NHEC special election results!

Twags · 10-17-2020, 11:26 AM

All,

My friend and colleague, Dick Knox, says it best:

"A very big THANK YOU to NH Electric Co-op members who responded to the call to vote in the Co-op’s just-concluded special election on broadband. A stunning 88.4 percent of you voted Yes on the proposition to change NHEC’s bylaws, enabling it to go forward with its ambitious plans to bring fast, affordable internet service to tens of thousands of Co-op members who now lack it.
When was the last time ANY proposition won 88 percent of the vote?

Not only does this send a strong signal to the Co-op about what its members want and expect their utility to do to address the painful rural internet gap, but it stands as a resounding signal to elected officials (at all levels), to funding agencies, and to entrepreneurs (both nonprofit, like NHEC, and for-profit) that broadband internet is a pressing need with compelling public support. The pandemic underscored this need. As Co-op board chairman Tom Mongeon noted, it’s analogous to the Co-op’s provision of electricity to rural areas in 1939.

Finally, this is the second time in four months that Co-op members have sent this signal. Back in June, a pro-broadband initiative put forward by a no-budget grass roots group fell just 183 votes shy of the two-thirds majority needed to change the Co-op’s bylaws adding broadband to the utility’s charter. But that was enough to get the ball rolling…and as it rolled it gathered size and momentum, as this special election result shows.

In other words, democracy can (sometimes) work.

Richard Knox
Chair, New Hampshire Broadband Advocates"

Outdoorsman · 10-17-2020, 01:08 PM

Our rates will skyrocket in the near future!

Congratulations to NHEC on finding a way to collect $ from members to invest in non-COOP PROFIT!

mswlogo · 10-18-2020, 01:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twags

All,

My friend and colleague, Dick Knox, says it best:

"A very big THANK YOU to NH Electric Co-op members who responded to the call to vote in the Co-op’s just-concluded special election on broadband. A stunning 88.4 percent of you voted Yes on the proposition to change NHEC’s bylaws, enabling it to go forward with its ambitious plans to bring fast, affordable internet service to tens of thousands of Co-op members who now lack it.
When was the last time ANY proposition won 88 percent of the vote?

Not only does this send a strong signal to the Co-op about what its members want and expect their utility to do to address the painful rural internet gap, but it stands as a resounding signal to elected officials (at all levels), to funding agencies, and to entrepreneurs (both nonprofit, like NHEC, and for-profit) that broadband internet is a pressing need with compelling public support. The pandemic underscored this need. As Co-op board chairman Tom Mongeon noted, it’s analogous to the Co-op’s provision of electricity to rural areas in 1939.

Finally, this is the second time in four months that Co-op members have sent this signal. Back in June, a pro-broadband initiative put forward by a no-budget grass roots group fell just 183 votes shy of the two-thirds majority needed to change the Co-op’s bylaws adding broadband to the utility’s charter. But that was enough to get the ball rolling…and as it rolled it gathered size and momentum, as this special election result shows.

In other words, democracy can (sometimes) work.

Richard Knox
Chair, New Hampshire Broadband Advocates"

Can you answer a dumb question?

What is NHEC Co-op?

Does it affect me in Bristol?

Why does one sign up? Is it to get cheaper electric rates? Can anyone in NH sign up? Do you have to be a resident?

Congrats on the vote.

fatlazyless · 10-18-2020, 04:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mswlogo

Can you answer a dumb question?

What is NHEC Co-op?

'A Brief History on New Hampshire Electric Cooperative; 1915-1948' ...... if you google that .... the Co-Op was born to go out into the NH country-side to rural areas because existing utilities like Boston Edison were not interested to go way out there ..... no way ..... not out to those Moultonborough back-woods sticks, for example ..... hardly, just not worth the effort, no damned way to build a line way back there, for what and for the very few poor farm people, way out there.

upthesaukee · 10-18-2020, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mswlogo

Can you answer a dumb question?

What is NHEC Co-op?

Does it affect me in Bristol?

Why does one sign up? Is it to get cheaper electric rates? Can anyone in NH sign up? Do you have to be a resident?

Congrats on the vote.

NHEC is an electricity provider in portions of NH, and it appears that it does cover close to 300 customers in Bristol.

Who do you pay your electrical bill to?

Dave

mswlogo · 10-18-2020, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by upthesaukee

NHEC is an electricity provider in portions of NH, and it appears that it does cover close to 300 customers in Bristol.

Who do you pay your electrical bill to?

