Lakeport Landing business

[fatlazyless]

From an article in today's Laconia Citizen, it sounds like the City of Laconia will be taking possession of the one-acre lot, and the Lakeport Landing's primary showroom/repair/office building in November, 2015 which has been home to www.lakeportlanding.com for the last 29-years for the very low price of zero dollars as per their 30-year lease agreement.

Considering all the real jobs and people involved, it is a super-duper catastrophe that an agreement which continues the business cannot be worked out.....seems like a major disaster for the business, owners, and employees...if they .... the City of Laconia and the business ...... cannot re-do the lease agreement to keep a very viable business going strong???? Twenty-nine years of selling boats, running a successful marina biz.....and employing many people ....and it sounds like they are not getting the treatment they deserve from the City of Laconia.

[Charlie T]

From an article in today's Laconia Citizen, it sounds like the City of Laconia will be taking possession of the one-acre lot, and the Lakeport Landing's primary showroom/repair/office building in November, 2015 which has been home to www.lakeportlanding.com for the last 29-years for the very low price of zero dollars as per their 30-year lease agreement.

Considering all the real jobs and people involved, it is a super-duper catastrophe that an agreement which continues the business cannot be worked out.....seems like a major disaster for the business, owners, and employees...if they .... the City of Laconia and the business ...... cannot re-do the lease agreement to keep a very viable business going strong???? Twenty-nine years of selling boats, running a successful marina biz.....and employing many people ....and it sounds like they are not getting the treatment they deserve from the City of Laconia.

Hey FLL

Someone needs to say it so it might as well be me. Don't you think your words might carry more weight if ANY of your other 4426 posts were sincere????? You may or may not have a valid point in this case but I don't think most on this forum that have read and put up with your nonsense over the years put a lot of faith in what you have to say.

"Don't ya know"

My opinion only, everyone else's mileage may vary.

Charlie T

[brk-lnt]

Some more info about the lease expiration:

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/81974-council-to-sound-public-on-union-ave-propertylakeport-landing

It would be nice to see this handled "peacefully" and practically. Give Lakeport Landing a fair shot at outright acquiring the property instead of getting into some kind of a bidding war with Irwin/etc. However, given the way Laconia seems to handle most of its business, I doubt this process will end resembling anything at all dignified.

[BroadHopper]

Some more info about the lease expiration:

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/81974-council-to-sound-public-on-union-ave-propertylakeport-landing

It would be nice to see this handled "peacefully" and practically. Give Lakeport Landing a fair shot at outright acquiring the property instead of getting into some kind of a bidding war with Irwin/etc. However, given the way Laconia seems to handle most of its business, I doubt this process will end resembling anything at all dignified.

You are correct, the current council act like a bunch of bumbling idiots. With the David Gammon case, the Hathaway House, building a new high school, building the new athletic field, etc. etc. they are crying for money. Good thing Straight Arrow Party in the 80's put a cap on annual spending. This cap even make the county be careful with spending.

So with the cap, they consider the strip mall as income, and the one lot as money to burn!

The council has already been told to be careful with the Lakeport Landing fiasco. Losing the business will be disastrous to the city's coffin. Problem is the council don't care about the future, just what they can do now. Let the future worry about the future.

[Rusty]

Hey FLL

Someone needs to say it so it might as well be me. Don't you think your words might carry more weight if ANY of your other 4426 posts were sincere????? You may or may not have a valid point in this case but I don't think most on this forum that have read and put up with your nonsense over the years put a lot of faith in what you have to say.

"Don't ya know"

My opinion only, everyone else's mileage may vary.

Charlie T

Your comment is un-called for and down right nasty!

[brk-lnt]

Your comment is un-called for and down right nasty!

Not to get off topic, but I disagree. 99% of what FLL posts is non-constructive gibberish. I have him blocked for exactly that reason, I got tired of reading his 'contributions'.

[Rusty]

Not to get off topic, but I disagree. 99% of what FLL posts is non-constructive gibberish. I have him blocked for exactly that reason, I got tired of reading his 'contributions'.

Do you think that what FLL said in this thread is "gibberish"?

If you do, please point out what part that you don't like.

IMO FLL contributes more to this forum then 99% of you regulars.

[SAMIAM]

I agree with FLL on this one. Laconia is notorious for throwing roadblocks up to business. Too bad because there was a group wanting to restore the Hathaway house until it was realized that the bureaucratic red tape would not allow for a workable budget.
Lakeport Landing is long established business that has contributed much to the lakes region......shameful that the city is not willing to help them.

[brk-lnt]

Do you think that what FLL said in this thread is "gibberish"?



To a degree, yes. He's previously used a fair amount of hyperbole in his posts, and he posts without citing any sources, references, or other information. Given some of his previous posts I'd say someone would have to be a bit "generous" to take any of his posts at face value. So, in a way, his post is indeed gibberish since you can't really trust any of the information provided in it.

If you take the time to read some of the other news articles circulating on this issue, it sounds as if what to do with the property is still in question/in the process of being decided by the city. They may take possession of the property, yes, but they are also in process of seeking public input on the matter.

It's a semi-serious matter as far as the overall business is concerned and the tax base and such for the city. If he wanted to foster a genuine discussion on the matter, his post was a less than ideal way to go about doing that.

[Charlie T]

Your comment is un-called for and down right nasty!

I disagree Rusty. There was nothing "nasty" about my post. FLL has admitted his main reason for being here is to stir the pot. My post was to point out to him that "The boy who cried wolf too much wasn't believed when the wolf actually appeared". If you always act as the court jester don't expect to be taken seriously on that rare occasion that you don't act like a fool.

I stand by my post. It was not meant to be nasty or offensive, it was simply a truthful statement.

[Rusty]

FLL has admitted his main reason for being here is to stir the pot.

So what!! Why do you care what FLL posts, the Admin is the one who will make a decision as to when it gets to be too much.

Don't read his posts if you dislike them so much.

I enjoy his comments and think it would be a shame if he ever decided to stop posting or the Admin took action against him.

[glennsteely]

Your comment is un-called for and down right nasty!

others have blocked him, so you do it if you don't like his posts....personally, I think he is funny, witty and one of the very reasons that I come here everyday!!

[jrc]

Why waste time with bashing FLL, he can't help himself. Thanksgiving is coming, we all have that special relative.

Back to the topic. In my opinion, assuming the city does not need the lot for city purposes, it should sell or lease to the highest bidder. Anything else would smell of corruption.

[TiltonBB]

Laconia Daily Sun

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/82281-alternative-for-lakeport-landing

[LIforrelaxin]

So lets think about this some. What has Lakeport Landing gotten out of this deal....

1. Free use of public property
2. extra room to help them run their business.

What has the City of Laconia gotten from this:

1. A successful business with in the Town.

What would seem reasonable at this point?

1. For Lakeport Landing be given the chance to buy the lot at market value
2. For Lakeport Landing to get the first right of refusal
3. For Lakeport Landing to create a new lease for the land with the Town, that incorporates a market value rent for the Town.

At the end of the day the Town will do what it wants.....I suggest that those of you that Live in Laconia, and have an opinion on this to get involved and give your opinion to the City Council....

I also think that Ms. Blizzard needs to be careful and more truthful about what she says. Loosing the use of the property will have a negative effect on the business, however I don't believe it will be detrimental to the business. I do believe it will have an effect on the operating costs of the business but certainly nothing that will impair the ability of the business to be profitable.

Why should Lakeport Landing get a concession like the use of the land for free? For the first 30 years the rent was the cost of putting up a building, and developing it, while cultivating their business... I am actually ok with that. Now the building is up, the land developed to their needs..... So now it is time to pay the piper and buy the land from the Town.

As Irwin would undoubtedly want to buy the lot, the Town seems to be doing what the should be doing and acting in their own best interest. I am sure Lakeport Landing, is acting in their best interest as well....Unfortunately it has to play out in a way that will make everyone comfortable... Because the town can't simply put a new lease into place or directly sell the lot to Lakeport.... There is red tape involved.....

My Hope is the following:

The town puts the lot and building up for Sale, with Lakeport Landing having the first right of refusal. Why you may ask, because it allows their to be no argument between the two parties on the value of the land. Then as the sale price also includes the building, Lakeport should get credit towards the purchase price for sum of money they invested into the building that they previously put up.

Unfortunately I don't live or own property in Laconia, so I have no ability to influence the outcome of this issue. But As I stated earlier those of you that are residents should speak to the Town council, and help influence the outcome.

[dave603]

Don't really see a problem here. Lakeport "leased" the property for the last 30 years at $0 dollars.
So what if they did do improvements to the area.
The City charter, according to this last article, demands the city to put it out for bid to ALL interested parties.
Sounds more to me like someone got a sweetheart deal 30 years ago.
Wish I could get that kind of lease to run my business. I could use 30 years of making a profit with no lease.

[Woodsy]

I didn't see where Lakeport Landing leased the property for $0... but who cares if they did? I doubt there $0 dollar lease only because it would smack of the very favoritism that Irwin Marine sued the city over when the city originally sold the contested property to Lakeport Landing. I think a $0 lease would have been cause for another lawsuit. Though back then I suppose anything was possible.

Anyway, Lakeport Landing has 30 years of paying the taxes on the property, 30 years of maintaining and improving the property and they have 30 years of being a good business in the city. They employ a lot of people and this will negatively affect them one way or another.

As a Laconia resident I would like to see what is best for the City, and Lakeport Landing within the constraints of the law... I do not need to see my tax dollars being spent defending a silly lawsuit brought by Irwin Marine or Lakeport Landing.

That being said, I think the only real course of action is to declare the property surplus, then sell the property.. Unfortunately for Lakeport, I don't think there is an easy way out other than buying the property. I don't think the City can legally give Lakeport the first right of refusal. But if they can, they should. If not, then let the bidding process begin and be open and transparent.

Woodsy

[BroadHopper]

As a Laconia resident I would like to see what is best for the City, and Lakeport Landing within the constraints of the law... I do not need to see my tax dollars being spent defending a silly lawsuit brought by Irwin Marine or Lakeport Landing.


That is exactly what the city did with the D. Gammon case. Dave contested the $538 that was owed to him in challenging a case the city lost. Instead the city balked and the city lost again spending 10 times that in Superior Court. This is one of many. When it comes to the Lakeport Landing case, well history will repeats itself. No wonder the lawyers in town are living well. And on our dime!

[BroadHopper]

I did have serious contention during the SL debate. But it is to the proponent advantage when he was making accusations that was false.

I do admire his wits and every forum has a 'character'. Normally I ignore his remarks and others can either take it at face value or do your homework and the truth will speak.

[LIforrelaxin]

I don't think the City can legally give Lakeport the first right of refusal. But if they can, they should. If not, then let the bidding process begin and be open and transparent.

Woodsy

Well Woodsy, the good news is we agree....

The question is can they legally give first right of refusal.... I don't know why they couldn't, but I also don't know if the could.

The other possibility is that it be Auction off to have the same effect... Once again if it is allowable within the governing laws....

And that is what this is really about, what legally can be done...... I am sure the Town could release the land to Lakeport as well... But what does that do... it just puts the same situation in play again sometime in the future.

[Happy Gourmand]

Aren't many of the buildings at the Weirs and some other locations on leased land? What happens when those leases expire?

[Woodsy]

The way most laws governing the disposal of public property are written, I think the city has a fiduciary and legal duty to the citizens of Laconia to sell the property for fair market value.

I don't think the public property disposal laws allow for the City to be able to legally "gift" the property to a "For Profit" business.

The City can show any favoritism towards Lakeport Landing, and I think the right of first refusal might be considered favoritism by Irwin Marine and result in another lawsuit. But I have not seen the lease agreement either.

How the City goes about the sale of the property will mostly be semantics. In the end a sale will occur, and the property will belong to someone other than the City of Laconia. I personally would like to see Lakeport Landing retain the property. IMHO I think it would be extremely detrimental to their business to lose that location.

Woodsy

Woodsy

[BroadHopper]

I believe the land between the railroad track and the lake are considered leased land. Gov Hassan, in order to raise revenue, passed a law back in 2007 that anyone using that land must pay lease to the state. Not sure if it is really happening, but I do know they are looking into a development of land between the lake and track off Paugus Bay. The state is determining whether the developer/association must pay a lease fee.

