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02-12-2011, 05:39 AM | #101 | |||
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The Decline of Empathy...
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2) Just as BoaterEd's Les Hall writes from Concord: Quote:
3) Empathy is a vital trait—the glue that holds civilized society together. Empathy is generally conceived as the ability to put oneself in another’s shoes...what it would be like to be the other person and then experience similar reactions ourselves, and to have more of an involuntary, automatic response. Our peaceable boaters are not getting empathy. Quote:
Our Speed Limit comes with a points system.
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02-12-2011, 09:52 AM | #102 |
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This video shows what Lake Winnnipesaukee will look like every summer if SB-27 is passed:
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02-12-2011, 10:28 AM | #103 |
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Except for daytime rather than nightime, this video looks like leaving Wolfeboro after July 4th fireworks.
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02-12-2011, 10:45 AM | #104 | |
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Do you think any of these Go Fast Boaters were being “reasonable and prudent under the existing conditions”? Do you think that any of these Go Fast Boaters took into consideration the following Coast Guard “RULES” which is written in SB-27 (A) The state of visibility. (B) The traffic density including concentrations of fishing vessels or any other vessels. (C) The manageability of the vessel with special reference to stopping distance and turning ability in the prevailing conditions. (E) The state of wind, sea, and current, and the proximity of navigational hazards. (F) The draft in relation to the available depth of water. |
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02-12-2011, 11:43 AM | #105 |
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02-12-2011, 11:57 AM | #106 | |
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Did you know that slower speeds in no-wake zones can churn up a lot of sediment than would be the case at higher speed? The placement of docks and boathouses impacts fish species. There is hard science to back-up what I am discussing. So since you are one of the people who promotes these kinds of things, are you willing to forgo your dock and shorefront properties from having beaches? How about allowing faster speeds through NWZs to correspond to the average depth? Could be 8-12 MPH instead of a blanket 6 MPH. Are you willing to put your money where your mouth is or are you they typical Winni "as long as I have mine" type of guy? |
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02-12-2011, 12:34 PM | #107 | |
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Evidently you didn't watch the video!!! So I did a cut that is 2:28 into the video that shows one GFB amost hitting a sail boat. Go to that section of the video and tell me these guys aren't violating some Coast Guard "Rule". Don't just jump into a conversation without atleast giving it some thought! Take some time to watch that video and you will see that they could care less who gets in their way!! Last edited by Rusty; 02-12-2011 at 12:42 PM. Reason: changed time for video to 2:28 |
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02-12-2011, 12:52 PM | #108 | |
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I would also not characterize when they passed the sailboat as "almost hitting" it. Although zoom camera angles can fool us, it does however appear less than 150 ft away. Go to Sebago. There is no 150 ft rule. The world does not end over there.... |
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02-12-2011, 12:58 PM | #109 | |
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The Senate Transportation Committee will hold a hearing on SB27 on Thursday, February 24 at 9am in Room 305/307 of the Legislative Office Building, which is the building across the street behind the Statehouse in Concord. See you there lawn psycho |
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02-12-2011, 01:09 PM | #110 |
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02-12-2011, 01:59 PM | #111 |
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02-12-2011, 02:13 PM | #112 |
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02-12-2011, 06:57 PM | #113 | |
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Why don't you show a video from Winnipesaukee prior to the speed limit? Wouldn't that be a more realistic depiction of Winnipesaukee without the current speed limit? |
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02-12-2011, 07:21 PM | #114 | |
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I say: No it won’t, it will look just like that video with the President of SBONH leading the charge. You say: "As far as I can tell, SB-27 does not require people to operate at high speeds." I say: I know it doesn’t but they will and the President of the SBONH will lead the charge. You say: "Why don't you show a video from Winnipesaukee prior to the speed limit? Wouldn't that be a more realistic depiction of Winnipesaukee without the current speed limit?" I say: Believe me, prior to the speed limit I have seen days on Lake Winnipesaukee just like that video. |
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02-12-2011, 07:37 PM | #115 | |
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Prior to the speed limit bill passing would the operators of those vessels be subject to ticketing for boating offenses? |
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02-12-2011, 07:48 PM | #116 | |
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This is my last post for this thread, I don’t want the webmaster to moderate me because I post too much. See you all at the hearing on SB27 on Thursday, February 24 at 9am in Room 305/307 of the Legislative Office Building. Rusty |
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02-13-2011, 06:03 AM | #118 | ||||
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The Arrogance of SB-27...
