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Old 09-19-2022, 07:34 PM   #1
Dad207
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Default Treat New Dock?

Just replaced my dock -- its pretty big, 20 x 15 with a U -shaped boat slip and an access pier. Pressure treated pine , of course, but wondering if I should use a commercial sealant. There is alot of discussion on line about the advantages-- protection from sunlight and water, snow absorption, but I have also heard that once treated you've got an ongoing maintenance issue, need to power wash and re-treat every 3-4 years. That may not be the worst case, but interested in a variety of views.


--Treat or no?
--Product experience
--Maintenance post treatment
--Environmental-- what can I use, and to what degree must I prevent dripping into the Lake?


I do know that I need to let it dry out-- 3-6 months.
Input very much appreciated.
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Old 09-19-2022, 07:55 PM   #2
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You would need to seal it to protect it from water absorption.
The capillary action of wet/dry will cause it to ''crack'' more and allow for the mold to accelerate the decaying process.

A UV inhibitor... of various degrees... as part of the stain (color) determines how long that may last; with oil taking more even wear than acrylic.

Rather than just letting it dry for best estimate... use a moisture meter.

You can tell if the sealer has failed using a ''beading'' test.
You can only tell if the UV inhibitor is failing from the graying of the wood.

Cleaning gets done before any application of stain as a means not to trap mold beneath the stain. Most important for transparent and semi-transparent stains as that will create a darkening.
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Old 09-19-2022, 08:20 PM   #3
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It's poison! You don't want it anywhere near the lake. I'm pretty sure the back of the can will say to keep it away from surface water
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Old 09-19-2022, 09:00 PM   #4
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Acrylic is actually mostly water.
Oil creates a ''slick'' but is no more damaging than gasoline powered boats in the waterway.

The real problem is proper application.
It is the stripping of that dock that will create the serious problem.
Strippers and brighteners are serious business.
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Old 09-20-2022, 04:00 AM   #5
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Smile Ask Me about Piling Docks...

Our PT Southern Pine dock is about 48 years old, with no planks replaced. (Only two flipped in its history). Construction on a neighbor's dock tells me it's the same contractor, and it looks somewhat better. How frequently it gets treated is unknown.

I never saw my dock when it was new--it's been gray "forever". I'd guess it was treated four times in its long history. (Three times by me.) 'Always used Thompson's Sealer and used either a brush or a roller: The roller threw a lot of sealer, but the majority of drops landed against the adjacent boards' wide edges. (The brush was much harder to control the excess sealer).

There are only three issues that need attention:

1) Splinters

2) Vegetative growth on the dozen planks nearest shore

3) Resetting the nails

✔ Checked annually, and a few splinters are glued back in place using epoxy--temporarily held in place with doorstop-shaped wooden wedges. Sometimes removal or sanding will fix the occasional splinter. Always barefoot, i donít have splinters as an issue, but some folks had that justified concern for their grandchildren.

✔ Vegetation is a recent condition, caused by too many oversized boat wakes crashing ashore. (Occasionally, wakes will soak a sun bather at the end of the dock.). So far, wood rot is not a problem. It's slippery there but fortunately, they're not in a well-traveled area. I need to re-treat those boards in spring, when it's relatively clear of vegetation and the weather is warm and dry. Maybe a day in late spring, when the sun heats the dock so it's too hot to walk on!

✔ Nails need hammering back in place: lag bolts need tightening.

After one episode of finding the dock submerged after "Ice-Out", I've chained the outermost
piling sets to the dock. Yes, a chain will occasionally break during Ice-Out, but the dock is saved from becoming a floating dock!

Repairing with a farm jack:
https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ead.php?t=1694
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Old 09-20-2022, 06:28 AM   #6
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That is impressive Aps. At 48 years it doesnít owe you much. Thatís when PT was made to last but 48 is even well past that. We had a section of our dock replaced 10 years ago. I replaced 7 PT 2x6ís used as decking last month. Three had rotted thru. Iíve got another 8 or so to go before next season.
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Old 09-20-2022, 09:39 AM   #7
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48 years ago...
PT included arsenic.

We no longer have that option, and haven't for some time.
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Old 09-20-2022, 11:27 AM   #8
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Default Illegal?

I have heard it is illegal to stain or paint a dock that is over the water in NH. Anyone know for sure?
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Old 09-20-2022, 12:02 PM   #9
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It isn't.
They do it all the time.
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Old 09-20-2022, 12:55 PM   #10
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Interesting to note that some of the longest lived buildings in the country have exteriors that have never been painted. I had a craftsman tell me that he feels the problem with building anything now days is the wood contains moisture and when it gets painted the outside is sealed so the wood canít ďbreathĒ. When put together it makes some sense. Bottom line, I pressure wash my dock about every 8 - 10 years or so but, I donít treat it.


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Old 09-20-2022, 02:14 PM   #11
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Vertical lasts different than horizontal...
And uncovered horizontal was made from woods that were naturally resistant to rot and splinter... generally either through natural inhibitors or tight grains.

You can still do that if you use these types of wood.
Other items, such as white pine from NH was older growth - grew more slowly - and had tighter grain. They would be coated man times with a polywhey produce that came from the milking industry as a waste product to making cheese or as spoiled milk that could not be sold.
This is the basis for Vermont Natural Coatings' products.
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Old 09-20-2022, 11:30 PM   #12
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Arrow Arsenic Saves Trees...

