Replacing a 23 year-old Oil Furnace

[CateP]

One of the houses we are considering buying has a 23 year old oil furnace. (Burnham brand). If we decide to purchase this house...

1. Do you think we should replace it ASAP?
2. If yes, what brand would you recommend? (high efficiency?)
3. What is the average cost of replacing a furnace?
4. Any recommendations for good furnace dealers and installers in the area?


We know nothing about oil furnaces and wonder if there are cost effective, energy efficient solutions out there in 2011. (we're not rolling in $$ here so we're looking for the best solution, not most expensive).

Thanks in advance for your knowledgeable replies.

[Slickcraft]

We have a 21 year old Burnham oil furnace with a Beckett burner. It has been serviced every year by Foley Oil which includes cleaning, maybe new electrodes and efficiency measurement. Last fall the efficiency measurement was 83.5% which is pretty good. While I am no furnace expert, my impression that our furnace has many good years left if properly maintained.

The furnace in question should have a service tag with this type of data if there had been yearly service. Most any oil company should have a qualified service tech that could inspect the furnace in question and give an opinion of condition. Also maybe only a burner upgrade (not the whole boiler) could improve efficiency.

[SIKSUKR]

As with Slickcraft, I have a 18 yo Burnham with a Beckett burner and feel like there are at least 10+ years left on it. Could be double or triple that. If your boiler checks out fine I wouldn't think of changing it until you have a major issue.

[CateP]

As always great replies. I think it is definitely worth getting an efficiency rating of the current system before jumping into a new one.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

As with Slickcraft, I have a 18 yo Burnham with a Beckett burner and feel like there are at least 10+ years left on it. Could be double or triple that. If your boiler checks out fine I wouldn't think of changing it until you have a major issue.

except mine is 48 years and is still running at 81.5% efficiency which is excellent. Cost can vary as to what needs to be changed in the home to accept a new boiler. It could run from $3K to 5K for the unit and installation. (Hot water)

[Belmont Resident]

I just asked my plumber this same question. Usually 20 years is the life expectancy of a boiler.
If you’re interested I use Mike Mahoney, Mahoney’s plumbing & heating 203-994-3090. He has done several for me and for contractors that I've worked with and he is very fair with his prices.
Good luck with your new home. I'd offer my services as a painter but it's further than I'd like to commute.

[Kamper]

I've got a hot-air furnace that's lots older than that. I've been told that unless the combustion chamber fails, they can keep it going indefinitly because a lot of the parts have common dimensions to newer designs.

The only way to know for sure is to have it service and ask the tech how much life it has left in it but age alone is not a reason to be afraid of a furnace.

Good luck!

[NoBozo]

My oil burner is 38 years old.....(Utica Boiler) Forced Hot Water, Tankless. It's still running fine even though my oil company wanted to replace it many YEARS ago. The efficiency has been in the order of 78% for the last 33 years or so.

Every year I have this conversation with the maintenence man that comes by to clean the furnace as part of our "maintenence contract". ($219./year)

A maintenence contract is a 24/7 insurance policy that covers you for certain things in the system that may fail...such as ALL electrical components ...the most likley things to fail. ..(Labor included). If the furnace stops running..you call them and they come out and FIX IT at no further cost to you.

Plumbing components (water/piping) are NOT usually covered...but plumbing rarely if ever fails.

A new "excellent" furnace would run around 5-6 thousand dollars (installed) depending on what type of furnace you pick. The oil company knows you don't know anything, so will try to SELL you the most cost effective furnace (For Them) that they can. It's kinda like buying a car..except ...at least a car can be pleasing to the eye..fun to drive..and looks good in the driveway. For some reason a furnace doesn't have the same satisfaction... as a nice Beamer.

They ALL have an Agenda and that is to SELL you a new furnace..even if your furnace is only 15 years old. The realities of home ownership. NB

[gf2020]

A furnace heats air that is blown thru ducts.

