Meredith SB-2 petition

[fatlazyless]

Both the Meredith Center Store and George's Dinner have the SB-2 petition for any Meredith resident if you care to sign it. It was easy, took about one minute, and the nice lady behind the counter even lent me a pen to use.

There are actually two petitions, one for Meredith school business, and one for Meredith town business, and the two petitions need your signature and address.

What is SB-2, which stands for Senate Bill 2? It would change the method for voting from the existing town meeting style to a ballot style similar to how we vote for candidates.

Typically, the town meeting style is done at the end of the town meeting held on the 2nd tuesday night in March. It can easily be 10pm before a vote is taken, and then it's done by a show of hands in the open town meeting.

Typically, the SB-2 ballot style would also be done on the second Tuesday of March in the Community Center but from between 7am-7pm, with a private booth, paper ballot.

With SB-2, absentee voting is possible so that people in the military, or people in Florida for the winter for example, could vote.

Alton, Gilford and other towns have chosen the SB-2 system.

How do I know about this? First off, I personally have absolutely nothing to do with creating the petition. I am just a forum blabbermouth who likes to read the Laconia Daily Sun. After reading a letter to the editor in today's LaDaSun, I stopped at George's Dinner, and sure enough, the very nice lady behind the counter handed me the two petitions to read and sign. Did not cost me even a dime!

[fatlazyless]

Here's a quote I found in www.democracyfornewhampshire.com, written by paul 01/17/2007
......................................

I agree with Cosy - SB 2 is an improvement. For 20 years starting in 1973 I lived mostly in Amherst and Milford and recall the Town Meeting approach as quaint and in its' way charming...but dominated by the few, and subject to intimidation and manipulaton. And decisions were made by an appallingly small percentage of town residents.

The notion that traditional Town Meeting participants are better informed, and thus better able to reach the right decision may sometimes be true. But this is still the rule of minority. And often the winning decision isn't necessarily that of the "informed": winners are often "townies" or residents who have been in town the longest, or those who have a strong attachment to a position or benefit from it, or those who can pack the hall with supporters. I recall a case where nursing homes were emptied and seniors bused in, by a well organized effort over a school issue, that blocked many citizens from access to the hall.

The fundamenal principle of our Democracy is that each American has the right to cast a vote. The constitution does not say "an informed vote" and often we pay the price for a poorly informed, misled, or apathetic electorate. The proper way to address this is to engage the electorate, not to hope that they don't turn out - or worse, erect barriers.

We should always support methods of Democratic decision making that permit and encourage the most citizens to participate. Traditional Town Meeting has many barriers to participation that SB 2 tears down. The requirement that one be present at a particular date and time to vote; that one must endure long and uncomfortable meetings; that one must stay to the end lest something happen after most people have left, subverting the will of the majority; that one's opinions and votes are not necessarily confidential; that one can be subject to harrassment and intimidation and that due to constrained facilities and fire codes, only a small portion of the electorate can physically participate.

The voting machine issue is a seperate topic. I am deeply concerned about them as anyone. But the first principle is to let people vote. How we count the votes is a vitally important detail, but it cannot subvert the principle.

We can find appropriate ways to count under SB 2. That issue should not be a barrier to the benefits of SB 2 for more communities.
..............................

[Argie's Wife]

Is Meredith in a SAU situation with other towns?

Just wondering, because Alton is in a JMA (joint maintenance agreement) with Barnstead for the high school and it's sorta a pain with getting warrant articles to the public hearings, etc. on time where Alton is SB-2 and Barnstead is not. (I'm not saying one is better than the other - just that there's some scheduling differences that can create opportunities/problems.)

[fatlazyless]

Yes, my very limited local school knowledge says that Interlakes High School located in Meredith, grades 9-12, is a school administration unit for Sandwich, Center Harbor and Meredith students.

[fatlazyless]

I stopped into George's Diner late today to see what progress the petition was making, and since my signing it last Monday, a total of just one individual has added their name. That's terrible progress, and it is doomed to fail at this rate.

Meredith has something like 5500 residents. Both Alton and Gilford have switched over to SB-2, so it is probably doable in Meredith, too.

Maybe trying a different marketing approach is worth a try? How about having some friendly, out-going, energetic person like myself, stand out in front of the Rite Aid with a clip board and a copy of the petition for residents to sign?

Going directly to the residents has got to be more effective than trying to get them to go to the Meredith Center Store or George's Diner. 8 1/2 x 11" hand-out SB-2 info sheets for people who are on-the-fence could be helpfull.

Give me a private message or email, and I'll volunteer a 12 hour shift on Monday, Dec 24, which is probably a busy day at the Rite Aid.

[fatlazyless]

In Gilford, the police department recently voted to join the International Brotherhood of Teamsters for union representation in their job bargaining with the town. An argument can be made that no one knows the local town management better than the police dept, and with the school dep a close second.

Without the much higher voter turn-out which SB-2 creates, it is just too easy for a small number of committed residents to attend the town meeting and sway the vote.

In the past few years, important items such as a new Meredith police station, new community center, and new million dollar football field w/ no bleacher seats were all passed at the annual town meeting.

So, it would appear that all the police, teachers, and municiple employees are all better organized than the resident population, the peoples who pay the tax bill.

As it is now without SB-2, if you want your vote to count on non-candidate issues, then you need to show up to the 2nd Tuesday in March, town meeting, and vote.

And, a Merry Christmas to everybody!

[tis]

I agree with you FLL. You get a lot more people voting and not just the special interests in a SB2 town than just town meeting. Some of the police, fire, teachers, etc. don't like it because they cannot sway the vote quiet as easily by packing the meetings. Hopefully the public will make a point to be more informed so they will know what they are voting for. Good luck, I hope you get it.
Someone brought to my attention a listing of the top schools and I was surprised that Gilford didn't rate that well. I thought Gilford spent a lot of money on their schools. Carpenter in Wolfeboro was number 8 I think and Tuftonboro was just a couple behind. I shouldn't quote numbers because I am not sure, but they were right up there.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by tis

I agree with you FLL. You get a lot more people voting and not just the special interests in a SB2 town than just town meeting. Some of the police, fire, teachers, etc. don't like it because they cannot sway the vote quiet as easily by packing the meetings. Hopefully the public will make a point to be more informed so they will know what they are voting for. Good luck, I hope you get it.
Someone brought to my attention a listing of the top schools and I was surprised that Gilford didn't rate that well. I thought Gilford spent a lot of money on their schools. Carpenter in Wolfeboro was number 8 I think and Tuftonboro was just a couple behind. I shouldn't quote numbers because I am not sure, but they were right up there.

SB2 is a good thing. I've heard that Gilford schools have been slipping recently, but I don't know how true that really is.

[vrrooom]

I am a long time Gilfrod resident >25 years, and support the SB2 method of managing spending by plebisite. Before SB 2, the town meetings were dominated by special interest groups (supporters of some particular spending item) who dominated the meeting and intimidated by rudeness anyone who was not seen as supporting of their interests (personal or family salaries as town employees,facilities,other projects). I do not know how other towns meetings are run, but having sat thru several at Gilford, I would be surprised if they are much different.

Gilford schools, stand as proof that you can't buy good education. Gilford is one of the top 10% of the districts in spending per pupil, and yet the preformance (standard tests) indicates mediocure results. Our school administration and leadership would be sacked in a commercial world, where failure to perform and wasting money is not acceptable. Unless Gilford gets new leadership, we will continue to spend and waste more on compensation thus continuing to reward poor performance.

Education presents a one time opportunity, you can't do it over, so you must do it well the first and only time.

[SAMIAM]

Wish we'd had SB2 in Meredith before we built the police station and community center......each of them would serve cities 10 times the size of Meredith.

[wifi]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

Wish we'd had SB2 in Meredith before we built the police station and community center......each of them would serve cities 10 times the size of Meredith.

Next on the list is Moultonboro, they already have their gigantic new town hall, new library and new police fire station, now they are pushing hard for a community center.

Wonder if Moultonboro would consider renting from Meredith?

Dreamer, me....

[ITD]

Your choices in Meredith under SB2 for something like a new police station will be whether the chief's door has right hand hinges or left hand hinges.

Town meeting is one of the purest forms of democracy in this country. There is nothing so sweet as an article appropriating $10,000 being amended to $7000 by the citizens on the floor of a town meeting. With schemes like SB2, you lose this ability, subjugating your rights to a few elected people, who will absolutely be influenced by special interests and their interpretation of the "greater good".

Schemes like SB2 are dreamed up by Massachusetts transplants who were driven out of their home state because it has gotten so expensive, yet are only comfortable with a bunch of criminal legislators spending their money. They are too lazy to get involved themselves, and get upset when they see their neighbors doing it at town meeting.

Happy New Year

[SAMIAM]

Yuh...right,ITD.......you mean there is nothing like 20 voters (all with something to gain) approving a 3 million dollar project at 11;00 pm,when most working folks have gone to bed.
GET OUT THERE FLL.....we need ya' buddy

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

Yuh...right,ITD.......you mean there is nothing like 20 voters (all with something to gain) approving a 3 million dollar project at 11;00 pm,when most working folks have gone to bed.
GET OUT THERE FLL.....we need ya' buddy

Could not have said it any better.

[camp guy]

I live in Wolfeboro, and Wolfeboro is an SB-2 town. I lived elswhere for 25plus years in a town meeting vote town, and I lived in Wolfeboro when it was a town meeting vote town, and there are pluses and minuses to the SB-2 form of voting. The opportunity for more people to vote, the day time voting, the absentee voting - all of these are pluses, but the biggest minus is the loss of discussion about an article, and the ability to do someting based on that discussion. I know, I know, there is a deliberative session several days before the vote, and each article can be discussed then, and some changes can be made, but nothing beats a well-moderated discussion right at the time of the vote. You know, in politics it isn't always what is WRITTEN in the Article, sometimes it is WHO is behind the Article. In the town I lived in away from Wolfeboro, the town meeting moderator would require a sponsor of any article to speak to the point of that article as the first speaker, then others could discuss it back and forth. If a sponsor didn't speak, the moderator would rule the article out of order and go on to the next article. At the deliberative sessions there is usually some explanation, but not the good old discussion you need to really find out the WHO behind an article.

So, if you are activly trying to go SB-2, be prepared to give up some of the privileges of discussion you have now.

[fatlazyless]

As far as I can tell,

(1) 25 signatures & addresses of residents,

(2) and to be handed in to selectmen 5 weeks before town meeting,


is what it takes to get an SB2 petiton item on the ballot.

With a Meredith population at about 6000 people, getting 25 voters to walk into either the Meredith Center Store or George's Diner and ask to sign the two petitions should not be too difficult to do. It's not hard to find people who are unhappy with their property taxes, and want to do something about it.

What I do not know is how the ballot is handled. Is a vote held in the town meeting by a show of hands, or on a paper ballot as a seperate petition article where the voters go to the Community Center on the 2nd Tuesday in March, March 11, from 7am-7pm, or what?

What am I missing here? What else is there to know or do?
..............................

SB2 and Town Meeting

www.nhpr.org, March 1 2007, NHPR radio interview by Laura Knoy

"The traditional town meeting may slowly be on its' way out as more and more towns adopt SB2, a form of local government that has been around since 1996 and allows residents to vote on town and shool district warrants at the polls instead of in town and school district meetings. Sixty of New Hampshire's 221 towns have adopted SB2 and only a handfull (three) have reverted back. We'll look at town meeting, its place in New England and what the future may hold as it competes with the new guy in town - Senate Bill 2."

(The rest and large part of this radio interview can be read at www.nhpr.org)

.................................

An opinion reply to the above NHPR article.

"Since my property taxes have skyrocketed this year I've become a more involved citizen. I've been attending selectman meetings and budget committee meetings, and Hopkinton-Contoocook Taxpayer Assn meetings. I see SB2 as a win-win situation for all the taxpayers. Town meetings and the School meeting can run on for hours and by the final vote, they've lost half the audience. It's not fair to the seniors, those with children, or those who just can't sit there on the bleachers hour after hour. I'd like to see the Town & School Meeting or the "Deliberative Session" as they will be called, televised and available through our cable TV. Then the vote will take place 30 days thereafter; giving all of us a sufficient amount of time to study all the articles and make good decisions in the privacy of the ballet booth. It will also give those who cannot get to the polls the ability to have an absentee ballot and vote on every issue."

Thankyou, Joan Flood

www.nhpr.org

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by camp guy

I live in Wolfeboro, and Wolfeboro is an SB-2 town. I lived elswhere for 25plus years in a town meeting vote town, and I lived in Wolfeboro when it was a town meeting vote town, and there are pluses and minuses to the SB-2 form of voting. The opportunity for more people to vote, the day time voting, the absentee voting - all of these are pluses, but the biggest minus is the loss of discussion about an article, and the ability to do someting based on that discussion. I know, I know, there is a deliberative session several days before the vote, and each article can be discussed then, and some changes can be made, but nothing beats a well-moderated discussion right at the time of the vote. You know, in politics it isn't always what is WRITTEN in the Article, sometimes it is WHO is behind the Article. In the town I lived in away from Wolfeboro, the town meeting moderator would require a sponsor of any article to speak to the point of that article as the first speaker, then others could discuss it back and forth. If a sponsor didn't speak, the moderator would rule the article out of order and go on to the next article. At the deliberative sessions there is usually some explanation, but not the good old discussion you need to really find out the WHO behind an article.

