2023 Meredith Tax Rate & Bills Coming Today

[Bittz]

https://www.meredithnh.org/sites/g/f...rate_final.pdf

[Biggd]

Finally got mine today.
My assessment went up 33% but my bill only went up 10%.
I'm happy!

[garysanfran]

Why does a 10% increase make you happy?

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by garysanfran

Why does a 10% increase make you happy?

It was actually under 10%, I rounded up.
I added a large screened in porch, thought it was going to be much higher.
Reading the Moultonborough thread, I was getting nervous!
Just read a real estate report yesterday about waterfront increases from 2022 to 2023, makes me feel really happy with 10%.
I bought my place 9 years ago, I could not afford it at today's prices.

[John Mercier]

Moultonborough had the buy down during the previous year. I don't think Meredith did.

The assessments have gone berserk... and I think that may happen again... but the amount to be raised was more level from year-to-year.

[garysanfran]

My Meredith tax payment in January 2023 was $6,385.13

My tax due January 8, 2024, is $11,201.55.

No improvements of any kind done during that time.

WHAT???

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by garysanfran

My Meredith tax payment in January 2023 was $6,385.13

My tax due January 8, 2024, is $11,201.55.

No improvements of any kind done during that time.

WHAT???

So you wouldn't be happy with just a 10% increase? That would be $7,024.00

[John Mercier]

Meredith pays taxes in January?
Ours are always July 1st and then early December.

[garysanfran]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Meredith pays taxes in January?
Ours are always July 1st and then early December.

Due 1/08, not late until July. Not concerned about the date, just the amount with no increase in anything positive.

[garysanfran]

10% is outrageous, what I am being charged is extortion...For what?

This place has been in may family since 1961. I bought it about 6 yrs. ago.

Every property on my road has sold over those 62 years because the original owners could no longer afford or justify the tax.

So for this increase I get...

Increased congestion
Inadequate infrastructure
Intolerable boat traffic on weekends
A seasonable place not used during winter
No snow plowing service on a private road
No paved road
No town water
No kids in school
An increase in Massachusetts influenced politics

I can afford the new taxes...I'd rather throw tea into the harbor.

However...

To be continued.

[tis]

Originally Posted by garysanfran

10% is outrageous, what I am being charged is extortion...For what?

This place has been in may family since 1961. I bought it about 6 yrs. ago.

Every property on my road has sold over those 62 years because the original owners could no longer afford or justify the tax.

So for this increase I get...

Increased congestion
Inadequate infrastructure
Intolerable boat traffic on weekends
A seasonable place not used during winter
No snow plowing service on a private road
No paved road
No town water
No kids in school
An increase in Massachusetts influenced politics

I can afford the new taxes...I'd rather throw tea into the harbor.

However...

To be continued.

You just proved my point. Sooner or later at least SOME people are going to get tired of such high taxes even if they can afford them. I think the towns need to slow down on their spending.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by tis

You just proved my point. Sooner or later at least SOME people are going to get tired of such high taxes even if they can afford them. I think the towns need to slow down on their spending.

Biggd and Garysanfran are talking about property in the same town.
So it wasn't town spending.

Garysanfran must have property that is a lot more desirable to people willing to expend more for a property of that nature... so it pushed his assessment higher.

I doubt if he chose to sell at the new assessment level that the property would be on the market very long.

[4 for Boating]

So it looks to me that waterfront LAND in most cases doubled in value - the actual buildings/homes sort of stayed the same. Of course the actual tax rate went down BUT that in no way compensates for the double aspect - not even close.

In the example above from Gary > I'm rough estimating that he is paying some $5k to $6k more in taxes due to this per year now? As well as any other waterfront owners.

So given the above situation - the question is >> where is all that additional tax revenue going? To pay for spending that has increase for the town (if so for what exactly) OR did non-waterfront homeowners see a reduction in their taxes and more burden is being put on the waterfront owners? What exactly is the justification for such a large/disproportionate increase?

The money must be going somewhere as from a waterfront owner perspective - the increase cloud be close to 33%.

I used to live in a town many years ago where they could not raise the taxes on anyone more than 4% per year. This here seems like the Wild West.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by 4 for Boating

So it looks to me that waterfront LAND in most cases doubled in value ...

