A lighthouse on the Witches?

[Bizer]

Bizer receives all sorts of inquiries. We try and answer them all. My favorite was a phone call I received about 10 years ago, "I'm driving north on I-93 and I'm calling you from my cell phone. What exit do I get off at to get to Laconia?"

But, I digress ...

Today, Bizer received an email which asked, "Hi - It would be extremely helpful to know the approximate dimensions of the Witches on Lake Winnipesaukee for a lighthouse proposal." Answer: about 2100 ft long and 650 feet wide. Anyone heard of any plan to put a lighthouse on the Witches?

[Biggd]

Bizer receives all sorts of inquiries. We try and answer them all. My favorite was a phone call I received about 10 years ago, "I'm driving north on I-93 and I'm calling you from my cell phone. What exit do I get off at to get to Laconia?"

But, I digress ...

Today, Bizer received an email which asked, "Hi - It would be extremely helpful to know the approximate dimensions of the Witches on Lake Winnipesaukee for a lighthouse proposal." Answer: about 2100 ft long and 650 feet wide. Anyone heard of any plan to put a lighthouse on the Witches?I think it's a great idea but who would pay for it? That's the bigger question.

[webmaster]

I think it's a great idea but who would pay for it? That's the bigger question.Back in 2001 I suggested (in jest) that this site would sponsor it.

Here's the thread from our old forum:

https://www.winnipesaukeeforum.com/archive1.cgi?read=22396

[Rich]

I think it's a great idea but who would pay for it? That's the bigger question.

I bet a "go fund me" type of collection would work. Just propose it here, and in the several Facebook groups. Also I'm sure that WMUR would run with a story about it.

[The Real BigGuy]

I can’t believe anyone would seriously consider this. The area is well marked by spars. At night use a map & compass or a GPS. If your uncomfortable at night stay away from the area or don’t go out. Another sissification of our society!


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[AC2717]

While I agree with the Big Guy

i also think those spars should be lighted and flash to show the channel through the middle and around it

[Pricestavern]

I actually like the idea of a lighthouse on the Witches. Doesn't have to be extravagant, just utilitarian. Might save a prop or two and possibly a life.

[Biggd]

I actually like the idea of a lighthouse on the Witches. Doesn't have to be extravagant, just utilitarian. Might save a prop or two and possibly a life.I agree! I don't see any downside other than cost.

[The Real BigGuy]

Ok, blinking spars I can go with. A light house is a little over the top.


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[Biggd]

Ok, blinking spars I can go with. A light house is a little over the top.


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=92687)I don't think a light house like you see on the ocean shore would be appropriate but some kind of bright blinking warning light for the deaf, dumb, and blind would be useful and cost efficient. :D

[Descant]

Ok, blinking spars I can go with. A light house is a little over the top.

There are already three flashers in the area. Used to be only two (27 & 28) #71 was added "recently". I think #71 could add to the confusion. If you only see only one flasher, is #71 or #28? If you see 71 and think you're looking at 28, you could go on the wrong side.

Maybe CG Surplus bell buoys, tuned to sound like wind chimes, and, of course, lighted?

[kawishiwi]

Bizer receives all sorts of inquiries. We try and answer them all. My favorite was a phone call I received about 10 years ago, "I'm driving north on I-93 and I'm calling you from my cell phone. What exit do I get off at to get to Laconia?"

But, I digress ...

Today, Bizer received an email which asked, "Hi - It would be extremely helpful to know the approximate dimensions of the Witches on Lake Winnipesaukee for a lighthouse proposal." Answer: about 2100 ft long and 650 feet wide. Anyone heard of any plan to put a lighthouse on the Witches?

This sounds like a high school, end of the semester, project.

[tis]

Good luck. I am sure first you would have to get approval. The way government works it would probably take what, 5 years? And then, everybody would want lighthouses out on the lake. I have a feeling this idea is dead in the water. It would be kind of neat though. I like lighthouses.

[The Real BigGuy]

Ok, for those who think it’s a good idea, where do yo put it on a 2100 ft x 650 ft shoal? Is one enough? Do you need 2 or 3? How about a keepers cottage? Better yet, let’s be like the Chinese and fill the shoal to create a new island the we don’t need any additional lights at all.

For those unsure, yes I am being sarcastic. (and maybe trying to stir the pot)


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[Descant]

Ok, for those who think it’s a good idea, where do yo put it on a 2100 ft x 650 ft shoal? Is one enough? Do you need 2 or 3? How about a keepers cottage? Better yet, let’s be like the Chinese and fill the shoal to create a new island the we don’t need any additional lights at all.

For those unsure, yes I am being sarcastic. (and maybe trying to stir the pot)
[/url]
On April 1, 1998, the Laconia Citizen reported the sinking of Four Mile Island. Perhaps this could be a replacement? We could call it "The Mysterious Island" (sorry, Jules Verne) since it would be uncharted.