So, if you are activly trying to go SB-2, be prepared to give up some of the privileges of discussion you have now.

You make a good point, but the problem is that there are aggressive factions in most of our small towns that have decided that by building mega-buildings (police stations, fire stations, community centers, elderly-centers, schools, libraries) they can increase the number of personal (them) and build up a voting block that is hard to defeat. The towns are being buried under pension costs & the costs associated with running these buildings. SB-2 came about because of these issues. Anyone who remembers what happened in town-meeting in Bow several years ago understands why SB-2 is popular with the voters. And as an addendum: Almost every town that has voted in SB-2 in NH has hardly ever voted it out again. it's imperfect, I grant you that, but once put into practice, folks seem to like it.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by camp guy

I live in Wolfeboro, and Wolfeboro is an SB-2 town. I lived elswhere for 25plus years in a town meeting vote town, and I lived in Wolfeboro when it was a town meeting vote town, and there are pluses and minuses to the SB-2 form of voting. The opportunity for more people to vote, the day time voting, the absentee voting - all of these are pluses, but the biggest minus is the loss of discussion about an article, and the ability to do someting based on that discussion. I know, I know, there is a deliberative session several days before the vote, and each article can be discussed then, and some changes can be made, but nothing beats a well-moderated discussion right at the time of the vote. You know, in politics it isn't always what is WRITTEN in the Article, sometimes it is WHO is behind the Article. In the town I lived in away from Wolfeboro, the town meeting moderator would require a sponsor of any article to speak to the point of that article as the first speaker, then others could discuss it back and forth. If a sponsor didn't speak, the moderator would rule the article out of order and go on to the next article. At the deliberative sessions there is usually some explanation, but not the good old discussion you need to really find out the WHO behind an article.

So, if you are activly trying to go SB-2, be prepared to give up some of the privileges of discussion you have now.

Sorry but I don't understand your point about finding out who is behind an article...

Here's my case:
Alton is SB2 and the deliberative session consists of the town's Warrants, the school districts' Warrants (Alton has two school districts), and the petition Warrant articles. The petition Warrants are presented, usually, by the parties who are promoting it. For example, last year we had a petition Warrant article for a social worker/drug and alcohol counselor for the high school. The petition Warrant article was well presented and thoroughly discussed. I can't think of a single Warrant that we didn't have at least some idea who was behind it...

Additionally, there's room for public input at the deliberative session and discussion for each Warrant article. The town's budget committee reviews and recommends the Warrant articles, as does the town's selectmen. They present the Warrant articles to the public at the deliberative session and invite the public to ask questions or discuss the article. I've seen a vote called on a Warrant article or other budget item, for that matter, when members of the public still wanted to bump their gums about it, but mostly it's very fair and I felt that people weren't unjustly cut off.

I guess what I'm saying here is that there's room for input - you just have be ready to play by the new rules to get your point in there at the right time...

p.s.
Please don't take it that I'm being disrespectful to you or your point of view - I'm not. It's just that I see how it works in Alton with the town and the school districts and although it's "different" I do prefer it to the town meeting format and feel that we have more to gain as being SB2 than we did by not going that route - that's all...

[camp guy]

To Argies Wife: absolutely no disrespect taken, as a metter of fact, you made a very clear and accurate explanation of the process. My only concern is that some articles are written in such a way that knowing the people (WHO) can help clarify the article. All towns have "groups" with agendas, and in all towns not everyone knows everyone, but it does help understand the intent of an article if you know the people involved.

[snowbird]

Voter participation has increased a huge amount in Gilford since we passed SB2 two or three years ago. Sometimes as many as 2,000 votes are cast on an issue, versus a few hundred in the old town meeting format. Democracy at work! Meredith voters would be well advised to take advantage of this opportunity.

[camp guy]

A side issue to all of this, and maybe one not for this thread, is the issues faced by the non-voter eligible people who live in some of the local towns. In Wolfeboro, for instance, some serious road/utility infrastructure work had to be done on Sewall Rd (a road along the edge of Wolfeboro Bay and therefore very high property values) but many of the people who live on Sewall Road are not voter-eligible due to their resident status. Unfortunately, because many people who don't live on Sewall Rd don't really care about that road, and most of these people are voters, it was very difficult and costly to get the work done over about a three year period. This is anecdotal, but the issue is, some of the people who pay the most have no vote (say) in the use of the money they pay. Again, I know, I know, they choose to live in these spots, and they know the trade-offs, but it's too bad there isn't a way to let them participate in the town government. The irony of the whole situation, at least in Wolfeboro, is that some of these non-voters are extremely active in volunteer work within the town while they are resident. Sort of one-sided, lop-sided. This is probably the case in many of the towns bordering water bodies in New Hampshire.

[Argie's Wife]

Originally Posted by camp guy

To Argies Wife: absolutely no disrespect taken, as a metter of fact, you made a very clear and accurate explanation of the process. My only concern is that some articles are written in such a way that knowing the people (WHO) can help clarify the article. All towns have "groups" with agendas, and in all towns not everyone knows everyone, but it does help understand the intent of an article if you know the people involved.

And I totally agree with you on that one... but from my experience, the ambiguously worded Warrant articles are generally those that there written by high-priced lawyers with little regard for the layman. It's almost like they don't WANT you to know what it is you're voting on. However, here in Alton it seems like it's always the same ten people who are "activists" in the town - you can pretty much tell who's going to be presenting something even before they speak! Likewise, it's the same ten people who ask a lot of questions (God bless 'em!) and get to the root of what's really before the people to vote on.

Love my town~!

And thanks for not taking my initial post wrong - it can be a challenge to communicate in this format (non-verbal) and I didn't want to step on any toes...

[fatlazyless]

Stopped into George's Dinner late this afternoon and unfortunately not a single name had been added in the last seven days, so this petition drive definately needs an energy boost. As I understand it. each petition needs 25 signatures & address, and then to be submitted to the town 5 weeks before the March 11 town meeting, or by February 5. As I say earlier, with 6000 Meredith population, how hard can it be to get just 25?

Anyway, I shall give it a go when the weather gets nice & warm & sunny, hopefully this weekend at the Rite Aid-Cumberland Farm-Aubuchons....looking for Meredith voters who want to sign the SB-2 petitions for town & school.

[summersux]

Originally Posted by ITD

Schemes like SB2 are dreamed up by Massachusetts transplants who were driven out of their home state because it has gotten so expensive, yet are only comfortable with a bunch of criminal legislators spending their money. They are too lazy to get involved themselves, and get upset when they see their neighbors doing it at town meeting.

You hit the nail right on the head good job man.

PS. A lot of people don't like to admit that they are lazy thus will not like your comment.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by summersux

You hit the nail right on the head good job man.

PS. A lot of people don't like to admit that they are lazy thus will not like your comment.

SB-2 has its good & bad points, but it's a valid way to run town government. Where SB-2 has been instituted it has thrived. Very, very few NH towns have voted SB-2 out after adopting it. As for SB-2 being some Massachusetts-scam......show me some documentation for that ?

IMO SB-2 works best in towns with fast growing populations......in smaller towns, not so much.

[summersux]

Originally Posted by Irish mist

SB-2 has its good & bad points, but it's a valid way to run town government. Where SB-2 has been instituted it has thrived. Very, very few NH towns have voted SB-2 out after adopting it. As for SB-2 being some Massachusetts-scam......show me some documentation for that ?

IMO SB-2 works best in towns with fast growing populations......in smaller towns, not so much.

Your the one who said it you back it up. I don't believe that. But this is interesting and the time frame is right. Link

Originally Posted by Dave Michaels, The Dallas Morning News

Last modified 1/5/2008 - 12:34 pm
Originally created 010508

New residents from Massachusetts change New Hampshire political landscape


By Dave Michaels, The Dallas Morning News

MANCHESTER, N.H. - New Hampshire, once among the reddest states in the country, has undergone an elephantine demographic shift since its last hotly contested presidential primary, with an influx of new voters that could turn the outcome of both races Tuesday.


The Granite State gained 207,000 new residents between 2001 and 2005 - including about 90,000 who moved over the border from Massachusetts, according to a recent report by the University of New Hampshire's Carsey Institute. During the same period, 188,000 people left the state.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by summersux

Your the one who said it you back it up. I don't believe that. But this is interesting and the time frame is right. Link

Back what up ? You show me some stats that people from Massachusetts are moving to NH......no kidding. They are also moving here from NY & NJ & and the Mid Atlantic states, and just about everywhere else.....so what ? Where in your article does it show THESE people started the SB-2 movement ? A poster said people from Massachusetts have started the SB-2 movement, and I asked for some information on that, some facts.....your information about the changing demographics of NH is well known, but it contains no information about SB-2.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Irish mist

SB-2 has its good & bad points, but it's a valid way to run town government. Where SB-2 has been instituted it has thrived. Very, very few NH towns have voted SB-2 out after adopting it. As for SB-2 being some Massachusetts-scam......show me some documentation for that ?

IMO SB-2 works best in towns with fast growing populations......in smaller towns, not so much.

Come on Irish Mist, I said scheme, not scam. I don't think SB-2 is a scam. I also said "Schemes like SB2 are dreamed up by Massachusetts transplants who were driven out of their home state because it has gotten so expensive", I stand behind that statement, although maybe I should have said "Massachusetts and other choke-hold blue state transplant". You have to admit, the political leanings of NH are changing. As to whether Massachusetts transplants or NH old timers wrote SB-2, it really doesn't matter, I certainly don't care.

What I do see, is the purest form of Democracy being phased out due to laziness and apathy. Schemes like SB2 add a layer of bureaucracy to the voting process, removing the spirited debate and change on the fly afforded by a town meeting. For the convenience of voting yes or no to one choice on election day, you give up the chance to get together with your neighbors and truly hammer out and fix or reject an article. Yes, I understand about meetings for articles and hearings. As far as SB2 being the answer to "special interests", I seriously doubt it.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by ITD

Come on Irish Mist, I said scheme, not scam. I don't think SB-2 is a scam. I also said "Schemes like SB2 are dreamed up by Massachusetts transplants who were driven out of their home state because it has gotten so expensive", I stand behind that statement, although maybe I should have said "Massachusetts and other choke-hold blue state transplant". You have to admit, the political leanings of NH are changing. As to whether Massachusetts transplants or NH old timers wrote SB-2, it really doesn't matter, I certainly don't care.

What I do see, is the purest form of Democracy being phased out due to laziness and apathy. Schemes like SB2 add a layer of bureaucracy to the voting process, removing the spirited debate and change on the fly afforded by a town meeting. For the convenience of voting yes or no to one choice on election day, you give up the chance to get together with your neighbors and truly hammer out and fix or reject an article. Yes, I understand about meetings for articles and hearings. As far as SB2 being the answer to "special interests", I seriously doubt it.

There are studies that show that the majority of Massachusetts transplants are conservative, but that's up for debate. I was just concerned that you were painting everyone from away with a broad-brush. I share your concern about how NH is going blue......but I don't think SB-2 is a major problem. Folks who vote it in seem to love it. I certainly think towns with small populations don't need SB-2.

But larger, fast growing towns seem to adopt to SB-2 very well. Lol, if I had my way.....I would build a wall in Salem and stop all this growth but I'm afraid that's not to be. Every town has the right to vote SB-2 out......and I trust my fellow citizens to do just that if it is not serving them well.

You can't tell me that town-meeting does not have some serious flaws ? We have all heard of those late night votes.....and those"factions" that form. President Madison warned of factions, and town-meeting can really devolve into that situation from my experience. I like that folks have the option of SB-2. It's just another tool to help citizens get involved in government.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by Irish mist

There are studies that show that the majority of Massachusetts transplants are conservative, but that's up for debate. I was just concerned that you were painting everyone from away with a broad-brush. I share your concern about how NH is going blue......but I don't think SB-2 is a major problem. Folks who vote it in seem to love it. I certainly think towns with small populations don't need SB-2.

But larger, fast growing towns seem to adopt to SB-2 very well. Lol, if I had my way.....I would build a wall in Salem and stop all this growth but I'm afraid that's not to be. Every town has the right to vote SB-2 out......and I trust my fellow citizens to do just that if it is not serving them well.

You can't tell me that town-meeting does not have some serious flaws ? We have all heard of those late night votes.....and those"factions" that form. President Madison warned of factions, and town-meeting can really devolve into that situation from my experience. I like that folks have the option of SB-2. It's just another tool to help citizens get involved in government.

I really don't think town meeting has serious flaws. The flaw lies with the voters who don't show up and/or don't care. When 20 out of 1000 voters show up that is recipe for disaster. When 500 or even 250 out of 1000 show up, the shenanigans are quickly squashed.

