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Old 07-27-2019, 09:16 PM   #1
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Default Rights

What are my rights when a neighbor ties a boat up to my
dock without permission ?

Bill
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Old 07-27-2019, 09:22 PM   #2
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Perhaps you need to post a Private Dock/No Trespassing /Posted sign to let him know he should not use your dock.
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Old 07-27-2019, 09:39 PM   #3
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Would you expect to have to post a sign at your dock.

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Old 07-27-2019, 09:43 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Water Camper View Post
Would you expect to have to post a sign at your dock.

Bill
I would say the first thing to do is speak to the neighbor. Why is he/she parking there?

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Old 07-27-2019, 10:14 PM   #5
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Maybe it was "too long a day" on the lake and he pulled into the wrong dock
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:02 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkxingu View Post
I would say the first thing to do is speak to the neighbor. Why is he/she parking there?
Says he couldn't find a transient slip for his boat.

What are my rights ? In my mind he is trespassing.
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:13 AM   #7
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Unfortunately, disrespect towards others is becoming a common occurrence. I suppose you could have untied the boat and send it off adrift. Opps...
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:16 AM   #8
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Unfortunately, disrespect towards others is becoming a common occurrence.
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:34 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Water Camper View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by thinkxingu View Post
I would say the first thing to do is speak to the neighbor. Why is he/she parking there?
Says he couldn't find a transient slip for his boat.

What are my rights ? In my mind he is trespassing.
How long was it docked at your slip? If it was a short time (couple hours or overnight and it was gone in the morning) I would probably not make a big deal about it. However if it persisted or was an extended period I would call the Marine Patrol and take lots of pictures.


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Old 07-28-2019, 07:37 AM   #10
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WHAT????? They have no right docking at YOUR dock.
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:37 AM   #11
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Default Marine Patrol

Contact Marine Patrol. If your dock is owned or leased by you, he is trespassing.

How does someone launch a boat that will be on the lake and not have already secured docking for the boat?

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Old 07-28-2019, 08:17 AM   #12
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Parking meters. Might as well make some money at it.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:25 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Water Camper View Post
Says he couldn't find a transient slip for his boat.

What are my rights ? In my mind he is trespassing.
Holy mackerel...that thing would have been gone in a NY minute if it was my dock...with or without him on it.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:28 AM   #14
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Arrow If He Has One...

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Says he couldn't find a transient slip for his boat. What are my rights ? In my mind he is trespassing.
What's the problem with your neighbor's dock?
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:33 AM   #15
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Tied up overnight. Neighbor doesn't have a dock. Just went over and reminded him that he said it would be gone in the morning. It is now 8:30 am.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:40 AM   #16
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Lightbulb Desperate Boater?

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Tied up overnight. Neighbor doesn't have a dock. Just went over and reminded him that he said it would be gone in the morning. It is now 8:30 am.
Seems like a very profitable rental is in the air.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:45 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Water Camper View Post
Tied up overnight. Neighbor doesn't have a dock. Just went over and reminded him that he said it would be gone in the morning. It is now 8:30 am.
I would inform him that he has 15 minutes to move the boat and if he doesn’t you are going to untie it. Also any subsequent instance will result in immediate untying of the boat.


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Old 07-28-2019, 09:05 AM   #18
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I don’t think you can legally untie it but, if it isn’t gone I’d call both the MP & the local police. On the other hand, if his tying up isn’t interfering with your use you could offer to rent him space. Based on his understanding of lack of availability it might be lucrative.


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Old 07-28-2019, 09:19 AM   #19
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Default Rights

As wrong as it sounds, just remember, you ARE living next to him and in the big, big picture, you probably want to get along. Rather than start with a full salvo of retribution, maybe a calm conversation is in order. Not knowing any more than you posted, it is hard to offer a solution, but I would try to keep some sort of cordial relationship in place.
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:36 AM   #20
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State statute says you cannot maliciously cast a boat adrift. Seems to me that if you cast this boat adrift (since it’s violating private property) then this would not be malicious. If it was on my dock they would never see it again....
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:40 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camp guy View Post
As wrong as it sounds, just remember, you ARE living next to him and in the big, big picture, you probably want to get along. Rather than start with a full salvo of retribution, maybe a calm conversation is in order. Not knowing any more than you posted, it is hard to offer a solution, but I would try to keep some sort of cordial relationship in place.
Words to live by. .............


Thanks for presenting a more reasonable approach.
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:50 AM   #22
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We have had issues with his parents who actually own the property nextdoor. We own the water front. Went to court and established a court order which denies their right to tie up to our dock. Property has not been used in years. The son came up yesterday with numerous friends and 2 boats. They came in late last evening. They tied 1 boat to my dock. Trying to be hospitable I allowed them to keep the boat overnight but it needed to be removed in the morning. 8:00 am arrived and no activity next door. Took pictures then woke up my neighbor and reminded him of our conversation. He said he would move boat soon. Waited an hour and went back over and said the boat needs to be moved immediately. He has finally moved the boat.
I have given him a copy of the court order.

