Boat vs Pontoon

pcmc · 12-23-2011, 05:02 PM

Hi everyone,

I am new to boating and am as green as they come. We don't even have a boat yet, but are looking.

Will you give some advice as to pro's and con's(your opinion) of a boat and/or a pontoon?

I have my eye on a few boats that are older in the 17'-18' range with 3.0 or 4.3 engines. Were staying in the $4k price range, so this may squeeze out pontoons, but Im curious about the space of pontoon vs a boat. Any opinions would be great. Also, I will trailering it every time, to the States Landing boat launch in Moultonborough which is about a 1/2 mile away.

Please NO heated discussions, I don't want this to go in that direction. Just your personal opinion as to what you like and dislike about either. Seeing as many marinas are closed for the holidays, I figured I ask this now and have some time compare.

Thankyou and Happy Holidays to all,

Peter

WinterHarborGirl · 12-23-2011, 05:35 PM

If you plan on going out to the broads you will probably need somrthing bigger than an 17 ft boat.....we started with 17 foot bowrider and quickley traded for a 23 foot bowrider.... We love our bowrider but I think a pontoon would also be awesome....Lots of room... i guess it depends on how many people you will be having and if you want to ski....My son skis and so do I (sometimes) so we needed a boat....

RLW · 12-23-2011, 06:07 PM

I agree with thread 2, however we also ski behind our 22' pontoon boat without any problems. We do have a SUPRA wake boat also, but as I said we do ski behind the pontoon boat and it is also a lot easier to get onto and off of than a regular boat. We have some elderly friends and it is a pleasure for them to get on and off. Just my 2¢. Both means of transportation are great

NoBozo · 12-23-2011, 07:12 PM

If you have multiple guests on a regular basis..and have no particular afinity to one or the other, I would get a Toon. Plenty of room and a stable platform to walk around on for those guests that don't have boating experience. Great for sightseeing.

If you only need to entertain another couple, a 17-20' bowrider would be a good start...leaning toward 20+ feet.

Outboards are low maintenence when winter comes. Inboard/Outdrives are NOT low maintenance. If you do nothing to an outboard in the fall, to prepare for winter, you will be fine. The water drains out every time you haul the boat out of the water. (Outboard engine in the verticle position)

If you do nothing with an Inboard/Outdrive, the water will NOT drain out and the engine will Freeze ...As in ICE..and you will be out Thousands of dollars in repairs.

NB

pcmc · 12-23-2011, 07:55 PM

Thanks for the responses.
I never thought about an issue with elderly having difficulty getting in and out, apriciate that view.
How much Hp is needed to ski behind a toon?
Are toons fun to drive ?..boring but convenience out weights this?
Can toons go to the broads? I've heard a little about the broads, but have never experienced them.(wait we are talking about the lake right

...)

Belmont Resident · 12-24-2011, 04:44 AM

Although some will disagree I believe most will agree that a 17’ boat may leave you wishing you had something bigger. Although boating has dropped off due to the economy, on a busy weekend even on a 22’ boat you can and will get tossed around and wet from spray.
Good luck with your purchase.

secondcurve · 12-24-2011, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Belmont Resident

Although some will disagree I believe most will agree that a 17’ boat may leave you wishing you had something bigger. Although boating has dropped off due to the economy, on a busy weekend even on a 22’ boat you can and will get tossed around and wet from spray.
Good luck with your purchase.

I totally agree. If I were you, I'd rent a few different boats this summer to get the hang of things. I'd also go as far to say that going on the broads in a 17 foot pontoon boat on all but the calmest of midweek days is crazy.

fpartri497 · 12-24-2011, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by secondcurve

I totally agree. If I were you, I'd rent a few different boats this summer to get the hang of things. I'd also go as far to say that going on the broads in a 17 foot pontoon boat on all but the calmest of midweek days is crazy.

I also agree nothing smaller than a 22 footer. I have moved up five times now In size to a 28 foot cruiser. the broads can be very nasty at times.

NHBUOY · 12-24-2011, 10:27 AM

If you are undecided, and not in a "hurry" to purchase either one, your best bet may be to "demo"/sea-trial hands-on the boats that interest you.

Kurt at the AmericanBoatClub in Meredith, has all the boats you would need to make a decision. You are basically joining a boat club that, for a nominal yearly fee, gives you access to any boat he has in his stable, all summer long.

He has what you need to compare & contrast the boat vs pontoon quandry.

A perfect program for you. NHB.

Grandpa Redneck · 12-24-2011, 02:04 PM

While I cant say much about the std V-hull boats as I only had a small 15 ft fishing boat for 1 summer, I highly recommend a Pontoon, we have had 3 and love them. As was said earlier they are a great stable platform , Grandama Redneck has a bum knee and hated the fishing boat because it rocked too much when she tried to move around bothering her knee. She has no problem with the Toon. Its kinda like your living room on the water plenty of room to move around. We ski and tube behind our current toon A 22 foot Premier 225 Sunsation LTD PTX(tripple log performance series) with a 150 merc Optimax (thanks Matt Galvin & Winnisquam Marine!!!). It is truly a BLAST to drive. We never tried skiing on our previous toons, but the one before this we did tube with it alot, another Premier 225 Sunsation Ltd only a 2 log with a 90 merc on it, It tubed quite well.
In my opinion as well as many of the people I know a Toon is the most versatile boat available, great for entertaining family and friends, for fishing, skiing, tubing, cruising, or just lounging around.
I would suggest talking to the folks at Winnisquam Marine, they have gone out of their way to make sure we got what we needed and wanted in a toon. The very knowledgeabl sales dept treated us Great before and after the sale and the Service has been excellent as well, They also sell V hulls and I am sure they would be happy to discuss the pro's and con's of both with you.

camp guy · 12-24-2011, 09:10 PM

I agree with "secondcurve" about renting different styles trying to find out what you like. Another idea would be to hang out at the launch ramp and see what people are using, and talking to them about size and style. In my experiences I've found that fellow boaters are more than willing to talk about their boat, good, bad, and ugly.

Meredith is a very busy ramp at which you might get some ideas.

