Downings Landing

[Just Sold]

I found this on the F&G web site and it gives insight on the plans for Downings Landing. http://www.wildlife.state.nh.us/acce...ng-wj-2015.pdf


Downing’s Landing Access Site – Lake Winnipesaukee, Alton, N.H.

At the southern tip of Alton Bay at the mouth of the Merrymeeting River, Downing’s Landing is N.H. Fish and Game’s first no-fee trailered-boat launch facility on Lake Winnipesaukee. It continues a legacy of gateway access to the “Big Lake” from this property that began in the late 1800s.

According to historical research completed as part of Fish and Game’s permitting process to refurbish and improve the facility, Samuel Downing moved from the Seacoast to New Durham in the 1830s and became a prosperous farmer. He and his children purchased property along Alton Bay between 1845 and 1870 to establish the J.H. Downing Store (now the Amelyne Corner Market), the Winnipesaukee House Hotel (493 Main) and, as a co-developer, the Cocheco Railroad Depot (later the Boston and Maine) terminus near Bay Street.

In 1892, the Downing family purchased the Downing’s Landing property from the Winnipiseogee Lake Cotton and Woolen Manufacturing Company. The facility served as a boat launch and the base for a lake property delivery-boat service, speed boat tours, boat sales and a water recreation business until the family sold the property to Fish and Game in November of 2012.

Downing’s Landing has an asphalt ramp and passenger access dock. Its parking area can accommodate 25 trailered boats and offers several cartop spaces. Access is open to all on a first-come-first-served basis. Launch early, as high demand fills the lot quickly on summer holidays and weekends. The fishing pier and snack bar are closed to the public, pending repairs.

Lake Winnipesaukee offers an exciting range of fishing opportunities across its Downing’s Landing Access Site – Lake Winnipesaukee, Alton, N.H. 72-square-mile expanse, encompassed by 178 miles of shoreline. Every year, Fish and Game stocks nearly 40,000 fish into the lake, including about 30,000 landlocked salmon and 9,000 rainbow trout. These stocked fish complement the native lake trout, perch and small and largemouth bass populations. With a maximum depth of 213 feet, the lake has many warm and cold water fisheries.

In its current configuration and condition, Downing’s Landing offers an important access to Lake Winnipesaukee. Over the next few years, as funding allows, Fish and Game will be upgrading the facility. Currently, the site is in the evaluation and planning stages required for state and federal permit applications to Boating on the “Big Lake” is one of the crown jewels in New Hampshire’s treasure chest of outdoor recreation opportunities. construct shoreline projects. A new double ramp with an industry state-of-the-art precast concrete plank system is planned, along with a new parking layout affording cartop spaces and room for about 30 trailered-boat slots.

Visit Downing’s Landing and enjoy boating on the “Big Lake,” one of the crown jewels in New Hampshire’s treasure chest of outdoor recreational opportunities.

[Hillcountry]

Good news!

[upthesaukee]

Nice article, and thanks for sharing, but...

Fish and Game purchased the property in 2012, and since then have done little to prevent the boat launch from suffering damage due to boaters power loading their boats, creating large prop-wash depressions in the launch area. Even the picture of the ramp in the article shows the poor condition of ramp, and its docks. The article is from July 2015, 9 months ago.

If you go here: http://www2.des.state.nh.us/OneStop/...BDate=&REDate=

and select the option to search applications in an Excel format, you can scroll down the spreadsheet to see applications to repair existing docks dating back to Sept 2011 with a permit approved April 29, 2013. Looks like they have just now started work on the facility.

I could not find any application for repair / replace the boat launch area, a key to the "lake access" to Lake Winnipesaukee.

Oh, if you do want to search the permits in a spreadsheet, just scroll down to row 524!!!!

Not sure this such great news, or just a continuation of rhetoric.

[Just Sold]

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

Nice article, and thanks for sharing, but...

Fish and Game purchased the property in 2012, and since then have done little to prevent the boat launch from suffering damage due to boaters power loading their boats, creating large prop-wash depressions in the launch area. Even the picture of the ramp in the article shows the poor condition of ramp, and its docks. The article is from July 2015, 9 months ago.

Uppy, I have an e-mail into F&G asking what is/will/when be done at Downings Landing including what permits are in process or approved. I will post when and if I receive an answer.