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(That perpetrator—described as "unremorseful and perjurous" by the judge—will be out of jail just in time for this 4th of July holiday-weekend.) Quote:
The situation got steadily worse until the Speed Limit came to the lake. 1) Sediment (+ Nitrogen and Phosphorus) is DES' responsibility—take it up with them. 2) "Producing-more-sediment-at-slower-speeds-than-No-Wake" is a new one on me. 3) Oversized boats produce greater damage above a genuine "no-wake" speed. 4) Ask any fisherman, fish are actually attracted to "structure". My money is on the Speed Limit. Quote:
Rob LaPointe established a horrendous driving record before committing his double-homicide upon two peaceable boaters. The "points" gathered in the 22 convictions on his driving record meant nothing to him. Like Lake Winnipesaukee's most recent "celebrity", he retains "good" lawyers. 2) Last season, I watched as a GFBL passed a Marine Patrol at double the speed limit; at the time, the NHMP boat was towing a PWC, and unable/unwilling—to enforce noise- or speed- limits. I've watched many summers as many other over-sized boats chose to ignore the laws they didn't like. 3) That Director Barrett is only lukewarm into enforcements, just may mean his time is up! (Just as former Commissioner Richard Flynn's backroom "monkeying" with Speed Limits led to his eventual replacement.) Quote:
You can never beat "The Longest and Safest Season in Anyone's Memory". 1) SB-27 removes the speed limits, the points system, and any chance of ridding BWI through NHMP use of RADAR. (Especially RADAR after dark, when NHMP patrolboats are nearly indistinguishable from other night boat traffic). 2) Since these changes apply throughout the state, does Squam Lake risk losing its "kinder" reputation as well? 3) A Tuftonboro family—who remain unknown to me—tried to hand me their video camera—right from their dock! I had to turn down that offer, as there was great risk in being a small boater near this airborne ocean-racer, so this photo must substitute for the video. BTW: This photo accompanied every letter I've mailed to those Representatives and Senators who were wishy-washy on Speed Limits. 'Guess I'll need to mail those again—just to make sure. Last edited by ApS; 02-13-2011 at 01:03 PM. Reason: Re-find photograph...tidy-up... |
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02-13-2011, 09:26 AM | #120 | |
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In the “Posting Guidelines” that are in the FAQ section it states the following: “Don't post excessive numbers of messages or comments. Posting more than a few messages or comments in a day is excessive and may get you moderated or restricted.” I know there are a lot of members (including me) who post more than “a few” in a day but I just don’t want to be moderated if I over post. |
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02-13-2011, 10:45 AM | #121 | |
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Last summer we were at the West Alton sandbar and one of the super shiny old-school wooden boats picked up anchor. When he started the motor I swear it must have regsitered as a mini-quake. As he pulled away, he headed somewhere towards Wolfeboro at what appeared crusing speed probably around 20-25 MPH. That boat was loud and my wife's comment was, "why does he have to drive it so fast"? Keep in mind that most basic bowriders can reach 50 MPH so making every boat on the water into law breakers isn't fair either. The speed limit doesn't change a single thing on the lake. If you think the dumb moves are isolated to high performance boats you don't boat on the same Winni I do. However, I do find most people respectful of other boats and it's not pandamonium as the SL supporters would like to mislead the non-boating public to believe. |
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02-13-2011, 03:36 PM | #122 | |
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A boathouse and covered dock is simply stealing from the lake as that area is totally shaded. The biggest threat to the lake are those who on shorefront property. How many things from their properties and docks end up in the lake. You talk about stuff making into the lake. Let's talk about run-off from clearings and the 100s and 100s of septic fields that are nowvery close to the lake. So keep spewing your venom about how everyone else is raining on your parade while you're the bigger part of the problem. Too busy to play scientist right now. |
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02-13-2011, 03:42 PM | #123 | |
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#2 his opinion I promise I won't take a fast boat to concord #3 put yourself in the shoes of those who want to go faster than 45 under safe conditions and see how you would feel even though there are no high speed accident statistics on the lake and by that I mean greater than 3 mph we know that wouldn't have made a difference #4 by the way I am a passenger on 93 south as I type and wait isn't there a speed limit...... with a point system that must be why everyone is going 55 |
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02-13-2011, 11:11 PM | #124 | |
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"Over the past 10 years, Barrett said, there have been three boating deaths attributed to speed." |
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02-14-2011, 06:22 AM | #125 |
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One was estimated at 3 mph over the night time sl like that would have made a difference what are the other 2 if you don't mind refreshing my memory...... you cant say 33 is high speed and that's why we need to get rid of all these 100 mph boats it makes no sense
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02-14-2011, 08:51 AM | #126 |
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It's unbelievable how people can equate "high speed accidents" with accidents "attributed to speed".
