septic question

winterh · 10-23-2013, 09:04 PM

looking at a waterfront home that has 3 bedrooms and a guest cottage for a total of 4 bedrooms. Site assessment says current use exceeds lot capacity but existing use is grandfathered. No problems evident with existing system. Home was built in the 70's
So what does all that mean? If I need to replace at some point and lot can only support a 2 BR system will they make me get rid of guest house or other bedrooms? Can I improve home as long as I do not add BR's?

tis · 10-24-2013, 07:15 AM

We had a permit for four bedrooms which was grandfathered. When we tore the houses down, we could only get a permit for the 2 bedroom septic.
So be very careful if you want the 4 bedroom septic.

winterh · 10-24-2013, 08:00 AM

Not looking to tear down but may want to improve. Just want to make sure i can kep the rooms and guest house I have if septic fails or not

ishoot308 · 10-24-2013, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winterh

Not looking to tear down but may want to improve. Just want to make sure i can kep the rooms and guest house I have if septic fails or not

Yes you can keep the rooms! I can't answer your other questions but I do know if you ever wanted to sell the home you could only advertise it based on what your septic capacity is.

I wouldn't worry too much about overloading the system unless you have the guest house and extra bedrooms booked every day. Care should be taken when you do have a full house for a few days, don't do five loads of laundry and 10 showers every day!

We have three bedrooms and a bunkhouse but our septic is rated for two. It's only me and my wife most of the time so what difference does it make having the other bedrooms?? Yes when we have multiple guests we are careful, but simply using those other rooms occasionally certainly is not a problem whatsoever.

Good Luck!

Dan

songkrai · 10-24-2013, 09:17 AM

Not sure what the rules are today. Best to quietly check up on such.

I did view a "new" home construction on the lake.
But this "new" home was a remodel.
The builder/owner left one 8' (foot) stud section on foundation/concrete. All sheet rock, insulation, siding, etc removed. The whole rest of the house was removed.
Then they built a complete house around this one 8' section of wall.
This is the 3rd house built on this site in my lifetime.
Second septic probably around the 1970's.

Best to read up on the rules.

DickR · 10-24-2013, 09:36 AM

Another thing to consider is your future planned or possible use of the property. Even if what's there is grandfathered, that won't help if the system fails down the road and you can't replace it with an adequate and legal system. You might want to pay for your own septic assessment/opinion from a system designer, with ultimate replacement in mind.

Lakegeezer · 10-24-2013, 11:49 AM

The state is willing to work with you if your plan makes sense and is the best for the situation. When we replaced our system, several years before a remodel, seven wavers were required to get something useful and yet environmentally safe. We had to move a culvert away from the field and use double wall pipe from the tank to the field because it went under a seasonal stream. The local septic designers can help you figure out what is best.

In the end, you want to make sure the tank doesn't leak and the field leaches slowly, even in heavy rain. The downside to not doing it right is more aquatic plants and eventually more muck along your shoreline.

AKADQ · 10-24-2013, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by winterh

looking at a waterfront home that has 3 bedrooms and a guest cottage for a total of 4 bedrooms. Site assessment says current use exceeds lot capacity but existing use is grandfathered. No problems evident with existing system. Home was built in the 70's
So what does all that mean? If I need to replace at some point and lot can only support a 2 BR system will they make me get rid of guest house or other bedrooms? Can I improve home as long as I do not add BR's?

I just went through this very same situation with an old camp we bought last year. A four bedroom main house with a one bedroom guest cottage. When we purchased we knew we needed to replace the septic system. You first need to get someone over there to do a septic design for you. Although you are grandfathered for your existing septic, it does not guarantee that you get to keep what you have. We ended up losing a bedroom in the main house in order to keep the existing one bedroom in the guest house. I felt it was a give and take wit the state and a win win for me. Yes I lost a bedroom in the main house but got to keep the one bedroom in the guest house...

songkrai · 10-24-2013, 07:12 PM

Best to read up on the difference between a bedroom and a regular room.
You can have as many regular rooms as you want.

ApS · 10-24-2013, 07:31 PM

You might be able to increase the number of bedrooms.

• If your access is from a private roadway, check across that road. There may be land available for sale to put in a leach field / tank that would be acceptable.

• There is a crushed Florida rock available that inhibits the release of phosphates and nitrogen into lakes; however, it may not be feasible for delivery to New England.

Quote:

Originally Posted by songkrai

Best to read up on the difference between a bedroom and a regular room. You can have as many regular rooms as you want.

...and can sleep in them...

Kamper · 10-27-2013, 08:11 AM

In general...