[upthesaukee]

Originally Posted by Just Sold

Uppy, I have an e-mail into F&G asking what is/will/when be done at Downings Landing including what permits are in process or approved. I will post when and if I receive an answer.

Thanks... I am all about waiting a time with patience, but around 4 years??? give me a break. It's kind of like buying a boat, but not being able to afford to insure it, dock it, tow it, fuel it... why do it.

Not a good use of funds, looking back, unless they can turn it around in the forseeable future..

thanks for your update on the emai. I look forward to hear what they say.

Safe boating to you.

[Diver1111]

I want to go in at Downings this weekend.

Prior posts in another thread said it had chain link fence? around it-so-is it available now-today-for launching or do I need to go elsewhere?

[Lakeboater]

Originally Posted by Diver1111

I want to go in at Downings this weekend.

Prior posts in another thread said it had chain link fence? around it-so-is it available now-today-for launching or do I need to go elsewhere?

You can put in at Downing today. The chain link fence is along the back of the building and the docks attached to building. Fence does not effect ramp or parking.

[riverat]

Last week a mold removal company had been working inside the buildings with vacuums and ventilation and monitors set up outside for air testing. my guess there was/still a mold or mildew problem. first sign of improvement this year.

[Just Sold]

Originally Posted by Just Sold

Uppy, I have an e-mail into F&G asking what is/will/when be done at Downings Landing including what permits are in process or approved. I will post when and if I receive an answer.

I received this e-mail today and I think it answers many questions even if some may not provide quick resolve to some of the facility issues. I did respond to Garret and said that I felt the courtesy dock at the ramp appears to be in poor condition and very hazardous. I feel someone may trip/fall and get hurt using it. Anyone in Alton want to post a photo of it?

Dear Mr. XXXXXX:

Thank you for your email inquiry about New Hampshire Fish and Game’s Downing’s Landing boat access ramp to Lake Winnipesaukee.

First, I thank you on behalf of everyone at Fish and Game for backing the Department with your boat registration fees for many years! The Department would not own the Downing’s Landing site or many other ramp sites without the long-standing support by patrons like you.

Maintaining safe conditions is a key concern at all our boat access facilities. We made repairs to the Downing’s Landing ramp courtesy dock last September to remove several trip-and-fall situations and firm up the platform to provide satisfactory access for launching and retrieving boats. We will be upgrading the ramp to a state-of-the-art system similar to the Lake Winnisquam ramp located on Water Street in Laconia.

As a Department, and like you and many others in the boating community, we would like to improve the conditions at Downing’s Landing as quickly as possible. But, we have to proceed and operate within our means. As you may know, the Department is essentially self-funded through various program license and registration fees. We receive only five dollars from each boat registration to build new ramp facilities and maintain 143 existing sites (Public Boat Access Program). There are about 90,000 boats registered in NH so that is $450,000+/-. We leverage these dollars to receive another $450,000+/- in federal funding through the Wildlife and Sportfish Restoration Act grant fund managed by the US Fish and Wildlife Service. So, in a good year we may receive almost one million dollars to design/permit new access ramps, maintain/refurbish existing ramps, maintain/purchase equipment, pay personnel, and purchase new access properties, if they become available. It seems like a lot of money, but that 5 dollar contribution has not gone up since the early 1990s and we all know a dollar does not go as far as it once did.

The price to purchase the Downing’s Landing property in 2012 was about one million dollars; a lump sum greater than the annual budget for the Public Boat Access Program. We could not afford to miss that rare opportunity to secure waterfront on Lake Winnipesaukee, but the reality of the outcome now requires even more attentiveness and evaluation of project budgets and access priorities.

A schedule to refurbish the Downing’s Landing facility to a “Winnisquam level of quality” is not firm at this time. There are several competing projects ahead of this site including the ramp to Ossipee Lake located on the Pine River. This project was permitted and on the priority list several years ago. We started the construction of that ramp this month. We intend to pursue pre-construction activities at Downing’s Landing to lay the ground work for design and permitting as resources may allow. An archeological evaluation has been completed and the site is clear for development from an historical perspective. Last week the buildings at Downing’s Landing were cleared of hazardous materials and abated for asbestos. Next week the buildings will be demolished to prepare the site for further pre-design/pre-permitting assessment as funds become available. We hope to do a subsurface investigation this fall to support a design for a new main dock.