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02-14-2011, 09:21 AM | #127 | |
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With respect to the other two accidents, why is it my job to refresh your memory on those accidents. You should be familiar with all the accidents before you post statements claiming there have been "no high speed accidents". Additionally there have been other high speed accidents not involving death that you are not considering. The three accidents I refer to are only recent FATAL accidents. The have also been other fatal accidents that are not recent including a multiple decapitation accident at extreme high speed. Posting you opinion on an open forum is one thing. However when you post as a statement of fact, you should know what you are talking about. |
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02-14-2011, 10:00 AM | #128 | |
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BI, I want to spend a few hours out on a boat with you next summer and we'll review our findings together. Did you ever think that perhaps you're only willing to "see" the bad in every action taken on the lake? It seems that as soon as people own lakefront property the angst from some sense of entitlement must keep you guys awake at night. I just don't see the pandamonium that you describe. You seem to infer that boating fatalities are a daily occurence. Look how many people visit the lake each year. The data just doesn't show speed as public enemy number one. If I thought the SL would make any difference I would support it. If you restrict Hp, then you WILL hit the wallets of marinas and I don't see that gaining much traction. Many boats have 250-350 Hp on the lake. Even the mid-line Four Winns like I own which is an everyman's bowrider it pushing 320 Hp for a 23 foot boat. Enforce the 150 ft rule heavily and make sure at every launch and marina, have signs that remind people. You want people to think before they act. Speed tickets/fines on the road are meant as revenue enhancement and don't deter speeding. Haven't you had a psycology 101? So why on earth would you think they would work on a lake? In all of this debate, I still don't see what you are trying to fix that a heavily enforced 150 ft rule doesn't already address? Please, I'd like a serious answer. |
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02-14-2011, 11:17 AM | #129 | |
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02-14-2011, 11:19 AM | #130 | |
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I do not believe accidents are the main reason we need speed limits. In fact they are rather far down on my list of reasons. However... There is now pending legislation which makes this a political debate. If you post statements of fact that are untrue in a political debate you should expect to be called on it. That is all I am doing. Years ago I researched these accidents and I know the facts. I believe the anti-SL side should know the facts BEFORE they post blanket statements about these accidents. Or before they post that these accidents never happened. These are real accidents with real people. It is an insult to their memory to claim these accidents never happened. Once again I will point out it is not my job to educate the anti-SL side about the facts. However I will point out that all the accidents I refer to have been posted about in this very forum. Last edited by Bear Islander; 02-14-2011 at 12:34 PM. Reason: spelling |
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02-14-2011, 11:33 AM | #131 | |
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02-14-2011, 12:00 PM | #132 |
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Solution
Here's my solution to this speed limit:
1) Get rid of the fixed speed limit on Winnipesaukee, NH's largest lake. Apply the USCG "reasonable and prudent" rule. 2) Make the fixed speed limit (45/25) applicable to all other lakes in NH. This way there is something for everyone. People who want peace and quiet (don't give me the "safety" BS) can go to the hundreds of other lakes in the state and enjoy themselves to the utmost. Meanwhile, Marine Patrol can enforce the dozens of laws already on the books to go after BWI, the safe passage law, equipment violations, etc., etc,....................................... |
02-14-2011, 12:19 PM | #133 | |
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02-14-2011, 12:28 PM | #134 | |
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It was posted about extensively in August of 2003 in the old forum so you need to search the archives. The threads are named "Boat enters cottage - upside down.." and "Baja gets air". This accident was also part of the testimony in the Moultonboro HB162 public hearing. It has been discussed in recent years on this forum but I have been informed by SL supporters that it happened to long ago to count. I guess that means it never happened and the people are not dead. |
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02-14-2011, 02:52 PM | #135 |
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I think there should be.... get this.... a COMPROMISE!
