Private Roads

[Shortstop]

Request for clarification as to rules associated with Private Roads;

As I drive down Moultonborough Neck Rd. there are many roads labeled as Private. What exactly does that mean? Should I stay off at all times? I wanted to check out some real-estate for sale at Jonathons Landing and they are listed as Private roads....can I proceed to look at the location as a potential buyer or do I need someones approval? What if I'm just curious to checkout a street to see whats up there (thats labeled Private)?

I'll do what's right. I'm just not sure if that means to stay off at all times, or something else.

[Jonas Pilot]

Good question SS.

[RailroadJoe]

I figure that if there is a sign made by the town for the street, then it should be okay to drive. But who really knows. Unless it says no trespassing I try it.

[Jonas Pilot]

I might do that in the late fall but not this time of year. If the road had a for sale sign at the beginning I'd go down it if I was a prospective buyer.

[RLW]

All it means is that it is an association type of road and is not maintain by the town. Another words it isn't a town road and no it dose not mean for you to stay off of it unless it is a private drive way and not a road way to several homes. This is located all over the place. It may say something like this, Places Mill Road P or PVT that is still a road that you can travel on. Now if it says KEEP OUT and says Places Mill Road P or PVT then one should obey that sign...

[Irrigation Guy]

Originally Posted by RLW

All it means is that it is not maintain by the town.

The town may plow it for now, but that could change and otherwise does not maintain it.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Shortstop

Request for clarification as to rules associated with Private Roads;

As I drive down Moultonborough Neck Rd. there are many roads labeled as Private. What exactly does that mean? Should I stay off at all times? I wanted to check out some real-estate for sale at Jonathons Landing and they are listed as Private roads....can I proceed to look at the location as a potential buyer or do I need someones approval? What if I'm just curious to checkout a street to see whats up there (thats labeled Private)?

I'll do what's right. I'm just not sure if that means to stay off at all times, or something else.

As a potential buyer, I would notify the listing agent that you wish to do a drive by. If it is a road with multiple houses it may be ok, but if it is private marked on a driveway I would stay out. Some people, although selling, dont like drive bys. I did one a few months back in Wolfeboro up on Martin Hill and was greeted by a crazed pitbull and an even more crazed teen that chased us away in a rednecked out 4x4. He chased us all the way into Brookfield, hinking, flashing, motioning, etc. The road and property was not posted at all, and had a for sale sign up.

I was in a new escalade, kids in the back seat watching Curious George and all. Its not like we looked like hoodlums casing the joint. A nasty call to the broker was made promptly after.

[Mirror Lake's BB]

Last summer, Sargent Jim Hathcock was at our cottage 'removing' a sick raccoon for us (he even took the deceased animal away for us). We then asked him that exact question as we live on a road with a sign that says 'Private Road.' He said that anyone has the right to travel over these roads, they don't have to live in one of the houses on the road. The only exception he said is a gated community.

[P-3 Guy]

I live at the end of a 1/4 mile private road that's shared with four other property owners. The town put up a street sign at the beginning of our road (where it meets the public road) for 911 purposes, but it's a different color than the street signs for public roads, designating our road as private. In addition, we have put a "Private Road" sign on the post below the street sign.

My feeling is, anyone who has legitimate business is welcome on our road. Package delivery, visiting a friend, etc. This would include driving in to look at a home that was listed for sale, if you were really in the market to buy and this particular location and description looked promising. But please, don't drive in "just to see what's there." While we're not antisocial, we enjoy our privacy and the relative quiet of living on a private road. Private funds were used to build the road and the five homeowners share the cost of maintaining it, and the less vehicle traffic the better.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Mirror Lake's BB

Last summer, Det. Hughes was at our cottage 'removing' a sick raccoon for us (he even took the deceased animal away for us). We then asked him that exact question as we live on a road with a sign that says 'Private Road.' He said that anyone has the right to travel over these roads, they don't have to live in one of the houses on the road. The only exception he said is a gated community.

