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Old 09-03-2020, 12:37 PM   #1
XCR-700
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Unhappy Boat Washing

I have recently seen several references to "approved wash station" for boats.

Can anyone help me understand what is that exactly, and where are they???
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Old 09-03-2020, 02:55 PM   #2
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Default Approved?

Someplace where the soaps etc are contained and/or fed into a waste water treatment facility. Storm water drains often go straight to a local river so washing your car/boat on the roadside or driveway may send waste someplace you really don't want it to go. In some cities, storm drains commingle with septic and a variety of undesirable results can occur in a big storm. Newer MS4 regulations are trying to combat this but the remedies are expensive. (MS4=municipal storm sewer separation system). For similar reasons, it is not recommended that you pump your bilge or pull the drain plug while you are still on the launch ramp, draining back into the lake.
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Old 09-03-2020, 03:26 PM   #3
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The comment was in several web pages and it was very specific to Winnipesaukee.

A couple of the pages were from the Laconia Sun, which states as follows: Do not wash your boat in the lake — only at an approved wash station, or away from the lake. Use nontoxic, and chlorine- and phosphate-free cleaners.

So I am reading this as there is some "approved wash station" on Winnipesaukee, that you can wash you boat on the water.

Otherwise why would would they say "or away from the lake"

And again, if not on the Winnipesaukee at an approved wash station (in the water) why include the comment about "Use nontoxic, and chlorine- and phosphate-free cleaners"

This very confusing.

They make special boat wash specifically to be used while the boat is in the water, it is purposely engineered to be safe.

I feel certain I am either missing something (the most likely situation), or we are again facing zealots that are so extreme the only solution to meet their standards it to eradicate mankind.
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Old 09-03-2020, 04:11 PM   #4
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I think the reporter used unfortunate phrasing. DES publishes a procedures card for washing your boat. Most marinas have a supply. The intent is to wash the boat like you would the kitchen floor. Sponge wash and sponge rinse, collecting all water in your wash bucket. No hosing off. To clean after a rainstorm, wet dry with chamois and rinse in a bucket. Dispose of the waste water away from the lake. I know there are a lot of "harmless" products sold, but that's not really for use in the lake, or runoff into the lake, if you listen to DES.
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Old 09-03-2020, 05:34 PM   #5
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Clearly I need to do more research on this, but I just found this statement is also on the Lake Winnipesaukee Association web page!

And I know the marine "boat wash" manufacturers explicitly claim their products are safe for us in the water.

I also see the guy on Ship Shape washing boats in the water all the time and demos by the various vendors using their products are always on boats on the water.

Somewhere there is a disconnect.
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Old 09-03-2020, 06:59 PM   #6
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This article is a little dated, but the general ideas remains the same. Labelling something as "green" does not necessarily make it so - and how fast a product biodegrades is very important.

https://www.boatus.org/findings/47/
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Old 09-03-2020, 07:59 PM   #7
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This article is a little dated, but the general ideas remains the same. Labelling something as "green" does not necessarily make it so - and how fast a product biodegrades is very important.

https://www.boatus.org/findings/47/
Good read!

But we are still left with no location for this elusive approved wash station, and a nagging sense some think we should not wash boats in the water while there is clearly a whole industry dedicated to creating products for washing boats on the water.

The notion that you should not wash boats while in the water at all seems unrealistic and somewhat absurd to me. However I can see how finding environmentally safe products might be challenging.

Something tells me that my personal questions about whats reasonable regarding washing you boat on the water is likely not as simple as I had thought. Just hoping I dont find this is a much a tar-pit as so many of the discussions about COVID have been,,,
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Old 09-03-2020, 09:34 PM   #8
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Default 2020 Boat Wash Review

