Shoreland Protection Rules

[Boat Doc]

Next Wed. there is a rules hearing at NH Env. Services regarding the new shoreland rules. I'm told this hearing may be nothing more than a person with a tape recorder taking input, but all of us that own lakefront property should get involved.

To that end, I suggest you all consider joining the NH Shorefront Association. This is a new group which believes in protecting water quality and private property rights. Also, one thing I really liked was simply being aware of what is going on in Concord as I did not find out about all these changes until very recently (on this Forum!).

The website is: www.nhshorefront.org

I want to protect the lake for my grandchildren to inherit both our property and clean water, but I also want to protect the rather hefty investment in my shorefront (not to mention value for the taxes!).

I'm all for saving the trees and reducing run-off, etc..., but why would Env. Services need to be involved in giving me a permit for my new shed which may be over 200 ft back from the water (as I understand things just about everything within 250 ft will require their blessing). I know what we went through for our relatively simple dock permit and I am very concerned this difficult and trying process will be the same now for projects on my own land.

Thanks for considering my thoughts.

[phoenix]

agree with you. i am going to join.

[AQUAMAN]

I have joined as well. The website is user friendly. It will be a great resource to keep tabs on new laws and new rule-making at DES. I have a permit application at the wetlands board now that Darlene Forst is reviewing. She has made it so difficult that I have turned it over to a lawyer. It should not be this difficult and when we hit April 1, 2008 it all becomes that much more difficult.

[Gatto Nero]

Originally Posted by AQUAMAN

I have a permit application at the wetlands board now that Darlene Forst is reviewing. She has made it so difficult that I have turned it over to a lawyer. It should not be this difficult and when we hit April 1, 2008 it all becomes that much more difficult.

I would agree that the permitting process is a painful one and it's about to get even more painful come April 1, but don't think for a minute that the person or persons responsible for reviewing the applications are the ones making it difficult. They are just doing their jobs as best they can under the circumstances. I have had more than my fair share of the permitting process over the past few years. It has not been easy, but I have found everyone involved in the process to be nothing but professional. There are lots of rules to deal with but they didn't create those rules. They are just there to enforce them. Considering what they have to deal with and the resources they have available to them I think they do a pretty good job.

That said, I think NH Shorefront Association is a great idea, and I would bet the DES does too. If you've been reading this forum for a while you probably know that ShoreThings reached out to everyone on this forum for input. She also reached out personally to people that she thought would have some constructive input and invited them to the meetings regarding these changes. Unfortunately, I couldn't make it to the meetings myself but it would have been nice to have had representation through and organization like nhshorefront.org.

[tis]

I am with you Aquaman. Gatto, unfortunately they have different interpretations, depending on who your reviewer is. It is a damn big hassle and I only see it getting bigger. I think they have already started changing to the new rules, even though they aren't final yet. I think it is a huge mess down there and will only get worse in April. I wonder if Shore Things really cares or that was just a show. Once the going got rough she disappeared. Sorry but this whole thing gets my dander up!

[Gatto Nero]

Tis, I agree, in part.

It has been my experience that they do have different interpretations of the rules and that that can be painful. But I believe that the new rules are, in part, intended to be more finely defined so that there is less left up to individual interpretation. I'm not saying I like the rules, I just don't blame the people who enforce them for the problems those rules create.

I reread the changes again tonight and my head was spinning when when I finally got through it. I honestly can't say if they are all that much more strict or not, at least the parts that concern my situation. They may even work in my favor, but there is no doubt that the permit process will be about 10X more complicated. So far I have been able to handle everything I have gone through on my own, and I've been through a lot. I have serious doubts if I will be able to do that if/when I ever need to deal with it again.

I can't argue about other people's intentions, only my interpretation of them, and I believe the intentions of the people I have dealt with are sincere. Think about it. What motive would they have to screw you over? Why would she bother posting if she didn't want the opinions the post would produce? Do you go out of your way just to mess with people in your job? Ok, maybe once in a while, but it's usually in good fun.

[Onshore]

Gatto Nero, I appreciate the sentiment but it is unnecessary. You are correct that DES is happy to see the development of an organization that will help keep the people who are directly affected by our programs informed. Our only concern is the adversarial tone that seems to be developing. The NH Lakes Association is a similar organization to this new NH Shorefront organization with which we have had a cooperative working relationship for many years. We are somewhat dismayed by statements on this new organizations website that insinuate that the public was not involved in the development of that new standards since some of the membership of this new organization has been directly involved with the development of these new standards since September of 2005. Given the fact that of the five founding members of this new organization; one was a voting member of the Commission that proposed the changes to the Shoreland Act, a second was employed by a voting member, two others were personally involved in hammering out compromises during the senate hearings on the legislation, and three of the five were also directly involved in the same meetings to develop the new rule package you had been invited to attend we would hope they would wish to continue the development of the program in a positive and cooperative manner. Regardless of the approach they take from here on out the fact that they are increasing public awareness of the issues is the most important thing.