Good luck. Keep up the research, after all, it is an investment you'd like to get right.

Merry Christmas.

NoRegrets · 12-25-2011, 07:49 PM

Your post is an exciting way to spend the off season. Trying to select a rationalle for choosing a pontoon vs. fiberglass vessel for a first boat is exciting. The Pontoon boat behaves very differently in wind. I do not think you can go wrong with either choice. You should experience both but going through a full season with either will give you great memories and a few surprises. You wouild have to own one of each to really know what is better. The Pontoon is very spacious but somewhat exposed. The bow rider can sit lower in teh water and you can hide behind the windshield when needed. To be out on the water is priceless no matter what boat you pick.

Personal opinion: Fair weather and your budget I MAY pick the pontoon.

SteveA · 12-28-2011, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by secondcurve

I totally agree. If I were you, I'd rent a few different boats this summer to get the hang of things. I'd also go as far to say that going on the broads in a 17 foot pontoon boat on all but the calmest of midweek days is crazy.

SC is VERY correct with this comment. We have a 20' pontoon and it is not good for the Broads except on a midweek calm evening. Way too much "chop" on the Broads during the busy time of day or on weekends.

That being said, we really like the pontoon for those times that the lake is calm and it is easier "on and off" than a traditional type boat. When conditions are "right" our boat is a very relaxing way to be on the lake. Also a typical toon is fairly low maintenance.

John A. Birdsall · 12-28-2011, 10:56 AM

as I grew older (and heavier) I found getting into and out of the runabout to be a chore I did not like, and thus used the boat less. I was given my fathers pontoon boat which I enjoy using. It is a 24' Princecraft with large toons on it. It has a 75 hp Mercury and a few years back we pulled two skiers with it. Not much problem doing that.

We have taken this out into the broads many many times and depending on how many people on board and where they sit you can get water spray on you. But that sometimes is part of the fun of boating isn't it?

As for size of runabout I have had boats from a 6' to now a 24' boat on the lake, I must say I never had the 6' out of sight of the cottage but the 11' has been in every port, every area of the lake, and under all bridges. And have been out in the broads in all type of weather. and I miss that boat, and I think the Mount misses it also.

Boating is fun, just have to have what is right fit for you and your family. Its great that we all have likes and what not as too boats.

crowsnest · 12-28-2011, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grandpa Redneck

While I cant say much about the std V-hull boats as I only had a small 15 ft fishing boat for 1 summer, I highly recommend a Pontoon, we have had 3 and love them. As was said earlier they are a great stable platform , Grandama Redneck has a bum knee and hated the fishing boat because it rocked too much when she tried to move around bothering her knee. She has no problem with the Toon. Its kinda like your living room on the water plenty of room to move around. We ski and tube behind our current toon A 22 foot Premier 225 Sunsation LTD PTX(tripple log performance series) with a 150 merc Optimax (thanks Matt Galvin & Winnisquam Marine!!!). It is truly a BLAST to drive. We never tried skiing on our previous toons, but the one before this we did tube with it alot, another Premier 225 Sunsation Ltd only a 2 log with a 90 merc on it, It tubed quite well.
In my opinion as well as many of the people I know a Toon is the most versatile boat available, great for entertaining family and friends, for fishing, skiing, tubing, cruising, or just lounging around.
I would suggest talking to the folks at Winnisquam Marine, they have gone out of their way to make sure we got what we needed and wanted in a toon. The very knowledgeabl sales dept treated us Great before and after the sale and the Service has been excellent as well, They also sell V hulls and I am sure they would be happy to discuss the pro's and con's of both with you.

We started with a 18 bow rider went to a 26 crownline (cabin) back to a 22 cuddy then to a 24 Premier sunsation with 2 toons with a 115 merc. We liked the pontoon boat the best so we got a enclosure for it to get out of the weather and (I still have and is for sale brand new used once). we liked that so much in july of this year we bought a premeir 225 Sunsation ltd ptx triple toon with a 150 just like Grandparedneck from Matt @ winnisquam marine. We liked that one so much in august of this year we traded up to the Premeir 24.5 Grand Isle with a 225 merc. WE have had a few boats over the years and I like the Pontoons for the lake (Hey Grandparedneck if Matt told you the boat you have was only used for about 6 weeks it was mine nice toon !!)

MikeF-NH · 12-28-2011, 01:30 PM

I have been boating Winni for about 7 years now in my 16 ft aluminum with a 40 HP and will absolutely disagree that it's inappropriate for the Broads BUT you have to be smart about it. When winds exceed 10-15 mph, it will get rough quck out there and the waves will grow quickly. An ex-marine friend of mine who ran small water craft in some of the toughest waters of the world, said he's had days on the Broads that have made him cringe. Point being, the boat is 1/2 the equation, common sense is the other 1/2. Given what I've seen my boat do and pontoons in the 17-18 foot range do on the Broads, I would much rather be in a v-hull anything than a toon when things get nasty out there. Of course the advantage to the toon in the case bad things happening, is it can flip over and still be floating and is "self bailing" in that it won't hold any water.

Once you've decided to be smart about how and when to handle the Broads, I would then take them out of the equation and just stay clear when winds kick up and stay in Moultonboro Bay or at least on the Moultonboro side of Long Island/Cow Island....plenty to explore in that water. With that in mind, I would begin asking yourself "what will I be using the boat for mostly". The toon is a far superior "pleasure craft" in comfort, accessibility and stability to a v-hull and most will come with a bimini which can't be understated in hot mid-summer sun. It's a great swim platform for rafting and, assuming you get enough motor, should be good for pulling skiers and tubers.

If you are going to fish (other than trolling), I would probably head toward a v-hull with a bow mount trolling motor. There are many "fish and ski" models around but might be hard to find in your budget.

If you are going to try many different water bodies with questionable ramps, a larger toon might be less flexible in this regard. Also if you go anything fibergalss, you really don't want to "beach it" as you will quickly wear the gel coat...in this case, aluminum (toon or v-hull) is the trick.