If the road is built on private property, I have a hard time believing that's true. And if the road is on private property, what's to prevent the owners form putting up a gate and becoming a gated community? Or, more practically, putting up No Trespassing signs? Just because private property has a road on it doesn't mean that everyone "has a right" to use the road.

[kjkam]

We have a house on a private road in laconia, the road is posted, and there is a gate, but we don't close it. To me a private road is just that, legimate business aside, it's meant to be used by those that pay to maintain it, (paving, snow plowing, clearing of trees). As others have said, if you have business there, by all means use the road, but it is meant to maintain a certain amount of privacy.

[RLW]

Originally Posted by LocalRealtor

The town may plow it for now, but that could change and otherwise does not maintain it.

You are extremely lucky to have the town plow the roads. Wait until the towns people see it as many towns have and it will come to a stop as the towns people do not, I repeat do not want the town to plow private roadways with their tax dollars as they have not been accepted by the towns people at a town meeting and built to towns specification and if they have then the town would have accepted them. Just a point of view, not for arguing.

[DPatnaude]

Originally Posted by RLW

You are extremely lucky to have the town plow the roads. Wait until the towns people see it as many towns have and it will come to a stop as the towns people do not, I repeat do not want the town to plow private roadways with their tax dollars

The property owners on the private roads are also tax payers. Many are also not year round residents, so the few tax dollar benefits are plowing and emergency services.

[Mirror Lake's BB]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

If the road is built on private property, I have a hard time believing that's true. And if the road is on private property, what's to prevent the owners form putting up a gate and becoming a gated community? Or, more practically, putting up No Trespassing signs? Just because private property has a road on it doesn't mean that everyone "has a right" to use the road.

We are just repeating what we have been told. In reality, I would think that the right of use would be spelled out in the easement description in the deeds of the properties that the private road occupies. I imagine the Sargent may have tried giving a simple answer which actually may be more complicated and specific to the particular road.

I imagine someone on the forum will have the answer as there are many private roads in the area.

[Kamper]

Another interpretation of "Private Road" is pass at your own risk. While not haivng the same imperative as "POSTED" or "No Trespassing," I have considerred this advisory to be a request for privacy and don't travel on them unless I have a valid reason too.

[ChocolateGypsy]

Before the signs were put up, we'd have problems with "young drivers" using our driveway as a "short cut..." thinking it was just another road... come around the corner too fast and... SMASH! (Surprise! Backhoe.)

Just be aware that if you go down a private road, you may have some explaining to do.

[Newbiesaukee]

so knowledgable, it is surprising to me that no one seems to know the real answer. Courtesy-wise, not a tough call..but what is LEGALLY correct?

[BroadHopper]

A private road is own by the association or an individual. Unless it is posted No trespassing, it should not be used by the general public.

Private roads technically are not maintained by govt. It is up to the owner to keep it in good shape and plowed. I've heard of private roads plowed by the towns, there is no law against it.

If you have private access with a locked gate, the fire, police dept may require that you leave a key in case of emergency.

If you get into an accident on a private road, police generally do not step in unless both parties required. Technically laws like speeding, DUI etc. are not effective on a private road, you travel at your own risk. I have heard of insurance companies that will not cover a claim if you are on a private road.

[Mirror Lake's BB]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

Unless it is posted No trespassing, it should not be used by the general public.

Wouldn't "no trespassing" inherently mean that "it should not be used by the general public"? Unless I'm having a problem understanding what you are trying to say, the way you word it, it would be no trespassing whether posted or not.

???

I agree with Newbiesaukee, there must be someone out there that knows what is legally correct.

[Irrigation Guy]

Originally Posted by Newbiesaukee

so knowledgable, it is surprising to me that no one seems to know the real answer. Courtesy-wise, not a tough call..but what is LEGALLY correct?