IMHO, all of the FATAL accidents have occured at NIGHT and ALCOHOL was involved! In EVERY SINGLE ACCIDENT there was a violation of the COLREGS! EVERY SINGLE ONE! It can be argued that all accidents are violations of the COLREGS. But in the last 2 accidents, both accidents occured at NIGHT, several of the COLREGS were violated, quite possibly some BWI laws as well. Niether of the last 2 accidents occured over the current night time speed limit of 30 MPH.... however they were both grossly in violation of Rule 6, namely too fast for the conditions at the time of the accident and failure to keep a proper lookout. Add in booze and you have recipe for disaster. No speed limit would have prevented these accidents from occuring! I personally think a COMPROMISE is in order! I get that there are extremeists on either side, but I think there can be middle ground! I propose the adoption of the COLREGS, an unlimited DAYTIME limit (when visibility can be measured in MILES) and keep the current night time limit of 30 MPH. My logic is this, we have had NO hi-speed collisions during the daytime. The reason being visibilty is measured in miles, and we have the 150' rule! That rule does more to prevent accidents than many people realize! Most of the major accidents occur at night, and usually alcohol is involved. Given the inherent lack of depth perception at night, lower visibilty, and increased possibility of intoxicated skippers... I think the current night time limit of 30 MPH is appropriate! Woodsy
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02-14-2011, 03:24 PM | #136 | |
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02-14-2011, 03:55 PM | #137 |
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I can offer no help in the search, but I recall the accident. Happened in the mid 1970s. A boat was traveling at a very high speed and hit the shore. The boat flipped in mid-air and crashed into a camp that was quite a distance from the shore. IIRC, all aboard were at least double the legal alcohol limit and all died. I'm pretty sure there was a major crackdown on BUI, as a result.
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02-14-2011, 04:04 PM | #138 | |
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02-14-2011, 04:28 PM | #139 | |
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But it doesn't alter the fact that it did happen and when someone posts that it didn't they are in error. And I think you are way off base with your idea that lakefront owners are all in favor of speed limits. Several of the top people fighting speed limits are waterfront owners. The old forum is at http://www.winnipesaukeeforum.com/ you can search August 2003 but you will find the old forum is not as user friendly as the current forum. |
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02-14-2011, 04:29 PM | #140 | |
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02-14-2011, 05:30 PM | #141 | |
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Jarhead posted that there were "no high speed accident statistics on the lake" That was his claim and he put no time limits on this claim. I refuted his post by mentioning several accidents including this one. The accident in question was high speed, fatal, and happened on Winnipesaukee. That is all I ever claimed. |
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02-14-2011, 05:51 PM | #142 | |
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02-14-2011, 06:52 PM | #143 | |
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For a third time I will point out that it is not by duty to educate the anti-SL side about accident data. You want me to do all the leg work and post it here so you can pick it apart and come up with reasons why it is not relevant. My point is that you need to educate yourself about the facts BEFORE you start making blanket statements about the history of boat accidents on Winnipesaukee. |
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02-14-2011, 07:00 PM | #144 | |
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And if you need to bring up something from the 70s to maintain relevance to today's current problems then I will call you out on it. The article does not say how fast they were going but it would appear the chain of events that led to the crash is too much to drink. So what data exists showing 45 MPH will make any difference for daytime boating? The SL proponents desire to link some of these accidents is a prime example of how correlation does not imply causation. Suggested reading for the pro-SL crowd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correla...mply_causation We could spend hours just discussing the lack of correlation. I frequently post things as a tongue-and-cheek way for people to see the fallacies of their logic but it often goes over people's heads. |
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02-14-2011, 07:16 PM | #145 |
