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Old 12-06-2016, 09:27 PM   #1
greeleyhill
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Default Water Circulators in the Winter

Hey gang - two questions for you. For those that use water circulators under their dock during the winter, when do you turn them on and do you usually file a permit with the town or state?
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Old 12-06-2016, 10:04 PM   #2
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Hey gang - two questions for you. For those that use water circulators under their dock during the winter, when do you turn them on and do you usually file a permit with the town or state?
I set up a camera and a remote system to turn it on an off. I start it when I see ice. How long it runs depends on temperature. For temps above 20 I usually run about 6 to 8 hours a day. When it gets really cold I run it more, at around 10 or below for highs I run all day. I use a service to install and remove, they will monitor it, but they tend to just leave it on when it starts to get real cold running the electric bill up so I control it myself.
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Old 12-06-2016, 10:48 PM   #3
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I follow pretty much the same protocol using remote cameras and system to turn the circulators on and off.

A permit is required to be filed with the town at a cost of 50 cents per circulator. Unfortunately, you only can pay for the current year, and must apply annually.
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Old 12-06-2016, 11:05 PM   #4
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Isa that true for all towns?
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Old 12-07-2016, 09:00 AM   #5
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Default NH Statutes

270:33 Heating, Agitating or Other Devices in Public Waters, Safety Hazard. No person shall put, place, operate or cause to be put, placed or operated in the waters of this state any so-called heating, agitating or other device which inhibits or prevents the natural freezing of water, or forming of ice, and impedes either the ingress or egress to or from ice by means of any public access thereto. If the heating, agitating or other device is placed anywhere else, nearby signs shall likewise be placed to warn of possible danger. Said signs shall read DANGER, THIN ICE and shall be of sufficient size to be readable at a distance of not less than 150 feet, and shall be visible from all directions and shall be equipped with reflectors and color-coded in a pattern unique for this purpose only. The department of safety is hereby authorized to establish said unique design and coloring and any homemade copies shall follow this design and coloring. The provisions of this section shall be enforced by any law enforcement agency under the direction of the department of safety pursuant to RSA 106-A:14 and the department of fish and game pursuant to RSA 206:26.
Source. 1973, 321:1, eff. Nov. 1, 1973.

270:34 Registration Required. Any person operating or hereinafter operating any such agitating or heating device which tends to inhibit the natural production of ice on public waters must obtain a registration to be designed and distributed by the department of safety, from the municipal clerk of the town in which such device shall be operated and said registration shall contain the name and address of owner and the location of said device. A permanent file of such registrations shall be kept by municipal clerks and a fee of $.50 per registration may be charged.
Source. 1973, 321:1, eff. Nov. 1, 1973.
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Old 12-07-2016, 09:07 AM   #6
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Earl Bagley, Winnipesaukee Aquatherm service, that's who I use to install and remove my circulator. He takes care of the permit. He will also show up and repair/replace failed units which usually involves cutting through ice to recover.

http://www.manta.com/c/mm0z45r/winni...atherm-service
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Old 12-07-2016, 09:54 AM   #7
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If you need a water circulator, and do not want to spend the 300 to 500-dollar price for a used or new circulator, I have successfully used the 1/6-hp utility pumps sold by Lowe's now selling for about $80 each........ the Lowe's Utiltech, made in China, 1/6-hp utility pump. I used three pumps positioned for best coverage and ran them in line with a temp/time control for the three winter months. Each pump draws water from below and expels it straight up which agitates the surface water. It is easy to hang each pump with a single rope line from the dock or boat lift.

For its size, compared to other 1/6-hp pumps, the Utiltech 1/6-hp is very heavy because it is made with a vinyl coated, cast iron body and the heavy weight helps to keep it stationary while in use, hanging from a single rope line.

Colder air temps call for longer running time to fight back the building ice ..... especially in the month of January ...... it's all about the air temp ..... and ice is much stronger, sturdier and resistant to a hand held ice chopper at say 10-degrees than it is at 25-degrees. Colder = stronger and more elastic and sturdy ice ........ colder temps = a stronger and sturdier molecular bond within the ice.

...........

One of the neighborhood issues with water circulators is the noise of constantly splashing water. Is possible to have an unoccupied home, next door, with a noisy, constant, splashy circulator that creates a lot of unwanted noise, like a water torture, for the next door neighbor who lives there in the winter ........ what to do ...... who do you call ........ hello-911......all this splashy, water noise is driving me c-r-a-z-y ....... so's please, let's get a cop down here asap .....pdq ......and make it a code-3 ........ yikes ..... !
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Old 12-07-2016, 12:44 PM   #8
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50 cents per Circulator is that right?? Hardly seems worth the paperwork.
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Old 12-07-2016, 01:20 PM   #9
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50 cents per Circulator is that right?? Hardly seems worth the paperwork.
If you look at the dates of the RSA's, they are 1973. Over 40 years without a fee increase. I shudder to think how many fees have not been updated for decades.

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Old 12-07-2016, 01:24 PM   #10
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We've had Earl for years at our Association and I have never had record of him filing for a permit. I found out about the permit last year and filed for it myself as the town had no record.
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Old 12-07-2016, 01:59 PM   #11
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Something to mention - try to be cognizant of the affect your water circulator is having on the ice thickness in front of your next door neighbors. If you are not careful you can cut off access to the ice for other people. Just a thought - those who do not participate in on-ice activities might not think about this aspect.
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Old 12-07-2016, 02:14 PM   #12
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Very good point TC mike. I have this problem. Neighbor leaves a seasonal dock in all winter and throws a circulator off the end of it so we cant get on the ice off our beach anymore.
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Old 12-07-2016, 02:21 PM   #13
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I use an "Ice Eater Thermostat" that sells on ebay for $25. It plugs in-line with a circulator and turns it on under 32 degrees. You can also buy an adjustable thermostat, but its a lot more money and you might set it wrong.