[Biggd]

Ok, for those who think it’s a good idea, where do yo put it on a 2100 ft x 650 ft shoal? Is one enough? Do you need 2 or 3? How about a keepers cottage? Better yet, let’s be like the Chinese and fill the shoal to create a new island the we don’t need any additional lights at all.

For those unsure, yes I am being sarcastic. (and maybe trying to stir the pot)


Sent from my iPhone using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=92687)Maybe the state should just sell it, let some mega rich owner build a McMansion on it and require them to keep the lights on. Just think of the tax revenue! :D

[Patofnaud]

Mount small blinking lights to all sea gulls. Then just dodge the 30 gulls standing on the rocks. :)

[gravy boat]

Build a wall. :D

[upthesaukee]

Build a wall. :D

Make Gilford pay for it! :D

Dave

[tis]

Make Gilford pay for it! :D

Dave


:laugh::laugh::laugh: Anybody but us!!

[jbolty]

Ok, for those who think it’s a good idea, where do yo put it on a 2100 ft x 650 ft shoal? Is one enough? Do you need 2 or 3? How about a keepers cottage? Better yet, let’s be like the Chinese and fill the shoal to create a new island the we don’t need any additional lights at all.

For those unsure, yes I am being sarcastic. (and maybe trying to stir the pot)


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why not build a casino on it?

[brk-lnt]

The most logical thing would be to just dredge the area and remove the hazard entirely. A barge and a few sticks of dynamite would take of it the same way other unwanted granite deposits in the state are removed.

[joey2665]

Waste of money. Leave it as it is, maybe just add a few more lighted spars at minimal cost. How many serious incidents have there been in the last 5 years at the witches?

[Superduty1]

Perfect spot for The Dive, with room to expand.

[Descant]

Waste of money. Leave it as it is, maybe just add a few more lighted spars at minimal cost. How many serious incidents have there been in the last 5 years at the witches?

Are you serious??

I don't think anybody else on this thread is.

BTW, other lighthouses on Winnipesaukee were privately funded. Of course they are on private property where you are quite welcome to spend money anyway you want. You'd have to negotiate a 99 year lease for the Witches and then negotiate with Shore Things to build. I expect she'd enjoy the challenge. Can't be much trickier than building on Wilcomb (sp?) Island.

[jetlag100]

How about solar lights...put them on some poles that would be installed like a light post and put them around the witches....it would look awesome and serve a purpose:D

[Bizer]

Personally, I think they should put a daymark at/near the northernmost and southernmost rock of the Witches. Use a telephone pole (to handle the winter ice) and put solar-powered lights on top. I feel daymarks are good navigational aids because they are easy to see and they do not drift out of position.

Here's what they look like.
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark5.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark6.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark1.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark3.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark4.jpg

If anyone put something this conspicuous on their shorefront property, Bizer would probably put it on the map as a navigational aid.

[Descant]

Bizer's Daymarks? Can't tell if this is serious or not. The one with the boat wrapped around it makes me think "An expensive solution to a non-problem" not preventing accidents, just protecting indestructible rocks from damage.

[Onshore]

Are you serious??

I don't think anybody else on this thread is.

BTW, other lighthouses on Winnipesaukee were privately funded. Of course they are on private property where you are quite welcome to spend money anyway you want. You'd have to negotiate a 99 year lease for the Witches and then negotiate with Shore Things to build. I expect she'd enjoy the challenge. Can't be much trickier than building on Wilcomb (sp?) Island.

We've already met. As we explained to them in the meeting we, NHDES, are not the biggest challenge here. The biggest underlying problem here is that NHDES lacks the authority to approve a project that that takes public land and transfers it to a private holding. That authority rests with the Governor and Executive Council. They need to figure out who is going to take ownership of this and be responsible for maintaining it. Once they figure that out they can move forward in pursuing the construction and potential land transfer.

[GusMan]

Hi All,

Interestingly... there are several lighthouses on Lake Sunapee at least one of which I believe marks a hazardous reef/navigation area (I'd have to dig out my chart to see for sure). It's my understanding that they are quite popular with the tourists for photo ops etc.

I have no idea who owns them... but kinda neat nonetheless..

Hell... the cottage on Becky's Garden is a huge draw.... why not the Witches? (mostly busting chops!)….

Cheers..

Gusman

[Descant]

Waste of money. Leave it as it is, maybe just add a few more lighted spars at minimal cost. How many serious incidents have there been in the last 5 years at the witches?

Hmmm. Same as Middle Ground Shoals, I bet. I know the lake is a lot busier than it used to be, but there are times when I believe it was better when the Public Utilities Commission was in charge instead of Safety and DES. Like many other things, when people start asking their legislators to pass a law, the long term result is not always the intended outcome. And you get Department Commissioners who tell staff to "put a buoy there" (because my friend doesn't want so many boats coming so close?). Now, we have a logical MP who removes unnecessary buoys because there really is no hazard. Good job, MP. DES says there are certain classes of docks that present no environmental impact, but they don't want to stop regulating them. The Legislative dock study commission couldn't meet because they couldn't get a quorum. Are they really interested? Time to figure out that we just don't need more regulation. Just let MP do their law enforcement job, and read your own chart to avoid prop damage. Here endeth the rant.

