lights at night... You wouldn't believe this but I saw a battery powered clamp on lights for kayaks and canoes.

Ready for this.... 4th of July 3 years ago.. Crusing in a fountain in choppy weather. Probably going 40 - 45 mph... Nothing major... There were good 2-3 foot waves with cross wakes everywhere.. Just enjoying a nice jont down the center of the broads where we were going to stop an chill out. RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE of the broads is 2 eight foot BLUE Kayakers with BLUE life jackets one. Absolute stupidity. I don't care if you are going 25, 40, 45 or 60 this was tough to see in these conditions... So yes I think your crackhead comment would apply! :D

I have a big boat that is fast, I have a little boat 17 foot center consol fishing boat, and a 26 foot party boat at my dock. With respect and common sense there is no need for restrictions. And no I don't think I own the lake because I have a bigger faster boat. I know when and how to use it very well and IMO the broads is a perfect place to do that. Not in the bays where you have weekend warriors and major congestion.

For those new to this forum I want to point out this post. This topic was closed for many reasons including an overwhelming amount of complaints from members. It is fine to comment on the future impact of the law or the current enforcement but what I am seeing are the same few people making the same points and going down the same paths that were repeated so often last time that I finally had to put a lid on it. If you are really interested in this topic you can read these same points repeated endlessly in the Speed Limit sub-forum.

I'm very close to closing this thread as well. We will not have a repeat of the bickering that dragged this forum down for so long.

Again, please feel free to comment on the future economic impact, enforcement and other personal observations. Just please don't again argue the merits of the law. The law passed, that debate is over. Save it for 2011.

I've got my finger on the "Close" button.

Will be interesting to see what happens in the derby this year. Never been to one but assume a lot of the guys run to different areas real fast. Maybe we should have a pool on how many tix are given out by MP?

We can only wait and see what the impact will be on the economy but as bad as it is now I don't see the speed limit making it much worse. Maybe a few years ago but not today. :(

I had started a thread awhile back about the poker runs... I also think that since it is geared more towards the "go fast boats" it may take a hit as far as attendance. Which not only hurts the economy but easter seals as well. What a shame.

Speed limit or not the lake will be less crowded this year, you can't have 8% unemployment and not hit a few boaters. Plus fear, uncertainty and doubt will force a bunch more to convert their "fun" money to "just in case I get laid off" money.

As a side note. I've been scouting out a kayak or small canoe for just a little fun and fishing. Everywere I shop down in southern NH, they say I'm crazy to use a paddle boat on Winnipesaukee, it's so bad up there they had to put a speed limit in. So that campaign will have some effect as well.

Don, thank you for mentioning a key word in your post...enforcement. I think that when the dust settles in 2011 we will see how "unenforceable" this piece of legislation was from a practical standpoint. Money, equipment, training and manpower will ultimately set the course for this law. My opinion is, that in the end, we will see how little there was to have worried about.

This thread just cannot end well. Push that close button Mr. Webmaster before the rest of the SL gang wakes up.

Hold that thought...
 

From this morning's MSN Money:

:rolleye2: So why would you think that? :rolleye1:

I disagree. I feel that whether we like it or not it will it very much part of the lake and will need to be discussed. I think as pointed out the merits of the law have been beaten like a dead horse but how it is enforced and if it is taking a toll on the lakes economy is a very important topic that should be discussed.

It will be tough because it is such a Hot Topic. But something that needs to be discussed none the less.

Really. Do you mean that??!!
 

Honestly, you can't be serious. I mean, I love a spirited discussion more than most. Even one that becomes an argument.
But this topic? Although I am neutral on it (very seldom do I travel over 40 MPH, and never go out at night) , I read most of the posts about the speed limits. But they have long since turned into the same regurgitated garbage over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again! All this thread is, is a disguise to start it up again. Anyone can see this.
I mean, the speed limit being bad for business?????? Business is, and going to be, way way off this year. Probably fatal for many places. And the speed limit has little, if anything to do with it.

I agree, I can not see this thread ending well either............

My Marina
 

Spoke to the owner of our marina the other day and its only half full with paying customers as of last weekend. I think its going to be a slow quiet summer on the lake.