Can you imagine what would become of LB/SD, Channel and Thurston Marine? How about Irwin Gardens? Hassan open Pandora's box!

[Rusty]

I believe the land between the railroad track and the lake are considered leased land. Gov Hassan, in order to raise revenue, passed a law back in 2007 that anyone using that land must pay lease to the state. Not sure if it is really happening, but I do know they are looking into a development of land between the lake and track off Paugus Bay. The state is determining whether the developer/association must pay a lease fee.

Can you imagine what would become of LB/SD, Channel and Thurston Marine? How about Irwin Gardens? Hassan open Pandora's box!

Hassan wasn't Governor in 2007.

[Woodsy]

Happy...

The State of NH has been leasing the waterfront (mostly on property that the railroad originally owned) to property owners for decades... It used to be be for pretty short $$. During the last building boom, developers were taking advantage. As a result, the State looked at getting more $$$ for those leases.

For example... Southdown is a property with LOTS of leased waterfront. They could be very negatively affected if the State decided not to renew their lease.


Woodsy

[BroadHopper]

http://laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/81266-selectboard-passes-on-shorefront-lease

After reading this article, the state was leasing the land, however the state is reviewing all properties as there are those who have not been paying a lease. As the last paragraph states, its all about revenue.

[gwhite13]

Is anyone sure taxes were paid by LL. If I lease property from someone, they generally are responsible for taxes. Since a municipal entity does not incur taxes, moot dollars abound.

[brk-lnt]

Is anyone sure taxes were paid by LL. If I lease property from someone, they generally are responsible for taxes. Since a municipal entity does not incur taxes, moot dollars abound.

No idea, but it wouldn't be at all surprising if they didn't pay *property* taxes. They would have likely paid other taxes to the city though.

[Resident 2B]

No idea, but it wouldn't be at all surprising if they didn't pay *property* taxes. They would have likely paid other taxes to the city though.

What other taxes are there? No sales or income taxes in NH.

R2B

[brk-lnt]

What other taxes are there? No sales or income taxes in NH.

R2B

You're right, I was thinking of the state taxes that businesses pay. Not sure what other taxes, if any, would have gone to the city of Laconia.

[tis]

State business profits and enterprise taxes. But those are not Laconia taxes of course.

[VitaBene]

"The way most laws governing the disposal of public property are written, I think the city has a fiduciary and legal duty to the citizens of Laconia to sell the property for fair market value."


Woodsy, I can't say it better than that

[Lakeboater]

So lets think about this some. What has Lakeport Landing gotten out of this deal....

1. Free use of public property
2. extra room to help them run their business.

What has the City of Laconia gotten from this:

1. A successful business with in the Town.

What would seem reasonable at this point?

1. For Lakeport Landing be given the chance to buy the lot at market value
2. For Lakeport Landing to get the first right of refusal
3. For Lakeport Landing to create a new lease for the land with the Town, that incorporates a market value rent for the Town.

At the end of the day the Town will do what it wants.....I suggest that those of you that Live in Laconia, and have an opinion on this to get involved and give your opinion to the City Council....

I also think that Ms. Blizzard needs to be careful and more truthful about what she says. Loosing the use of the property will have a negative effect on the business, however I don't believe it will be detrimental to the business. I do believe it will have an effect on the operating costs of the business but certainly nothing that will impair the ability of the business to be profitable.

Why should Lakeport Landing get a concession like the use of the land for free? For the first 30 years the rent was the cost of putting up a building, and developing it, while cultivating their business... I am actually ok with that. Now the building is up, the land developed to their needs..... So now it is time to pay the piper and buy the land from the Town.

As Irwin would undoubtedly want to buy the lot, the Town seems to be doing what the should be doing and acting in their own best interest. I am sure Lakeport Landing, is acting in their best interest as well....Unfortunately it has to play out in a way that will make everyone comfortable... Because the town can't simply put a new lease into place or directly sell the lot to Lakeport.... There is red tape involved.....

My Hope is the following:

The town puts the lot and building up for Sale, with Lakeport Landing having the first right of refusal. Why you may ask, because it allows their to be no argument between the two parties on the value of the land. Then as the sale price also includes the building, Lakeport should get credit towards the purchase price for sum of money they invested into the building that they previously put up.

Unfortunately I don't live or own property in Laconia, so I have no ability to influence the outcome of this issue. But As I stated earlier those of you that are residents should speak to the Town council, and help influence the outcome.

I don't really follow the part about LL getting a credit for the building.
From the Laconia Sun: The lease expires on November 1, 2015 and the tenant has no right to extend it further. At the termination of the lease all buildings and improvements on the lot become the property of the city.
To me that would seem that the improvements made (the building) were instead of rent and should belong to the city or the city should gain from the improvements. I wouldn't think that LL would get a credit if they or anyone else buys it.

[VitaBene]

I don't really follow the part about LL getting a credit for the building.
From the Laconia Sun: The lease expires on November 1, 2015 and the tenant has no right to extend it further. At the termination of the lease all buildings and improvements on the lot become the property of the city.
To me that would seem that the improvements made (the building) were instead of rent and should belong to the city or the city should gain from the improvements. I wouldn't think that LL would get a credit if they or anyone else buys it.
They built no mansion over there. 29 years later, any storage building turned showroom/ office has had a good life!

[sum-r breeze]

Lakeport Landing has had a rough go of it over the last few years. They lost their Formula franchise and now they might lose their high visibility show room too. Those are a couple of tough hurdles to over come.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz i'll be wavin' back

[LIforrelaxin]

I don't really follow the part about LL getting a credit for the building.
From the Laconia Sun: The lease expires on November 1, 2015 and the tenant has no right to extend it further. At the termination of the lease all buildings and improvements on the lot become the property of the city.
To me that would seem that the improvements made (the building) were instead of rent and should belong to the city or the city should gain from the improvements. I wouldn't think that LL would get a credit if they or anyone else buys it.

I don't disagree... My reasoning is the following LL could have made no improvements to the land, and just used it as a storage yard.... Why make them pay for the building twice, that is all....LL new what they where doing and involved in... so they caused this situation all on their own.... from that regard I have now sympathy for them.... I expect the city to be fair, but do what is best for them city, and allowable in the confines of the laws that govern them..

[LIforrelaxin]

Lakeport Landing has had a rough go of it over the last few years. They lost their Formula franchise and now they might lose their high visibility show room too. Those are a couple of tough hurdles to over come.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz i'll be wavin' back

While I don't disagree that these hurdles are tough on a business, I think that they put themselves in this position.....Certainly Erica's high profile legal troubles didn't help either... Why a successful Marina was aligned only with one boat MFG, is mind boggling... They should have had a better portfolio of products... but that was their choice.... The chose to build upon land they didn't own, and which had a lease with a definite end point, and conditions. Once again the marina entered into this by choice...Therefore they caused this situation...

Now that isn't to say that I think the city should simply screw the company... I think they need to understand what is allowable within the laws that govern the town and try to come to a mutually beneficial solution, that would help LL keep using the land, and building....

Time will tell...

[Happy Gourmand]

Does anybody know how much they paid to Laconia to lease this land? Some posts make it sound like they used the property for 30 years for nothing. This whole situation is not a "first". I'd be surprised if there are not procedures in place to deal with this situation that is fair to all parties.

[sum-r breeze]

While I don't disagree that these hurdles are tough on a business, I think that they put themselves in this position.....Certainly Erica's high profile legal troubles didn't help either... Why a successful Marina was aligned only with one boat MFG, is mind boggling... They should have had a better portfolio of products... but that was their choice.... The chose to build upon land they didn't own, and which had a lease with a definite end point, and conditions. Once again the marina entered into this by choice...Therefore they caused this situation...

Now that isn't to say that I think the city should simply screw the company... I think they need to understand what is allowable within the laws that govern the town and try to come to a mutually beneficial solution, that would help LL keep using the land, and building....

Time will tell...

I agree.....actions have consequences. I wonder if Irwin's has been approached by the city of Laconia? They being the closest abutter.

The Breeze
wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[fatlazyless]

It could be that the City of Laconia is seeing a big big purchase price if they sell off the very hi-visibility Lakeport Landing marina home building to the next door neighbor, Irwin Marine, plus to sub-divide the one acre lot and keep one half-acre for the city for either a small park, or a parking lot, or for the Lakeport fire station, or some city use. U-know......split the property in half......keep half the land for the city....and sell the marina building on a half-acre for some big big bucks to Irwin. After thirty years, that chain link fence topped with three lines of barbed wire, that seperates Irwins and Lakeport will be a-coming down?

With three locations; in Hudson, Alton, and Laconia, and being New England's one and only five-star Sea Ray dealer..... Irwin ... www.irwinmarine.com ...definately has the big money to pay the big-bucks, and seems like an automatic, made-to-order BUYER ....with no broker needed!

As for creating more local Laconia jobs with the addition of the Lakeport Landing property over to Irwin Marine......it ain't necessarily so. About two or three months ago, an article in the LaDaSun mentioned that Irwin's had cut their number of employees from about 78 down to 49 ......something to do with having fewer than 50 employees.....and health insurance.....and the Affordable Health Care Act of 2010....and...oh well.....November 1, 2015 is about 49-weeks from now.....which is when this 30-year lease agreement expires.....so who knows what will happen?......maybe Carnac the Magnificent could foresee how this scenario will unwind? ......yes, I see a lot of money.....mucho mucho mucho mega green-stuff.....some very big money for the city here?

Irwin's could be using the Lakeport Landing building for selling and servicing jetskis and snowmobiles; items that have been sold from Alton but not from Laconia, and finance the building purchase with a low-interest, 30-year loan, or something? That seems like a good, strong Irwin use for that huge two-story marina designed, service building with its huge visibility from Union Ave; jetskis and snowmobiles; sales and service ..... certainly MUCHO more major MOJO for their retail biz than kayaks, and Sunfish sailboats!

The City has the land and building assessed for something like $375,000, so if Irwin pays double that at $750,000 for half the land, a one-half acre, and the very nice marina service building; over a 30-year loan, that works out to $750,000 divided by 30 years = $25,000/year plus the interest. Now, is it worth $25,000/year+interest to Irwin to have ownership of the hi-visibility two-story marina building for selling and servicing jetskis and snowmobiles which are two items not currently sold from Irwin's-Laconia? Only Irwin's know's what Irwin's wants to do ..... but it seems like a good business move to me for them to purchase the building.... IF they can beat out Lakeport Landing's price offer....

If Carnac the Magnificent was still on tv ... he'd be riding a new snowmobile... that he bought at Irwin's on Union Ave .... come the winter of 2016!!! ..... go....Carnac.....go.....definately magnificent!

.....say-hey....how's about the City using that new money to build on city land somewhere a $750,000, Laconia community tennis center with six courts inside an inflatable structure ... www.arizonstructures.com ; all air-conditioned and heated.....that's what Laconia really wants ..... plus maybe the City could name it the Stephanie Beaudoin memorial tennis courts as a way to remember her! Unlike football, basketball, and baseball; tennis is a sport that one can play till you are 99!

[john60ri]

Surprised at the criticism of FLL. I've always found him very entertaining. Hang in there, pal!

[fatlazyless]

"Alternative for Lakeport Landing? City Council defers decision"

Today's November 27 Laconia Daily Sun has a nuts and bolts report on the latest "what's happening" at Lakeport Landing. Some interesting stuff!

The Laconia City Council voted unanimously to wait at least 90-days before making any decisions on how to proceed with the Lakeport Landing property.