Tis, I understand your frustration and whether you choose to believe it or not I can assure you the shoreline and shoreland staff is greatly concerned with developing a program that issues its decisions in a fair, timely, and above all, consistent manner. Please understand that as an employee of the state my job is to apply the standards and requirements put in place by the legislature or through the administrative rule process. While I can answer any factual questions that people may have but I cannot answer questions relate to personal philosophy or opinions on the issues because I am required to maintain my objectivity. Simply put any opinions I may have are irrelevant and cannot be allowed to enter into these discussions.

[Lakegeezer]

Having the NH-DES particapate in this discussion is welcome and refreshing. Thanks "Shore Things" for keeping the public informed and maintaining integrity in the process.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by tis

"...It is a damn big hassle and I only see it getting bigger...I think it is a huge mess down there and will only get worse in April..."

Speaking of mess, one of the area's biggest spec-builders got to a "tear down" near me, bulldozed the lot, and walked away. The resulting spring flood washed tons of silt, sand, and soil downslope and into the lake—then they put up a silt fence! (And then a second—then a third silt fence, then a fourth—and a few generations of hay bales.)

The two newest neighboring homes will have to dredge the lake bottom for their boats as a result of the spec-builder's failure to mitigate their own series of cascading failures.

The problem continues uphill, which this spring will likely see a big fertilized lawn on an impossibe-to-mow slope to keep still more of the scarified lot from ending up in the lake. It's possible that wood chips will be used instead, which also get washed into the lake—then gets replenished again. This gross inattention to Mother Nature only serves to feed the algae and milfoil already in the lake.

This photo shows how the localized flooding even carried rocks downhill across the dock's surface.

Something has to be done to keep the lake healthy, and it wasn't happening in 2007.

[Onshore]

The newest draft of the proposed Shoreland Program Administrative Rules, Chapter Env-Wq 1400 has been posted on-line at:

http://www.des.state.nh.us/RuleMaking/

[mcdude]

see Citizen Article here......

SHOREFRONT PROPERTY OWNERS FORM ASSOCIATION

Robinson said the shorefront owners group has already hired a lobbyist to represent it in Concord and will be keeping active in assuring its interests are heard.

[fatlazyless]

Oooohhhhh....nnnoooooo....thanks for the heads-up, McDude....this means I gotta get started like right away saw'n down those three ugly, old, large, Pin Oaks that arch out over my tiny little 55' waterfront.....since all I got is a 12" electric chain saw.....from U-know-where....and them trees need to be gone by April 1......or else....they is here .....basically forever!

[Skip]

Move afoot to delay implementation until July 1st.

STORY today in the Citizen on-line!

[tis]

Thanks for that post Skip. It seems they should have the rules in place before they enact it.

[Lakegeezer]

The local construction crews will be happy. This winter has been tough on business. It will be a noisy spring.

[Bear Islander]

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

The local construction crews will be happy. This winter has been tough on business. It will be a noisy spring.

Except of course on the islands of Meredith, where construction is at a standstill.

[fatlazyless]

Yes, good question. So, what's next for the intrepid developers on Sheep Island, Lake Wicwas? Did the 490-525, no vote on their zoning friendly article change their persona from a couple of wolves, to a couple of sheep? Ouchy ouchy...gotta be expensive....legal costs & all.... & plus the tightening of mortgage credit locally does not help..

[Onshore]

Well, here's where the Shoreland Program stands right now. We will be ready to bring the program on line on April 1 if the law still requires it. The next hearing on the shoreland rules package is this Friday, March 21. The major point of contention has been the establishment of criteria to qualify a project as "vested". Briefly, "vested" simply means that your project is sufficiently underway and thus should not have to obtain the new shoreland permit. This is a dangerously oversimplified explanation but the problem is that the State's attorneys, the attorneys serving as lobbyists for a couple of groups, and the JLCAR's attorneys are still hammering out the criteria for qualifying as "vested". When this is settled DES will have to provide guidance documents explaining what it takes to be "vested" as well as just what being "vested' means. Another significant change that may come out of the last meeting involves the requirement for a stamped surveyed plan. Originally DES only wanted a surveyed plan when there would be more than 20% impervious area. JLCAR heard testimony at the last meeting stating that a surveyed plan should be required for all projects. We frankly do not want those plans for all projects because of the cost associated with obtaining them. However we may need to take the compromise position of requiring them for projects having as little as 15 % impervious. I can not emphasize enough that people take time to go to the rulemaking website listed earlier in the thread and check for the latest version and amendments to see what's coming.