A boiler heats water or steam that flows thru pipes.

Either system will have a burner.

23 years may very well be beyond the typical life expectancy of a oil burner, but a furnace or boiler should last considerably longer than 23 years. The boiler of my house here in MA is 58 years old and still works fine. I am starting to consider replacements, however.

[CateP]

Originally Posted by gf2020

A furnace heats air that is blown thru ducts.

A boiler heats water or steam that flows thru pipes.

Either system will have a burner.

23 years may very well be beyond the typical life expectancy of a oil burner, but a furnace or boiler should last considerably longer than 23 years. The boiler of my house here in MA is 58 years old and still works fine. I am starting to consider replacements, however.

Ahh. See? This whole oil thing is new to me. If a house has baseboard heat its being heated by a boiler, not a furnace.

Just read an article in Time magazine about shale gas and wondering when natural gas is going to make it's way into the area. We're not thrilled to be using oil for heat.

[NoBozo]

Natural gas is nice as long as it works as it's supposed to. It's certainly cleaner and less damaging to the environment.

However, I have a BIG problem with natural gas: When the "system" fails....due to a little gas leak, etc, it is almost always SPECTACULAR, and it Will make the six o'clock news every time. That's just my opinion though. NB

[dpg]

Your probably still good but personally I wouldn't push it till there's issues. Remember any heating system won't fail on a nice day in July it will be a cold, January night, oh about 2:00 A.M. Not many people drive a car till it just doesn't go anymore and their a lot more expensive. A new high efficiency unit will literally pay for itslef in fuel savings over (most) older models.

[bigdog]

Can folks give me some referrals for 'Plumbing & Heating' contractors.

Looking for a backup resource, in case my Oil dealer cannot provide burner-service. Emergency situation has happened in the past, and don't want to get caught again in that position.

Saw 'Mahoney’s Plumbing & Heating' mentioned, any others ?

Thanks,
BD

[lawn psycho]

It's a numbers game. Say it cost $4000 extra that you put into the house. What is the interest rate and what does that do to your payment? Figure the newer boilers will save you 5-10% in oil costs. Multiply that by savings by expected use and average oil cost and you can see the difference versus the monthly payment. Basically the payback is almost immediate since the montly oil savings will be more than the incremental cost in mortgage. If you sell the house you won't pay that interest.

Good boilers (Burnham is middle of the road) can last a long time but it's the burners that go. Consider at least getting a new burner and boiler service if you don't want a new system.

IMO, go with a Buderus or Viessman boilers. Lifetime warranty and top notch quality.

We have the Buderus with a seperate tank for hot water storage and an "outdoor reset". We're burning 600 gallons a year with 2000+ square feet and that includes having an 18 year old who takes long showers and leaves windows and doors open. The set-up means basically unlimited hotwater.

Also, should you ever decide to sell it becomes a selling point having a higher end system. The Buderus and Viessman brands even look high-end with higher quality casings and fully insultated boilers all the way around.

[camp guy]

I have a newly installed (August 2010) Buderus boiler with a Riello burner and find it to be just wonderful. Compared to what I had it is night vs day.

My skills in this arena of home management are pitifully low, so I rely upon Rymes Propane and Oil (603- 539-4194) for both oil and service, and they have been equally as wonderful.

The Buderus is extremely quiet, very efficient, and for what it's worth, it looks good.

Yes, it was a little more than some other systems, but I think it is well worth it. It is at least worth checking out as one of your options.