Dave

It’s been Eversource, but can’t you choose?

longislander · 10-18-2020, 08:55 AM

Four electric distribution companies operate in New Hampshire, each serving a mutually exclusive franchise territory.

https://www.puc.nh.gov/Electric/electric.htm

Also,

A republic, not a democracy ...

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. "

One day a year ... a democracy ... e.g., town meeting, if you attend. "Majority" rules, ... not elected officials.

fatlazyless · 10-18-2020, 09:06 AM

Mutually exclusive means you have just Eversource and no where else to buy your electricity, unless you are Walmart in Plymouth that get's its electricity from Southern Power ..... specifically Alabama Power ..... burning soft coal from Wyoming delivered by a BNSF coal freight train, haul'n coal from Cheyenne, WY to Birmingham, AL ...... choo-choo ..... el cheapo 'Bama pow'r delivered over the Co-Op's wire lines to that friendly, helpful, low-price Plymouth, Gilford & Tilton Walmart.

P-3 Guy · 10-19-2020, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longislander

A republic, not a democracy ...

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. "

One day a year ... a democracy ... e.g., town meeting, if you attend. "Majority" rules, ... not elected officials.

In the context of US constitutional law, the definition of republic refers specifically to a form of government in which elected individuals represent the citizen body and exercise power according to the rule of law under a constitution, including separation of powers with an elected head of state, referred to as a constitutional republic or representative democracy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic

The terms republic and democracy are not mutually exclusive.

FlyingScot · 10-19-2020, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longislander

Also,

A republic, not a democracy ...

"I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. "

One day a year ... a democracy ... e.g., town meeting, if you attend. "Majority" rules, ... not elected officials.

Not sure why you bring this up, other than it's a new talking point to discredit our democratic norms. All of the NHEC members were offered the chance to vote on this specific issue--democracy decided we should add broadband to our cooperative

longislander · 10-19-2020, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Not sure why you bring this up, other than it's a new talking point to discredit our democratic norms.

... discredit our democratic norms ... please!

Talking point ...you mean like what you just stated!

Since Wiki is quoted, than quote it more accurately to reality:
A democratic republic

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_republic
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance

The board of directors initiated this second bylaw change, not "the people".

Quote:

democracy decided we should add broadband to our cooperative

No it didn't!
Maybe you don't understand what you voted for.

Quote:

These bylaw changes give NHEC the ability to respond quickly and efficiently to federal, state, and local funding opportunities. The changes will also allow NHEC’s Board of Directors to enter into strategic partnerships and evaluate the best organizational structure to meet the goal of ensuring members have access to the broadband service they need.

Quote:

... ensuring members have access to the broadband service they need.

And how are they going to determine that? I deserve at least gigabit speed!

https://www.nhec.com/nhec-members-ap...aw-amendments/

Notice that the directors not "the people" will decide new ventures. Difference between democracy and elected officials.

Hopefully, the directors will choose a venture that will be "co- .... operative" with providing electricity, without causing consumer monetary damage, and not think that stringing fiber cable on poles will be the end-all.

ApS · 10-19-2020, 07:32 PM

Stamp collectors have known what we are—at least since 1947.

longislander · 10-19-2020, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Stamp collectors have known what we are

Like FDR ...?

https://postalmuseum.si.edu/collecti...ting-president

He also tried to pack SCOTUS! (Supreme Court of the US) speaking historically, not "constitutionally", notwithstanding relevancy.

Was the NH COOP Board stacked?

fatlazyless · 10-20-2020, 04:07 AM

So, will a second set of wires be needed for the Co-Op's internet service, or will this new high powered internet travel the power lines already there over the copper lines in place since 1950.

Ye olde 1950 copper wires go 2020 wifi with more technology than ever imagined, or something?

longislander · 10-20-2020, 07:00 AM

Quote:

So, will a second set of wires be needed for the Co-Op's internet service, or will this new high powered internet travel the power lines already there over the copper lines in place since 1950.

Ye olde 1950 copper wires go 2020 wifi with more technology than ever imagined, or something?

Rumor has it, maybe a petition, that an RFP may go out for blankets. Something about smoke signals!

However, the copper-wire-power-line approach has/is been contemplated by others.

https://eandt.theiet.org/content/art...er-power-line/

https://www.state.nj.us/rpa/BPLwhitepaper.pdf

May as well include WIKI ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadb...er_power_lines

Lakegeezer · 10-20-2020, 07:18 AM

The current electric wires will not carry data. That was tried in other parts of the country about a decade ago with little success. Any new cable will be fiber optics. Instead of electricity, light is beamed through the cable. Different colors of light represent different frequencies, or channels. Long-haul cables need to be amplified every 30 miles or so. Neighborhood distribution boxes regenerate light for individual homes. Gigabit speed is pretty standard, but 10 Gigabit service is technically possible, if there was a market. No need till we have hologram projectors in our living rooms, if ever.