Go to some shows this winter. Surf craigs list. Check the marinas (last). Take your time and get the craft that meets your needs. The boat that is best for you is not necessary what is best for each responder on this thread. Think about flexibility and limitations of each design. make sure your motor is reliable (don't want to be paddling back to the ramp).

Finally, get your boaters safety class done and your certificate earned NOW. The education is important and required just like a car license. Be smart when starting out. Stay in calmer bays, learn out to take wakes and waves, take your time around markers so you really understand ATON. Understand not only what is required of you but what is not required but is courteous. Pick up a Bizer map of Winni...keep it on board.

Don't be afraid of the Broads (respect them) but go out on them for the first time in a flat calm morning to get a feel for how long it takes to get from one safe harbor to another. Learn what Middle Ground Shoals is "the easy way not the hard way". Know where the Graveyard is and the Witches is (if heading to Weirs).

Grandpa Redneck · 12-28-2011, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crowsnest

We started with a 18 bow rider went to a 26 crownline (cabin) back to a 22 cuddy then to a 24 Premier sunsation with 2 toons with a 115 merc. We liked the pontoon boat the best so we got a enclosure for it to get out of the weather and (I still have and is for sale brand new used once). we liked that so much in july of this year we bought a premeir 225 Sunsation ltd ptx triple toon with a 150 just like Grandparedneck from Matt @ winnisquam marine. We liked that one so much in august of this year we traded up to the Premeir 24.5 Grand Isle with a 225 merc. WE have had a few boats over the years and I like the Pontoons for the lake (Hey Grandparedneck if Matt told you the boat you have was only used for about 6 weeks it was mine nice toon !!)

Crowsnest, we got our PTX in the fall of 2010, it was one of their 2010 rental fleet. Matt and the crew @ Winnisquam are definately great to deal with!!! and the Premier PTX package is AWSOME!!!!!

jrc · 12-28-2011, 09:11 PM

It all depends on where and how you want to boat. If you want to launch at States Landing and pull a skier around Moultonboro Bay, a small 17' runabout will be great. You will have a blast.

With something less than 20 feet you can still explore the lake including the broads but you have to be careful. The broads are nasty when there is a strong north wind. There are days when anything short of the Mt Washington will give you a rough or wet ride. You also want to avoid the Weirs Beach and channel area on a busy summer weekend.

I never owned a pontoon so I can't add any value on that decision. But one word of advice, if you plan to explore and be away from your home port, you need a bathroom. Otherwise you and the boys may go, but forget the women.

I recommend the opposite approach, jump right in, get a boat you can easily afford and give it a try. I promise that whatever research you do, you will need to change boats in a few years or get out of boating. You can't learn to own a boat without owning a boat.

codeman671 · 12-28-2011, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grandpa Redneck

Crowsnest, we got our PTX in the fall of 2010, it was one of their 2010 rental fleet. Matt and the crew @ Winnisquam are definately great to deal with!!! and the Premier PTX package is AWSOME!!!!!

If memory serves me correct Matt left winnisquam in the spring of 2011, just after I took delivery of my ptx with a 250 pro xs.

The original post mentioned a $4k budget which may be tough if you want something that can run the lake in all conditions. A pontoon will certainly give you plenty of space. Being that you would have to stay with a twin tube look for a 24'. I have picked up some decent ones in the past in the $5-7k range.

NHBUOY · 12-28-2011, 10:09 PM

At Winnisquam Marine, ask for Kevin Dubia. He is the guy you want to talk to in sales there now. Fun place to do business.

Grandpa Redneck · 12-29-2011, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codeman671

If memory serves me correct Matt left winnisquam in the spring of 2011, just after I took delivery of my ptx with a 250 pro xs.

Codeman671, Matt is still there, We saw to him in November when we dropped ours off for the winter.

secondcurve · 12-29-2011, 06:48 AM

While I agree that using one's head helps avoid problems in a small boat there are times when things change quickly leaving even the most experienced boater exposed to difficult conditions. There have been many times when I have left one end of the lake to go to the other in perfectly calm conditions only to return several hours later in heavy chop. Thus, the need to have the right boat is critical on a lake like Winnipesaukee, in my opinion.

crowsnest · 12-29-2011, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codeman671

If memory serves me correct Matt left winnisquam in the spring of 2011, just after I took delivery of my ptx with a 250 pro xs.

The original post mentioned a $4k budget which may be tough if you want something that can run the lake in all conditions. A pontoon will certainly give you plenty of space. Being that you would have to stay with a twin tube look for a 24'. I have picked up some decent ones in the past in the $5-7k range.

He sent me a Christmas card he is still there. great people to deal with
Have you seen the 31 Premeir entertainer with the bar

codeman671 · 12-29-2011, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crowsnest

He sent me a Christmas card he is still there. great people to deal with
Have you seen the 31 Premeir entertainer with the bar

Yeah, that that boat is wild...I like the twin engine 27' that is on the lake.

Who was the tall guy in sales then? Chris? Whomever it was they left right after. I only deal with Ryan, and he has been great. Best buying and after sale experience out of any of the dealers in the area that I have had.

crowsnest · 12-29-2011, 09:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codeman671

Yeah, that that boat is wild...I like the twin engine 27' that is on the lake.

Who was the tall guy in sales then? Chris? Whomever it was they left right after. I only deal with Ryan, and he has been great. Best buying and after sale experience out of any of the dealers in the area that I have had.

I think it was Chris he left last year. I think that leaves ED Julie Ryan Matt and Kevin. I would not buy any where else. Service is second to none

Grandpa Redneck · 12-29-2011, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crowsnest

I think it was Chris he left last year. I think that leaves ED Julie Ryan Matt and Kevin. I would not buy any where else. Service is second to none

I whole heartedly agree, when we were shopping for our boat, we looked at several other places before we stopped at Winnisquam. We really liked some of the other toons but did not like the attitude at the other dealers. Winnisquam was a great experience, before and after the sale, they really treated us great. The whole crew there is always pleasant to deal with.

AB_Monterey · 12-29-2011, 10:14 AM

Does anyone else think that a $4000 boat will end up costing a lot more in the long run?