If you don't care, your pocket will get picked. Come to think of it, if you care and beg for more taxes, you will be turned upside down and shaken until all the money falls out of your pockets. Once the Genie is out of the bottle, it is nearly impossible to put back in. Look at the Mass. income tax.

As far as transplants go, most of the ones I know personally are flaming liberals. I try to make it a point when they complain that they are bringing to NH exactly what they ran away from in Mass., high taxes, they never get it though.....

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by ITD

I really don't think town meeting has serious flaws. The flaw lies with the voters who don't show up and/or don't care. When 20 out of 1000 voters show up that is recipe for disaster. When 500 or even 250 out of 1000 show up, the shenanigans are quickly squashed.

If you don't care, your pocket will get picked. Come to think of it, if you care and beg for more taxes, you will be turned upside down and shaken until all the money falls out of your pockets. Once the Genie is out of the bottle, it is nearly impossible to put back in. Look at the Mass. income tax.

As far as transplants go, most of the ones I know personally are flaming liberals. I try to make it a point when they complain that they are bringing to NH exactly what they ran away from in Mass., high taxes, they never get it though.....

I can only go by what I see........NH folks seem to love SB-2. If it is such a bad system I think most towns would have voted it out. Gilford folks seem pleased with its recent arrival. As for transplants: this is JMO but most Massachusetts folks I know moved here to get away from taxes, and vote conservative. Most of the liberals seem to be coming up from NY &NJ & from other parts of the nation.

In the old days most people that moved here were from MA......now they are from everywhere, and they have no sense of the NH low tax history.

[fatlazyless]

Yesterday's primary election at the Meredith Community Center was like the perfect spot for collecting signatures for an SB2 petition, plus the weather was highly cooperative, too. I got there at about 8am, equipped with my olde rockin' chair, and rocked away for about ten hours until six o'clock, collecting a lot of signatures. Printed name, signed name, address, and date on two seperate petitions; one for town business, and one for school business. I have not yet actually counted up all the signatures yet, but there are quite a few. Later on today, I will deliver the two petitions to the Meredith Town Clerk for her inspection, scrutiny and administration. Hopefully, the petitions will pass legal scrutiny. I got my petition info from a website for NH taxpayers, and will put that website here later on.

Thanks again to all the Meredith voters who chose to sign the petitions. It was a fairly easy "sell" and that presidential primary and the warm weather were the perfect spot.
.....................

Here's the count. For the town petition, there's 15 1/2 pages w/ 13 voter's per page for about 200 Meredith voters, total. And , for the school petition, there's 15 pages w/ 13 voters per page for also about 200 Meredith voters.

If you read the rsa, it says that 25 signatures is what's needed.

As I understand it, what these petitons do is to put the two questions on a town voting ballot for a yes or no vote.
................
town petition


We, the undersigned Town of Meredith registered voters respectfully request that the Town adopt the following warrant.
Shall we adopt the provisions of RSA 40:13 (known as SB2) to allow official ballot voting on all issues before the Town of Meredith on the second Tuesday of March?
By signing this petition, you are affirming that you are a registered voter in the Town of Meredith.
.......................


.......................
school petition


We, the undersigned Town of Meredith registered voters respectfully request that the Town adopt the following warrant.
'Shall we adopt the provisions of RSA 40:13 (known as SB2) to allow official ballot voting on all issues before the Interlakes School District, in SAU #2, on the second Tuesday of March?"
By signing this petition, you are affirming that you are a registered voter in the Town of Meredith.
............

Now, today I will deliver the two petitions to the Meredith Town Clerk, for her inspection, scrutiny and administration, and wait to see what all happens next.

Thanks again to everyone who chose to sign!

...............

So yesterday on primary day, I sat outside the Community Center and collected signatures for about ten hours. What moved me the most was to see all the different people of Meredith. There was quite a number of older and injured voters who slowly walked in to vote with the assistance of their cane or walker. Moving slowly and gingerly, they all wanted to get inside to vote.

[ITD]

Sounds like we have a political activist amongst us, good for you Less. Now if we could only convince you it's a spending problem not a need more taxes problem............

[WeirsBeachBoater]

I wish I knew that was you, You were very polite, and I was to, as I ignored you.....LOL

[SAMIAM]

Sorry I missed meeting you FLL......I saw you but since I have already signed the petition,I didn't connect the dots.Good job.

[EricP]

I would have introduced myself as well. I did sign the petition, didn't realize it was you.

[fatlazyless]

The Meredith News
Thursday, January 10, 2008
(top of front page on the right)


MEREDITH - For the first time ever, Meredith's Town Warrant this year may ask voters whether they want to adopt Senate Bill 2, with a petition in support of the bill currently circulating through town.

The petition, initiated by Meredith resident Richard Juve, currently sits behind the counter at George's Dinner and at the Meredith Center Grocery Store and Garage, and calls for a change from the more traditonal form of Town Meeting to the SB2 format. Instituted as an alternative form of Town Meeting in 1995, instead of a meeting at night, SB2 towns pass or fail articles on the warrant by secret ballots cast at a polling place all day.

Gilford adopted the SB2 form of government several years ago and Moultonboro has had petitioned warrant articles on it for several years. Deputy Town Clerk Kerri Parker confirmed that a petition for SB2 has never been on Meredith's Town Warrant.

Juve said that about 50 people so far have signed the petition and said that he hopes to get in 200 signatures before he submits it to the town clerk in a week. Both George's Diner and Meredith Center Store reported filling up their pages. Twenty-five signatures of registered Meredith voters are required for a petition to make it to the Town Warrant, submitted by Feb 5.

"It (traditional Town Meeting) is based on a time when we all got together in town and met our friends and brought food." said Juve. "Now people have to hire a babysitter for four or five hours, and they can't stay that long. What if they work a night shift? What if they're at a business meeting, or in the military and overseas?'

Dr. David Almstrom, a veterinarian doctor and another supporter of SB2 government in Meredith, agreed that the changing lifestyles of residents should warrant a change to allow more residents to take part in the process.

"For the average person, there's not enough time," said Almstrom. "I run a practice that covers emergencies, and others have kids at home. If more people participate, it brings more people in, and that's to our advantage."

Juve said that rising tax rates in an uncertain economic situation and problems that residents had in attending Town Meeting are the reasons that spurred him to pursue the SB2 petition.

Citing the roughly 240 people who attended the last Town Meeting, out of a town with a poplation of over 6000, Juve said that he thought SB2 would open up the process for greater participation.

"(In SB2), no one sees my hand go up and never speaks to me again for the rest for the year." said Juve. "The wonderfull advantage is that you have time to think about it and make your decision in the privacy of the voting booth."

In the SB2 style of Town Meeting, the school and municipal budgets are formally presented to residents, then considered and amended by the public at later deliberative sessions. Once the amendments are set and approved by the public present at the session, the polling station opens in March for residents to vote on each warrant article. Juve said that these deliberative sessions have the essence of the Town Meeting but get the ballot out sooner.

If the petition fails, Juve said that he and others will try again at the next Town Meeting and asked that anyone with questions about the petition call him at 279-5643.

The Meredith News, Thursday, January 10, 2008

.........................................

[fatlazyless]

Editorial - January 10, 2008

The Meredith News

Think long and hard on SB2

It's good to see that Meredith will be considering Senate Bill 2 this year; unlike several neighboring towns, it will be a first for Meredith voters. This does not mean, however, that the town should rush into adopting the practice, which eliminates the traditional town meeting in favor of a deliberative session followed several weeks later by Election Day. The deliberative session is as close to town meeting as SB2 gets, and though voters cannot vote on warrant articles, they can make amendments that, if passed by the majority in attendance, will ultimately be put on the ballot for Election Day.

Both Moultonboro and Sanborton have been debating the merits and downfalls of SB2 for years, and neither town has seen it to pass - yet. Undoubtedly it will continue to be a topic of conversation for many years to come. Gilford, on the other hand, has been an SB2 town since it was adopted in 2004, and at this point it seems to be working out just fine, with no serious attempts to change back to a town meeting format.

What this appears to mean is that some towns are ready for the change and some are not. It's not necessarily an inevitable change, either, despite the fact that as of 2006, 57 towns in the state (roughly 32 percent) had adopted SB2. Sixty towns in total have adopted the bill at some point, but three have rescinded it.

So what does this newfound interest in SB2 mean for Meredith? What it should mean is a good opportunity for discussion. Passing the bill the first year it is introduced is probably not the best idea, as it seems to take a while for people to truly research and understand the bill's effects. It is fairly complicated, and even a lengthy discussion or debate at town meeting won't be enough to truly inform voters. This year's vote should be the first step in a process that involves educating the public of both the positives and negatives of SB2 so that voters will be able to make an informed decision.

With only two months to go before the 2008 Town Meeting, it just doesn't make sense that enough people would be comfortable with SB2 to vote it in, and that's a good thing. There's a reason it's been a hot-button issue in other towns, and Meredith, which is a traditional New Hampshire town in so many ways seems an unlikely candidate to abandon town meeting as soon as 2009. Still, as we said, it is definately worth the discussion and getting a petitioned article on the warrant is the best way to get that conversation
going.

The Meredith News, January 10, 2008




............

[fatlazyless]

The Citizen of Laconia
by Erin Plummer
January 23, 2008

Meredith will vote on SB2 for town, school
..........

A petitioned article calling for the implementation of Senate Bill 2 will be on the warrants of the town and the Inter-Lakes School District.

The petition, generated by resident Richard Juve, would change the town's form of government to the Official Ballot Act, commonly known as SB2, which would eliminate the traditional town meeting process and replace it with a deliberative session to amend articles, while voting would take place by secret ballot.

Petitions with 174 signatures were submitted to the town and school district calling for SB2 after they were circulated around town and were available to voters during the primary on Jan. 8.

Town Manager Carol Granfield told the selectmen during Monday's budget workshop that she had spoken with Inter-Lakes Superintendent Phil McCormack about the possibility of having a joint public hearing between Meredith and Inter-Lakes. Granfield said a joint hearing would be best to differentiate between the effects it would have on the two different groups.

Other board members said the joint meeting might not be the best idea, as Inter-Lakes also includes Center Harbor and Sandwich, which are not facing SB2 petitions, and that further discussion should be held with McCormack to determine the process.

Granfield said the passage of SB2 in Meredith would be unique for the town as it would be one of the few with SB2 that does not have a union. SB2 requires communities to fulfill all contracts and without a union "if you're not obligated to something, some people might want to be obligated."

An SB2 article cannot indicate whether the boards approve or disapprove of it.

"I don't think we should promote it or hide from it," said Board Chair Frank Michel.

Selectman Collette Worsman said the petition for SB2 was a sign voters are fed up with town spending. Worsman advocated methods of cutting around $500,000 from this year's budget by trimming some department line items.

"The community has had enough of tax increases," Worsman said. "I truly believe there are a lot more out there who are tired of seeing the increases (and the taxation on money) they have worked so hard to get."

"I do hear the consensus of the community that we need to conserve the money that we spend. It should be on necessities, not luxuries."
.................................................. ....................
by Erin Plummer
Wednesday, January 23, 2008
The Citizen of Laconia
...........


...........



The two SB2 ballot questions for town & school will take place on Wednesday, March 12, and be a paper ballot, private vote held in the Community Center from 7am - 7pm.

I believe there's another ballot question as well that has to do with a zoning issue.

The annual town meeting is scheduled for Tuesday, March 11 in the evening, as usual.



............

[ITD]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

The Citizen of Laconia
by Erin Plummer
January 23, 2008

{Snip}

Selectman Collette Worsman said the petition for SB2 was a sign voters are fed up with town spending. Worsman advocated methods of cutting around $500,000 from this year's budget by trimming some department line items.

"The community has had enough of tax increases," Worsman said. "I truly believe there are a lot more out there who are tired of seeing the increases (and the taxation on money) they have worked so hard to get."

"I do hear the consensus of the community that we need to conserve the money that we spend. It should be on necessities, not luxuries."
..........



by Erin Plummer
Wednesday, January 23, 2008
The Citizen of Laconia
...........




............

Ok Less, here's your chance, I suggest you call Selectman Collette Worsman and tell her that you fully support her effort to cut $500,000 in spending AS LONG AS she makes sure it goes toward REDUCING THE TAX RATE. I can almost guarantee they have some other area where they want to put that money and it's not back in your wallet. Go Less, Go....

[fatlazyless]

Laconia Daily Sun, Monday, Feb 4, 2008
letter to the editor
.....

Ask Moultonborough officials why they're so afraid of SB-2

To the editor,

SB-2 is good for Moultonborough, and yes, for Meredith, too.

Why is it that the general consensus among the "Powers-To-Be, (the Board of Selectmen, the School Board, the town Moderator, the Superintendent of Schools, etc.) in Moultonboro that SB-2 is a fiscal threat to the town and the school system? Why when given the opportunity to weigh-in they have condemned SB-2 by voice, signage, or action by standing silent. This condemnation of silence has by no means gone unnoticed by the electorate. But, the question remains...WHY?

