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Old 01-08-2018, 02:29 PM   #1
Closetzguy
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Default Early ice damage

This piling has moved vertically almost 6 feet! What are the chances it goes back down perfectly?
Sorry can't rotate the photo!
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Old 01-08-2018, 03:06 PM   #2
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very possible it is already pulled out of the ground and the ice is just holding it there in place
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Old 01-08-2018, 03:29 PM   #3
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Slim to none.
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Old 01-08-2018, 04:40 PM   #4
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Slim to none.
And Slim just left town...
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Old 01-08-2018, 04:48 PM   #5
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And Slim just left town...
With a nun?
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Old 01-09-2018, 10:35 AM   #6
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if you have a service on standby, like Watermark, I would put the call in now to get it on their schedule.
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Old 01-09-2018, 04:21 PM   #7
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if you have a service on standby, like Watermark, I would put the call in now to get it on their schedule.
I'd be surprised if they couldn't figure out a way to tap that back into place with it still captured by the ice.

Nice thing is you won't have to hold it straight, looks pretty good from here
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Old 01-09-2018, 05:02 PM   #8
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My guess is when it was driven they likely hit ledge and couldnt get down where they wanted to. We had one like that on our dock.
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Old 01-09-2018, 05:24 PM   #9
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My guess is when it was driven they likely hit ledge and couldnt get down where they wanted to. We had one like that on our dock.
Let me guess DES doesn't have permits for underwater blasting?
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Old 01-09-2018, 07:25 PM   #10
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Is the piling attached to shore somehow so that it does not float away once ice-out occurs? This would be the time to save it from floating away in the spring if you prevent it.
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Old 01-10-2018, 10:56 PM   #11
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What is it that makes that happen? I run bubblers because I was under impression that once iced in the rising lake level in spring would pull the pilings up with it but thats not what happened here. This is way to high for it to be the rising lake.
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Old 01-10-2018, 11:35 PM   #12
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It seems very unusual.

Maybe the deep freeze temperatures of last week got conducted down the wood piling, freezing the existing moisture inside the wood piling which increased its' buoyancy by 10%, and at the same time the now frozen piling has less surface friction between the piling wood surface and the lake bottom causing the lake bottom to lose its' grip allowing the piling to rise up vertically, held in position by the ice surface.

Probably, some part of the piling is still sticking into the lake bottom, otherwise it would be a leaner or be tipped over, but would not be 90-degree vertical, as it is.
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Old 01-10-2018, 11:43 PM   #13
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For the fun of it I thought I would rotate the piling upright.
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Old 01-11-2018, 03:57 AM   #14
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I'd be surprised if they couldn't figure out a way to tap that back into place with it still captured by the ice. Nice thing is you won't have to hold it straight, looks pretty good from here
• Those are called "tie-off" pilings. I have four installed in 1982. Since then, one has been replaced several times; meanwhile, the ice has pushed-over two others—making them useless. One original piling, 11" in diameter, has been creeping upwards after breaking off at the waterline several years ago. It's expected to be resting on the bottom (with three others) next Spring—and won't be replaced.

• Neighbors have experienced the same losses of tie-off pilings.

• An installer told me that once the bottom was disturbed, don't expect replacement pilings to stay in place. He also advised that the ice doesn't break them off, so pilings can be driven as deeply as desired. So far, his advice has been "on-target".

• In Spring, three years ago, one neighbor's "ice-cluster" (three secured together) drifted into my dock. He'd installed three ice-clusters in an area of many piling replacements. That Spring, two failed ice-clusters had been pulled up on his shoreline. When I advised him of my "find", he emailed, and wrote it wasn't his.

.
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Old 01-11-2018, 06:57 AM   #15
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Let me guess DES doesn't have permits for underwater blasting?
not sure for dock pilings but we have had two different marine contractors work on installing replacement pilings and when they hit ledge/Rock they moved the posts to spots where they could drive them down. They didn't blast.
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Old 01-11-2018, 11:49 AM   #16
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Interesting.......this as well as the other 2 were replaced 3 years ago. It seems your right.....putting in back in roughly the same spot didn't work very well. I guess it's a good thing I have whips as well. I just like to tie off to the piers when I leave for the week.
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Old 01-12-2018, 06:24 AM   #17
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It seems very unusual.

Maybe the deep freeze temperatures of last week got conducted down the wood piling, freezing the existing moisture inside the wood piling which increased its' buoyancy by 10%, and at the same time the now frozen piling has less surface friction between the piling wood surface and the lake bottom causing the lake bottom to lose its' grip allowing the piling to rise up vertically, held in position by the ice surface.