FYI -

TITLE LXII
CRIMINAL CODE

CHAPTER 635
UNAUTHORIZED ENTRIES

Section 635:4

635:4 Prescribed Manner of Posting. – A person may post his land to prohibit criminal trespass and physical activities by posting signs of durable material with any words describing the physical activity prohibited, such as "No Hunting or Trespassing'', printed with block letters no less than 2 inches in height, and with the name and address of the owner or lessee of such land. Such signs shall be posted not more than 100 yards apart on all sides and shall also be posted at gates, bars and commonly used entrances. This section shall not prevent any owner from adding to the language required by this section.
Source. 1977, 284:1, eff. Aug. 21, 1977.

[GM doc]

Has anyone contacted Ward Bird for his 2cents?

[Newbiesaukee]

but does not answer OP's question of the green "official" street signs on Moultonborough Neck and Long Island stating "private" road, but not posted as no trespassing.

[ishoot308]

Here's the answer to shortstop's question. Absolutely no problem going down the roads at Jonathans Landing to check out real estate. Just don't ring peoples doorbells or walk on their property. Been there many times in the past doing the same thing.

BTW, Jonathan's Landing is a nice place!!

Good Luck!

Dan

[Irrigation Guy]

Originally Posted by Newbiesaukee

but does not answer OP's question of the green "official" street signs on Moultonborough Neck and Long Island stating "private" road, but not posted no trespassing.

See answer below. The signs are really a road standard thing with the Federal Highway Administration and were upgraded within the past couple years.

Originally Posted by LocalRealtor

The town may plow it for now, but that could change and otherwise does not maintain it.

[Slickcraft]

Several years ago Alton completed a 911 related street naming and house numbering project. All streets public and private received green signs paid for by the Town and installed by the Highway Dept.

The sole purpose of installing the green signs at the beginning of private roads is to identify the road location for 911 related responding emergency vehicles. Every effort was made to physically locate the signs on public right of way just prior to the beginning of the private road.

The presence of the green sign at the beginning of a private road is in no way intended to speak to the existence or non-existence of any public right to pass.

[Newbiesaukee]

So, as long as it is not posted "No Trespassing," or other specific terms as described in the reference previously cited, then there is no legal restriction to driving on roads labeled private. Is this correct? I seem to be a little dense about this.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Newbiesaukee

So, as long as it is not posted "No Trespassing," or other specific terms as described in the reference previously cited, then there is no legal restriction to driving on roads labeled private. Is this correct? I seem to be a little dense about this.

Sure, you can drive down a road marked as "Private," but you don't have a legal right to be there, as you would on a public road. If the land owner sees you and asks you to leave, you are legally obligated to do so, or you could potentially face trespassing charges.

But remember, there's a reason that the road has been marked as "Private," and it's usually because the land owner values his/her privacy. Be respectful and stay off of private roads, unless you have legitimate business in being there.

[Newbiesaukee]

We have both posted on this thread and your answer is a little different from what others have said regarding ones legal right to drive on the roads on Moultonborough Neck and Long Island which are "official" green signs with the name of the road and "pvt road" written on them ( this was the original question). I live on a private dirt road and I would not, as a courtesy, drive on something labeled private. But, the assertion has been made that it IS legal to drive on roads labeled private without more specific proscription. I guess you can lead a horse to water or beat it to death but you may not be able to get a definitive answer. I appreciate the effort made to enlighten me, however.

[jrc]

We've had the trespassing discussion in gory detail before and I think it applies here. For reference look up RSA 635:2 Criminal Trespass.

To be in violation of this law you need to know your not supposed to be there. A "No Trespassing" sign is pretty clear, a land owner telling you to leave is pretty clear, a fence or gate is pretty clear, but is a sign saying "Private Road" clear?

My driveway is wooded and long enough to look like a road to some people, my sign says "Private Driveway, No Trespassing" It doesn't stop everyone, plenty of people come up to the house and turn around.

Personally, I would avoid driving past a "Private" anything sign unless I had business there.

