Ya know since when is calling somebody a flatlander "derogatory"? Please, what is with everyone these days having such thin skin? Next thing you know it's going to be considered a racial. Boy I tell ya the lengths to which some take the political correctness is beyond ridiculous.

Hell people call me a redneck all the time and frankly I'm damn proud of it too. If some use that label in an attempt to make it derogatory, well that's their problem, not mine. Afterall they are no doubt a flatlander.

[Newbiesaukee]

I honestly had never heard the term "flatlander" until I read it on the forum. I assumed in NH, it meant someone from somewhere that didn't have mountains (or hills). Although most of the responses to this thread are humerous or informative, the context in which the term seems to be used is NEVER as a compliment. At best, it is geographically desciptive, but its use does most frequently imply some criticsm of the person so described. I guess if the person using the term would be offended to have himself described as one, then the thing speaks for itself.

I avoid terms such as "flatlander" as I do not know how the person so described would interpret it.

Any such description which requires the qualificaton...."but some of my best friends are....." is probably best avoided.

[codeman671]

I was called a flatlander in my post about wanting air conditioning in my island home. Last time I checked wanting AC wasnt something that would put me into the classification of being a flatlander. I like my house cool , whats the big deal? I grew up 45 minutes from the lake (still in NH for those that classify people south of the border as flatlanders) and have never lived out of the state. I am not a tourist or a transplant.

I am a redneck trapped in the life of a yuppie. Not big into politics. I like to ski and boat and I drive a truck. Does this make me a flatlander? I think not.

[Janet]

Originally Posted by CrawfordCentury

Sorta right on the first count. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off base on the second count.

Part two first. Moxie's is delicious. Period. True, it's an acquired taste not everyone has the good sense to acquire. Sorta like feta cheese, black liquorice, or the vocal stylings of Tom Waits. Purely for the initiated.

As far as it being a Mainer thing, that's more a matter of cultural appropriation.



Originally, it was called Moxie Nerve Food. It was a brain stimulant, one amongst many of the ole tyme patent medicines of the gad light era. Think along the lines of Dr. Hofstetters Celebrated Stomach Bitters or Dr. Kilmer's Swamp Root Cure for Liver, Kidney and Bladder Woes and you've got the idea. (As an aside, the aqua bottles were manufactured at the Lyndeborough Glass Works, which was over near Peterborough).

But with the passage of the FDA in 1906, Moxie, Coke, various sarsaparillas, and others sought to rebrand themselves as soft drinks. Maken the transition from brain tonic to "soda pop."

Which is why us of a geezerly mindset still call carbonated softdrinks "tonic." It's what they once was.

Love my Moxie. Only way to get Moxie here in Texas is to order online. Did that once but was way too costly...$64.00 a case! It's sometimes hard to find in NH. Have found it at Jo-Jos and Heath's in Center Harbor. Looking forward to my trip in August for the month to drink my fill!

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by CrawfordCentury

Sorta right on the first count. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off base on the second count.

Part two first. Moxie's is delicious. Period. True, it's an acquired taste not everyone has the good sense to acquire. Sorta like feta cheese, black liquorice, or the vocal stylings of Tom Waits. Purely for the initiated.

Tom Waits? Moxie? Feta? Liquorice?

You must be my soul mate.... (and don't let Argie see this!)

[Rattlesnake Guy]

I have successfully lubricated a business transaction by agreeing to include 2 cases of moxie on a shipment going to Atlanta. Apparently you can't buy it there. I tried it once, I won't make that mistake again.

[Irish mist]

Throwing the word flatlander around in NH in the 60s & 70s had more of a bite to it when there were 700,000 folks in the whole state, and most of them were born here.....now, not so much. Over 50% of NH residents are from away these days, and there's over 1.3 million people up here. Today flantlander is used as more of a joke, or in a good-natured manner from my experience.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by codeman671

I am a redneck trapped in the life of a yuppie. Not big into politics. I like to ski and boat and I drive a truck. Does this make me a flatlander? I think not.

Well said. That fits us locals to a tee. The yuppies are telling us when, where and how we can boat and ski. They ruin politics!

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Well said. That fits us locals to a tee. The yuppies are telling us when, where and how we can boat and ski. They ruin politics!

It was you that called me the flatlander...

[BroadHopper]

Me bad! Guess I'm more of a local green redneck that likes his windows open. And skiiny dips at night to keep cool!

My yuppy McMansion neighbors with ac called the cops because they can't stand redneck butts shining in the moon!

[Channel Pirate]

A NH native is anyone born in NH that can put up with all the crap that comes with living here year round and hasn't moved away yet.

