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Old 05-03-2021, 09:11 PM   #1
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Default Sandy Point Going Condo!

It looks like Sandy Point Resort will be sold to condo developers. The price is in the $10 million range.

The potential buyers are doing their due diligence now but there should be a closing before the end of the year.

At one time there were 77 units there but it looks like in condo form there will be about 36 units, with docks. There is over 2,000 feet of lake frontage.

One concern is whether to rehab existing units or build new on the existing footprints. Another concern is the septic system is located across the street so it requires a pump system. But, without town sewer that is better than having the system on the lake side of the street.

At one time the price would seem crazy but with the current real estate market maybe it isn't that out of whack!

Last edited by TiltonBB; 05-04-2021 at 06:35 AM.
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:18 AM   #2
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Do they build houses anymore ?
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:29 AM   #3
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Based on the the asking price for the units at Bartonís Motel. The developers have a chance to make a very nice dollar.


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Old 05-04-2021, 09:41 AM   #4
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I use to own a cottage directly across the bay from Sandy Point back in the late 70's. Alton Bay has changed so much.
This run up in prices will probably put the nail in the coffin for the rest of the motel style rentals.
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Old 05-04-2021, 10:01 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Biggd View Post
I use to own a cottage directly across the bay from Sandy Point back in the late 70's. Alton Bay has changed so much.
This run up in prices will probably put the nail in the coffin for the rest of the motel style rentals.
There's no money in motel style rentals...
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Old 05-04-2021, 10:13 AM   #6
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Default One other problem.

One other problem: Sandy Point is on seasonal town water. I believe the water is turned off from around Oct to April. Water lines can be found actually above ground in the vicinity of Sandy Point.

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Old 05-04-2021, 10:23 AM   #7
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There's no money in motel style rentals...
I know that but there still are a few left and now these motel owners will be cashing in.
The area is changing, more people are making it their home.
The resort feel of years ago is fading fast.
I have fond memories of camping at the track on motorcycle weekend and then a few years later moving up to the luxury digs of a 10x10 rental cabin, LOL!
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Old 05-04-2021, 10:31 AM   #8
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Default Sandy Point going Condo

I am not an Alton Bay resident, but I certainly hope the local government has strong planning ordinances to address what is obviously a questionable septic system.
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Old 05-04-2021, 10:47 AM   #9
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Donít understand how Alton has managed to avoid a sewer system with over 20 miles of heavily populated lake shore frontage. More and more of it is becoming 3 and 4 season residences as well.
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Old 05-04-2021, 11:31 AM   #10
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Internet driving directions say it is 9.3-miles from Sandy Point, Alton, going up Route 11 to Lake Shore Park in Gilford, next to Ellacoya State Park.

Lake Shore/Ellacoya has that very prominent septic pumping station shed so why not run a septic line from Sandy Point, 9.3-miles, to Lake Shore/Ellacoya!

That was easy! ....

With a regional sewer hook-up like that, Sandy Point in Alton could have more densely built condos, similar to Christmas Island, Laconia, or Lake Shore Park, Gilford.
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Old 05-04-2021, 02:28 PM   #11
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I am not an Alton Bay resident, but I certainly hope the local government has strong planning ordinances to address what is obviously a questionable septic system.
This could definitely be an issue! Does anyone know if the now vacant Sandy Point Restaurant is tied into the same system?
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Old 05-04-2021, 07:02 PM   #12
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From what I understand, everything on the property is tied to the same septic, with tanks throughout the property, pumping to a leach field across the street.
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Old 05-05-2021, 01:15 PM   #13
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If the number of units goes from 77 down to 36, the septic may be able to handle the reduced load. Docks around the lake are selling for $100K in 24-48 hours. Attach a nice condo and sales for $400K should be no problem. This will be interesting to follow. Thanks to folks like Upthesaukee for keeping us up to date.
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Old 05-05-2021, 06:52 PM   #14
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The 72 unit number would include all the hotel rooms in their original configuration. It will be interesting to see what the plans are for the property, existing structures, utilities and docks. Certainly a lot of potential there for a developer. Just going to be a matter of what the town will permit.
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Old 05-06-2021, 12:44 PM   #15
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Default Few motel units at Sandy Point

