No Wake Restriction?

[Jeanzb1]

With all this rain, do you all think we will have a no-wake on Winni? There is already one on Sunapee.


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[ishoot308]

I do not believe so…not yet anyway.

Dan

[chachee52]

Originally Posted by Jeanzb1

With all this rain, do you all think we will have a no-wake on Winni? There is already one on Sunapee.


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It was higher on Winni last times they implemented the No Wake Zone on Winni.

[fatlazyless]

You know what ....... hydrologically speaking ....... me-thinks that dock in the BearCam with the three plastic tubs full of water should be the gauge for making the big lake a no-wake zone. When those dock boards under the three tubs become 'under water' ....... it's time for the MP to hit the no-wake button ...... budda-budda-bing ....... where's the water!

[garysanfran]

At least ban wakeboarding. The water is about 3" higher than this morning's level.

[fatlazyless]

Hey there ..... just go pile some old concrete blocks or big rocks or something heavy on your dock and everything will be just fine ....... the water is rising fast ........ so what! ........ no worries! .......

[garysanfran]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Hey there ..... just go pile some old concrete blocks or big rocks or something heavy on your dock and everything will be just fine ....... the water is rising fast ........ so what! ........ no worries! .......

I'm running out of 32 gal. barrels filled with water to weight the boards down. If the water rises enough, the weight will only be the plastic. The water, in the barrels, will be underwater.

I found a snorkel in my basement today. I'm taking it to bed, next to my glasses and wallet in case of an emergency. So happy there's no discussion of tornados.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Hey there ..... just go pile some old concrete blocks or big rocks or something heavy on your dock and everything will be just fine ....... the water is rising fast ........ so what! ........ no worries! .......

Don't the dam people take into account that waves--but especially wakes--are leaching-out chemicals from wood treatments in the lake's thousands of docks?

Besides Thompson's, shouldn't that concern include copper arsenate (CCA) from older wooden docks?

Here:

"Prolonged exposure may also cause central and peripheral nervous system damage, liver and kidney dysfunction, cardiovascular and gastrointestinal disturbances, skin rashes and dermatitis."

Or here:

http://npic.orst.edu/faq/cca.html#:~...ood%20products.

I've never seen so many smaller fish floating.

[FlyingScot]

Originally Posted by ApS

Don't the dam people take into account that waves--but especially wakes--are leaching-out chemicals from wood treatments in the lake's thousands of docks?

Besides Thompson's, shouldn't that concern include copper arsenate (CCA) from older wooden docks?

Here:



Or here:

http://npic.orst.edu/faq/cca.html#:~...ood%20products.

I've never seen so many smaller fish floating.

Agreed. Of course, that also means those lucky enough to own docks should be building them with aluminum, cedar, and ipe--not pressure treated wood. It's not just waves, but also rain and age that causes leaching

[John Mercier]

Older PT would already be leached out.
They haven't offered it locally for many years now.

[LIforrelaxin]

Not sure why this conversation is in this thread... But I am going to share my 2 cents....

1st aluminum docks aren't necessarily the answer, people would think they are...

2nd the preservatives used in newer pressure treated wood have changed.

3rd there are much worse issues facing the lake, then this....

The over use of this body of water for recreation purposes is becoming very evident, I have seen many changes in my 35 years or so on the lake. The biggest issue is over development..... Am i indicating the the lake is in jeopardy... no The lake will survive, but it is going to change because of the environment around it... To try and point the finger at anyone thing is ridiculous.....the best label is over development..... it happens everywhere it is not surprising....

[barefootbay]

Originally Posted by LIforrelaxin

Not sure why this conversation is in this thread... But I am going to share my 2 cents....

1st aluminum docks aren't necessarily the answer, people would think they are...

2nd the preservatives used in newer pressure treated wood have changed.

3rd there are much worse issues facing the lake, then this....

The over use of this body of water for recreation purposes is becoming very evident, I have seen many changes in my 35 years or so on the lake. The biggest issue is over development..... Am i indicating the the lake is in jeopardy... no The lake will survive, but it is going to change because of the environment around it... To try and point the finger at anyone thing is ridiculous.....the best label is over development..... it happens everywhere it is not surprising....

As I have said before the lake is being loved to Death !

[tis]

If you're worried about overdevelopment, you'd better worry about the hundreds of boats mooring with 30 people in each boat.

[Biggd]

Never a dull moment on the forum.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by John Mercier

Older PT would already be leached out.
They haven't offered it locally for many years now.

