House urges clear tax rules on assessing views

Seaplane Pilot · 09-28-2005, 01:04 PM

Article on view tax from today's Union Leader. Beware Tuftonboro residents, the company mentioned - Avitar Associates - just did the reassessment for Tuftonboro. How many of us in Tuftonboro were assessed on views?

http://www.theunionleader.com/articl...?article=61036

fatlazyless · 09-28-2005, 06:17 PM

Said the real estate agent to the NH farmer about the view from his hillside farm: This sure is a beautifull view that you all have, up here. Replied the farmer to the real estate agent. Yes, except one cannot eat the view. As a farm while outstanding views are very nice, they are not too unusual and do not add any value to it as farm land.

Now, if you subdivide that farm into residential lots, then the view makes a huge difference for what someone will pay.

Wasn't this a major reason why the 'in current use' tax exempt category for property of at least ten acres was created about 25 years ago?

hazelnut · 09-29-2005, 07:33 AM

We folks with property in Tuftonboro have had our own run-in with Avitar. Several residents of Cow Island were shocked at the increased asessments to their properties, myself included. My "beach" was taxed like $130,000. I quoted the term "beach" due to the fact that my "beach" is a 10 foot wide set of cement steps into the water. A large percentage of us met with the town on individual appointments to file for abatement. We all wait anxiously to hear our results. As far as I can tell the Avitar system is SERIOUSLY flawed.
According to Avitar, my property was asessed as roughly the third highest land value on the entire island. My lot is 27,000sf with 150 feet of waterfront. In contrast every single 5 acre parcel with 500 feet of frontage on the other side of the island was asessed $100,000 LESS than mine

The "other" side of Cow Island I speak of is the Idlewild side where most residents have the 5 acres 500 feet parcels. Several lots have Broad views sunsets etc. In contrast my lot faces Tuftonboro Neck with a view of the channel by the Barbers Pole.

Don't even get me started on the fact that we Islanders don't get a tax break for our seasonal status. Or the fact that none of us even use one stitch of Tuftonboro services.

I know this is a sore subject beaten to death. I already know that there is a group of people out there who believe that we get what we deserve. "If we can afford the waterfront house than tough luck we can afford the taxes, etc." This is so often not the case. Most of the Islanders I know are hard working people who scraped together pennies to buy land, camped out on it, saved up, put up a shed, saved some more, Built a modest cottage, then BAM! The asessors come and spike the asessment and next thing you know these people are forced to consider selling due to the fact that they can't afford the taxes.

I will be curious to see how this whole thing works out. Sorry I had to vent.

Tired of Waiting · 09-29-2005, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hazelnut

.
Sorry I had to vent.

than to boil over. Man I can see it now, Hazelnut all over the place.......

Tis true that the islanders seem to get the pointed end of the stick when the tax man comes. I guess it's all part of the tax grab game.

I feel for ya.

ToW

ITD · 09-30-2005, 07:25 AM

Wow, they've finally figured out how to tax something you don't own (the view). Only sure things in life, death and taxes.....

TomC · 09-30-2005, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITD

Wow, they've finally figured out how to tax something you don't own (the view). Only sure things in life, death and taxes.....

no-one (or more accurately: the citizens of NH) owns the lake, but they sure as heck tax the owner of the land adjacent to it..

no difference really, if a beautiful view enhances the value of a property, then a value-based tax system is going to capture it

Lin · 10-02-2005, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatlazyless

Now, if you subdivide that farm into residential lots, then the view makes a huge difference for what someone will pay.

Wasn't this a major reason why the 'in current use' tax exempt category for property of at least ten acres was created about 25 years ago?

What a stupid thing to tax. I read that article. I believe that if the state accepts Avitar's side then farmland, forestland and open space will be at premiuim prices and lost to the farmer or landholder that won't be able to afford the property, much akin to lakefront property. We had this in theory at forestry college. Does one have the right to build and block your view? Does a town have a right to tax for that view? And that was in the 70's. What's to say you get charged top dollar for a view of totally forested mountainside/valley and someone comes along and builds even one house that you didn't want in your view. Will the town reduce your tax cause your view is now ruined. I doubt it. And in that article it talked that city dwellers that like the top floors for the view of the city they aren't taxed a view tax? I think they have opened a major oildrum of worms!