[mcdude]

Laconia Daily Sun

City manager to negotiate sale of city lot

Published Date Wednesday, 27 May 2015 01:38


LACONIA — The City Council last night rejected two offers — one from Lakeport Landing and the other from Irwin Marine – for the property on Union Avenue leased for the past 30 years to Landing Landing, both of which fell shy of the appraised value of $480,000.
The property, a 0.81 acre strip between the roadway and railway was leased to Lakeport Landing in 1985 for 10 years with two 10-year renewal periods. The lease will expire on November 1, 2015 and cannot be renewed again. In 1987 Lakeport Landing constructed a 9,840-square-foot building on the lot. Under the terms of the lease, ownership of the building would revert to the city at the expiration date.
Erica Blizzard, who owns and operates Lakeport Landing, offered to purchase the property for $331,400 and subsequently Irwin Marine, which operates on the abutting lot, submitted an offer of $335,000.
Councilor Brenda Baer (Ward 4) proposed negotiating a sale of the property to Lakeport Landing at its appraised value. She was joined only by Councilor Arman Bolduc (Ward 6). With Councilors Henery Lipman (Ward 3), David Bownes (Ward 2) and Ava Doyle (Ward 1) in the majority, Baer's motion failed by a vote of three-to-two.
Lipman proposed authorizing the City Manager Scott Myers to negotiate with both Lakeport Landing and Irwin Marine, with respect to the appraised value as well as other conditions for the sale of the property. The city will require easements to maintain the retaining wall along Union Avenue. The owner of the property would be expected to maintain its taxable value for a specified period of time. Should Lakeport Landing fail to acquire the property, the transaction would be subject to a transition period of up to two years to enable the firm to make alternative arrangements for its operations. Finally, prospective buyers would asked to consider subdividing the property and transfer approximately a third of the lot to the city for a parking lot.
Lipman said he anticipated these discussion would begin soon with an eye to structuring a sale of the property in July.

<?xml:namespace prefix = "fb" ns = "http://www.facebook.com/2008/fbml" /><fb:like href="http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/86311-lakeport-landing-sale" action="like" layout="standard" font="verdana" colorscheme="light" width="320" show_faces="false"></fb:like> <IFRAME tabIndex=0 id=I0_1432747663267 title=+1 style="HEIGHT: 20px; WIDTH: 90px; POSITION: static; LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; TOP: 0px; VISIBILITY: visible" marginHeight=0 src="https://apis.google.com/se/0/_/+1/fastbutton?usegapi=1&size=medium&hl=en-GB&origin=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.laconiadailysun.com&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.laconiadailysun.com%2Findex.p hp%2Fnewsx%2Flocal-news%2F86311-lakeport-landing-sale&gsrc=3p&ic=1&jsh=m%3B%2F_%2Fscs%2Fapps-static%2F_%2Fjs%2Fk%3Doz.gapi.en_US.YqpD8a2mz-8.O%2Fm%3D__features__%2Fam%3DAQ%2Frt%3Dj%2Fd%3D1% 2Ft%3Dzcms%2Frs%3DAGLTcCPs2ZeVwdTbFnkRBExJVLHllHWv 2A#_methods=onPlusOne%2C_ready%2C_close%2C_open%2C _resizeMe%2C_renderstart%2Concircled%2Cdrefresh%2C erefresh&id=I0_1432747663267&parent=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.laconiadailysun.com&pfname=&rpctoken=51646466" frameBorder=0 width="100%" name=I0_1432747663267 marginWidth=0 scrolling=no data-gapiattached="true"></IFRAME>

[AC2717]

Laconia Daily Sun

its only worth what people are willing to pay for it
$480k is a ridiculous amount for that strip of property especially the amount of work anyone other than Lakeport or Irwin would have to do with it

I cant believe I am asking (cause I Know the answer) what is wrong with these people:(

[BroadHopper]

The city appraised value of 480K is for the land and building. After the sale, the buyer is to relinquish a third of the lot to the city. The city did not specify that piece if the property. Also the buyer would need to provide an easement to the city regarding the retaining wall along Union Ave. Having all that, the 330 and some change is a fair value for the property.

Obviously to Brenda Baer, its all about the revenue. She doesn't care about the what will become of the future. I hope to God someone replace that woman. During her tenure she has done more harm than good in the city.

[Rich]

Erica Blizzard, who owns and operates Lakeport Landing

Is this the person that had an 'event' that eventually led to the creating of a speed limit on the lake? Or am I mistaken? I'm not a local.

[Phantom]

Is this the person that had an 'event' that eventually led to the creating of a speed limit on the lake? Or am I mistaken? I'm not a local.

Don't know that it "Led to the Speed Limit" being placed into affect ..... but yes, she had a horrific boating accident

.

[Misha888]

sell it to The State of NH. The state pays top dollar for real estate. But, that's another thread.

The city appraised value of 480K is for the land and building. After the sale, the buyer is to relinquish a third of the lot to the city. The city did not specify that piece if the property. Also the buyer would need to provide an easement to the city regarding the retaining wall along Union Ave. Having all that, the 330 and some change is a fair value for the property.

Obviously to Brenda Baer, its all about the revenue. She doesn't care about the what will become of the future. I hope to God someone replace that woman. During her tenure she has done more harm than good in the city.

[secondcurve]

its only worth what people are willing to pay for it
$480k is a ridiculous amount for that strip of property especially the amount of work anyone other than Lakeport or Irwin would have to do with it

I cant believe I am asking (cause I Know the answer) what is wrong with these people:(

There are two interested buyers who opened the bidding at $331,400 and $335,000. Based upon this and the fact that the seller is a city (read stupid government entity and God knows Laconia has proven this time and time again) I'm fairly certain that the fair value of the property is closer to the appraised value. Obviously, the bidders started the process low hoping to attain the property at a discount. The city should move to install a parking lot and I'm sure the offers will substantially increase.

[TiltonBB]

its only worth what people are willing to pay for it
$480k is a ridiculous amount for that strip of property especially the amount of work anyone other than Lakeport or Irwin would have to do with it

I cant believe I am asking (cause I Know the answer) what is wrong with these people:(

It is all about the exposure for sales but it comes with the benefit of additional space to operate your business. It just has to make financial sense.

The building and land are situated so that everyone that drives by sees their boats on display. I always look in when I go by to see the boats that are there. That is "free" advertising for them.

Since the markup on boats from wholesale to retail is about 30% the sale of one $300,000 boat, even at a negotiated price, will generate $50,000 to $90,000 for the seller. That income will more than offset the purchase price.

Now if that lot and the exposure helps to initiate the sale of 2 or 3 or more boats per year even a purchase price of $1,000,000 could make financial sense to the buyer.

[AC2717]

There are two interested buyers who opened the bidding at $331,400 and $335,000. Based upon this and the fact that the seller is a city (read stupid government entity and God knows Laconia has proven this time and time again) I'm fairly certain that the fair value of the property is closer to the appraised value. Obviously, the bidders started the process low hoping to attain the property at a discount. The city should move to install a parking lot and I'm sure the offers will substantially increase.

don't disagree here, but in the end it comes down to what someone is willing to pay

[brk-lnt]

don't disagree here, but in the end it comes down to what someone is willing to pay

Agreed with that.

This is also, IMO, a very interesting case. The property has a relatively high prospective value to Lakeport Landing and Irwin's. However, given the fact that it's pretty much boxed in, it would be a poor location for many other businesses. It has no direct water access, so it's diminished value for any other kind of boat brokerage. Parking would appear to be a significant issue if it were to become independently owned.

This appears to be another in a long chain of poor decisions from the Laconia city planners.

[mcdude]

Laconia Daily Sun
Published Date Thursday, 28 May 2015 12:37

LACONIA — City officials yesterday clarified the decision the City Council took when it met this week with respect to selling the property on Union Avenue, which has been leased to Lakeport Landing, Inc. for the past 30 years. The city manager has been asked to hold "informal conversations" with the two companies that have expressed interest in buying it in order to answer questions about the city's detailed position and gauge the level of remaining interest.
The property, a 0.81 acre strip between the roadway and railway was leased to Lakeport Landing in 1985 for 10 years with two 10-year renewal periods. The lease will expire on October 31, 2015 and the tenant has no renewal rights. In 1987 Lakeport Landing constructed a 9,840-square-foot building on the lot. Under the terms of the lease, ownership of the land and building would revert to the city at the expiration date.
In January, Erica Blizzard, who owns and operates Lakeport Landing, offered to purchase the property for $331.400 and subsequently Irwin Marine, which operates on the abutting lot, submitted a more recent offer of $335,000. Meanwhile, earlier this month Capital Appraisal Associates, Inc. of Concord pegged the market value of the land and building at $480,000.
With Councilor Bob Hamel (Ward 5) absent, five of the six councilors discussed the issue in a non-public session prior to their regularly scheduled meeting, but remained divided. Reading from a prepared statement in open session, Councilor Brenda Baer (Ward 4) offered a motion to negotiate the sale of the property solely with Blizzard. "First do no harm," she began. "We are dealing with people. We are dealing with our neighbors." She recalled that the council agreed to sell the former police station on Church Street to Binnie Media for $1 in an effort to revitalize downtown and said that selling to Blizzard would "build confidence with the business community." Baer urged her colleagues to "do the fair thing, the right thing." Only Councilor Armand Boluc (Ward 6), whose ward includes the property, joined with Baer and her motion failed by a vote of three-to-two.
Councilor Henry Lipman (Ward 3) then moved to reject both offers, which fell short of the appraised value of the property, and to authorize City Manager Scott Myers to conduct "informal conversations" with representatives of Lakeport Landing and Irwin Marine to inform them of terms and conditions of a sale of importance to the city.
Mayor Ed Engler said on Wednesday that the city manager was not directed to negotiate a sale of the property, but only to sound the two parties on reactions to four specific issues and report to the council when it meets on Monday, June 8.
First, he said that the city expected the sale price to match or exceed the appraised value of the property.
The city will also require an assurance that the owner of the property will not alter or demolish the existing building unless the change sustains or increases the existing taxable value of the property.
If the current tenant is displaced by the sale, the mayor said that the city will require the date of possession by the new owner be deferred for up to two years from the date of the closing to provide time for Lakeport Landing to secure new quarters. Should this provision be invoked, he explained that beginning when the lease expires on November 1, 2015, Lakeport Landing would pay a monthly rent consistent with the appraised value of the property.
Finally, Engler said that the property must be conveyed with easements enabling the city to maintain water and sewer lines as well as the retaining wall paralleling Union Avenue.

[AC2717]

Laconia Daily Sun

so then who else but Lakeport or Irwin would buy it if they have the wait 2 years to do anything with it

value just went even lower in my opinion

either release it to Lakeport, open a leasing war or sell it to them or Irwin on fair market value -what someone is willing to pay for it

[fatlazyless]

Some little birdy like a honking, canada goose needs to quietly whisper a message to Irwin Marine; the property in discussion here would make a super-duper venue building for Irwin's personal watercraft, aka jetskis, and snowmobile business. While pwc's and snow-mo's are sold at the Alton and Hudson Irwin's, they are not sold at the Laconia Irwin's. Business at the Laconia Irwin pretty much slows down for the winter, so's having a big-visibility, snowmobile business at the Union Ave corner lot would give Irwin's a big boost up to an all-year-around business that could compete big-time with the nearby H K Motorsports.

So's, how much is that worth to Irwin's when it could re-pay this new property acquisition with a thirty year, commercial mortgage?

[Woodsy]

I do not want to see Lakeport Landing lose out on purchasing the property. I do think its vital for their business. They pay a ton of property taxes on their other properties. If they went under that would truly be a loss for Laconia & the Lake Winni community.

That being said, as a Laconia taxpayer, I think the city should get as close as possible to fair market value for the property purchase. I am not sure the assessed value is accurate. The city should have an appraisal done by an independent firm. Give Lakeport Landing the right of first refusal. If they decline... then let the games begin!

Woodsy

[meredith weekender]

This parcel is in a very high traffic area and would enhance both Lakeport and Irwin. The City has a duty to the taxpayers of Laconia to get the highest price possible for the property and ensure that its use will be in the best benefit of the City. The City should put the property up for a sealed bid with a minimum reserve and also have the bidders submit formal proposals as to what there plans for development of the property will be.

[AC2717]

not a bad idea at all

but it still all comes down to what someone is willing to pay for it, maybe that might perk up the offers a little

anything is worth anything you want it to be, but when you are selling it, it is only worth what another person will pay for it

[meredith weekender]

I do not want to see Lakeport Landing lose out on purchasing the property. I do think its vital for their business. They pay a ton of property taxes on their other properties. If they went under that would truly be a loss for Laconia & the Lake Winni community.

That being said, as a Laconia taxpayer, I think the city should get as close as possible to fair market value for the property purchase. I am not sure the assessed value is accurate. The city should have an appraisal done by an independent firm. Give Lakeport Landing the right of first refusal. If they decline... then let the games begin!

Woodsy



Lakeport does pay taxes on several properties that they own in Laconia BUT Irwin also pays taxes on several properties that they own as well.