Just found out a friends of our just sold his boat because of all this. He said he does not want the hassle of getting pulled over because his boat looks like it's dong 80 at 40mph. He said he spent 5-10k on feul a summer, and 500 on a reserved spot at the poker run. He even used to take all the NASCAR teams out on rides to show them our great lake.
I always thought I would spend my whole life on this lake but if this sticks in two years. I will raise my family some other place.

Hopefully sooner rather than later.

This is a open forum I think this is a great topic for everyone to discuss.
Let's stay on topic everyone so this thread will stay.

agree
 

Quick story. We received our invoice this year, along with the annual letter, explaining: "hey, pay now, pay in full, no launches if any outstanding balances, and oh, by the way...due to OUR EXTENSIVE WAITING LIST, pay by the due date, or come get your boat." So, we did our duty and mailed the check 2 days before the dead line. This is for valet service by the way.
And the fact of the matter is that we really could have used another month or two to pay in full. But, not wanting to lose our spot, as we actually do love the place, we moved some things around, and got it paid on their requested date. Now, there are a lot of ways to ask for money in this economy, and I think the way they did it was crappy. How about this:
"Although we realize many of our valued customers are facing uncertain times, we must request payment, in full, by (whatever date), as our fine marina has many obligations we need to stay up with. We ask for your understanding in this matter. Any questions should be directed to the 'such and such'..." Much nicer than "hey, pay now. We have 12 people behind you waiting for your spot!"
The rest of the story:
I had 2 people call the day I mailed the check, and continue to have people call every 7 or 8 days, and guess what? They all get the same response.
"Plenty of room. When would you like to drop your boat off?"
What happened to the waiting list?????
I will say this, however. Noone has been offered a discount. Noone. Price has remained uniform, and all callers have been told the money is due in full. So, it is fair. I just didn't like the tone of the letter.

You're 100% right on that one. And the same goes for all the melodrama over poker runs and charity. One poster was commenting on how the Easter Seals will lose out because of the new law (and by implication, sick children) and what a shame it is. In reality, charities are fortunately quite adept at raising money and as the saying goes, when one door shuts, another opens. Within the confines of the new law there will be plenty(perhaps more and better) of opportunities to raise money. I look forward to some of the positive aspects of the new law that we'll see.

Here is a great example as to why this topic is good to discuss. As a kid I worked at sandy point as a dock boy on weekends. I would get 10-25 boats a night all larger boats from other ends of the lake. I can't see any more than 5% of those people making the trip this year becaus of the 25mph. Most won't come by car do to how long it takes to drive there.

I knew it helped, but did not realize it helped that much.

You know a B3 lower gearcase bolts right up to a B1 upper gearcase, right? Might be worth picking one up on eBay while the 45/25 law is in effect and you can't really use the top end of the B1. A 1.5:1 ratio B1 upper gearcase would be a 2:1 ratio with a B3 lower bolted on, if memory serves. The swap takes mere minutes.

Dave...

I have been looking for a deal on a B3 lower for awhile.... but they dont give them (or the propellers) away! LOL!

Woodsy

Nothing to do with it...
 

You see...my larger point is this.....You're right. People are not going to come this year. But here's the news. It has nothing to do with speed limits!!!!!
Yeah, people have pride. So they will indeed say foolish things like "we skipped the boat this year. Damn speed limits! Gonna leave it sitting for the summer." or " Yeah, we don't travel much at night for dinner. It takes too long with the new speed limits." They will say these things because they have pride. What they really mean is, "money is very tight, so we are cutting back for a while".
The Speed Limit is a very nice, convient scape goat.

Honestly I am quite serious... It is not a disguise but a true discussion. whether speculative or not at this point, it is something that is of a concern. I do agree the economy overall will have much more of an impact but you can't rule out the possibility that this will end up impacting certain, not all, but certain industries around the lake. Discussing them is a topic that can and should be discussed if people want to. If you feel it has been discussed over and over again, then feel free 'not' to participate.

Since it has just started and the season has just begun it is difficult to say that it has already been discussed because people now are beginning to make their summer plans and may voice whether or not the limits are a deciding factor in their vacation plans.

