Boating Question...Long Island

[sa meredith]

Any help would be greatly appreciated!!! I keep my boat (23 feet) at Paugus Bay Marina, but am visiting some friends, who are coming for Bike Weekend, at a home on Long Island, and plan on spending the night. I have nowhere to dock the boat. I called Trexlers about a possible one night slip rental, but they were less than interested. Does anyone have a suggestion???? Anything?

[TomC]

Maybe you could call Harilla and ask them the same thing. They are on the other end of LI

[Dave R]

I think you can legally anchor it on one end and tie it to shore in front of the friend's place on the other end. As long as you have persmission and the boat is tied to shore.

The statute:

270-A:2 Where Overnight Mooring Permitted. – A houseboat may be beached or grounded, or tied to the shore of any of the inland surface waters of the state for an overnight period, or any part of an overnight period, only when on or at a location owned, leased, or otherwise under the control of the owner or operator of the houseboat or by permission of the owner, lessee, or person otherwise in control of such location. An unoccupied houseboat may be anchored on the inland surface waters of the state for an overnight period, or any part of an overnight period, only in an area reasonably adjacent to a location owned, leased, or otherwise under the control of the owner or operator of the houseboat or by permission of the owner, lessee, or person otherwise in control of such location.

[sa meredith]

he is not water front. That's the problem. Can I anchor it the little cove to right, immediately after passing under the bridge??? I think there is a public launch right there.

[cowisl]

Call harilla, or leave it in center harbor....

[GWC...]

I keep my boat (23 feet) at Paugus Bay Marina, but am visiting some friends, who are coming for Bike Weekend, at a home on Long Island, and plan on spending the night. Does anyone have a suggestion???? Anything?
Try getting to your friends' home the same way you get to Paugus Bay Marina. :rolleye2: ;)

[wildwoodfam]

he is not water front. That's the problem. Can I anchor it the little cove to right, immediately after passing under the bridge??? I think there is a public launch right there.

You cannot anchor and leave your boat overnight in the cove near the public launch near the bridge, nor can you beach your boat on public beachfront, nor can you tie it up at the public dock. Trexlers will not be accomodating - they are hardly accomodating to folks who purchase boats at their establishment....let alone a one time visitor!

The guys down at Harrilla are pretty decent guys - but I am not sure of any available space they would have for an overnight slip. They are very busy on weekends, and the spaces are reserved for their customers with rack/valet service.

You may be better served simply driving to Long Island which is easy to do by car!

Sorry :rolleye1:

[Skip]

Hey, take a gamble.....all this talk about signs, why don't you just anchor the boat in the cove and put a little sign on the windshield "gone for gas, be right back!" :laugh:

[SAMIAM]

I'm with Skip.....I'd tie up in the cove.Summer crowd is not up in any great numbers and MP patrols are limited.I don't think anyone would complain.
I'd roll the dice.

[GTO]

Doesn't your friend know any neighbor there that is waterfront on the island. Ask the neighbor if you can tie up to their dock...offer them a case of beer or something.

[Islander]

I don't think telling him to break the law is the right answer. Most laws have good reasons behind them.

SAMIAM

You are wrong! I will complain. And I know where and when it will be and its length.

[Skip]

I don't think telling him to break the law is the right answer. Most laws have good reasons behind them.

SAMIAM

You are wrong! I will complain. And I know where and when it will be and its length.

Well.....no one has yet told him to "break the law" as the RSA cited specifically prohibits a "houseboat" from overnight mooring. I am still awaiting anyone to cite me the RSA or administrative rule that prohibits any and all boats (or vessels) besides a "houseboat" from overnight mooring. So, if his boat does not meet the statutory requirement of "houseboat" no law or administrative code that I have seen would indicate he would be in violation.

And remember, a "hosueboat" has a specific statutory definition, and does not encompass all vessels.

Perhaps he can be our test case? :confused:

[wildwoodfam]

and wake up in the morning to find my boat gone! Which could happen. They do check those docks frequently by boat and cruiser - and beach area especially on the weekend and they will pull the boat. The MPD are down at their town docks and beach frequently during the weekends - especially overnight. The campground being right there, and the small colony of rental cottages next to the town beach are checked on frequently and the residents on the other side of the causeway keep an eye on the waterfront over there.