[tummyman]

I've had a Biasi boiler for 6 years now....and have two - one in NH and one in MA. Very small, reliable, a less cost that the Buderus, and with the same efficiencies. If you do go with a new boiler, look into this one before making a final decision. It has excellent european castings and is what the industry calls a "three pass" design. Three pass is much more efficient than the traditional styles. I have my NH one in a closet next to my 1/2 bath and it is inside my main living area, as I have a crawl space. Visit their web site... www.qhtinc.com and look at the B10 model. You can call them for an installer in the area. I think Blake Plumbing in Holderness/Ashland installs them. At least get a comparative quote. As far as burners are concerned, Reillo, Burnham, and Carlin are the three main makers. You will not go wrong with any of them. Find out what your oil company mainly services, as you will want them to be carrying parts just in case of a shutdown on a Sunday night. The other thing with oil....make sure you have a new tank that is double walled. A leak can be EXTREMELY costly. Safe money is to replace any tank ove 20 years old if you plan to be in the house a long time. I just replaced a tank in MA with a Roth double walled..top of the line tank. Cost was $2500. I agree with prior writers on propane/gas. It is fine IF properly installed and maintained annually, but we lived through a house explosion of a neighbors in Moultonborough where a little girl was killed in her sleep about 7 years ago. We still have vivid memories of the results.

[steadyon]

GF is exactly correct. also, the life exp. of a boiler is 30-50 yrs. and a furnace is 18-20. although some furnaces are much older than that. When the furnace is old you need to be cautious of the heat exchanger cracking which will put carbon monoxide into the house.

[MAXUM]

Originally Posted by CateP

One of the houses we are considering buying has a 23 year old oil furnace. (Burnham brand). If we decide to purchase this house...

1. Do you think we should replace it ASAP?
2. If yes, what brand would you recommend? (high efficiency?)
3. What is the average cost of replacing a furnace?
4. Any recommendations for good furnace dealers and installers in the area?


We know nothing about oil furnaces and wonder if there are cost effective, energy efficient solutions out there in 2011. (we're not rolling in $$ here so we're looking for the best solution, not most expensive).

Thanks in advance for your knowledgeable replies.

It's all about how well they were maintained. Most folks forget about what's in the basement until one day it doesn't work and by then usually it's to late. Even if maintained like anything eventually things wear out and have to be replaced. Getting the furnace/boiler evaluated might not be a bad thing to do if there aren't any indications it's been regularly serviced. I keep records of the service performed on mine since I alternate servicing it myself and having it done every other year. I my records on a clip board near the furnace so I don't loose them and easily accessible for reference.

[TheProfessor]

Originally Posted by CateP

As always great replies. I think it is definitely worth getting an efficiency rating of the current system before jumping into a new one.

If it is not broken don't fix it.

Some will last a very long time if annual maintenance has been done. With a boiler there are two main parts - the heat exchanger and the burner. The burner is the removable motor that shoots the oil into the heat exchanger to create the flame/heat.

Efficiency of older units will be lower then the high priced newer units. But the older units are much simpler and potentially have much less items to go wrong or break.

If there is nothing wrong with the heat exchanger and all works fine - then save your money and keep going as is. But do put aside a fund for a new unit at some time in the future.

On newer models the higher the efficiency rating the more the cost of new unit. And the more complicated the internals. Some of today's new high efficincy boilers use more circuit boards and electronics. More parts that can break. Note: one family member had put in a new high efficiency unit a few years back and the unit stopped working/broke. The oil company technician could not fix. So the actual installer was called in. And spent half a day diagnosing. Come to find out he had to take out one of the circuit boards and on back of circuit board there was a black mark. The board has shorted out. One little tiny black dot - burnt circuit board. A part at that time that cost $200.00 (retail). The total cost for repair - out of warranty - was much higher.

As mentioned above some have had excellent results with brands mentioned.

If this were my home I would stick with well known brands. The brand is more important then the efficiency. If it were my home I would choose Weil-McLain. Trane, Lennox, Carrier are other good name brands.

The actual cost (wholesale) of a new boiler is around $1,000. Price will vary some by brand and by BTU and efficiency rating. All contractors have overhead to cover - insurance, vehicles, taxes, etc. - and must make a profit to stay in business. So do shop around when time comes. But most important is not the lowest price but the quality of installation and the COME BACK if unit malfunctions. Yes, the oil company you choose should provide on call repair service also.

Sometimes new is not always better.