Sandy Point cottages went seasonal back in the 1980's. There are about 35 cottages all leased by the season. The Hillside motel was changed from 8 rooms to 4 two room efficiencies and they are also seasonal leases. Same thing with the unit below which was converted from 6 rooms to 3 seasonal efficiency units. The only actual motel units rented out weekly or overnight are the 12 rooms at the top of hill in the Scenic motel, and the 6 units on the beach which are also converted efficiencies which had originally been 10 one room units. Right now that makes about 53 units, no longer 77. Uppy is correct, the water is town water and is shut off from mid October to mid April as the water supply runs above ground at the bridge 1/ 2 east on Rt 11. Only the owner's residence has a well. All the cottages share septic systems which are pumped across the road to the leach field across from the restaurant building which is also on the shared system.

The condos being built at Barton's are a different story. There they have city sewers and year round water. Sandy Point is a little more rustic and I am sure the 1940's era shared septic and seasonal water will be an issue.
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Old 05-06-2021, 02:46 PM   #16
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Ha! Just wait till the NH DOT learns of this. If the the rentals/restaurant facilities in the front (the buildings on Rt. 11) get torn down, the DOT will want their right-of-way back. That'll seriously cut into the developer's profit margin! Nothin's easy!
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Old 05-06-2021, 04:42 PM   #17
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Ha! Just wait till the NH DOT learns of this. If the the rentals/restaurant facilities in the front (the buildings on Rt. 11) get torn down, the DOT will want their right-of-way back. That'll seriously cut into the developer's profit margin! Nothin's easy!
Are you talking about the old Railroad right of way?
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Old 05-06-2021, 05:17 PM   #18
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Ha! Just wait till the NH DOT learns of this. If the the rentals/restaurant facilities in the front (the buildings on Rt. 11) get torn down, the DOT will want their right-of-way back. That'll seriously cut into the developer's profit margin! Nothin's easy!
I remember hearing that the last room or 2 of the upper motel is within the ROW. I believe the ROW is 50 feet on either side of the center line of Route 11. Not sure if the restaurant building is also within the ROW as well as the 3 cottages below the embankment just east of the Sandy Point entrance.
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Old 05-07-2021, 08:01 AM   #19
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Default Railroad Right of Way

Gilford residence learned early on the state never left the right of way. In fact the Winnipesaukee Basin uses the right of way for the sewage pipe. They ran out of money before Ames Farm. There are still plans to continue the sewage all the way to Alton. Not sure if they will get funded, but I'm sure once they start testing the waters it will continue.
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Old 05-07-2021, 08:03 AM   #20
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The problem with extending the sewer is that the last I knew Franklin was at capacity if not over. Now maybe it has since been expanded if that is possible and I am not sure it is.
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Old 05-07-2021, 09:03 AM   #21
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Ugh ... I forgot about the leaching field/parking lot across the street. That's definitely in the DOT ROW; the developers can kiss that goodbye. Sigh .....
Life, in some ways, was better when the railroad was there; instead of a state highway!
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Old 05-07-2021, 09:18 AM   #22
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Default Sandy Point Condo

Having read all these posts, and seen the different little tidbits of information, this project looks to me to be something which will keep lawyers and surveyors busy for long time. Sandy Point is geographically a very sensitive area, and it would be a real shame if technicalities became the deciding issues with respect to development.
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Old 05-24-2021, 07:45 AM   #23
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It will be an interesting to see what Alton will allow a developer to do with the property, if the sale even goes through. The tax implications for the town could be quite significant if a condo project is approved.
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Old 05-28-2021, 10:45 PM   #24
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It will be interesting to see how DES Shorefront permitting looks at the change from seasonal to year-round development.
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Old 05-28-2021, 11:26 PM   #25
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Quote:
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It will be interesting to see how DES Shorefront permitting looks at the change from seasonal to year-round development.
But will they look at an existing structure?