I understand that a budget is a budget but be very careful and have anything you're interested in checked out throughly prior to purchase.

Kamper · 12-29-2011, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeF-NH

I have been boating Winni for about 7 years now in my 16 ft aluminum with a 40 HP and will absolutely disagree that it's inappropriate for the Broads BUT you have to be smart about it. ...

That's pretty much what I've been using too. The lake starts to get choppy after 10-11am once people wake up and start tearing around. It calms down again around 4pm-ish when they go back to their docks or the ramp. Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday are usually not so bad as the extended weekend days. Since the wind blows from north to south, and picks up after noon, you should expect to run slower on the Broads if you are heading north in a small boat when it gets blustery because the chop kicks up pretty good.

ishoot308 · 12-29-2011, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AB_Monterey

Does anyone else think that a $4000 boat will end up costing a lot more in the long run?

I understand that a budget is a budget but be very careful and have anything you're interested in checked out throughly prior to purchase.

Yes, I do. I think that for the size boat that Peter is looking for, you may find a boat but I would be very leary of the motor. Not saying there isn't a chance of finding something, just with the budget constraints it will be extremely hard. Your advice of having it checked thoroughly is spot on. I will only add that the person checking it should be someone competent and well respected in the industry.

Dan

pcmc · 12-29-2011, 09:41 PM

I would like to thank each and everyone of you for taking the time and sharing your knowledge.
My THANKYOU option vanished on post #16, so I want to keep the Thankyou's coming.

So many scenarios to consider. The mention of spending more in the long run on maintaining the boat vs spending up now is on my mind. My thinking for now is to try to stay in the 4k price range and try to find a cared for machine. If disaster strikes I will be able to make some repairs. If I throw 3k more at it now, I will still be buying an approximately 10 yr old boat. That concerns me because its 10yrs of who knows what type of care, BUT its also could be a 10 yr newer craft. So my head keeps juggling these thoughts back and forth.

Can anyone recommend an experienced boat tech that will travel the area to do a PPI?(
pre purchase inspection).....the area being the Lakes Region and possibly to Southern NH.
Again Thankyou to each and everyone here.
Peter

Grandpa Redneck · 12-29-2011, 09:57 PM

Peter, you may want to check with Winnisquam Marine they do usually have several used or brokerage boats in your price range, and the used ones will have a warranty on them for at least 60 days and usually untill january of the following year.

Just something to think about.

Resident 2B · 12-29-2011, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pcmc

I would like to thank each and everyone of you for taking the time and sharing your knowledge.
My THANKYOU option vanished on post #16, so I want to keep the Thankyou's coming.

You get 5 new "thank yous" each day.

Good luck with your decision. Painful fun!

R2B

Greene's Basin Girl · 12-30-2011, 01:00 AM

Peter-
I am planning on buying a triple toon this spring. NhEscape and myself are going to the New England Boat Show ( Feb. 11-19, 2012 ) to view all brands. That is where i want to start my search. I will also consider everyone opinion's from the forum before purchasing. I will only consider a 22'-24' or above. as many have mentioned- the broads can be very rough.

Cmjn98 · 12-30-2011, 12:06 PM

My family's first boat on the lake was a 1993 Four Winns 210 Horizon and the boat is absolutely spectacular. W bought it at Irwin marine from their dealer Alan Lydiard and he is now the first person we ask when it comes to buying a new boat. We bought the boat in 2008 for the extraordinary price of $6,500. we still have the boat but we realized it was a bit small and uncomfortable. So we went back to Al and he showed us a 1996 sea ray 280 Br that we currently own as of July 2011 and we absolutely love it as well. so i strongly recommend that you go to Al Lydiard of Irwin marine in Laconia, He'll give you a great price and treat you right!

codeman671 · 12-30-2011, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pcmc

I would like to thank each and everyone of you for taking the time and sharing your knowledge.
My THANKYOU option vanished on post #16, so I want to keep the Thankyou's coming.

So many scenarios to consider. The mention of spending more in the long run on maintaining the boat vs spending up now is on my mind. My thinking for now is to try to stay in the 4k price range and try to find a cared for machine. If disaster strikes I will be able to make some repairs. If I throw 3k more at it now, I will still be buying an approximately 10 yr old boat. That concerns me because its 10yrs of who knows what type of care, BUT its also could be a 10 yr newer craft. So my head keeps juggling these thoughts back and forth.

Can anyone recommend an experienced boat tech that will travel the area to do a PPI?(
pre purchase inspection).....the area being the Lakes Region and possibly to Southern NH.
Again Thankyou to each and everyone here.
Peter

I would recommend Matt at Supreme Marine for a PPI. Ed Malen with Signature as well. Both work mobile.

diz · 12-30-2011, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grandpa Redneck

Peter, you may want to check with Winnisquam Marine they do usually have several used or brokerage boats in your price range, and the used ones will have a warranty on them for at least 60 days and usually untill january of the following year.

Just something to think about.

For what it's worth, I bought my boat there last year. I am very happy with their sales and service staff.

secondcurve · 12-30-2011, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by diz

For what it's worth, I bought my boat there last year. I am very happy with their sales and service staff.

I also bought a boat at Winnisquam and agree the staff, attitude, etc. are second to none I have come across in the boating world.

NoBozo · 12-30-2011, 07:45 PM

I don't recommend NOVICES buy a BIG boat to start. A BIG boat would be over 20 feet. (What happens in The Broads is Totally IRRELEVANT)

When children are learning to SAIL..they don't start out in a J-24. They start out in a Optimist or Mirror Dinghy. Around eight feet or less. After you can handle a small sailboat...THEN it may be time to Graduate to a larger boat.

Let me explain: A Small boat reacts very quickly to changing conditions...the junior skipper will learn to react quickly to adapt to the new conditions. If the young skipper doesn't adapt..he will go swimming. Skill is a developed sence that comes with experience.

Lets try this: The airline pilot that you flew with last, did NOT take his first flying lessons... in a 737. He probably started out in a Cessna.

You start out small and work your way up. There are NO shortcuts.