I just stumbled on my dock's building permit. It was built in 1987.

...And have yet to replace a single plank!

However, the pressure of 35 winters' ice floes has splintered many a 6"x8" crossmember.

Not addressed was Thompson's Water Sealer and the many dead Sunfish.

Wakes are definitely an increasing problem--and not just to erosion. Can you explain this boulder's positioning in this earlier picture?

https://indepthnh.org/2023/08/13/wol...investigation/

[John Mercier]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Agreed. Of course, that also means those lucky enough to own docks should be building them with aluminum, cedar, and ipe--not pressure treated wood. It's not just waves, but also rain and age that causes leaching

Alaskan Yellow Cedar decking is now priced very competitive with PT, so worth the upgrade if someone needs some soon.

Also saw a product called MillBoard. They will be manning a booth at our two local events, so we can learn more about that product. Looks promising, though more in line with the cost of high end Trex or Azek.

[tis]

Originally Posted by FlyingScot

Agreed. Of course, that also means those lucky enough to own docks should be building them with aluminum, cedar, and ipe--not pressure treated wood. It's not just waves, but also rain and age that causes leaching

Except that they did change the formula for pressure treated quite a few years ago, so it does not have the same danger-supposedly-that it did. I personally would never use real wood outside ever again.

[John Mercier]

They removed the arsenic.
Not really a problem for us in New England as its primary purpose was to stop termites that actually consume the wood.

Thompson's Water Sealer shouldn't cause any more ''fish kill'' than any other stain/sealer used over the water.

The problem with Thompson's, like other clear sealers, is that it would need to be applied annually. Best to have removable docks for those products.

[ApS]

Over time, small amounts of chemicals may leach from CCA-treated timber, but research has found that the amount of leached arsenic is less than that found in common foods.

(Emphasis on natural leaching, not immersed leaching).

Thompson's will "bead" rainwater for about two years. Its been several years since I last did any treatment, and probably treated the dock only three times in its 35 years. Annual sealing has sequestered huge amounts of preservatives all over the lake.

I think the small dead fish problem was due to the overwhelming quantity of preservatives released rather suddenly in response to this year's high water extremes. (Immersing treated docks underwater). Lawn chemicals shouldn't be overlooked.

Trying to keep the lake "deep" in Autumn points to heavy development in the shallow parts of the lake. (And the oversized deep-vee "big-money" boats recently introduced).

Originally Posted by tis

Except that they did change the formula for pressure treated quite a few years ago, so it does not have the same danger-supposedly-that it did. I personally would never use real wood outside ever again.

The Libby Museum dock was recently covered with Trex (plastic "artificial" wood). One winter's ice warped the new dock in its entirety. Trex is not the strongest material--not the coolest material--nor is it cheap, nor free of fossil fuel content.

Using 2"x8" treated yellow pine planking adds great strength to resist Mother Nature's Winter Wrath--and it's renewable!

[John Mercier]

We use independent testing as the stated lifetime generally doesn't work for us.

Clear - including Thompson - about 1 year. Semi-transparent about two/three years. Semi-solid about three/four. Solid about five. Tested on horizontal surfaces in mid NY State. Annual applications with oil help fill the void created by evaporation of the water content. Without filling those voids the lumber will wick water back in speeding decay.

I used marine grade Penofin for years... and I'm not in a waterfront situation.

Other than that... you will get graying, fiber breakdown, and will need to brighten (which is much worse for the lake). The chemistry of the oil based sealer/stains is lighter hydrocarbons, and should have no more effect on the lake than powerboats. It floats on the surface and evaporates into the air.

Trex is mostly recycled plastic and sawdust with a nylon coating.
It has several levels of quality... but none of them should ''warp''. So they may want to put in for a warranty claim.

[ApS]

Those of us who stay after the season may see a "bathtub ring" of leached contaminants on boulders around the lake. (Which is added to the usual contaminants added by fossil fuels, outboard and I/O gearcase greases, sunken boats, cranes lost overboard from barges, and suntan oils).

A photograph of previous "bathtub rings" corresponding to spring (and summer) contaminants was added to the forum in 2006:

https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums...9&postcount=16

Keeping the lake overfull surely has consequences.

Originally Posted by Biggd

Never a dull moment on the forum.

Member tis is likely referring to the pontoon boats who raft in formerly quiet and clean coves around the lake. (I've seen the "ladder-dip" too).

"Greater" Winter Harbor has become too rough with wakes to support rafting.

What are we swimming in, anyway?