Mashugana · 10-03-2005, 07:21 AM

So what do the assessors do when the view from a property gets blocked by trees or another building? Do they lower the value and the tax?

What defines a valuable view? Is your dream view the same as mine? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What is a beautiful view for one person may not be the view desired by another. Raising the tax because of the view makes no sense.

Can landowners build a fence to block their view so they get a tax break?

ITD · 10-03-2005, 07:34 AM

There should be a rebate for when rafters or fishermen block the view, what about night time or when the weather is bad?

Next they'll be trying to figure out a way to tax non-property owners who enjoy the view.

glennsteely · 10-04-2005, 10:47 PM

People who live in NY city, or Philly and love the view of the city skyline, arent being taxed......YET! I think that is crazy!! I agree that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but on the opposite side of the coin, how unfair is it to tax summer dwellers when they dont use the schools, or basically any other service that is provided by tax money?? What is next?? Will you guys be taxed more than L.A. residents for the cleaner air?? More than Arizona residents for the fresher seafood?? It just doesnt even sound right, to be able to be taxed for something you dont own or control......

ApS · 10-05-2005, 07:17 AM

While the family was picking over a "Moving Sale" last month, I admired the lake view from this particular hillside property. It was a bit restricted by trees on the neighboring undeveloped lots, but the owner had cut a few pine groves to allow the view.

The seller and I talked a long time and I felt comfortable enough to comment (kidding), "Someday, New Hampshire will be taxing views like this. Yours is about a 70° view, so you'd get a discount over a hilltop property."

He said, "There's talk of this in Concord".

I nearly fell over. Holy Cow!

Note: Beware of bureaucrats approaching you with measuring tapes*. They'll be taxing the New Hampshire air we breathe next!

*Apologies to...was it...The Emperor's New Clothes?

SAMIAM · 10-05-2005, 11:27 AM

Hazelnut,I for one don't think you're getting what you "deserve"......I'm a native and getting screwed just like you.Using no services and paying a ton of tax after developing our little lakeside cottage into a more improved home.Already,two families have left our road....driven out in their retirement years by high taxes.

09-28-2005, 01:04 PM	#1
Seaplane Pilot Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,177 Thanks: 664 Thanked 943 Times in 368 Posts	House urges clear tax rules on assessing views Article on view tax from today's Union Leader. Beware Tuftonboro residents, the company mentioned - Avitar Associates - just did the reassessment for Tuftonboro. How many of us in Tuftonboro were assessed on views? http://www.theunionleader.com/articl...?article=61036

09-29-2005, 07:33 AM	#3
hazelnut Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,348 Blog Entries: 3 Thanks: 508 Thanked 462 Times in 162 Posts	Avitar We folks with property in Tuftonboro have had our own run-in with Avitar. Several residents of Cow Island were shocked at the increased asessments to their properties, myself included. My "beach" was taxed like $130,000. I quoted the term "beach" due to the fact that my "beach" is a 10 foot wide set of cement steps into the water. A large percentage of us met with the town on individual appointments to file for abatement. We all wait anxiously to hear our results. As far as I can tell the Avitar system is SERIOUSLY flawed. According to Avitar, my property was asessed as roughly the third highest land value on the entire island. My lot is 27,000sf with 150 feet of waterfront. In contrast every single 5 acre parcel with 500 feet of frontage on the other side of the island was asessed $100,000 LESS than mine The "other" side of Cow Island I speak of is the Idlewild side where most residents have the 5 acres 500 feet parcels. Several lots have Broad views sunsets etc. In contrast my lot faces Tuftonboro Neck with a view of the channel by the Barbers Pole. Don't even get me started on the fact that we Islanders don't get a tax break for our seasonal status. Or the fact that none of us even use one stitch of Tuftonboro services. I know this is a sore subject beaten to death. I already know that there is a group of people out there who believe that we get what we deserve. "If we can afford the waterfront house than tough luck we can afford the taxes, etc." This is so often not the case. Most of the Islanders I know are hard working people who scraped together pennies to buy land, camped out on it, saved up, put up a shed, saved some more, Built a modest cottage, then BAM! The asessors come and spike the asessment and next thing you know these people are forced to consider selling due to the fact that they can't afford the taxes. I will be curious to see how this whole thing works out. Sorry I had to vent.

