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Old 03-18-2020, 04:37 PM   #1
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Default Winni derby

What are everyone’s thoughts on “the powers they be” that run the winni derby coming up soon?
In my opinion, I think an event of this type and magnitude should definitely be CANCELLED!
This event brings many from out of state to the lakes region (lake Winnipesaukee, specifically) to fish it’s waters in search of landlocked salmon and other species. Will the Chinese coronavirus be propagated by the influx of people coming here from who knows where?
That in itself is good reason to cancel the event. Never mind the damage it does to the LLS fishery where many salmon are caught, wounded, handled poorly before being released because of being under legal size.
Thoughts?
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Old 03-18-2020, 07:01 PM   #2
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While the language used indicate that your desire to cancel the derby transcends any risk of this virus....the virus does give a compelling and legit excuse to move that agenda forward. Rather than dig up the old argument of whether or not to have a derby for which neither side of the argument will change their minds...lets focus on the issue at hand...the virus.

Scouts of America who run the event have already suspended all scouting activities such as local weekly meetings, district round tables and camping event...they haven't moved on the derby yet. There is already a decent number of participants who have paid and returning money is something they would want to avoid. Sponsors have also probably been acquired and committed and many attendees have reserved rentals and sunk dollars into the local economy in preparation.

Then of course there are local businesses (the original draw for local support of this event). Those businesses are mostly small businesses who are now and will continue to struggle. Removing this and other events like bike week will pull yet further funds out of the lakes region.

So the risk. If its risky to fish...its risky to fish. Should NH Fish and Game cancel fishing season? So this now boils down to the end of day awards and the kick off BBQ events. They could work around those by removing the need to be in attendance to receive your prize. Otherwise if they insist on mandatory attendance to these then yes...the risk of close personal contact with hundreds of sportsmen suggests the event should and probably will be cancelled. Scouting is very risk adverse. I imagine they are postponing a tough decision in hopes that the hysteria dies out or the curve significantly flattens (not a bad choice). I don't think they want to face a choice of "cancel gatherings or cancel the event" but it may come to that.

Here's my plan if it runs. If I'm top 3 I would show at the awards. I will not go to the awards for a hat or tee-shirt or even a rod/reel combo. I bet many feel the same way. That would mean probably less than 50 people attend awards and that greatly reduces risk. They could also consolidate prizes for less but more expensive prizes to reduce gathering attendance. Holding these awards ceremonies outside would also reduce risk.

While I clearly support the event, I don't think it should be run without severe risk mitigation. I would hate to see the politics of this virus be used to push the agenda of a group of anti-derby supporters.
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Old 03-18-2020, 07:03 PM   #3
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I think the Winni Derby that get's held in May should be postponed to the first week in February and held simultaneously with the ice fishing derby. If you think about it, this really makes a lot of sense, especially for the local hospitality businesses.
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Old 03-18-2020, 08:42 PM   #4
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While the language used indicate that your desire to cancel the derby transcends any risk of this virus....the virus does give a compelling and legit excuse to move that agenda forward. Rather than dig up the old argument of whether or not to have a derby for which neither side of the argument will change their minds...lets focus on the issue at hand...the virus.

Scouts of America who run the event have already suspended all scouting activities such as local weekly meetings, district round tables and camping event...they haven't moved on the derby yet. There is already a decent number of participants who have paid and returning money is something they would want to avoid. Sponsors have also probably been acquired and committed and many attendees have reserved rentals and sunk dollars into the local economy in preparation.

Then of course there are local businesses (the original draw for local support of this event). Those businesses are mostly small businesses who are now and will continue to struggle. Removing this and other events like bike week will pull yet further funds out of the lakes region.

So the risk. If its risky to fish...its risky to fish. Should NH Fish and Game cancel fishing season? So this now boils down to the end of day awards and the kick off BBQ events. They could work around those by removing the need to be in attendance to receive your prize. Otherwise if they insist on mandatory attendance to these then yes...the risk of close personal contact with hundreds of sportsmen suggests the event should and probably will be cancelled. Scouting is very risk adverse. I imagine they are postponing a tough decision in hopes that the hysteria dies out or the curve significantly flattens (not a bad choice). I don't think they want to face a choice of "cancel gatherings or cancel the event" but it may come to that.

Here's my plan if it runs. If I'm top 3 I would show at the awards. I will not go to the awards for a hat or tee-shirt or even a rod/reel combo. I bet many feel the same way. That would mean probably less than 50 people attend awards and that greatly reduces risk. They could also consolidate prizes for less but more expensive prizes to reduce gathering attendance. Holding these awards ceremonies outside would also reduce risk.

