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The Real BigGuy 08-10-2018 12:42 PM

Driving to the Lake
 
Came north on 95 out of MA this morning. I hit bumper to bumper traffic just south of the toll booth. The traffic stayed bumper to bumper to about a mile south of exit 4 in Portsmouth. There was an accident on the Southbound side. Northbound traffic was all a “gawker blocker.” Added an hour to my trip.

Makes boat traffic on the lake seem not so bad!


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BroadHopper 08-10-2018 05:24 PM

Boat traffic
 
Picking up way early today! Don't know why?

Glad to put up the boat for the weekend. Lots of loonies out there!

tis 08-10-2018 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BroadHopper (Post 299857)
Picking up way early today! Don't know why?

Glad to put up the boat for the weekend. Lots of loonies out there!

I noticed that too! I think people are realizing summer is going and the kids are going back to school.

TiltonBB 08-11-2018 05:35 AM

Childrens Camp Bus
 
I was southbound in Greenland and stuck in accident traffic for about an hour. When an ambulance responding from Dover went by in the breakdown lane it was a clue that something significant had occurred.

After the accident there was about 5 miles of backup in the northbound lane just from rubberneckers. After seeing the bus, I am surprised no one was killed. It appears that all of the children were wearing seat belts. I still don't understand why some people don't wear seat belts.

When I returned about 2 hours later the traffic was at about 20 MPH from the MA/NH line through Portsmouth. It just never recovered.

https://www.wmur.com/article/injurie...nland/22697379

fatlazyless 08-11-2018 07:09 AM

Smallish buses like that usually have seats for 15, including the driver, and no more than 15, because if it can seat 16 then a commercial drivers license w/ passenger endorsement is needed as opposed to a regular car operators license. The minimum age for a cdl-license is 21.

So, it is possible and maybe likely the driver had a regular car license as opposed to a cdl-passenger but this is a good question. Seems like not requiring a cdl-pass for driving a mini-bus w/ 15-seats is a weak link, low safety ceiling in the national safety license design that could require all the 15-seater mini-buses used by schools, camps, municipal and religious organizations and others to be driven by a driver with a cdl-passenger license as opposed to a regular car license.

Buses with seats for 15 have seat belts. The buses with seats for 16 or more in New Hampshire do not have seat belts, except for the cdl-driver who is required to use it.

The WMUR news clip said it was driven by a 21-year old who had a medical event, and went off-road into the trees.

My not so humble opinion: If he had a cdl-passenger license, he would have kept the bus a whole lot more safe like by stopping in the break down lane or something like the side of the road ...... bet you he just has a regular car operator's license .... this single item will probably soon get reported .... just my three cents here!

Requiring the 15-seat mini buses commonly used by schools, camps, municipal and religious organizations and others to be driven by a driver with a cdl-pass endorsement will probably never ever happen ...... is like a loophole on a number of levels that is just not doable?

Kittery, Maine Community Center bus crash with 13 aboard, August 10, 2018, 9:30-am in Greenland, NH on I-95; news clip-1:07 length
https://www.newscentermaine.com/vide...ash/97-8216332

No deaths, a few young children injured, one seriously injured?

http://www.pressherald.com/2018/08/1...5-in-greenland

The Real BigGuy 08-11-2018 12:24 PM

Don’t know what having a CDL would do to prevent a “medical event”. However, I am not opposed to requiring a CDL for any size bus.


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fatlazyless 08-11-2018 12:49 PM

No, having a cdl would not prevent a medical event, but having a cdl requires a medical physical exam performed by a doctor every two years that includes a vision, physical dexterity and urine-drug exam, and a psychological test that asks the question ..... hey there buddy.....why in holy heck do you want to drive a great big truck ..... like why ...... are you totally crazy or just stupid!:D:laugh::D

Pass the medical test, administered by either an MD or a DO, pay the fee, and you get a NH-DOT Medical Card, required to drive a truck/bus just like a drivers license, and good for two years. When you get stopped by a cop, they want to see license, med card, registration. Driving violations stay on your record for 15-years.

Definitely, requiring a cdl-passenger license for driving the 15-seat mini-bus commonly used by schools, towns, camps, church groups and others would be an unwelcome hurtle for these groups. This is a federal law that gets enforced by the states. If a state want a more stringent law, it can pass one. The federal boundary line between no-cdl, and yes-cdl, is the line drawn between 15-16 seats on the bus, so it's 15-no, and 16-yes, for a cdl. 15 includes the driver, so if the mini-bus has seats for 14 plus a driver seat, then it can be driven with a regular car operator license. If it has seats for 15 plus a driver seat, then a cdl-pass is required, and it is no longer considered to be a mini-bus ........ it is a bus.

Sooner or later, doing a google search for 'Kittery Maine school bus crash' will tell if the driver had a regular car operator's license, or a cdl-passenger license? Me-thinks, knowing what I know, he has just the car operator's license ..... time will tell.

It seems just a wee bit wacky that the driver of a box truck with a gross vehicle weight (truck and freight) of 12,000-lbs and up is required to have a cdl, while the driver of a mini-bus with up to 14 passengers is not ..... how's about that?

tis 08-11-2018 04:36 PM

You now need a CDL certified doctor to do a medical exam for a CDL driver. But there is such a shortage of drivers now that things aren't getting delivered. It is a crisis. The government is considering allowing 18 year olds to get their CDL. Guess we will see if it passes.