So given the above situation - the question is >> where is all that additional tax revenue going? To pay for spending that has increase for the town (if so for what exactly) OR did non-waterfront homeowners see a reduction in their taxes and more burden is being put on the waterfront owners? What exactly is the justification for such a large/disproportionate increase? ...

You have answered your own question, the massive increase in lake front valuations, not only on land but also the buildings, is shifting the tax burden to those owners. This increase in valuation is based on actual sale prices of homes that is used as a yardstick for the tax valuations.

There is nothing mysterious here, this is the way the property tax system is DESIGNED to work. The "wealthy" property owners are expected to pay a bigger portion of tax than the more modest property owners.

As to towns spending more, in general, the towns have not gone on massive spending sprees. Consider that costs have gone up due to the cumulative 20% inflation over the last few years. (Gee, I wonder what caused that?) The town's costs, including school costs, are not immune from that. Plus, every town faces occasional big bills that have to be met. Maybe a few towns could afford to trim their budgets a bit but that is not what is pushing most of this tax increase onto lake front owners.

As to the concern expressed by some others that the high taxes (and high prices) are going to repel buyers, YES, eventually they will. The TELL on that will be when houses are sitting unsold for long periods of time and unsold inventory rises. (I don't think that is happening yet.) When that happens, people who need to sell will reduce their sales price to entice buyers, in spite of the tax concern. The lowered sale prices will eventually shift the tax burden away from lake front property owners. All these "market forces" are unpredictable in scope and timing because they are subject to individual decisions about buying and selling. The only thing we know for sure is that property markets WILL fluctuate and the prices of property drive the tax apportionment.

[DickR]

Originally Posted by jeffk

...
There is nothing mysterious here, this is the way the property tax system is DESIGNED to work. The "wealthy" property owners are expected to pay a bigger portion of tax than the more modest property owners.

The property tax, based on likely selling price, is fundamentally a tax based on someone else's ability to pay it. However, it sure works to the benefit of towns with a lot of vacation property, owned by folks "from away" who have no say in spending and get little in the way of services from the town. It isn't likely to change, but it tends to force out long-term property owners.

[4 for Boating]

Putting aside the waterfront aspect for a second and just talking in general - I think it's more than a bit ridiculous for a tax bill for anyone to go up over 30% in one single year with no changes to the property.

Let's take for a moment that this was across the board > it would cripple most people. I understand raising taxes/higher costs and it looks to me that the Town (Meredith) has increased spending by some 8%? Again I look to the old days where I used to live where the tax amount raise per year was capped as to not cause a hardship on anyone.

Back to waterfront > going to be a bit of a shocker for those not seeing it coming...

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by DickR

The property tax, based on likely selling price, is fundamentally a tax based on someone else's ability to pay it. However, it sure works to the benefit of towns with a lot of vacation property, owned by folks "from away" who have no say in spending and get little in the way of services from the town. It isn't likely to change, but it tends to force out long-term property owners.

That is largely due to a change in their relative status.
The same happens on non-waterfront properties for individuals that do not save enough in retirement funding to cover the reality of their lifestyle.

I know someone that sold their lakefront cabin on Squam after inheriting it. His grandfather was a judge... he's a carpenter. The judge could afford the property, the carpenter can't. Different levels of status in society with different pay scales and pensions.

[LIforrelaxin]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

I know someone that sold their lakefront cabin on Squam after inheriting it. His grandfather was a judge... he's a carpenter. The judge could afford the property, the carpenter can't. Different levels of status in society with different pay scales and pensions.

That is a scenario that Makes sense.....

My scenario however is where that falls apart.... My father a successful Engineer 30+ years retired early, and was able to by our property and maintain it in retirement... I am a successful Engineer with 25+ years, making more money then my father even thought about.... Yes I am able maintain the property well I am working, but realize that if I want to retire early I will need to sell the property, because it will be to much of a financial Drain....

Everything changes always does, it however is a shame that things have gotten so out of control in NH, that people are having to make decisions not because they don't want to continue to visit the same place, but because they are being Taxed out of their places, because a state doesn't want to evolve......