It will pay for itself the first year.
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Old 12-07-2016, 02:21 PM   #14
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Something to mention - try to be cognizant of the affect your water circulator is having on the ice thickness in front of your next door neighbors. If you are not careful you can cut off access to the ice for other people. Just a thought - those who do not participate in on-ice activities might not think about this aspect.
Absolutely, the use of remote on/off and cameras allow the greatest control. Those who turn on the circulators and forget them give each of us who try to limit open water a bad name. In the past, I had a 7 day clock and needed to make assumptions as to the weather if away. I had the tendency to schedule running it less than needed to avoid impacting my neighbors, and paid the price one year when the ice formed quickly and lifted the dock.
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Old 12-07-2016, 03:35 PM   #15
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I had one thru a local dock company for ten years. As long as you don't impact waterway and have a red danger sign you should not have a problem. I certainly didn't bother with a permit and didn't know it even existed . I also had a temp setting box so I believe it went on and off on its own. The service did come out every couple of weeks to check that it still worked
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Old 12-07-2016, 04:38 PM   #16
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This subject has come up before. Do a search on this forum for them. There have been many good points made on the use and overuse of circulators, including how the extent and frequency of time-on periods can depend on location and wind exposure, and on trying to deal with neighboring property owners whose use prevents you from accessing the lake.
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Old 12-07-2016, 06:23 PM   #17
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Default thermostat and timer

I only had a thermostat on mine until a couple of years ago when we had a few weeks where it never got above freezing, so the unit ran 24/7 and created a pretty wide swath of open water around both sides of the dock, which was problematic for us getting off the ice to shore (had to walk up from the neighbors).

Since then, I coupled the thermostat with a timer, so if the air temp is less than 32, the timer will let it run up to 9 hours (always enough to clear up everything), but just enough around the dock, and saves $$ too!

Had to scoop snow out of the boat for the commute this morning -PIG

ps: a good portion of Wicwas is frozen... if the cold temps keep up... we should see ice forming in Winni within the next couple of weeks
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Old 12-08-2016, 06:17 AM   #18
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Default ...... arrrggghhhhhh...... here comes the deep freeze!

.....cold....cold....cold......have you seen the weather forecast starting six days from today....supposedly, the weather is dipping into the semi deep freeze with three days of lows down to zero degrees ...... yikes.....it is definitely time for me to go get my 40' dock and boat lift out and up onto the land, dragging it all up and over a six foot rocky embankment....

......don't mean to be braggn' here....but I am like the greatest 65-year old, one man dock removal team, in the world history of removing docks.....ho-ho-ho......and arrrggghhhhhh! ........ :....I do it with a 10' ramp and now with two come-alongs since the winch got worn out last year?
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Old 12-11-2016, 12:57 PM   #19
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I have a circulator set in front of my dock, last year was my first year on the lake dealing with a dock and Ice. Set mine up on timer to go on for 6 hours and go off for 6, worked well. In reading blogs people talk about a thermostat controlled remotely, how does that work? If it is set for 32 degrees wouldn't run all the time?
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Old 12-18-2016, 04:48 PM   #20
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Default Thermostat!

I also use a standard timer and an inline thermostat that cuts out above freezing. Saved a lot on electricity when i added that.

I put up a thin ice sign but have never gotten a permit in over 20 years.

I echo the concern about the hyperactive use of circulators by some. It's as much about direction of the flow as hours run. Both matter.

I still cannot understand why the town of Meredith runs the circulator so heavily at Cattle Landing that it destroys access there all winter. At the only public parking area on that part of the lake. They can protect the floating dock pilings without creating a thirty foot circle of open water. Yes i reached out to a Selectman a few years back and got a nice response that led to no action.
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Old 12-18-2016, 09:14 PM   #21
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I also use a standard timer and an inline thermostat that cuts out above freezing. Saved a lot on electricity when i added that.

I put up a thin ice sign but have never gotten a permit in over 20 years.
I use a timer & thermostat combo to control our circulator as well, and agree it does save money as the motor doesn't run when the air temp. is above freezing.

As for the annual permit, I look at it this way: 1) it's required by law, and 2) how much increased legal & financial liability could you potentially incur if someone fell through thin ice near your dock and you had no permit for the circulator? Those two factors make getting a permit each year an easy decision for me.
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Old 12-18-2016, 09:33 PM   #22
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I still cannot understand why the town of Meredith runs the circulator so heavily at Cattle Landing that it destroys access there all winter. At the only public parking area on that part of the lake. They can protect the floating dock pilings without creating a thirty foot circle of open water. Yes i reached out to a Selectman a few years back and got a nice response that led to no action.
Suggest you send an email to mfaller@meredithnh.org , the DPW Dept head .... Mike does a totally super-duper job at the Meredith DPW ..... could well be the circulator control is a timer that does not have a temperature setting, so it runs too much....creating too much open water.

And, on the other hand, could be the town simply doesn't want the Cattle Landing town dock to become a 'go to' spot for snowmobiles, atv's, and bob houses to access the lake via the 60" opening in the blue fence, there?

You know that were the opening in the fence to re-constructed from a 60" opening down to a 12" open, the reduced size could restrict the winter access away from the snowmobiles, atv's and bob-houses.....and much more toward pedestrian use by snowshoe, hikers, and cross country skiers ........ here here!!!

If that fence don't fit ...... then you must omit ....... git off that machine and go take a hike ..... !
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