Bill
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Old 07-28-2019, 09:55 AM   #23
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It seems you have done all you could to peacefully resolve the situation.
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:11 AM   #24
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Default An old thread on this subject

https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ead.php?t=3166
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:58 AM   #25
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A boat cast adrift is clearly a hazard to navigation. If you untied it you would be responsible. If someone was injured you could be prosecuted.

A boat adrift could cause damage to another boat or dock, possibly yours.

Hard to believe people would recommend setting it adrift, totally irresponsible!
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:05 AM   #26
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A boat cast adrift is clearly a hazard to navigation. If you untied it you would be responsible. If someone was injured you could be prosecuted.

A boat adrift could cause damage to another boat or dock, possibly yours.

Hard to believe people would recommend setting it adrift, totally irresponsible!
So tying up to your dock without permission is responsible?
People, especially the “me generation” which this sounds like it was, push their limits because they usually face no consequences.
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:36 AM   #27
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So tying up to your dock without permission is responsible?
People, especially the “me generation” which this sounds like it was, push their limits because they usually face no consequences.
Of course tying up under these circumstances is irresponsible. But that's a separate issue from whether it is legal or otherwise appropriate to untie the boat. A loose boat could be a VERY bad situation, and nobody's going to have much sympathy for the guy who untied it simply because he was angry with his neighbor's rudeness
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:14 PM   #28
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Default The "Me" Generation?

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So tying up to your dock without permission is responsible?
People, especially the “me generation” which this sounds like it was, push their limits because they usually face no consequences.

The "Me" Generation is most closely tied to the Baby Boomers, less so to the Millenials. Assuming you meant the Millenials.... In any event, I wouldn't tie this to a generation, but rather to someone who feels entitled, shows a lack of judgment, is willing to openly trespass on their neighbor. We can find that type of person in any generation.

We have been discussing "rights", which can become litigious. Might also want to approach this asking what's "fair." The two are often at odds with each other, but, I think, it forces a more considered - not necessarily easier - approach.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:58 PM   #29
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There should be no delay in calling the authorities after the first refusal to remove the boat from your dock. You showed weakness and they took advantage of it.


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Old 07-28-2019, 09:01 PM   #30
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There should be no delay in calling the authorities after the first refusal to remove the boat from your dock. You showed weakness and they took advantage of it.
Won't happen a 2nd time !

Bill
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:18 PM   #31
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Tell 'em next time the entire forum will park their boats at his place. Oh, and we'll have our cars shipped over. They'll go in the backyard.
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Old 07-29-2019, 06:33 AM   #32
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Default Renting

For those who suggested "renting" , if you think the abuse of your rights is bad now, wait until you "rent" to someone. Their sense of entitlement to abuse your property will soar. You want to engage in a business transaction with people who start out by disrespecting your property rights? You will wake up to six boats of his friends tied up to your dock and garbage strewn all over the shore. After all they are renting it, right?
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Old 07-29-2019, 11:04 AM   #33
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WaterCamper..... Your dock your rules! It was beyond gracious of you to let them tie up overnight. You at least made an attempt to be a a good neighbor to an obviously crappy one! Cheers!

Next time (if there is a next time) call the MP and let them resolve the situation....

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Old 07-29-2019, 03:14 PM   #34
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For those who suggested "renting" , if you think the abuse of your rights is bad now, wait until you "rent" to someone. Their sense of entitlement to abuse your property will soar. You want to engage in a business transaction with people who start out by disrespecting your property rights? You will wake up to six boats of his friends tied up to your dock and garbage strewn all over the shore. After all they are renting it, right?
I was just advised that renting NH dock space isn't permitted.
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Old 07-29-2019, 03:29 PM   #35
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I was just advised that renting NH dock space isn't permitted.
Who told you that? A lot of slips at MVYC are rented, as are ones in other marina's, condo associations and private residences. Pretty sure that if it wasn't permitted MYYC et al wouldn't be doing it.

Only time I can imagine that is in an association where it's part of the bylaws.
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Old 07-29-2019, 04:00 PM   #36
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Post a sign on your dock; "One 25 foot docking space for rent for $100 per hour". Chances are real good they won't bite, but if they do you have a nice profitable reward.......

They also will recognize the legal financial penalties if they do use your space.
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Old 07-29-2019, 04:15 PM   #37
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Post a sign on your dock; "One 25 foot docking space for rent for $100 per hour". Chances are real good they won't bite, but if they do you have a nice profitable reward.......

They also will recognize the legal financial penalties if they do use your space.
Haha, great idea !!

I think the best thing the OP has is that court order, present that to any police officer, and they would have a hard time telling the court why they wouldn't enforce it.
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Old 07-29-2019, 04:40 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Water Camper View Post
We have had issues with his parents who actually own the property nextdoor. We own the water front. Went to court and established a court order which denies their right to tie up to our dock. Property has not been used in years. The son came up yesterday with numerous friends and 2 boats. They came in late last evening. They tied 1 boat to my dock. Trying to be hospitable I allowed them to keep the boat overnight but it needed to be removed in the morning. 8:00 am arrived and no activity next door. Took pictures then woke up my neighbor and reminded him of our conversation. He said he would move boat soon. Waited an hour and went back over and said the boat needs to be moved immediately. He has finally moved the boat.
I have given him a copy of the court order.