10-03-2005, 07:21 AM	#8
Mashugana Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 73 Thanks: 2 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	What if your view gets blocked? So what do the assessors do when the view from a property gets blocked by trees or another building? Do they lower the value and the tax? What defines a valuable view? Is your dream view the same as mine? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What is a beautiful view for one person may not be the view desired by another. Raising the tax because of the view makes no sense. Can landowners build a fence to block their view so they get a tax break?

10-04-2005, 10:47 PM	#10
glennsteely Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Mantua, N.J. Posts: 472 Thanks: 90 Thanked 111 Times in 38 Posts	Taxing the view is absurd..... People who live in NY city, or Philly and love the view of the city skyline, arent being taxed......YET! I think that is crazy!! I agree that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but on the opposite side of the coin, how unfair is it to tax summer dwellers when they dont use the schools, or basically any other service that is provided by tax money?? What is next?? Will you guys be taxed more than L.A. residents for the cleaner air?? More than Arizona residents for the fresher seafood?? It just doesnt even sound right, to be able to be taxed for something you dont own or control...... __________________ You have to go out on a limb sometimes, cause that is where the fruit is. You can't get to the fruit from that nice safe spot, clinging to the trunk of the tree......

10-05-2005, 07:17 AM	#11
ApS Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Florida (Sebring & Keys), Wolfeboro Posts: 5,938 Thanks: 2,205 Thanked 776 Times in 553 Posts	Tax Relief for Lakefront Owners? While the family was picking over a "Moving Sale" last month, I admired the lake view from this particular hillside property. It was a bit restricted by trees on the neighboring undeveloped lots, but the owner had cut a few pine groves to allow the view. The seller and I talked a long time and I felt comfortable enough to comment (kidding), "Someday, New Hampshire will be taxing views like this. Yours is about a 70° view, so you'd get a discount over a hilltop property." He said, "There's talk of this in Concord". I nearly fell over. Holy Cow! Note: Beware of bureaucrats approaching you with measuring tapes. They'll be taxing the New Hampshire air* we breathe next! *Apologies to...was it...The Emperor's New Clothes?

09-28-2005, 06:17 PM	#2
fatlazyless Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,755 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 300 Thanked 1,010 Times in 736 Posts	Said the real estate agent to the NH farmer about the view from his hillside farm: This sure is a beautifull view that you all have, up here. Replied the farmer to the real estate agent. Yes, except one cannot eat the view. As a farm while outstanding views are very nice, they are not too unusual and do not add any value to it as farm land. Now, if you subdivide that farm into residential lots, then the view makes a huge difference for what someone will pay. Wasn't this a major reason why the 'in current use' tax exempt category for property of at least ten acres was created about 25 years ago?

09-30-2005, 07:25 AM	#5
ITD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 2,928 Thanks: 476 Thanked 691 Times in 387 Posts	Wow, they've finally figured out how to tax something you don't own (the view). Only sure things in life, death and taxes.....

10-03-2005, 07:34 AM	#9
ITD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonboro, NH Posts: 2,928 Thanks: 476 Thanked 691 Times in 387 Posts	There should be a rebate for when rafters or fishermen block the view, what about night time or when the weather is bad? Next they'll be trying to figure out a way to tax non-property owners who enjoy the view.

10-05-2005, 11:27 AM	#12
SAMIAM Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Moultonborough Posts: 2,896 Thanks: 334 Thanked 1,676 Times in 586 Posts	Hazelnut,I for one don't think you're getting what you "deserve"......I'm a native and getting screwed just like you.Using no services and paying a ton of tax after developing our little lakeside cottage into a more improved home.Already,two families have left our road....driven out in their retirement years by high taxes.