Just got a Hot Tub and my warranty is already void?

[JasonG]

I have one that is got me a bit confused and I would love some honest feedback. Am I the one to blame?

January 2016 I purchased a new hot tub. Dealer in NH and brand will remain nameless.

Dealer (the owner in all situations) came by, installed it, and saw my setup. This is key to the who issue, because my setup used an extension cord. Now being in the business of selling battery chargers, I was well aware that I could not use a cheap extension cord. So I purchased one that had a 50% buffer for the amp draw and was only 15 feet long. The cord never gets hot, was short, exterior grade, and easily can carry the current of the 12 amp hot tub.

But we have had issues with the tub recently. A slight burning smell from the hot tub over the past 6 weeks. I called the factory whom sent out the dealer to replace the main circuit board. Problem was still there with a burning smell, so I called the factory back. They said it is likely the pump and sent one out. This is all under warranty.

Today I call the dealer to arrange an install of the pump. He informs me my warranty was void and it would be a $170 service fee. Of course I questioned this. He tells me is was void because I used an extension cord. The factory warranty states the use of any extension cord immediately voids the warranty.

1 My first issue with this right away is when the dealer installed the tub in the first place, he knew it was getting plugged into an extension cord. If this was going to void my warranty, should he have said something right away? I would have gladly held off. He did suggest that I get a regular plug outlet to plug into, but nothing else.

2 When the dealer did the first repair, he did not inform me that it was out of warranty at all. He now calls that a courtesy warranty coverage. But if the first repair was a courtesy and cancelled my warranty, how did they send out the second part under warranty? He also question ME to make sure that I knew the problem was the pump and not something else. Huh? How would I know? I am asking the factory for help here.

3. When I called the factory about this issue, they had no idea about my warranty coverage being cancelled. At this point I am wondering what the dealer is talking about. Working with the same rep at the factory on this issue since day one, they knew I was using an extension cord before the first repair. She did confirm today that an extension cord can void the warranty.

At this point I have not heard back from the dealer or manufacturer. No idea which way this will turn.

Am I in the wrong here for any reason?

[radioman]

What a story jason, get a lawyer and let him go after both the dealer and the factory, and good luck.

[Pineedles]

Sorry my friend, it's what's on paper that counts. A salesman's word is not good enough, and they are under no obligation to advise you that you are installing a system incorrectly that would void the warranty. Don't waste your money on a lawyer.

[JasonG]

Yes, a bit crappy. What is really getting to me is that the dealer is the one that filled it up, plugged it into the extension cord, and thanked me for my business. No warranty details until he was about to leave and handed me the warranty in the manual.

[ishoot308]

Jason;

If I were you I would try and resolve this as amicably as possible with the factory and simply tell them exactly what you stated here. Be persistent but be as polite and respectful as possible and tell them it was their certified dealer who allowed the setup to occur with an extension cord. If this was not correct why did they set it up this way?? Have the factory do your pleading for you to their dealer as it sounds like they were listening to you at least...

Getting lawyers involved will cost you more money than the repair bill...

Good luck!

Dan

[Winnisquamer]

Like stated above I would contact the hot tub brand and explain the situation that it was installed as such and that had the tech informed you of the installation not being up to manufacturers code or warranty requirements they shouldn't nor would you have let them install the unit. As far as the installer being responsible for any of the costs I find that unlikely, he could've told you your warranty was good for 2,000 years, it doesn't mean he's right.. Always, ALWAYS read your warranty paperwork when purchasing anything you plan on having serviced at some time.

I always assume a salesmen is full of ****. (Excuse the language)

[brk-lnt]

I would also suggest calling the factory.

Ask them *why* an extension cord voids the warranty. They will likely tell you its due to people using low-grade cords that have too much voltage drop. Then ask them what wiring they'd recommend for your setup (gauge, etc.). If you extension cord meets or exceeds their specs, ask them how/why that voids your warranty when it is functionally equivalent to a "properly" wired setup.

However, if you're "in the business", you should know that extension cords are prohibited from acting as "permanent" wiring, which is effectively what you're doing. Regardless of what the dealer said/did, I think YOU know this is an improper setup on a technicality.

[JasonG]

Already working with the factory and they are trying to work it out with the dealer.

Appreciate the responses!