NB

ishoot308 · 12-30-2011, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoBozo

I don't recommend NOVICES buy a BIG boat to start. A BIG boat would be over 20 feet. (What happens in The Broads is Totally IRRELEVANT)

When children are learning to SAIL..they don't start out in a J-24. They start out in a Optimist or Mirror Dinghy. Around eight feet or less. After you can handle a small sailboat...THEN it may be time to Graduate to a larger boat.

Let me explain: A Small boat reacts very quickly to changing conditions...the junior skipper will learn to react quickly to adapt to the new conditions. If the young skipper doesn't adapt..he will go swimming. Skill is a developed sence that comes with experience.

Lets try this: The airline pilot that you flew with last, did NOT take his first flying lessons... in a 737. He probably started out in a Cessna.

You start out small and work your way up. There are NO shortcuts.

NB

I must disagree with this. When I was teaching my wife how to operate and navigate I can tell you it was a LOT easier in a 22' Eastern than it would of been in a 12', 14', or 16' Alumacraft with a tiller handle motor. Learning how to dock or operate either of these boats will take the same amount of time. Learning to navigate the lake safely will take much longer and will only come with experience but it will be the same in either boat and I would much rather see her in the Eastern than a smaller, less stable boat that does not handle chop as well...

I am not sure why you think a smaller boat would react quicker to conditions... If the wind and swells pick up, turn the wheel or tiller handle and head to safe port. Where is the reaction time difference?? As a mater of fact again in this circumstance I would rather be in the larger boat, but again no difference in reaction time...

Your comparison of an airline pilot starting out in a Cessna instead of a 737 is an exagerated extreme that really isn't relevant. Kinda like comparing a rowboat to the mount... When were talking 16' or 24' boats, both are considered small crafts...

Happy New Year!

Dan

pcmc · 12-30-2011, 11:39 PM

Regarding the last two posts...I can appreciate nobozo's words of caution.
If I interpret him correctly, I see it as a larger boat may give a false sense of security if conditions are worse, then a larger boat may lead on, due to its "slower" bobbing up and down and stability. Where a smaller craft will toss me around and give an earlier, tell tale warning to turn back, before I get deeper into a troubled situation. Thats how I interperate the "quicker reaction".

Ishoot308, I agree I would rather have the larger boat for saftey sake, but "the broads" is an area I have only heard people speak of, I have never been there. I may never venture that far, who knows. I definatly don't want to get into a boat I feel intimidated by it when I need to dock it or load it onto a trailer.

An embarrassing novice question....Why is every American made vehicle left hand drive, but boats are right hand drive, just wondering???

pcmc · 12-31-2011, 12:15 AM

Another factor that weighs in for us...my wife does not handle hot sun well for long periods.

Do bimini tops offer adequate protection on a bowrider.

On toons they seem to cover the entire boat, Are they a one man job or is a helper needed to put them up?

I hate to do this,... way back jrc mentioned a bathroom for the women...
...urgh, something else I never thought of, LOL!, it sure makes me laugh though. We like the bowrider style so this will probably not change things, but how would you praise the benefit of a cuddy.
It seems great to get out of the weather except the driver, but does this area get hot and hold the heat.
Do you wish there was more floor area, considering a 17'-20' boat?
Maybe you like this style better for storage reasons?
I'm curious because I think my boys(7&9 yrs old) would want to be up in the seats and things would get crowded rather quick, even without having company with us. Any thoughts?

Knomad · 12-31-2011, 08:19 AM

Pontoon biminis are generally larger than those on a bowrider. On our 20' pontoon we have a 11' bimini. It is simple to set up and the frame is sturderer than what we had on our bowrider. The bimini on the pontoon is higher than the one on the bowrider. This means that later in the day when the sun starts to go down, the shade spot gets smaller. We carry a couple of large towels and clip them to the bimini on the sunny side with 2" spring clamps from the HW store.

We also have a pop up changing room on our pontoon boat with a portipoti. Unlike the cramped space on a bowrider, adults can actually use it.

jrc · 12-31-2011, 09:35 AM

The bathroom thing is serious. Unless you are buying a boat just tube/ski for an hour or two or you have a house/camp to return to, you need a place to pee. A cuddy is nice if you plan to spend the day on the boat. Sometimes you just need a break from the sun. Biminis are nice but you have to move around the boat to find shade.

I still suggest you get an older inexpensive boat with the understanding that you will only keep it a year or two. There are tons of people getting out of boating becase of the economy. You can get a good deal if you look around.

If you can buy from a dealer that gives you some peace of mind. If not, buy a towing plan from BoatUS or Seatow. Older boats breakdown and being stranded is no fun.

You will learn more about boating in that first year, than the rest of your life. You will learn what you like and what you hate. You will learn if your family likes boating or not.

You cannot buy a boat big enough to always be safe and comfortable on Winnipesaukee. With any boat you buy you can be bested by the weather, so you have to plan for it. If the weather (wind) is bad or predicted to be bad stay close to home and in sheltered areas. If a storm comes up, wait it out. If the weather really turns nasty, eat your pride. Find safe spot, call a cab and go get your trailer.

Grandpa Redneck · 12-31-2011, 10:22 AM

Like Knomad said our pontoon has a pop up changing room/priviacy enclosure with a porta-potty it is easy to use even for a larger adult and is an absolute necessity for spending a day on the lake.

Pontoon Biminis are easy to put up even for 1 person, most cover a little over 1/2 the boat and you can get them with the double bimini option that will cover the entire boat, there are aftermarket ones that can be added to a single bimini to boat to cover the front too.

http://www.overtons.com/modperl/prod...+&merchID=4005

http://www.overtons.com/modperl/prod...+&merchID=4005

http://www.imbac-products.com/produc.../bimini-buddy/

These style clips are great to hang a couple towels on the sides of the bimini to give more shade like Knomad also mentioned

http://www.overtons.com/modperl/prod...+&merchID=4005

AmericanBoatClub · 12-31-2011, 10:48 AM

I am just gonna throw our hat in there again. All our boat offer everything you are talking about and more and around your price range $3600/yr. It also takes all the risk out of equation that goes with buying an older boat, we handle all repairs, we even insure you. If it is a nice day and you want to hit up a sand bar take a pontoon boat, if you want to go all day and not worry about weather, grab the 240 Sundancer. Water skiiing grab a bowrider. No trailers or ramps to worry about,etc.