If the Legislature does manage to get the effective date moved then we will of course adjust accordingly. What the Citizen article does not explain is that there may be other changes coming that we will need to address. The amendment to HB 1151 is in large part to allow time for the legislature to debate some other possible changes (including the issue of "vesting") included in another bill. These issues had been being argued/discussed under Senate Bill 417. This bill is being terminated but the same issues will now be heard as part of Senate Bill 352.

BTW while writing this I received word that it is highly unlikely that the House will get to HB 1151 this week and therefore, it will not be heard before their next session which is April 7. That would be after the law takes effect on the 1st...

[hemlockpoint]

I guess this is not surprising considering 483Bs Legislative sponsors were all Democrats and our legislature and executive branch is now Democrat controlled.

The more complex you make these laws the more difficult(and expensive) it is to administer. DES people appear to have their ducks in a row but our legislature is screwed up.

What do I do with my project now? I am 80 percent complete. Dont ask how that is measured or the Democrats will have to come up with a new bill and a fee to calculate it for me.

[Onshore]

What does 80% complete mean?

[ApS]

Originally Posted by Cobalt

"...If Concord wants to have a positive and immediate impact on the health of the lakes, give a 100% tax credit to shorefront homeowners who upgrade their septic systems..."

I'd agree with a pumpout of any system upon every sale of a real estate property.

As a homeowner who has lived here two decades before the lake's quality index was reduced from a "Class A" lake to a "Class B" lake, there are at least three major changes that have affected water quality—IMHO:

1) Thousands of new structures have been built.
2) Thousands of new homes have been built with only token regard to clay and silt depositions in rainwater runoff. (Growing milfoil and algae).
3) Even more than thousands of new homes have added dishwashers.

Dishwasher detergent:

1) Because of its nature to "grow" milfoil and algae, a high phosphorus content of certain cleansers has been banned from many watershed communities nationwide—though not banned in the "Live Free or Die" state.

2) Dishwasher detergents contain an extremely high phosphorus content.

3) Dishwasher detergents have been exempted from those nationwide bans!

Phosphorus eventually finds its way to the lake even through the newest of septic systems.

My point, if it's not clear, is that we've ringed the lake with thousands of new, previously non-existant, dishwashing appliances that add a pollutant that fertilizes algae and milfoil.

The addition of qualifying new septic systems—and upgrades to existing systems—has not allowed the Lake to approach the water's quality before those thousands of homes were constructed: In fact, it's not even close.

Originally Posted by Seaplane Pilot

"...I highly doubt that maintenance crews are blowing leaf litter into the lake on a widespread basis. C'mon, give us a break..."

ETA: Sunday's Edit
Edited To Add for Today's observations:
My immediate neighbor's yard just received "yard maintenance". (Yes, on Sunday—Mother's Day ).

Since we are "green" --> <-- and prefer a natural New Hampshire-style woods, we have no objection that most of the leaf litter was directed to our yard by the leafblower-guy.

At the same time, the other guy raked leaf litter downhill towards the lake. Then, the leafblower-guy tried to send the pile into the lake.

But very few leaves ended up in the lake—only because we had gusting winds of about 30-MPH!
(End of Edit).

(Start of another edit!)
ETA: Wednesday's Edit
Two leafblowers operated for what seemed like hours this Wednesday. (So they've changed from the usual Thursday routine of last year).

Since there was no wind, the newest leaf litter pile on the water stayed in front of the two properties. At 4PM, an east wind came up, and made a trail of leaves about 300 yards long.

I've taken a photo as proof-positive, and when the film is processed, I'll post it here for Seaplane Pilot's edification.

(Start of still another edit!)

ETA: Today, Tuesday's Edit:

'Went to a yard sale two weeks ago among a neighborhood of about 10 "newer" homes on Knoll Road's steep lots. Unhappily, the odor of overflowed septic tank permeated the neighborhood. (Knoll Road is a stone's throw from Lake Winnipesaukee).

(End of 3rd Edit—returning to original post).

It's possible that it's only my neighborhood that is getting ritzier.

Just last Monday, I watched a crew blowing leaf-litter into the lake from two adjacent properties a few doors down.

One of the two properties is an immense McMansion with 181-feet of lake frontage. The trail of leaves drifted under my dock as I watched. (And there's nothing unusual about that occurrence, though Thursday "cleanups" are worse than Monday's).

I'd suggest you listen in your neighborhood: When the leafblowers stop, you may have to acknowledge the following phrase:

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