[dpg]

You SHOULD give us the name of the dealer if they plugged in the extension cord at setup and said nothing, shame on them. Well (maybe) you could wait till this is resolved so they do not read it here themselves but this is something inquiring minds (and people shopping for one) should know. I agree about the lawyer, I'd pay for the fix before giving anything to a lawyer.

[ITD]

Name the dealer and the brand so others won't get sucked into this scam, the dealer sounds clueless. A lawyer will cost you many times what the dealer is charging so forget that. Either pay up or fix it yourself, hot tubs aren't rocket science, but you should be handy if you try.

[Kamper]

I think you're not going to get satisfaction in this.

Even if your town's codes require permanent wiring/plumbing for hot-tubs, the dealer actually only delivered it even if it were placed to your exact specifications. Permits would only have been required if that work had been done so you can't nail them on permit issues.

My advice is to get the proper wiring done and pay for the repairs as necessary. Then enjoy yourself and put it behind you. This is likely to be cheaper than a law-suit and definitely less frustrating and time consuming.

Good luck!

[JasonG]

I really would rather not name the dealer, especially where it is not settled. This may work out or it may not.

[ishoot308]

Originally Posted by JasonG

I really would rather not name the dealer, especially where it is not settled. This may work out or it may not.

I agree! If the dealer steps up to the plate and works with you on this issue why bad mouth them for no reason.

If they don't...well then the choice is yours...

Dan

[COW ISL TIME]

Hi Jason, I am a hot tub dealer I sell three brands of hot tubs and have two locations. I would like to ask a couple of questions, was this dealer some one who works out of a warehouse and offers $8000.00 hot tubs for $3999.99 in the seacoast area ? If it was he is selling Chinese hot tubs witch are basically a disposable hot tub.
Please don't use an extension cord no matter how good it is, it's a very dangerous condition and voids the warranty on all three brands that I carry.
If the dealer is at all reputable he should be working with you on solving this problem instead of passing it on to the manufacturer , and the manufacturer should be forcing the dealer to help the customer out.
Moral of the story try to go to a brick and mortar store with a good word of mouth reputation, stay away from the places that don't have store fronts and the internet company's, you may pay a little more but in the long run you'll be happier and get a better product

[JasonG]

Originally Posted by COW ISL TIME

Hi Jason, I am a hot tub dealer I sell three brands of hot tubs and have two locations. I would like to ask a couple of questions, was this dealer some one who works out of a warehouse and offers $8000.00 hot tubs for $3999.99 in the seacoast area ? If it was he is selling Chinese hot tubs witch are basically a disposable hot tub.
Please don't use an extension cord no matter how good it is, it's a very dangerous condition and voids the warranty on all three brands that I carry.
If the dealer is at all reputable he should be working with you on solving this problem instead of passing it on to the manufacturer , and the manufacturer should be forcing the dealer to help the customer out.
Moral of the story try to go to a brick and mortar store with a good word of mouth reputation, stay away from the places that don't have store fronts and the internet company's, you may pay a little more but in the long run you'll be happier and get a better product

Hello
No, this is a well established retail business with great reviews online. Price was on target with other sellers across the country.

I fully understand about the cord now. What continues to irk me a bit is after the first repair ( I was not home ), the same dealer plugged the hot tub into the extension cord after the repairs were done.

[SIKSUKR]

I beg to differ here a little.Jason clearly said the dealer told him he needs to have an outlet installed. I know I've been excited about a certain something and wanted to use it right away until I can do it properly in the past. Another thing that he posted was " A slight burning smell from the hot tub over the past 6 weeks". 6 weeks of burning smell and still had not installed the outlet? From my view the op has culpability in this.

[LIforrelaxin]

Can I interject in this craziness here.....About the extension cord specifically....

Extension cord is an ambiguous term... there are many types... some where are designed to be used with low wattage lights etc. in side your home... Some that are meant to be used outside with low wattage devices... Right on up to heavy duty extension cords used to connect a RV or Boat to a power source....

What are hot tub manufactures warning against? Having an inappropriate extension cord which could cause a fire.... or other danger...

If you run a outlet to the Hot tub, you are in essence using an extension cord.... however it if it is done by an electrician, you are probably going to end up with a dedicated circuit, and by code the wire used will be off the correct size to deal with the current load to provide the power needed at the hot tub.

If I put a dedicated circuit off my main box, with the correct receptacle, and used a have duty extension cord to my hot tub... That should in no way void a warranty....

