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Old 10-09-2016, 04:19 PM   #1
Descant
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Default Friendly rocks for future generations

The kids closed camp today, third and fourth generation, and they sent pictures of the low water. Some of these rocks that they (grandchildren) haven't fully seen before, I recall playing on as a kid. Some were never fully exposed during my kid's lifetimes (they have many decades to go), but grandchildren will recognize them sometime in the future. (I hope the lake will fill up and it will be many years from now.)

"Through the channel and over the waves to Grandmother's camp we go..."

We're closed now, so no holiday meals at Grandma's camp, but camp is a stabilizing place in several families, including ours from Texas, MA and NH and our neighbors whose extended family comes to the island from Long Island, Baltimore and Hawaii as well as Maine. Both families have been on the island for over 60 years and share all sorts of family events.

For you young islanders, make plans now to keep the family camp in the family. There will be a time when you are too old, or have lost interest, and want to sell. Your kids can't afford it. Ten years after that, you'll all reminisce and the kids will say, "I wish we still had the camp because we could never afford to buy one now, and it was so great growing up on the island".
(Unsolicited advice from an old f*rt.)

Thanks for your understanding of my year end thoughts, and appreciation for past generations.
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Old 10-10-2016, 07:15 AM   #2
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Default End of the season

Boys of Summer
Don Henley

Nobody on the road,
Nobody on the beach
I feel it in the air
The summer's out of reach
Empty lake, empty streets
The sun goes down alone
I'm driving by your house
Don't know you're not home
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Old 10-11-2016, 05:49 PM   #3
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Nice read. We lost our place in Moultonborough nearly 3 years ago. My grandparents passed and some family wanted to cash in and run. They would not work with my immediate family on the price to help make it happen, so the house with 50 years worth of memories was sold. As a result, we have a few less Christmas cards to mail every year..

Thankfully, we have a new place on Hermit Lake and we're making great new memories. These places are not just houses. These "camps" or "uppa lake" as we call it are special.
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Old 10-11-2016, 07:29 PM   #4
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I also am seeing rocks and expanse of beach that I have not seen since I was a kid. Glad to have old pictures to reinforce my memories. We are also a 4.5 generation camp and would love to correspond with other long timers about your strategies that make that work. PM me!
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Old 10-12-2016, 12:24 AM   #5
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Wanna keep that Winni camp in the family?

Set up a trust.
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Old 10-12-2016, 10:07 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. V View Post
Wanna keep that Winni camp in the family?

Set up a trust.
The feedback I'm getting relates more to management than to methods ownership.

Example:
Parents= first owners, bought it when they were 50+. They now spend more time in FL than NH and no longer want to spend summers "painting the porch and waxing the boat." They love camp and having grandchildren visit.
Maybe they want to sell the camp to the kids to better fund retirement plans.

"Set up a trust" doesn't address management, financial contributions, unexpected assessments, who does camp or boat maintenance, etc. Can we just endow a trust? Where would that money come from?
And parents who are 80 may not have done estate planning and are now afraid to do something that will treat children unequally.

Our example:
Thirty years ago, we transferred ownership to a Realty Trust. The "Grantor" was 82. Two children and three grandchildren were equal shareholders. Grampa continued to pay bills for 5 years as the trust was unfunded. Taxes were the biggest bill. Still are. When both of the original owners passed, the now adult five shareholders agreed to a long term funding plan. That plan will take a while longer to fully implement. In the interim, we all chipped in for some major maintenance that we expect will not have to be done again for another 30-50 years (breakwater re-set).

So, not an instantaneous process, but a gradual transition.

Rules to live by:

If it breaks while you're here, you fix it.
Last person to use the boat fills the tank.

What do you do?
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Old 10-12-2016, 11:04 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. V View Post
Wanna keep that Winni camp in the family?

Set up a trust.
Well trusts help they don't always prevent the eventual sale....

They keep property from being taken forcefully..... Which is why ours is in a trust...

But make no mistake, should my mother require care down the road, that can't be afford with out selling the camp... It will be sold trust or no trust.....

If my siblings can't afford to help with Taxes and up keep we may in the end need to sell...trust or no trust

No one knows what the future holds... and sometimes unforeseeable circumstances force our hands....
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Old 10-12-2016, 06:33 PM   #8
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My mom and her siblings are the 7th generation to own our family camp. Over the 202 year history the majority of the original 200 acre parcel on Moultonboro Neck has been sold off, with the 6th generation being the last to sell off parcels. All of my grandfather's siblings sold their parcels in the 60s, and that is why he inherited the house in an effort to maintain ownership in the family.

The current generation of owners pay monthly dues that are deposited to a camp fund and all expenses are paid out of the camp checking account. Cleaning products, paper products, etc., are generally replaced as needed by whomever happens to be at camp at the time. Anything to do with maintenance, gas for the lawn mower, propane for the grill, etc., is paid for from the camp checking account. The siblings are each given a guaranteed 2 weeks to reserve the camp for themselves and guests but holiday weekends/weeks are not able to be reserved so that anyone can use it for the holiday, but it might mean pitching a tent. In reality, most owners don't mind a sibling, niece, nephews, etc, joining them for a weekend so reserving isn't a big deal. Most are of the 'more the merrier' mentality. It is required that a sibling owner be present for overnight stays, which can sometimes be a sticking point for the next generation.