Bill
Why on earth are you discussing this in an open forum?

You have a court order.... Hospitality did not work...

Your Right is to contact the courts and let them know the neighbor is in violation.

I get what you are trying to do (keep the peace), but from what you are writing here, Enough already is what I would do.
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:11 PM   #39
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Haha, great idea !!

I think the best thing the OP has is that court order, present that to any police officer, and they would have a hard time telling the court why they wouldn't enforce it.
I disagree. A police officer or marine patrol officer would not consider this criminal behavior, but instead a civil dispute. The only recourse the OP has is to go back to court with evidence showing a violation of the court order. This isn't necessarily as simple as it appears. Contempt violations are very difficult to prove.

The issue here is respect and a violation of boundaries. When I wrote my original post, I did not know that there was a history between the OP and the neighbor. Had I known that there was already a court order in place, I most definitely would have untied his boat. The OP is dealing with a bully, and as my mother taught me at a young age, you punch a bully in the nose. He doesn't respect the OP nor any of his rights. The neighbor (and his son) aren't interested in discussing the issue. I realize the boat may cause damage if untied, but the risk is probably pretty low and one that I would be willing to take. It may seem irresponsible to some, but I am not going to let anyone violate my personal property and space. As someone noted above, bullies take advantage of people trying to be nice and act reasonable. With this neighbor, the next thing you know he's on your property and treating it as his own.

That said, no one enjoys confrontation, but sometimes a stand needs to be made. I am sorry the OP had to deal with this. To go through the effort of obtaining a court order shows what he's been through. Unfortunately, there are no easy solutions.
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:21 PM   #40
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Why wouldn't the criminal trespass laws apply if the dock and the land to which it is attached were marked with private property/no trespassing/posted signs?
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:34 PM   #41
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Quote:
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I most definitely would have untied his boat. The OP is dealing with a bully, and as my mother taught me at a young age, you punch a bully in the nose. He doesn't respect the OP nor any of his rights. The neighbor (and his son) aren't interested in discussing the issue. I realize the boat may cause damage if untied, but the risk is probably pretty low and one that I would be willing to take. It may seem irresponsible to some, but I am not going to let anyone violate my personal property and space.
Interesting. Untie it and let it go. So when a boat with a family of 5 hits that unlit drifting boat that you untied, the risk of injury, property damage, and legal problems for a hazard you created are something you are comfortable with?

Maybe your mother forgot to explain that actions have consequences.
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:44 PM   #42
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Can we get Marine Patrol to weight in on this issue, to see what they are inclined to do for the OP?
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:44 PM   #43
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Regarding Loon's post, criminal trespassing is different than trespassing. The neighbor did not commit a crime. I am fairly confident that the police would not want to be involved.

Regarding Tilton's post, I think the risk would be very low, and if after speaking to the person and asking/demanding that the boat be removed, absent a physical altercation, what would you suggest? Hiring an attorney, going to court, obtaining a court order, and having that court order ignored or laughed at? I wouldn't have the time or the patience. Maybe a physical altercation is the only alternative, but one that should be avoided. Also, although not stated, in my scenario, the neighbor would be informed that his boat was no longer on the dock so I doubt the family of five would be in any danger. I would hope that the neighbor would care enough to retrieve it.
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Old 07-29-2019, 05:51 PM   #44
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If the property had been posted, wouldn't trespassing be a crime? Posting might provide a remedy for any future trespassing.
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Old 07-29-2019, 06:05 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major View Post
Regarding Loon's post, criminal trespassing is different than trespassing. The neighbor did not commit a crime. I am fairly confident that the police would not want to be involved.

Regarding Tilton's post, I think the risk would be very low, and if after speaking to the person and asking/demanding that the boat be removed, absent a physical altercation, what would you suggest? Hiring an attorney, going to court, obtaining a court order, and having that court order ignored or laughed at? I wouldn't have the time or the patience. Maybe a physical altercation is the only alternative, but one that should be avoided. Also, although not stated, in my scenario, the neighbor would be informed that his boat was no longer on the dock so I doubt the family of five would be in any danger. I would hope that the neighbor would care enough to retrieve it.
Let me remind you of how ish works in "real life".....

You set a boat adrift because you are entitled...... Then this.....