[imyourhuckleberry]

Originally Posted by garysanfran

At least ban wakeboarding. The water is about 3" higher than this morning's level.

I think you mean wake surfing?

[Rinkerguy]

This may not be a popular idea, but …
I would think MP needs to consider banning any sort of water skiing, wake boarding, tubing, jet ski activity within say 500 ft from shore or other boats. Maybe even a temporary speed limit reduction of 30 mph. All this in the interest of safety and in lue of a lake wide no wake zone.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Rinkerguy

This may not be a popular idea, but …
I would think MP needs to consider banning any sort of water skiing, wake boarding, tubing, jet ski activity within say 500 ft from shore or other boats. Maybe even a temporary speed limit reduction of 30 mph. All this in the interest of safety and in lue of a lake wide no wake zone.

The faster the speed the smaller the wake. And jet skis don’t make much in general, certainly less than most boats.

[ApS]

Originally Posted by codeman671

The faster the speed the smaller the wake. And jet skis don’t make much in general, certainly less than most boats.

Yup.

Everybody's boat wake is average.

[LoveLakeLife]

Originally Posted by Rinkerguy

This may not be a popular idea, but …
I would think MP needs to consider banning any sort of water skiing, wake boarding, tubing, jet ski activity within say 500 ft from shore or other boats. Maybe even a temporary speed limit reduction of 30 mph. All this in the interest of safety and in lue of a lake wide no wake zone.

I wonder if the police would have the authority to institute a rule like that, which would effectively have the force of law. Can anybody weigh in on the authority for such a move?


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[fatlazyless]

From Friday, July 14 ...... http://www.dos.nh.gov/news-and-media...ires-lakes-and ...... and today is Monday, July 17, 2023 ....... so, what do you think? ...... where's the water at? ........ the Marine Patrol in Gilford has floating docks that go up and down with the lake level so's they don't have to be placing 32-gal trash cans full of water, or concrete blocks, or something heavy on their docks to keep it from rock'n & roll'n with the incoming waves and wakes.

Golly gee wilikers ....... looking very closely at that BearCam dock with those three water-filled buckets ...... it looks like his dock is NOW just a tiny bit, below the water! ........ no, looking at it in better light, it is still above the water line, so a lake wide no-wake is NOT needed, at this time.

[jeffk]

Yesterdays deluge undid all the lake lowering progress from last week. This was not a huge surprise; a lot of rain was predicted. The Lakeport dam output was throttled back until downstream areas shed yesterday's rain. Less rain is predicted in the next ten days so once the dam opens up again some drawdown progress can be made, however it will take a week or more to get levels down.

Winnipesaukee is nowhere near a no wake zone posting, based on historic levels and previous no wake bans. It would be nice if people on the lake showed some awareness of the current problems caused by high water but such common sense appears to be in short supply with the general boating public. Just observe the typical behaviors of boaters on a summer weekend and you will know that many folks just don't "get it", high water or not.

[SAB1]

We have been very lucky so far with gentle to no winds throughout this high water. A good couple days of northwest at 20mph and a lot of dock damage would occur with boats sitting so high.

[WinnisquamZ]

On Winnisquam we are back to where we were a few weeks ago. Docks are underwater and junk is in the water, again. The neighbors have arrived, assessed their situation and have done nothing. Forecast is looking better for the next week. Let’s open those dams and enjoy the sunshine


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[WinnisquamZ]

Today will be a interesting day. Sunshine and new rentals arrived this past weekend. And after yesterday rain they are waiting to hit the water


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[8gv]

With all the awareness of high water it will be interesting to see how boaters behave.

"We'd better slow down so we don't do damage."

Plowing along at a 45° angle...

"See, we care!"

[LIforrelaxin]

I don't anticipate a no-wake order on Winnipesaukee unless it goes over 505 Feet. At the moment It looks like that will be avoided, they have begun to open the dame back up, it seems they turned the valve up to ~950 cfs late yesterday, which seems to be arresting the rise. Hopefully over the course of the week, they will get it back to where they had it at the end last week, ~1800cfs.... If they can get there the lake will come down rather quickly.

The good news is I got my son up there and we raised the dock this weekend. Hopefully we will not see anymore rain, and I will not have to run back up there this week......

[thinkxingu]

Originally Posted by 8gv

With all the awareness of high water it will be interesting to see how boaters behave.

"We'd better slow down so we don't do damage."

Plowing along at a 45° angle...

"See, we care!"

We've only been out three or four times this year, but each time we saw a TON of this.

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