Best best would be to either bargain with a neighbor for dock space or drive over to LI! - If it were my dock and my neighbor came to me to ask that favor I would think twice - because if there was even the slightest potential to have a wind kick up this weekend thereby causing a rocking at the dock - and perhaps damage :eek: to the boat - the dock owner would be liable. AND in this society where even judges in DC seem to sue frivolously - I would be cautious about a strnager using my dock.

Could be I am overanalyzing - but you cannot be too safe.

Then again - if he had a HUGE LED sign they might think he was on official business and was meant to be tied up at the town dock and leave him alone! :D

[Dave R]

NH law:

"II. ""Houseboat'' means any ship, boat, raft, float, catamaran or marine craft of any description upon or within which are located sleeping and toilet facilities, regardless of whether such facilities are of a permanent or temporary nature."

sa meredith, Skip makes a great point. If you have a porta-potti, leave it at the dock and you are good to go. "Sleeping facilities" are too easily misinterpreted, IMO, could mean a sunpad for all I know. All of the overnight mooring prohibitions plainly refer to this houseboat definition.

Oddly enough, these laws actually encourage folks to remove the toilet facilities from their boats, spend the night at anchor, and just sneak into the lake when nature calls. :rolleye1:

[Skip]

NH law:

"II. ""Houseboat'' means any ship, boat, raft, float, catamaran or marine craft of any description upon or within which are located sleeping and toilet facilities, regardless of whether such facilities are of a permanent or temporary nature."

sa meredith, Skip makes a great point. If you have a porta-potti, leave it at the dock and you are good to go. "Sleeping facilities" are too easily misinterpreted, IMO, could mean a sunpad for all I know. All of the overnight mooring prohibitions plainly refer to this houseboat definition.

Oddly enough, these laws actually encourage folks to remove the toilet facilities from their boats, spend the night at anchor, and just sneak into the lake when nature calls. :rolleye1:

Uh-oh Dave R, you've just stumbled on to a tremendous error in our boating laws!

And let's look at it another way. Say you have a 23 footer with sunpads and a porti-potti. Stretch the intent of the law and now declare this a "houseboat".

Uh-oh again!

You see, there are a number of ponds and lakes in NH that specifically ban "houseboats". One of the most famous? Why Squam Lake.

But wait, Squam lake is loaded with 20 to 23 footers that have sun pads and porti-potties or the new heads found in many a deck boat.

Then how come the MPs are not at it full throttle summonsing all these illegal "temporary" houseboats?

Because we go back to legislative intent....

By the way, one of the great myths is that there is a large force of MPs secretly cruising the waterways at night hauling away hundreds of these violators.

Of course nothing is further from the truth....but hey, we're all guilty of indulging in hyperbole here to make a point....me included! :)

Again, a challenge to Islander and Wildwood. Cite us the RSA or Administrative Rule that bans overnight anchoring for vessels other than "houseboats". :confused:


Ooops, have to go finish prepping my (temporary?) houseboat, its getting its first dip this evening...hope to see some of you proud Dads out on the Lake this Sunday! :)

[RGA645]

:laugh: I don't know why you're so worked up Skip, your tug isn't even in the water yet!!

[Skip]

:laugh: I don't know why you're so worked up Skip, your tug isn't even in the water yet!!

Don't be dissing yer Andy, she'll take it personally....and she's getting the dip tonight or first thing tomorrow morning....really late this year! But she's shining like a proof set penny right now!!! :laugh:

Heck, maybe I'll fly the rebel flag and even leave her in the water tonight! ;)

[jrc]

If you read Chapter 72-A Boat Fees, in the NH laws, you will find this section:

...
II. ""Cruiser'' means a power-driven boat intended for cruising with living accommodations, the hull designed with its sides meeting in a sharp edge at the bow and the sides meeting at a flat surface at the stern.
III. ""Houseboat'' means a barge-like boat fitted for use as a floating dwelling propelled by either inboard or outboard power.
IV. ""Inboard runabout'' means a small pleasure motorboat equipped with the motor located inside the hull, and may be propelled by a jet drive, transom drive, or through bottom drive.
...