IF the OP has done his work right, and used the proper equipment in his set up, he shouldn't have casued an issue with the hot tub itself.... If he is smelling a burning smell it could be a legitimate problem with the tub....

However as he is using an extension cord he opens that door.... but if he provides details to show that his setup is as good, or better then having an electrician install a to code circuit and outlet... A court would be hard pressed to rule against him.

[JasonG]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

I beg to differ here a little.Jason clearly said the dealer told him he needs to have an outlet installed. I know I've been excited about a certain something and wanted to use it right away until I can do it properly in the past. Another thing that he posted was " A slight burning smell from the hot tub over the past 6 weeks". 6 weeks of burning smell and still had not installed the outlet? From my view the op has culpability in this.

Well..that is not what I or the dealer said. As the dealer was done installing, filling with water, and plugged in the extension cord, he then suggested an outlet. Did not say it was required. Did not say it would void the warranty. Did not tell me it was a safety issue. Did not tell me I was wrong. But lesson learned to think that a dealer or sales person would actually tell me that what I was planning to do was wrong and would void a warranty.

Was not 6 weeks of using the tub straight and smelling burning. That would be crazy. It was found 6 weeks ago. Dealer came out for first repair ( and still plugged it back into an extension cord himself after the repair ). Use it for a few days and smelled the burning again. Unplugged. Tub has had a lot of down time the past 6 weeks.

Sure, throw blame on me for trusting someone to actually tell me what I had planned was wrong. I mean that seriously, major lesson learned here to trust anyone. I wish I was told what to do from the start. But I relied on the expert with a well established store to tell me what I can and cannot do. Going forward I literally need to google pro's and cons of anything significant I buy.

[4Fun]

There are 2 reasons they probably recommend not using an extension cord.

First one is safety. A dedicated outlet with a GFI breaker should be used. You are more likely NOT to use one if you use a cord. Second, If you use a low capacity extension cord you WILL burn out the motor as it can't pass enough current to the motor. This could also explain the burning smell. Additionally, even with a heavy duty cord more or loose connections will also add resistance to the circuit.

Motors are very sensitive to this. It's similar to running your well pump on a generator without enough capacity. It will work but eventually burn out.

This should be a glaring issue for the installer especially on the service call.

[Winnisquamer]

Originally Posted by JasonG

Going forward I literally need to google pro's and cons of anything significant I buy.

Everyone should.

[SIKSUKR]

Originally Posted by JasonG

Well..that is not what I or the dealer said. As the dealer was done installing, filling with water, and plugged in the extension cord, he then suggested an outlet. Did not say it was required. Did not say it would void the warranty. Did not tell me it was a safety issue. Did not tell me I was wrong. But lesson learned to think that a dealer or sales person would actually tell me that what I was planning to do was wrong and would void a warranty.

Was not 6 weeks of using the tub straight and smelling burning. That would be crazy. It was found 6 weeks ago. Dealer came out for first repair ( and still plugged it back into an extension cord himself after the repair ). Use it for a few days and smelled the burning again. Unplugged. Tub has had a lot of down time the past 6 weeks.

Sure, throw blame on me for trusting someone to actually tell me what I had planned was wrong. I mean that seriously, major lesson learned here to trust anyone. I wish I was told what to do from the start. But I relied on the expert with a well established store to tell me what I can and cannot do. Going forward I literally need to google pro's and cons of anything significant I buy.

Easy there. Your op sure sounded like what I responded to. It certainly doesn't mean that is in fact the case. Good luck.

[JasonG]

Originally Posted by SIKSUKR

Easy there. Your op sure sounded like what I responded to. It certainly doesn't mean that is in fact the case. Good luck.

No worries.

[jeffk]

One of the things about an extension cord, it's not only the cord, it's the supply line to the outlet you plug it into. Say you need a 10 Ga wire to meet the draw for the tub. So you get a heavy duty 10 Ga extension cord and plug it in. But the receptacle it is plugged into is wired with 12 or even 14 Ga wire. The draw will be too much for the line. A receptacle specifically wired for the tub would be 10 Ga all the way from the appropriate sized breaker.

I agree that the dealer should have strongly warned you and said it would void the warranty; even refuse to plug it in. That's good customer service. However, ultimately, they give us all the product paperwork so that WE can read it and be responsible for the product.