If one were to listen to their scare tactics, comments and acerbic bombs, their cries have been loud but artificial. So for the sake of clarity and fairness and at the larger risk chastisement I will explain SB-2. First, you should understand there is no "smoke and mirrors". SB-2 IS A VOTING INITIATIVE...it is that simple.

Over a decade ago the State of New Hampshire recognized that not all eligible voters in the Town Meeting process were able to physically be there to voice their opinion and exercise their right to vote. In fact for various reasons, attendance at town and school district meetings around the state was periously low. This left the door open for very small but powerfully connected groups to overwhelm the process and control signifigant spending issues. The purpose of SB-2 is to allow all of the electorate to vote, by ballot and still have an opportunity to discuss and amend any of the warrant articles if they so chose. I will repeat that...IT ALLOWS ALL THE ELECTORATE TO VOTE.

Here is how it works. About a month before the second Tuesday in March (traditional Town Meeting Day) there is a "Deliberative Session" when those that can (and want to) be physically present, have the opportunity to discuss each article of he warrant. At this time, the various parts of a proposed budget item, wording and costs, may be amended. But the actual acceptance or rejection is done by ballot on Election Day...that second Tuesday in March. Since the expenditures of the warrant articles determine the budget for the ensuing year, if they are not passed, the previous year's budget plus any committed financial obligations becomes the default budget so that "life as we know it" may continue without damaging the town's rating or reputation. Simple, huh?

Before we hear the repeated clamor from those that say "SB-2 is dangerous" or worse "it is dangerous to allow all those uninformd voters to vote" (and sadly I have heard that very statement tossed around by our public officials) let me say that the news media is "on board" with SB-2. The local newspaper in nearby Wolfeboro (an SB-2 Town) prints out the entire warrant with check-off- boxes so that before Election Day you, the (uninformed) voter can take the time to become informed as to what are the issues and decide how you want to vote. Take the checklist with you in the booth.

The next time you have the opportunity to speak to one of the above mentioned "power brokers" in Moultonborough, ask them specifically what is so "dangerous" about SB-2. Ask them why they would promote and support the disenfranchisement of all the good folks that are out of state on retirement, away at college, out of state/country serving in the military, elderly, a working parent on second shift or those that are intimidated by voting against the crowd or speaking up in front of 200-300 people. Wouldn't you like to have more say in town?

As we approach the spring voting rituals, I urge you to learn about SB-2 and support it at the polls. For more information contact the Moultonborough Citizen's Alliance, www.moultonborocitizensalliance@yahoo.com or call me.

Rick Heath
Moultonborough
........
Laconia Daily Sun, Monday, February 4, 2008
letter to the editor




......

[wifi]

Here is the link, for ease in clickability:

http://www.moultonborocitizensalliance.com/


Yes, Moultonboro and other towns need to rein in spending.

[fatlazyless]

Monday, February 11, 5:30

Meredith Community Center

SB-2 public hearing
................

What happens at an SB-2 public hearing? That's a good question and I do not know. I assume there will be public officials such as selectmen, maybe the town manager, and others who will present information and respond to questions from the audience. But, I do not really know.
Probably, the Laconia Citizen, Laconia Daily Sun & The Meredith News will be there and have some good news articles in the next day's newspaper.

[SAMIAM]

I've never voted absentee before and I don't want to miss this one....where do you pick up the ballots? town hall?

[fatlazyless]

The town clerk's counter in Meredith Town Hall should know about absentee voting. Probably, there is no absentee voting now, and that is one change that passing SB-2 would create. Voting day is on either Tuesday March 11, or Wednesday March 12 (not sure which day), from 7am-7pm, in the Community Center, by paper ballot.

SB-2 is not the only issue on this year's March paper ballot vote......a zoning issue....a fire station rebuild....(& ?)...

[SAMIAM]

Thanks...I'll check it out

[tis]

You are right, FLL. There is a deliberative session which is held before the vote in March. At these, all the town officials attend and everyone discusses the articles that will be voted on. Sometimes they will try to amend them, or maybe even delete them by putting a zero dollar amount on them. Unfortunately not a lot of people usually attend these. But the old way with town meeting, a lot of people didn't usually attend either and they not only discussed the articles but voted on them the same night, so a very small minority of people are voting. At least this way, with the people voting in March, there is usually a bigger turnout. This is an all day affair and not at night, so enables more people to vote. Even still, I think it is still sad that more people don't vote. I think things would certainly change in the Lakes Region if more people voted.

Yes Sam, you can get your absentee ballot at the town halls. Voting is always on Tuesdays.

[fatlazyless]

According to the Meredith News editorial above, this will be Meredith's first try at passing a SB-2 style of voting. It has come up in Moultonboro and Sanbornton a number of times and always lost. It was passed first attempt in Gilford in 2004.

Probably a lot depends on the weather for the voting day, and in letting Meredith voters know that the polls are open 7am-7pm.

There was a huge turnout of Meredith voters on presidential primary day, January 8. There was people with various walkers, canes, & assistance of others and some who looked like they was gonna vote even if it was the last thing they ever did. That primary pried people out of the woodwork like they was handing out Ulysses S. Grant's, or something. That was an historical NH voting day for the numbers of people who showed up to vote.

In about ten hours, I got about 200 to sign both the school and town petitions, and then maybe some got rejected for not having their address correct or something, It came out to 174.

The weather was unusually warm & sunny and that was a big help.

[Argie's Wife]

Rick - Your letter makes some excellent points about SB-2.

The issue with those who are worried about the uninformed voting is really an insult to the voters. Warrant articles are posted well in advance to the deliberative session. Copies (handouts) are available at the Town Hall and at the day of the meeting. Some towns place a copy of the Warrant articles on the town's website. The Warrant articles are printed in the newspaper, too.

Something I would like to suggest to help "sell" your point - Consider videotaping the deliberative sessions to broadcast on the local cable access channel. If townspeople are concerned that there's low turnout and that the uninformed are voting, then you can counter that argument easily. Meeting minutes are also taken during those meetings and would be on the town website or at the Town Clerk's office. You could also offer to have a copy of the video available at the local library.

Finally, suggest that this will offer more "transparency" for the local government - they will like that (and they'd better embrace that concept - the voters do NOT like it when officials don't want public information readily available.

[fatlazyless]

While I wasn't at last night's SB2 public hearing at the Community Center, today's www.citizen.com has a good article about it. Apparently SB2 supporter, Richard Juve, and SB2 opponent, Selectman, big-bad, Bob Flanders, had opposing opinions.

That's interesting because in the last selectman's race that had two open seats, if I remember correctly, it was Miller Lovett 750 votes, Bob Flanders 650 votes, and Richard Juve 625 votes. If Juve had won, the 3-2 voting dynamics of the five member selectboard would be the flip-flopped the other way.

My cheap $15.00 msn-tv2 box never can make a working link so could someone please post a good direct link to today's Feb 12 Citizen story.

Apparently, I was all wrong about the SB2 vote being held on a paper ballot from 7-7am on Tuesday. This article in the newspaper says it is decided at the town meeting, late at night, and needs a 60% vote to get passed.

That will be almost impossible what with the local 'Meredith voting machine' being steered by 'Big Bad Bob' and his followers all going to town meeting. It looks like SB2 in Meredith is definately doomed.....rest in peace....SB2-Meredith!.....60%....wow....ho- buoy!

[EricP]

http://www.citizen.com/apps/pbcs.dll...132/-1/CITIZEN

I need SB-2 style voting as well. Typically I am out of town all week and home weekends. I can't usually attend meetings, vote, etc...

Time for the good-ole-boys club to be dethroned. and for us to take back our town from the select few. Isn't that why we lost our last town manager?

[summersux]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Laconia Daily Sun, Monday, Feb 4, 2008
letter to the editor
.....

Ask Moultonborough officials why they're so afraid of SB-2

To the editor,

SB-2 is good for Moultonborough, and yes, for Meredith, too.

Why is it that the general consensus among the "Powers-To-Be, (the Board of Selectmen, the School Board, the town Moderator, the Superintendent of Schools, etc.) in Moultonboro that SB-2 is a fiscal threat to the town and the school system? Why when given the opportunity to weigh-in they have condemned SB-2 by voice, signage, or action by standing silent. This condemnation of silence has by no means gone unnoticed by the electorate. But, the question remains...WHY?

If one were to listen to their scare tactics, comments and acerbic bombs, their cries have been loud but artificial. So for the sake of clarity and fairness and at the larger risk chastisement I will explain SB-2. First, you should understand there is no "smoke and mirrors". SB-2 IS A VOTING INITIATIVE...it is that simple.

Over a decade ago the State of New Hampshire recognized that not all eligible voters in the Town Meeting process were able to physically be there to voice their opinion and exercise their right to vote. In fact for various reasons, attendance at town and school district meetings around the state was periously low. This left the door open for very small but powerfully connected groups to overwhelm the process and control signifigant spending issues. The purpose of SB-2 is to allow all of the electorate to vote, by ballot and still have an opportunity to discuss and amend any of the warrant articles if they so chose. I will repeat that...IT ALLOWS ALL THE ELECTORATE TO VOTE.

Here is how it works. About a month before the second Tuesday in March (traditional Town Meeting Day) there is a "Deliberative Session" when those that can (and want to) be physically present, have the opportunity to discuss each article of he warrant. At this time, the various parts of a proposed budget item, wording and costs, may be amended. But the actual acceptance or rejection is done by ballot on Election Day...that second Tuesday in March. Since the expenditures of the warrant articles determine the budget for the ensuing year, if they are not passed, the previous year's budget plus any committed financial obligations becomes the default budget so that "life as we know it" may continue without damaging the town's rating or reputation. Simple, huh?

Before we hear the repeated clamor from those that say "SB-2 is dangerous" or worse "it is dangerous to allow all those uninformd voters to vote" (and sadly I have heard that very statement tossed around by our public officials) let me say that the news media is "on board" with SB-2. The local newspaper in nearby Wolfeboro (an SB-2 Town) prints out the entire warrant with check-off- boxes so that before Election Day you, the (uninformed) voter can take the time to become informed as to what are the issues and decide how you want to vote. Take the checklist with you in the booth.

The next time you have the opportunity to speak to one of the above mentioned "power brokers" in Moultonborough, ask them specifically what is so "dangerous" about SB-2. Ask them why they would promote and support the disenfranchisement of all the good folks that are out of state on retirement, away at college, out of state/country serving in the military, elderly, a working parent on second shift or those that are intimidated by voting against the crowd or speaking up in front of 200-300 people. Wouldn't you like to have more say in town?

As we approach the spring voting rituals, I urge you to learn about SB-2 and support it at the polls. For more information contact the Moultonborough Citizen's Alliance, www.moultonborocitizensalliance@yahoo.com or call me.

Rick Heath
Moultonborough
........
Laconia Daily Sun, Monday, February 4, 2008
letter to the editor




......

Haha old Rick is not even a Meredith resident yet he knows what’s good for the residents of our great Town. Rick, screw up your own Town and leave ours alone please.

[SAMIAM]

If there is a single family in the Moultonborough/Meredith area that has contributed more to the well being and economy than the Heath family,I'd like to know who it is.They were all born ,raised, and schooled here (not that it makes them any better) but certainly shows that they have their roots here in the lakes region.
Summersux......how many jobs have you created over the years? the Heaths have literally employed thousands.What do you pay for taxes?...maybe you'd prefer the Heath's bill. How many town boards have you served on? The Heaths have served in some capacity their entire lives.
"Old Rick? wish we had more like him.

[fatlazyless]

A letter to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun,
Wednesday, February 20, 2008, from Peter Miller who is a former Meredith Selectman and was chairman as recently as 2006.
..........

Let's be honest about this; SB-2 is just meant to curb town and school spending

To the editor,

Shame on Mr. Juve for playing the "service" card in his attempt to peddle Senate Bill 2 to the voters of Meredith. Though it has always been true that residents unable to attend the annual town meeting have been disenfranchised from that vote, this criticism of the town meeting form of government is signifigantly less relevant today than it was at other times in American history. Until ADA, annual meeting places were not required to have handicap access, precluding attendance by the disabled. Regarding military servce, far greater numbers of draft-age men served on the front lines - and died - during the Civil War, World War II, and "Nam than is true today. Yet town meetings were not abolished in New Hampshire during those wars. My $20 bill says there has never been a hue and cry in Meredith to abolish town meeting during wartime because draftees were unable to attend and vote.

The town meeting form of government is the democracy that was envisioned by Benjamin Franklin, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, and the other enlightened architects of our glorious nation. They believed that free discussion and debate, followed by a vote, produced the best decisions. Our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution were forged in town meeting type deliberations. By practicing the democracy that they preached, these individuals, the greatest political minds in the history of mankind, put heir very lives on the line. If 1776 had failed, they surely would have been executed. hence Paine's famous words, "Give me liberty, or give me death." Town meetig democracy is their lagacy to us, and it is our direct and unbroken connection with them.