A Flatlander is anyone born south of were you were born, so Massachusettes fairweather'ers(*Foot-Note) can call people from Rhode Island flatlanders ect..ect.. and pass it on down the megalopolis, so as not to offend the torists and part timers that keep us sales tax free.

* Fairweather'ers are not just from Mass so don't get all wound up when some local calls you that (new slang) if you don't live here and work here you will most likely be sub-catagorized.

I go to Marco Isl. FL in January and they call me "Snowbird"

[SAMIAM]

Ok, we've heard from all those who are offended by that word.....but how about us poor locals. We have to put up with all of those "out of staters" who think we all have only one tooth, sit around playing banjo, drinking moonshine and call our fathers "uncle dad"
We have to suffer through the "deliverance Syndrome" every day.....it's not easy........oop's, gotta run, possum pie is almost ready.

[jrc]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

I have successfully lubricated a business transaction by agreeing to include 2 cases of moxie on a shipment going to Atlanta. Apparently you can't buy it there. I tried it once, I won't make that mistake again.

Well Moxie tastes like lubricant so it fitting you used it that way. We all learned to aquire the Moxie taste as kids, Nana would mix a little Moxie and milk. She's 92 and still drinking it!

The whole flatlander, redneck, native thing is about a state of mind, not a state of birth. People don't seem to understand that things can be different and both can be good. Some days you want Moxie, some days you want champagne. Just don't try to change one into the other.

[LIforrelaxin]

Originally Posted by codeman671

I am a redneck trapped in the life of a yuppie. Not big into politics. I like to ski and boat and I drive a truck. Does this make me a flatlander? I think not.

I here you on that one man, I seemed trapped in the same vicious whirlwind myself

[LIforrelaxin]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

I tried it once, I won't make that mistake again.

You and me both, When I moved to Massachusetts from Washington State, all my friends and their families raved about it.... so one day while eating over, I decided what the hell I will give it a shot... I was never so glad that they only gave me a small shot glass full to try.....

[Misty Blue]

After a heated 3 AM debate at the power plant we decided to look into the term "Moxie".

The advertising slogan was "Ya gott'a try Moxie. A common term for a hard working boy was "That kid's got Moxie".

Which came first, the Moxie or the kid?

When used as the product name it is a noun. When used as a discription of a positive attitude it is an adjective. So here goes...

There was a saying long, long ago that "That kid's got Moxie". It sort of meant that the squirt had a good work ethec and was one to mow lawns, soon to have three others mowing for him and one day would own Pike industries. Yup. That kid's got Moxie.

The adjective however came AFTER the product! I don't know what they put in that stuff (my brother drank it all the time, I was a fresca guy) but it must have given the little guy the spark that put him into high gear.

So the kid's got Moxie and there is no way that he is a flatlander!

PS. I think that the stuff is made in Lowell, MA elevation 64 feet above sea level. Ironic?

Misty Blue

[nvtngtxpyr]

Then again you could always go to the font of all wisdom on the interwebs - Wikiedia:

"Moxie originated as a patent medicine called "Moxie Nerve Food,"[1] which was created around 1876 by Dr. Augustin Thompson. Thompson claimed that it contained an extract from a rare, unnamed South American plant, which had supposedly been discovered by a friend of his, Lieutenant Moxie,[1] who had used it as a panacea. Moxie, he claimed, was especially effective against "paralysis, softening of the brain, nervousness, and insomnia."[1]

After a few years, Thompson added soda water to the formula and changed the product's name to "Beverage Moxie Nerve Food." By 1884 he was selling Moxie both in bottles and in bulk as a soda fountain syrup. He marketed it as "a delicious blend of bitter and sweet, a drink to satisfy everyone's taste."[2]
.
.
.
Through extensive advertising, the neologism "moxie" has entered popular American usage with the meaning "courage, daring, and energy,"[9][10] as in "This guy's got moxie!"

Moxie is closely associated with the state of Maine. Its creator, Dr. Augustin Thompson, was born in Union, Maine. Moxie was designated the official soft drink of Maine on May 10, 2005.[11]"

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moxie

[CrawfordCentury]

Originally Posted by WinnDixie

Well, this thread draws me right out of my little corner!

And so, here I am all alonelylike now. At least I've got my dunce cap to keep me company.

Another geezer here (geezette??? can a lady be a geezer?).

No, a lady can not be a geezer. A lady may be a geezelle, should she wish.