[jeffk]

This is what we need. We could just build a little platform for him to "perform" on. :D

[ApS]

Bizer's Daymarks? Can't tell if this is serious or not.

The one with the boat wrapped around it makes me think "An expensive solution to a non-problem" not preventing accidents, just protecting indestructible rocks from damage.
You're thinking of this Daymarker? :rolleye2:

http://survivingdating.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/crashedboat.jpg

[Onshore]

From Joey 2665; Waste of money. Leave it as it is, maybe just add a few more lighted spars at minimal cost. How many serious incidents have there been in the last 5 years at the witches?

Hmmm. Same as Middle Ground Shoals,I bet. I know the lake is a lot busier than it used to be, but there are times when I believe it was better when the Public Utilities Commission was in charge instead of Safety and DES. Like many other things, when people start asking their legislators to pass a law, the long term result is not always the intended outcome. And you get Department Commissioners who tell staff to "put a buoy there" (because my friend doesn't want so many boats coming so close?). Now, we have a logical MP who removes unnecessary buoys because there really is no hazard. Good job, MP. DES says there are certain classes of docks that present no environmental impact, but they don't want to stop regulating them. The Legislative dock study commission couldn't meet because they couldn't get a quorum. Are they really interested? Time to figure out that we just don't need more regulation. Just let MP do their law enforcement job, and read your own chart to avoid prop damage. Here endeth the rant.

I believe the next committee meeting is scheduled for January 11th at the Legislative Office Building in Concord at 10:00 a.m. You should come. The meetings are open to the public. You can verify the schedule by keeping an eye on the House calendar which is posted weekly here: http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/house/caljourns/default.htm

They list it by its long title, Commission To Study The Effectiveness Of The Current Statutes Related To Management Of Non-Tidal Public Waterways And The Construction Or Placement Of Structures Within Them.

[steve-on-mark]

Personally, I think they should put a daymark at/near the northernmost and southernmost rock of the Witches. Use a telephone pole (to handle the winter ice) and put solar-powered lights on top. I feel daymarks are good navigational aids because they are easy to see and they do not drift out of position.

Here's what they look like.
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark5.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark6.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark1.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark3.jpg
www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark4.jpg

If anyone put something this conspicuous on their shorefront property, Bizer would probably put it on the map as a navigational aid.I think he should include the green rope lighting on the east side of mink...best navigational aid coming out of Smith cove![emoji6]


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[BoatHouse]

www.bizer.com/lwother/daymark1.jpg


Is it No Wake or 5MPH?

[brk-lnt]

Is it No Wake or 5MPH?



Yes, it is.

[Descant]

Yes, it is.
Wrong thread. The Witches is not a NWZ. LOL.

[MAXUM]

It's a "NO GO" zone for most captains. ;)

[RumGuy]

You will notice that the daymarker did it's job, and prevented the boat from entering what might have been a bad area.

[Kamper]

Speaking of DayMarks, this might help in a few spots...

[Onshore]

I believe the next committee meeting is scheduled for January 11th at the Legislative Office Building in Concord at 10:00 a.m. You should come. The meetings are open to the public. You can verify the schedule by keeping an eye on the House calendar which is posted weekly here: http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/house/caljourns/default.htm

They list it by its long title, Commission To Study The Effectiveness Of The Current Statutes Related To Management Of Non-Tidal Public Waterways And The Construction Or Placement Of Structures Within Them.

The Commission's meeting scheduled for the 11th is being postponed for a week or two in order to allow the new interim chair to confirm that vacant seat on the Commission are being filled so that there will be a quorum. Please refer to the House calendar at the link provided for the rescheduled time. It is anticipated to only be a 2 week delay at most.

[Descant]

Thanks for keeping us posted, Shore Things.
Two related bills have been filed. One to adjust membership and establish a quorum of 7. The second one will extend the report deadline from November 2019 to November 2020. That likely means any recommended changes will come as legislation in 2021, pass in June 2021 to be effective January 2022.

HB 219 relative to membership on the Structures on Non-tidal Public Waterways Commission.
HB 228 extending the commission to study the current statutes related to management of non-tidal public waterways and the construction or placement of structures within them.

[Kerk]

My first experience was WatereSkiing through rthe Witches and loosing one of the wood fins on my wood Water Skis which I still own. It was a scary experience! Went to Goodhue & Hawkins & after a little educatuion I bought my first Chart. This is now the STATE Location of theMarine Patrol ! still Boat on Winni. As a owner of Island proprety since 81 after renting before that. Lots of fond memorys. kerk

[Descant]

My first experience was WatereSkiing through rthe Witches and loosing one of the wood fins on my wood Water Skis which I still own. It was a scary experience! Went to Goodhue & Hawkins & after a little educatuion I bought my first Chart. This is now the STATE Location of theMarine Patrol ! still Boat on Winni. As a owner of Island proprety since 81 after renting before that. Lots of fond memorys. kerk

I'm amazed that you damaged your skis, but not the boat. Yes, scary.
BTW, Goodhue and Hawkins Navy Yard is in Wolfeboro, still in business. Sounds like you bought your chart at Goodhue Boat Yard in Glendale, now the site of MP headquarters.