Meredith's town meeting has been a lively event all the many years I have attended. Voters have not been afraid to speak their minds. The debates pro and con ther major warrant articles have been excellent, and I for one have benefited from them. Though some votes are far from unanimous, ultimately we respect each other for airing enough to attend, to speak, and to vote. The annual town meeting is an extremely important part of he social fabric of our town.

"But you can still have your deliberative session," say the proponents of SB-2. That's a joke. In every town that has adopted Senate Bill 2, attendance at deliberative sessions has been minimal. It is the vote that brings people out. SB-2 towns suffer from a disconnect between discussion/debate and voting.

Let's be honest about SB-2. The issue is town and school spending, and SB-2 is meant to be a club with which every capital project, no matter how necessary, and every budget increase, no matter how modest and justified can be bludgeoned to death. So please don't insult voters' intelligence with the other rhetoric.

The SB-2 folks say the sky has not fallen in SB-2 towns. But what has been the fate of capital projects in those towns? In which of those towns have employees unionized, and which of those towns will see unionization in the years to come? What is the state of employee moral, employee retention, and other factors with huge cost ramifications in SB-2 towns? What has happened to the quality of services, and the quality of education? What is the state of civic pride? The string of defeated capital projects and imposed default budgets will cost taxpayers more in the long run, but the SB-2ers can't see it because of their tunnel vision. Or maybe they just don't plan to be around when the economic consequences hit.

Here in Meredih, we have escaped the divisiveness found in so many other Lakes Region towns. We have rallied behind capital projects that have failed repeatedly in neighboring communities. We are perceived to be a cut above, and that has attracted many fine new residents and many talented new town employees. We have a very good thing going here, as witnessed by the extraordinary increase in the value of our property. Why tamper with success?

There are many, many reasons why Meredith voters should deep six SB-2. I will say more about them in the days and weeks to come. I have only begun to speak.

Peter Miller
Meredith

Laconia Daily Sun, Feb 20, 2008
Letter to the Editor
.......


As I understand it, the voting on Meredith SB-2 will be held at the Tuesday night, March 11, town meeting, and a 60% majority is needed for SB-2 to be approved.

Hmmmmm....is this letter the start of the 2009 selectman's race between Peter Miller and Richard Juve, when Peter Brothers' three year term is over? What did Miller say...."Shame on Richard Juve...."...what's up with that...why's he targeting Juve in his opening sentence? Let's not forget that Richard Juve, a newcomer, came close to beating Flanders, and lost a close race by 650-625. And, Miller Lovett was on top with 750 votes as the three candidates vied for two open seats in the November 2006 Meredith selectman's election.


....

[tis]

I absolute agree, SB2 allows more working people to vote, because they have all day to vote, not just a few hours on an evening or on a Saturday when they are tired or have plans with their family. As Rick Heath's letter said, "the powers (that) be" don't like SBs because they can pack the meeting and get their pet projects voted on. Instead of a few hundred voting, thousands vote and that is a much better representation. I agree not quite as many attend the deliberative sessions, but still, I think there is a pretty fair turnout. I think the proof is in these two letters.

[wifi]

Wow... I don't like change for the sake of change, but from the letter here it seems the main reasons to shoot down SB-2 in Meredith are:

1) Meetings are the way its always been done

2) SB-2 would impede town spending, because voters wouldn't approve the spending article

Ummmm... tell me there is something I am missing?

Are Meredith town meetings represented by a quorum of voters? If its like Moultonboro, for sure not. If the voters shoot down something because they are misinformed, its the town Selectpersons fault, not the fault of 'letting' all the voters vote. Lets find ways to balance the budget rather than reasons to increase it.

With that kind of attitude, I wish you success, FLL

[Irish mist]

If SB-2 was so bad NH towns would be voting it right out at the next election.....that's not happening. It enjoys overwhelming success all over NH.

[fatlazyless]

Our New Hampshire property tax bill has four different items; town, school, state school, and county.

All four items are on the increase and all four items are being litigated, petitioned, warranted, and cost-shifted in an effort to lower the tax bill, and at the same time the next Meredith property tax bill should be about 4%, or more, larger than the last one due December 2007.

Governor Lynch wants a constitutional amendment to control the state school costs. A number of towns including Meredith are pooling town money to pay the lawyers to sue the state to keep the state from shifting its' county expenses onto the towns. SB-2, which requires a 60% majority vote at a town meeting, has been passed by about 60 different NH towns since SB-2 was created in 1996.

SB-2 will not do all that much to control the town and school costs as most expenses are contractual and do not come up for a warrant vote. Typically, warrant votes are for big capital items like community centers, police stations, fire stations, and football fields.

What SB-2 really is, is an expression of anger by property tax payers who have seen their taxes go up, big-time.

People grow old, pay off their mortgages, and get annoyed and frustrated as their six month, semi-annual property tax bill grows and grows. You can pay off a mortgage, but that property tax bill, it never gets paid off, and it just keeps on a-grow'n, and a-grow'n, and a-grow'n!

[SAMIAM]

I was just thinking how nice it would be if I could bring my whole crew to a town meeting and wait until later in the evening to vote for a big addition to my building,a nice cost of living increase for everyone,a couple of paid holidays and ,hmmm,let's see....oh yes,maybe some nice retirement packages for everyone. All to be paid for by the taxpayers.

[ITD]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

People grow old, pay off their mortgages, and get annoyed and frustrated as their six month, semi-annual property tax bill grows and grows. You can pay off a mortgage, but that property tax bill, it never gets paid off, and it just keeps on a-grow'n, and a-grow'n, and a-grow'n!

And why do you think that is Less, why it's because they keep a-spendin' a-spendin' a-spendin', hopefully if SB2 goes thru people will start votin' down those a-spendin' articles.

[fatlazyless]

Quotes taken from the February 14, 2008, Laconia Daily Sun, 'SB-2 debate begins in Meredith,' by Michael Kitch
............................

Town Manager Carol Granfield set the scene with a staff report which concluded "the SB-2 form of government is not recommended as a positive improvement for the Town of Meredith." She explained that SB-2 was primarily intended to provide voters unable to attend Town Meeting an opportunity to vote on the warrant and to enable voters to cast their ballots in private.

However, Granfield expressed a number of reservations about the process. "Many people voting," she said. "do not understand the articles. (And) Those who don't understand the articles typically vote no." She noted that when voters reject the budget, the default budget taking its place includes contractual agreements with collective bargaining units, which must be honored, sometimes at the expense of positions and services. Granfield suggested that SB-2, by increasing the likelihood of voters rejecting budgets while ensuring that union contracts must be fulfilled, could encourage municipal employees to form collective bargaining units. "SB-2 communities." Granfield suggested "may better assist towns that do not have a professional manager and department heads on staff."
........................

Fire Chief Chuck Palm, who is running to replace chairman Frank Michel on the Selectboard, suggested that expectations that voters could control the tax rate by adopting SB-2 are misplaced. He recalled that last year the tax rate rose 17 cents, from $10.74 to $10.91, but that the town portion of the rate dropped 9-cents, from $3.79 to $3.70. On the other hand, the school portion climbed 6-cents, the state property tax 13-cents and county tax 7-cents, he said, adding that the largest share of the increase, the state and county taxes, is beyond the control of the town.

"We can control the tax rate with what we have right here." Palm declared.
...........................

Selectman Bob Flanders said that 'my biggest concern is that when the people go to the polls they have the full story," referring to the "warts and pimples" of the SB-2 process. "I've just heard an awfull lot of negatives," he said, recalling that in one town voters endorsed contradictory articles and in another reduced an appropriation for a fire station to $1. Noting that participation in the deliberative meeting is an important part of the SB-2 process, Flanders said that those people wintering in Florida and unable to attend are "disenfranchised," even if they cast absentee ballots. "Is that a more representative form of government? It doesn't seem like that to me," he said.
...........................

The proposal to adopt SB-2 will appear on both the town and school district warrant in March, where it will require a super-majority of 60-percent to succeed. Town Moderator Lou Kahn said that he will invite Bob Ambrose, Senior Deputy Secretary of State, who is well versed in the design and operation of SB-2, to explain the official ballot form of town government at Candidates Night, which is scheduled for the evening of Thursday, February 28, at the Community Center.
..........................

excerpts all from The Laconia Daily Sun, Feb 14, 2008, "SB-2 debate begins in Meredith' by Michael Kitch






.........................
Hey there, Is that Laconia Daily Sun a good newspaper, or is that Laconia Daily Sun a good newspaper?

[fatlazyless]

Here's a Thursday, February 21, in-depth and play-by-play analysis on what your Meredith and Moultonboro town leaders really and truly think about SB-2 from your good buddies over at www.granitegrok.com (in the good neighbor town of Gilford).

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...llot_html:):):)

What a bummer...the link on the edit is looking good but it doesn't survive the save button. Is this a conspiracy? Someone....out there...please repost....so's the planet can easily & quickly examine the powerfull insight of GraniteGrok!

[GWC...]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Here's a Thursday, February 21, in-depth and play-by-play analysis on what your Meredith and Moultonboro town leaders really and truly think about SB-2 from your good buddies over at www.granitegrok.com (in the good neighbor town of Gilford).

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...llot_html:):):)

What a bummer...the link on the edit is looking good but it doesn't survive the save button. Is this a conspiracy? Someone....out there...please repost....so's the planet can easily & quickly examine the powerfull insight of GraniteGrok!

Hope this helps...

The first link works; the second is the link you posted – note the small differences in the URL.

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...al_ballot.html

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...llot_html:):):

For your viewing pleasure and general enhancement of taxation knowledge:

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...goal_is_y.html

[longislander]

http://granitegrok.com/blog/2008/02/...al_ballot.html

[fatlazyless]

From page B6 of today's Saturday, February 23, 2008, Laconia Citizen, By Erin Plummer

SB2 gets opposition in Center Harbor

By Erin Plummer

A small, yet vocal group of Center Harbor residents voiced opposition to the implementation of Senate Bill 2 in the Inter-Lakes School District.

The second of three scheduled hearings was held in Center Harbor on Thursday on the petitioned warrant article to implement the Official Ballot Act, commonly known as SB2, that would replace the traditional school district meeting with a deliberative session and ballot voting on warrant articles at Inter-Lakes.

Members of the School Board with Superintendent Phil McCormack and attorney Barbara Loman explained the law and how it would effect voting and budgeting in the school district.

Around three Center Harbor residents were present at the meeting, all voicing fervent opposition to SB2.

"I think it's a more detached way of participating in your local government," said Center Harbor Selectman Charley Hanson, who spoke of his experiences with SB2 in Weare. " It creates a bit of an uneven playing field."

Resident Bess Hanson said a deliberative session cannot compare to a traditional school meeting. "people who go to those are the ones who are truly interested."

Resident Kay Peranelli noted how few people typically attend the deliberative session in SB2 towns. "I think you miss an awfull lot by not showing up," she said.

With the discussion that goes on at a regular town meeting, "I think you get far better decisions when you get that discussion, that debate," Peranelli said.

"Yes, it takes time and no, it's not convenient for a lot of people, but democracy isn't easy."

Laconia Citizen Feb 23, 2008
By Erin Plummer
......




......

[tis]

I have news for these people. In Wolfeboro, the same interested people show up for the deliberative session that used to show up for town meeting. I don't know what makes them think that people will go to town meeting any more than they would go to the deliberative session. Personally I think it is just the only thing they could think of to say bad about SB2. In Wolfeboro in the old days maybe three hundred showed up for town meeting. Depending on what is going on, it it not much different. But the big think is instead of two or three hundred voting, it is in the thousands. Still, not enough vote, usually not a third. It is too bad more don't.

[summersux]

Originally Posted by SAMIAM

If there is a single family in the Moultonborough/Meredith area that has contributed more to the well being and economy than the Heath family,I'd like to know who it is.They were all born ,raised, and schooled here (not that it makes them any better) but certainly shows that they have their roots here in the lakes region.
Summersux......how many jobs have you created over the years? the Heaths have literally employed thousands.What do you pay for taxes?...maybe you'd prefer the Heath's bill. How many town boards have you served on? The Heaths have served in some capacity their entire lives.
"Old Rick? wish we had more like him.

The residents in the Town which he resides should be proud. Plenty of home owners in both Towns that have contributed to the economy not just Rick.

Is this a chest thumping thread?





Did anyone see the deliberative session for Alton on channel 26? HaHa.


Wait, you can't ever pay off taxes? No way.

[SAMIAM]

Is this a chest thumping thread?

Not at all Summersux......just that I've known the family for many years and know them all to be give time unselfishly to their community.Didn't mean to rant.

[fatlazyless]

SB2 takes precedence over school budget increase

The Meredith News, Thursday, Feb 21, 2008

By Sarah Schmidt


MOULTONBORO - At the presentation of the Moultonboro School District budget, the focus wasn't the 3.97 percent increase in the budget, but rather the hotly debated SB2 hearing.

With little input from the attending public about the budget, School Board Chair Laurie Whitley opened the public hearing for the SB2 petition warrant article. Several Moultonboro town officials stepped forward to speak as citizens, by and large speaking against the passage of the SB2 warrant article.