As I have said plenty of other places, for me to consider that are more affordable... My hope is to keep the Winnipesaukee property until I am ready to retire, because it is close to work and allows me to utilize it often.... But in retirement, it is likely off to Maine... or Vt. where I can buy a comparable property, and pay significantly less property Tax....

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

That is a scenario that Makes sense.....

My scenario however is where that falls apart.... My father a successful Engineer 30+ years retired early, and was able to by our property and maintain it in retirement... I am a successful Engineer with 25+ years, making more money then my father even thought about.... Yes I am able maintain the property well I am working, but realize that if I want to retire early I will need to sell the property, because it will be to much of a financial Drain....

Everything changes always does, it however is a shame that things have gotten so out of control in NH, that people are having to make decisions not because they don't want to continue to visit the same place, but because they are being Taxed out of their places, because a state doesn't want to evolve......

As I have said plenty of other places, for me to consider that are more affordable... My hope is to keep the Winnipesaukee property until I am ready to retire, because it is close to work and allows me to utilize it often.... But in retirement, it is likely off to Maine... or Vt. where I can buy a comparable property, and pay significantly less property Tax....

I have a few friends that own lakefront in Maine and they complain about their tax bills also. I have others that own coastal property in Maine and their bills are outrageous! You can't escape the tax man.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

... because a state doesn't want to evolve ...
and pay significantly less property Tax....

This is where I cannot agree. Instituting Sales and Income taxes to reduce property taxes is a DEVOLUTION. Most states have gone this route and it has solved NOTHING. It just shifts the tax burden around, often onto those who can least afford it.

Consider this, in NH if I want to avoid high taxes, I simply do not buy an expensive piece of property.

If I inherit one, I sell it and pocket a couple million dollars. At 5% earnings (NOT taxed by NH unless dividends and interest and even that is being phased out) on the $2 million you can take an annual $100,000 vacation anywhere in the world for the rest of your life.

Try avoiding a sales tax. It's built into much of what is bought in many states.

If you are not retired, income tax unavoidably gobbles up a chunk of your pay. In some states, high wage earners are "progressively" taxed at a higher rate.

And what do you get for your "evolved" tax structure? Usually, out of control spending because once politicians have a money pot to access they think of MANY ways to expand spending for "evolved" causes. Check in with Vermont, California, New York, ... where they are taxed through the roof, INCLUDING heavy property taxes, and they are STILL GOING BROKE. Further, since most of these "evolved" taxes are instituted at the state level, they are out of the range of local control. If you think it's tough to control local spending, controlling state spending of sales and income taxes is impossible. The federal government, where we are $33 TRILLION in debt, is FAR worse.

As others have pointed out, NH has one of the lowest overall tax burdens and, for the most part, it is funded by people who CHOOSE to buy/keep expensive property and CAN afford it and businesses who are making a profit.

If paying taxes like Vermont is "evolved", I would rather remain a property tax paying, devolved, monkey and keep more of my hard earned money. Please don't step on my tail.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Biggd and Garysanfran are talking about property in the same town.
So it wasn't town spending.

Garysanfran must have property that is a lot more desirable to people willing to expend more for a property of that nature... so it pushed his assessment higher.

I doubt if he chose to sell at the new assessment level that the property would be on the market very long.

I'm assuming Garysanfran has private waterfront, I only have water rights with a dock. I feel for the longtime waterfront owners that can't afford to keep family properties in the family, they are getting jammed up.
I was thrilled that my taxes went up less than 10% because I've seen the value of my property triple. I could not afford to buy my Meredith home today as a second home.
I hate to say it, but if I had a private waterfront home today, I would probably sell it, buy off the lake and invest the profit.
I understand that some properties have sentimental value, but you have to detach yourself from that if it becomes a financial burden.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by garysanfran

10% is outrageous, what I am being charged is extortion...For what?

This place has been in may family since 1961. I bought it about 6 yrs. ago.

Every property on my road has sold over those 62 years because the original owners could no longer afford or justify the tax.

So for this increase I get...