While I clearly support the event, I don't think it should be run without severe risk mitigation. I would hate to see the politics of this virus be used to push the agenda of a group of anti-derby supporters.
Gee...how could you tell that I don't approve of the derby...any derby?
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Old 03-18-2020, 08:45 PM   #5
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I think the Winni Derby that get's held in May should be postponed to the first week in February and held simultaneously with the ice fishing derby. If you think about it, this really makes a lot of sense, especially for the local hospitality businesses.
Can't happen...as the prime candidate of fish species is landlocked salmon and they cannot be taken through the ice...only from April 1 to Sept 30.
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Old 03-18-2020, 09:30 PM   #6
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I hate to see anyones opportunities to competitively fish dimininised. Even though this is not my favorite fish species to fish for and might seem selfish to speak about it. But I have fond memories of talking with Bill Martel (RIP) and how great the fishing was years ago, especially after WWII , gas rationing, and most guys fighting overseas. With the curent events of the past few days I don't think it would hurt to hold it back a year. I would not be a opposed to it either, but it just might be the trigger/excuse to help the fish recover a little. I'll defer to the experts on this species and let them decide what they feel is best. As mentioned I too would hate to see the politics of this virus be used to push the agenda of a group of anti-derby supporters.


Side note @ Hillcountry thanks for the recent nice photos the past few weeks even though they were not bass.
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Old 03-19-2020, 08:59 AM   #7
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they should cancel the winni derby for the next 2-3 years or so. the salmon population in the lake is in trouble. we're missing an entire age structure of fish due to poor stocking practices. the salmon population needs a few years to recover. it wouldn't break my heart at all if they did away with the derby altogether. we'd have much bigger and better fish, like champlain or sebago.

they could always change the event to exclude salmon and make rock bass the targeted species. rock bass are taking over the lake and need some serious culling. and they're super easy to fish for and catch. no boat needed, no fancy specific tackle or gear needed. whoever brings in the most rock bass wins. if we had hundreds of people hauling in buckets of rock bass, that would put a good dent in their population.
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Old 03-19-2020, 09:02 AM   #8
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Without a doubt .......... I could support that.

As I'm sure you know they have done similar things on Lake Sunapee with reported sucess.

As mentionrd above ROCK BASS:: they're super easy to fish for and catch. no boat needed, no fancy specific tackle or gear needed. whoever brings in the most rock bass wins. if we had hundreds of people hauling in buckets of rock bass, that would put a good dent in their population.


Acording to member APS ..... they are good eating.
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Old 03-19-2020, 12:48 PM   #9
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I 100% agree that if all parties agree that the salmon population is in trouble then something should be done. However that burden shouldn’t fall on a very small portion of those impacting the fishery. Fish and Game should make the entire lake for all anglers catch and release only. That includes the meat fishermen and the guides.

We’ve moved away from the original point of closing the derby because of the virus to closing it because it kills fish so the root point of this thread is now very clear...the original poster just wants the derby to go away.
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Old 03-19-2020, 02:30 PM   #10
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I 100% agree that if all parties agree that the salmon population is in trouble then something should be done. However that burden shouldn’t fall on a very small portion of those impacting the fishery. Fish and Game should make the entire lake for all anglers catch and release only. That includes the meat fishermen and the guides.

We’ve moved away from the original point of closing the derby because of the virus to closing it because it kills fish so the root point of this thread is now very clear...the original poster just wants the derby to go away.
I absolutely do want the derbies to “go away” and I make no bones about my view, for all to see, as well.
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Old 03-19-2020, 03:40 PM   #11
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I absolutely do want the derbies to “go away” and I make no bones about my view, for all to see, as well.
Thank you for making your position crystal clear, however what could be done to maybe have something to look forward too. Keep in mind I have no skin in this I don't fish tournaments any more and never fish for meat other than killing rock bass and feeding the lobsters.
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Old 03-19-2020, 03:55 PM   #12
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Thank you for making your position crystal clear, however what could be done to maybe have something to look forward too. Keep in mind I have no skin in this I don't fish tournaments any more and never fish for meat other than killing rock bass and feeding the lobsters.
I think we can all look forward to getting through this crisis as unscathed as possible. Fishing will be secondary to keeping my family and myself virus free and healthy. I do, however, like the rock bass tournament idea and would support it if pursued. Unfortunately, I don’t think it would happen.
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Old 03-19-2020, 04:03 PM   #13
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I would like to see them target Lake Trout (not rainbows) as the main prize fish for a year or two. Targeting lakers would certainly be fishing opposite waters of where salmon would be in May. There is certainly plenty (too many!) of lake trout in the lake. A culling of lakers would do the lake some good!

They could have a separate or youth class for Rock Bass. Doing this would be a win / win for everyone...The derby is still a go and for the most part the salmon waters would be mostly unscathed...yes some will still be caught but certainly not like a targeted prize fish would be.