My question is answered: definitely NOT flatlanders--we: my husband LOVES Moxie...always some waiting for him when we come up...trust me-- you do NOT get it here!! Me ,not so much, but I'm with you on feta cheese and black licorice! Anyhow, Moxie is seriously a New England thing...and that is an awesome bottle you have! We also remember when we were kids it was always "tonic"! Tonic was always "wicked good" on a hot day!

Not my bottle - nabbed that pic off from the interwbs. Though I do have...well more than a couple pre-FDA antique medicines in my collection, including a couple moxies. Needless to say, Mrs. Crawford's a very understanding lady, putten up with the veritable patent medicine museum we live amongst. She's partial to the big Moxie bottles, which are ideal for bonken me upside the head when I listen to the Tom Waits albums too loud and eat all the feta.

LOL! gotta love the power of moxie. Mere mention alone's defused a contentious discussion on who gets to belong to the "We're from here and you ain't" subject at hand.

[CrawfordCentury]

Since this has morphed into a quasi-moxie thread, here's a link to a vid of a NH Chronicle segment that aired this week. I prefer vids embedded in the thread, but WMUR's web site didn't provide the code. Apologies for making you take the extra step http://www.wmur.com/chronicle/23526620/detail.html#

There's also a group that's called the Moxie Congress. Site: http://www.moxiecongress.org/

It says they got a facebook page too. I don't do facebook, so I haven't been. With my mug, if I were to upload my face into the internets, I'd prolly break the world wide web.

[WinnDixie]

Originally Posted by CrawfordCentury

And so, here I am all alonelylike now. At least I've got my dunce cap to keep me company.

No, a lady can not be a geezer. A lady may be a geezelle, should she wish.

___________________________________
OK, I can live with "geezelle", I guess...sounds like "gazelle", which implies a lot better than it really is, in my case!! Rolls off the tongue as well as "flatlander", too! Bottoms up, you Moxie drinkers! NuGrape for me!

[SIKSUKR]

A flatlander is one thing but I can't stand a flatlander with Moxie!

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

...
That's a double-negative, so to correct your grammar—it's actually:

"...we ain't got no big hills here like New Hampshire...."

...

Ah-yuh yer right.

[Lake Charm]

Flatlanders drink "soda"....non Flatlanders drink "pop"!

Gotta Love It!

[Winnipesaukee Divers]

Real New Hamphireites drink "Tonic"... Ya, don't even try to make scenes of this one either... My wife's families were the original settlers of Hampton and being true New Hampshiretes they don't mind setting you straight on the proper enunciation of terms. Coming from Vermont, where we don't have an accent, I find this a bit odd.

You’d think after forty-seven years I would have developed some sort of acceptance of the language over here, but, it still glares in my ears.

[BroadHopper]

While boating up in Nova Scotia one year, I stop at a marine store and ask for a 'pop'. The guy behind the counter says I must be from Na Hampsha. Enough said!

[tis]

That's funny. I never heard people here ever use "pop". We used "tonic" when I was very small but at some point it turned to "soda."

We used to have supper and now we have dinner. We used to have cellars and now we have basements. We used to have dooryards and now we have what, yards? We used to have piazzas (sp?) and now we have porches. All the old Yankee NH ways gone I guess.

[Slickcraft]

It does appear that the flatlanda phenomena is somewhat seasonal in nature; many appeared with this warm weather about the same time as the mosquitoes.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by tis

That's funny. I never heard people here ever use "pop". We used "tonic" when I was very small but at some point it turned to "soda."

We used to have supper and now we have dinner. We used to have cellars and now we have basements. We used to have dooryards and now we have what, yards? We used to have piazzas (sp?) and now we have porches. All the old Yankee NH ways gone I guess.

"Piazza" is the correct spelling. I remember all those other expressions, too—but I lived in Tuftonboro, not Wolfeboro—where all those flatlanders live.

Member Newbiesaukee must not have read any newspapers' comic sections: I remember where I first saw flatlander used—many years ago:



I don't think there are any flatlanders who appreciate my idea of comfort when viewing Lake Winnipesaukee's vistas from my own acre of lakefront property.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

I grew up in NH drinking "tonic". When I started traveling in my 20s for work, I changed what I drink to "soda" to be understood in most regions of the country and to stop having to explain why I would want to drink tonic. My cousin's out west drink "pop". Never heard it here in the Granite State. Now I drink Diet Coke with my 1200 calorie sandwich.

[BGB2]

A "flatlander" is someone like me who used this forum to help decide where to retire. After realizing that I'm a "flatlander" and maybe a "swamp yankee" and that my wife is a "Masshole" with "red neck" roots, I decided the lakes region is my favorite place to visit, but it will never be home.