Or at what point of refurbishments do they kick in DES Shorefront regulations?
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Old 05-29-2021, 10:10 AM   #26
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But will they look at an existing structure?

Or at what point of refurbishments do they kick in DES Shorefront regulations?
Last I experienced, seasonal to year round was a big deal for them.
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Old 05-29-2021, 11:22 AM   #27
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Seems like a shame to add more condos, Is there really a shortage of condos on Winnipesaukee???

Sandy Point going condo just shuts out visitors even more from getting a really nice lake experience.

I think a nice hotel/inn would so much more interesting. There are so few places to point people to where they can stay in a really modern/clean/nice hotel on the water.

I suppose the seasonal nature of the region makes an upscale resort not too likely, probably not profitable enough in the modern world.

As a kid there were so many nice family oriented but clean/nice and affordable places to stay on the lake. Now its all privately owned and prices are easily exceeding most peoples primary homes. Totally flip flopped from my childhood when Winnipesaukee waterfront homes with beach and dock were less than half the cost of peoples primary homes.

Progress, I guess,,,
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Old 05-29-2021, 02:40 PM   #28
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Seems like a shame to add more condos, Is there really a shortage of condos on Winnipesaukee???

Sandy Point going condo just shuts out visitors even more from getting a really nice lake experience.

I think a nice hotel/inn would so much more interesting. There are so few places to point people to where they can stay in a really modern/clean/nice hotel on the water.

I suppose the seasonal nature of the region makes an upscale resort not too likely, probably not profitable enough in the modern world.

As a kid there were so many nice family oriented but clean/nice and affordable places to stay on the lake. Now its all privately owned and prices are easily exceeding most peoples primary homes. Totally flip flopped from my childhood when Winnipesaukee waterfront homes with beach and dock were less than half the cost of peoples primary homes.

Progress, I guess,,,
Reading through the "Summer Staffing" thread, there are many reasons why running a hotel as you describe, is more rare these days. Nevertheless, you can rent many of these condos on VRBO, but usually not for just one night.
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Old 05-30-2021, 12:17 AM   #29
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Reading through the "Summer Staffing" thread, there are many reasons why running a hotel as you describe, is more rare these days. Nevertheless, you can rent many of these condos on VRBO, but usually not for just one night.
Im sure you are correct, but staying in a rented condo is not at all the same as a resort.

Clearly there are differences and for many there is still a preference for the hotel/resort over other options.

Not much we can do about it, what happens to Sandy Point is a private matter. I'm just a guy remembering what was very fondly and finding I'm far less happy with what is. I suppose it happens to each generation as we age. For me, the best I saw of Winnipesaukee probably ended in the early 70's and will not be seen again. Hard to forget playing pinball in the old game room on the lower level of Sandy Point, and going down to Downings Landing and that marvelous smell of the old marine gas and 2-cycle oil,,, or maybe the old donut shop next to the mini golf, or the old roller skating pavilion. I'm sure many people will have very different experiences and preferences.
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Old 05-30-2021, 04:51 AM   #30
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If the number of units goes from 77 down to 36, the septic may be able to handle the reduced load. Docks around the lake are selling for $100K in 24-48 hours. Attach a nice condo and sales for $400K should be no problem. This will be interesting to follow. Thanks to folks like Upthesaukee for keeping us up to date.
at 36 units they will have to sell in the $700 k to$800 k for any profit
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Old 05-30-2021, 08:11 AM   #31
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Keep in mind the new Condos on paugus bay are selling for well over 800k and only share a day dock