Just my thoughts...

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Old 03-19-2020, 04:34 PM   #14
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I would like to see them target Lake Trout (not rainbows) as the main prize fish for a year or two. Targeting lakers would certainly be fishing opposite waters of where salmon would be in May. There is certainly plenty (too many!) of lake trout in the lake. A culling of lakers would do the lake some good!

They could have a separate or youth class for Rock Bass. Doing this would be a win / win for everyone...The derby is still a go and for the most part the salmon waters would be mostly unscathed...yes some will still be caught but certainly not like a targeted prize fish would be.

Just my thoughts...

Dan
Thank you some really good thoughts Dan. What ever is done I think you would find most fisherpeople will support it, if it it is something for the fishermen, by the fishermen. Having a youth aspect and a somewhat traditional apspect I think would help make it a possible success .
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Old 04-06-2020, 01:24 PM   #15
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Just wondering if there is any updates on the derby? I imagine it's probably not going to happen.

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Old 04-09-2020, 07:12 AM   #16
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If organizers want to cancel it it's their prerogative, but I think it should go on with some common sense rules, like keep 6' apart.

It's outdoors and there's something to be said for carrying on with life and the things that make life worth living. Can't live in fear all the time. Just use common sense.
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Old 04-09-2020, 10:00 AM   #17
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If organizers want to cancel it it's their prerogative, but I think it should go on with some common sense rules, like keep 6' apart.

It's outdoors and there's something to be said for carrying on with life and the things that make life worth living. Can't live in fear all the time. Just use common sense.
Crowds and an influx of fishermen/contestants to the lake do not bode well for what the country is going through...if we're still under a "stay at home" order how can it take place?
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Old 04-09-2020, 07:58 PM   #18
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Default NHF&G Covid19

Based on what F&G is doing I highly doubt the derby will happen.

https://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/about/covid19.html

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Old 04-09-2020, 09:30 PM   #19
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Based on what F&G is doing I highly doubt the derby will happen.

https://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/about/covid19.html

Dan
I seen the same thing. I'm guessing this will kill all the early season tournaments includung bass tournaments.
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Old 04-09-2020, 09:31 PM   #20
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I seen the same thing. I'm guessing this will kill all the early season tournaments includung bass tournaments.
That would be my assumption also Top...

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Old 04-09-2020, 09:42 PM   #21
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May not be a bad thing, Especially with the poor salmon fisihing that is being reported by you guys that fish them.

My self I don't fish during the spawn for bass. There is simply no sport in it.

Don't get me wrong ........ I wiill look ...... but I rarley will throw a bait and if I do throw a bait ....... its usually something I never used before just to test it out.
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Old 04-10-2020, 09:45 AM   #22
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fine with me if they do cancel it, i hope they do. they should anyway just for the sake of the salmon.
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Old 04-10-2020, 10:32 AM   #23
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fine with me if they do cancel it, i hope they do. they should anyway just for the sake of the salmon.
Me too!
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Old 04-10-2020, 01:10 PM   #24
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Default 2020 Winni Derby Officially Cancelled

Just got my email from the Derby and it has been Cancelled for 2020
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Old 04-10-2020, 02:39 PM   #25
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Some will be happy and some unhappy with the derby cancel. It certainly will impact many businesses in the lakes region. With the gov closing all hotels until May 4 and risk of it going longer, the cancel made sense and had nothing to do with fishing quality. Personally, the quality of the fishing this year has been superior. All I’m catching is 4 and 5 year olds and definitely the largest salmon I’ve ever taken.

Since I already rented my house for the weekend...I’m still fishing that entire
Weekend. The fishing should be better than it is during a derby year with less boats on the water. Now if this wind would only die down so I can get out a few more times before mid May...
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Old 04-10-2020, 03:58 PM   #26
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Some will be happy and some unhappy with the derby cancel. It certainly will impact many businesses in the lakes region. With the gov closing all hotels until May 4 and risk of it going longer, the cancel made sense and had nothing to do with fishing quality. Personally, the quality of the fishing this year has been superior. All I’m catching is 4 and 5 year olds and definitely the largest salmon I’ve ever taken.

Since I already rented my house for the weekend...I’m still fishing that entire
Weekend. The fishing should be better than it is during a derby year with less boats on the water. Now if this wind would only die down so I can get out a few more times before mid May...
Agree on the 5 year old salmon. They are absolutely beautiful! The days of catching double digit salmon will be gone for a while but if you put your time in, the fish you do catch are beautiful.

In 2-3 years Winni will be a fantastic fishery!

Dan
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Old 04-13-2020, 10:54 AM   #27
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Agree on the 5 year old salmon. They are absolutely beautiful! The days of catching double digit salmon will be gone for a while but if you put your time in, the fish you do catch are beautiful.