[WinnDixie]

[ Now I drink Diet Coke with my 1200 calorie sandwich.[/QUOTE]

Oh do I hear you, Rattlesnake Guy!! This native coming up from the flatlands will be turned loose in Sawyers very soon now...and the order will be.."a lobster roll, onion rings, a peppermint stick sugar cone, with chocolate jimmies...and a Diet Coke"!! Ah, sweet denial!

[Newbiesaukee]

Wikipedia agrees with my perception...so I must be correct.

"A pejorative term for a person who lives at lower altitude, used by those living at higher altitudes."

The urban dictionary is more humerous (and less "G" rated so check out the link: (hope it works)

"http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=flat+lander"

(not really a link..you need to cut and paste...I hate technology)

[jmen24]

Growing up I would spent lots of time at my grandparents house. Living there was my great grandmother that was born at the turn of the century. It was always refered to as tonic, if I was mowing the lawn and it was 150 degrees, it was a tonic that I was offered, not water. My family did not say "pop", but I knew a few that did. Now it is soda for me, but I rarely request it that way, mostly it is a Mountain Dew or Coke or Cherry Coke.

My thought on the "cella" is this, being right around 6 feet tall I can't stand up straight in my grandparent's "cella", I can however in my basement.

The porch has always been a porch for me as that is what my grandparents called it. And I will tell you one thing, if your screen door don't creek when it opens and slap when it shuts, you ain't from around here.

[Argie's Wife]

And the "Other" category is:
Soda Pop (Midwest)
Soft drink (W Coast)
Tonic (Boston)
Co-cola (Deep South)
Fizz, Fizzy Pop, Fizzy Drink
Dr Pepper (Texas)
Pepsi (South)

(Source: www.popvssoda.com)

[LIforrelaxin]

Little did I know the conversation I was starting... what a thread.... I think I am going to go grab, a ummm, well you know, ahhh... hummm,,,,, a soda, pop, tonic, sorta thing, but definitely not moxie....

[jrc]

If you go to the Market Basket in Concord the aisle sign still says Tonic over the aisle with Coke and Pepsi. I don't know if they have Moxie.

[RI Swamp Yankee]

Actually it doesn't matter what you call me ..... so long as you don't call me late for supper

[CrawfordCentury]

Originally Posted by Acres per Second

"Piazza" is the correct spelling. I remember all those other expressions, too—but I lived in Tuftonboro, not Wolfeboro—where all those flatlanders live.

Member Newbiesaukee must not have read any newspapers' comic sections: I remember where I first saw flatlander used—many years ago:



I don't think there are any flatlanders who appreciate my idea of comfort when viewing Lake Winnipesaukee's vistas from my own acre of lakefront property.

LOL! You nouveua riche really chap my hide, with all them fancey, schmancey amenities.

Or maybe not - maybe it's just jealousy or class envy. Some don't even have upholstery. I think this is a flatlander after eating a pepperoni piazza that didn't agree with him. And he's setten on his veranda.

[jmen24]

Originally Posted by jrc

If you go to the Market Basket in Concord the aisle sign still says Tonic over the aisle with Coke and Pepsi. I don't know if they have Moxie.

Yes, they do.

[SIKSUKR]

I'm going with soft drink.

[Begonezvous]

I grew up in Northeast Mass and my family always called it Tonic. My wife grew up in the same town and she claims to have never heard the term. Go figure.
I was in Iowa for work and asked the office manager where i could find a soda machine. "why do you need a sewing machine?" she asked. When I explained that I wanted a diet coke, she said "oh, you want a pop".

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

"...I grew up in NH drinking "tonic"...I changed what I drink to "soda"...My cousin's out west drink "pop"..."

The Soda Pop Board of America liked Cola in the 1950s:

[Argie's Wife]

WOW... and I thought marketing directed at young parents was bad today...

"Start Junior on Cola now so that he will be accepted by his peers when he's a teenager."

Makes me sorta glad my kids hate the stuff - "Eewwww! Bubbles!"

[eillac@dow]

Growing up south of Boston, it was always known as Tonic.

Sometimes today, I catch myself not using the word "tonic" and it kills me to lose that terminology.

I think I may be one of the few in my area that use it. Hope not!

[Lucky1]

Flatlanders: noun, associated with elves, Santa, Easter Bunny, Toothfairy, etc.

[trfour]

However, I do know all about folks from MA. getting a little ticked off from being called folks from Massa'chewsus!

I'm a very proud and was born at Boston's MEMorial Hospital a while back in 1944, [ In The AM ] so's I was wide awake at the getGo! I hit the ground running in Southy, no LESS!

OH, were them ever the days...