[tis]

You guys weren't serious about a lighthouse on the Witches were you? Or were you???? I thought it was tongue in cheek.

[Onshore]

Thanks for keeping us posted, Shore Things.
Two related bills have been filed. One to adjust membership and establish a quorum of 7. The second one will extend the report deadline from November 2019 to November 2020. That likely means any recommended changes will come as legislation in 2021, pass in June 2021 to be effective January 2022.

HB 219 relative to membership on the Structures on Non-tidal Public Waterways Commission.
HB 228 extending the commission to study the current statutes related to management of non-tidal public waterways and the construction or placement of structures within them.

The Commission can make recommendations on legislation at anytime; they don't have to wait until their final report is out. There is already an LSR (19-0768) in relative to creating a dock registration process. I fully expect them to be reviewing it and commenting on it. They could vote to ask the appropriate legislative committees to push it forward this year, recommend changes, or ask for it to be tabled for review. We'll have to see what happens but what ever it is the Commission's effect will start to be felt this session.

[Onshore]

You guys weren't serious about a lighthouse on the Witches were you? Or were you???? I thought it was tongue in cheek.

The group putting this idea forward is quite serious.

[RAY WHALER]

Thanks


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[Poor Richard]

The group putting this idea forward is quite serious.

How Massachusetts of them.

[Descant]

The Commission can make recommendations on legislation at anytime; they don't have to wait until their final report is out. There is already an LSR (19-0768) in relative to creating a dock registration process. I fully expect them to be reviewing it and commenting on it. They could vote to ask the appropriate legislative committees to push it forward this year, recommend changes, or ask for it to be tabled for review. We'll have to see what happens but what ever it is the Commission's effect will start to be felt this session.

The deadline for signing off on LSRs/Bills was January 4th. Nobody rose, as far as I can see, to sponsor LSR 768 as a bill, so it is dead. Could come up as an amendment to something else, but unlikely. I stand by my estimate that nothing will happen soon.

[LIforrelaxin]

How Massachusetts of them.

Are you sure they are from Massachusetts? Sometimes I get tired of people jumping to this conclusion....

Now having said that... I will absolutely laugh if we start seeing lighthouses on the lake in area's like the Witches... Because once that happens, I see one on Middle ground shoal.... The Graveyard... etc.....

With the charts and electronics available to aide in navigation... people are just not paying attention when they wander into these area's....

[Poor Richard]

Are you sure they are from Massachusetts? Sometimes I get tired of people jumping to this conclusion....

Lighten up. It was a joke.

[Top-Water]

Back in 2001 I suggested (in jest) that this site would sponsor it.

Why not ask the Margate to give back the one that was at the "White Owl Cabins" It would certainly help keep the cost down. I don't think they are using it at the Margate any more. While I'm certainly not sure they are the same exact light house...... I'd have a hard time believing they are not especially when it was essentially right across the street at one time.

https://i.imgur.com/JEBJN7O.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/FFH2BOf.jpg

Reference White Owl Cabins Thread
https://www.winnipesaukee.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7283&highlight=White+cabins

[Onshore]

The deadline for signing off on LSRs/Bills was January 4th. Nobody rose, as far as I can see, to sponsor LSR 768 as a bill, so it is dead. Could come up as an amendment to something else, but unlikely. I stand by my estimate that nothing will happen soon.

LSR 768 is now HB 645-FN
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/lsr_search/billText.aspx?id=821&type=4

[MD88Pilot]

Mount small blinking lights to all sea gulls. Then just dodge the 30 gulls standing on the rocks. :)

Some way some how, someone will still hit it.

[Descant]

I want to guess that there are more bent props between Little Island and Big Island, or between Chase and Farm Island than there are on the Witches. Some people just deserve the bent prop award and nothing anybody does will prevent them from getting that trophy. And they will claim to their death that the buoy wasn't in the right place.

[Sandyisl]

Brand new to the forum but certainly not the lake. I hate to be negative but in my opinion i think a good start is bizer making a proper chart. Not a placemat.

[TiltonBB]

Brand new to the forum but certainly not the lake. I hate to be negative but in my opinion i think a good start is bizer making a proper chart. Not a placemat.

Not sure what your post means. Bizer does make regular charts that are available through this website as well as many other places.

[Descant]

Sandyisl, Welcome to the Forum. I'm not sure either what your post means, but the Bizer chart is available in many formats, paper, laminated, digital, etc. Many other publishers have, over the years, published in a variety of formats as well. Some of the posters here look askance at new posters who are only negative, so please be aware. We all try to be friendly with only a few trolls.

[upthesaukee]

Not sure what your post means. Bizer does make regular charts that are available through this website as well as many other places.