"I don't see the petitioners (of SB2) running for committees or the school board," said Town Moderator Mel Borrin. "This is just a method of getting you to cut the budget, a 'getcha' deal."

Borrin said that if the town voted to change to the SB2 form of government, it would endanger the school budget, since such a large portion of it encompasses the salaries for teachers negotiated by their union. He also spoke against the practice in SB2 of allowing residents to vote on the Town Warrant in a polling booth.

"If they say you're spending too much, let them challenge you," said Borrin."There's no challenge behind a curtain when voting all no. It can cripple something begun years ago."

Borrin also took issue with the deliberative session of the SB2 process, where residents can amend articles a month before voting on them, and said that just as many people who couldn't attend Town Meeting would not be able to attend a deliberative session. School Superintendent Mike Lancor also expresses concern about the deliberative session's average attendance and called SB2 ballots themselves a form of "multiple choice."

"My concern is that SB2 does not give voters a full choice," said Selectman Ed Charest. "When the ballot is mailed out, you're getting a choice that other people have made for you. It's taking away the right to vote."

Chair Karel Crawford also spoke against the petition warrant article, encouraging people to vote for people who represented their interests.

Speaking in support of SB2, Al Hume took issue with the defnition of the purest form of government, saying that rather than the exact method, the best method is to maximize the amount of people who could vote.

"If Moultonboro had SB2, there would be a lot more people voting," said Hume. "About 360 people voted on the whole budget, and 107 at the school. The purest form of government is maximizing the number of people voting."

Hume said that SB2 would not change the government in Moultonboro, just the time and manner in which warrant articles are approved in. It would also, he said, allow people who could not make it to Town Meeting, who could not stay the whole time, or who felt more comfortable casting their vote in a private booth, the ability to vote.

"I don't think people are hiding behind a closed booth." said Hume, in response to Borrin's earlier comment on voting on the Town Warrant in polling booths.

Crawford noted that both the school and town budgets and warrant articles will come before voters at Town Meeting on Saturday, March 15. Childcare will be provided and a lunch will be available for purchase.

As far as the school budget, the majority of the $518,465 increase is in the $475,781 increase in the personnel budget, much of it in salary increase for teachers and other school employees. The Moultonboro School District will enter the second year of its collective bargaining agreement in the next school year, with an average salary increase of 5.12 percent, and an average step increase of 1.8 percent. Other increases include salaries for 10 and 12 month employees, administrative and conract employees, paraeducator's salaries, retirement, FICA, and dental insuirance. The personnel budget accounts for about 70.1 percent of the total budget, and the increases within the personnel budget accounts for 91.8 percent of the budget.

Amoung the warrant articles up for a vote this year is an article that would appropriate up to $50,000 from the unreserved fund balance at the end of the school year, to be placed in an expendable trust fund for buildings and grounds.

The Meredith News,Thursday, February 21, 2008

By Sarah Schmidt

.....





.....

[fatlazyless]

The Meredith News, Thursday, Feb 21, 2008

Letters to the Editor

.........

School Board opposes SB2

To the Editor:

As many folks in Moultonboro may or may not know, an article was placed on the Moultonboro School District ballot (warrant) by a citizens' petition asking voters to adopt provision RSA 40:13 (known as SB2). After holding a Public Hearing on the SB2 article on Feb.12, the School Board members voted 5 - 0 to oppose this article. All residents of Moultonboro will have an opportunity to vote on this article on Election day, which is March 11.

Please give our position on this article serious consideration before you make your final decision. A no vote on this petitioned warrant article will maintain our current form of government which allows all residents to discuss and vote on warrant articles during our annual meeting. Thankyou very much.

Also I want to remind you that the School District Annual Meeting is March 15 at 9 a.m. in the Community Auditorium at Moultonboro Academy. The Annual Town Meeting will follow.

Laurie Whitley
Chair
Moultonboro School Board

.........


Why does the School Board oppose SB2?

To the Editor,

I am writing in support of SB2 for Moultonboro. The Moultonboro School Board prefers a "no" vote on SB2, evidenced by a 5 - 0 vote at the recent public hearing, thereby opposing full participation in government. My question to the school board (and all others that oppose SB2) is why?

The only thing SB2 will change is when and how you vote. Everything else remains the same. All warrant articles are discussed and amended during the Deliberative Session in early February. Voting on these articles takes place 30 days later during Election Day, on the second Tuesday in March in the privacy of a ballot box. No more disenfranchisement and no more fear of hostile and vocal special interests.

Vote yes to SB2 on March 11 and allow all citizens to participate in our town's future.

Paul Punturieri
Moultonboro
........



........

[Irish mist]

I guess the town officals fear the citizens will use the "privacy of the voting booth" to get away from the the gaze of the police & fire personal that often sit-in at town meeting and stare down the voters.

I have a friend in Gilford who was a public supporter of S-B2 & he use to get phone calls a three in the morning at his unlisted number every night threatening his business & family.
________
YAMAHA PSR-185

[fatlazyless]

Gilford....hmmmm....that's really something. talking about Gilford....Gilford approved SB-2 in their first petitioned warrant in 2004, and as everyone knows, it takes a 60% super majority. I wonder how organized Gilford was in their 'get out the vote' effort?

I'll be very surprised if it passes in Meredith because the SB-2 supporters do not seem to be all that organized. I just do not know nuth'n! But, I think I can safely assume that the opposition will be better organized and vote on Tuesday night, March 11, at Town Meeting.

Heck, a bundle of kindling wood is better organized than us supporters! Hopefully, there will be enough SB-2 supporters who show up at town meeting and vote to be able to overcome the high hurdle of 60%. It wil not be easy! It will be a huge challenge! In order for SB-2 to meet the 60%, there needs to be some type of get-out-the-vote!

Something I did not know and just learned today by reading the Meredith News is that the Inter-Lakes SAU School District, SB-2 petition, that I submitted to the town clerk, puts SB-2 warrants (ballots) in the town meetings for Center Harbor, Sandwich, and Meredith, as these three towns comprise the Inter-Lakes SAU. How many people across the three towns have an interest in the SAU which I believe includes the Junior and Senior High School ? How big is this?

Back in December, I read Richard Juve's letter to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun, while eating breakfast at McDonald's, and then pursued my own two petitions at primary day, January 8. Like I said, it was the perfect spot!

[fatlazyless]

An excerpted quote by Moultonboro Selectman Ed Charest from the Feb 21, 2008, Meredith News front page article entitled 'SB2 takes precedence over school budget increase,' by Sarah Schmidt
.....

As for seasonal residents, Charest said that it was the residents' choice to live elsewhere during the winter.

"If someone wants to do something badly enough, they can do it," said Charest. "Couples find babysitters, make arrangements. My father-in-law could park out front, and someone would take it in. If it's a hot item, people show up. If not, they're making the assumption that the government is making good choices. We're doing our job. People let us know when we don't."

The Meredith News, 2/21/08, by Sarah Schmidt
.........


As Selectman Ed Charest says, "if it's a hot item, people show up," and hopefully enough SB-2 supporters will show up to the town meetings. Time will tell, it always does.

[WeirsBeachBoater]

I will admit there are flaws in the town meeting style, but there are more in SB2. The uninformed voter assumes that you just go to the polls to vote once SB is in place. Not true, what the supporters of SB2 aren't telling you is that it is more prone to corruption. There is a 2 part system, there is a deliberative session, and then a voting session. What happens in most of these towns that are new to SB2 is that the special interest groups that everyone so nicely points to at town meeting, now can go to the deliberative session, that the uninformed don't know exists. The facts show the turnout at these sessions is dramatically low. Then by the end of the session they have turned an article to restore the fire station into an article to improve the fire station by $1.00 !!! You want to see crooked politics at their best vote for SB2!

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by WeirsBeachBoater

I will admit there are flaws in the town meeting style, but there are more in SB2. The uninformed voter assumes that you just go to the polls to vote once SB is in place. Not true, what the supporters of SB2 aren't telling you is that it is more prone to corruption. There is a 2 part system, there is a deliberative session, and then a voting session. What happens in most of these towns that are new to SB2 is that the special interest groups that everyone so nicely points to at town meeting, now can go to the deliberative session, that the uninformed don't know exists. The facts show the turnout at these sessions is dramatically low. Then by the end of the session they have turned an article to restore the fire station into an article to improve the fire station by $1.00 !!! You want to see crooked politics at their best vote for SB2!

I'll say it again: If SB-2 is so bad how come every town that has voted it in almost never votes it out ? It's very, very popular where ever it has been tried with the voting public.

[WeirsBeachBoater]

Because 90% of the voters are uninformed!

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by WeirsBeachBoater

Because 90% of the voters are uninformed!

I see.....90% of the voters in NH are idiots becaue they don't agree with you. My, my, how do we all take care of ourselves out here without the likes of you to do it for us.

[WeirsBeachBoater]

Now you are twisting... you must have spent some time in the speed limit forum.
Let me rephrase, many voters believe what they are told, many pro sb2 people are painting a pretty picture of sb2. Now I am saying that there is a low percentage of the voters who will dig further to educate themselves. If you want you can compare this to town meeting, most voters know when it is, but what percentage (of able bodied residents who are in town that night) go! SB2 has some upside, but also has some downside!!! I wish the proponents would tell the whole story, thats all.

[tis]

Originally Posted by WeirsBeachBoater

I will admit there are flaws in the town meeting style, but there are more in SB2. The uninformed voter assumes that you just go to the polls to vote once SB is in place. Not true, what the supporters of SB2 aren't telling you is that it is more prone to corruption. There is a 2 part system, there is a deliberative session, and then a voting session. What happens in most of these towns that are new to SB2 is that the special interest groups that everyone so nicely points to at town meeting, now can go to the deliberative session, that the uninformed don't know exists. The facts show the turnout at these sessions is dramatically low. Then by the end of the session they have turned an article to restore the fire station into an article to improve the fire station by $1.00 !!! You want to see crooked politics at their best vote for SB2!

That is nonsense.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by WeirsBeachBoater

Now you are twisting... you must have spent some time in the speed limit forum.
Let me rephrase, many voters believe what they are told, many pro sb2 people are painting a pretty picture of sb2. Now I am saying that there is a low percentage of the voters who will dig further to educate themselves. If you want you can compare this to town meeting, most voters know when it is, but what percentage (of able bodied residents who are in town that night) go! SB2 has some upside, but also has some downside!!! I wish the proponents would tell the whole story, thats all.

In general my experience with NH voters is that by & large most of them are intelligent, thoughtful, and care about their communities. SB-2 has been voted in small towns & large towns all over NH with very positive results. The citizens like it. They almost never vote it out. That's the reality of the situation. The SB-2 movement is thriving & expanding in NH because the citizens think it works better than town meeting in some cases.

You can see the same thing happening with the tax-cap movement that the city of Laconia just put in. Citizens want government to keep spending under control. There is no doubt that SB-2 will help control some of the spending issues that face our towns.

[fatlazyless]

Probably, Laconia passed a tax cap for some of the same reasons that Wolfeboro, Alton & Gilford passed SB-2. As a city and not a town, SB-2 is not an option for Laconia. It looks like SB-2 may be spreading and moving around the lake to Meredith and Moultonboro.

For a town with no school system,, no school administration unit, no town hall, no town roads, no library, no police dept, no fire dept, no community center, no public works dept, no budget, and no people; suggest you move to the very large and not too far away NH town of Livermore, and live happily ever after...........lol.
.........
Here's a letter to the editor in today's February 27, 2008, Laconia Daily Sun, from Meredith.
.........

SB-2 would allow people to vote their wallets. And that's bad?

To the editor:

Its time to take back Meredith, not to an earlier time, but from the special interest and the tax and spenders. Many of the taxpayers of Meredith - both natives and others - who have migrated here from the south seeking lower taxes and freedom are profoundly disappointed in the tax and spenders who have taken over the town and school system. It's time to rise up and empower the people and pass SB-2.

The founders of this great republic would be ecstatic that more voters would be participating in the voting in any form of government. The people in control ignore the falling property values, bad economy, high cost of fuels and other goods. Not everyone has unlimited income. The town of Meredith is used as an example of out of control spending by people from other towns.

One selectman made the statement that with SB-2, people would vote their wallets - not a good thing, well, ya!

If all you can afford is a Ford you don't buy a Lincoln. What's next, maybe an olympic swimming pool for the Inter-Lakes High School county club or the community center? People of Meredith and Meredith Center, rise up like our forefathers did with the British and take back Meredith. We can always go back to town meeting where 10-percent run the town. Hats off to Ms. Worsman and Mr. Lovett on the Selectboard but they need help. Elect Jim Waldron to the Selectboard.

George Horne
Meredith
.........


.........

[fatlazyless]

Letter to the Meredith News from Moultonboro, Thursday, February 28, 2008
.....