[Skip]

If you read Chapter 72-A Boat Fees, in the NH laws, you will find this section:

...
II. ""Cruiser'' means a power-driven boat intended for cruising with living accommodations, the hull designed with its sides meeting in a sharp edge at the bow and the sides meeting at a flat surface at the stern.
III. ""Houseboat'' means a barge-like boat fitted for use as a floating dwelling propelled by either inboard or outboard power.
IV. ""Inboard runabout'' means a small pleasure motorboat equipped with the motor located inside the hull, and may be propelled by a jet drive, transom drive, or through bottom drive.
...

Excellent find JRC!

And now we get to the original intent of the legislation, to prevent someone with a "houseboat" from launching and virtually living afloat. However, all other vessels haven fallen through the crack....as there is (that I can find or have someone find for me) no general legislation or rule preventing overnight mooring for all vessels.

By the way, if it were illegal to moor for part of or all the overnight hours, then is it therefore illegal for a person fishing at night to anchor while he is fishing for any part of the night???? :confused:

Ah, the mystery deepens! ;)

[Gavia immer]

he is not water front. That's the problem.
Ask for permission to tie up to his property anyway.

How much anchor line do you have? ;)

[Don]

Hey, take a gamble.....all this talk about signs, why don't you just anchor the boat in the cove and put a little sign on the windshield "gone for gas, be right back!" :laugh:Since I know that the MP reads this forum it might not be a very good gamble Skip...:rolleye1:

[Skip]

Since I know that the MP reads this forum it might not be a very good gamble Skip...:rolleye1:

Good point Don, but of course the statement was made with tongue firmly placed in cheek, as denoted by the trailing smiley face.

However, if the Marine Patrol is indeed reading this thread then I also offer the challenge to them, please enlighten all of us boaters out here to the RSA or Administrative Rule thsat prohibits "all vessels", not just "houseboats", from overnight mooring!

I have e-mailed this request in the past to them and personally queried an MP Officer and have yet to receive an answer.

Maybe I'll get lucky this time.....:D

[Bear Islander]

Skip

SB 129 from 1993 "This bill expands the chapter on use of houseboats to include the overnight use of all vessels."

It could be that the common belief that "you can't anchor overnight" comes from this bill. However I can't find that it ever was enacted.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/legislation/1994/SB0129.html

[Skip]

Skip

SB 129 from 1993 "This bill expands the chapter on use of houseboats to include the overnight use of all vessels."

It could be that the common belief that "you can't anchor overnight" comes from this bill. However I can't find that it ever was enacted.

http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/legislation/1994/SB0129.html

Hello BI,

You are absolutely correct, there was an attempt by the Senate back in 93 to close this loophole. It did make it out of the Senate with ammendments but died in House Committee 16-0 (RES, REC & DEV) late in 93 after being determined ITL or "inexpedient to legislate".

This is not the first or only time we can find problems like this within the State. Remember a few years ago when Safety dropped the ball and let a number of Administrative Rules expire prematurely? There is also a myriad of issues with some of the RSAs & Rules regarding OHRVs & ATVs.

Sadly these problems are well known in Concord but there is apparently little desire to roll up sleeves and correct these errors! It is easier just to let things remain the same and if someone does challenge a summons, the case is quietly nol prossed....while the masses just pay their tickets and move on. :(

As a sidebar, my personal opinon in that this RSA should be ammended as proposed back in 1993. It is in the best interest of the health of the lake & its residents that overnight anchoring or houseboat usage should be fairly regulated.

[Bear Islander]

The Marine Patrol sometimes takes liberties. If you read the Administrative Rule below you find the Bear Island NWZ should extend 150' north and south of the Mail Dock. The buoys however are at least 300' south and 800' north of that dock. An area at least 6 times greater than authorized.

I don't complain because I agree with the placement. If the NWZ was as small as specified, boats could just go around it.