https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ad.php?t=23775

or this

https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ad.php?t=24587

WTH

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Originally Posted by Major View Post
What if it were your son or daughter? I know if it was one of my boys, I would want an eye for an eye. There are two components to our criminal justice system. The first is to punish and rehabilitate criminals for the crimes they commit. The second is to provide justice to victims of criminal behavior. We focus too often on the first and not on the second.
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Old 07-29-2019, 07:41 PM   #46
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Untie the boat. Walk it out about 30 feet. Drop its anchor.
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Old 07-29-2019, 09:58 PM   #47
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You must have a friend or know someone who has an extra boat they are not using for a week. Just ask them if they mind have it docked on your dock. Hence, no space for the rude next door neighbor. Problem Solved ! Yw..
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:22 AM   #48
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This is an interesting topic and a slippery slope.
Untying the boat and releasing or anchoring it is almost certainly criminal.
The neighbor docking on another deck is something that should probably be litigated in state court.
The lake, starting at the high water mark is state property and as a result, property ownership claims are goin to be tough to argue...
If the neighbor were to come and go by way of water, without actually trespassing on the land the dock is adjacent to, the case would be very interesting.
I hope this makes it to court, it could change a lot for the shore of lake winnipesaukee.
We were in the boat last night and I was thinking about all of the trampolines and rafts on the lake without permit.... does a property owner have the right to ban a passerby from using them if accessed by water?
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Old 07-30-2019, 05:45 AM   #49
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Are you being serious Patiently?????

While we are at it, why doesn't Water Camper feel free to take his neighbors' boat for a ride any time he wants.
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Old 07-30-2019, 08:12 AM   #50
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Default Another option.....

Post your dock, No Trespassing/Docking - Violators will be towed.

They dock, you have them towed! No different than parking in your driveway!


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Old 07-30-2019, 08:35 AM   #51
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This whole thread makes me appreciate my neighbors! They are always there to lend a helping hand (including dock space as needed) as do I.
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Old 07-30-2019, 08:54 AM   #52
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an older thread on this subject

https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...ighlight=towed

One of my suggestions, for a sign.

To the owner of ________________________________

They say the boat you should not rock
but you need permission before you dock.

Here you stand broken hearted
'cause your boat has pre-departed.

To Glendale MPHQ you must go
to pay the impound fees you now owe.
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:03 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by Garcia View Post
This whole thread makes me appreciate my neighbors! They are always there to lend a helping hand (including dock space as needed) as do I.
I agree. Do it all the time. No big deal but then again us islanders tend to be a little more laid back about such things. I mean we have folks walking through our property all the time too, tis part of the way of life out there and I personally think it adds to the awesomeness of island life.
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:33 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by Outdoorsman View Post
Let me remind you of how ish works in "real life".....

You set a boat adrift because you are entitled...... Then this.....
I don't get your point. In this instance, a not-so-neighborly neighbor is treating the OP's personal property as his own. He is impinging the OP's rights as a property owner. The OP did nothing wrong and merely wanted to quietly enjoy HIS property. In the two cases you referenced, persons high on alcohol and drugs, respectively, criminally killed several people while operating a motor vehicle. I think it is the height of hyperbole and an exaggeration to suggest that an untied boat could create such a danger, especially when the owner of the boat has notice of it being untied.

For the record, if it was my neighbor, of course I would let him use the slip in case of emergency or a last minute need. I get along great with my neighbors because I respect their rights and the respect mine. This is not the case in this thread. The OP HAD TO GO TO COURT TO ENFORCE HIS RIGHTS! Am I the only one that finds this completely unacceptable?! I would not give an inch to that neighbor. His behavior changes everything.
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:38 AM   #55
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Default Dock space

We share dock space with our island neighbors ALL THE TIME! It is done with mutual courtesy, respect and most importantly...permission.

If I arrived to the island one day and an unknown boat was tied up at my dock I'd be pretty pi$$ed, however, if a note was left with explanation, name & phone #, or some indication that there may have been an emergency, I'd be ok with it for a day or so as long I can communicate with the owner.

Communication is key.
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:45 AM   #56
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Kamper, thank you for the thread. I love the idea of throwing bread and sardines on his boat to attract birds! I think you have solved the problem. ;-)
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Old 07-30-2019, 10:52 AM   #57
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Getting back to the initial question, I don't see why leaving your boat tied to a private dock you don't own would be viewed any differently than leaving your car parked in a private driveway you don't own. You shouldn't be surprised if it gets towed. Yes the dock is in public waters but the end of my driveway is in the road right of way and I'm pretty certain that doesn't mean someone can park in the end of my driveway and block it off. Does anyone know what the legal ramifications would be, if any, if one were to have that boat towed away? Where is Skip to weigh in on this issue?
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:42 AM   #58
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Getting back to the initial question, I don't see why leaving your boat tied to a private dock you don't own would be viewed any differently than leaving your car parked in a private driveway you don't own. You shouldn't be surprised if it gets towed. Yes the dock is in public waters but the end of my driveway is in the road right of way and I'm pretty certain that doesn't mean someone can park in the end of my driveway and block it off. Does anyone know what the legal ramifications would be, if any, if one were to have that boat towed away? Where is Skip to weigh in on this issue?
This was answered in the prior thread provided by Kamper. Difficult, if not impossible to find someone to tow the boat. Marine patrol won't do it. Private tow boats won't either. Also, I'm not sure how it works with a car parked in a private driveway. If I call a tow company to tow a car parked in my parking space without permission, does the tow company automatically just tow the car? Again this is a civil issue, not criminal. My guess is that you would have to get a court order to tow the vehicle.
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:57 AM   #59
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You don't need a court order to tow a boat anymore than they need a court order to tow a parked car.... They tow in the Weirs all the time when people park in private spots. Gulbicki's Towing gets all the Gringo tows.

