Marine Patrol Woes...LDS

[sunset on the dock]

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...054b085dd.html

Interesting article in today's LDS. We certainly have noticed fewer patrol boats than in the past. A stronger presence is needed in terms of 150' rule violations, wake boat issues, NWZ violations, and speeding on all parts of the lake.

[LIforrelaxin]

This is not at all surprising. As attractive is the job sounds being on the water all day. Dealing with the boating public isn't a cake walk. As the next new generation of boaters has happened onto the scene you see a lot of arrogant and self entitled attitudes.... the Marine Patrol officers have to deal with that.... I do not envy them.

This past spring I was in a position to help the Marine Patrol understand if there was anything wrong when I discovered a boat loose on some rocks, and then a short distance away the gas tank and battery for that boat on a beach... It was a neat experience, as we collaborated, we got each other to the point where we felt comfortable that no one was in the immediate area hurt and in distress...

The officers in the Marine Patrol division, have a love and respect for the water and it shows... But they also have to put up with a lot of non-sense..... Hopefully they will have some luck with recruitment through the winter.......

[Biggd]

Law enforcement everywhere is struggling to fill positions.
It's a sad state of affairs as they are restricted by social media in the ability to do the job that needs to be done.
Criminals have the upper hand as everything is manipulated by public video posting which riles up the masses.
Criminals will always be criminals, but the posting of criminal activity encourages other people that would not normally act that way to believe they are entitled to act that way, JMO!

[WinnisquamZ]

True. Laconia PD placed a large advertisement on social media looking for applicants


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[Garcia]

Originally Posted by sunset on the dock

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news...054b085dd.html

Interesting article in today's LDS. We certainly have noticed fewer patrol boats than in the past. A stronger presence is needed in terms of 150' rule violations, wake boat issues, NWZ violations, and speeding on all parts of the lake.

I know the job is not a cakewalk - but my longtime hope and plan is when I "retire" from education to work for the marine patrol. Still a few years away!

[ITD]

Hmm, what could have happened to cause people not to want to serve as police officers?

[AC2717]

Originally Posted by Garcia

I know the job is not a cakewalk - but my longtime hope and plan is when I "retire" from education to work for the marine patrol. Still a few years away!

I have been thinking the same thing, but alas I am only in my 40s and working full time but have anyways wanted to join up

[thinkxingu]

In addition to being a questionably awesome job—how many boaters needing attention are sober?—the part-time/seasonal piece is incredibly challenging. And the $23.xx training wage is not a huge sell.

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[Biggd]

Originally Posted by ITD

Hmm, what could have happened to cause people not to want to serve as police officers?

My guess would be the growing number of hate groups expanding thru social media.

[tummyman]

Remember, these folks are all certified State Police Officers and carry firearms. They are also the law enforcement people for all the islands as well. And at times, not a lot of backup to assist. Not as easy a job as in the past when it was college kids. etc. and no firearm requirement. I have total respect for each and every Marine Patrol Officer !! Tough job.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

In addition to being a questionably awesome job—how many boaters needing attention are sober?—the part-time/seasonal piece is incredibly challenging. And the $23.xx training wage is not a huge sell.

Sent from my SM-S911U using Tapatalk

It is a lot to go through for a six months 40hr job.
And our expanding population means that becoming a local LEO gives better pay, benefits, year round employment, and the opportunity for overtime.

[Descant]

Don't we have similar problems with F & G and State Police? ~20 years ago we changed from MP as the Division of Safety Services to be part of State Police. The incentive was, we got a lot of money from Homeland security to patrol the coast 12 months a year. Concord's eyes lit up. Maine, on the other hand, with hundreds of miles of coast, let the USCG do that job and combined Inland marine services with Fish and Wildlife. More year round jobs with similar duties. We should have taken that route IMHO.
We have ~4500 miles of state highways and ~6500 miles of snowmobile/ATV trails, and 960 lakes and ponds. I'd be happy to see more CO's and MP's. As for State Police, their numbers are down too, but it appears they do things like accident investigation and construction site monitoring, that don't require a fully trained, gun carrying trooper.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by thinkxingu

In addition to being a questionably awesome job—how many boaters needing attention are sober?—the part-time/seasonal piece is incredibly challenging. And the $23.xx training wage is not a huge sell.