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I just want some hard facts and I get nothing but do my own research comments .... I have and can find no official data to support the claims of all these high speed accidents .... I have educated myself and there are no facts
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02-14-2011, 07:18 PM | #146 | |
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I leave it to the reader to determine their own OPINION as to how relevant these accidents are to a speed limit. If you want to look things up on wikipedia, try looking up the difference between fact and opinion. |
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02-14-2011, 07:22 PM | #147 | |
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Didn't the M/S Mount Washington have a drunk passenger go overboard and die several years ago? The boat was *gasp*, moving. The captain must be a cowboy. Yeeeehaaaaaa! |
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02-14-2011, 07:27 PM | #148 | |
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Over the past 10 years, Barrett said, there have been three boating deaths attributed to speed. |
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02-14-2011, 07:57 PM | #149 | |
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Correlation does not mean causation Psst, the insurance companies rely on this fact when setting car insurance rates. |
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02-14-2011, 08:07 PM | #150 |
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[QUOTE=Bear Islander;150506]Below is a quote from David Barrett the head of the New Hampshire Marine Patrol and a long time opponent of speed limits. He is an "official" and he is quoting "data". Therefore there IS official data. I guess you did not educate yourself well enough.
Over the past 10 years, Barrett said, there have been three boating deaths attributed to speed.[/QUOte speed doesn't mean high speed that's what your missing......why do I bother you win I can't take anymore |
02-14-2011, 10:18 PM | #151 |
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I'm curious if even ONE person out there has changed their mind on the need or lack thereof based on the years of back-and-forth by posting not only here but the newspapers and other forums.
I'm grounded in hard science and don't see the SL having any effect on the lake other than a a dozen or so tickets being handed out each year. I can see where the SL-proponents perceptions would lead them to believe a speed limit will be effective and possibly improve safety. However, after having admitted that the speed limits won't fix many of the problems people thought, they still fight for it. Do you really think someone doing 50 MPH in a bowrider is worthy of a ticket and points on their license? The SL supporters all or nothing attitude is what I think will cause them to lose the battle with SB-27...... |
02-15-2011, 08:14 AM | #152 | |
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02-15-2011, 11:28 AM | #153 | |
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Yes... I know... The accident I describe is made up, not very likely and doesn't really pertain to SB27. Just like yours. |
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02-15-2011, 02:20 PM | #154 |
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I don't know what's worse. The M/S Mount Washington crashing into something or a 100 MPH bowrider. Which one has happened and which is the one the SL proponents want to portray has happened?
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02-15-2011, 03:41 PM | #155 |
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A big jet could have a malfunction during takeoff, crash into the sandbar at Silver Sands during a NASCAR race week, and kill 101 people sitting on their boats. Shall we now ban all jet traffic from Laconia airport?
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02-15-2011, 05:00 PM | #156 |
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An interstellar dark body could pass through the Solar System's Oort Cloud causing a comet to fall through the Kuiper Belt on its way to impact the Sun. The disruption in the Sun's plasma could cause solar radiation to effect communications satellites. Thus a satellite could fall out of orbit and hit the pilot house of the M/S Mount Washinton as it passes the Witches causing it to loose control and hit two bow riders sending them out of control towards the Silver Sands sandbar resulting in SB27 failing to get out of committee.
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02-15-2011, 05:08 PM | #157 | |
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02-15-2011, 07:45 PM | #158 |
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Live Free or Die!
I want to testify about SB-27 next week, but I will be on a boat with engines 50 times larger than any boat on Winnipesaukee.