Be not afraid, vote for SB2

To the editor,

Can't believe the selectman votes 4 - 1 on the petition warrant article that would give $375,000 to the Recreation Strategic Planning Team. I thought this was put on the back burner for two years. These are bad economic times. We do not need the senior center. Stop making people think it is a good thing for them. No, it is not. If the taxes keep going up the seniors will lose their homes, and that is what the townspeople do not want. They said they got 300 signatures from the people in town that want the Senior Center. What about the rest? I guess we need to get 301 signatures that say no we don't.

NOW WHAT!

We should be watching how we spend our tax dollars. The selectmen are not in our best interest, only the special interest. So, people of the town of Moultonboro, listen up and make sure you vote for SB2. Be not afraid. Be afraid if you do not vote and let the selectmen vote for you. We as taxpayers should have a say in where our hard-earned money goes.

Anna de Rosa
Moultonboro

.....


....
As you know, SB-2 needs 60% to get passed! fll

[phoenix]

and today there is an article in the local papers that mention a new bill in the legislature that would restart the donor town tax that is Moultonboro would rasie its property tax rate to give money to other towns. Bill put in by a number of democrats

[fatlazyless]

From letters to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun, Thursday, February 28,
2008

Peter Miller has served the town of Meredith as selectman and was chairman as recently as December 2006, when he chose not to run for re-election.

Whether you agree or disagree with him on SB-2, you can tell from this letter that he very much cares about the Town of Meredith and about town government. fll


.....................

Town officials need annual meetings to get their message out to the voters

To the editor,

The events leading up to Meredith's vote on Senate Bill 2 illustrate what is wrong with the SB-2 decision making process. Because this challenge to our current form of government will be decided on election Tuesday rather than town meeting Wednesday, there is no provision for voters to formally gather to discuss the pros and cons of SB-2 or to put some hard questions to the lead petitioners. Instead, information is transmitted in a haphazard way - letters to the editor, remarks made at Board of Selectmen meetings, and suchlike. That's poor preparation for a decision of this magntude.

Compare that to the way voters will decide whether to approve the fire station bond issue at the upcoming town meeting. A power point presentation of the proposed stations's plans and projected costs will be shown to all those who have assembled to vote. The discussion that follows will allow voters to ask tough, probing questions of selectmen, and to voice their sentiments pro and con. After the last person who wishes to speak has been heard, and only then, voters will decide the issue by secret ballot.

If Senate Bill 2 is enacted, this thorough and time-tested way of conducting business will be no more. All warrant articles will be decided the way Senate BIll 2 is being acted on this year. Yes, Senate Bill 2 does provide for a deliberative session, but these are very poorly attended in SB-2 towns because there is no vote to bring people out. Typically, only a tiny fraction of those who cast ballots on election Tuesday attend the deliberative session beforehand. In contrast, nearly 100-percent of those voting at Town Meeting listen to and/or participate in the deliberation that precedes each vote.

"But it's hard for our senior citizens to sit through a long evening meeting," say the SB-2 advocates. Well, let me tell you something. I'm one of Meredith's senior citizens. I have many physical infirmities, including hearing loss and a medical condition that causes my leg muscles to cramp if I sit too long in a chair. Yet I am so opposed to Senate Bill 2 that I would donate one of my Social Security checks to help finance the effort to dump SB-2 in the compost heap. If I can make it through a long town meeting, so can my fellow seniors. It may not be fun, but it is a vital civic duty, and it is participatory democracy at its finest. One evening a year is not an excessive sacrifice.

Town meeting insures thoughtful deliberation prior to voting. Year after year, I have been very impressed with the questions and concerns voiced by Meredith residents at town meeeting. We learn from each other at this annual gathering, and the various perspectives people express at the microphone act as a system of checks and balances.

The thing that scares me the most about SB-2 is that there are no checks and balances. Voters reach a decision somehow - because of what they read in the press, or because a friend of a friend of a friend said such-and-such, or because of what they overheard while eating breakfast at George's Diner, or because they hold a grudge against a town employee or official. With Senate Bill 2, it is much more likely that reaction, not reflection, will prevail. That is dangerous, because it leads to bad decisions.

Senate Bill 2 is favored by reactionaries who want no capital spending and no budget increase. If Senate Bill 2 had been enacted in Meredith six years ago, the police department would still be in that decrepit facility near the bowling alley, there would be no Community Center, and the fire station renovation would be headed for defeat. Why do I say that? Because town leaders would have had no effective means of explaining to voters why these capital projects were necessary, timely, and cost-effective, and because emotion would have prevailed over reason far too often in the voting booth.

Town meeting is the only official event that generates a large turnout. Most Board of Selectmen meetings are attended by a predictable few - the press, department heads, former selectmen and selectman wannabes, and people who have a vested interest in that night's agenda items. During the years I was selectman, the Board's annual budget and warrant hearings attracted almost no one.

When town officials can't get their message to the voters, it allows the critics to have an open field of play. Every town has a few self-appointed wisenheimers who bash elected and appointed officials as frequently as the rooster crows. You've published their diatribes, so you know what I mean. In time, the sheer repetition of these slams has an effect. They play on voters' emotions, and people assume that where there's smoke, there must be fire. The intent is to whip the public into a frenzy. There are voters who signed the SB-2 petition because they think Carol Granfield's gas allowance is too generous, or because they think the new police station should have a cell block facade, or because they are just plain mad at all the growth happening in town. If the fire station bond issue was being decided by SB-2 rules, they would take that negative attitude right into the voting booth, and it would be payback time, to hell with the consequences.

We need the checks and balances that town meetng provides. I ask every voter who shares my concerns to vote on election Tuesday and simply say NO to SB-2.

Thankyou for publishing this letter. There is still at least one more yet to come.

Peter Miller
Meredith
..................






....................

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

From letters to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun, Thursday, February 28,
2008

Peter Miller has served the town of Meredith as a selectman and was chairman as recently as December 2006, when he chose not to run for re-election.

Whether you agree or disagree with him on SB-2, you can tell from this letter that he very much cares about the Town of Meredith and about town government. fll


.....................

Town officials need annual meetings to get their message out to the voters

To the editor,

The events leading up to Meredith's vote on Senate Bill 2 illustrate what is wrong with the SB-2 decision making process. Because this challenge to our current form of government will be decided on election Tuesday rather than town meeting Wednesday, there is no provision for voters to formally gather to discuss the pros and cons of SB-2 or to put some hard questions to the lead petitioners. Instead, information is transmitted in a haphazard way - letters to the editor, remarks made at Board of Selectmen meetings, and suchlike. That's poor preparation for a decision of this magntude.

Compare that to the way voters will decide whether to approve the fire station bond issue at the upcoming town meeting. A power point presentation of the proposed stations's plans and projected costs will be shown to all those who have assembled to vote. The discussion that follows will allow voters to ask tough, probing questions of selectmen, and to voice their sentiments pro and con. After the last person who wishes to speak has been heard, and only then, voters will decide the issue by secret ballot.

If Senate Bill 2 is enacted, this thorough and time-tested way of conducting business will be no more. All warrant articles will be decided the way Senate BIll 2 is being acted on this year. Yes, Senate Bill 2 does provide for a deliberative session, but these are very poorly attended in SB-2 towns because there is no vote to bring people out. Typically, only a tiny fraction of those who cast ballots on election Tuesday attend the deliberative session beforehand. In contrast, nearly 100-percent of those voting at Town Meeting listen to and/or participate in the deliberation that precedes each vote.

"But it's hard for our senior citizens to sit through a long evening meeting," say the SB-2 advocates. Well, let me tell you something. I'm one of Meredith's senior citizens. I have many physical infirmities, including hearing loss and a medical condition that causes my leg muscles to cramp if I sit too long in a chair. Yet I am so opposed to Senate Bill 2 that I would donate one of my Social Security checks to help finance the effort to dump SB-2 in the compost heap. If I can make it through a long town meeting, so can my fellow seniors. It may not be fun, but it is a vital civic duty, and it is participatory democracy at its finest. One evening a year is not an excessive sacrifice.

Town meeting insures thoughtful deliberation prior to voting. Year after year, I have been very impressed with the questions and concerns voiced by Meredith residents at town meeeting. We learn from each other at this annual gathering, and the various perspectives people express at the microphone act as a system of checks and balances.

The thing that scares me the most about SB-2 is that there are no checks and balances. Voters reach a decision somehow - because of what they read in the press, or because a friend of a friend of a friend said such-and-such, or because of what they overheard while eating breakfast at George's Diner, or because they hold a grudge against a town employee or official. With Senate Bill 2, it is much more likely that reaction, not reflection, will prevail. That is dangerous, because it leads to bad decisions.

Senate Bill 2 is favored by reactionaries who want no capital spending and no budget increase. If Senate Bill 2 had been enacted in Meredith six years ago, the police department would still be in that decrepit facility near the bowling alley, there would be no Community Center, and the fire station renovation would be headed for defeat. Why do I say that? Because town leaders would have had no effective means of explaining to voters why these capital projects were necessary, timely, and cost-effective, and because emotion would have prevailed over reason far too often in the voting booth.

Town meeting is the only official event that generates a large turnout. Most Board of Selectmen meetings are attended by a predictable few - the press, department heads, former selectmen and selectman wannabes, and people who have a vested interest in that night's agenda items. During the years I was selectman, the Board's annual budget and warrant hearings attracted almost no one.

When town officials can't get their message to the voters, it allows the critics to have an open field of play. Every town has a few self-appointed wisenheimers who bash elected and appointed officials as frequently as the rooster crows. You've published their diatribes, so you know what I mean. In time, the sheer repetition of these slams has an effect. They play on voters' emotions, and people assume that where there's smoke, there must be fire. The intent is to whip the public into a frenzy. There are voters who signed the SB-2 petition because they think Carol Granfield's gas allowance is too generous, or because they think the new police station should have a cell block facade, or because they are just plain mad at all the growth happening in town. If the fire station bond issue was being decided by SB-2 rules, they would take that negative attitude right into the voting booth, and it would be payback time, to hell with the consequences.

We need the checks and balances that town meetng provides. I ask every voter who shares my concerns to vote on election Tuesday and simply say NO to SB-2.

Thankyou for publishing this letter. There is still at least one more yet to come.

Peter Miller
Meredith
..................






....................

Lol, the thing that scares Peter Miller is that there is going to be thousands of new voters in Meredith. And these new voters are not going to be inclined to be lose with the town's cash.

[ITD]

Good letter from Mr. Miller. Thanks for posting it Less.

I too have problems with bills like SB2. I think we've turned into a society of sound bites. Everybody wants everything presented to them in neat little packages that don't take more than 15 to 30 seconds to digest. Then they want to act. Unfortunately, not much in life is that simple. The instant gratification we seek, be it in speed limits to solve a crowding, noise, large wake problem, that stock that will turn our $500 investment into $1,000,000, that pill that will allow us to eat like pigs and still lose weight, these things seldom work. The people claiming that they are too busy to go to town meeting will still be too busy to attend informational meetings and probably too busy to vote. The problem I have with SB2 is it gives too much power to the proponents and opponents who try to turn complex issues into 15 second sound bites. It gives too much power to voters who make up their mind based on these sound bites or worse use the einey meeney miney moe method. Voting is a responsibility, it's not supposed to be easy all the time. Tough decisions require information and thought, not quick decisions at voting time.

I think the people who think this will slow down spending are in for a shock.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by ITD

Good letter from Mr. Miller. Thanks for posting it Less.

I too have problems with bills like SB2. I think we've turned into a society of sound bites. Everybody wants everything presented to them in neat little packages that don't take more than 15 to 30 seconds to digest. Then they want to act. Unfortunately, not much in life is that simple. The instant gratification we seek, be it in speed limits to solve a crowding, noise, large wake problem, that stock that will turn our $500 investment into $1,000,000, that pill that will allow us to eat like pigs and still lose weight, these things seldom work. The people claiming that they are too busy to go to town meeting will still be too busy to attend informational meetings and probably too busy to vote. The problem I have with SB2 is it gives too much power to the proponents and opponents who try to turn complex issues into 15 second sound bites. It gives too much power to voters who make up their mind based on these sound bites or worse use the einey meeney miney moe method. Voting is a responsibility, it's not supposed to be easy all the time. Tough decisions require information and thought, not quick decisions at voting time.

I think the people who think this will slow down spending are in for a shock.

SB-2 works very well for most every town that has adopted it. It has slowed down spending in Gilford for a recent example. What is great about SB-2 is that it allows voters PRIVACY. That's a big deal in small towns. I have seen how town meeting is stacked with the education groups, and the fire groups, and the police groups.....and I have seen the fire & police groups make a point of staring down the voters at town meeting. It can be ugly. This takes some of the ugly away....and some of the POWER of these groups to pressure the voters. In the long run SB-2 will be adopted anyway....it's proved to work well.
________
Nevada marijuana dispensary

[wifi]

Originally Posted by Irish mist

SB-2 works very well for most every town that has adopted it. It has slowed down spending in Gilford for a recent example. What is great about SB-2 is that it allows voters PRIVACY. That's a big deal in small towns. I have seen how town meeting is stacked with the education groups, and the fire groups, and the police groups.....and I have seen the fire & police groups make a point of staring down the voters at town meeting. It can be ugly. This takes some of the ugly away....and some of the POWER of these groups to pressure the voters. In the long run SB-2 will be adopted anyway....it's proved to work well.