Increased congestion
Inadequate infrastructure
Intolerable boat traffic on weekends
A seasonable place not used during winter
No snow plowing service on a private road
No paved road
No town water
No kids in school
An increase in Massachusetts influenced politics

I can afford the new taxes...I'd rather throw tea into the harbor.

However...

To be continued.

Maybe time to sell, take the money and run!

[WinnisquamZ]

Meredith tax payers feeling the pain us Laconia taxpayers felt last year


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

Meredith tax payers feeling the pain us Laconia taxpayers felt last year


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

and this year as well, Laconia hammered me again

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by AC2717

and this year as well, Laconia hammered me again

Unfortunately, the popularity of the NH lakes region is a blessing for some and a curse for others!

[AC2717]

I love my location and 828sqft of space for 18 years but now at $9k in taxes, my wife and I are in serious discussion of an exit strategy.

[Biggd]

Originally Posted by AC2717

I love my location and 828sqft of space for 18 years but now at $9k in taxes, my wife and I are in serious discussion of an exit strategy.

I see you're from Maynard, have you been to the Sanctuary? I went to dinner at Magnolia's and a concert at the Sanctuary about a month ago.

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by Biggd

I see you're from Maynard, have you been to the Sanctuary? I went to dinner at Magnolia's and a concert at the Sanctuary about a month ago.

yes, and they have a nice little bar in the back

[LIforrelaxin]

As I read the comments here I am left to ponder what I always ponder, is the way that the State of NH, funds itself proper at this point... Local cities and towns are left to raise funds to run there communities, there is very little state aid in that regard. Thus at times the towns have to levy a huge tax burden on its residents....

The reason that this is the case, is the NH State Goverment, is not properly funded, and thus is strapped to provide aid to towns, for projects that in most other state will get not only federal funding, but also state funding for similar improvements....

As I have always said, spread the pain... I know the people of NH think that a sales tax is criminal... but honestly it is how you can shift the pain, and also grab a tremendous amount of revenue for the tourism industry... That tax, then can be used to fund grants that local communities can apply to the state for to offset the costs, associated with building up infrustructure, and schools.... as they grow...

Or the state of NH can continue on it mary way, of become a Rich mans paradise, where no one can afford to own except the elite.... or Maybe that is what the state desires....

As another poster mentioned, I can pay the taxes, that isn't the issue, but at a certain point, I will start to feel like my money is better spent else where....

To counteract a point made either in this thread, or possiblely another, about the affordability of a home on a lake, being for the elite... Well that is true in NH, the are plenty of properties in other states available, that are more affordable cost wise, and have taxes that are minuscule when compared to
NH.... My point, the lakes region is a gem because of it location, and proximity to major cities like Boston, NY, and Hartford.... at a certain point the gem got recognized, and now we are where we are at today...... well another area will become a gem soon enough for those of us that don't need to be with all the city folks...

[WinnisquamZ]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

As I read the comments here I am left to ponder what I always ponder, is the way that the State of NH, funds itself proper at this point... Local cities and towns are left to raise funds to run there communities, there is very little state aid in that regard. Thus at times the towns have to levy a huge tax burden on its residents....

The reason that this is the case, is the NH State Goverment, is not properly funded, and thus is strapped to provide aid to towns, for projects that in most other state will get not only federal funding, but also state funding for similar improvements....

As I have always said, spread the pain... I know the people of NH think that a sales tax is criminal... but honestly it is how you can shift the pain, and also grab a tremendous amount of revenue for the tourism industry... That tax, then can be used to fund grants that local communities can apply to the state for to offset the costs, associated with building up infrustructure, and schools.... as they grow...

Or the state of NH can continue on it mary way, of become a Rich mans paradise, where no one can afford to own except the elite.... or Maybe that is what the state desires....

As another poster mentioned, I can pay the taxes, that isn't the issue, but at a certain point, I will start to feel like my money is better spent else where....

To counteract a point made either in this thread, or possiblely another, about the affordability of a home on a lake, being for the elite... Well that is true in NH, the are plenty of properties in other states available, that are more affordable cost wise, and have taxes that are minuscule when compared to

NH.... My point, the lakes region is a gem because of it location, and proximity to major cities like Boston, NY, and Hartford.... at a certain point the gem got recognized, and now we are where we are at today...... well another area will become a gem soon enough for those of us that don't need to be with all the city folks...