I hope you will understand and support the Department’s multiple efforts to provide and maintain high quality access to the State’s water bodies and wildlife habitats in a fashion that protects and conserves the environmental conditions that attract us to these natural resources. We endeavor to complete these projects as quickly as possible using our funding from the state’s fishing and boating enthusiasts in the most cost effective manner. Unfortunately we cannot complete these objectives overnight and still achieve the high quality results the public deserves at a reasonable cost.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact the Department. I appreciate the opportunity to address your concerns and urge you to call me if you have further questions.

Sincerely,

Garret Graaskamp, P.G.
Coordinator
NHFG-SPBAP

[fatlazyless]

Motorboats use gasoline and NH has a very low state gas tax so maybe the legislature could raise the gas tax by ten cents and put the money to work into the roads, bridges, boat launch ramps, and other state public infer-structure.

Instead of just putting up a sign like 'frost heaves ahead' maybe the state will do more infer-structure maintenance and upgrades like the super Downing's-Alton Bay launch ramp.

Just like buying a car or a boat, it takes money to have good infer-structure, and the current NH gas tax is just not getting it done enough.

Do you really want to be backing your million dollar yacht down a shaky-breaky boat launch ramp that swings and sways with each incoming boat wake or slight breeze ...... probably knot! If people cannot afford a ten cent state gasoline tax increase, they can always get out and walk, or ride a bicycle, which would probably do them some good, besides.

[Woodguy53]

Unless NH tax policy has changed taxes paid on gasoline for off-road use is reimberseable from the state. This includes motorboats, generators etc.
I don't use enough gas yearly to bother with the form - but I believe it's still available.

[jeffk]

Is there any charge to use the boat launch sites? Maybe even a "season pass" for frequent users?

[Seaplane Pilot]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Motorboats use gasoline and NH has a very low state gas tax so maybe the legislature could raise the gas tax by ten cents and put the money to work into the roads, bridges, boat launch ramps, and other state public infer-structure.

Instead of just putting up a sign like 'frost heaves ahead' maybe the state will do more infer-structure maintenance and upgrades like the super Downing's-Alton Bay launch ramp.

Just like buying a car or a boat, it takes money to have good infer-structure, and the current NH gas tax is just not getting it done enough.

Do you really want to be backing your million dollar yacht down a shaky-breaky boat launch ramp that swings and sways with each incoming boat wake or slight breeze ...... probably knot! If people cannot afford a ten cent state gasoline tax increase, they can always get out and walk, or ride a bicycle, which would probably do them some good, besides.

Instead of increasing taxes, let's try cutting expenses for once. Cut 1% from all State department budgets (which is just fat and waste anyway) and put it toward fixing the ramps. When does it ever end with you guys anyway. As I have said before on this forum, enough is enough! Stay away from my wallet!

[noreast]

With 1% from each department we could build the "Ramp to no where". It would be uuugge!

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by jeffk

Is there any charge to use the boat launch sites? Maybe even a "season pass" for frequent users?

No, it's free.

I'd happily pay a fee for maintenance and repairs. I used it for years when it was a commercial enterprise, so paying to launch and park is not a problem for me. I imagine a fee would reduce crowds too. It gets really crowded now and I often launch very early (or very late and spend the night on the boat) to ensure parking and avoid the mayhem. Of course there's plenty of other incentives to spend the night on the boat so that's not a big deal, but the really early starts aren't my wife's favorite thing.

[jeffk]

Originally Posted by Dave R

No, it's free.

I'd happily pay a fee for maintenance and repairs. I used it for years when it was a commercial enterprise, so paying to launch and park is not a problem for me. I imagine a fee would reduce crowds too. It gets really crowded now and I often launch very early (or very late and spend the night on the boat) to ensure parking and avoid the mayhem. Of course there's plenty of other incentives to spend the night on the boat so that's not a big deal, but the really early starts aren't my wife's favorite thing.

Thanks.

If you want something, the best way to get it is to PAY for it, not wait for someone to provide it free. Also, free things are often substandard and not maintained.

I am having my boat valeted this year. Part of the cost for that is essentially a "launch fee". People that rent slips are paying for avoiding a launch fee (and the launch itself). People that have lakefront property are effectively paying as part of their property cost and taxes. All these people have solved the launch problem by paying for it.