If you go to Olde Bay Dinner in Alton Bay, the tables have charts over the surface of the table, and have for years. These are NOT special charts made as placemats, they are actual Bizer charts. Makes for interesting conversation.

Dave

[tis]

I keep asking but nobody ever answers. Does Duncan still make charts? (Maybe nobody knows.)

[webmaster]

Does Duncan still make charts? (Maybe nobody knows.)I think most of us aren't sure. The Duncan Press website is down and I don't have any other information. If I hear anything I'll post it here.

[tis]

I think most of us aren't sure. The Duncan Press website is down and I don't have any other information. If I hear anything I'll post it here.

Thank you so much for the reply! I have been curious about what happened to them and also looked on the website and found nothing. You would think they would say something on there. Maybe they only print them every few years?

[Descant]

10:15 am Jan.24 2019
I Googled: "Duncan Lake Winnipesaukee Chart" That took me to a page that offers several Duncan chart-like products. Clicked on one and it took me to a product page, described the product and offered to 'add it to my cart'. I didn't want it so I left the store.
There are a few entries that announce August 1, 2018, Duncan "officially approved' their new chart. Those also indicatew that online is their only store. If you click on these, the response is access denied.
to this page. I like to Google before I ask on this or other forums, and I appreciate that the Webmaster often does this for us. Thank you.

[tis]

10:15 am Jan.24 2019
I Googled: "Duncan Lake Winnipesaukee Chart" That took me to a page that offers several Duncan chart-like products. Clicked on one and it took me to a product page, described the product and offered to 'add it to my cart'. I didn't want it so I left the store.
There are a few entries that announce August 1, 2018, Duncan "officially approved' their new chart. Those also indicatew that online is their only store. If you click on these, the response is access denied.
to this page. I like to Google before I ask on this or other forums, and I appreciate that the Webmaster often does this for us. Thank you.

I have googled it a few time in the past couple years too because I wondered what happened to them. I felt I didn't get a real answer either, that is why I asked. I know somebody that actually tried to order one on line and they weren't able to get one. That was a year ago or so.

[upthesaukee]

I have googled it a few time in the past couple years too because I wondered what happened to them. I felt I didn't get a real answer either, that is why I asked. I know somebody that actually tried to order one on line and they weren't able to get one. That was a year ago or so.

I sent on nh.gov and the are no reports since around 2003-4 for Duncan Press Inc. Sally Fichett is the agent with a mail address in Center Harbor and business address in AZ.

Interesting that it is so hard to get to their website.

Dave

[tis]

I sent on nh.gov and the are no reports since around 2003-4 for Duncan Press Inc. Sally Fichett is the agent with a mail address in Center Harbor and business address in AZ.

Interesting that it is so hard to get to their website.

Dave

So maybe they are not even doing business any more?! It IS interesting, isn't it? I am getting a warning now that it's not a safe site. I think they were around before Bizer weren't they?

[Descant]

I have at my desk a PUC chart published in 1962. Blue water and beige land. For awhile, I recall a white water/green land chart being available, in the 60's, I think simultaneously with the PUC chart published and distributed by the Capital Offset Company. I don't know if that green/white one was Duncan or if there was another publisher that was taken over by Duncan. I still have one on the boat, but I use it for guests to follow along, not really for up to date navigation. For navigation, I don't think there's any question Bizer is the most accurate and up to date.
As a matter of interest, there were only 59 flashers in 1962 and it lists several headway speed locations, including 10 mph between Varney and Kenison Islands, 12 mph between Loon and Meredith Neck and 12 mph south of the "marine bandstand" in Alton Bay.
To return to discussion of the Witches and a lighthouse, in 1962, only two flashers marked "Witch Rocks", #27 to the south and #28 next to Timber Island.

[hilltopper]

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news/local/meeting-to-discuss-lighthouse-at-the-witches/article_2843973e-bea1-11e9-84dc-936886ed0ccc.html

[Biggd]

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news/local/meeting-to-discuss-lighthouse-at-the-witches/article_2843973e-bea1-11e9-84dc-936886ed0ccc.htmlThey must be reading the forum. :emb:

[tis]

They must be reading the forum. :emb:
I thought that too Bigg.

[codeman671]

I've been watching it unfold on Facebook. I have been hoping this was just satire as I am having a hard time believing that anyone would actually support this....

[Descant]

They're serving fruitcake and Kool-Ade for refreshments. The papers will report it as "heavily supported by the attendees" because serious boaters won't show up. Maybe some abutters will show up to prevent the light flashing in their living room every 6 seconds?

[Barney Bear]

Perhaps it could be built in the shape of a huge witch hat. 🐻

[ishoot308]

Dumb, dumb, dumb!

I cannot believe the state is even considering this dumbass idea!

Dan

[Hillcountry]

Dumb, dumb, dumb!

I cannot believe the state is even considering this dumbass idea!

Dan

I agree! Stay out of The Witches! If you don't know the hazard by now, you never will!

[Weekend Pundit]

I for one will attend the public hearing in Gilford on the 26th. I will voice my opinion that more lighted buoys would be a more cost effective means of warning off boaters from The Witches.