Sent from my SM-S911U using Tapatalk

$23/hour for this job is an embarrassment to us a society.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by Descant

Don't we have similar problems with F & G and State Police? ~20 years ago we changed from MP as the Division of Safety Services to be part of State Police. The incentive was, we got a lot of money from Homeland security to patrol the coast 12 months a year. Concord's eyes lit up. Maine, on the other hand, with hundreds of miles of coast, let the USCG do that job and combined Inland marine services with Fish and Wildlife. More year round jobs with similar duties. We should have taken that route IMHO.
We have ~4500 miles of state highways and ~6500 miles of snowmobile/ATV trails, and 960 lakes and ponds. I'd be happy to see more CO's and MP's. As for State Police, their numbers are down too, but it appears they do things like accident investigation and construction site monitoring, that don't require a fully trained, gun carrying trooper.

I think the F&G issue is a bit different. They have more to do than law enforcement. So they have a lot of personnel that are not LEO, or even vaguely related.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

$23/hour for this job is an embarrassment to us a society.

Years ago, Winter Harbor used to see many "boating stops", lasting 10-15 minutes. One time, when a Jet Ski (from Washington, DC) was given a written warning not to tow a skier after sunset, they were called back when the Jet Ski resumed the infraction. The Jet Ski was towed away!

Lately, with one exception, their job is to "show the flag". The exception? Winter Harbor's hit-and-run, when two MPs were sighted patrolling in a single morning. This was the second major boating event I could have seen from my porch. (The first was an under-aged operator Jet Ski fatality, of which there was zero follow-up).

That this $23 job can be filled at all is a testament to being paid over $100 a day to boat on Lake Winnipesaukee--plus having law enforcement experience on one's résumé.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by ApS

Years ago, Winter Harbor used to see many "boating stops", lasting 10-15 minutes. One time, when a Jet Ski (from Washington, DC) was given a written warning not to tow a skier after sunset, they were called back when the Jet Ski resumed the infraction. The Jet Ski was towed away!

Lately, with one exception, their job is to "show the flag". The exception? Winter Harbor's hit-and-run, when two MPs were sighted patrolling in a single morning. This was the second major boating event I could have seen from my porch. (The first was an under-aged operator Jet Ski fatality, of which there was zero follow-up).

That this $23 job can be filled at all is a testament to being paid over $100 a day to boat on Lake Winnipesaukee--plus having law enforcement experience on one's résumé.

You tie yourself in knots:

The job is reduced to waving the flag because they are understaffed at $23/hour

Getting paid $100/day to ride in a boat might be fun on a Sunday a couple of times a summer. That's very different than trying to pay the bills EVERY day while worrying about jet skiing jerks, drunks, people who might require you to draw your gun...

We undervalue our police (and firefighters, teachers, and other folks who are the backbone of our society) at our own peril

[SAMIAM]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

$23/hour for this job is an embarrassment to us a society.

It's only a seasonal job. Dont think $23 is outrageous considering they are paid for all training which gives them a very marketable skill
Wonder if bennies are included

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

You tie yourself in knots:

The job is reduced to waving the flag because they are understaffed at $23/hour

Getting paid $100/day to ride in a boat might be fun on a Sunday a couple of times a summer. That's very different than trying to pay the bills EVERY day while worrying about jet skiing jerks, drunks, people who might require you to draw your gun...

We undervalue our police (and firefighters, teachers, and other folks who are the backbone of our society) at our own peril

Imagine that, you and I in 100% agreement!

Whats next, world peace,,, nah,,, but its a start.

ATB

[Garcia]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

It's only a seasonal job. Dont think $23 is outrageous considering they are paid for all training which gives them a very marketable skill
Wonder if bennies are included

As I said earlier, I am interested in joining once I stop doing what I do know. The pay would be fine because it will be something extra; I could not live on it. Health insurance would be a huge plus as that is not part of my current retirement plan/package.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

It's only a seasonal job. Dont think $23 is outrageous considering they are paid for all training which gives them a very marketable skill
Wonder if bennies are included

I don't think they do benefits for the part timers.
The marketable skill is what causes the issue.

It is easy to switch from part time MP to full time on a local PD and get the same pay with a full benefit package.
You could start as MP one year, and be PD the next.

[Weekend Pundit]

Originally Posted by WinnisquamZ

True. Laconia PD placed a large advertisement on social media looking for applicants

Gilford PD is in the same boat. They've even gone so far as to use roadside LED signs to advertise for applicants as well as social media and so on.

[Weekend Pundit]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Getting paid $100/day to ride in a boat might be fun on a Sunday a couple of times a summer. That's very different than trying to pay the bills EVERY day while worrying about jet skiing jerks, drunks, people who might require you to draw your gun...