[secondcurve]

so then who else but Lakeport or Irwin would buy it if they have the wait 2 years to do anything with it

value just went even lower in my opinion

either release it to Lakeport, open a leasing war or sell it to them or Irwin on fair market value -what someone is willing to pay for it

Why should a 2-year notice be given at the end of a 10-year lease? The city and certaintly the tenant knew the expiration date of the lease 10-years ago. Shouldn't the tenant have been planning for the expiration date? If I rent an apartment do I wait untill the lease expires before I start thinking about where I will live in the future? I don't think so. I can see offering it to the exisiting tenant exclusively if they are willing to pay fair market (appraised) value. Otherwise, put the proerty up for auction and get the highest price. Then invest the proceeds in the dump down the street called Weirs Beach.

[secondcurve]

I do not want to see Lakeport Landing lose out on purchasing the property. I do think its vital for their business. They pay a ton of property taxes on their other properties. If they went under that would truly be a loss for Laconia & the Lake Winni community.

That being said, as a Laconia taxpayer, I think the city should get as close as possible to fair market value for the property purchase. I am not sure the assessed value is accurate. The city should have an appraisal done by an independent firm. Give Lakeport Landing the right of first refusal. If they decline... then let the games begin!

Woodsy

Woodsy: The article says that the city did commission an appraisal from an outside appraisal firm earlier in the month and the value was determined to be $480,000.....................Show me the money if you want to stay!

[Woodsy]

Weekender...

Yes Irwins pays taxes... but where will the $$$ come from if Lakeport goes under?

Secondcurve....

You are a bit out of line calling the Weirs a dump! I did miss in the article where the property had already been appraised. If tis appraised at $480 then the city needs to get as close as they can to that. It still boils down to what someone is willing to pay. Lots of properties appraise higher than the selling price for a variety of reasons. (Although $150K off is a bit much). The city needs to deal with Lakeport and Irwin's in good faith. It needs to be an open process. The city cannot show favoritism either way...

Woodsy

[meredith weekender]

Weekender...

Yes Irwins pays taxes... but where will the $$$ come from if Lakeport goes under?

Secondcurve....

You are a bit out of line calling the Weirs a dump! I did miss in the article where the property had already been appraised. If tis appraised at $480 then the city needs to get as close as they can to that. It still boils down to what someone is willing to pay. Lots of properties appraise higher than the selling price for a variety of reasons. (Although $150K off is a bit much). The city needs to deal with Lakeport and Irwin's in good faith. It needs to be an open process. The city cannot show favoritism either way...

Woodsy



Woodsy, It is highly unlikely that Lakeport would go out due to losing their current showroom and display area. If for some reason they did go out, I am sure that any of the successful marinas and boat storage facilities would be interested in in their properties as there is only limited areas for docking and storage on the lake.

[BroadHopper]

Brenda Baer is known to be anti-boater. Supports the speed limits and turned down a proposal for a public dock in the Lakeport area that was proposed and OK by the 1953 city council.

She usually do not answer my calls and emails so I would not see an 'honest solution to the problem.

[Misha888]

if either parties need to go the bank, the bank will decide on its value based on income (capitalization rate). I'm certain both parties have accountants who have done the math and know how much cash they have on hand for such a transaction. If current tenant gets those two extra years, they have the advantage . . . and I could go on.

[secondcurve]

Secondcurve....

You are a bit out of line calling the Weirs a dump!

Woodsy[/QUOTE]

Sorry. Perhaps a bit harsh but it is frustrating to see the city leaders unable to stop the downward spiral of the area. I remember what it was and it has been a long painful slide.

[BroadHopper]

if either parties need to go the bank, the bank will decide on its value based on income (capitalization rate). I'm certain both parties have accountants who have done the math and know how much cash they have on hand for such a transaction. If current tenant gets those two extra years, they have the advantage . . . and I could go on.

I don't think the city council care less what the bank believe the value of the property is or how much capital a business can raise. Whatever the appraised value is, someone has the cash, even if its the syndicate and they will take the money. Good example is state surplus land such as Laconia State School, the politicians want millions for land that has been appraised for far less. Meanwhile the buildings are rotting away. :(

[Woodsy]

Secondcurve....

You are a bit out of line calling the Weirs a dump!

Woodsy

Sorry. Perhaps a bit harsh but it is frustrating to see the city leaders unable to stop the downward spiral of the area. I remember what it was and it has been a long painful slide.[/QUOTE]

That's not calling it a DUMP! :) I live in the Weirs, I love it there. And to be truthful there are really cool bright spots right now....

They have cleaned up the old saloon lot... prob paving it today

Christmas Island is not only reopening, but they are spending tons of money on upgrades...

Nothin Fancy opened a bar & Grille with a deck on Weirs Blvd

Faro seems to be knocking it out of the park businesswise...

All wee need to do is get some re-investment $$$ on Lakeside ave....


Woodsy

[PaugusBayFireFighter]

Sorry. Perhaps a bit harsh but it is frustrating to see the city leaders unable to stop the downward spiral of the area. I remember what it was and it has been a long painful slide.

That's not calling it a DUMP! :) I live in the Weirs, I love it there. And to be truthful there are really cool bright spots right now....

They have cleaned up the old saloon lot... prob paving it today

Christmas Island is not only reopening, but they are spending tons of money on upgrades...

Nothin Fancy opened a bar & Grille with a deck on Weirs Blvd

Faro seems to be knocking it out of the park businesswise...

All wee need to do is get some re-investment $$$ on Lakeside ave....


Woodsy[/QUOTE]

And the business owners along Weirs Blvd. spoke up and squashed proposed zoning that would have prevented any new business in the area. Hopefully this trend continues. Langley Cove will have 290 new homes very soon.
Progress.

[SIKSUKR]

I know its part of the lease agreement but its seems weird to have to pay again for a building you built.

[Smokienorm]

Is this the person that had an 'event' that eventually led to the creating of a speed limit on the lake? Or am I mistaken? I'm not a local.

A "horrific accident" is an understatement. One person was killed and another severely injured in the incident- the press reported that the driver was DWI and got off very lightly in the criminal justice system. But that's a story for another day.

[Smokienorm]

I know its part of the lease agreement but its seems weird to have to pay again for a building you built.

It is very common (based on 40+ years of real estate law practice) for a land lease to provide that anything built on the land during the term of the lease becomes the property of the land owner when the lease term expires. Otherwise, the tenant might be required to remove, at the tenant's expense (which could be substantial), anything that was built on the land and restore the land to its condition at the beginning of the lease.

[secondcurve]

I know its part of the lease agreement but its seems weird to have to pay again for a building you built.

It all depends on what the lease payments have been for the past 30 years. This information is notably absent. My guess is the payments have been below market. Thus, the marina may still be ahead even if they have to tear down the building in the end.

[Misha888]

just basing my comment on reality. If rent only makes a commercial piece of property a certain value they could be sitting on it for a while, I assume.

From my experience with the town of Laconia and what I've read over the past 10 years, it's all about the quick buck even if you have been a business owner for decades.

The State of NH purchased the marina behind marine patrol for $1.1 maybe that guy can go buy that land and re-establish his business with his windfall. The church in Laconia sold for $280k (or something close) far less than "town appraised" value.



I don't think the city council care less what the bank believe the value of the property is or how much capital a business can raise. Whatever the appraised value is, someone has the cash, even if its the syndicate and they will take the money. Good example is state surplus land such as Laconia State School, the politicians want millions for land that has been appraised for far less. Meanwhile the buildings are rotting away. :(

[SIKSUKR]

It all depends on what the lease payments have been for the past 30 years. This information is notably absent. My guess is the payments have been below market. Thus, the marina may still be ahead even if they have to tear down the building in the end.

I totally understand the lease agreement and have no issue.With my commercial property some tenants do many costly imrovement worth 10's to even $100,000 dollars worth.Those stay with my building.It would be odd to have them pay for that again if they purchased that space but thats how it works.

[MeredithMan]

From today's Citizen.....

LACONIA — After more than eight months of attempting to reach a consensus about what to do with the Lakeport Landing Marina property at 21 Elm. St., the Laconia City Council has agreed to sell the site to Irwin Marine.

Coming out of a nonpublic session in which councilors discussed offers received for the .81 acre parcel and 9,000-square-foot showroom at the site, Mayor Edward Engler said that bids were received and unsealed Monday evening.

The first bid was $331,400 from Lakeport Landing Marina owner Erica Blizzard and she asked the city to defer taking any action on the matter until July so a second appraisal of the property could be conducted.

The second bid was by Irwin Marine and was for $528,000.

In May, the Capital Appraisal Company of Concord valued the property and existing building at $480,000.

The city originally bought the strip of land from the Boston Maine Railroad in 1958 and then sold the property to Lakeport Landing Marina in the mid-1980s. But that purchase agreement was nullified by the New Hampshire Supreme Court after a series of lawsuits filed by Irwin Marine claiming fair and open bidding on the property had not been followed.

Following the Supreme Court's guidance and approval under the terms of settling the lawsuits, the city signed a 10-year lease with the business, which was renewed for 10 years in 1995 and again for 10 years in 2005.

However, under the terms of lease approved by the New Hampshire Supreme Court, the original lease could not be extended beyond the 30-year point and Lakeport Landing Marina's current lease expires Nov. 1.

Councilors voted unanimously in February to declare the property as surplus, opening the door to a potential sale.

Mayor Edward Engler said both bids contained provisions agreeing to allow the city an easement for inspection and repair of a retaining wall adjacent to the property along Union Avenue, granting the city access to public parking space close to Elm Street, to retain the existing building on the site so the city would not lose taxable value and if the property was sold to any party other than Lakeport Landing Marina, the business would not have to relocate for two years.

Ward 3 Councilor Henry Lipman made a motion to accept the offer to sell the property to Irwin Marine and instruct City Manager Scott Myers to finalize the agreement.

By a vote of 4-2, the council voted to sell the site and building to Irwin Marine.

Councilors Ava Doyle, David Bownes, Robert Hamel and Lipman voted for the motion, with Councilor Brenda Baer and Armand Bolduc voting against it.

Prior to the meeting, Rod Dyer, former Laconia mayor and the attorney representing Erica Blizzard, shared a letter he sent last week to the city manager and city councilors about why the city should sell the site to Blizzard.

In the letter, he said that through the years since Lakeport Landing Marina has been on the property, it has rendered to Laconia rental payments, tax payments and improvements of more than $560,000.

"That investment in the premises is now on the verge of being lost as the city considers whether 'fairness' requires wiping the slate clean and viewing both interested parties as identical, event though one has invested literally hundreds of thousands of dollars into the property and the other has invested nothing," Dyer wrote in his letter.

Baer said she was dejected by the outcome of the situation.

"I've been beaten many times, but tonight I am truly disappointed," she said.

Bolduc said he agreed with Baer.

"I still say I'm disappointed, but we'll have to live with it," he said

[codeman671]

She should have ponied up... Can't feel bad about this. Irwin stepped up big time over her number.

[LIforrelaxin]

I agree with Codeman.... LakePort Landing had 30 years to figure this out, with the city... the lease ended and it was time to pay the piper...

I continue to wonder financially how well LakePort Landing is really doing....

While I agree with Woodsy that it would be a lose for the community... maybe it is time for some new blood in the Marina industry around the lake.

[fatlazyless]

So's .....what will Irwin's do with their new, high-visibilty addition.....will it be used for more boats.....or will it be used for pwc's, sno-mos, and maybe atv's? Maybe a canoe and kayak center.....no? .....hmmmm....probably not?

Oh well.....wait & see .... 24-months from now? Will Irwin Marine still be there ..... very similar to today......in the year 2065 when everyone is about 120-years old and still boating ...... ho-ho-ho?

[thinkxingu]

She should have ponied up... Can't feel bad about this. Irwin stepped up big time over her number.
Yes, but in my mind some of the money invested in the property should have been taken into consideration. Sometimes it's not just about the money.

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[brk-lnt]

Yes, but in my mind some of the money invested in the property should have been taken into consideration.

Technically, no. Typical lease terms (and I have no insight about this particular deal) are that any improvements revert to the landlord/property owner at lease end unless other arrangements have been made.

I'm not sure how I feel about the outcome of this. On one side, yes, LL had a long time to plan for this. But 30 years of runway does not mean they should be taken to the cleaners by the city either, IMO the property was way overvalued.

Does Irwins really *need* that parcel? They seem to have plenty of land, this whole thing almost seems mildly confrontational on Irwins part.