If you feel the limits will have little or nothing to do with it that is your valid opinion. I don't see why it is a problem if I or others want to voice theirs. Or come on and explain what they have been hearing from family and friends.

I agree the thread can lead to the same old arguments but that is why Mr. Webmaster stepped in to make sure it stays on topic.

The other topic that has been brought up but not discussed in your previous post was enforcement. This is also going to be an important item to look at over this coming season. I also think discussing peoples views and observations (now that the economy has played a large role in cutting back on MP funding) will be important.

On a side bar I think people supporting would like no discussion to take place so that if there are issues no one hears about them.. But that is my 2 cents

Again a very good point that is speculative. You can not say that is the case for everyone. I know of many people with bigger faster boats and are not hurting what so ever $ wise, that have decided they do not need the hassel and will go elsewhere. In such a tight economy any small business owner will tell you every little bit helps.

I am sure you are right that there are people who will use it as a scape goat and pointing that out in this thread is your right. And I think others who may disagree with you deserve to be heard as well.

nothing personal.

Yes charitable organizations are pros at fund raising. They may be able to adapt. However the poker runs have been a proven successful way of raising money. My point is it is a shame that something that was so successful and brought many people to the lake may not be as successful this year due to the topic at hand.

Charitable organizations are taking a tremendous hit regardless due to the economy, I feel this just makes it even harder. Again just my own opinion.

....the weather rules!
 

Any way you can slice this thread about what drives the local lake economy.....a gallon of gasoline...speed limits...overall economy....price on scrap metal going to South Korea...ozone levels...or President Obama....toss it all into the local mix and what really rules the summer lakes region, business economy is the weekend weather, along with the mid-week weather. It is far & away, the 8000lb King Kong guerrilla around these here parts, and it's all about the weather.

Fast boat, slow boat, sailboat, canoe or a swimmer: it's got to be the weather that matters the most.


Last three summers of 2006, 2007, & 2008 were all rain & clouds & cold from May 15 - August 15. Based on the law of averages and the old adage of 'a cold winter = a hot summer', this coming summer is predicted to be a hotter and sunnier summer. :)

Three cheers for this summer's terrific boating weather!:cheers::cheers::cheers:

Yeah, they are not cheap, but if top speed is not a priority, a nice upgrade. You can get deals now and then on craigslist.

My boat model is actually faster with a small block and a B1, but I like longevity and effortless cruising RPM of the big block, and the control of the B3

Sounds like the Me Generation is upset!!:laugh:

I don't understand why 45 mph is such a problem , how fast do you need to go?

I've been on the lake at night and most of the time you can't see your hand in front of you, why would one need to be out there going fast?

I applaude those that understand and will do their part in making the Lake safer and more enjoyable for all.

Off topic but I respect your opinion.

unfortunate timing, no matter how you look at it
 

I'm a supporter of a speed limit on the Lake (maybe not exactly the bill that's in force now), and I have to say that it's really unfortunate that the speed limit has gone into effect during this severe economic downturn.

As this thread has already demonstrated, when the renewal of the bill is up for discussion, it's gonna be impossible to figure out how much of any downturn in business was due to the speed limit vs. other factors, especially the economy. The arguments will be heated on both sides, with no real factual basis...just lots of opinions, coming fast and furious.

Here's an idea...how about postponing the start of the two years of the current speed limit until the recession is over? I almost hate to suggest it, because I know that some folks will try to leverage this into killing the law altogether, but this might make sense all the way around.

Oh, and Dave...thanks for posting the listing of businesses that have supported the speed limit bill. I'll be sure to patronize them ;)

Although I disagree with your position on the limits themselves you do make a good point that it will be difficult to determine the economic downturn with the other factors going on in the world. However I have to ask even if there was no economic downturn, How could we attribute any losses directly to the limits? I am an opponent of them, but there will be no concreate evidence to be used either way. It will always be a matter of opinion.

There are certain industries geared towards faster boats i.e. poker runs, gas etc. However all boats still burn gas and all boats are welcome in poker runs so again it will be speculative to attribute any loss directly due to the limits.

These could be offset by more cruisers on the lake for example...

I am not condoning the limits at all. I think they will hurt a whole lot more then they will help, however I don't know if there will be an actual way to meter this.