IM, I think you have hit the nail on the head. Every town official that opposes it, does so because they say some pet project of theirs wouldn't have been voted in, or throws in red herrings and fear, like unions.

If a particular line 'budget' item needs approval, why can't the voter study it and let the town officials or special interest groups convince the voter there is a need? Why is there fear the voter gets to vote in private ?

I have been to many town meetings and seen them stuffed by special agendas and stare downs.

[Irish mist]

Originally Posted by wifi

IM, I think you have hit the nail on the head. Every town official that opposes it, does so because they say some pet project of theirs wouldn't have been voted in, or throws in red herrings like unions.

If a particulal line 'budget' item needs approval, why can't the voter study it and let the town officials or special interest groups convinced the voter there is a need. Why is there fear the voter gets to vote in private ?

The "privacy of the voting booth" is indeed what they fear. The dirty little secret of many town meetings (not all) but many, is the pressure town "safety" officals put on the public to vote their way. Without that public pressure the town-folk often are more careful wih the town money.

[fatlazyless]

Here's a letter to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun, February 28, 2008, from Rick Heath of Moultonboro. As many readers know, Mr Heath is on the team that runs the totally terrific E. M. Heath supermarket and hardware stores in Center Harbor, that shopping mecca for the area! (Looking for a freebie cup of coffee from six choices of exotic Green Mt coffee including hawaian kona.......head for Heath's Super!)



......

Not everyone is able to be present at the town and school district meetings

To the editor,

In a most amazing statement by Moderator Borrin at the recent School District Public Hearing on SB-2, he indicated that those who would rather vote by ballot either within the privacy of a voting booth "hiding behind a curtain" (his words, not mine) or by absentee ballot had less courage than those dedicated souls that are able to make it to the town and school district meetings. Can we assume that as the chief election official in the town (Town Moderator as defined by RSA) he meant that hundreds of disenfranchised voters mean less to him than having the courage to stand before a stacked audience of prujudiced voters to muster up a vote against them?

I can tell you as a busines owner, parent having had kids in school and as a member of the community, it is easier to stay home. I will also tell you courage or cowardice has nothing to do with it. Because under the present forum, any one voter innocently going to "the purest form of democracy" to express their opinion is like leading the lamb to slaughter. I have seen the intimidation, the bullying, the impatience with the inexperienced participant, the arrogance of decades at the helm, and the cavalier behavior that is common from the podium all too often. No, setting yourself up for this kind of treatment in order to express one's opinion is not courage; it is stupidity.

Setting this allegation aside, SB-2 is not about "cutting taxes with large groups of absentee ballots"(his contention not mine) nor is it about having to run for office to demonstrate one's dedication to his community, nor is it "how we are going to 'getcha' by undermining the present process." SB-2 simply is a voting initiative that allows all registered voters to vote on the warrant articles. I know this is a simple concept for some of our town fathers to wrap their minds around, but not everyone is able to be present at the town and school district meetings. Should this simple fact deny those taxpaying, registered resident voters the right to have a saying how their tax dollar is spent?Their reply is that you have the opportunity to be there, discuss, and vote along with the rest of them; if that does not fit your schedule or your needs, then tough beans. Besides it is dangerous to allow uneducated voters to vote; only those insiders that have stuck with the process all throughout the year and fully understand all concepts of every article should be allowed the vote. By this standard we ought not to be voting on people for the office of selectmen unless we know ahead of time how they will represent us on all issues all the time. But they (all but one) just did a 180-degeree flip-flop on their supporting the multi-million dollar recreation center.

We all have priorities in life. Family, job or business, church, recreation, community obligations, etc. are some that come to mind. This writer would suggest a blend of some or all of these, and others I have missed, would be a healthy and natural prescription or blueprint with which to live life. That is not to say that if I put business higher on the list than recreation, or if my neighbor puts recreation higher than family, one of us is right and the other is wrong. There are no laws governing how we make our priority list or even that we need to have the list at all. I vote. I vote at primaries, local elections, state and national elections. I enjoy the process of taking my ballot and filling it out and either mailing it in by absentee or going behind the striped curtains and handing my ballot to the moderator. If you are not physically there at the town meeting, your right to vote is being denied. Why are we allowed to mail in our vote on all other aspects of government but not for town meetings? How is this called democracy at all, let alone domocracy in the purest form?

Please vote yes on SB-2 whether you live in Moultonboro, Meredith, Center Harbor, or Sandwich. Vote for the true purest form of democracy.

Rick Heath
Moultonboro
..........

Laconia Daily Sun, letter to the editor, Feb 28, 2008

[snowbird]

As a citizen of Gilford who is absent during the winter months, I am proud of our town and grateful that it extended to all registered voters the right to participate. I take my privilege and my responsibility seriously, study the issues, and have voted each and every time since our town so generously displayed its wisdom. Thank you, Gilford.

[fatlazyless]

Top of the front page, spanning the center of today's March 4, 2008 Laconia Daily Sun, in large bold letters:

Shaker board accused of trying to suppress SB-2 vote

Proponents wonder why polls will only be open for 1 hour and why Official Ballot vote is mixed in with articles that will be voted on at the annual meeting itself; the board says state law dictates the order(sub headline)

By Ray Carbone, The Laconia Daily Sun

Belmont - Two Planning Board members are criticizing the way the Shaker Regional School Board has set up the warrant for the annual district meeting set for Friday night, saying it's rigged to mislead voters about how they can vote on the official ballot (or, "SB-2") article.

Ward Peterson and Claude Patten have both written letters to The Daily Sun and taken out advertisements in the newspaper this week to let voters know they won't have to sit through the entire annual district meeting before they can vote on whether or not to adopt SB-2 for the Belmont-Canterbury school district.

"I took my ad because I wanted to make sure people know it's a ballot vote and the polls are open from 7 to 8 p.m.," Peterson said last night.

Peterson said the school board has taken the unusual measure of placing the SB-2 article on the warrant after a $500,000 bond issue article aimed at addressing several safety-related issues at the district's four schools, including installing a bus loop at Canterbury Elementary School, putting a sprinkler system into Belmont Elementary School and improving security at all four buildings. The bond-issue vote will take place durng the meeting itself.

...& 15 more paragraphs....can be read at www.laconiadailysun.com

by Ray Carbone, Laconia Daily Sun

oopsie doopsie...posted this in the wrong thread....meant to post in the SB-2 thread.....SB-2 fatigue is setting in here

[fatlazyless]

letter to the editor, Laconia Daily Sun, March 4, 008

How nice the town can close offices during Town Meeting

To the editor,

I find it very ironic that at the same Moultonborough selectmen's meeting where the selectmen were stating the reasons why the town should NOT Vote for SB-2, they were planning to close the town dump and library so that the employees could attend the Town Meeting. If Moultonborough were an SB-2 town this would not be necessary. They could vote at any time from 7 a.m. until 7 p.m.

How convenient that the town can close facilities for Town Meeting. What other businesses can afford to close so that their employees can attend the meeting?

The non-resident taxpayer may want to use these facilities on the morning of March 15. What service does his tax dollar get him?

In closing let me mention that I am a year round resident of Moultonborough. Otherwise, according to the town officials, my opinion wouldn't matter.

Jim Morrison
Moultonborough

Laconia Daily Sun
...............

..............

[fatlazyless]

Laconia Daily Sun, March 4, 2008

SB-2 is way for voters to seize power from 'we know what's best for you' crowd

To the editor,

This great news paper has been fair enough to print my letters in the past so I will be courteous and make this short and to the point and not take up half the news paper so others may voice their opinions, that's the New Hampshire way.

The voting on SB-2 will be a secret ballot tuesday March 11 at the Community Center, not at the Town Meeting, so be sure to vote "yes" on article seven for the town and queston one for the school. If you vote "no" or do not vote at all, don't complain about out of control spending and unkept promises (old police station sale). This is your shot at controlling spending at the local level. The cost of everything is going ever higher, this is your chance at controlling some of it.

Laconia has a tax cap, Gilford has SB-2, Meredith needs SB-2. It is time to seize power from the 'we know what's best for you" crowd. The special interests are going to do their best to defeat this, so every vote counts.

George Horne, Meredith

Laconia Daily Sun
......


.....

[wifi]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

......I find it very ironic that at the same Moultonborough selectmen's meeting where the selectmen were stating the reasons why the town should NOT Vote for SB-2, they were planning to close the town dump and library so that the employees could attend the Town Meeting........

Makes me wonder if the town employees are against SB-2, otherwise the town officials would not want their votes.

[SAMIAM]

wifi.....I'm sure all town employees are against SB2.......where else can you go to a meeting,wait until others have gone home and then vote yourself a nice raise,more benefits and maybe a little extra vacation time?

[fatlazyless]

"Voters wll decide on the $18,399,208 budget during the school district hearing on March 5." Erin Plummer, Laconia Daily Citizen, Feb 8, 2008
.............

So, it is highly likely to be approved, as probably the people who chose to show up to Inter-Lakes High School tonight at 7pm and vote have a strong interest in their schools, which is certainly understandable.
.............

The vote on SB2 for the Interlakes School District that includes Meredith, Center Harbor, and Sandwich, as well as SB2 for the Town of Meredith is to be held on Tuesday, March 11, all day, 7am-7pm, at the Community Center, as far as I can tell.

As I understand it, if either of the SB2 warrants, for the town, or the school, passes with a 60% vote, super-majority, on Tuesday, March 11, it would change the voting format in the future so that the town and school vote would be held at an all-day vote at the Community Center as opposed to an evening or late night hearing with the actual time for voting determined by the hearing moderator.

So, the number one main change that SB-2 creates is that it increases the number of voters who show up and vote. It makes voting more accessable to town & school district residents by having a 12 hour polling place, absentee voting, a secret paper ballot, and daytime hours.

Regardless to whether SB-2 gets approved or not, your Meredith property tax bill for June 2008 is said to be increasing by four to eight percent over what you paid in December, 2007. And, how do you like them apples?

....................

from Laconia Daily Sun, Wednesday, March 5, 2008

Inter-Lakes board staying out of SB-2 fight; meeting tonight

By Adam Drapcho

MEREDITH - Charting a very different course than other Lakes Region school boards, the Inter-Lakes School Board has declined to take a formal position on the SB-2, official ballot, issue.

Board Chair Jack Carty said the board understands its responsibility to be confined to issues of education, be it educational budget, philosophy, or facilities. Because the SB-2 proposition - brought forward by a citizens' petition - does not directly affect education, Carty said that ball is in the court of the legislative body: the voters.

"How the voters go about the manner in which they chose to vote is the responsibility of the voters."

He said individual board members are free to discuss their personal views in a private setting, and he declined to offer his view for publication.

The SB-2 issue will be discussed, but not voted on, at the annual school district meeting tonight at 7 at Inter-Lakes High School. The question will be decided on by voters at town voting March 11. A 60-percent majority will be required for passage.
''''''''
Adam Drapcho, Laconia Daily Sun, 3/5/08
.........


.........

[fatlazyless]

letter to the editor, Wednesday, March 5, 2008, Laconia Daily Sun
.......

Yes to new buildings, but they're worried about $15,000?

To the editor,

I was amused by Selectman Bob Flanders response in Tuesday's article regarding Meredith's milfoil proble. $15,000 would be exhausted and he expected a "greater commitment from the people most affected". "They're not participating at a sufficient level," he said, adding that he anticipated the town and residents would share the costs evenly."

Just wondering what the difference is between the milfoil issue and Town of Meredith Water/Sewer? All residents are now paying for town water/sewer when only a small percentage of town residents use this service. $15,000 is a small amount considering what the town has paid for consultants to the water department. The fact is the head of the department should have that knowledge for the salary he is being paid.

I want my taxes lowered but let's use some common sense here. Nothing is thought of building new buildings, spending millions of dollars, and they're worried about $15,000?

Please get out and vote next week! Vote YES to SB-2! Let's give it a try.

Pam Bliss,
Meredith
........


.......

[fatlazyless]

The Meredith News, Thursday, March 6, 2008

Vote no on SB2

To the Editor,

Please consider the character of Moultonboro when you vote on March 11. Has anything changed so drastically in our town that would make you want to stop Town Meeting? This historical form of government has served our town well since its inception and continues to work. This current wave of government paranoia has to stop. If this miniscule group of individuals truly wants to effect positive change, why don't they run for office, this is the traditional way, not change your form of government. You elect the selectmen to represent you, please trust them to do just that. SB2 is not for Moultonboro, please vote no on article 2 on March 11.

Karel A. Crawford
Moultonboro
.....


.....

[wifi]

First there is the battering ram approach, where if SB-2 was approved, you would be voting by "hiding behind a curtain", now the emotional pleading rolls out.

There might be hope for SB-2 yet, where logical arguments have been made.