"(ap) The area 150 feet north of the Bear Island mail dock to 150 feet south of the mail dock in the channel between the Bear Island Post Office and Pine Island shall be a "no wake" area."

[wildwoodfam]

We never go up on Biker Weekend - so I didn't have an opportunity to check out whether there was a mystery boat "anchored" off shore by the LI bridge. I hope you'll let us know how things worked out for you - it will certainly set a precedent.

[sa meredith]

Holy cow......my intention was not to start a huge debate (or certainly any trouble) but if anyone is interested in how it turned out, I am happy to let you know:
First of all, to the sarcastic person who asked why I don't simply get to LI the same way I get to Paugus Bay Marina, that is EXACTLY what I had to settle for. I have a seasonal home in Meredith, and simply use Meredith Center Road to get to the Marina. It's a staight shot, no turns, past Laconia Country Club, and empties right into the driveway of the Marina. Now, I assume you are familiar with the traffic on Bike Weekend. I knew I would be out on the water in the morning anyway. Why would I want to go back, and then make a drive by car, that nomally takes 35/40 minutes, knowing full well it would be 1/1.5 hours?
The way things played out kinda sucked. At 3:30, I hooked up with the friends, who were on bikes, at the Meredith Town Docks. After a bit, I decided, as they went on their way to the Weirs, to drive the boat over to Long Island, and take a shot things would work themselves out. Big waste of gas and time. Another shot with Trexlers failed terribly (I think they actually laughed a me). I thought long and hard about anchoring right by the pubic launch, and came very close. Actually started to cover the boat, but thought better of it. And finally cruised a bit, hoping to find some water front homeowners, sitting on their dock, thinking I would ask if, for a fee of $50, I could tie up for the night. I decided against that idea very quickly, thinking it was very "tacky" . (Also, possibly, an invasion of privacy). So, long drive back to Paugus Bay Marina, and then a drive from 6:40 to a bit after 8 to the LI bridge. Not a great story, but that's waht happened.
Thanks to anyone who offered me a solution.

[hazelnut]

A couple of years ago I wanted to tie up at Silver Sands to go to a concert at Meadowbrook. We are over on Cow Island. It was a NO GO from Silver Sands. It would be nice to be able to pay a fee for parking at Marina's. I had to make other arrangements and things worked out but I was bummed. It would be nice if Meadowbrook had some sort of agreement with a marina over there. Anyway, you probably did the wise thing but you might have actually gotten away with it. Kind of a risk though, I think I would have done what you did in the end.

[Islander]

The Marinas already have more slips than current regulations allow. They depend on the fact that their slips are grandfathered. This means no way can they ever add even one slip.

They have decided they can make more money by renting them by the season. Many Marinas will only rent you a slip if you buy your boat and get your gas, winter storage and service from them.

So when someone wants a temporary slip there is no room.

[wildwoodfam]

Sorry you ended up doing the back and forth. In the end you were probably safe doing that - any number of issues could have come up, none the least could have been the disappearance of the boat had you anchored and left it alone near the launch!! Easy pickin's there!! I had some toys taken out of my boat there when I had docked it to run across to the porta-potties a couple summers ago!

Anyway - hour and 20 from Meredith to LI - WOW!! :eek: OUCH! Now you see why we never come up on Biker weekend!;)

[sa meredith]

I understand about limited slips and so forth. I am very happy with the valet service at Paugus Bay Marina, and they are great guys, always taking time to answer my foolish questions. At 40 years old, I am only two years into this boating thing, so I often feel foolish...and they always lend a hand,so I would never consider another place. I was just thinking another Marina would have somewhere, ANYWHERE, to put a boat for ONE night.
Enough on this subject...
Is there enough pollen on the lake???? Holy crap!

[hazelnut]

One last post here Sa Meredith. I fully understand your point. I mean most Marinas have service spots for their boats, pick-up drop off etc. I do not think it is too much to ask for one night on a special circumstance. Not that they would advertise it or anything. I mean it seems completely impossible to think that they wouldn't have one little spot that you might tie up to. Anyway, POLLEN, awwww darn I thought that I'd miss that... I'll be up this weekend.