A lighthouse sounds cool, maybe even a bit of a tourist attraction, but to mark The Graveyard Of Lower Units And Props, maybe not.

[Descant]

Although there really aren't, to my knowledge, many accidents on the Witches, I bet the predominant number occur during the day.

[ishoot308]

Although there really aren't, to my knowledge, many accidents on the Witches, I bet the predominant number occur during the day.

I honestly think middle ground shoals is way more dangerous than the witches since it occurs in the broads and kinda comes out of nowhere. Though neither should be intimidating to any boater with a map!

Dan

[JADAQ]

They could call it “Flatlander light”

[kawishiwi]

Now thats a PERFECT use for the dive!
Additional navigational aid AND a burger & a beer if you chop rock with your prop.

[Top-Water]

I honestly think middle ground shoals is way more dangerous than the witches since it occurs in the broads and kinda comes out of nowhere. Though neither should be intimidating to any boater with a map!

Dan

:) I agree, up close inside a bass boat reveals a lot of refrigerator sized boulders. A lot of very big stuff submerged there that could do a world of hurt on your hull or engine prop. As mentioned it "kinda comes out of nowhere".

[thinkxingu]

In six summers, I've not heard of Middle Ground Shoals--where is it?I honestly think middle ground shoals is way more dangerous than the witches since it occurs in the broads and kinda comes out of nowhere. Though neither should be intimidating to any boater with a map!

Dan

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[Wifi-1]

In six summers, I've not heard of Middle Ground Shoals--where is it?

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Believe it is south of Cow and west of Swetts Pt, in T'boro

[Seaplane Pilot]

Yes, South of Cow - near passage between Cow and Tuftonboro Neck.

[thinkxingu]

Yes, South of Cow - near passage between Cow and Tuftonboro Neck.What map is that? It looks gross, but is it a more technical chart?

Here it is! I never knew it had a name--on my GPS it's just marked as it's a venomous snake or Danger! Will Robinson with a ton of markers.15208

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[Seaplane Pilot]

What map is that? It looks gross, but is it a more technical chart?

Here it is! I never knew it had a name--on my GPS it's just marked as it's a venomous snake or Danger! Will Robinson with a ton of markers.15208

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It’s the Navionics Boating App for iPhone.

[BroadHopper]

I don't think a light house like you see on the ocean shore would be appropriate but some kind of bright blinking warning light for the deaf, dumb, and blind would be useful and cost efficient. :D

Please don't associate deaf and blind with dumb. Physical loss and mental loss don't mix! You sound like the feds!

I do believe The Witches test the Darwin theory remarkably but I think money is better spent providing flashers to begin channels such as The Graveyard!

[Biggd]

Please don't associate deaf and blind with dumb. Physical loss and mental loss don't mix! You sound like the feds!

I do believe The Witches test the Darwin theory remarkably but I think money is better spent providing flashers to begin channels such as The Graveyard!Really?
I was sarcastically referring to myself, hence the smiley face at the end?

[Garcia]

Does anyone know how often boaters run into trouble in any of the areas mentioned in this thread? I’m all for safety, but am not aware of lots of issues that would be solved by a lighthouse or lights.

[marcucci]

What map is that? It looks gross, but is it a more technical chart?

Here it is! I never knew it had a name--on my GPS it's just marked as it's a venomous snake or Danger! Will Robinson with a ton of markers.15208

Sent from my SM-G950U using Winnipesaukee Forum mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=92687)@thinkxingu Wow, knowing you and knowing where we are on the lake I was going to be super surprised if you didn't know this. It's like the mini-witches over this side of the lake. Glad you did know about it, just not its name!

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[thinkxingu]

@thinkxingu Wow, knowing you and knowing where we are on the lake I was going to be super surprised if you didn't know this. It's like the mini-witches over this side of the lake. Glad you did know about it, just not its name!

Sent from my SM-T350 using TapatalkFrom where we're coming from, we never go close to there--it's either along the shore from/towards the Barber Pole or on the other side by Ragged/Hole/Sandy.

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[kawishiwi]

Huh, I've spent a little time fishing around Middle Ground and never saw a threat to my little outboard. Shallow enough to see bottom but didnt see anything less than 5 ft deep. Did I miss the prop threats out there?

[Descant]

I agree with an earlier post that a lighthouse on the Witches is not a clever move. Thinking about it just a little, to put a lighthouse or some structure in the middle would likely require barge access. I don't think a sizable barge could get near the middle. Of course, it would attract know nothings, just like the chart marking "Loon Nesting Area" and the tourists saying "Let's go there and see the loons" when the intent is for you to stay away. The Witches and the Graveyard don't have lots of mishaps-look at the list of wrecks-- they just have scary names.

[Descant]

To me, a lighthouse is just not a serious proposal, for financial reasons if nothing else. However to be financially practical, I suggest the following:
the State of NH can lease rights to a commercial operation, (say, Bizer, who started this thread). We already lease antenna space on the top of Mount Washington. The commercial operator could install a motion detector or other electronic device that would trigger a warning on your cell phone (using the "operator's" app and your paid subscription) when you approach too close to the Witches. You pay a subscription fee to the operator, with the cost based on how many hazards you want to be warned away from.