https://www.marinetalk.com/best-boat-washes/
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Old 09-04-2020, 07:52 AM   #9
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If you keep your boat waxed or better yet Ceramic Coated all you need is the lake water to keep it clean. I have two boats one that's waxed and the other Ceramic Coated and the dirt basically wipes right off both. Rain will actually clean the outside as well, the non-skid swim platform is spotless after a good heavy rain. However when I'm docked on the island I do have some trees overhanging the boats which requires a quick rinse and wipe most days. When I'm away one is one the mooring and the other in the Marina and in both of those spots they stay very clean.
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Old 09-04-2020, 08:03 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Formula260SS View Post
If you keep your boat waxed or better yet Ceramic Coated all you need is the lake water to keep it clean. I have two boats one that's waxed and the other Ceramic Coated and the dirt basically wipes right off both. Rain will actually clean the outside as well, the non-skid swim platform is spotless after a good heavy rain. However when I'm docked on the island I do have some trees overhanging the boats which requires a quick rinse and wipe most days. When I'm away one is one the mooring and the other in the Marina and in both of those spots they stay very clean.
Agreed, but once in a while a little soap is needed. And it appears you can get better (safer) products for those occasions.

Its been more than 20 years since I have dealt with a boat that does not come home with me on the trailer, so I would love to hear what others are using for when they do feel the need to wash the boat while in the lake.

Not talking about some every use ritual, but in the year I have owned this boat, only the rain has washed it and some maintenance is required and I think it can be done responsibly.

Lots of advertising hype out there and even the "expert" comparisons dont tell the whole story, so anything other Winnipesaukee boaters are willing to share is appreciated.

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Old 09-04-2020, 09:16 AM   #11
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Chemical Guys make a product called Waterless Car Wash. I've been using it this year on the topside with very good results. Spray on and wipe off with microfiber towels. I polish my every boat every year with Starbright Marine Polish with Teflon I get at West marine. When the waterline starts to show on the hull I just swim around the boat with a sponge and it wipes right off.
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Old 09-04-2020, 09:38 AM   #12
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Default Ceramic Coating

Quote:
Originally Posted by Formula260SS View Post
If you keep your boat waxed or better yet Ceramic Coated all you need is the lake water to keep it clean. I have two boats one that's waxed and the other Ceramic Coated and the dirt basically wipes right off both. Rain will actually clean the outside as well, the non-skid swim platform is spotless after a good heavy rain. However when I'm docked on the island I do have some trees overhanging the boats which requires a quick rinse and wipe most days. When I'm away one is one the mooring and the other in the Marina and in both of those spots they stay very clean.
I agree. I had my 1994 Sea Ray Ceramic coated this year. (Diamond Shine). Very pleased. For those times when you just can't tear yourself away from the soap habit, there are cleaning processes that don't need to be flushed into the lake.
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Old 09-04-2020, 12:13 PM   #13
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Thumbs up Thanks to NH Marine Patrol

I would not call it exhaustive research so far, but I have not found anything that says ceramic finish treated boats do not need to be washed with soap.

So far I have found just the opposite, where that was listed as one of the myths and you were warned to make sure you washed your boat frequently with soap to preserve the expensive ceramic finish/treatment, and I even found some info raising concerns that PH neutral soap is not the best choice to get the dirt off the ceramic treatment.

Also my boat is a Formula, so it is not just gelcoat, but it is also painted with an automotive type paint.

On the Formula site they specifically recommend Boat Zoap and they talk about "lathering" down the boat and show a team working on a boat at the dock.

So based on that I decided to call the NH Marine Patrol folks and ask if there were any restrictions, or prohibitions or guidance on washing boats in the water.

Feeling a bit like a fool for such a stupid question, I actually apologized in advance and said this is probably the stupidest question you will get. The person I spoke to laughed and said I was not even close to the stupidest question he has been asked

Super nice guy!

He actually said he was happy to have someone ask and informed me that it is not a fine-able offense and they recognize boat maintenance is necessary and important, but that they hope people will use common sense and not over do it or use harsh industrial products.

I was very impressed not only by his people skills and demeanor, but it was also clear that I was speaking to someone who had a clue about boats and the lake. This is EXACTLY what you hope to get in a civil servant for your tax dollars!

Sadly I did not get his name, but if they are reading this thread or anyone knows who I was talking to, please pass along my appreciation for not treating me like an idiot and for providing clear and concise guidance.

Last edited by XCR-700; 09-04-2020 at 01:09 PM.
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Old 09-04-2020, 02:02 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by XCR-700 View Post
I would not call it exhaustive research so far, but I have not found anything that says ceramic finish treated boats do not need to be washed with soap.

So far I have found just the opposite, where that was listed as one of the myths and you were warned to make sure you washed your boat frequently with soap to preserve the expensive ceramic finish/treatment, and I even found some info raising concerns that PH neutral soap is not the best choice to get the dirt off the ceramic treatment.