I hope Lakeport Landing continues to thrive in the area, we don't need any businesses going away.

[meredith weekender]

Codeman hit the nail on the head. If Lakeport landing really wanted the parcel and if it really meant something to them they would have given their best offer up front.

With the loss of the Formula Line and the attitude in the sales department they probably don't need the exposure and display space.

[sum-r breeze]

It's nice to see the good guys win.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[codeman671]

Sometimes it's not just about the money.



Unfortunately in business it usually is...

I have never done business with Lakeport Landing so I have no issue with them there. As far as my non-business related opinion, I was quite disgusted with Erica's actions a few years back and the overall entitlement, arrogance and disregard for others safety related to it. Sounds to me like they thought they could steal the property and got caught with their pants down. Irwin paid a few hundred grand more, obviously seeing the potential and won.

Although some may not think the property was worth much, commercial property can't be compared to residential. The opportunity value was high, high being that Irwin is next door and now can expand further. Also, high in that it will cost Lakeport plenty to relocate. As an owner of commercial/industrial property, prices out there are not cheap especially when it comes to specialized properties.

[meredith weekender]

It's nice to see the good guys win.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back



It is nice to see a family owned business that has been established in the area for what seems to be an eternity to keep investing in the area. The Irwin name is a staple in the lakes region and they are in it for the long haul.

[Broken Glass]

It is nice to see a family owned business that has been established in the area for what seems to be an eternity to keep investing in the area. The Irwin name is a staple in the lakes region and they are in it for the long haul.

Are you seriously saying that the Irwin family is a great family business?? A great family business that just forced their neighbors out of their place of business?? The Blizzards BOUGHT the property thirty years ago, but the great family business Irwin SUED the City all the way to Supreme Court. They forced the Blizzards to have to lease the land not buy it. Now that they have been neighbors for over thirty years, the great family business Irwin, has pulled the rug out from under Lakeport by over paying for the property. The Blizzard family worked just as hard the Irwin family for the last thirty years building their business. Lakeport invested alot of money on the property, maintained it, and paid property taxes on it for thirty years.

It appears that the Irwin business has won the battle. I think that really small people will rejoice in watching a hard working successful area business, get forced out of their business home.

Don't you have any appreciation at all for what has happened to a "family owned business that has been established in the area for what seems to be an eternity" ?????? And I am not talking about IRWIN

[sum-r breeze]

Unfortunately in business it usually is...

I have never done business with Lakeport Landing so I have no issue with them there. As far as my non-business related opinion, I was quite disgusted with Erica's actions a few years back and the overall entitlement, arrogance and disregard for others safety related to it. Sounds to me like they thought they could steal the property and got caught with their pants down. Irwin paid a few hundred grand more, obviously seeing the potential and won.

Although some may not think the property was worth much, commercial property can't be compared to residential. The opportunity value was high, high being that Irwin is next door and now can expand further. Also, high in that it will cost Lakeport plenty to relocate. As an owner of commercial/industrial property, prices out there are not cheap especially when it comes to specialized properties.

I have and I do. I'm not going to elaborate on my experience there.....but .....Irwin's has my business and always will. Class act, stem to stern.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' Back

[mcdude]

Laconia Daily sun


LACONIA — In an unexpected turn of events, a divided City Council on Monday night decided to sell the city property on Elm Street leased to Lakeport Landing marina for the past 30 years to Irwin Marine, its neighbor and competitor, for $528,000.
Taken aback by the decision, Erica Blizzard, the owner of Lakeport Landing, said that "the City Council has shown tonight that in this city you can buy whatever you want is you have enough money."
Councilors Ava Doyle (Ward 1), David Bownes (Ward 2), Henry Lipman (Ward 3) and Bob Hamel (Ward 5) voted to sell to Irwin Marine while Councilors Brenda Baer (Ward 4) and Arman Bolduc (Ward 6) dissented.
"I'm truly disappointed," said Baer after the vote. "I've been beaten many times on many subjects, but this time I'm truly disappointed." She was echoed by Bolduc who expressed his disappointment and remarked "we have to live with it".
The property, a 0.81 acre strip between the roadway and railway was leased to Lakeport Landing in 1985 for 10 years with two 10-year renewal periods. The lease will expire on October 31, 2015 and the tenant has no renewal rights. In 1987 Lakeport Landing constructed a 9,840-square-foot building on the lot. Under the terms of the lease, ownership of building will go to the city at the expiration date.
The City Council has wrestled with the issue since last October when Blizzard first asked about the future of the property. Councilors searched for a means of ensuring the firm retained control or gained ownership of the lot and building. At the same time, Irwin Marine, which abuts Lakeport Landing, expressed its interest and insisted the land and building should be sold by an open, competitive bidding process.
An independent appraiser pegged the value of the property at $480,000, well above the $331,400 initially offered by Lakeport Landing and $335,000 offered by Irwin Marine. After receiving the two offers the council asked City Manager Scott Myers to hold "informal conversations" with both parties to gauge their reactions to four conditions the council expected to attach to the sale of the property and report to the council when on Monday, June 8.
First, the city required the sale price to match or exceed the appraised value of the property.
The city sought an assurance that the owner of the property will not alter or demolish the existing building unless the change sustains or increases the existing taxable value of the property. If the current tenant is displaced by the sale, the city the date of possession by the new owner would be deferred for up to two years from the date of the closing to provide time for Lakeport Landing to secure new quarters. Should this provision be invoked, from when the lease expires, Lakeport Landing would pay a monthly rent consistent with the appraised value of the property. Finally, the property must be conveyed with easements enabling the city to maintain water and sewer lines as well as the retaining paralleling Union Avenue.
Myers wrote to both parties on June 1 and, in addition to outlining the conditions specified by council, asked each to submit their "highest and best offers" for the property to his office by 4 p.m. on Monday, June 8, the day of the regularly scheduled City Council meeting.
On June 4, Attorney Rod Dyer, representing Lakeport Landing, advised Myers that Blizzard questioned the independent appraisal of the property and said she would ask the council for an opportunity to commission a second appraisal, which would be presented to the council by the end of the month. He repeated the request when the council met on Monday and asked that any decision be deferred until the second appraisal was presented.
Instead, the council spent some 40 minutes in a non-public session, under the exception to the Right-to-Know permitting private discussion of the purchase, lease or sale of real property. When the public meeting reconvened, Mayor Ed Engler reviewed the process and said that the responses of both parties to the conditions set by the council were "accommodating". Then he announced that the highest and best offer submitted by Lakeport Landing matched its original bid of $331,400, without referring to its request for a second appraisal, while Irwin Marine had offered $528,000.
"Councilors, the floor is yours," the mayor then remarked and Lipman moved to accept the offer of Irwin Marine and authorize the city manger to enter a purchase and sales agreement. Bownes seconded the motion and the vote was taken.
"I'm shocked at the outcome," Dyer said, "and disappointed that the council did not allow us the opportunity to come forward with a more realistic appraisal."

[Chimi]

Both the city and Irwins should be ashamed. I hope it backfires on Irwin's, and also hope that people are disgusted with their actions and will both boycott Irwin's and support Lakeport. Hopefully Lakeport can secure another location somewhere on Union Ave, close to their current location. Too bad they didn't grab that building where Paugus Bay Marina just opened their showroom. I don't do business with either marina, but I can assure you that I will never spend a dime at Irwin's. I used to get gas at Mountain view, but since that's operated by Irwin's, I will now go elsewhere.

Maybe Irwin's will do the right thing and lease the building back to Lakeport?

[codeman671]

The city gave them both opportunities to ante up. Lakeport made no attempt to raise their bid, they submitted the same bid twice and tried to discredit the appraisal thinking they could work the system. Irwin played by the rules and went up almost $200k!

Lakeport has sold single boats worth more than they offered for the real estate.

What comes around goes around. In this case I feel that she got what's coming to her.

Heck, for $331k I would have bought it and leased it out....

[thinkxingu]

The city gave them both opportunities to ante up. Lakeport made no attempt to raise their bid, they submitted the same bid twice and tried to discredit the appraisal thinking they could work the system. Irwin played by the rules and went up almost $200k!

Lakeport has sold single boats worth more than they offered for the real estate.

What comes around goes around. In this case I feel that she got what's coming to her.

Heck, for $331k I would have bought it and leased it out....
I've heard many people say the appraisal was much higher than it should be, and Irwin's paid a lot more than THAT.

I think it was fair to expect at least one other appraisal and then have both parties go from there.

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[BroadHopper]

The appraisal was based before the fact that the city wants most of the parcel converted to public parking. So I think it is fair that the current appraisal is very high. LL was gambling on the appraisal in the July time frame showing a much lower value.

Also LL made over $500,000 in improvements that should have been calculated in the value. I agree with Codeman but as a financial analyst, Irwin Marine's bid is way over the value, and I believe shows a power grab. I wish them the best of luck recuperating the money.

City of Laconia is 'hungry for money'. Hamel has to pay for his huge mistake, the High school sport complex. He was hoping it will pay for itself by renting out to sport teams etc. It is not panning out and will get worst due to the changing demographics. Predicted even before his folly.

Kudos to Baer, although I am not a fan, I will give her a pat on the back to stand up for what is right for Lakeport sector of the city.

I strongly believe Irwin Marine is upset as the city been leasing waterfront to Paugus Bay Marina and LL for dock space. I will not be surprise Irwin will go after PBM.

[SAMIAM]

Irwins has a huge amount of frontage on Union Avenue.
To deprive Lakeport Landing of that little strip in such an underhanded way seems spiteful.
The intention seems to be not to help their business,but to hurt LL

[brk-lnt]

Irwins has a huge amount of frontage on Union Avenue.
To deprive Lakeport Landing of that little strip in such an underhanded way seems spiteful.
The intention seems to be not to help their business,but to hurt LL

Those are my thoughts exactly. I simply don't see that plot of land doing anything significant to affect Irwin's ability to run a successful business. It does however negatively affect Lakeport Landing.

I don't think Irwin's in bidding a market price, I believe they are attempting to use their resources to ultimately reduce competition and viability of boating in the area.

[fatlazyless]

So, what will Irwin do with their new high-visibility addition, the former Lakeport Landing property, starting maybe in 24-months from now?

Will it be more boats?

Will it be pwc's/sno-mo's?

Will it be atv's?

Will it be kayaks, canoes, small sailboats?
................

I have no clue, but my best so-called educated guess would be to use it for pwc's/sno-mo's, since that seems like a good all-year around fit for what they already have for a boats inventory, and I don't think Irwin's currently has any pwc's at Union Ave, Laconia.
................

If Irwin's gets a thirty year commercial mortgage, the $528,000 purchase price divided by 30 years equals $17600/year for thirty years plus the interest, and the entire amount is a deductible business expense against any profits.

So, the question is .... is this new addition worth paying $17,600 plus bank interest per year for 30 years plus property taxes. After 30 years, they would own it if they choose to go this mortgage route? That's like $2000/month or something, total?

Was purchasing this property from the City of Laconia for $528,000 a good business decision for Irwin's?

[codeman671]

So, what will Irwin do with their new high-visibility addition, the former Lakeport Landing property, starting maybe in 24-months from now?

Will it be more boats?

Will it be pwc's/sno-mo's?

Will it be atv's?

Will it be kayaks, canoes, small sailboats?
................

I have no clue, but my best so-called educated guess would be to use it for pwc's/sno-mo's, since that seems like a good all-year around fit for what they already have for a boats inventory, and I don't think Irwin's currently has any pwc's at Union Ave, Laconia.
................

If Irwin's gets a thirty year commercial mortgage, the $528,000 purchase price divided by 30 years equals $17600/year for thirty years plus the interest, and the entire amount is a deductible business expense against any profits.

So, the question is .... is this new addition worth paying $17,600 plus bank interest per year for 30 years plus property taxes. After 30 years, they would own it if they choose to go this mortgage route? That's like $2000/month or something, total?

Was purchasing this property from the City of Laconia for $528,000 a good business decision for Irwin's?

Your math is a bit flawed. Commercial loans are typically 20 years, not 30. Assuming 25% down which is a standard in commercial, you are looking more like $2600 per month plus taxes. Not sure what the tax bill is there. Still, a small price to pay for convenience and expandability. Granted I am sure they could afford to stroke a check and pay it outright.

[AC2717]

here it is period point blank!