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mercier View Post
48 years ago...

PT included arsenic.

We no longer have that option, and haven't for some time.
I wonder how many trees I've spared by not going "green"?

Arsenic is found naturally: Twenty percent of New Hampshire's wells exceed by half-again a dangerous level of Arsenic.
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Old 09-21-2022, 07:09 AM   #13
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It had nothing to do with going green.

PT is not manufactured in NH... nor is Southern Yellow Pine grown here.
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Old 09-22-2022, 12:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ApS View Post
I wonder how many trees I've spared by not going "green"?

Arsenic is found naturally: Twenty percent of New Hampshire's wells exceed by half-again a dangerous level of Arsenic.
Which is why those wells don’t produce drinking water safe for human consumption without a treatment system installed.

Just because something occurs naturally doesn’t mean it’s safe to add more to the environment.


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Old 09-22-2022, 02:30 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dad207 View Post
Just replaced my dock -- its pretty big, 20 x 15 with a U -shaped boat slip and an access pier. Pressure treated pine , of course, but wondering if I should use a commercial sealant. There is alot of discussion on line about the advantages-- protection from sunlight and water, snow absorption, but I have also heard that once treated you've got an ongoing maintenance issue, need to power wash and re-treat every 3-4 years. That may not be the worst case, but interested in a variety of views.


--Treat or no?
--Product experience
--Maintenance post treatment
--Environmental-- what can I use, and to what degree must I prevent dripping into the Lake?


I do know that I need to let it dry out-- 3-6 months.
Input very much appreciated.
I'd recommend you treat it either with a transparent or semi solid quality stain such as Sikkens. I prefer semi solid. Hopefully it was put together with screws and not nails. Nails have a tendency to pull out causing the boards to curl.
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Old 09-22-2022, 04:30 PM   #16
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You will not find Sikkens in the US anymore.
The North American rights were purchased by PPG several years ago, and now is sold under the name Proluxe.
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Old 09-22-2022, 07:05 PM   #17
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Default Same Product?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mercier View Post
You will not find Sikkens in the US anymore.
The North American rights were purchased by PPG several years ago, and now is sold under the name Proluxe.
Isnít the formulation the exact same just relabeled by PPG??
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Old 09-22-2022, 08:39 PM   #18
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Question Does the Repeated Rebuilding of "Green" Docks Improve the Environment?

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It had nothing to do with going green.
It was the EPA that phased out CCA (chromated copper arsenate), beginning in 2004.

Except for turning a river orange with arsenic, the EPA represents our tax dollars at the front of "green".

Quote:
...nor is Southern Yellow Pine grown here.
Correct.

I pass-by miles and miles of Yellow Pine "forests" twice a year. It's a huge "crop".

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Real BigGuy View Post
Which is why those wells donít produce drinking water safe for human consumption without a treatment system installed. Just because something occurs naturally doesnít mean itís safe to add more to the environment.
Wouldn't it make sense for the driller of those wells to continue drilling deeper when arsenic is found in the water produced?

As to arsenic in the lake, if you capped an arsenic-producing well, wouldn't that groundwater eventually find its way into the lake?

Lake Winnipesaukee is supplied by natural springs, which contain measurable units of arsenic; fortunately, the Winnipesaukee Basin is also flushed by rainwater, which regularly dilutes the arsenic--as well as other poisonous elements.

I'd be curious how Lake Winnipesaukee's water compares with Wolfeboro's town water in undesirable elements. Having seen Wolfeboro's analyses, I think I know the answer!
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Old 09-22-2022, 08:57 PM   #19
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If you knew about decking - and you don't - the green choice would be either the recycle products, the PVC products, or Forest Certified exotics.

https://www.cpsc.gov/s3fs-public/270_0.pdf

We began using pressure treated wood because it was a cheap option, not a green option.
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Old 09-22-2022, 09:22 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ishoot308 View Post
Isnít the formulation the exact same just relabeled by PPG??
Depends. Sikkens produced many formulations. They sold to PPG because of the VOC compliance demands of certain State meant that some of the line could not be sold in all 50 States. So it depends on what you are specifically looking for. The SRD that we sell is complaint in NH... but I can't get some of the others that I can in Vermont.

The only stains sold locally, that I know of, that changed dramatically were Cabot ATO (we can only sell the original in NH as quarts due to the VOC; Vermont can get it in gallons and five gallons) and Cabot Oil Deck stains (they now have blue lids with a modified oil).

Penofin decided to leave the market in NH, I can still get it in Vermont. But for me, it isn't worth the trip.
I went to Native Exotic decking when we had it. It had stain pressure treated right into the deck board.
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Old Yesterday, 04:18 AM   #21
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Cool CCA (Chromium-Copper-Arsenate) Keeps the Seas from Rising...

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mercier View Post
If you knew about decking - and you don't - the green choice would be either the recycle products, the PVC products, or Forest Certified exotics.
We began using pressure treated wood because it was a cheap option, not a green option.
Correct: With the benefits of a CCA dock, there's no need to. .

The EPA may have erred.

A Florida neighbor has a 125-foot dock to keep his 50-foot Kevlar powerboat. (With four hard points molded in for delivery by helicopter). The decking is a brick-colored flow-through product he'd bought through eBay. It may appear "green", but fossil fuels were entirely employed in its manufacture.

The decking and boat survived Hurricane Irma, but the aluminum/stainless lift itself broke.
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