Also my boat is a Formula, so it is not just gelcoat, but it is also painted with an automotive type paint.

On the Formula site they specifically recommend Boat Zoap and they talk about "lathering" down the boat and show a team working on a boat at the dock.

So based on that I decided to call the NH Marine Patrol folks and ask if there were any restrictions, or prohibitions or guidance on washing boats in the water.

Feeling a bit like a fool for such a stupid question, I actually apologized in advance and said this is probably the stupidest question you will get. The person I spoke to laughed and said I was not even close to the stupidest question he has been asked

Super nice guy!

He actually said he was happy to have someone ask and informed me that it is not a fine-able offense and they recognize boat maintenance is necessary and important, but that they hope people will use common sense and not over do it or use harsh industrial products.

I was very impressed not only by his people skills and demeanor, but it was also clear that I was speaking to someone who had a clue about boats and the lake. This is EXACTLY what you hope to get in a civil servant for your tax dollars!

Sadly I did not get his name, but if they are reading this thread or anyone knows who I was talking to, please pass along my appreciation for not treating me like an idiot and for providing clear and concise guidance.
When my ceramic coating was done, they gave me a spray bottle of cleaner/polish and some micro fiber cloths. The instructions were to wet the boat down, spray stuff on the cloths and wipe it down. No "washing" needed.
I'd guess the Formula picture was not taken in NH, or next to a water intake for somebody who uses lake supply for domestic use. Yes, there is no fine- able offense, but this is not an MP issue. I think you will get more complete answers from DES. I haven't seen Boat Zoap on the shelves in ages, but I think they also used to sell a bilge cleaner. Pour it in, add water, slosh it around and let the bilge pump empty the oil, dirt, anti-freeze etc into the lake, along with the soap. That just transfers junk from your bilge into the lake. Now, THAT'S a plan.
Sorry I can't continue the conversation, but I'm going boating this weekend. Enjoy your weekend.


it
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Old 09-04-2020, 02:39 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Descant View Post
When my ceramic coating was done, they gave me a spray bottle of cleaner/polish and some micro fiber cloths. The instructions were to wet the boat down, spray stuff on the cloths and wipe it down. No "washing" needed.
I'd guess the Formula picture was not taken in NH, or next to a water intake for somebody who uses lake supply for domestic use. Yes, there is no fine- able offense, but this is not an MP issue. I think you will get more complete answers from DES. I haven't seen Boat Zoap on the shelves in ages, but I think they also used to sell a bilge cleaner. Pour it in, add water, slosh it around and let the bilge pump empty the oil, dirt, anti-freeze etc into the lake, along with the soap. That just transfers junk from your bilge into the lake. Now, THAT'S a plan.
Sorry I can't continue the conversation, but I'm going boating this weekend. Enjoy your weekend.


it
What Descant said..... anything that goes into the water is a no no at my place.
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Old 09-04-2020, 03:18 PM   #16
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I think anyone would agree putting bilge cleaner in your boat and pumping the results overboard is not reasonable, but then in 2020 I would hope most of you folks on the water would not simply be rolling a hose into the lake and using that for your drinking water supply without a robust filtration system,,, Arguably that's not very responsible either.

As in the other thread going on at the moment, you are much more likely to succumb to some aliment from a parasite than a cap-full of soap.

But that's your call.

Also based on what I read in some of these websites about boat soap, you should be MUCH more concerned about your waterless/no rinse cleaners, apparently they tend to contain the most harsh of chemicals. I get that you are not rinsing them off, but you are breathing them and you will get water on the hull that will wash over the surface you just cleaned, so please beware that serious concerns are being raised about those products.

I remember when we all thought Trichloroethane was the best cleaner possible because it smelled good and evaporated quickly and did not leave a mess of liquid to worry about, then we learned how bad it was. Now so many of us have respiratory problems its practically an epidemic of old people with inhalers and oxygen tanks,,,

I seriously doubt in the grand scheme of things a cap-full of modern marine soap is the worst thing you are exposed to in Winnipesaukee water.

That said, we all need to be careful and make reasonable decisions not just for ourselves, but the people around us.

Happy and Safe boating this weekend!
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