I know some will scoff, but 15 years ago who had GPS/maps on their phone? How many of us will have driverless cars in the next 5 years? We already have waypoints and autopilot integrated with GPS. What's next? BTW, USCG is decommissioning lighthouses and lightships as an unnecessary thing of the past. Maybe we could buy the "Nantucket" or "Ambrose" and anchor it on Middle Ground Shoals? Spend the night, $250.00, payable to the already existing Navigation Safety Fund.

[JEEPONLY]

Please don't associate deaf and blind with dumb. Physical loss and mental loss don't mix! You sound like the feds!

It has always been my understanding that "dumb", in this context, means unable to speak. If this is correct, it is somewhat natural to include the term with the mention of deaf and blind.

[Redbarn]

Please don't associate deaf and blind with dumb. Physical loss and mental loss don't mix! You sound like the feds!

It has always been my understanding that "dumb", in this context, means unable to speak. If this is correct, it is somewhat natural to include the term with the mention of deaf and blind.

stephen hawking

Or many autistic people who use a AAC/sign language probably disagree

Not one to be the pc police, maybe I missed the joke, but the original poster was making a joke and I think everyone got it, maybe you are too but saying some one is dumb because they can't speak is odd. ��*♂️

[Denis D]

dumb

adjective

adjective: dumb; comparative adjective: dumber; superlative adjective: dumbest

1.
temporarily unable or unwilling to speak.
"they stood dumb while the attacker poured out a stream of abuse"


synonyms: speechless, tongue-tied, wordless, silent, at a loss for words, voiceless, inarticulate, taciturn, uncommunicative, untalkative, tight-lipped, close-mouthed, saying nothing; informalmum
"she stood dumb while he poured out a stream of abuse"

[Redbarn]

dumb

adjective

adjective: dumb; comparative adjective: dumber; superlative adjective: dumbest

1.
temporarily unable or unwilling to speak.
"they stood dumb while the attacker poured out a stream of abuse"


synonyms: speechless, tongue-tied, wordless, silent, at a loss for words, voiceless, inarticulate, taciturn, uncommunicative, untalkative, tight-lipped, close-mouthed, saying nothing; informalmum
"she stood dumb while he poured out a stream of abuse"

I stand corrected, anyone who can't speak is dumb, according to this

I am out... #internet

[Woody38]

Rather than a lighthouse, what about this. Place something like day markers on the witches. These would be large enough for everyone to see and could be lit at night. I personally find the channel markers difficult to find evenas I know where they are located.

_________________________________

I m a retired workaholic and continuing aquaholic

[TiltonBB]

There will be a meeting on Monday, Aug. 26, to discuss the lighthouse idea and gauge public opinion and support of the proposal. The meeting will begin at 7 p.m. at the Marine Patrol headquarters in Gilford.

From the Laconia Sun:

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news/local/a-lighthouse-on-the-witches-it-s-up-to-boaters/article_b6451e56-c5c0-11e9-9e79-73b0f2e04d36.html#utm_source=laconiadailysun.com&utm_campaign=%2Fnewsletters%2Flists%2Fheadlines%2F saturday%2F%3F-dc%3D1566639017&utm_medium=email&utm_content=headline

[GodSmile]

I think the efforts of the Marine Patrol would be better directed to patrolling the lake to insure adherence to current rules.

[TiltonBB]

I think the efforts of the Marine Patrol would be better directed to patrolling the lake to insure adherence to current rules.

The Marine Patrol has not taken any position, did not originate the idea, and only offered to host an informational meeting. This lighthouse movement is from the efforts of someone outside the agency. The meeting seems like an excellent way for the Marine Patrol to let the discussion happen and see what the general public thinks. I am glad that they want our opinion.

"Dunleavy said he offered for his agency to host the meeting as a means to measure that support. However, he stopped short of saying whether he would cast his vote in support of the proposal.

“If I want to vote on something, I want to be informed and I’m not there yet,” he said.

The best way for boaters to protect themselves is to be aware of where they are and how to interpret navigational markers, he said."

[Weekend Pundit]

There will be a meeting on Monday, Aug. 26, to discuss the lighthouse idea and gauge public opinion and support of the proposal. The meeting will begin at 7 p.m. at the Marine Patrol headquarters in Gilford.

From the Laconia Sun:

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news/local/a-lighthouse-on-the-witches-it-s-up-to-boaters/article_b6451e56-c5c0-11e9-9e79-73b0f2e04d36.html#utm_source=laconiadailysun.com&utm_campaign=%2Fnewsletters%2Flists%2Fheadlines%2F saturday%2F%3F-dc%3D1566639017&utm_medium=email&utm_content=headline

The meeting is being held at the Gilford Town Hall, Conference Room A, at 7pm. It is not being held at the Marine Patrol HQ.