Happy new year!

Kurt
603.231.6002

NoBozo · 12-31-2011, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ishoot308

I am not sure why you think a smaller boat would react quicker to conditions..... Dan

It actually takes more skill to SAIL a small dinghy across the Broads in a breeze than a J-24 or a Tartan 30. If you think about it for a minute..In the 8 foot sailing dinghy, if you are not paying total attention to what you are doing, a gust of wind (Sailors call it a Puff), OR a wave of a different size or character hits the boat, it will capsize the boat if you are day dreaming. In an 8 foot dinghy, you also must be "nimble' ...knowing when and how to move your body around the boat to Prevent Capsize.

The US Coast Guard Accadamy teaches their cadets to Sail dinghys first. Then they learn to Sail larger boats. Then they go on a Short Cruise on the CG Barque EAGLE (@ 295 feet). Then the next year on a Long Cruise aboard Eagle. All this "Sailing" experience...so they can ultimately command a Big Azz power boat.

Happy New Year to you also 308.

BTW: You should TRY sailing an 8 foot dinghy in a good (whitecaps) breeze. It builds character..

pcmc · 12-31-2011, 11:11 PM

Jrc, I'm with you on the importance of a bathroom. I wasn't joking to poke fun or at your expense. What made me chuckle was thinking about our comutes to the lake from CT. We never seem to make it "with doors closed", we always have to stop for one reason or another. Out on the lake I can just imagine my wife trying to get me to pull over, at which point I would probably bust a gut laughing. I appreciate the be prepared attitudes.
We definitely have plenty to learn and you have all been a huge help.

jst_4_kiks · 12-31-2011, 11:38 PM

dont be afraid of any question or concern that would have about anything. thats what we are here for. lots of us here have had the experience (good and bad), dealing with the starting small, selling and buying bigger and better, etc.

perhaps come spring time/summer rent a boat that you think would suit your needs. practice driving around the lake, loaded with people, by yourself, sunny calm day, windy day, busy holiday weekend. everything handles differently at different times.

jrc · 01-01-2012, 10:15 AM

No worries.

You are getting a bunch of different advice because there are a bunch of ways to have fun with a boat on Winnipesaukee.

Happy New Year, only 110 days to ice out!

robmac · 01-02-2012, 04:07 AM

What ever you decide the best advice is to sea trial it before you buy it. As far as ice out don't we need ice in first?

12-23-2011, 06:07 PM	#3
RLW Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Alton Bay on the mountain by a lake Posts: 2,023 Thanks: 563 Thanked 444 Times in 311 Posts	Just my 2¢ I agree with thread 2, however we also ski behind our 22' pontoon boat without any problems. We do have a SUPRA wake boat also, but as I said we do ski behind the pontoon boat and it is also a lot easier to get onto and off of than a regular boat. We have some elderly friends and it is a pleasure for them to get on and off. Just my 2¢. Both means of transportation are great __________________ There is nothing better than living on Alton Mountain & our grand kids visits.

12-23-2011, 07:55 PM	#5
pcmc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 412 Thanks: 211 Thanked 106 Times in 73 Posts	Thanks for the responses. I never thought about an issue with elderly having difficulty getting in and out, apriciate that view. How much Hp is needed to ski behind a toon? Are toons fun to drive ?..boring but convenience out weights this? Can toons go to the broads? I've heard a little about the broads, but have never experienced them.(wait we are talking about the lake right...)

12-24-2011, 04:44 AM	#6
Belmont Resident Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Belmont NH but prefer Jackman Maine Posts: 1,857 Thanks: 491 Thanked 409 Times in 251 Posts	size matters Although some will disagree I believe most will agree that a 17’ boat may leave you wishing you had something bigger. Although boating has dropped off due to the economy, on a busy weekend even on a 22’ boat you can and will get tossed around and wet from spray. Good luck with your purchase. __________________ "better to have a short life that is full of what you like doing, then a long life spent in a miserable way.."

12-24-2011, 02:04 PM	#10
Grandpa Redneck Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: White Mountain Area NH Posts: 155 Thanks: 310 Thanked 112 Times in 59 Posts	While I cant say much about the std V-hull boats as I only had a small 15 ft fishing boat for 1 summer, I highly recommend a Pontoon, we have had 3 and love them. As was said earlier they are a great stable platform , Grandama Redneck has a bum knee and hated the fishing boat because it rocked too much when she tried to move around bothering her knee. She has no problem with the Toon. Its kinda like your living room on the water plenty of room to move around. We ski and tube behind our current toon A 22 foot Premier 225 Sunsation LTD PTX(tripple log performance series) with a 150 merc Optimax (thanks Matt Galvin & Winnisquam Marine!!!). It is truly a BLAST to drive. We never tried skiing on our previous toons, but the one before this we did tube with it alot, another Premier 225 Sunsation Ltd only a 2 log with a 90 merc on it, It tubed quite well. In my opinion as well as many of the people I know a Toon is the most versatile boat available, great for entertaining family and friends, for fishing, skiing, tubing, cruising, or just lounging around. I would suggest talking to the folks at Winnisquam Marine, they have gone out of their way to make sure we got what we needed and wanted in a toon. The very knowledgeabl sales dept treated us Great before and after the sale and the Service has been excellent as well, They also sell V hulls and I am sure they would be happy to discuss the pro's and con's of both with you. __________________ Freedom Lovin' gun crazy Redneck

12-24-2011, 09:10 PM	#11
camp guy Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: formerly Winter Harbor, still Wolfeboro Posts: 1,135 Thanks: 284 Thanked 480 Times in 271 Posts	Boat vs Pontoon I agree with "secondcurve" about renting different styles trying to find out what you like. Another idea would be to hang out at the launch ramp and see what people are using, and talking to them about size and style. In my experiences I've found that fellow boaters are more than willing to talk about their boat, good, bad, and ugly. Meredith is a very busy ramp at which you might get some ideas. Good luck. Keep up the research, after all, it is an investment you'd like to get right. Merry Christmas.