You can repair and maintain grandfatherred installations as long as you don't substantially alter the infrastructure that interacts with those features. If you reduce the 'load' from a 4 bedroom house to a 2 bedroom house you will probably pass through the permitting process without difficuly, if your current system is appropriate for a 2 bedroom system. If you decided later to adjust back to a 4 bedroom facility you will need a variance or may be required to upgrade the system if possible. Approval is not guaranteed.

Some items, like septic systems, may require that you bring them up to current code if/when they need major maintenance. For example: If you use a leach-tank instead of a leach field. People use to just cover these over with timber and dirt. Youare not required to dig them up and replace the cover with metal until the timbers fail or you dig it up to clear the silt out of it. You will able to retain that facility even if leach-tanks are no longer up to code for new installations.

That's all I think I know about that...

10-23-2013, 09:04 PM	#1
winterh Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 230 Thanks: 21 Thanked 119 Times in 54 Posts	septic question looking at a waterfront home that has 3 bedrooms and a guest cottage for a total of 4 bedrooms. Site assessment says current use exceeds lot capacity but existing use is grandfathered. No problems evident with existing system. Home was built in the 70's So what does all that mean? If I need to replace at some point and lot can only support a 2 BR system will they make me get rid of guest house or other bedrooms? Can I improve home as long as I do not add BR's?

10-24-2013, 11:49 AM	#7
Lakegeezer Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 1,657 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 342 Thanked 618 Times in 278 Posts	The state is willing to work with you if your plan makes sense and is the best for the situation. When we replaced our system, several years before a remodel, seven wavers were required to get something useful and yet environmentally safe. We had to move a culvert away from the field and use double wall pipe from the tank to the field because it went under a seasonal stream. The local septic designers can help you figure out what is best. In the end, you want to make sure the tank doesn't leak and the field leaches slowly, even in heavy rain. The downside to not doing it right is more aquatic plants and eventually more muck along your shoreline. __________________ -lg

10-24-2013, 07:15 AM	#2
tis Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,408 Thanks: 719 Thanked 1,381 Times in 957 Posts	We had a permit for four bedrooms which was grandfathered. When we tore the houses down, we could only get a permit for the 2 bedroom septic. So be very careful if you want the 4 bedroom septic.

10-24-2013, 08:00 AM	#3
winterh Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 230 Thanks: 21 Thanked 119 Times in 54 Posts	Not looking to tear down but may want to improve. Just want to make sure i can kep the rooms and guest house I have if septic fails or not

10-24-2013, 09:17 AM	#5
songkrai Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 725 Thanks: 35 Thanked 145 Times in 98 Posts	Not sure what the rules are today. Best to quietly check up on such. I did view a "new" home construction on the lake. But this "new" home was a remodel. The builder/owner left one 8' (foot) stud section on foundation/concrete. All sheet rock, insulation, siding, etc removed. The whole rest of the house was removed. Then they built a complete house around this one 8' section of wall. This is the 3rd house built on this site in my lifetime. Second septic probably around the 1970's. Best to read up on the rules.

10-24-2013, 09:36 AM	#6
DickR Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 735 Thanks: 4 Thanked 254 Times in 166 Posts	Another thing to consider is your future planned or possible use of the property. Even if what's there is grandfathered, that won't help if the system fails down the road and you can't replace it with an adequate and legal system. You might want to pay for your own septic assessment/opinion from a system designer, with ultimate replacement in mind.

10-24-2013, 07:12 PM	#9
songkrai Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 725 Thanks: 35 Thanked 145 Times in 98 Posts	Best to read up on the difference between a bedroom and a regular room. You can have as many regular rooms as you want.

The Following User Says Thank You to songkrai For This Useful Post:
dpg (10-25-2013)

10-27-2013, 08:11 AM	#11
Kamper Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Thornton's Ferry Posts: 1,296 Thanks: 67 Thanked 166 Times in 126 Posts	In general... You can repair and maintain grandfatherred installations as long as you don't substantially alter the infrastructure that interacts with those features. If you reduce the 'load' from a 4 bedroom house to a 2 bedroom house you will probably pass through the permitting process without difficuly, if your current system is appropriate for a 2 bedroom system. If you decided later to adjust back to a 4 bedroom facility you will need a variance or may be required to upgrade the system if possible. Approval is not guaranteed. Some items, like septic systems, may require that you bring them up to current code if/when they need major maintenance. For example: If you use a leach-tank instead of a leach field. People use to just cover these over with timber and dirt. Youare not required to dig them up and replace the cover with metal until the timbers fail or you dig it up to clear the silt out of it. You will able to retain that facility even if leach-tanks are no longer up to code for new installations. That's all I think I know about that...