In 2-3 years Winni will be a fantastic fishery!

Dan
You guys are killing me... Pictures of these 4 and 5 year olds please!
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Old 04-13-2020, 12:54 PM   #28
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Here’s one from last season... No boat this season...yet.
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Old 04-18-2020, 10:55 AM   #29
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I am disappointed but also glad they are cancelling the derby. I think its the right thing to do. I did not have very much luck fishing salmon last summer and hope that the lack of pressure from the derby gives the salmon a deserved break, and will improve fishing this summer. I do feel for the Naswa where I stay every year and the other resorts that lose their income.
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Old 04-20-2020, 08:44 AM   #30
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While I don't want the conversation to turn ugly, I just get frustrated when so many feel like this: "that the lack of pressure from the derby gives the salmon a deserved break".

There is no question that putting 1000 boats on the water for a single weekend targeting salmon from daybreak to sunset puts a LOT of pressure on the fish. Anyone fishing in the weeks following the derby will support that assertion.

However, I talking to some of the organizers (and if you don't believe me - speak to them yourself) about how many fish are brought to the weigh station...his answer was "hundreds" as in 300-ish he said was a good estimate.

Now if you follow Winni trolling boards as I do, you see that the overwhelming majoring of anglers are taking home their limits of these beautiful 4-6 year old monster salmon this year. If we do some simple deductive math we get this:
-100 anglers on the lake each weekend day bringing home a limit (legally and ethically). That's 400 salmon a weekend (probably less because weather keeps some off...lets just cut it in half...200 salmon a weekend.
-6 weeks leading up to the derby would be 1200 salmon lifted out of the lake and filleted....just before the derby. Lets not count how many more are killed from June-Oct.

If we accept these number as reasonable...how can we suggest the derby is a major factor in the salmon numbers?

Hook wounded fish need to go home. They are a drain on the resource and need to be harvested but I'm seeing beautiful healthy fish being hoisted with no hook wounding. With the numbers down as they are this year. We should be encouraging folks to put healthy fish back while understanding they have a legal right to take 2 home rather than bashing the derby.

My told you so moment will be when we don't have a derby this year and in late May we are still reporting the fishery declining. It won't recover until the new age class fish take hold.

All this is one mans opinion but I'm hoping all can see the math and logic and I welcome any adjustments to my numbers based on anything observed or learned from reliable sources. I really wonder what Rick Davis would say about all this - RIP.

Tight lines all and be safe out there!
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Old 04-20-2020, 12:56 PM   #31
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While I don't want the conversation to turn ugly, I just get frustrated when so many feel like this: "that the lack of pressure from the derby gives the salmon a deserved break".

There is no question that putting 1000 boats on the water for a single weekend targeting salmon from daybreak to sunset puts a LOT of pressure on the fish. Anyone fishing in the weeks following the derby will support that assertion.

However, I talking to some of the organizers (and if you don't believe me - speak to them yourself) about how many fish are brought to the weigh station...his answer was "hundreds" as in 300-ish he said was a good estimate.

Now if you follow Winni trolling boards as I do, you see that the overwhelming majoring of anglers are taking home their limits of these beautiful 4-6 year old monster salmon this year. If we do some simple deductive math we get this:
-100 anglers on the lake each weekend day bringing home a limit (legally and ethically). That's 400 salmon a weekend (probably less because weather keeps some off...lets just cut it in half...200 salmon a weekend.
-6 weeks leading up to the derby would be 1200 salmon lifted out of the lake and filleted....just before the derby. Lets not count how many more are killed from June-Oct.

If we accept these number as reasonable...how can we suggest the derby is a major factor in the salmon numbers?

Hook wounded fish need to go home. They are a drain on the resource and need to be harvested but I'm seeing beautiful healthy fish being hoisted with no hook wounding. With the numbers down as they are this year. We should be encouraging folks to put healthy fish back while understanding they have a legal right to take 2 home rather than bashing the derby.

My told you so moment will be when we don't have a derby this year and in late May we are still reporting the fishery declining. It won't recover until the new age class fish take hold.

All this is one mans opinion but I'm hoping all can see the math and logic and I welcome any adjustments to my numbers based on anything observed or learned from reliable sources. I really wonder what Rick Davis would say about all this - RIP.

Tight lines all and be safe out there!
All good points but...in a “normal” season, with the derby, the regular fishermen of Winni are still out there doing their thing. This year, with no derby, you can deduct all the fish that would be killed/wounded during the derby, therefore, less of an impact on the fishery.
As you know, I’m not in favor of any derby or tournament on any body of water, so I’m biased in that respect. I don’t think our little New England fishery can support them as the huge southern and midwestern lakes and reservoirs can.
Just my humble opinion.
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