THERE DOES NOT HAVE TO BE FEELINGS IN BUSINESS. what would someone not want to take out their competitor to generate more business for themselves

Now not saying this situation at hand is ethical, but if it is legal, then there is nothing to say about it, you choose where you want to spend your money. Everyone had a right to bid on the property and this is what happened. You cannot punish the winner because the others feelings were hurt. Someone might have chosen to over pay and only time will tell if it works out, someone might have tried to pay actual value and because they did not over pay will have that money in their pocket, who knows.

the beauty of Economics and Capitalism.:)
- it is apart of what makes this country great!

[sum-r breeze]

here it is period point blank!

THERE DOES NOT HAVE TO BE FEELINGS IN BUSINESS. what would someone not want to take out their competitor to generate more business for themselves

Now not saying this situation at hand is ethical, but if it is legal, then there is nothing to say about it, you choose where you want to spend your money. Everyone had a right to bid on the property and this is what happened. You cannot punish the winner because the others feelings were hurt. Someone might have chosen to over pay and only time will tell if it works out, someone might have tried to pay actual value and because they did not over pay will have that money in their pocket, who knows.

the beauty of Economics and Capitalism.:)
- it is apart of what makes this country great!

Do you want to talk ethics? Have a conversation with Kevin from Paugus Bay Marine about what was done to him by the Blizzards. I said it before on this forum and I will say it again. My old Italian grandmother used to warn me in broken English...."If you do bad things then bad things will happen to you." Business is business...leave your "feelings" at the door. Good business practices are rewarded and bad ones come back to bite you in the a$$

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[Just Sold]

My observation is that Lakeport Landing did not make a reasonable offer using the conditions put forth by the City Council. They tried to alter the conditions and that move blew up in their face. They lost fair and square to the higher bidder. That is what happens in any real estate deal be it commercial or residential. Erica Blizzard and Lakeport Landing made their bed and they have to sleep in it.

[brk-lnt]

My observation is that Lakeport Landing do not make a reasonable offer using the conditions put forth by the City Council. They tried to alter the conditions and that move blew up in their face. They lost fair and square to the higher bidder. That is what happens in any real estate deal be it commercial or residential. Erica Blizzard and Lakeport Landing made their bed and they have to sleep in it.

Of course everyone is assuming they had infinite financial resources to engage in a bidding war.

[Resident 2B]

My observation is that Lakeport Landing do not make a reasonable offer using the conditions put forth by the City Council. They tried to alter the conditions and that move blew up in their face. They lost fair and square to the higher bidder. That is what happens in any real estate deal be it commercial or residential. Erica Blizzard and Lakeport Landing made their bed and they have to sleep in it.

I agree. I understand Erica stated that money can buy whatever you want in Laconia. Not a direct quote, but that was the jest of her statement. Open bidding is clearly top bid gets the property as long as the minimum is met. That is the way it is.

R2B

[Charlie T]

Of course everyone is assuming they had infinite financial resources to engage in a bidding war.

If I had to guess I'd think that much of the financial reserves that Lakeport may have saved up over the years have gone to legal fees. I guess you reap what you sow

[sum-r breeze]

I agree. I understand Erica stated that money can buy whatever you want in Laconia. Not a direct quote, but that was the jest of her statement. Open bidding is clearly top bit gets the property as long as the minimum is met. That is the way it is.

R2B

Welcome to the real world Honey.....Time to put your big girl pants on!!

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[playinghooky]

The sale of Lakeport Landing to Irwin is unfair, reconsider it
Jun 11, 2015

In 1978, my family purchased Lakeport Landing Marina. They sold everything they had including a vehicle just for the down payment. My father came from less than nothing, but what he lacked in education and money, he made up for with hard work and determination. My parents struggled for years working every day to turn a boat yard, which looked more like a junk yard, into a marina. My father had a vision.

His vision was hindered in 1983 after he rightfully purchased the property located at 21 Elm St. from the City of Laconia for $25,000. An error was made by the city and Irwin Marine sued to block the sale. The mistake resulted in the city having to undo the transaction and return the money to my father.

We ended up with a 30-year lease instead which at the time was our only option. My father always believed that there was an understanding with the city that he had the first right to purchase the property at the end of the lease.

My father passed away on April 10, 2013. For most of my life, I have known how important obtaining this property was to him. I saw how disappointed he was at the end when he realized that his time was running out and this part of his vision from way back in 1978 had not been achieved.

Over the years, we invested over $500,000 in the property in the form of improvements, taxes and lease payments. Last fall we offered to purchase the property for $331,400, which is the assessed value. By this offer, we were essentially purchasing the showroom twice. We had made the lease payments for the last 30 years and also paid to build the building, which in 1983 was in excess of $200,000. It was the deal my father had to take 30 years ago and 30 years later, this is what the city of Laconia felt the property was worth.

I became aware that Irwin Marine also still wanted the property and intended to move aggressively to do whatever it took to obtain it. They are already the largest marina in the state of New Hampshire, so obtaining this property, which is a long, narrow strip of land less than one acre, was not going to give them any more exposure and very little additional space. I couldn’t help but think that it must be some sort of power play when their representatives bluntly told me that they would acquire the property and have much deeper pockets than Lakeport Landing to do so. They informed me that it “wasn’t personal, it was business.” After 37 years of being their neighbor it was both personal and business, bad business.

I was shocked when the City Council unexpectedly made their decision during a time where I felt we were still in the negotiation process. I believe there was a “rush to judgement” and lack of consideration when the final decision was made roughly 30 minutes after looking at the two offers.

Sure, the Irwin Marine offer was in excess of any reasonable value for the property, but I question whether the City Council really had time to consider the fairness of the two offers. Without committing to a final price, my offer included an agreement to keep a taxable building of the existing size on the property for a period of 50 years.

I also agreed to substantially increase the size of another building on Park Street, which would have added to the city’s tax roll. In the long run, the city would be making much more money with Lakeport Landing’s commitment to expand, than Irwin Marine’s one time overpayment.

The City Council took something special away from me to give to Irwin Marine, because they felt this was in the best interest of the city. Who is the city? Am I not part of the city? Is my family’s taxpaying dollars since 1978 not part of the city? Are my employees who live here not part of the city? Was it fair to view both parties as identical even though Lakeport Landing has invested hundreds of thousands into the property and Irwin Marine has invested nothing?

The City Council still has the opportunity to “get it right,” if any one of the four councilors (Bownes, Doyle, Hamel or Lipman) would move to reconsider Monday’s vote to sell the property to Irwin Marine and acknowledge that the process of our negotiations may not have been properly followed.

Erica Blizzard

Laconia

[Joebon]

It's amazing that people don't read the leases/contracts they sign. Someone that entitled deserves what has happened.

[BroadHopper]

desperately needs parking for the valet service and those who trailer their boats and use the launch ramp. I was told that was the original goal of the land purchase, for parking. Since the city is looking for more parking, this has to be the carrot on the end of the stick.

[codeman671]

desperately needs parking for the valet service and those who trailer their boats and use the launch ramp. I was told that was the original goal of the land purchase, for parking. Since the city is looking for more parking, this has to be the carrot on the end of the stick.

Tearing down the building and turning it into a parking lot, although suiting Irwin's needs, will lower the assessed value of the property and cost Laconia in reduced tax revenue.

[sum-r breeze]

Irwin Marine is the most respected name in the boating industry of the lakes region for reason..........They earned it..............Lakeport Landing is not.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[Little Bear]

Irwin Marine is the most respected name in the boating industry of the lakes region for reason..........They earned it..............Lakeport Landing is not.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

On what do you base this assessment/opinion?

[sum-r breeze]

On what do you base this assessment/opinion?

Personal experience with both businesses. I wouldn't be this opinionated without direct interaction with both.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[BroadHopper]

I have personal experience with both businesses. My family and the Irwins grew up together. Although Blizzard is a 'late comer', he has the family's trust and have given us plenty of business.

They are both trusted businesses with similar philosophies. The siblings are the differences, with more modern philosophies that my generation may or may not agree. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

I have bought boats and supplies from both businesses. Irwin appeals to the middle class while LL appeals to the upper class as far as sales, yet LL has lower gas prices, lower slip and storage fees. Both have excellent maintenance facilities, Bruce and Ron are excellent to deal with, but major repairs and troubleshoot goes to Dave's Motorboat Shop.

I have never had experience with PBM, although Paul and Jack has a few 'choice words' about Kevin. I am sure Kevin has a few words about their business as well. That is what competition is all about.

Business is game. Pick you battles ladies and gentlemen!

[sum-r breeze]

I have personal experience with both businesses. My family and the Irwins grew up together. Although Blizzard is a 'late comer', he has the family's trust and have given us plenty of business.

They are both trusted businesses with similar philosophies. The siblings are the differences, with more modern philosophies that my generation may or may not agree. Everyone is entitled to their opinions.

I have bought boats and supplies from both businesses. Irwin appeals to the middle class while LL appeals to the upper class as far as sales, yet LL has lower gas prices, lower slip and storage fees. Both have excellent maintenance facilities, Bruce and Ron are excellent to deal with, but major repairs and troubleshoot goes to Dave's Motorboat Shop.

I have never had experience with PBM, although Paul and Jack has a few 'choice words' about Kevin. I am sure Kevin has a few words about their business as well. That is what competition is all about.

Business is game. Pick you battles ladies and gentlemen!

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with the upper class/ middle class assessment of the cliental. Irwin marine sells entry level boats but it also sells Meridian Yachts one of which is the largest (and probably most expensive) in MVYC. This diverse boating customer base ensures that when someone gets into boating as a young family, who can only afford "so much" boat, they will continue as customers as their financial position improves with age. Irwin treats their trailer boat customers with the same caring and appreciative attitude as they do with the big end sales. I know because I've been on both ends of that spectrum. People in the service business need to think along the lines of how the person on the other side of the counter would like to be treated. I use a saying frequently in my business "You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem." Think about what has transpired and how you can make things better instead of denying and stonewalling the solution. A satisfied customer will tell three people...a dissatisfied one will tell three hundred.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[Rich]

"You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem."

I'm glad you have had great dealings with Irwin, perhaps it was in the past?

I had a major problem brewing with one of their sales persons, I emailed all the current owners and upper management about it. Not one even took the time to say "What's going on", or "Sorry this is going on", nor even a "Thanks for being a customer".

So now I believe those that say that the sons are not running the business the same way as their father did. Just my opinion from doing business with them in the last 3 and 4 years.

Some on their staff are great, but their upper management seemed that they couldn't have cared less. Oh, I wasn't making a small purchase from them, just sayin! ;)

I haven't had any business (yet) with Lakeport Landing, so I can't comment on them at all. But based on my personal experience with Irwin, I'm happy to tell anyone that asks that I wasn't happy with the way they handled my transaction (and several aspects of delivery). I'll give them the benefit of change, because the sales person I was dealing with is now gone, and this can only be an improvement for them. But their upper management didn't care at the time to look into what was going on, so as long as they are still in control, I don't believe their reputation is as great as they once were.

So I'll repeat your quote:
"You can always tell the type of business you are dealing with when you go to them with a problem."

Exactly! :rolleye1:

[sum-r breeze]

I'm glad you have had great dealings with Irwin, perhaps it was in the past?

I had a major problem brewing with one of their sales persons, I emailed all the current owners and upper management about it. Not one even took the time to say "What's going on", or "Sorry this is going on", nor even a "Thanks for being a customer".

So now I believe those that say that the sons are not running the business the same way as their father did. Just my opinion from doing business with them in the last 3 and 4 years.

Some on their staff are great, but their upper management seemed that they couldn't have cared less. Oh, I wasn't making a small purchase from them, just sayin! ;)

I haven't had any business (yet) with Lakeport Landing, so I can't comment on them at all. But based on my personal experience with Irwin, I'm happy to tell anyone that asks that I wasn't happy with the way they handled my transaction (and several aspects of delivery). I'll give them the benefit of change, because the sales person I was dealing with is now gone, and this can only be an improvement for them. But their upper management didn't care at the time to look into what was going on, so as long as they are still in control, I don't believe their reputation is as great as they once were.