12-23-2011, 05:02 PM	#1
pcmc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 412 Thanks: 211 Thanked 106 Times in 73 Posts	Boat vs Pontoon Hi everyone, I am new to boating and am as green as they come. We don't even have a boat yet, but are looking. Will you give some advice as to pro's and con's(your opinion) of a boat and/or a pontoon? I have my eye on a few boats that are older in the 17'-18' range with 3.0 or 4.3 engines. Were staying in the $4k price range, so this may squeeze out pontoons, but Im curious about the space of pontoon vs a boat. Any opinions would be great. Also, I will trailering it every time, to the States Landing boat launch in Moultonborough which is about a 1/2 mile away. Please NO heated discussions, I don't want this to go in that direction. Just your personal opinion as to what you like and dislike about either. Seeing as many marinas are closed for the holidays, I figured I ask this now and have some time compare. Thankyou and Happy Holidays to all, Peter

12-23-2011, 05:35 PM	#2
WinterHarborGirl Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Chelmsford Mass and Moultonboro Posts: 58 Thanks: 43 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	If you plan on going out to the broads you will probably need somrthing bigger than an 17 ft boat.....we started with 17 foot bowrider and quickley traded for a 23 foot bowrider.... We love our bowrider but I think a pontoon would also be awesome....Lots of room... i guess it depends on how many people you will be having and if you want to ski....My son skis and so do I (sometimes) so we needed a boat....

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12-23-2011, 07:12 PM	#4
NoBozo Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Portsmouth. RI Posts: 2,231 Thanks: 400 Thanked 460 Times in 308 Posts	If you have multiple guests on a regular basis..and have no particular afinity to one or the other, I would get a Toon. Plenty of room and a stable platform to walk around on for those guests that don't have boating experience. Great for sightseeing. If you only need to entertain another couple, a 17-20' bowrider would be a good start...leaning toward 20+ feet. Outboards are low maintenence when winter comes. Inboard/Outdrives are NOT low maintenance. If you do nothing to an outboard in the fall, to prepare for winter, you will be fine. The water drains out every time you haul the boat out of the water. (Outboard engine in the verticle position) If you do nothing with an Inboard/Outdrive, the water will NOT drain out and the engine will Freeze ...As in ICE..and you will be out Thousands of dollars in repairs. NB

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12-24-2011, 10:27 AM	#9
NHBUOY Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Loon Mtn. winters...Meredith Neck summers Posts: 398 Thanks: 288 Thanked 94 Times in 60 Posts	If you are undecided, and not in a "hurry" to purchase either one, your best bet may be to "demo"/sea-trial hands-on the boats that interest you. Kurt at the AmericanBoatClub in Meredith, has all the boats you would need to make a decision. You are basically joining a boat club that, for a nominal yearly fee, gives you access to any boat he has in his stable, all summer long. He has what you need to compare & contrast the boat vs pontoon quandry. A perfect program for you. NHB.

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12-25-2011, 07:49 PM	#12
NoRegrets Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Hudson - NH Posts: 408 Thanks: 233 Thanked 212 Times in 88 Posts	Your post is an exciting way to spend the off season. Trying to select a rationalle for choosing a pontoon vs. fiberglass vessel for a first boat is exciting. The Pontoon boat behaves very differently in wind. I do not think you can go wrong with either choice. You should experience both but going through a full season with either will give you great memories and a few surprises. You wouild have to own one of each to really know what is better. The Pontoon is very spacious but somewhat exposed. The bow rider can sit lower in teh water and you can hide behind the windshield when needed. To be out on the water is priceless no matter what boat you pick. Personal opinion: Fair weather and your budget I MAY pick the pontoon.

12-28-2011, 10:56 AM	#14
John A. Birdsall Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Norwich, CT Posts: 599 Thanks: 27 Thanked 51 Times in 35 Posts	runabout vs pontoon boat as I grew older (and heavier) I found getting into and out of the runabout to be a chore I did not like, and thus used the boat less. I was given my fathers pontoon boat which I enjoy using. It is a 24' Princecraft with large toons on it. It has a 75 hp Mercury and a few years back we pulled two skiers with it. Not much problem doing that. We have taken this out into the broads many many times and depending on how many people on board and where they sit you can get water spray on you. But that sometimes is part of the fun of boating isn't it? As for size of runabout I have had boats from a 6' to now a 24' boat on the lake, I must say I never had the 6' out of sight of the cottage but the 11' has been in every port, every area of the lake, and under all bridges. And have been out in the broads in all type of weather. and I miss that boat, and I think the Mount misses it also. Boating is fun, just have to have what is right fit for you and your family. Its great that we all have likes and what not as too boats.