In place of testimony, let me say the following: There are some folks that have insinuated that they represent the majority of opinion about what should be the law on Lake Winnipesaukee. IMO there was fraudulent correspondence to legislators that influenced their initial vote. I think the people of New Hampshire are more concerned with freedom, than trying to tweak themselves into a false nirvana of safety. There are some rich shorefront property owners, (Island and Mainland) that want to control how the lake is used. Little by little these rich people will try to control how they think the lake should be used. Does anyone want this lake controlled by rich shorefront owners? It's the people of New Hampshire who must decide. Live Free or Die! Never has this motto meant as much as it does now! |
02-16-2011, 07:39 AM | #159 |
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SB27 is about speed being reasonable and prudent. Both situations described here would apply.
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02-16-2011, 08:26 AM | #160 |
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Here's my 2-cents. After this bill gets voted down in the legislative process, the 'Safe Boaters of New Hampshire' should rename themselves the 'Speedy Boaters of New Hampshire' to be honest.
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02-16-2011, 08:54 AM | #161 |
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I'm a member and I don't have a fast boat. I bet I'm in the majority in that regard within SBONH.
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02-16-2011, 09:05 AM | #162 |
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To a casual observer, the SBONH's preliminary efforts just seemed like window dressing that was a lead-up to their #1 true intent of repealing the boat speed limits.
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02-16-2011, 09:37 AM | #163 |
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Why can there not be any COMPROMISE?? Its like the western front in WWI... Both sides seem dug in and unwilling to budge!
I have no problem with a nighttime limit because thats when ALL of the accidents cited by WINNFABS have occured! I have a problem with a daytime limit because there is ABSOLUTELY NO DATA WHATSOEVER to show that its necessary! No accidents! No anything! Just anecdotal stories about how the guy went by me too close and too fast! We all have stories like that! Because I like to putt around the lake, I have stories like that involving every kind of boat! We need to find a compromise that we can all live with so we can put this issue to rest once and for all! The divisiveness on the lake is acidic! Woodsy
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02-16-2011, 12:41 PM | #164 | |
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I don't have a dog in the fight for night time limits. As far as day limits, I simply look at the 150 ft rule as already being very agressive. 150 ft is a long way and I encourage anyone to go measure it out on their property and see how far away it is. I've said it over and over, the speed limit itself won't make any difference on the lake except for a dozen or so who happen to get tickets. Making everyday bowriders into lawbreakers doesn't sit well with me. |
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02-16-2011, 02:27 PM | #165 | |
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"This group is dedicated to discussing safe power boating and recreational activities on Lake Winnipesaukee and the other inland lakes of the Lakes Region in NH. We work together to help shape legislation that affects our freedoms and enjoyment of the lakes." Clearly, SBONH is involved in SB-27, I'm pretty sure everyone is aware of that. The casual observer can also note the SBONH has also been involved with US Power Squadron Safety Inspections prior to endorsing SB-27. Those safety inspections have nothing to do with speed limits and amount to more than just "window dressing", IMO. FWIW, I eagerly joined SBONH but was never interested in having any involvement with NHRBA. In hindsight, I think I chose well... |
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02-16-2011, 09:49 PM | #166 | |
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I am an officer (VP) of SBONH and own an old Chris Craft bowrider that can maybe break the daytime SL by 1 MPH. Branding us as cowboys makes for better vitriol. John |
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02-17-2011, 07:10 AM | #167 | |
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The waters of Lake Winnipesaukee run downstream for about two miles and pour into Lake Winnisquam. Lake Winnisquam is the state's third largest lake and has a lot fewer rocks than Winnipesaukee for boaters to tear up their props. Winnisquam has a no-fee, free to anyone, state boat launch facility complete with a double launch ramp, a big dock, parking for vehicle and trailer, and a toilet. All paid with money from boat registrations, and free to use by anyone. Lake Winnipesaukee does not have a similar state boat launch. It used to have Ames Farm Inn for a popular boat launch, day use spot, but not anymore.