TiltonBB 08-11-2018 08:24 PM

CDL Required for 26,000 Pounds
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fatlazyless (Post 299904)
It seems just a wee bit wacky that the driver of a box truck with a gross vehicle weight (truck and freight) of 12,000-lbs and up is required to have a cdl, while the driver of a mini-bus with up to 14 passengers is not ..... how's about that?

A Class B CDL is required for vehicles in excess of 26,000 pounds not 12,000 pounds. The weight limits were set to enable the companies like U Haul, Ryder, and Penske to rent trucks to non CDL licensed operators. The exception is when the vehicle is equipped with air brakes,then a CDL is required.

From the NH DMV:

Class B: Any single vehicle with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds, or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 10,000 pounds GVWR. Tests required for a Class B license in New Hampshire:
General CDL Knowledge Test.
Air Brakes Knowledge Test.
Road Skills Test in a Class B vehicle.

fatlazyless 08-12-2018 08:02 AM

Oh ok, thanks for the correction, 12,000 does seem light for the gross weight of a large box truck, so my memory messed up making it 12,000-lb and not the correct gross weight of 12-tons, or 24,000-lbs. I knew it was 12-somethings .... ho-ho.

TiltonBB 08-12-2018 08:40 AM

Need a WalMart Calculator?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by fatlazyless (Post 299946)
Oh ok, thanks for the correction, 12,000 does seem light for the gross weight of a large box truck, so my memory messed up making it 12,000-lb and not the correct gross weight of 12-tons, or 24,000-lbs. I knew it was 12-somethings .... ho-ho.

Ho, Ho..................Not 12 something!

Close......................But really 13 tons.................26,000 pounds.

fatlazyless 08-12-2018 09:58 AM

ooopsie-doopsie.......my bad.....so, what's 2000-lbs when going from 24-26k .....just small change?

The point is who may drive a mini-bus in the US and in NH. If the NH legislature wanted to require a cdl-pass for driving a mini-bus with 14-passengers in NH it could up-grade the federal law for the State of NH.

Is very unlikely to happen.

TiltonBB 08-13-2018 04:25 PM

Bad Driving Record!
 
The driver of the camp bus.

An extensive violation record for someone only 21 year old. That would be a bad record if you were 50, not 21.

Wouldn't you think a camp could find a driver with a better record than this guy?

According to his driving record, Guy has twice been convicted of driving to endanger for incidents in 2013 and in 2016.

He has several other driving violations including speeding, failure to display a valid inspection sticker, driving after suspension, failure to appear in court for driving offenses and failure to pay fines levied by the Maine BMV.

https://www.wmur.com/article/driver-...shows/22716238

fatlazyless 08-13-2018 07:59 PM

https://www.maine.gov/bmv/drc/ ...... is totally unacceptable for the City of Kittery, Kittery Community Center, summer camp program to not require a ten year drivers record for driving a 14-passenger mini-bus like this one.

The smashed mini-bus most likely had an automatic transmission and normal hydraulic brakes as opposed to air brakes which make it more easy-to-drive to a larger number of drivers than the typical cdl-pass bus with a manual stick shift and air brakes ...... probably too easy-to-drive ..... so any nit-wit loser can drive it.

Shame, shame, shame ....... on Kittery, Maine!

Looks like Kittery didn't do their home work on this one.

In my humble opinion, the job applicant must pay for their 10-year, driver history record as part of the job application. Probably,
this step would have deterred someone with an unsafe driving history from applying for the job, knowing they would get rejected.

Maine Bureau Motor Vehicles:
10-year record: $12
3-year record: $7

City of Kittery to investigate whether driver who crashed van had background check: https://www.pressherald.com/2018/08/...kground-check/ (includes 3 internet comments)

https://www.gmfleet.com/specialty-ve...uttle-bus.html : a 2018 GM Savana shuttle bus that looks(?) pretty similar, more or less(?) to the smashed up 2010 bus in the Press Herald photo, from what can be seen.
.
Looking at the smashed up shuttle bus, it seems like it could have been a lot worse, with 13-people on board, in terms of personal injuries; 11-campers, 1-camp counselor, 1-van driver. It says everyone was wearing a seatbelt(?) somewhere above. Wearing seat belts is not required by law for passengers or driver in this mini-bus in New Hampshire, but everyone, passengers and driver are required by law to wear seat belts in the State of Maine. Looking at the smash-up condition, wearing seat belts and the strength/design of the vehicle probably made a huge difference for not getting killed and more injured.

http://www.unionleader.com/safety/Co...ng-AA-08132018

......oopsie-doopsie.....my bad....am incorrect on wearing seat belts......in New Hampshire, ages 17 and younger are required to wear seat belts, with a first time offense of $50. So, probably just the counselor and the driver were not required to be wearing seat belts in New Hampshire. Wearing seat belts seems like a no-brainer?

fatlazyless 09-11-2018 02:27 PM

" .... a parent's worst nightmare"
 
So, what's next?

https://www.pressherald.com/2018/09/...ainst-Kittery/


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