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Old 07-19-2007, 04:18 PM   #1
sgold44
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Default Fines for Boating w/out a license?

Does anyone know what the fine is for operating a boat without a NH license. I've tried to search on-line, but have had no luck. (I have my license, just wondering)
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Old 07-19-2007, 05:41 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgold44
Does anyone know what the fine is for operating a boat without a NH license. I've tried to search on-line, but have had no luck. (I have my license, just wondering)
$60 the first time, $300 the next.

Valid certificates from other states meet the requirements as long as they are NASBLA approved and issued by the proper authorities.
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Old 07-19-2007, 06:19 PM   #3
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Default Be careful

If you are forty something and boating with your family, expect to be stopped by MP. They will find a reason as they did with me this past weekend. I suspect that they are on a real campaign to find and fine anyone without a license. (Don't worry....I've had one for several years) When all checked out, I was sent off with a warning for something that I don't agree that I even violated but it wasn't the place to argue about it with my kids on the boat.
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Old 07-19-2007, 06:24 PM   #4
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Boatguy:

Can you tell us what you were stopped for? I've been stopped twice in the past two years. Once, I could see their point and once I felt they were stopping me just to stop me. In both cases, they agreed I wasn't doing anything wrong and they let me go without a fine. I must say they were professional and respectful both times, so I had no problem with the stops.
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Old 07-19-2007, 07:04 PM   #5
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I was stopped for the 150ft rule but don't feel that it was a valid stop. MP was courteous and professional and when they saw I had a license and much more that the required safety information they let me go with a warning. I'm sure the officer saw it differently than me, but this is my side of the story.

1. Marine Patrol was sitting idle and then quickly headed towards me and created the violation between the markers on the north side of Eagle Island.

2. I was going 15 mi/hour when I first spotted him and slowed to 6 miles per hours as I saw him speed out of the cove and head towards me. He felt that I was still doing 15. This is where we disagree. I had the eyes on the speedometer. He clearly was not at no wake speed.

3. If I would have gone any slower, I would have had to pull another boat full of twenty somethings out of my stern as they didn't slow at all and were actually attempting to pass me as MP signalled to me to pull over.

I asked him why he didn't stop the other boat as it was doing something far more dangerous. He said it was because I was first in line.

This was my first stop ever by MP so I guess I shouldn't complain. I am a very careful boater and I was very surprised to be pulled over in this situation.
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Old 07-19-2007, 08:43 PM   #6
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Boat Guy64,

What you just described is the classic MP move to invoke the 150 foot violation. I see them do this all day especially around no wake zones. They force you down to headway speed but encroach the 150' before your boat can realistically slow down. Appears they use this as a method to conduct their routine vessel inpection after stopping someone to look for a more tangible violation.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:05 AM   #7
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We got stopped on Winnisquam by a MP officer who didn't even look old enough to shave.We were stopped right in the middle of a busy channel for a "safety" check....blue lights and all.He was polite enough and so were we and finally figured out why he chose us.The family that was with us happens to have two really beautiful teenage daughters.........hmmmm...such a coincidence.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:14 AM   #8
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Based on years of observation and conversations, my theory is simple regarding MP stops:

They are bored.
They need to do a certain amount of "work" per shift.
They pull over the least-threatening looking boats so they can have something to put in their log, but won't be at risk of a hassle.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:24 AM   #9
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SAMIAM
We got stopped ... for a "safety" check...
I thought the NH State Supreme Court declared those unconstitutional? You can probably make a complaint if you want to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJM
Based on years of observation and conversations, ...
Makes sense to me too.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:49 AM   #10
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Default Articulable suspicion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamper
I thought the NH State Supreme Court declared those unconstitutional? You can probably make a complaint if you want to.
You are correct. An MP (or any other law enforcement officer) has to have an articulabe reason (or suspicion) that a violation has, is or will be taking place to effect a stop. There are limited exceptions to this rule (search and arrest warrants, court ordered, verified or accepted road blocks and the like).