Disagree. The state reported they had a surplus again this year. Not remembering the figures, but 400 million comes to mind. Would like to see the city and towns keep more upfront then having to go back and beg for it.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

Disagree. The state reported they had a surplus again this year. Not remembering the figures, but 400 million comes to mind. Would like to see the city and towns keep more upfront then having to go back and beg for it.

Since the State has a two year budget, having an excess one year does not equate to the budget being in surplus.
The State receives the majority of its funding from sales and income taxes that are irregular.

The State gas tax is partially refunded to the municipalities, along with the Meals & Rental tax, the two Business taxes generally fund the education grant system.

The cost of labor for the municipalities is rising, and that can be seen in each of the two budgets and the county budget. That rise in cost is due to a lack of labor in the area, and the inefficiency of the customer base.

[tis]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

As I read the comments here I am left to ponder what I always ponder, is the way that the State of NH, funds itself proper at this point... Local cities and towns are left to raise funds to run there communities, there is very little state aid in that regard. Thus at times the towns have to levy a huge tax burden on its residents....

The reason that this is the case, is the NH State Goverment, is not properly funded, and thus is strapped to provide aid to towns, for projects that in most other state will get not only federal funding, but also state funding for similar improvements....

As I have always said, spread the pain... I know the people of NH think that a sales tax is criminal... but honestly it is how you can shift the pain, and also grab a tremendous amount of revenue for the tourism industry... That tax, then can be used to fund grants that local communities can apply to the state for to offset the costs, associated with building up infrustructure, and schools.... as they grow...

Or the state of NH can continue on it mary way, of become a Rich mans paradise, where no one can afford to own except the elite.... or Maybe that is what the state desires....

As another poster mentioned, I can pay the taxes, that isn't the issue, but at a certain point, I will start to feel like my money is better spent else where....

To counteract a point made either in this thread, or possiblely another, about the affordability of a home on a lake, being for the elite... Well that is true in NH, the are plenty of properties in other states available, that are more affordable cost wise, and have taxes that are minuscule when compared to
NH.... My point, the lakes region is a gem because of it location, and proximity to major cities like Boston, NY, and Hartford.... at a certain point the gem got recognized, and now we are where we are at today...... well another area will become a gem soon enough for those of us that don't need to be with all the city folks...

The problem is, if they found another source for taxes, you and I both know that the property taxes wouldn't go down. They would just spend more.

[garysanfran]

Ironically? Or not...

In the same mail as my outrageous tax bill was a Christmas card from the top waterfront realtor in The Lakes Region.

[WinnisquamZ]

Originally Posted by AC2717

I love my location and 828sqft of space for 18 years but now at $9k in taxes, my wife and I are in serious discussion of an exit strategy.

Same here. House has been in the family since 66. The wife and I will be the ones to move on from it. Current taxes is a wealth drain. Exit strategy is 4-6 years out and in good health. Oh course, when life kicks one in the groin plans change. Waiting on spring


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[WinnisquamZ]

Welcome to the club


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[John Mercier]

Private road you would need to pave yourself.
Public sewer and water is actually paid for by a separate bill... not property tax.
And not sure what a Massachussets influenced politics would look like.

But look on the bright side... you could always sell out.
The increase is due to the desirability of your location.

[Jeanzb1]

Our Gilford tax payment in July went from $2285 to $3114 this month. Big gulp.


Sent from my iPad using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[WinnisquamZ]

All this talk about capital gains and increased equity is infuriating. We want to enjoy the home. Just as our grandparents and parents did. We want to keep the property, not sell it. Many think it’s a good problem to have. While find it stressful


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app

[John Mercier]

Then you need to remove all the values that caused the area to be seen as a tourist attraction.

[I.C.Isles]

I saw Deval Patrick speak at a corporate event once. He summed it up well in a candid way. He told us that while companies worked to be more efficient and have less people do the work to compete, the government worked to employ people and get votes.

So…bloated government offices with early retirees still on the payroll and dependent on the government is a good thing that the politicians strive to grow to generate more votes.


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app