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02-17-2011, 08:55 AM | #168 |
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02-17-2011, 07:09 PM | #169 | |
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"Hindsight" can be a Zero...
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SBONH has less than one year from which any "hindsight" can be determined. The Lake holds its breath. __________________ |
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02-17-2011, 07:54 PM | #170 | |
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Science "Lite"...
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Triple-digit speeds—in any way that SBONH defines it—are no way to take in the many natural wonders and scenic beauty of Lake Winnipesaukee. 2) http://www-heb.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/pub.../moorage_e.pdf Your "documentation" concerns the ocean's marine environment in Canada. |
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02-18-2011, 07:25 AM | #171 |
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Today's February 18 www.laconiadailysun.com has a page 5 letter to the editor from the N H Camp Director's Association that strongly supports the 45/30 speed limit on Lake Winnipesaukee and is a well written and intelligent letter.
The local newspapers have had quite a number of speed limits letters of late from a variety of people. I know that Massachusetts has a state-wide boat speed limit of either 40 or 45, but here in NH the speed limit has been a lake-by-lake decision driven by local people. So, if Lake Winnisquam, the state's 3rd largest lake, wants a speed limit similar to Squam or Winnipesaukee, it would have to be locally putt-putt-putted.
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02-19-2011, 10:06 AM | #172 | |
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02-19-2011, 11:04 AM | #173 |
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02-19-2011, 02:21 PM | #174 |
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BY Acres per Second.
Triple-digit speeds—in any way that SBONH defines it—are no way to take in the many natural wonders and scenic beauty of Lake Winnipesaukee. That is such a STUPID statement. You are a foolish man. Talk about making things up, my goodness. I bet you have never, ever seen a boat go triple digit speed on Winnie in your life. Other then regulated boat races a few years ago. Speak the truth and others will listen, Talking BS, people think your a fool. But, I suppose if the shoe fits?? Just saying !! |
02-20-2011, 04:56 AM | #175 | ||
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Speed and PWCs...
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(Sorry for the "all-caps", but that's how the article was posted.) Quote:
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02-20-2011, 08:49 AM | #176 | |
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02-20-2011, 09:52 AM | #177 |
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02-20-2011, 09:54 AM | #178 | |
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02-20-2011, 10:18 AM | #179 | |
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You take one comment out of context and criticize it. They use their campers as "pawns" and "camps should be ashamed for disseminating such trash". Then in the next post you wonder why speed limit supporters are unwilling to talk compromise. Funny how you never want to talk compromise when you think you have the votes in the legislature. Tell me again why these camp directors don't have a clue? One would think they are fairly knowledgeable about safety, boating, the environment etc.. |
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02-20-2011, 10:45 AM | #180 | |
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How many active summer camps are on Winnipesaukee? The obvious one's I know of. The camp directors are using a blanket statement so what applies to one lake doesn't apply to another. Most activities I see from the camps are very near where the camps are located which makes sense for safety. The stay close to the camps not because of boats but to allow for greater supervision. Period. |
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02-20-2011, 04:51 PM | #181 | |
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Your agenda is really becoming transparent.
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__________________ __________________ So what have we learned in the past two thousand years? "The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of Obamunism should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest the Republic become bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance." . . .Evidently nothing. (Cicero, 55 BC augmented by me, 2010 AD) |
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02-20-2011, 06:11 PM | #182 |
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Yankee, what is disgusting is how BI and other SL supporters are willing to distort and mislead to obtain their objective. We should get collections of signatures at the sand bars and popular swimming holes to start taking back the lake!
I have a good way to combat this but will reveal it only after the testimony is completed. |
02-21-2011, 09:01 AM | #183 | |
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02-21-2011, 10:54 AM | #184 | |
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http://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/...oads#post62946 |
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02-22-2011, 12:20 PM | #185 | |
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02-22-2011, 01:18 PM | #186 |
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Does anyone have the data showing the speeds that tickets were issued by MP for 2010?