However, these exceptions rarely if ever apply to the average MP officer on routine patrol.
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Old 07-20-2007, 08:50 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAMIAM
...two really beautiful teenage daughters.........hmmmm...such a coincidence.
We used to say they got stopped by the FBI, female body inspectors.
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Old 07-20-2007, 09:34 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAMIAM
We got stopped on Winnisquam by a MP officer who didn't even look old enough to shave.We were stopped right in the middle of a busy channel for a "safety" check....blue lights and all.He was polite enough and so were we and finally figured out why he chose us.The family that was with us happens to have two really beautiful teenage daughters.........hmmmm...such a coincidence.
MP does NOT stop for a safety check. This is a common error in thinking among many who get stopped. A boat is not stopped for a safety check, but all boats stopped will receive a safety check.

There was a reason for the stop. An operational infraction, obvious equipment or registration violation and so on. Try to remember back. There was a reason and the officer told you the reason.
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Old 07-20-2007, 10:52 AM   #13
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Don't recall being informed of any violations...He checked all pfd's fire extinguisher,horns etc.I showed my boating certificate and he left.We were not all outraged and ranting....just a minor annoyance. Maybe if I was his age I'd have done the same.The girls did look quite good.
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Old 07-20-2007, 12:45 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAMIAM
Don't recall being informed of any violations...He checked all pfd's fire extinguisher,horns etc.I showed my boating certificate and he left.We were not all outraged and ranting....just a minor annoyance. Maybe if I was his age I'd have done the same.The girls did look quite good.
He couldn't stop you without a reason......................an officer must have a reason.
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Old 07-20-2007, 01:03 PM   #15
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I ask for the reason if they are not forthcoming as soon as they stop us
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Old 07-20-2007, 01:15 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robmac
I ask for the reason if they are not forthcoming as soon as they stop us
It is your right to know.
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Old 07-20-2007, 01:40 PM   #17
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As Skip says he needs to have an articulatable reason.

But really, if you look suspicious you can get pulled over. On the road this is pretty easy. Since everyone routinely drives over the speed limit, everyone is subject to being pulled over:

" Your honor, the defendant was driving 62 MPH in a 55 MPH zone, I stopped him for this violation when I noticed empty beer cans and the smell of alcohol..."

On the water:

"Your honor, as I approached within 150' of the vessel, the operator did not immediately slow to no wake speed. I stopped him for this violation when I noticed empty beer cans and the smell of alcohol..."

I'm not saying that anyone is lying, I'm saying the LEO can use any small transgression or ambiguity to stop you, if they have a burning desire to do so.
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Old 07-21-2007, 08:01 AM   #18
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Why would the MP need a reason to stop you while local police and state are allowed to conduct random checks at vatious "checkpoints". I think they all pretty much do what the feel like.
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Old 07-21-2007, 09:14 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SAMIAM
Why would the MP need a reason to stop you while local police and state are allowed to conduct random checks at vatious "checkpoints". I think they all pretty much do what the feel like.
Checkpoints must be authorized by the court and published. They are not set up and operated on a whim.

Any officer needs at least articulable suspicion to make a stop.
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Old 07-21-2007, 06:30 PM   #20
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Thanks,officer
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Old 07-23-2007, 04:57 AM   #21
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Default articulable suspicion

Skip,

Iím told that the Coast Guard does not need ďarticulable suspicionĒ to stop a boat under CFR 46. Does anyone know if thatís true?
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Old 07-23-2007, 05:33 AM   #22
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Exclamation 14 Usc 89

Quote:
Originally Posted by RamJet
Skip,

Iím told that the Coast Guard does not need ďarticulable suspicionĒ to stop a boat under CFR 46. Does anyone know if thatís true?
You are correct, they have sweeping powers only applicable to them that can be found under 14 USC 89. They can board your boat at any time to conduct regulatory compliance checks and while on board cite you or make arrests for any other violations they lawfully come upon while conducting their compliance check operation.
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Old 07-23-2007, 12:31 PM   #23
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Default Uscg & Mp

