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Old 04-12-2024, 06:54 AM   #1
TiltonBB
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Default 50 condos proposed for Union Ave

The site of the former Friendly's next to T Bones. Their plan was presented to the Laconia Planning Board earlier this month, which referred the proposal to the city’s Technical Review Committee, a study team including representatives from each major department.

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...7d1c00707.html
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Old 04-12-2024, 07:24 AM   #2
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Will the waste treatment facilities be able to keep up with all the added "housing"?
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Old 04-12-2024, 07:46 AM   #3
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Good questions. Give them credit for addressing “workforce housing” on their own and with private funding Never have been a fan of this type of building in the Laconia area. Done correctly it works


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Old 04-12-2024, 08:45 AM   #4
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The waste treatment facilities have limited further capacity... so its a matter of which projects on the system get built first.

All the ''workforce'' housing in Laconia is built privately...
You may be mistaking it with subsidized housing, which is different.
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Old 04-12-2024, 10:15 AM   #5
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Units are to sell for $500,000. Doesn't sound like workforce housing. They are holding some units for rent. Doubt it will be section 8 housing. The picture in the paper looks like an office building, not housing. I'm sure it will get approved since they say some rental units will go to city employees. Sucking up?
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Old 04-12-2024, 05:42 PM   #6
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Not all the units are expected to be workforce housing.
The condos at the top will pay for the project, and the rentals at the bottom will be what the developers use for workforce housing.
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Old 04-12-2024, 08:54 PM   #7
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50 condos sold for $500,000 each. $25,000,000 should cover the construction cost.
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Old 04-12-2024, 10:26 PM   #8
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I believe that it will be 40 condos.
The parcel, if the parking and permits can be solved, has very low development costs relative to other parcels, so will high enough density... plenty of profit after the build out, and ten apartments for continuing income.

It will probably change before being finalized.
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Old 04-13-2024, 11:18 AM   #9
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50 units on 1 acre, .
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Old 04-13-2024, 03:16 PM   #10
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I roughed the numbers. At 10 per level, they will be compact. Unless they intend to seek a waiver on the parking requirements.

Last edited by John Mercier; 04-13-2024 at 07:01 PM.
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Old 04-13-2024, 05:11 PM   #11
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Default Imagination

With some imagination, on 1.77 acres: one floor retail, two floors parking, 7 floors, 300 apartments. On the roof, a pool, biergarten and a dog park. Exercise and conference rooms. Financed with a Delaware Statutory Trust (DST) so it is locked in to 1, 2, 3 bedroom rentals for ten years. Views of the river and nearby marina. https://www.vistabrooklyn.com/
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Old 04-13-2024, 07:01 PM   #12
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But that didn't have a municipal regulation that required 1.5 parking spaces per apartment.

300 apartments in Laconia requires 450 parking spaces at roughly 500SF each when travel lanes are included. 225,000SF on a lot roughly 77,100SF means that it would never be built.

So some variance on the parking regulation is going to be required or these units could be as small as 500SF each. Not impossible to make a unit that small, but requires a decent amount of design for it to feel comfortable.
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Old 04-13-2024, 11:29 PM   #13
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Default double check

I double checked. They have 450 parking spaces and 308 apartments, some of which are studios, some 1. 2, 3 BR. Rents from ~$1250-~$6600. I believe a parking space is 9 x24=216 sf. In a private parking garage, you only need one way traffic, so I'm not sure you need 500 sf, but it seems to work in a relatively new building built in 2021. Sent a PM. In NH towns, we tend to want space around a building to drive fire trucks. In our cities, that seems to be less important, either because it's an old building (no codes) or newer, with fire retardant construction, sprinklers, etc. and too tall for ladders anyway, so setbacks may be smaller, allowing nearly full use of a parcel, especially if it is bounded by streets not other buildings.
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Old 04-14-2024, 08:37 AM   #14
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They were able to place it under the building, which means the footprint on the property didn't have to be much larger than the building itself.

That doesn't seem to be the plan here, and unless snow is going to be removed off-site... they usually require the space.

Middleton-Meredith has that large patch of green lawn that they use when the Big Lake doesn't freeze over to host the Pond Hockey event.