Yeah, I don't read mine either.

Bummer.

[Kamper]

My hot tub is 220v. That meant I needed a 'paired circuit' (not sure of the technical term). Was yours just 110v?

[JasonG]

Originally Posted by Kamper

My hot tub is 220v. That meant I needed a 'paired circuit' (not sure of the technical term). Was yours just 110v?

Yes, just 110v.

Electrician came by and installed a dedicated 20 amp line to the hot tub. Factory agreed to take care of the claim and understands both sides of the story.

[Major]

A related question. We purchased a Dimension One hot tub from Northern Pool and Spa. Unfortunately, it developed a small leak underneath the tub. The only options provided by Northern were to (1) remove the hot tub and ship it to Northern's Maine store to diagnose and repair the leak at a cost of $3,000, or (2) sell us a new hot tub. Our hot tub is only 8 years old and is kept indoors. Other than the leak, it's in excellent shape.

We've approached other hot tub dealers in the Lakes Region to see if they would repair the hot tub with no luck. They are interested in selling us a new one only.

Let me know if you know a repairman who can help. Thanks!

[Kamper]

Originally Posted by Major

A related question. (is this fixable?)

If you can locate the spot in the tub it's leaking from, a dab of gelcoat might do it.

Depending on the model, you may be able to remove all the side panel to see where the water is coming from. It might be a pipe issue.

Good luck!

[SIKSUKR]

Kind of unlikely its the tub itself leaking. When I had a leak I found it was a pwc fitting connecting the water jet hoses. It was buried inside of spray foam insulation so I had to do a bit of exploratory diging to find it. I had pretty good access so was not too big of a deal. fwiw

[Major]

We have removed the panels and cannot identify where the leak is coming from. It is my understanding that the unit needs to be raised off the floor, filled (at least partially) and run. As was suggested, it is most likely a pipe leak. Unfortunately, we can't do it ourselves.

[Reilly]

If the leak is small there is a product that you put in the tub & it seals from the inside , works great . google it

[noreast]

Originally Posted by JasonG

Well..that is not what I or the dealer said. As the dealer was done installing, filling with water, and plugged in the extension cord, he then suggested an outlet. Did not say it was required. Did not say it would void the warranty. Did not tell me it was a safety issue. Did not tell me I was wrong. But lesson learned to think that a dealer or sales person would actually tell me that what I was planning to do was wrong and would void a warranty.

Was not 6 weeks of using the tub straight and smelling burning. That would be crazy. It was found 6 weeks ago. Dealer came out for first repair ( and still plugged it back into an extension cord himself after the repair ). Use it for a few days and smelled the burning again. Unplugged. Tub has had a lot of down time the past 6 weeks.

Sure, throw blame on me for trusting someone to actually tell me what I had planned was wrong. I mean that seriously, major lesson learned here to trust anyone. I wish I was told what to do from the start. But I relied on the expert with a well established store to tell me what I can and cannot do. Going forward I literally need to google pro's and cons of anything significant I buy.

That's some passive approval plugging it back in himself, I'm posting this without reading the rest for some reason, my guess is the further along I read I will learn they're doing the right thing for you.

[Loub52]

Originally Posted by JasonG

I have one that is got me a bit confused and I would love some honest feedback. Am I the one to blame?

January 2016 I purchased a new hot tub. Dealer in NH and brand will remain nameless.

Dealer (the owner in all situations) came by, installed it, and saw my setup. This is key to the who issue, because my setup used an extension cord. Now being in the business of selling battery chargers, I was well aware that I could not use a cheap extension cord. So I purchased one that had a 50% buffer for the amp draw and was only 15 feet long. The cord never gets hot, was short, exterior grade, and easily can carry the current of the 12 amp hot tub.

But we have had issues with the tub recently. A slight burning smell from the hot tub over the past 6 weeks. I called the factory whom sent out the dealer to replace the main circuit board. Problem was still there with a burning smell, so I called the factory back. They said it is likely the pump and sent one out. This is all under warranty.

Today I call the dealer to arrange an install of the pump. He informs me my warranty was void and it would be a $170 service fee. Of course I questioned this. He tells me is was void because I used an extension cord. The factory warranty states the use of any extension cord immediately voids the warranty.