In the 1990s one of my friends was in the coast guard based at Portsmouth and from what he always told me, it sounded like most 'Coasties' weren't eager to make everyday boardings. They were more excited for the big time drug busts and mid-hurricane rescues they'd seen in the USCG's recruitment ads, and otherwise "trying to look busy" when a superior officer was nearby. From what I heard it sounded like they didn't especially enjoy working alongside the NHMP too much, sounded like the MPs were over-eager "wannabe's" who were in the way more than anything.

Granted, I'm only repeating this from stories he told, and it's been 10 years since he was in the CG so things may have changed.
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Old 07-26-2007, 08:48 PM   #24
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Default All They All Idiots??

I guess knowing how to promote safe boating is not part of what the marine patrol practices. All I ever see them doing is clogging up the Weirs area so everyone has to come off plane 1/2 mile before the channel. Or last weekend they were teaming up on the Paugus Bay side making it impossible to pass them 150' away so again everyone had to come off plane way before the no wake zone. To me, this is more than an annoyance, it is a hazard. I will stay away from the Weirs for the rest of the season. Maybe if they were older than 25 they may have more smarts. I have been boating - safely and fast - longer than most of these toy water cops have been alive. If they want to make boating safer on the lake they would spend their time policing the boat and jet ski renters. These folks are the real danger that invade us every summer and have absolutely no clue. They have caused more close calls than I can keep track of. Get my drift!
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Old 07-30-2007, 05:38 AM   #25
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Default So What Is A Violation?

"Appears they use this as a method to conduct their routine vessel inpection after stopping someone to look for a more tangible violation."

This makes me think, just what kinds of things can you be sited for that the MP are looking for? I always have enough jackets with me to cover the number of passengers, fire extinguisher, my certificate, etc. etc. Is there anything else specifically I should (am supposed) to have on board???

Thanks....

Oh, and we don't drink on board...
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Old 07-30-2007, 06:42 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpg

This makes me think, just what kinds of things can you be sited for that the MP are looking for? I always have enough jackets with me to cover the number of passengers, fire extinguisher, my certificate, etc. etc. Is there anything else specifically I should (am supposed) to have on board???
Have you had your Boating Ed class yet? If so, you should know the answers.
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Old 07-30-2007, 09:24 AM   #27
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I have a question that I hought I'd ask in this thread instead of starting a new one...

If you're stopped by the MP and you don't have that little boating cert card, but have your drivers license, is this sufficient to not get hit with a fine? I got my boating license the first year it was instituted but have moved 4 times in 3 states since. I no longer have this card, but I was told (by another boater) that if you present your drivers license, they can look up the boating license and see that you're clear. It doesn't mention anything about this in on the Dept of Safetey FAQ. Does anyone know if this is true?

I'm going to send in the replacement card app, but I'm wondering if it's worth chancing it until I get the replacement. The application says it takes 4-6 weeks, so the season may be over by the time I get the card.
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Old 07-30-2007, 09:37 AM   #28
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Post Carrying requirement, Boater Safety Certificate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lake4life
I have a question that I hought I'd ask in this thread instead of starting a new one...

If you're stopped by the MP and you don't have that little boating cert card, but have your drivers license, is this sufficient to not get hit with a fine? I got my boating license the first year it was instituted but have moved 4 times in 3 states since. I no longer have this card, but I was told (by another boater) that if you present your drivers license, they can look up the boating license and see that you're clear. It doesn't mention anything about this in on the Dept of Safetey FAQ. Does anyone know if this is true?

I'm going to send in the replacement card app, but I'm wondering if it's worth chancing it until I get the replacement. The application says it takes 4-6 weeks, so the season may be over by the time I get the card.
You have 48 hours to produce evidence of your certificate after the stop. This would include contacting MPHQ and getting a verification if you have lost the card. It would also be an affirmative defense if you are already in process of getting a replacement card, so I would do so immediately.