We normally remove the snow to that area. It has pretty extensive drainage system built in below it that carries the water under the Main store and to a streamlet around back leading to the ''duck pond''.
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Old 04-14-2024, 03:00 PM   #15
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Most of those condos will likely be bought by out of staters. Local "workforce" people aren't buying $500k houses or condos.. particularly younger people, they can't afford them. There are several newer condo buildings just down the street from there already, now this new proposal, and then there's the proposal at the weirs circle. Plus whatever they're building at the weirs up on the hill, the eventual development of the state school property, and I'm sure there are several more projects in the works that we haven't heard of yet. This city is getting far too developed for its current infrastructure. Too big for its britches.. Police, fire/EMS, water, sewer, roads etc. There are going to be so many people.. it's already almost impossible to get a table at a restaurant in the summer, traffic is terrible, just too many people and not enough to support them. Same with the lakes too. There are so many people on the lakes, that it's hard to enjoy them. Hell, Laconia doesn't even have a public boat ramp on Winni. Locals who live here year round have a lot of difficulty just trying to enjoy our own resources. The powers that be are ruining this city and they don't even see it. They're too drunk on all of that potential tax money coming in. That's all they care about. Before too long, it's going to be primarily populated by mostly the wealthy and the poor, with none of us middle class people left. Just big expensive houses and condos on one end, and low income housing on the other end. Those of us in the middle are getting squeezed out.
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Old 04-14-2024, 04:26 PM   #16
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None of the projects you listed, except this 50 condo project, and the LSS project, have any workforce housing that was ever associated with the projects. Nothing in the Weirs was ever proposed for workforce housing, Barton's was not promoted to be workforce housing either.

Also, members of the ''workforce'' do not need a public launch on Winnipesaukee. Generations of Laconia natives have lived here... and we never had a public ramp to Winnipesaukee or Winnisquam (that is a more recent development).

I've lived here my whole life and never had a problem enjoying the area.

I miss the Soda Shoppe and South End Diner, but Cafe DejaVu and Water Street Cafe are just as good; and when I want some light dinner fare... South End Pizza & Seafood... a little different than Weeks and the Soda Shoppe; but it works. And I don't over partake in any of this, so waiting in line for a bit on a Sunday morning or a Friday/Saturday night is not really an issue.

The middle class is migrating to the lower class ''workforce'' and higher class ''upper middle''; and the charts show that. The ''powers'' are simply promoting what the residents want. Same with the builders... they build whatever you want.

The problem is attitude. Levittown is a well known example of promoting a middle class lifestyle... 6000 SF lots with 750 SF starter homes.

We have some of those small homes in Laconia right on North Main St. No lake views, no special lake access, no public boating ramp... but you will notice the yards change. Some are well kept with planting of flowers and compact trees... drives with family cars; or sometimes they are in the garage. Those households are being well established, and will most likely move up into the middle class and onward to the upper middle class.

The others... well the move downward will be noticed rather quickly.
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Old 04-14-2024, 06:16 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mercier
... members of the ''workforce'' do not need a public launch on Winnipesaukee. Generations of Laconia natives have lived here... and we never had a public ramp to Winnipesaukee or Winnisquam (that is a more recent development)....
There was a public ramp in Lakeport next to the public dock. It was sold to Irwin Marine and there is now a large steel storage building on the site.
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Old 04-15-2024, 10:00 AM   #18
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Lived here forever and never knew...

Asking developers/builders to lower costs on housing so that you can afford to buy a boat to use a public ramp seems a bit schizophrenic to me.

Even seeking a public boat launch through the City (taxes), while seeking lower housing costs seems at the very least bi-polar.
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Old 04-15-2024, 04:38 PM   #19
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You're way off John. Perhaps you're not understanding people's points completely.

Current housing market prices are directly due to inflation, demand, and high interest rates. None of that is going to change until the market corrects itself when inflation levels lower and interest rates go down. No one is suggesting that builders should lower costs so people can buy a boat and use a public ramp. That statement itself is ridiculous and outlandish. To suggest such a theory actually seems a bit schizo on your part John.

I don't think the desire for a resident-only launch and/or beach on a body of water within the city in which we reside is bi-polar or crazy at all. Why not? Other towns around the lake have them. Try launching your boat at the Glendale launch or going to Gilford beach in the summertime without a town sticker.. Other towns have perks that only their residents get to enjoy, and so should we. Especially for the amount of property taxes we pay to live in this city.

You may want to reconsider how you word your responses when addressing other people's opinions, wishes or desires. Simply because it isn't something you would want, use, or like to see, other people might.
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Old 04-15-2024, 07:29 PM   #20
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Housing prices are always set by demand.
To lower inflation, the FED raises interest rates.

So that is bi-polar.

And the housing crisis was being discussed by Russ Thibeault back in 2000-2006; so nothing really new.

Back then, the discussion focused on how as the City transformed from manufacturing to tourism it would further the crisis.

Laconia made Bond Beach private. But I doubt the other public beaches on Opechee are a driving force in housing prices in the City.

The schizophrenia is the concept that natives should be behaving as tourists. We have plenty of lower cost recreational formats and outlets that allow us to save money and generally enjoy life to a greater aspect.
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