We pick an opening and closing day well ahead of time so that as many people that can come help do. We do the same for "work days" if we have a larger project to tackle. Usually if someone can't make a work day they will do something like wash all the windows the last time they are there for the season.

There is a checklist to go through before departing camp so that it is ready for the next person to arrive. Fairly basic tasks that include cleaning, bedding, what to turn off, what to leave on, etc.

All in all, we have experienced relatively minor conflicts over the last 20 years since my mom and her siblings have been the owners, but they do arise from time to time, but thankfully they have been resolved fairly simply.

Last edited by mneck1814; 10-12-2016 at 09:53 PM.
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Old 10-12-2016, 08:58 PM   #9
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Default to Mneck 1814

Good info, and some good habits that we may discuss/incorporate.
After seven generations, there must be some major upgraders, e.g. plumbing and electricity. How were these handled?
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Old 10-12-2016, 09:27 PM   #10
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Lakefront property in family since 1777. Divided in numerous ways since then. At some point, Diamond Island sold off. Things got hairy along the way on several occasions. What remains now almost solely in hands of one line of the family, who are great custodians of the property. We visit when we can.
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Old 10-12-2016, 09:49 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Descant View Post
Good info, and some good habits that we may discuss/incorporate.
After seven generations, there must be some major upgraders, e.g. plumbing and electricity. How were these handled?
There certainly have been some big changes, an interior renovation was done sometime in the 1940s that is mostly intact today. Indoor plumbing was added in 1971 when my grandparents inherited it. The 4th bedroom was converted to a bathroom and the hand pump in the back yard was traded in for an artesian well.

Before my grandmother gave the house to her kids in 1996 she completed a significant amount of renovations and upgrades in the 3 years prior. She had electrical service updated, replaced the well pump, put on a new metal roof, replaced all of the windows, replaced the siding and trim and had a bit of foundation and sill work done. She wanted to ensure that the maintenance would not be a financial burden on her children. Since then, the owners usually pick a project or upgrade to complete each year that is budgeted through the camp fund.
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Old 10-13-2016, 10:20 AM   #12
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This is an excellent and informative thread. Even though I don't own lakefront property I am very interested in family histories on the lake. On our annual sailing trip around the lake we try to meet people who have history and can tell us about it in person. Hopefully next year we can meet more of you.

P.S. I'll never forget the soap dish that has become part of the bark on a lakeside tree over at "Pine Needles" place. (Bathing in the lake days)
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Old 10-13-2016, 01:51 PM   #13
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Smile Friendly rocks for future generations

Savor what you have. You don't know what you got 'til its gone.
The "cottage" purchased by one of my uncles in the late fifties was always sanctuary for all three of our families, June, July, and August!
In 2008 I watched in the driveway of the property it being unceremoniously auctioned away. My uncle's "younger" 2nd wife had other thoughts about what the "cottage" represented to her. There isn't a day that goes by that I don't reminisce about that spot of paradise facing Diamond Island. I go by it in my boat with a heavy heart full of wonderful, wonderful memories, but am happy to see others now enjoying what I was a part of for almost 52 years.
Particularly happy most of my kids had the opportunity to be at the "cottage" with their Nan, my Mom. That no one can take away!

Cut my RH fingers off for the spot at the head of Cow Island.
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Old 10-13-2016, 08:38 PM   #14
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Default Everybody "helps"

Managing equal duties: Years ago, I/we spent a weekend closing up and sometimes a second day shutting down the water system. Reverse in the spring but the first 3-4 weekends were cleaning windows, etc. if the plumbing worked.
Now, closing means we move the deck furniture inside and call Island Support Services. In the spring, they turn on the water, clean the windows, move the deck furniture, shampoo carpet etc. We gain an extra 3-4 weekends of "lake" time instead of 3-4 weekends of cleaning time. Family who use the camp but live a long way away and can't do open or close are happy to write a check for their share. It makes us all participate equally instead of some of us doing all the work. Love those guys and gals at ISS. This change has eliminated a lot of family discussions about who does what and how much. Now family discussions can revolve around who watches the (grand)kids play in the water and who makes hors d'oeuvres. Much better plan for "vacation".
Of course, in a few years there will be no grand memories of crawling around under the building with the spiders with a blow torch trying to patch split pipes. I guess we all will have to make sacrifices. (Hmmm. Not as many split pipes anymore either. Must be the global warming.)
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Old 10-19-2016, 12:35 PM   #15
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Our house in Green's Basin was built in 1936. There wasn't a road to the area back then so all the building supplies were brought over on the ice. We went by boat to the place when we were growing up. We didn't have any running water. We used a hand pump that brought water in from the lake. We had propane for cooking and our lights were run by propane also.
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