So I'll repeat your quote:


Exactly! :rolleye1:

Sent you a PM with some contact info

[Rich]

Thanks for the PM

[secondcurve]

The sale of Lakeport Landing to Irwin is unfair, reconsider it
Jun 11, 2015

In 1978, my family purchased Lakeport Landing Marina. They sold everything they had including a vehicle just for the down payment. My father came from less than nothing, but what he lacked in education and money, he made up for with hard work and determination. My parents struggled for years working every day to turn a boat yard, which looked more like a junk yard, into a marina. My father had a vision.

His vision was hindered in 1983 after he rightfully purchased the property located at 21 Elm St. from the City of Laconia for $25,000. An error was made by the city and Irwin Marine sued to block the sale. The mistake resulted in the city having to undo the transaction and return the money to my father.

We ended up with a 30-year lease instead which at the time was our only option. My father always believed that there was an understanding with the city that he had the first right to purchase the property at the end of the lease.

My father passed away on April 10, 2013. For most of my life, I have known how important obtaining this property was to him. I saw how disappointed he was at the end when he realized that his time was running out and this part of his vision from way back in 1978 had not been achieved.

Over the years, we invested over $500,000 in the property in the form of improvements, taxes and lease payments. Last fall we offered to purchase the property for $331,400, which is the assessed value. By this offer, we were essentially purchasing the showroom twice. We had made the lease payments for the last 30 years and also paid to build the building, which in 1983 was in excess of $200,000. It was the deal my father had to take 30 years ago and 30 years later, this is what the city of Laconia felt the property was worth.

I became aware that Irwin Marine also still wanted the property and intended to move aggressively to do whatever it took to obtain it. They are already the largest marina in the state of New Hampshire, so obtaining this property, which is a long, narrow strip of land less than one acre, was not going to give them any more exposure and very little additional space. I couldn’t help but think that it must be some sort of power play when their representatives bluntly told me that they would acquire the property and have much deeper pockets than Lakeport Landing to do so. They informed me that it “wasn’t personal, it was business.” After 37 years of being their neighbor it was both personal and business, bad business.

I was shocked when the City Council unexpectedly made their decision during a time where I felt we were still in the negotiation process. I believe there was a “rush to judgement” and lack of consideration when the final decision was made roughly 30 minutes after looking at the two offers.

Sure, the Irwin Marine offer was in excess of any reasonable value for the property, but I question whether the City Council really had time to consider the fairness of the two offers. Without committing to a final price, my offer included an agreement to keep a taxable building of the existing size on the property for a period of 50 years.

I also agreed to substantially increase the size of another building on Park Street, which would have added to the city’s tax roll. In the long run, the city would be making much more money with Lakeport Landing’s commitment to expand, than Irwin Marine’s one time overpayment.

The City Council took something special away from me to give to Irwin Marine, because they felt this was in the best interest of the city. Who is the city? Am I not part of the city? Is my family’s taxpaying dollars since 1978 not part of the city? Are my employees who live here not part of the city? Was it fair to view both parties as identical even though Lakeport Landing has invested hundreds of thousands into the property and Irwin Marine has invested nothing?

The City Council still has the opportunity to “get it right,” if any one of the four councilors (Bownes, Doyle, Hamel or Lipman) would move to reconsider Monday’s vote to sell the property to Irwin Marine and acknowledge that the process of our negotiations may not have been properly followed.

Erica Blizzard

Laconia

Is it just me or is this lady highly offensive? "An error was made" which allowed the sale to be blocked? I wonder what the lease payments were for all these years? Probably a pittance? She should have bid above the appraisal price ($480,000) if she wanted the property. Her sense of entitlement is obnoxious.

[secondcurve]

Tearing down the building and turning it into a parking lot, although suiting Irwin's needs, will lower the assessed value of the property and cost Laconia in reduced tax revenue.

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

[HellRaZoR004]

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

Until they get reappraised the following year, or the file for it to be reevaluated.

[meredith weekender]

One of the stipulations that the City of Laconia had was that the property could not be altered in a way that reduce the taxable value of the property and therefore reduce the tax due on the property. This information is in the article published by the Laconia Sun on May 28, 2015 and is in an earlier post on this thread.

[codeman671]

Not true. If Irwin outbids Lakeport by a couple hundred thousand dollars the property tax bill will be calculated on the higher sales price regardless of what is done with the building.

Not true. If someone buys a property with a building on it and rips down the building the value is worth less and can be reassessed accordingly. Sales price and assessments don't usually match 100% anyhow. My home is proof of that, so weren't my last two. In fact, probably every one I have ever owned shows the same.

From Meredith Weekender's post above it appears that Laconia already thought of this and put in a clause to prevent them from altering the property in a way that would reduce the tax base.

[Sunbeam lodge]

Is it just me or is this lady highly offensive? "An error was made" which allowed the sale to be blocked? I wonder what the lease payments were for all these years? Probably a pittance? She should have bid above the appraisal price ($480,000) if she wanted the property. Her sense of entitlement is obnoxious.

From a financial viewpoint LL said they have spent $500k in improvements over the 30 years . $200 k for a building the rest was for taxes, lease payments. First the 200 k in building was an asset that is fully recovered through depreciation and a reduction in Fed taxes. The other $300k over 30 years amounts to $10k a year for taxes and lease payments. Can anyone sell millions of dollars of boats on that property and only pay $800 for taxes and lease payments. In addition those are normal cost of doing business and in their tax bracket the net cost after taxes would only be half that amount. They should have made a creditable bid as they have had a great deal over the years and they could then depreciate the cost of the new building over its useful life.

[secondcurve]

Not true. If someone buys a property with a building on it and rips down the building the value is worth less and can be reassessed accordingly. Sales price and assessments don't usually match 100% anyhow. My home is proof of that, so weren't my last two. In fact, probably every one I have ever owned shows the same.

From Meredith Weekender's post above it appears that Laconia already thought of this and put in a clause to prevent them from altering the property in a way that would reduce the tax base.

I stand corrected. Thanks

[laketrout]

There is always room for compromise in this case between Irwin and Lakeport/Blizzard's but the deep pockets won out this time. However I do not the whole story :confused:

[secondcurve]

There is always room for compromise in this case between Irwin and Lakeport/Blizzard's but the deep pockets won out this time. However I do not the whole story :confused:

Why should there be a compromise? The city was selling a property and two parties were interested. One party bid modestly above the appraised value and the other party bid significantly below the appraised value? Given the difficult fiscal condition most cities and towns face today it is incumbent to maximize value where possible. If the selectman sold the property to the lower bidder that would be equivalent to stealing from the Laconia tax payers.

[BroadHopper]

Why should there be a compromise? The city was selling a property and two parties were interested. One party bid modestly above the appraised value and the other party bid significantly below the appraised value? Given the difficult fiscal condition most cities and towns face today it is incumbent to maximize value where possible. If the selectman sold the property to the lower bidder that would be equivalent to stealing from the Laconia tax payers.

The problem is spending the money wisely. With the current track record it will be like throwing money down the drain! :cool:

[fatlazyless]

In today's Saturday Union Leader, article says that Erica Blizzard would have bid more had she known it would go to the highest offer, and she is asking the city council to re-consider their decision.

Sounds like there was some type of miss-communication or miss-understanding between the two parties, the City of Laconia and Erica,or maybe she just got incorrect council from her attorney?

hmmmm.....doesn't a higher price usually send the loudest message?


The vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2 city councilors, so stay tuned to see if the vote is again 4-2 to not re-consider? This seems to be getting over-complicated?

[meredith weekender]

Lakeport Landing (Erica) had her chance to put in her best and final bid. She chose to keep her bid amount the same. Irwin outbid Lakeport and therefore they won the bid. End of story, DONE.

[Resident 2B]

How can anyone running a business not understand the open bidding process? Even worse, how does she continue to carry on like she was fooled? Unbelievable in my opinion. If the bidding is re-opened because Erica did not understand what was happening and then she wins, why would Irwin not bring a costly lawsuit against the City of Laconia?

When you are in the game, you learn the rules before you play the game. Ignorance of the rules is not something you complain about after you lose.

R2B

[secondcurve]

How can anyone running a business not understand the open bidding process? Even worse, how does she continue to carry on like she was fooled? Unbelievable in my opinion. If the bidding is re-opened because Erica did not understand what was happening and then she wins, why would Irwin not bring a costly lawsuit against the City of Laconia?

When you are in the game, you learn the rules before you play the game. Ignorance of the rules is not something you complain about after you lose.

R2B

R2B

I wouldn't worry too much about the bidding process being reopened after Blizzard called out the councilmen in the newspaper. Any chance of a second look at the matter went out the window when she chastised the councilmen publicly.

[fatlazyless]

Well ..... in a few days or so ... time will tell what happens with a possible re-consideration. As already mentioned, the vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2, so's it is probably safe to assume the two will vote yes to a re-consideration, and then it would require just ONE of the four votes to switch for a 3-3 vote. At that point, am not sure what the protocol is..... does a tie 3-3 vote then go to the mayor to decide in case of a tie vote?

And, then the bids would be higher, with more money for the city, so's the city would most likely get a higher price if a re-consideration is the outcome ..... that would make a bigger income .... for the City .... more money, more money, more money....ka-ching, ka-chang, ka-ching ... for the City!

[Lakeboater]

Well ..... in a few days or so ... time will tell what happens with a possible re-consideration. As already mentioned, the vote to accept the higher offer was 4-2, so's it is probably safe to assume the two will vote yes to a re-consideration, and then it would require just ONE of the four votes to switch for a 3-3 vote. At that point, am not sure what the protocol is..... does a tie 3-3 vote then go to the mayor to decide in case of a tie vote?

And, then the bids would be higher, with more money for the city, so's the city would most likely get a higher price if a re-consideration is the outcome ..... that would make a bigger income .... for the City .... more money, more money, more money....ka-ching, ka-chang, ka-ching ... for the City!

I believe that the reconsideration vote has to come from 2 of the councilman that were in favor of the sale to Irwin not the 2 that opposed the sale.

[fatlazyless]

www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/86971-will-council-reconsider-marina-vote


.... and here's hope'n that this link actually works! Say-hey....it actually works....am I good....or am I good......I am the greatest!:eek: ...ugh!

.....now, back to figuring out what the h is going on with Lakeport Landing and Irwin's as they duke it out for a long narrow .81 acre of land, owned by the City of Laconia, that is apparently very dear to both of them!

[Patiently Watching]

What a waste of time and money...

If this property were really important to her, she would have bid accordingly.

[secondcurve]

www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/86971-will-council-reconsider-marina-vote


.... and here's hope'n that this link actually works! Say-hey....it actually works....am I good....or am I good......I am the greatest!:eek: ...ugh!

.....now, back to figuring out what the h is going on with Lakeport Landing and Irwin's as they duke it out for a long narrow .81 acre of land, owned by the City of Laconia, that is apparently very dear to both of them!

Thanks FLL. Blizzard was surprised that the city voted to sell to Irwin? What part of "submit your highest and best offer" did she not understand? Irwin won fair and square. Further, Laconia could use these funds for any of a number of good causes such as reinvestment in the Weirs, etc. I will be dumfounded if their original decision is reversed.

[BroadHopper]

Irwin's was well aware Blizzard bid, so they bid higher. I'm surprised Blizzard did not counter offer unless Irwin bid was at the last minute and Blizzard did not have a chance to for a counter offer. I've seen this before in other bids around the country. Certainly not fair but like everything else it is a game played within the rules.

[Resident 2B]

Irwin's was well aware Blizzard bid, so they bid higher. I'm surprised Blizzard did not counter offer unless Irwin bid was at the last minute and Blizzard did not have a chance to for a counter offer. I've seen this before in other bids around the country. Certainly not fair but like everything else it is a game played within the rules.

Aren't these sealed bids due in hand on a date and time made public to all? If so, there is no counter bidding.

This was a re-bid, so going into it, both parties knew what the other bid on the first round in which both bids were rejected by Laconia as being unacceptably low. That, in itself, told both parties to bring their bids up. Irwin increased their bid, but Blizzard did not.

R2B

[Patiently Watching]

Should have put her best foot forward - no surprise who the other bidder would be and their potential motivation.

Once again, she gambled and big. Nothing new...

[secondcurve]

Should have put her best foot forward - no surprise who the other bidder would be and their potential motivation.

Once again, she gambled and big. Nothing new...

And likely she will lose big, AGAIN.

[Broken Glass]

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

[sum-r breeze]

Personal experience with both businesses. I wouldn't be this opinionated without direct interaction with both.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back
No change... same story......balls or not

[codeman671]

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

It has been covered over and over again. The rules were set in place, Erica didn't listen to what the city was asking for, didn't pony up and lost out. She is crying over spilt milk.