[TiltonBB]

The meeting is being held at the Gilford Town Hall, Conference Room A, at 7pm. It is not being held at the Marine Patrol HQ.

My bad! I read the Marine Patrol was hosting it and missed the rest of the sentence. Thank you for the help

[brk-lnt]

To me, a lighthouse is just not a serious proposal, for financial reasons if nothing else. However to be financially practical, I suggest the following:
the State of NH can lease rights to a commercial operation, (say, Bizer, who started this thread). We already lease antenna space on the top of Mount Washington. The commercial operator could install a motion detector or other electronic device that would trigger a warning on your cell phone (using the "operator's" app and your paid subscription) when you approach too close to the Witches. You pay a subscription fee to the operator, with the cost based on how many hazards you want to be warned away from.



So your basic concept is that as you are approaching a navigational hazard, your phone dings so you can divert your attention to it?

[thinkxingu]

I dunno, friends, all this stuff seems so simple: be responsible or face the consequences. The line (for me, at least) is when it comes to life-threatening issues and, as best I know, historically the Witches have only destroyed dreams and outdrives.

They're marked, prominently--anything else is going too far. Some might even make the case that this type of prevention is, ultimately, enabling.

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[WinnisquamZ]

If it was Lake Michigan you would just drill a few holes and blow it up to a reasonable depth


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[Woodsy]

This is just SILLY!

To begin with we don't have a lot of Boat V. Witches collisions. It is a VERY RARE occurrence!

Secondly... we already have a way of marking this area. We could easily and cheaply use the diamond shaped "danger" markers in addition to the current spar buoys!


Woodsy

[Descant]

Many years ago(60's?) there were several orange barrels ringed with reflective tape surrounding the Witches. Highly visible day and night. I'd guess they were discontinued as being unnecessary. I agree with unnecessary.

[TiltonBB]

Why not tell all the marine contractors that build breakwaters on the lake that they can have the rocks free. Just pull in with your barge and excavator and load up and take them away. In a few short years the Witches will no longer exist and you can throw all the markers away.

[Wifi-1]

Great idea, but someone will discover some sort of life growing among the rocks, that can't be disturbed. Of course, this will be after a $10M study.... lol

[Hillcountry]

Why not tell all the marine contractors that build breakwaters on the lake that they can have the rocks free. Just pull in with your barge and excavator and load up and take them away. In a few short years the Witches will no longer exist and you can throw all the markers away.

So, is The Witches just a pile of rocks or more of a ledge outcropping?
If a pile of rocks were they deposited by glacier or man made many moons ago?

[Onshore]

It's a pile of rocks strewn about on top of a ledge outcropping. It is a natural formation.

[Biggd]

It's a pile of rocks strewn about on top of a ledge outcropping. It is a natural formation.And I thought it was built by witches? :D

[LIforrelaxin]

All of this is so funny to me... Why because this is all about liability.... Some people say the witches aren't distinguishable enough, some think they are.....

As I said once before, if this light house where to happen, then we will end up seeing more over time, in other area's such as middle ground shoal....

I personally don't care either way... what I care about is how it will get funded. How will it be maintained etc.

Now what people may not realize is that there is presedence for this.... There are light houses on Lake Sunapee.....

http://www.lakesunapee.org/lighthouses

I say if people really want to see this kind of thing in place "in the name of safety" let it happen, but don't expect the state to build it, maintain it etc. they answer is already there.... if the state will allow it, figure out how to build it and maintain it yourself.....

[Descant]

Why not tell all the marine contractors that build breakwaters on the lake that they can have the rocks free. Just pull in with your barge and excavator and load up and take them away. In a few short years the Witches will no longer exist and you can throw all the markers away.
I believe mining the Witches was OK and done post war, 1950's, pre DES days. I recall that boulders were removed to improve navigation on the east side of the Hole in the Wall, mid late 1950's.
As for building more breakwaters, it appears that, per your own new thread about Lockes Island boat crash, breakwaters are also a hazard to navigation. Hope nobody was hurt.

[Winni P]

Does anyone have an update from the lighthouse meeting?

[Hillcountry]

And I thought it was built by witches? :D

Lol...”there be witches here”! They put a spell on your lower unit if you ignore their warnings!

[TiltonBB]

As for building more breakwaters, it appears that, per your own new thread about Lockes Island boat crash, breakwaters are also a hazard to navigation. Hope nobody was hurt.

I'm not sure that breakwater was a hazard to navigation. If you are out of control that close to shore I don't think the breakwater is the problem. It looks like the breakwater saved the attached dock, and if there was a boat at that dock it would have saved that too.

[Descant]

Sorry. I thought the irony came through all on its own. I didn't add LOL or similar because the accident is not funny, just the two posts in two threads, both by TiltonBB have some internal irony.

[hilltopper]

https://www.laconiadailysun.com/news/local/dim-view-of-lighthouse-proposal-aired-at-meeting/article_92fa3a32-c906-11e9-a444-1b20a0474111.html

[Kamper]

Do we have any rocks big enough for this attention getter?