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Old 03-02-2004, 12:03 PM   #1
DAK
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Default Bottom paint?

Would you consider buying a boat with bottom paint on Winni? Is this a negative option for a freshwater only boat? Does it hurt or help resale? It is not a go-fast boat but more of a cruiser so mph loss is not an issue.
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Old 03-02-2004, 07:32 PM   #2
madrasahs
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

This question was asked last spring here, on bringing an ocean boat to Winnipesaukee. My concern then was anti-fouling bottom paint.

http://www.winnipesaukeeforum.com/archive1.cgi?noframes;read=56932

Since many islanders and lakefront property owners use lake water, they should be concerned that the antifouling paint TBT has been banned throughout the world due to its acute poisonous properties. Unfortunately, TBT is still available, though it was banned in 1989.

So, if your bottom paint is anti-fouling, it should be removed by professionals, who wear the supplied-air masks and full-body coveralls that will keep them from being poisoned.

I've noticed that most boats with contrasting color bottom paint show large areas that have "let-go" of the hull (exposing the white gelcoat underneath). The skipper won't be aware of the defect until haul-out, but everybody else can see it readily.
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Old 03-02-2004, 10:09 PM   #3
Archer
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

if you are going to leave it in the water all summer i would get the bottom paint.or you will have to spend big money in the fall to get it bottom washed with acid to get it clean
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Old 03-02-2004, 10:20 PM   #4
Will
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Well you have to take two things into effect, on the good side your not going to really have to worry about that ugly algae line. However you will have to repaint every two to three years depending on the paint. Also if your planning on painting now just remember paint only lasts for thirty days out of the water , then the copper leaches out. Up on the lake also a good paint is one with irgrasol or biolux, this is a slime/algae reducing agent. Anywho
Good Luck
Will
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Old 03-03-2004, 08:34 AM   #5
DAK
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Will,
I don't get it. Are you saying that when the boat is out of the water for the winter that after 30 days it need to be repainted?? That doesn't sound right?
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Old 03-03-2004, 09:43 AM   #6
Peter Picasso
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Default Annual paint not required

DAK,

Your concern is well merited. A good quality bottom paint made by several vendors can last several seasons and easily survive haul out.

The previous poster is repeating the mantra heard at most boating supply stores that attempt to get you to buy their most expensive bottom coatings on an annual basis.

Even with the national chain boating supply houses, you are better off doing your own research prior to purchase than entrust your boat to the opinion of the local clerk!

Been there, been burned...
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Old 03-03-2004, 10:24 AM   #7
Gil & Mary Anne Peck
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Given the environmental concerns of anti-fouling paint and the costs of re-doing it every two or three years I would suggest NOT painting the bottom of your boat. The cost of acid washing ( assuming you leave the boat in the lake all summer) are minimal- Hope this helps- above all- enjoy your boat- this is one of the most beautiful lakes in the world to do that
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Old 03-03-2004, 12:50 PM   #8
Mee'n'Mac
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

"Would you consider buying a boat with bottom paint on Winni? Is this a negative option for a freshwater only boat? Does it hurt or help resale? It is not a go-fast boat but more of a cruiser so mph loss is not an issue. "

Because bottom paint isn't really needed in fresh water and because once it's on you're stuck repainting the bottom every 3 or so years, I consider it a negative ($$ and hassle for little benefit). That said if I were looking a nice used boat that had bottom paint and the price was right I wouldn't be unduly deterred. I'd use it as a bargaining point to chip away at the price.
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Old 03-03-2004, 02:47 PM   #9
Proline
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Default Re: Another Option

If your worried about acid washing and cost, you can apply a coat of Star Brite Marine Polish with Teflon (avail. @ West Marine) to the underside of the hull in the spring. It makes removal of the build up very easy and the acid treatment is needed. It is of course an additional help to rub down the underside a couple times per summer. My boat has been in the lake for years and the underside is in showroom condition. Another product people like is called Easy On which supposedly inhibits fresh water growth.
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Old 03-03-2004, 03:45 PM   #10
Mee'n'Mac
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

I'm with Proline on this one. Pressure wash (no acid) the hull when the boat is hauled and wax before it goes back in, keeps the bottom clean.
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Old 03-03-2004, 04:25 PM   #11
JvB
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Default Re: Another Option

I'm sure those products are great for the lake too.
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Old 03-03-2004, 05:02 PM   #12
chunt
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Try buying a Sea Ray boat bigger than thirty feet, they are all bottom painted.
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Old 03-03-2004, 06:37 PM   #13
Will
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

As a matter of fact, since here we go again, when a boat is bottom painted initially you have to splash the boat within 30 days. After a season in the water the paint should still keep its copper content even through the winter. And By the way, No it is not a "rumor through massive boating supply chains" We tell people this because I get customers in the fall who want to paint there boat for next year, we advise them not to because the paint looses its antifouling properties when left out of the water without being splashed. Oh and by the way, you can call interlux, petit, or us paint to quote me on that!
Anywho I was just trying to help but was once again bad mouthed and criticized by the know it alls among us.

Sorry to interrupt
Will
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Old 03-04-2004, 08:30 AM   #14
DAK
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Will, probably just a little confusion. You are taking about when the boat is painted for the first time, right? I should have made it clearer that the boat I am looking at is already painted and was wondering if it was a smart thing. I currently rack store but plan to have a slip in the near future to enjoy overnights.
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Old 03-04-2004, 09:06 AM   #15
ITD
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

See the link below, from what I can see some paints become ineffective after 30 days of being out of the water, some don't. (see All you want to know about bottom paints)

The other link goes to an EPA sheet which in the following paragraph details the concerns with bottom paints.