The issue is that the towboat companies probably do not have a storage spot for a towed boat...

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Old 07-30-2019, 12:59 PM   #60
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Seems like moving the boat a short distance of 25-yards and dropping anchor, or tying it to a big cinder block, underwater, could both remove it, and keep it safe.

What would Judge Judy say about that?
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:04 PM   #61
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Seems like moving the boat a short distance of 25-yards and dropping anchor, or tying it to a big cinder block, underwater, could both remove it, and keep it safe.

What would Judge Judy say about that?
The trouble is...you shouldn't have to be doing this in the first place!
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:09 PM   #62
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Default Chill

IMHO, this thread exemplifies what is wrong in our society today.

Someone comes late to the party and uses a dock that they don’t have a “right” to use. Then they are, maybe, a bit slow or lazy at moving the boat away.

Immediately the discussion goes to “MY rights” and then to most every suggestion short of blowing the boat out of the water. My guess is that could be coming soon. Sounds like a great neighborhood!

There appears to be some sort of history with a prior owner/generation, but I suspect whoever left the boat at the dock was simply, at best, moving slow or just on a different schedule than others.

Maybe, just work it out without the dramatics!
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:31 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by MeEscape View Post
IMHO, this thread exemplifies what is wrong in our society today.

Someone comes late to the party and uses a dock that they don’t have a “right” to use. Then they are, maybe, a bit slow or lazy at moving the boat away.

Immediately the discussion goes to “MY rights” and then to most every suggestion short of blowing the boat out of the water. My guess is that could be coming soon. Sounds like a great neighborhood!

There appears to be some sort of history with a prior owner/generation, but I suspect whoever left the boat at the dock was simply, at best, moving slow or just on a different schedule than others.

Maybe, just work it out without the dramatics!
I think the history defines the recourse. If you're so chill give me the keys to your car and I'll give it back when I feel like. My timing may no suit your timing. I may be slow or lazy. After all, your so-called "rights" in your car can't be any more or less than the so-called "rights" of the dock owner.

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Old 07-30-2019, 02:43 PM   #64
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The trouble is...you shouldn't have to be doing this in the first place!
Hillcountry, is this before or after Judge Judy asks whether he has a job! I love it when she does that!
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:44 PM   #65
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Please, their schedule has nothing to do with trespassing on someones property! Lucky it wasn't mine I would have had it towed as soon as I didn't see a note explaining why it was there. And to answer your statement that as a dock owner you have no right to be upset that someone dumped a boat where it shouldn't be docked I should wait. SORRY YOU ARE 100% WRONG!
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Old 07-30-2019, 02:56 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by MeEscape View Post
IMHO, this thread exemplifies what is wrong in our society today.

Someone comes late to the party and uses a dock that they don’t have a “right” to use. Then they are, maybe, a bit slow or lazy at moving the boat away.

Immediately the discussion goes to “MY rights” and then to most every suggestion short of blowing the boat out of the water. My guess is that could be coming soon. Sounds like a great neighborhood!

There appears to be some sort of history with a prior owner/generation, but I suspect whoever left the boat at the dock was simply, at best, moving slow or just on a different schedule than others.

Maybe, just work it out without the dramatics!
This is one of those trolling attempts right? I mean I can never tell. I get asked some pretty incredible questions all the time and well it's my job to answer them so I always assume the person asking is serious but in this case this is a joke, right?
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Old 07-30-2019, 03:03 PM   #67
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This is one of those trolling attempts right? I mean I can never tell. I get asked some pretty incredible questions all the time and well it's my job to answer them so I always assume the person asking is serious but in this case this is a joke, right?
I guess I bit. I'm trying to get the hook out of my mouth.
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Old 07-30-2019, 03:19 PM   #68
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Just goes to show how this nation has devolved... I'm pretty sure it won't end well in the near future.
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Old 07-30-2019, 03:58 PM   #69
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Hillcountry, is this before or after Judge Judy asks whether he has a job! I love it when she does that!
This post actually cleared up SO MUCH confusion that I had with your qualifications.
Thank You!
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Old 07-30-2019, 06:05 PM   #70
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This is one of those trolling attempts right? I mean I can never tell. I get asked some pretty incredible questions all the time and well it's my job to answer them so I always assume the person asking is serious but in this case this is a joke, right?
My guess it’s the “chill” kid that used the OP’s dock...sounds just like one of the “me me me” me-linniels...
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Old 07-30-2019, 06:12 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by MeEscape View Post
IMHO, this thread exemplifies what is wrong in our society today.

Someone comes late to the party and uses a dock that they don’t have a “right” to use. Then they are, maybe, a bit slow or lazy at moving the boat away.

Immediately the discussion goes to “MY rights” and then to most every suggestion short of blowing the boat out of the water. My guess is that could be coming soon. Sounds like a great neighborhood!

There appears to be some sort of history with a prior owner/generation, but I suspect whoever left the boat at the dock was simply, at best, moving slow or just on a different schedule than others.