It is yet to be announced which business model NHEC will take. In one approach, they sell wholesale bandwidth and let other companies sell to consumers. This is a good approach if NHEC doesn't want to deal with consumer level internet problems. They would also have the cellular telephone and cable providers as customers. Firstlight is the primary competitor today, but with a limited presence. The other approach is to be an internet service provider to residences, competing with the telephone and cable companies. More revenue, more expenses, more competition.

There is a document floating around listing the many telecom grants available in 2021. If NHEC can get their proposals together quickly, the parts of the Lakes Region that uses NHEC will benefit greatly having Federal funds pay for the infrastructure. That was done for electricity, telephone and highways in the past, so its pretty straight forward once the public utility nature of the service is established. Thanks to Corona, the argument is a lot easier than it was.

longislander · 10-20-2020, 07:45 AM

https://www.shutterstock.com/image-p...ask-1666875952

TheTimeTraveler · 10-20-2020, 04:04 PM

So how long will it take NHEC to actually provide broadband to some or all of their customers? 5 years, 10 years, longer?

Anyone have any realistic idea?

8gv · 12-04-2020, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lakegeezer

No need till we have hologram projectors in our living rooms, if ever.

Wait, you don't have one yet?

fatlazyless · 12-04-2020, 07:40 PM

...... got an e-mail today, Dec 4, addressed to 'Dear Broadband Supporter' from the New Hampshire Electric Coop.

It runs about ten paragraphs and talks about NHEC's strong desire and intention to provide high speed internet access.

It says that NHEC has now provided internet access to four towns, up-north: Lempster, Colebrook, Stewartstown, and Clarksville, making broadband available to 900 homes, businesses, and civic institutions.

Customers will pay 49.95/month for 25-megabits-per-second and this includes both download and upload.

Those who need lightning-fast speed can get a gigabit-per-second for
89.95/month.
....................

So next question, and don't mean to sound selfish here ...... so when-when-when-when-when ...... like how soon ...... when will the NHEC hit our mega-million dollar, sandy beaches, here in beautiful Meredith, NH and starting dishing out that high quality, reasonable price internet service?

So, this is very good news, with the NHEC moving forward with providing internet access.

10-17-2020, 11:26 AM	#1
Twags Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Posts: 14 Thanks: 2 Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts	NHEC special election results! All, My friend and colleague, Dick Knox, says it best: "A very big THANK YOU to NH Electric Co-op members who responded to the call to vote in the Co-op’s just-concluded special election on broadband. A stunning 88.4 percent of you voted Yes on the proposition to change NHEC’s bylaws, enabling it to go forward with its ambitious plans to bring fast, affordable internet service to tens of thousands of Co-op members who now lack it. When was the last time ANY proposition won 88 percent of the vote? Not only does this send a strong signal to the Co-op about what its members want and expect their utility to do to address the painful rural internet gap, but it stands as a resounding signal to elected officials (at all levels), to funding agencies, and to entrepreneurs (both nonprofit, like NHEC, and for-profit) that broadband internet is a pressing need with compelling public support. The pandemic underscored this need. As Co-op board chairman Tom Mongeon noted, it’s analogous to the Co-op’s provision of electricity to rural areas in 1939. Finally, this is the second time in four months that Co-op members have sent this signal. Back in June, a pro-broadband initiative put forward by a no-budget grass roots group fell just 183 votes shy of the two-thirds majority needed to change the Co-op’s bylaws adding broadband to the utility’s charter. But that was enough to get the ball rolling…and as it rolled it gathered size and momentum, as this special election result shows. In other words, democracy can (sometimes) work. Richard Knox Chair, New Hampshire Broadband Advocates"

10-18-2020, 09:06 AM	#8
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,737 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,007 Times in 735 Posts	Mutually exclusive means you have just Eversource and no where else to buy your electricity, unless you are Walmart in Plymouth that get's its electricity from Southern Power ..... specifically Alabama Power ..... burning soft coal from Wyoming delivered by a BNSF coal freight train, haul'n coal from Cheyenne, WY to Birmingham, AL ...... choo-choo ..... el cheapo 'Bama pow'r delivered over the Co-Op's wire lines to that friendly, helpful, low-price Plymouth, Gilford & Tilton Walmart. __________________ ... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake!

