Name That Fish

[4 for Boating]

I was up at the lake Winn this weekend and my nephew caught this fish off the dock, took a picture and asked me what it was.

Typically everything w e catch is either a smallmouth or sunfish so this particular fish was new to us. Seemed kind of narrow/thin for white perch.

So can anyone tell me what type of fish this is?
Hopefully the attachment is present.

Thanks!

[Jonas Pilot]

It's a fall fish, some times called a lake chub or roach.

[4 for Boating]

Thanks!

Are these very common in Winnipesaukee?

Have been fishing on the lake for over 7 years and this is first one we have caught or seen for that matter.

Any idea on how big they get and are they viewed as “junk” fish?

[Fishy Cover]

A neighbor calls them whitefish.

[Jonas Pilot]

Your welcome.
It is native to New Hampshire and a member of the minnow family. It is common but being omnivorous it isn’t a fish that will often fall prey to an anglers lure or bait. I’ve caught them on night crawlers, jigs and even a spinner bait. The average size (caught) is similar to yours, 12 to 14 inches. I did catch one about 10 years ago that measured 21 1/4”. It put up a heck of a fight!
One of it’s nick names is “stone roller”. It earned this by the way it builds it’s “redd” or nest. It gathers small rocks and stones and piles them in a heap. This could be a couple of feet wide up to around 6 feet across. The first one I ever saw I thought had been made by kids. I’ve seen them in Sally’s Gut and the Smith River entering into Lake Wentworth.

[Jonas Pilot]

I can see how someone might get the the whitefish and the fallfish confused. They both have forked caudal fins and long semi slender bodies, they are close to the same color and both have distinctive scales, but they have a few field marks that can help you tell the difference. The lack of the adipose fin on the fallfish is one identifying characteristic. Another is the different sized scales, the fallfish is larger of the two. You’ll also notice the whitefish has a very distinctive difference in the size of the head in relation to it’s body girth. The head seems too small for the body.

Fallfish
http://pond.dnr.cornell.edu/nyfish/C...e/fallfish.jpg

Whitefish
http://pond.dnr.cornell.edu/nyfish/s...e_whtefish.jpg

[Jonas Pilot]

I always loved this story about the fallfish, contributed to Henry David Thoreau, the American author, poet and naturalist . He said the fallfish was an interesting culinary adventure. Thoreau said, It’s important to prepare the fish well, taking time to properly clean the fish. Take care to remove all the entrails and gills. Remove the blood line at the spine (easiest with a spoon) and rinse thoroughly. Carefully remove all scales and season according to your preferences. Preheat your oven to 325 degrees. Place the prepared fish in a clean paper bag, tightly seal and cook for 1 hour. Remove the fish from the bag, throw away the fish and eat the bag.

[MDoug]

It's a fallfish, a large minnow. Down south we call it a sucker, a bottom feeder.

[Jonas Pilot]

It's pretty easy to tell the difference between a fallfish and a white sucker due to the placement of the mouth, it's inferior, or beneath the snout. I like to call them "bugle lips" due to it's puckered mouth .

White sucker

http://pond.dnr.cornell.edu/nyfish/C...ucker_pic.html

[Ken B]

Definitely a chub. They can grow quite large as I've caught many in some of Maine's western rivers that come close to 4lbs. Great fun on a flyrod but quite a nuisance as they hit just about everything. My son actually caught one on a torpedo top water in Umbagog last summer. I laughed like crazy and my son thought i was nuts! he later caught on on a fly rod that went close to 20inches and proclaimed " dad, now I know what the reel is for"!

Ken

[hilltopper]

Definitely not a sucker or whitefish. I used to refer to them (fallfish) as "dace" growing up. Definitely fun to catch when they got above 14" but definitely what we considered a "junk fish".

[4 for Boating]

While we are on the topic of fish that you don’t see every day. My brother-in-law caught a Pike last weekend while canoeing out from our house. Fairly good size.

I was not aware that Pike were plentiful in Winn. Are they common? If not, the way they eat I’m sure they will be before long. “Seems like this year has brought us wide array of fish as compared to the past years of small mouth bass.”

[GusMan]

Hi 4 for Boating...