Maybe, just work it out without the dramatics!
Sorry but you have it back-asswards...
What is “wrong in our society” is exemplified in...wait for it....YOUR OWN POST.
You portray exactly, the kind of attitude that is taking this country down.
Chill my ass...
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Old 07-30-2019, 06:13 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Major View Post
I guess I bit. I'm trying to get the hook out of my mouth.
If so, Good trolling. 68 responses. However, the OP came back with additional info about a court order, which I think was crucial. I just don't know here, but I've been in similar situations so I give the benefit of the doubt to the OP.
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Old 07-30-2019, 08:42 PM   #73
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OP: It would seem that you do indeed have a viable remedy.

Given that you have a court order prohibiting them from using your dock, your remedy is to file an action for contempt of court (or whatever the equivalent action is called in the Granite State).
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Old 07-31-2019, 08:08 AM   #74
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If he/they violated a court order the go back to court with the evidence and let the court deal with it.

a question - was the boat impinging on the OP’s ability to use his dock? If it was a space that is normally open what’s the big deal if the neighbor didn’t respond immediately? I do agree however that they should ask. Sounds like there is more to this story of neighbor on neighbor crime. Maybe a fence on the property line fixes the issue.


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Old 07-31-2019, 09:39 AM   #75
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I am astounded by the responses. So the OP is supposed to take a day out of work, hire an attorney, and essentially re-litigate an issue that was already resolved in his favor. I've been involved in several contempt of court issues. It's not as easy as taking a photograph of the boat and saying the neighbor violated the court's order. You basically have to start from scratch. It's a very, very frustrating process.

I am also astounded by how easily people want to give away another person's property, all for maintaining an appearance of being a "good neighbor." Who's behavior is causing the issue? The OP or the neighbor? So if I have an extra dock slip, I should let my neighbor use it without permission so I can appear virtuous? Does this apply to excess parking spaces? To extra vehicles? Where does it end? It is the neighbor in this instance who broke the trust. He is not entitled to an ounce of mercy or grace in this situation.
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Old 07-31-2019, 03:18 PM   #76
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I would like to follow up;

First I would never consider releasing a boat secured to my dock, although I would be tempted !!

I have followed up with the Laconia PD. They suggest that at the present time this is a civil matter. If I want to pursue this I would need to go back to court, ugly.

They did volunteer to come and talk with my neighbor if this does reoccur.

Hope this helps,
Bill

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Old 07-31-2019, 03:31 PM   #77
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I would like to follow up;

First I would never consider releasing a boat secured to my dock, although I would be tempted !!

I have followed up with the Laconia PD. They suggest that at the present time this is a civil matter. If I want to pursue this I would need to go back to court, ugly.

They did volunteer to come and talk with my neighbor if this does reoccur.

Hope this helps,
Hill
I would advise you to "Post" your dock with NO TRESPASSING signs to prevent reoccurring issues.

It beats going to Court if you can nip it in the bud.
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:25 PM   #78
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Default Friends of ours

Some friends of ours allowed their neighbor (neighbor B) to dock their boat at their dock. It was agreeable and they were friends as well. It was always clear that the dock was on neighbors A's side of the property line and had paid for and installed the dock. Neighbors B (who used friends dock) sells house and then dies. Neighbor A also dies and leaves dock and house to family. Yes, they were older folk.

Still following? Neighbor C who bought house from neighbor B now claims he owns the dock that is on Neighbors A's land. Adverse possession is the claim and they are headed to court. Meanwhile neighbors C uses the dock as he pleases.

I know it will cost a lot of money to fight it out and if neighbor C can prove adverse possession he may win the dock.

Just goes to show you no good deed ever goes unpunished.
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Old 07-31-2019, 04:42 PM   #79
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Not to worry, isn't it too bad that you can't be nice to anybody any more?
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Old 07-31-2019, 05:36 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Not to Worry View Post
Some friends of ours allowed their neighbor (neighbor B) to dock their boat at their dock. It was agreeable and they were friends as well. It was always clear that the dock was on neighbors A's side of the property line and had paid for and installed the dock. Neighbors B (who used friends dock) sells house and then dies. Neighbor A also dies and leaves dock and house to family. Yes, they were older folk.

Still following? Neighbor C who bought house from neighbor B now claims he owns the dock that is on Neighbors A's land. Adverse possession is the claim and they are headed to court. Meanwhile neighbors C uses the dock as he pleases.

I know it will cost a lot of money to fight it out and if neighbor C can prove adverse possession he may win the dock.

Just goes to show you no good deed ever goes unpunished.
The fact pattern given here does not lead to adverse possession, based on the common understanding of the doctrine (I don't know what the New Hampshire common law precedent is). Specifically, the use of the dock by neighbor B was not "hostile."

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/adverse_possession
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Old 07-31-2019, 05:42 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by Not to Worry View Post
Some friends of ours allowed their neighbor (neighbor B) to dock their boat at their dock. It was agreeable and they were friends as well. It was always clear that the dock was on neighbors A's side of the property line and had paid for and installed the dock. Neighbors B (who used friends dock) sells house and then dies. Neighbor A also dies and leaves dock and house to family. Yes, they were older folk.