10-19-2020, 07:32 PM	#12
ApS Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro Posts: 5,937 Thanks: 2,205 Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts	"The Greatest Generation" Knew... Stamp collectors have known what we are—at least since 1947. Attached Images

10-20-2020, 04:07 AM	#14
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,737 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,007 Times in 735 Posts	So, will a second set of wires be needed for the Co-Op's internet service, or will this new high powered internet travel the power lines already there over the copper lines in place since 1950. Ye olde 1950 copper wires go 2020 wifi with more technology than ever imagined, or something? __________________ ... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake!

10-20-2020, 07:18 AM	#16
Lakegeezer Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 1,677 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 354 Thanked 639 Times in 290 Posts	Light, not copper is the next step The current electric wires will not carry data. That was tried in other parts of the country about a decade ago with little success. Any new cable will be fiber optics. Instead of electricity, light is beamed through the cable. Different colors of light represent different frequencies, or channels. Long-haul cables need to be amplified every 30 miles or so. Neighborhood distribution boxes regenerate light for individual homes. Gigabit speed is pretty standard, but 10 Gigabit service is technically possible, if there was a market. No need till we have hologram projectors in our living rooms, if ever. It is yet to be announced which business model NHEC will take. In one approach, they sell wholesale bandwidth and let other companies sell to consumers. This is a good approach if NHEC doesn't want to deal with consumer level internet problems. They would also have the cellular telephone and cable providers as customers. Firstlight is the primary competitor today, but with a limited presence. The other approach is to be an internet service provider to residences, competing with the telephone and cable companies. More revenue, more expenses, more competition. There is a document floating around listing the many telecom grants available in 2021. If NHEC can get their proposals together quickly, the parts of the Lakes Region that uses NHEC will benefit greatly having Federal funds pay for the infrastructure. That was done for electricity, telephone and highways in the past, so its pretty straight forward once the public utility nature of the service is established. Thanks to Corona, the argument is a lot easier than it was. __________________ -lg Last edited by Lakegeezer; 10-20-2020 at 07:18 AM. Reason: edit

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10-17-2020, 01:08 PM	#2
Outdoorsman Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 831 Thanks: 114 Thanked 210 Times in 132 Posts	Our rates will skyrocket in the near future! Congratulations to NHEC on finding a way to collect $ from members to invest in non-COOP PROFIT!

10-18-2020, 08:55 AM	#7
longislander Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 545 Thanks: 49 Thanked 100 Times in 75 Posts	Four electric distribution companies operate in New Hampshire, each serving a mutually exclusive franchise territory. https://www.puc.nh.gov/Electric/electric.htm Also, A republic, not a democracy ... "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. " One day a year ... a democracy ... e.g., town meeting, if you attend. "Majority" rules, ... not elected officials.

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10-20-2020, 07:45 AM	#17
longislander Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 545 Thanks: 49 Thanked 100 Times in 75 Posts	https://www.shutterstock.com/image-p...ask-1666875952

10-20-2020, 04:04 PM	#18
TheTimeTraveler Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2015 Posts: 873 Thanks: 277 Thanked 283 Times in 174 Posts	So how long will it take NHEC to actually provide broadband to some or all of their customers? 5 years, 10 years, longer? Anyone have any realistic idea?

12-04-2020, 07:40 PM	#20
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,737 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,007 Times in 735 Posts	...... got an e-mail today, Dec 4, addressed to 'Dear Broadband Supporter' from the New Hampshire Electric Coop. It runs about ten paragraphs and talks about NHEC's strong desire and intention to provide high speed internet access. It says that NHEC has now provided internet access to four towns, up-north: Lempster, Colebrook, Stewartstown, and Clarksville, making broadband available to 900 homes, businesses, and civic institutions. Customers will pay 49.95/month for 25-megabits-per-second and this includes both download and upload. Those who need lightning-fast speed can get a gigabit-per-second for 89.95/month. .................... So next question, and don't mean to sound selfish here ...... so when-when-when-when-when ...... like how soon ...... when will the NHEC hit our mega-million dollar, sandy beaches, here in beautiful Meredith, NH and starting dishing out that high quality, reasonable price internet service? So, this is very good news, with the NHEC moving forward with providing internet access. __________________ ... down and out, liv'n that Walmart side of the lake! Last edited by fatlazyless; 12-04-2020 at 08:27 PM.