1 My first issue with this right away is when the dealer installed the tub in the first place, he knew it was getting plugged into an extension cord. If this was going to void my warranty, should he have said something right away? I would have gladly held off. He did suggest that I get a regular plug outlet to plug into, but nothing else.

2 When the dealer did the first repair, he did not inform me that it was out of warranty at all. He now calls that a courtesy warranty coverage. But if the first repair was a courtesy and cancelled my warranty, how did they send out the second part under warranty? He also question ME to make sure that I knew the problem was the pump and not something else. Huh? How would I know? I am asking the factory for help here.

3. When I called the factory about this issue, they had no idea about my warranty coverage being cancelled. At this point I am wondering what the dealer is talking about. Working with the same rep at the factory on this issue since day one, they knew I was using an extension cord before the first repair. She did confirm today that an extension cord can void the warranty.

At this point I have not heard back from the dealer or manufacturer. No idea which way this will turn.

Am I in the wrong here for any reason?

Hot tub on an extension cord. Really?

[JasonG]

So here is an interesting situation as a follow up.

After the factory spoke to me and the dealer, the factory deemed that the spa is still under warranty. Because of the miss communication from the dealer not telling us the extension cord they plugged in would break warranty, and the dealer using the cord again after the first warranty coverage repair, we were found to not be in violation of our warranty. Factory already sent us a replacement motor under warranty to deal with the current issue. We did get a dedicated 20 amp outlet installed with a weather proof cover.

But, there is a problem. Per the factory, the dealer is responsible for the labor part of the warranty. The factory did tell me that this is their agreement with their dealers, and there is no other dealer in NH. They also told me that the dealer is likely not going to cover the labor part of the warranty based on the discussion with them.

So yes, I have a full factory warranty with nothing cancelled if anything else should happen. But the labor to do the repair work will be the discretion of the dealer.

I have not heard from the dealer in a week. Email, calls, messages left. Neither the manager or owner are getting back in touch with me. At this point I have to assume they are not open to talking to me because they know they are going to have a point/counterpoint conversation with me.

What would you do? How much longer should I wait before contacting the attorney generals office?
Anyone else find it odd that the factory will cover my parts, and says I have a full warranty, dealer did a bad install, but no labor coverage because that is up to the dealer?

[noreast]

I'm not surprised at that outcome from the manufacturer at all, That's what they should do. I would be shocked if the dealer didn't just install it for you. Of course Not knowing everything that was said between you two could change things. As a former business owner, As long as It didn't get to heated, I would do it even if I thought you were completely wrong. Forums like these are very powerful in a small community.

[radioman]

Jason, if I were you, I would inform the dealer that the game is over and you will tell the story not only here, but to anyone willing to listen!! Including Names and addresses.

[radioman]

Jason, I forget to add, say this is not a threat but it is a promise.

[JasonG]

I look at this from the perspective of a business owner too. Once I find out I made a mistake with my customers for any reason, I do what I can to make it right 110%. I think for this reason, I expected it when the situation is reversed.

I really have no desire to post whom the dealer or factory is for the spa. It is not relative to the situation. Who knows, maybe something is going on there out of the norm and this is an odd duck situation. Anything I post regarding them here, yelp, etc, could haunt them. I just need a really good reason, especially at this point, to provide a name.

Will post updates.

[barefootbay]

I too approached a local spa dealer inquiring for a repair estimate on a leak in my hot tub manifold . I was given a verbal quote of at least $ 1000.00 to look at it
I subsequently acquired the necessary parts from an online hot tub parts supplier and made the necessary repairs for under $ 75.00. 3 yrs later ,working great !

[AB_Monterey]

My tub is going on 18 years now. I have replaced the motor/pump twice. (Two water connections, 1 electrical) It takes minutes. Really, this is a simple job. I've forgot to drain a line once and had it freeze when I drained the tub while we were away for the winter (poor design if you ask me). Re-plumbed it myself and added a 2nd drain plug.

If you end up going the DIY route, I work cheap :-)

[JasonG]

Originally Posted by AB_Monterey

My tub is going on 18 years now. I have replaced the motor/pump twice. (Two water connections, 1 electrical) It takes minutes. Really, this is a simple job. I've forgot to drain a line once and had it freeze when I drained the tub while we were away for the winter (poor design if you ask me). Re-plumbed it myself and added a 2nd drain plug.

If you end up going the DIY route, I work cheap :-)

You have a valid point, it looks super easy to swap out.