My only thought is if the state would release how many go fast boats i.e. certain length, certain H.P. were registered this year opposed to past years. This again though could stem back to the overall economy one could argue.

To break it down I think that the discussion is valid and worth while because it keeps people thinking and trys to improve the lakes region the way we see fit. The only way we will be able to determine the impact will be from discussing what we have personally seen and heard. Through those observations we are free to form our own opinions and voice them come 2011.

So overall how ever you feel on the limits it is good to point out anything or anyone you have seen that has changed their plans due to them.

When this law is reconsidered for 2011 and beyond economic impact should not be a consideration. The only consideration should be whether it achieved its intended purpose of making the lake safer for small boats and others using the lake. I suspect that it won't make a big difference since the lake is already very safe but remember that NH now has an extremely Liberal legislature that thinks regulating every aspect of your lives is a good thing.

In the current economic, energy and environmental climate I personally don't understand why anyone would buy a huge, noisy, high-speed, gas-guzzling boat, especially if they know about the 45 MPH speed limit. This is as crazy as the soccer moms using their enormous Excursions and Escalades to do errands. I don't want to outlaw them, but what are these people thinking?

I beg to differ with you, any boat over 5000lbs on plane will create a wake that they could be held responsible for, and the gas mileage is horrifying. So Idling from one side to another is not reasonable. Dining by boat in the evening is just going to have to wait.

Do you promise? :laugh:

OCDACTIVE:

You don't put forth a very convincing argument that the speed limit will negatively impact the economy in a meaningful way for one simple reason, by your own admission you just purchased a go fast boat with full knowledge that there is a speed limit.......

That is true I bought a go fast boat even though there are speed limits.... However, I will not be using it at the lake near as much as I would have. I would have left her at the dock year round boosting economy at many gas pumps and with a 100 gallon tank that is a lot of $$$. Plus I would want to go to as many places on the lake as I could with this being her first year. Now I plan to keep her in my driveway so I can go out of Portsmouth and down to Naragansett Bay taking revenue I would have spent in the lakes region totally out of state which is an absolute shame in my opinion. I have dreamed my whole life of having a boat like I just bought and to run her on the place I know blind folded, but now I either can just get off plain or be looking over my shouldar all the time.

Either way the lakes region will be adversely effected as well as the state of NH because I will be leaving half the time.

I mentioned earlier that it will be very difficult to measure the actual impact and all we can do is share our plans. Well chaulk me up as money lost, for I am going elsewhere the majority of the time directly due to the limits and NOT due the overall economy for I have decided not to participate in the slowdown. :D

Not necessarily so. As has been pointed out before, many who have left the lake precisely because of the GFBL's may find the lake more enjoyable and therefore return. I myself plan to boat more, and especially on weekends. The net overall economic impact might well be quite positive in spite of your departure.

Are you going to boat more because there will be less boats in general or because you were previously afraid of the big fast boats wizzing around in all those congested area's? I am being facetious because I never saw any GFBL's being bullies while my wife isn't a big fan of congestion and boats going all directions. The two are entirely different.

You may be right and are entitled to your opinion.. There will be no way to really tell.. But I can say for certain that I am someone who would most definately be contributing to the economy of the area and now will not be. Probably 70% less then what I would have.

You will need probably two or three smaller boats to make up for that, realatively speaking. This would cause more congestion and perhaps cause more people not to go.

A few things I know about the GFB and their owners: Normally (there are always exceptions to the rule with any group) but Normally we only go fast when it is safe to do so, we normally know what the hell we are doing in a boat, and usually have to spend more to do it.

So overall I feel the economy and lake itself will suffer.

Also to clairify, those who I thought would return to the lake were canoers and kayakers.. (for the record I like to do both).. but I do not recall ever sinking 3 bills in the gas tank of one or taking family and friends to lunch at the naswa in one either..

Just making a point...


Economeys of scale.... It will take a lot more of them to make up for a few GFBs...

Again not necessarily so. (hopefully) you don't eat and drink 3 times as much as the small boater when you go out to eat. Furthermore,increased tourism in the region (and not just boating) brings money to many businesses not precisely on the shoreline of Winni. Could be a win/win for the lake's region.