Yes, an officer can also verify license status in the field but it would be dependent on how busy dispatch was at the time and in some cases whether the officer actually has communications with HQ given his particular location. If the officer has the tiime & the means he will definitely be in touch with HQ during the stop attempting to determine your eligibility to be operating.

Below is the applicable RSA:


Section 270-D:11
270-D:11 Possession Required; Penalty. –
I. Any person required to have a safe boater education certificate shall:
(a) Possess the certificate when operating a motorized vessel with any type of power motor in excess of 25 horsepower on the public waters of the state.
(b) Present the certificate upon the demand of a marine patrol officer.
II. No person charged with a violation of this section shall be convicted if, within a period of 48 hours, the person presents to the officer evidence that he or she held a valid safe boater education certificate which was in effect at the time of the violation.
III. Enforcement of this section shall be accomplished only as a secondary action when an operator of a motorized or registered vessel has been cited or charged with a violation or some other offense.
IV. Any person who violates this section shall be guilty of a violation punishable by a fine of $50 for a first offense and $250 for any subsequent offense.
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Old 07-30-2007, 01:00 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skip
.....
Thanks much!

I've sent in the application & check to get a replacement last week. I just hope they can get me the new one before the summer is over, which may be difficult considering I've had a few address and drivers license changes since 2002.
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Old 07-31-2007, 10:29 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NightWing
Have you had your Boating Ed class yet? If so, you should know the answers.
I was expecting an answer like that one! Can someone just answer - Please!
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Old 07-31-2007, 11:27 AM   #31
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dpg

Download this file, http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rules/saf-c400.html


and go to section PART Saf-C 403 EQUIPMENT REQUIREMENTS

We can't give you a good short list because it depends on your boat.
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Old 07-31-2007, 11:28 AM   #32
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Default What else do you need on board

Working lights, horn, paddle, throwable square Flotation or similar, depending on boat size one or more fire ext, PFD's, boat registration, boater registration.
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Old 07-31-2007, 11:35 AM   #33
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If you had an accident your insurance company may refuse to pay if you don't have a license or more importantly the right to operate a boat. Also, if you have an accident without a license you may more open to a lawsuit even if you are not at fault. I know a guy who had a car accident and the insurance company refused to pay because his inspection sticker was expired. They argued that the vehicle was not authorized to be on the road.
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Old 07-31-2007, 11:58 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpg
I was expecting an answer like that one! Can someone just answer - Please!
Seriously, you should know if you had your class. It can vary, depending on the size and type of boat. In general, these apply to motorized boats:

Clearly visible bow numbers, 3" high minimum, block letters of contrasting color, correctly spaced, mounted on the forward half of the vessel. Current year validation decal, mounted in line, within 6" to the right of the bow number.

Type I, II, III or V wearable PFD for everyone on board. Must be Coast Guard approved, in serviceable condition, properly sized for the wearer and readily available. Children 5 years and under must wear them, soon to change to 12 years and under.

Vessel 16' or over must also carry a type IV throwable ring or cushion.

Sound producing device, (horn or whistle) type defined by length of vessel.

Fire extinguisher, type B, size and number determined by length of vessel.

Proper lighting if operating during the hours of darkness, between sunset and sunrise.

Current registration on board.

Boating Ed Certificate for operator if required by age. (almost everyone)

Positive proof of ID good to have, but not essential. Photo Driver's License is best.

The Boater's Guide has this information. There are other things handy to have on board, but are not required. Certainly an anchor, navigational chart of the body of water you are on, emergency signal device (required if operating in coastal waters).
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Old 08-01-2007, 05:31 AM   #35
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Thank you for the information. I do have my certificate as a matter of fact I got it years ago when the requirement just started. No, I do not remember EVERY detail that was taught, I do by the way carry everything listed on my boat just a sanity check that's all.
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