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02-25-2011, 06:00 AM | #187 | |
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Compromise=Weakness
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Presently, that number has dropped down to 8; however, many of the NHMP's latest data for 2010 ("hat-tip" to VitaBene) are listed as "pending": Does it matter anyway? Skip said it best, when he asserted "the effort is doomed". In Concord, the word "compromise" has been thrown into the discussion—a compromise is never voiced from the position of a convincing argument. |
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03-27-2011, 04:00 PM | #188 | |
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03-27-2011, 04:12 PM | #189 | |
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There existing law to control this says anything over headway speed requires 150 feet between the boats. That is probably the law that is broken the most on our lakes. And yes, the boats in the video appear to be breaking it. They would have been breaking it at 45 miles per hour as well so the speed limit is not fixing the problem. |
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03-27-2011, 04:52 PM | #190 |
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Well isn't that something, Thurston complaining about the safety of the lake and the speed limit. Hey how many times have I seen some yahoo outfitted with one of his rental boats, out there on the lake doing things far more dangerous and foolish than just going "fast"?
I say banning rentals is much more likely to have an affect on the overall safety of the lake. |
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03-28-2011, 04:21 PM | #191 | |
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I still think the state should be licensing boat operators, just like they license operators of motorcycles, cars, trucks and airplane pilots, etc! |
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03-29-2011, 10:15 AM | #192 | |
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The FAA minimum number of Flight hours required is 40, BUT in Real Life it usually runs better than 60 hours.....IN The Plane. BTW: That is for a Full Fledged Pilots License..not the so called "Sports Pilot License" which is a relatively new category which carries numerous RESTRICTIONS. NB |
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03-29-2011, 10:38 AM | #193 | |
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03-29-2011, 05:21 PM | #194 | |
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03-31-2011, 06:49 PM | #195 | |
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I'd sure be curious to know just how many people "flunked". I agree w/ Seaplane no way anyone is going to turn away money that's sitting on the counter. |
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04-02-2011, 04:04 AM | #196 | |
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Now is the time to get a bill going that will require a full Boater's Education Certificate to rent a boat (or PWC). No more of this 14 Day Temporary NH Safe Boating Certificate that is administrated by crooks who only want the money and could care less about the safety of honest hard working safe boaters. I’ll bet that there wasn’t one customer of these dishonest boat rental businesses that passed that test. We’ve got to get them off our Lakes before it’s too late. I’m sure statistics will show that the majority of tickets issued by the MP are to people who only had a temporary certificate. Hey, how many times have I seen some yahoo outfitted with one of Shep Brown’s Boat Basin rental boats out there on the lake doing things far more dangerous and foolish than just going "fast"? I am going to pass the word around to boycott any boat rental business that allows anyone to rent a boat to someone who only has a temporary certificate. I’ll make sure to tell them that IMHO Shep Brown’ Boat Basin is the biggest offender. Last edited by Rusty; 04-02-2011 at 04:44 AM. |
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04-02-2011, 05:35 AM | #197 | |
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The first order of business would be to get the MP to even record this level of detail. I doubt they do but maybe they'll suprise us. In any event, it is ironic (err, moronic) that rental places would open their mouths about passing restrictive boating laws. |
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04-02-2011, 08:02 AM | #198 | |
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04-08-2011, 09:51 AM | #199 |
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...let's see if I got this right...an INORDINATE amount of "licensed boaters" DON'T (or WON'T) follow the simple "Rules of the Road(water)" & operate their boats while under the influence...Enforce THESE rules/laws...Don't make NEW laws that are going to be "ignored" & NOT enforced...
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04-11-2011, 12:02 PM | #200 |
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If John Steven were the governor, then this 55-mph increase would have a much better chance. With Governor Lynch, it's seems very likely that he will use his veto stamp and slap a fast veto on the bill if it passes the house.
Will it even pass the House? Nobody knows until the vote is held, but most likely there's plenty state reps who are keen to the governor's veto and will not care enough about the increase to 55 to be on the losing side when it will most likely get a veto, anyway. Probably, a number of undecided state reps will be no-shows on the day of the vote and essentially be punting on this issue.
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