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12-28-2011, 01:30 PM	#16
MikeF-NH Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 317 Thanks: 2 Thanked 120 Times in 80 Posts	I have been boating Winni for about 7 years now in my 16 ft aluminum with a 40 HP and will absolutely disagree that it's inappropriate for the Broads BUT you have to be smart about it. When winds exceed 10-15 mph, it will get rough quck out there and the waves will grow quickly. An ex-marine friend of mine who ran small water craft in some of the toughest waters of the world, said he's had days on the Broads that have made him cringe. Point being, the boat is 1/2 the equation, common sense is the other 1/2. Given what I've seen my boat do and pontoons in the 17-18 foot range do on the Broads, I would much rather be in a v-hull anything than a toon when things get nasty out there. Of course the advantage to the toon in the case bad things happening, is it can flip over and still be floating and is "self bailing" in that it won't hold any water. Once you've decided to be smart about how and when to handle the Broads, I would then take them out of the equation and just stay clear when winds kick up and stay in Moultonboro Bay or at least on the Moultonboro side of Long Island/Cow Island....plenty to explore in that water. With that in mind, I would begin asking yourself "what will I be using the boat for mostly". The toon is a far superior "pleasure craft" in comfort, accessibility and stability to a v-hull and most will come with a bimini which can't be understated in hot mid-summer sun. It's a great swim platform for rafting and, assuming you get enough motor, should be good for pulling skiers and tubers. If you are going to fish (other than trolling), I would probably head toward a v-hull with a bow mount trolling motor. There are many "fish and ski" models around but might be hard to find in your budget. If you are going to try many different water bodies with questionable ramps, a larger toon might be less flexible in this regard. Also if you go anything fibergalss, you really don't want to "beach it" as you will quickly wear the gel coat...in this case, aluminum (toon or v-hull) is the trick. Go to some shows this winter. Surf craigs list. Check the marinas (last). Take your time and get the craft that meets your needs. The boat that is best for you is not necessary what is best for each responder on this thread. Think about flexibility and limitations of each design. make sure your motor is reliable (don't want to be paddling back to the ramp). Finally, get your boaters safety class done and your certificate earned NOW. The education is important and required just like a car license. Be smart when starting out. Stay in calmer bays, learn out to take wakes and waves, take your time around markers so you really understand ATON. Understand not only what is required of you but what is not required but is courteous. Pick up a Bizer map of Winni...keep it on board. Don't be afraid of the Broads (respect them) but go out on them for the first time in a flat calm morning to get a feel for how long it takes to get from one safe harbor to another. Learn what Middle Ground Shoals is "the easy way not the hard way". Know where the Graveyard is and the Witches is (if heading to Weirs).

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12-28-2011, 09:11 PM	#18
jrc Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: NH Posts: 2,689 Thanks: 33 Thanked 439 Times in 249 Posts	It all depends on where and how you want to boat. If you want to launch at States Landing and pull a skier around Moultonboro Bay, a small 17' runabout will be great. You will have a blast. With something less than 20 feet you can still explore the lake including the broads but you have to be careful. The broads are nasty when there is a strong north wind. There are days when anything short of the Mt Washington will give you a rough or wet ride. You also want to avoid the Weirs Beach and channel area on a busy summer weekend. I never owned a pontoon so I can't add any value on that decision. But one word of advice, if you plan to explore and be away from your home port, you need a bathroom. Otherwise you and the boys may go, but forget the women. I recommend the opposite approach, jump right in, get a boat you can easily afford and give it a try. I promise that whatever research you do, you will need to change boats in a few years or get out of boating. You can't learn to own a boat without owning a boat.

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12-28-2011, 10:09 PM	#20
NHBUOY Senior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Loon Mtn. winters...Meredith Neck summers Posts: 398 Thanks: 288 Thanked 94 Times in 60 Posts	At Winnisquam Marine, ask for Kevin Dubia. He is the guy you want to talk to in sales there now. Fun place to do business.

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12-29-2011, 06:48 AM	#22
secondcurve Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,084 Thanks: 1,267 Thanked 557 Times in 286 Posts	Things Change Quickly While I agree that using one's head helps avoid problems in a small boat there are times when things change quickly leaving even the most experienced boater exposed to difficult conditions. There have been many times when I have left one end of the lake to go to the other in perfectly calm conditions only to return several hours later in heavy chop. Thus, the need to have the right boat is critical on a lake like Winnipesaukee, in my opinion.

12-29-2011, 10:14 AM	#27
AB_Monterey Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Alton Bay Posts: 293 Thanks: 86 Thanked 78 Times in 49 Posts	Does anyone else think that a $4000 boat will end up costing a lot more in the long run? I understand that a budget is a budget but be very careful and have anything you're interested in checked out throughly prior to purchase.

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12-29-2011, 09:41 PM	#30
pcmc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 412 Thanks: 211 Thanked 106 Times in 73 Posts	Thanks a bunch! I would like to thank each and everyone of you for taking the time and sharing your knowledge. My THANKYOU option vanished on post #16, so I want to keep the Thankyou's coming. So many scenarios to consider. The mention of spending more in the long run on maintaining the boat vs spending up now is on my mind. My thinking for now is to try to stay in the 4k price range and try to find a cared for machine. If disaster strikes I will be able to make some repairs. If I throw 3k more at it now, I will still be buying an approximately 10 yr old boat. That concerns me because its 10yrs of who knows what type of care, BUT its also could be a 10 yr newer craft. So my head keeps juggling these thoughts back and forth. Can anyone recommend an experienced boat tech that will travel the area to do a PPI?( pre purchase inspection).....the area being the Lakes Region and possibly to Southern NH. Again Thankyou to each and everyone here. Peter

12-29-2011, 09:57 PM	#31
Grandpa Redneck Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: White Mountain Area NH Posts: 155 Thanks: 310 Thanked 112 Times in 59 Posts	Peter, you may want to check with Winnisquam Marine they do usually have several used or brokerage boats in your price range, and the used ones will have a warranty on them for at least 60 days and usually untill january of the following year. Just something to think about. __________________ Freedom Lovin' gun crazy Redneck

12-30-2011, 01:00 AM	#33
Greene's Basin Girl Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Moultonborough, NH Posts: 1,515 Thanks: 394 Thanked 527 Times in 269 Posts	Peter- I am planning on buying a triple toon this spring. NhEscape and myself are going to the New England Boat Show ( Feb. 11-19, 2012 ) to view all brands. That is where i want to start my search. I will also consider everyone opinion's from the forum before purchasing. I will only consider a 22'-24' or above. as many have mentioned- the broads can be very rough.

12-30-2011, 12:06 PM	#34
Cmjn98 Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 5 Thanks: 1 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	The bigger the better. My family's first boat on the lake was a 1993 Four Winns 210 Horizon and the boat is absolutely spectacular. W bought it at Irwin marine from their dealer Alan Lydiard and he is now the first person we ask when it comes to buying a new boat. We bought the boat in 2008 for the extraordinary price of $6,500. we still have the boat but we realized it was a bit small and uncomfortable. So we went back to Al and he showed us a 1996 sea ray 280 Br that we currently own as of July 2011 and we absolutely love it as well. so i strongly recommend that you go to Al Lydiard of Irwin marine in Laconia, He'll give you a great price and treat you right!