If a reasonable launch fee were set up ($15/$20 seems to be common, maybe a little less since this is public and also subsidized by registration fees), the work to fix up the launch and maintain it would be paid for over time. As I previously mentioned, for frequent users, you could set up a yearly fee ($150? bulk rate) and pass card system.

Yeah, you would have to pay a high school kid to monitor access and collect money but you could do that June to September and spot check for compliance outside that time. They could also police the grounds, empty trash, and look for problems.

Money collected at the site should be earmarked for use AT the site, not disappeared into the system.

Just a thought.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by jeffk

If a reasonable launch fee were set up ($15/$20 seems to be common, maybe a little less since this is public and also subsidized by registration fees), the work to fix up the launch and maintain it would be paid for over time. As I previously mentioned, for frequent users, you could set up a yearly fee ($150? bulk rate) and pass card system.

Yeah, you would have to pay a high school kid to monitor access and collect money but you could do that June to September and spot check for compliance outside that time. They could also police the grounds, empty trash, and look for problems.

Money collected at the site should be earmarked for use AT the site, not disappeared into the system.

Just a thought.

Agreed. They could even use a pay and display machine or a parking fee lock box like the Downings used, during the week to save on labor costs.

I would love to see F&G officers writing tickets for power loading there, BUT, then we'd need laws to define power loading and to designate power-loading-prohibited areas and such and that's a road I'd rather not go down... Would probably be cheaper in the long run just to improve the ramp so that power loading does no harm to it.

Let's face it, power loading is much faster. Another issue is that many people don't realize that the signs that say "no power loading" there only prohibit the use of power in place of the winch. You can drive the boat on to the trailer at idle speed, shut off the engine, then winch the boat up the last few feet of trailer without doing any harm to the ramp. The Downings allowed that when they owned the ramp.

[fatlazyless]

Up north about an hour or so away in the White Mountain National Forest, the U.S. Forest Service started charging three dollars/day or $20/year to park your vehicle at the many different hiking trail parking lots. This was free up till about ten years ago.

Maybe the Fish and Game could do something similar like charge $3/launch or $20/year via a self deposit steel security drop box on site or a windshield sticker?

Just imagine how the Alton Police could secretly scope out this process from a distance through binoculars, and when some poor slob launches a boat without paying the three bucks they could turn on those bright blue flashing lights and arrest him for theft of service or something. So, besides raising money for the Fish and Game, it could be a good money maker for the town and state, too.

And, the local police could call it "catch and release" ......... ho-ho-ho-ho!

[Just Sold]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Just imagine how the Alton Police could secretly scope out this process from a distance through binoculars, and when some poor slob launches a boat without paying the three bucks they could turn on those bright blue flashing lights and arrest him for theft of service or something. So, besides raising money for the Fish and Game, it could be a good money maker for the town and state, too.

And, the local police could call it "catch and release" ......... ho-ho-ho-ho!

After talking with Alton PD last year on a ADA issue at Downings Landing they said F&G officers are the only ones that can enforce laws on F&G property. Alton Police will not even step on the Downings Landing property unless asked to by F&G.

[fatlazyless]

Originally Posted by Just Sold

After talking with Alton PD last year on a ADA issue at Downings Landing they said F&G officers are the only ones that can enforce laws on F&G property. Alton Police will not even step on the Downings Landing property unless asked to by F&G.

....them's the officers who wear those bright red uniform jackets similar to the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. In 24-years here, have seen one of them just once, and that was in Heath's Hardware.

.....so's why not have the F&G charge a small amount like the three dollars/day placed into a steel deposit box similar to what the Forest Service does....to make some revenue to help F&G maintain the facility? If F&G can raise the fishing license from $35 to 45 on 1/1/16, then they could charge three dollars/day-$20/yr-sticker price to use the ramps. A small fee which could go a long way to help power up the F&G.

[GBGX2]

Things are progressing!

[Just Sold]

I used the Downings today and the launch was OK but......the retrieval was a trying time with the Downings Landing Ramp so uneven it made it very difficult getting the boat out of the water and on the trailer properly. There was a deep hole on one side of the ramp making the trailer tilt quite a bit to one side. The left side towards the bridge is the worst. With more power loading and no date to rebuild the ramp it can only get worse.
Also the buildings are now completely down.