Are you sure the fish in question was a northern pike
and not a large pickerel?

I ask because pike are pretty rare in New Hampshire in
general and to my knowledge have never been introduced
to Winnipesaukee. Pickerel (and large ones at that) are quite
common in many areas of the big lake. At one time I believe
the CT River and Spofford Lake were the only NH waterbodies
with pike.

Cheers....

Gusman

[4 for Boating]

Hey Gusman,

Well, he's a pretty experienced fisherman/hunter. So I think he got it right. Wish they took a picture.

He was out in the canoe with my brother and my brother was talking about how treacherous the teeth looked and how it took a bit to get him off the hook without being able to put their fingers in the mouth and all.
Could be wrong I suppose but he’s pretty knowledgeable both in fresh and salt water.

I was sort of hoping he was wrong as I’m not fond of them and the way they are vicious predators.

[Jonas Pilot]

It's a common error to confuse the two but I think that the markings on the sides are way different. On the Pickerel the markings are more "chain" like and on the northern pike more "lima bean" shaped. If you look at the dorsal (top) fin and the caudal (tail) fin on the pike it will have dark blotches. One more way to tell the difference is the black "tear drop" under the pickerels eye and scales on the gill cover that covers the whole gill, unlike the pike that covers only the top half of the opercles (gill cover).

Pickerel
http://pond.dnr.cornell.edu/nyfish/E...kerel_pic.html

Pike
http://pond.dnr.cornell.edu/nyfish/E..._pike_pic.html

Umbagog has pike too, but to my knowledge there are no pike in "Winni".

[4 for Boating]

Thanks so much and NICE pictures.

I will run these by my brother as I was surprised to see how close they really are in terms of body type. Easy to make the mistake I think. Q > Do the Chain Pickerel have any teeth?

[Jonas Pilot]

That's what makes them a chore to handle. They will try to bite you too when you go to grab them. If I'm fishing for pickerel or pike I most always debarb the hook to make it easier to remove. That's best for the fish and the angler.

[4 for Boating]

Well if the pickerel have teeth then I’m guessing it was indeed a pickerel.

I talked to my brother last night and after looking at the pictures, he was thinking it could just as easily been a pickerel. Then he went into his description of wrestling with it in the canoe trying not to get bit.

Thanks for all your help cleaning this up for us.

[dpg]

Jonas - do you have a fish Phd? Very knowledgable.(sp) and great pictures also.

[Jonas Pilot]

dpg
Thanks for the kind words.
I tried hard to think of something clever for Phd but came up blank.

I've had some semi formal education but for the most part I'm self taught. I have always loved the relationship between above the water and below. It was a long time ago but I still remember the excitement and wonder I felt the first time I ever felt the tug at the end of my line. I couldn't see it. I wondered what it looked like and how big it was. When that alien creature finally came to the net I was so excited and so scared, not knowing what to do next. Good thing my grandfather was there to help me learn how to gently handle the fish and carefully remove the hook . As soon as that fish swam away I couldn't wait to see what my next trophy would be.

Many anglers go through a progression. We start off wanting to catch a fish, any fish. Then we want to catch a lot of fish, still, it doesn't matter what we pull in as long as it wiggles. Finally we want the challenge of a specific species. In order to accomplish this we must know much more about our quary. We need to know what they look like so we can identify them, we need to know what makes them tick, what type of habitat they prefer, what they would rather eat, and when they are going to be most active. This increases our chances of finding them and tricking them into eating our bait or lure and catching that elusive prize. This is the challenge in angling that I enjoy most, putting together the puzzle. That usually equals success.

[SIKSUKR]

PHD would be a Pickerel Habitat Degree.

[Nadia]

We call the fish in the picture a "sand roach", and consider them a junk fish. They are not suckers or algae eaters. The "whitefish" or "American Shad" is a completely different species. They (sand roaches) are certainly pretty but don't make for good eats, and they are pesky little bait snaggers. This is the time of year I find them to be plentiful (and quite annoying).

I like that recipe you posted Jonas Pilot My father-in-law had a similar recipe for rainbow trout (he did not like them). He suggested frying them in a cast iron pan, adding spices, onions, basil and EVOO. When they were cooked fully, toss the fish out and eat the pan.