Dealing with the larger pool of Cap'n Boneheads out there is bad enough for us regular boaters. It's got to be even more of a pain to deal with them in a law enforcement role.

It seems to me many of the new boaters out there forgot everything they learned to get their Boating Certificate 5 seconds after they receive it. It's one reason I rarely make it out onto the lake on weekends, and if I do, it's usually late in the day about an hour or so before sunset. I head over to Timber Island, anchor in the cove and watch the sun set.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

I don't think they do benefits for the part timers.
The marketable skill is what causes the issue.

It is easy to switch from part time MP to full time on a local PD and get the same pay with a full benefit package.
You could start as MP one year, and be PD the next.

...or the reverse...

Entire police departments are quitting.
https://www.npr.org/2021/06/24/10095...y-from-the-job

If you could cite burnout, low morale, assassinations, and departments' scrutiny in a "northern-tier state" (geographically similar to NH). Wouldn't you take an NHMP job, considering the pay is similar, but working conditions are much nicer?

[John Mercier]

If you want to make $23 per hour, have no bennies, and can survive on only six months pay... sure.

[Descant]

I know two guys who worked NHMP and ski patrol in the winter. One went on to full time State Police, the other to head safety services at one of our major ski areas. When you're young, benefits aren't the big deal they are for folks with families.

[ITD]

It's a part time seasonal job.

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by Descant

I know two guys who worked NHMP and ski patrol in the winter. One went on to full time State Police, the other to head safety services at one of our major ski areas. When you're young, benefits aren't the big deal they are for folks with families.

Contrary to popular belief... the young aren't stupid.
If a skill set that they have already trained for can pay more with benefits... they take that option.

It is why everyone jumps jobs so much.
Its a race to see who can save for a down payment on a home, while saving enough to make up for a retirement that has to be more self-funded than in previous generations.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

If you want to make $23 per hour, have no bennies, and can survive on only six months pay... sure.

Those of us who have boated on Lake Winnipesaukee for more than 70 years remember the Marine Patrol Reserve--who were paid nothing.

Why the Marine Patrol Reserve was dissolved needs another examination.

[Descant]

Originally Posted by ApS

Those of us who have boated on Lake Winnipesaukee for more than 70 years remember the Marine Patrol Reserve--who were paid nothing.

Why the Marine Patrol Reserve was dissolved needs another examination.

That question came to mind recently. The Auxiliary (?) reserve(?) was active in the 80's. I knew two of the group commanders and it seems they both had personnel (not personal) issues with the MP liaison and they resigned. If you dig back into your 70 years experience, recall that until the late 60's, there was no Marine Patrol. The Public Utilities Commission had two Steelcraft boats based in the Weirs Channel. Their duties revolved around maintaining aids to navigation (buoys and flashers) and they published navigation charts which were clear and uncluttered, easy to read. There was no 150' rule., NRZ, etc etc. Not many rules, so not many rule breakers. Many boaters belonged to the US Power Squadron and there was a lot of professionalism in boat operation. The federal clean water act pushed states to make rules about boat discharges and staying overnight on anchor or at public docks was banned. Once you start making rules you have to create an enforcement mechanism. They field complaints and push for more rules.
Now we have the internet where everybody can complain that we don't enforce or obey all these rules.

[tis]

We had an auxiliary in Winter Harbor and he used his own boat.

[John Mercier]

Remove MP from the State Police and station them under the F&G.
All water vehicles to register in NH... like snowmobile and OHRV.

And align field personnel to year round positions.

[fatlazyless]

The standards for NH-boaters could be raised by requiring boat license applicants to swim a one half mile, open water swim from the Marine Patrol dock, out and around Pig Island ... http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...to=8577&sort=1 .... and back, in order to get a NH motor boat license.

It's not the Marine Patrol that needs improving, it's the motor boater who need to pass a new and improved, more difficult boat license test and then have to redo this swim test, every five years. ......

[ApS]

Originally Posted by tis

We had an auxiliary in Winter Harbor and he used his own boat.

Yes, MP Auxiliary.

i'd conflated the term with my Dad's USN Fleet Reserve.

[XCR-700]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

The standards for NH-boaters could be raised by requiring boat license applicants to swim a one half mile, open water swim from the Marine Patrol dock, out and around Pig Island ... http://www.winnipesaukee.com/photopo...to=8577&sort=1 .... and back, in order to get a NH motor boat license.

It's not the Marine Patrol that needs improving, it's the motor boater who need to pass a new and improved, more difficult boat license test and then have to redo this swim test, every five years. ......

With or without a noodle???