Still following? Neighbor C who bought house from neighbor B now claims he owns the dock that is on Neighbors A's land. Adverse possession is the claim and they are headed to court. Meanwhile neighbors C uses the dock as he pleases.

I know it will cost a lot of money to fight it out and if neighbor C can prove adverse possession he may win the dock.

Just goes to show you no good deed ever goes unpunished.
My understanding of the law is if B was given permission by A then adverse possession does not apply. Anyway it is sad that C types exist.
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Old 07-31-2019, 06:08 PM   #82
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Adverse possession is invalid if one has been granted permission.
Call the police or MP and hand them the court order and tell them to get the offender to remove and maybe arrest them.

That being said I MIGHT set the boat free in the middle of the night. If questioned, I would say. What boat. If you tied a boat there you must not have secured it properly.

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Old 07-31-2019, 06:10 PM   #83
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My understanding of the law is if B was given permission by A then adverse possession does not apply. Anyway it is sad that C types exist.
Shamefully, the "person" that claims to be a lawyer has suggested just setting the boat adrift..... regardless of consequences...
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Old 07-31-2019, 06:15 PM   #84
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There is also a provision in the law that states that the person claiming adverse possession must be the one to occupy said property for a set period of time. This cannot, I would think, be conveyed or claimed through the purchase of a piece of property by another party.

Then again I'm just a forum lawyer so what the heck do I know.
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Old 07-31-2019, 07:05 PM   #85
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Some friends of ours allowed their neighbor (neighbor B) to dock their boat at their dock. It was agreeable and they were friends as well. It was always clear that the dock was on neighbors A's side of the property line and had paid for and installed the dock. Neighbors B (who used friends dock) sells house and then dies. Neighbor A also dies and leaves dock and house to family. Yes, they were older folk.

Still following? Neighbor C who bought house from neighbor B now claims he owns the dock that is on Neighbors A's land. Adverse possession is the claim and they are headed to court. Meanwhile neighbors C uses the dock as he pleases.

I know it will cost a lot of money to fight it out and if neighbor C can prove adverse possession he may win the dock.

Just goes to show you no good deed ever goes unpunished.
I’m going from my bad memory from law school but adverse possession requires that the use must be hostile. This doesn’t seem to be the case. Also, the possession must be for 20 years. I’m not sure whether this requirement is met. Finally, a new owner cannot tack on to the prior owner’s use. Again, I’m not sure whether this applies.

The lack of hostile possession seems to be the key.


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Old 07-31-2019, 07:25 PM   #86
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The word "hostile", altho used in the law, may not conform to what one might think. Reference:

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...ion-claim.html
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Old 07-31-2019, 07:44 PM   #87
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Correct but I think the fact that the neighbor had permission negates hostile possession.


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Old 08-01-2019, 09:18 AM   #88
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What are my rights when a neighbor ties a boat up to my
dock without permission ?

Bill
I think I saw the right answer, from others, but I will respond..... Your right is to call law enforcement. If you are on the mainland, I would start by calling your local police department. If you are on an Island I would start with the Marine Patrol.

Your premise that the neighbor is trespassing is correct. Police involvement when ensure that you don't do anything outside law. And if your neighbor is less then co-operative, they will deal with the issue for you.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:23 AM   #89
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I think I saw the right answer, from others, but I will respond..... Your right is to call law enforcement. If you are on the mainland, I would start by calling your local police department. If you are on an Island I would start with the Marine Patrol.

Your premise that the neighbor is trespassing is correct. Police involvement when ensure that you don't do anything outside law. And if your neighbor is less then co-operative, they will deal with the issue for you.
Life, I think you missed the OP's follow up. "I have followed up with the Laconia PD. They suggest that at the present time this is a civil matter. If I want to pursue this I would need to go back to court, ugly."

This is a civil, not criminal matter. The police and marine patrol will not want to be involved.
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Old 08-01-2019, 09:52 AM   #90
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Another issue is, what if the trespassers have had a few adult beverages and someone fall and is injured on your property? I know you pay and have to pay an attorney to mitagate the amount then fight with the insurance company! Me I would have already posted NO TRESPASSING sign on the dock
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Old 08-01-2019, 12:07 PM   #91
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Yes, the claim has to have been hostile and existed for 20 years. The fact that the previous owner had permission negates all of this. The new owner can only clain adverse possession if s/he has been using the property knowingly by the true owner and in hostility for 20 years.

Possible counter suit/ slap suit.

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Old 08-01-2019, 12:17 PM   #92
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Life, I think you missed the OP's follow up. "I have followed up with the Laconia PD. They suggest that at the present time this is a civil matter. If I want to pursue this I would need to go back to court, ugly."

This is a civil, not criminal matter. The police and marine patrol will not want to be involved.
If the Laconia PD, isn't willing to follow up, then there is a problem, or Trespassing is some how just a civil infraction in NH.

Given the situation, I would suggest skipping over the Laconia PD, and next try the Marine Patrol... As Jurisdictional wise, they probably have the Jurisdiction, as it involves the State Water Way....

If the Marine Patrol will not deal with it... Then its time to call the State Representative for the Town, and sit down with them....