"The highest concentrations of TBT and high
levels of copper have been recorded around
marinas where hundreds of recreational boats
are docked for long periods of time. Because
marinas are constructed where boats are
protected from wind and waves, the pesticide
concentrations are not as readily diluted by
natural mixing with adjacent waters. These
pesticides can accumulate in high
concentrations in the sediments and may have
a significant impact on the environment even
after the source of contamination is gone."

http://www.p2pays.org/ref/05/04853.pdf

Personally, I don't use a bottom paint. The bottom of my boat gets cleaned after haulout. I scrub with a soft brush on a pole once or twice during the season and the bottom is fine. Also the lake is better off without the added chemicals.




All you want to know about bottom paints
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Old 03-04-2004, 10:20 AM   #16
John
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

After one experience, if I kept my boat in Salt water I would use the coppertone anti-fouling paint. But in fresh water I would not. Although my Grandfather had put it on his 17' Lyman it did make that boat look sharp. My boat had submarine Red Lead on the bottom, it was horrible to take off. but the weight of that paint was too much. But with a sander I got it off and I mixed up various cans of Automobile white paint, and sprayed the bottom of the boat. That was about 1990. I have not had to paint the boats hull again, and it looks good, for a boat that 90% of the time was in the lake and never spent a night in the ocean. And I am not going to paint it this year either.

I take a sponge while I am swimming and wipe down what I can reach about every month or so. Simple.
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:41 PM   #17
SteveS
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Default Re: Another Option

I have used "Easy On". It's a thick wax, easy to put on, and seems to be well worth it. It takes 24 hours or so to set up. I don't think it contains anything too horrid for the lake, the manufacturer calls it "non-toxic"
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Old 03-04-2004, 08:30 PM   #18
Will
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Nope even if repainted, it has to be splashed within 30 days.
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Old 03-05-2004, 09:45 AM   #19
DAK
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Default Re: Bottom paint?

Safer to says 30 days splash after "fresh" paint? What about cured paint after a season or two?
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Old 03-05-2004, 10:09 AM   #20
Peter Picasso
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Default That is not correct!

Once again (and for the last time)I will caution the reader to research this subject on his/her own before taking the word of a store clerk.

Even a cursory visit to BoatUS or WestMarine's product websites will reveal that there are a number of products that require NO "splash" or "launch" to maintain the stability of their product once initial application drying has taken place. There are also some high copper content products that require wetting within 60 days of drying.

The best advice on this subject is to avoid bottom painting in a freshwater lake all together. There are a number of wax-on products and environmentally safe cleaning alternatives much better than using a toxic bottom coating.

Of course the sales commission on these products is much less, but what price do we place on the big Lake's ecological well being?
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Old 03-05-2004, 10:45 AM   #21
madrasahs
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Default Why paint a fiberglass/aluminum LAKE boat at all?

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Old 03-05-2004, 12:20 PM   #22
bill
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Default so it will not blister

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Old 03-05-2004, 02:49 PM   #23
Doral300sc
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Default Re: That is not correct!

Hey Pete,
sorry but there is no commission sales at West Marine or Boat US. All the employees are paid by the hour.
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Old 03-05-2004, 05:23 PM   #24
Mee'n'Mac
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Default Re: so it will not blister

I don't think any of the anti-fouling bottom paints discussed in this thread will have, or claim to have, any water barrier protection. Thus blistering can still occur. I've heard mixed reviews on so-called barrier protection "paints" so I'm not sure that even these work. Perhaps the newer varieties do better than the stuff I have in mind. Can anyone comment ?
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:58 PM   #25
Will
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Default Re: That is not correct!

Pete, still you remain wrong, products like the "go fast bottom paint, which do not need to be splashed are around, but hey look how good that worked (ahem delamination, early fouling) but the high copper paint that u speak of usually has to high of a content of copper and is usually not allowed on the lake or rivers. But you know what more importantly people need to chill out on this forum rather then try to know everything and jump all over those who speak from experience, I do this everyday and I am not wrong but hey do what you want then we can have a thread about how your bottom paint copper leached out. Anywho,,,,,,,

CHeers!!!!
Will
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Old 03-06-2004, 04:56 PM   #26
Matthew
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Default Re: Another Option

Actually, these products ARE good for the lake in that the acid wash helps to increase the acidity of the water, which makes it clearer, and the easy-on promotes the growth of helpful bacteria and algea in the lake, which feed the plankton that the fish eat. Teflon also helps the fish to digest their food and reduces their need for oxygen.
My father is a chemical engineer and understands the benefits of chemicals to society.
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Old 03-06-2004, 11:28 PM   #27
GWC...
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Default If so, why did Calif ban acid washing???

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Old 03-07-2004, 08:54 PM   #28
SteveG
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Default Re: so it will not blister

You need to apply a barrier coat for blister protection. Antifouling paint will not do anything to prevent blisters.
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Old 03-08-2004, 01:08 PM   #29
Ken
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Default Re: Another Option

Does anyone remember acid rain? Yes, it's still there. Sure, acid in the lake makes it clearer, but it does this by killing every live thing in the lake, which includes the fish. Best bet for the bottom of a freshwater boat - wax every spring and wash (no acid) every fall. A quick in-water sponge bath during the season helps. Been doing this every year for 40 years with good results!
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