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Old 05-30-2021, 10:54 AM   #32
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This is all going to end very badly. Not sure why these idiots that are over paying for all of these properties don't see it. I saw this exact thing happen in Florida. two years later mass foreclosures and fire sale prices. People that don't learn from history are destined to repeat it. House across from me sold for $625K less than 2 years ago. Last month sold for $825K. Is it worth it? NO. The people getting hurt by all this craziness are the locals that can't afford to live here anymore. Hang tight folks and bank your money. The next realestate crash is coming. Be ready then. I will be.
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Old 05-30-2021, 11:23 AM   #33
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Keep in mind the new Condos on paugus bay are selling for well over 800k and only share a day dock


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Agreed, if this happens, I see million dollar plus selling prices. Most especially on the south end of the lake.
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Old 05-30-2021, 12:12 PM   #34
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This is all going to end very badly. Not sure why these idiots that are over paying for all of these properties don't see it. I saw this exact thing happen in Florida. two years later mass foreclosures and fire sale prices. People that don't learn from history are destined to repeat it. House across from me sold for $625K less than 2 years ago. Last month sold for $825K. Is it worth it? NO. The people getting hurt by all this craziness are the locals that can't afford to live here anymore. Hang tight folks and bank your money. The next realestate crash is coming. Be ready then. I will be.
The biggest difference I see today is a lot of properties are selling for cash, no mortgage means no foreclosure. So unless we see a major recession I don't see it any time soon but I do think the market will slow down.
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Old 05-30-2021, 01:10 PM   #35
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So unless we see a major recession I don't see it any time soon but I do think the market will slow down.
Back in 2004 2005 advise was to purchase any real estate as price will go up 10% -30%. Buy. Buy. Buy.

Then, much hit bottom.

Hmmm . . . .
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Old 05-30-2021, 02:13 PM   #36
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Back in 2004 2005 advise was to purchase any real estate as price will go up 10% -30%. Buy. Buy. Buy.

Then, much hit bottom.

Hmmm . . . .
Just think if you purchased in 2005 and held til now. You could be up 80-100%. Real estate should almost always be thought of as a long term investment unless your in the business of flipping homes. You would be hard to find real estate that decreased in value if it’s held for at least 5 years.


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Old 05-30-2021, 04:29 PM   #37
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Keep in mind the new Condos on paugus bay are selling for well over 800k and only share a day dock


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Big difference is the Paugus Bay townhouses are a good size. If the Sandy Point units have to be built on the original footprints, they will be a lot smaller. There may only be 36 units planned, but if they are year round and occupied longer, the septic may have to be totally redesigned and enlarged. Right now Sandy Point is really only busy on the weekends. Most of the leasees work during the week and use the camps for vacations and weekends. The Paugus Bay units have city water & sewers. Sandy Point has 1940's era septic and seasonal town water. The cottages are not insulated and have 1940's wiring as well. I would think besides the cost to buy, another $5M would be needed to improve the property. That is provided the town and DES allow what the developer has planned.
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Old 05-30-2021, 04:50 PM   #38
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The Paugus Bay units are all garden style units. Yes they have access to city water and sewer, but they are on Union Ave. Traffic year round.


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Old 06-20-2021, 05:30 PM   #39
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If they are talking about trying to convert the current cabins to 2 story condos on their current footprint, I canít see how they would be marketable. Your talking about $800 - 1000 sq ft. maybe, depending how the stairs layout for in excess of $500-$600K. It will be challenging to get those they DES and town regulations, but wish them luck.
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Old 06-20-2021, 07:15 PM   #40
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Default Way too much $$$

These same developers rebuilt an 8 unit colony on the Center Harbor/Moultonborough town line. The 2 story condos are either 2 or 3 bedroom units, the smaller ones having only 650 square feet! Along with a 25 foot dock, these units were priced from $639K to $695K. Hard to believe, but people actually paid those outrageous amounts. They are all under agreement. Here is the 650 sq footer that sold for $639K. I guess people have money to burn. I don't know if a bank would even give a mortgage for a small place like that on a platform. Is it worth it? Google "14 Lake Shore Drive. Moultonborough" to see these units. Again, there are only 8 units here while the proposal is for 36 units at Sandy Point. Add the state ROW issues along Route 11, and that complicates things.
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