While the infraction may now be dealt with... As a homeowner you and have to have a avenue to resolve what is a criminal transgression, by your neighbor.... I understand the Laconia PD stand point, as often these issues will just resolve them selves.... Which is why it is important to report it to them, so the incident, and future incidents are logged.

Would I want my neighbor to go to jail, most certainly not... Would I like to have their boat safely removed from my property yes.... So I suppose in this light you could just call Sea Tow, and maybe they would come remove the vehicle.....
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Old 08-01-2019, 01:23 PM   #93
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Another issue is, what if the trespassers have had a few adult beverages and someone fall and is injured on your property? I know you pay and have to pay an attorney to mitagate the amount then fight with the insurance company! Me I would have already posted NO TRESPASSING sign on the dock
If somebody is injured on your property, there is recovery available from your medical payments coverage. Don't have to prove "fault". If there is a legal claim (lawsuit) your liability coverage includes defense costs as well as settlement if any. You call your insurance company and go back down to the dock and count the wavers as they go by. Fussing with lawyers is not an issue here.
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Old 08-01-2019, 01:46 PM   #94
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If this gets/becomes nastier, you can also ask the police to give the neighbor a "Tresspass Warning." After that, the police can supposedly arrest them any time they are on your property.

Then... Chain the boat to your dock and call it in when they come back to get it.
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Old 08-01-2019, 03:35 PM   #95
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Since there appears to be history of conflict between you and your neighbor I would put up small unobtrusive no trespassing signs were they would tie up their boat, I say small so it isn’t an eyesore to you.

I would also draft up an invoice for the time their boat was docked at your dock. $100 a day sounds reasonable.




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Old 08-01-2019, 04:14 PM   #96
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The LPD are wrong. This is in their jurisdiction. As a elder couple, the wife and I fearful of our property and possible harm have the right to defend yourself. Lawn chair and shotgun then call the LPD. Bet they handle the issue a bit more serious


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Old 08-07-2019, 11:43 PM   #97
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I disagree. A police officer or marine patrol officer would not consider this criminal behavior, but instead a civil dispute. The only recourse the OP has is to go back to court with evidence showing a violation of the court order. This isn't necessarily as simple as it appears. Contempt violations are very difficult to prove.

The issue here is respect and a violation of boundaries. When I wrote my original post, I did not know that there was a history between the OP and the neighbor. Had I known that there was already a court order in place, I most definitely would have untied his boat. The OP is dealing with a bully, and as my mother taught me at a young age, you punch a bully in the nose. He doesn't respect the OP nor any of his rights. The neighbor (and his son) aren't interested in discussing the issue. I realize the boat may cause damage if untied, but the risk is probably pretty low and one that I would be willing to take. It may seem irresponsible to some, but I am not going to let anyone violate my personal property and space. As someone noted above, bullies take advantage of people trying to be nice and act reasonable. With this neighbor, the next thing you know he's on your property and treating it as his own.

That said, no one enjoys confrontation, but sometimes a stand needs to be made. I am sorry the OP had to deal with this. To go through the effort of obtaining a court order shows what he's been through. Unfortunately, there are no easy solutions.
Hate to tell you, but violation of a court order is a criminal offense.


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Old 08-07-2019, 11:46 PM   #98
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This was answered in the prior thread provided by Kamper. Difficult, if not impossible to find someone to tow the boat. Marine patrol won't do it. Private tow boats won't either. Also, I'm not sure how it works with a car parked in a private driveway. If I call a tow company to tow a car parked in my parking space without permission, does the tow company automatically just tow the car? Again this is a civil issue, not criminal. My guess is that you would have to get a court order to tow the vehicle.
Trespassing is a criminal offense. It might only be municipal, but it is still criminal once he tells them to move it and they do not.


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Old 08-07-2019, 11:49 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Not to Worry View Post
Some friends of ours allowed their neighbor (neighbor B) to dock their boat at their dock. It was agreeable and they were friends as well. It was always clear that the dock was on neighbors A's side of the property line and had paid for and installed the dock. Neighbors B (who used friends dock) sells house and then dies. Neighbor A also dies and leaves dock and house to family. Yes, they were older folk.

Still following? Neighbor C who bought house from neighbor B now claims he owns the dock that is on Neighbors A's land. Adverse possession is the claim and they are headed to court. Meanwhile neighbors C uses the dock as he pleases.

I know it will cost a lot of money to fight it out and if neighbor C can prove adverse possession he may win the dock.

Just goes to show you no good deed ever goes unpunished.
Adverse possession takes over 21 years to be established and is impossible to prove.


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Old 08-07-2019, 11:51 PM   #100
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I’m going from my bad memory from law school but adverse possession requires that the use must be hostile. This doesn’t seem to be the case. Also, the possession must be for 20 years. I’m not sure whether this requirement is met. Finally, a new owner cannot tack on to the prior owner’s use. Again, I’m not sure whether this applies.

The lack of hostile possession seems to be the key.


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I clearly remember a life in being plus 21 years. And, yes, it has to be hostile. Not with permission.


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