[Heaven]

The "Private" sign only indicates that the road is not owned by the Town. It isn't an indication of who has the right-of-way across the underlying ownership of the land. That info will be in the deeds and legal paperwork. Every "private" road will be different. Some will be deeded as public access ROW, some will be deeded to particular individual property owners.

[jrc]

Ok here is a fun example of trespassing laws at work. If you are asked to leave jail and you don't they can arrest you for trespassing and put you in jail.

http://www.myfoxdc.com/story/1911001...obref=obinsite

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Newbiesaukee

We have both posted on this thread and your answer is a little different from what others have said regarding ones legal right to drive on the roads on Moultonborough Neck and Long Island which are "official" green signs with the name of the road and "pvt road" written on them ( this was the original question). I live on a private dirt road and I would not, as a courtesy, drive on something labeled private. But, the assertion has been made that it IS legal to drive on roads labeled private without more specific proscription. I guess you can lead a horse to water or beat it to death but you may not be able to get a definitive answer. I appreciate the effort made to enlighten me, however.

"Others" in this thread have said they figure that if there is a sign made by the town for the street, then it should be okay to drive, which is not true. Towns make and place signs for private roads primarily to assist first responders in getting to emergency locations. The addition of the words "Private Road," whether placed there by the town or the land owner, is an indication that the public does not have the same right of access as on a public road.

You will likely not find a specific proscription in the law for travel by the general public on private roads; general laws of property rights and trespass would apply.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Heaven

The "Private" sign only indicates that the road is not owned by the Town. It isn't an indication of who has the right-of-way across the underlying ownership of the land. That info will be in the deeds and legal paperwork. Every "private" road will be different. Some will be deeded as public access ROW, some will be deeded to particular individual property owners.

The "Private" sign is an indication that there is no right to access by the public at large. Those who have specific rights to use the road, either through an ownership interest or through deeded access, presumably know who they are.

[Heaven]

Originally Posted by TMI Guy

The "Private" sign is an indication that there is no right to access by the public at large. Those who have specific rights to use the road, either through an ownership interest or through deeded access, presumably know who they are.

A "town" road sign indicating "pvt" is no indication at all of who has rights to pass.

[ITD]

Just remember to stay off my lawn.

[P-3 Guy]

Originally Posted by Heaven

A "town" road sign indicating "pvt" is no indication at all of who has rights to pass.

You're right; it's not an indication of who has the right to pass. It's an indication of who doesn't have the right to pass, and that would be those who don't have a legal interest in the property, either through ownership rights or some other conveyance.

If I'm driving along a public road and I see an unfamiliar side road marked with a town road sign and the word "Private," I probably don't know who has the legal right to use that private road, but I'm pretty sure of one thing: I don't have the legal right to go down that road.

[Winnisquamguy]

Are police officers allowed to patrol a private rd.?

[SIKSUKR]

More importantly,can the ice cream truck drive through!

[Lakepilot]

Private roads are not paid for by the town. They are paved, plowed and maintained by the owners of the road. We have a house on a private road. We would like it to be taken over by the town, but they don't want the expense of maintaining it.

There is a lot of wear and tear on the road, especially when driven on during the winter or mud season. All that wear and tear is paid for by private owners.

If you want to drive on a private road ask the town to accept it and maintain it.

[SAB1]

Association roads are marked private as mentioned above becuase they typically are meant for members and guests. Members pay for the maintenance, insurance and taxes on the private land. In discussions with your insurance company, you will likely find out, as I did, that signage should be posted on the road indicating speed limit and also that the road is for members and guests of members only to minimize liability.

[nj2nh]

I am a lawyer and have no idea as to the official answer to t his question, but then we don't have that many private roads in Jersey.

We have a house on a private road in Alton that is at the end of a public road. The town does not pave or plow it. We have to pay the association to have that done. On the other hand, when we stayed on the public part of the road (we moved later on), I would never walk down on to the private part. Private there meant keep out, but there was also a really big sign to alert us that it was private. That sign is long gone.