Probably, some part of the piling is still sticking into the lake bottom, otherwise it would be a leaner or be tipped over, but would not be 90-degree vertical, as it is.
.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:35 PM   #18
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Default Walmart Fix

You know, if you went to Walmart and got a large number of their very fine noodles, you could rig a collar for the piling so that it remains vertical...
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Old 01-12-2018, 01:33 PM   #19
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.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!
How about, you just pat yourself on the back and we will end it at that.
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:05 PM   #20
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.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?

....... of course, I am!
If you can answer this easy physics question than I'll agree that you are the "greatest" thinker known to mankind:

A block of hardwood is floating easily on the surface of a lake. As a storm approaches, the density and pressure of the air above the lake begin to decrease. As a result of this decrease in air pressure and density, the block of wood

(A) moves upward slightly and floats higher in the water.

(B) continues to float just as it did before.

(C) moves downward slightly and floats lower in the water.

(D) sinks to the bottom of the lake.
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:25 PM   #21
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(E) None of the above. Thankfully, a conscientious boater spotted the wood, safely reversed course, and removed the hazardous piece of wood, making the lake safer for all to enjoy.

Dave

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Old 01-12-2018, 03:48 PM   #22
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If you can answer this easy physics question than I'll agree that you are the "greatest" thinker known to mankind:

A block of hardwood is floating easily on the surface of a lake. As a storm approaches, the density and pressure of the air above the lake begin to decrease. As a result of this decrease in air pressure and density, the block of wood

(C) moves downward slightly and floats lower in the water.
The log is buoyed up by the sum of two forces, the weight of the water displaced and the weight of the air displaced. Together they equal the weight of the log. With the weight of the now lower pressure air reduced, the log sinks ever so slightly. The buoyant force of the air displaced is further reduced because the volume of air displaced is reduced by this sinking, while the buoyant force of the water is increased due to more of it being displaced. One could calculate the increase in depth if given the densities of the log, water, and air before and after the pressure change. A bigger challenge would be to determine how to measure such a tiny change in immersion.
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:49 PM   #23
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How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
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Old 01-12-2018, 03:54 PM   #24
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How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
Ahh. You would, Chuck.
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Old 01-12-2018, 04:13 PM   #25
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How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
A woodchuck would chuck as much wood as a woodchuck could chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood.
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Old 01-13-2018, 06:48 AM   #26
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.....so, how's about some side comments coming back on my reasons here ..... truly the greatest and most well thought out, deep freeze, cold effects deductive reasoning ever, ever, ever made ........ so's what do you think-um ...... am I correct or what?....... of course, I am!
Logicnot your strong suit.

I submit that the rings of ice suggest that the piling (which appears light in color and was likely installed last season) remained buoyant, warmed the water around it during bright, sunlit, days, and floated up a few inches every day for a week. Darkness found it frozen-in again nightly—freezing a new "ice-collar" around it every night.

This happened several days in a row—which accounts for the multiple "ice collars" that have collected around the piling.

So, don't expect this piling to be vertical in April.

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Old 01-14-2018, 08:53 AM   #27
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You know this piling or post is probably a big, 20-25' long, soft wood, pine tree which got pounded into the lake bottom by a pile driver rig with a crane lowering a big heavy weight upon it. Much like sharpening a pencil, the narrow end of the piling gets sharpened to a point by a chain saw before being pounded into the lake bottom.

The piling gets pounded into the lake bottom for maybe six feet ..... so what could make the lake bottom lose its six foot long grip on the piling ..... to allow it to float straight up while being held in position by the surface ice?

Isn't it likely that some of the piling is still stuck into the lake bottom otherwise it would either be a leaner or have toppled over. So, it seems to me, that it is being held by both the ice surface, and the lake bottom. Something caused it to float upward but not enough to be totally out of the lake bottom.

So, vas ist das something?
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Old 01-16-2018, 02:02 PM   #28
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How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
woodchuck could chuck a lot of wood if its dentures were any good.
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Old 01-16-2018, 02:18 PM   #29
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Quote:
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How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
woodchuck could chuck a lot of wood if its dentures were any good.
I remember seeing a spoof commercial a year or two ago of a wood chuck chucking wood. I think it was a Geico commercial.
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Old 01-17-2018, 12:15 AM   #30
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Could it be a big thick thistle stick?
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Old 01-17-2018, 08:40 AM   #31
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A neighbor's dock had those piling and one year the ice came in and knocked them over but not completely. They got worse during the next few years and eventually they had to have them driven back in.
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