Irwin played by the rules and had bigger ones than she had.

I am a business owner in a market that takes a serious pair to be competitive in. Lots of personal financial risk involved and the reward isn't what it used to be, so I do take exception to your comment of being without balls, hiding behind a keyboard....I am sure others on this thread are not just keyboard jockeys with nothing more to do than sit around and be judgmental as well.

Many of us do know the players involved. Irwin has been a long standing name in the lakes region, maybe more so than Blizzard.

[Descant]

If posters want to keep repeating nothing new, this thread should be moved to the "Issues:" pages.

[fatlazyless]

As I understand it, there are six voting councilors and just off the top of my head, it will take two of the four councilors who voted yes to accept the Irwin-522k offer to vote yes to a re-consideration. Brenda Baer, and Armand Bolduc support the efforts of the Lakeport Landing business probably because it has been there for 30-years in its effort to purchase their .81 acre land and buildings.

These two, Baer and Bolduc, sounded pretty adamant in their suppost for the Blizzards and Lakeport Landing, so's only time will tell if they can convince two out of the other four councilors to go along with a re-consideration ..... plus, of course....it would most likely mean the City of Laconia would receive a higher price.

Oh ye all six councilors ...... take a good deep look into your hearts and just ask yourself: What is the right thing to do here?

[secondcurve]

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

When Ms. Blizzard started pointing fingers in her editorial she opened herself up to public criticism. She obviously feels that she is entitled to preferential pricing on the asset her family has profitably leased for the past 30-years. She fails to note in her editorial that her business has earned many times the $16,666.70 in annual lease payments, taxes, building expense, etc., much of which was tax deductible, it has paid over the past 30-years. Many tax payers and forum members do not feel a substantial discount is warranted at the expense of the hard working taxpayers of Laconia. The city is under financial stress and it would be unfair to offer Blizzard preferential pricing on a valuable city asset regardless of the length of time her business has been in Laconia. The city has gone above and beyond already by extending her lease an additional 2-years to allow for a smooth transition. Hopefully, the matter will be closed once and for all in the near term. I apologize if I have offered anyone, including Ms. Blizzard, but it is best to graciously move on when things do not go one's way, especially when the playing field was level.

[BroadHopper]

As I understand it, there are six voting councilors and just off the top of my head, it will take two of the four councilors who voted yes to accept the Irwin-522k offer to vote yes to a re-consideration. Brenda Baer, and Armand Bolduc support the efforts of the Lakeport Landing business probably because it has been there for 30-years in its effort to purchase their .81 acre land and buildings.

These two, Baer and Bolduc, sounded pretty adamant in their suppost for the Blizzards and Lakeport Landing, so's only time will tell if they can convince two out of the other four councilors to go along with a re-consideration ..... plus, of course....it would most likely mean the City of Laconia would receive a higher price.

Oh ye all six councilors ...... take a good deep look into your hearts and just ask yourself: What is the right thing to do here?

The other four wants to build a new high school off Parade Road! That's a waste of money! School enrollment been declining since the '70's. Graduating class is the smallest since the '40's. And they need a bigger school? They already spent millions in the Huot Center and the sport complex at the site and they want to move the school? I have been at odds with Baer for years and this is the first time I ever commended her.

Our tax dollars at work going down the drain...................

[Tank151]

It takes a lot of balls to survive in business these days. It takes no balls at all to sit back and criticize someone that you admittedly don't even know. This thread has turned into a disturbing bunch of comments, from people that get big balls behind their keyboard, but really have no balls at all....

Great remark - couldn't have said it better myself!

[fatlazyless]

......like wow....and holy smokes....that's pretty amazing how this finally ended up Monday night, July 13.....with the councilor's voting 3-3, and the deciding vote cast by the mayor to not re-consider, and to accept the much higher offer from Irwin's.



Most likely, having the mayor be responsible for the deciding vote could have swayed the six councilors to split their votes by 3-3, as opposed to making the decision themselves, and serving up the ball into his court.



Is it all over, or will there be a follow up lawsuit ... and isn't that what happened originally, 30-years ago, back in 1985..... a lawsuit which lead to the creation of the three 10-year leases.



Back 30-years ago, in 1985, Irwin Marine sued the City of Laconia because it felt it had been an unfair sale, and now 30-years later, in 2015, it seems likely that Lakeport Landing will sue the City of Laconia because it feels it is an unfair sale.

[Seaplane Pilot]

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/88171-lakeport-landing-sues-city-of-lac-over-bid-award

I hope they stick it to the City of Laconia.

[fatlazyless]

So's ...... what to do with the money?

Wouldn't it be nice if the City of Laconia directs all their $528,000 Irwin Marine high offer bid toward the construction of the www.wowtrail.org ...... making several miles ..... Laconia to Meredith .... about 9-miles total .... of the Winnipesaukee waterfront available to the public for the WOW trail, walking and bicycling paved trail ...... $528,000 public money well spent! You could probably go bicycling from April 1 to December 10, give or take a couple weeks, depending on the natural snowfall. That could be a very happening bicycle and walking, public rail-trail ....... like WOW!


Once it finally gets built, people will say 'so how come we didn't do this 30-years ago .....the WOW trail is super-duper.' It would bring a lot of people on bicycles through the Weirs Beach area.

[AC2717]

So's ...... what to do with the money?

Wouldn't it be nice if the City of Laconia directs all their $528,000 Irwin Marine high offer bid toward the construction of the www.wowtrail.org ...... making several miles ..... Laconia to Meredith .... about 9-miles total .... of the Winnipesaukee waterfront available to the public for the WOW trail, walking and bicycling paved trail ...... $528,000 public money well spent! You could probably go bicycling from April 1 to December 10, give or take a couple weeks, depending on the natural snowfall. That could be a very happening bicycle and walking, public rail-trail ....... like WOW!


Once it finally gets built, people will say 'so how come we didn't do this 30-years ago .....the WOW trail is super-duper.'

yeah because they should take away private property of others and give it to the public who will neglect it. that ship sailed years ago. I for one if were an owner on that proposed trail would fight it tooth and nail

next useless comment????

[Mr. V]

next useless comment????

How about this useless comment:

Why wasn't the property sold by a competitive, public bidding process, i.e. at public auction, where each prospective purchaser knows what the other bidders have bid, and has the opportunity to increase their own bid?

That would be fair and transparent.

[SAMIAM]

yeah because they should take away private property of others and give it to the public who will neglect it. that ship sailed years ago. I for one if were an owner on that proposed trail would fight it tooth and nail

next useless comment????

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs. Can't think of a better use for waterfront property. Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

[Major]

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs.Can't think of a better use for waterfront property.Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

Phase III of the WOW trail will never happen. They can't even get financing for Phase II. The expense of connecting Lakeport to Paugus Park Road alone is cost prohibitive, let alone the warchest of funds South Down and Long Bay have collected to fight the expansion.

[Winnisquamer]

Another trail for people to do drugs and leave drug paraphernalia on. I don't even enjoy walking to my car in Laconia never mind that new trail.

[Phantom]

Wouldn't that be nice......a beautiful chain link fence all the way from Lakeport the the Weirs.Can't think of a better use for waterfront property.Bet Southdown owners would be thrilled.

That's a shame because one thing MA does have is some pretty nice "Rail Trails" ..... including one in my town that winds between currently two towns (Hudson/Marlboro) with plans for five towns (Acton/Maynard/Stow/Hudson/Marlboro)

http://www.townofhudson.org/public_documents/hudsonma_exec/ARRT


http://www.traillink.com/state/ma-trails.aspx
.

[Woodsy]

WOW Trail is a GREAT idea...

But that being said there is NO reason why there has to be an ugly chain link fence between the trail and the railroad tracks... The state is way off on this. Its not like this is a high speed rail corridor!!!

As far as Southdown Shores goes, they can fight, bitch and complain all they want... They DO NOT OWN the RR tracks or the waterfront! The State of NH does! They might get a court to delay the project, but inevitably it will happen. The state can start by NOT renewing the leases on the docks & waterfront and revoke the existing RR Track crossings... Ultimately the state will prevail. Especially when the Right of way is in the plans originally submitted for Southdown.

Sorry if I offended some of my Southdown friends.. but I absolutely abhor the NIMBY attitude of some people... The lake is for EVERYONE!

Woodsy

[Resident 2B]

I also hope the WOW trail gets completed without a fence. This is public land that should be enjoyed by the public. It is that simple.

No idea why the SDS folks think they can stop it. They need to read the documents they should have received when they purchased. Their docks are connected to shoreline SDS does not own. Biggest reason I did not buy there.

R2B

[Major]

I also hope the WOW trail gets completed without a fence. This is public land that should be enjoyed by the public. It is that simple.

No idea why the SDS folks think they can stop it. They need to read the documents they should have received when they purchased. Their docks are connected to shoreline SDS does not own. Biggest reason I did not buy there.

R2B

My understanding is that the right of way does not necessarily extend to the water's edge, but is defined by a certain width. I am not an expert on SD/LB legal position, but we are certainly well funded for a fight.

Practically speaking, if the Wow trail folks can't raise $1M or so to complete Phase II, there is absolutely no way they will be able to raise the $10M+ to complete Phase III. Right now it's a pipe dream.

[secondcurve]

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/newsx/local-news/88171-lakeport-landing-sues-city-of-lac-over-bid-award

I hope they stick it to the City of Laconia.

Apparently the issue is Mr. Blizzard and now his daughter believe that there was a right of first refusal extended to them on the property but there wasn't any paperwork executed or filed with the land court. Verbal agreements, if in fact there was one, don't mean much with respect to real estate. In fact they mean nothing. I think they are wasting time and money but if you get good counsel sometimes you can prevail. It will be interesting to watch it work its way through the courts. If Blizzard is successful reversing the Pending sale, I'd imagine the city will be sued by Irwin for breech of contract. What a mess.

[BroadHopper]

When it comes to court cases has not been good. I often wonder if they ever seek legal council before they open their mouths? Or financial advise for that matter as in the case citizens are ask to fill a w-9 form so that they can receive refunds? I wonder where they got their city manager?

[BroadHopper]

A while back the good governor Hassen had the idea to 'rent' the railroad rights to the folks that actually use the land between the tracks and the water line. You heard right the state can reap in a huge sum of money in this venture. It is still in the works and legally can happen! I can see Southdown spending huge sum of money to prevent this from happening.

Oh and the state can allow the WOW trail to venture next to the tracks through Southdown legally! It will happen eventually!

Same as the old Lake Shore Railroad! A number of property owners between Glendale and up to just before Ame's Farm had to remove structures built on the old rail bed for the Winni sewer project back in the 80's. There is an effort going on to make a bike trail on the old bed between Gilford and Alton. It can happen despite property owners saying they can't use their land. If they look at their deeds the state never gave up the rights. I can see all those McMansions on Rte 11 either torn up or move for the new bike trail or the eventual goal of the Winni Basin Sewer Project to surround the lake with a sewer line.

[winnipiseogee]

My family is from Cape Cod and I can remember all the bitching when the rail trail was proposed down there. Same complaints we hear in the lakes region about derelicts using the trail, invasion of people's privacy (because apparently the property owners didn't realize they had a railroad in their back yard when they bought the place).

Of course now the Cape Cod rail trail is a huge and unqualified success. Property values of homes immediately near the trail have seen HUGE increases because everyone wants to be near the trail. Of course sometimes karma doesn't seem to work and the people that bitched the most had the biggest financial gain from the trail.

[brk-lnt]

My family is from Cape Cod and I can remember all the bitching when the rail trail was proposed down there. Same complaints we hear in the lakes region about derelicts using the trail, invasion of people's privacy (because apparently the property owners didn't realize they had a railroad in their back yard when they bought the place).

Of course now the Cape Cod rail trail is a huge and unqualified success. Property values of homes immediately near the trail have seen HUGE increases because everyone wants to be near the trail. Of course sometimes karma doesn't seem to work and the people that bitched the most had the biggest financial gain from the trail.

The general opposition to the trail in Southdown has been the ugly chainlink fence requirement. Personally, I don't think it will get much use, I think a lot of it will end up collecting trash (just look at existing segment), and I also think the general enthusiasm from the people who started this project has died down.

It's not exactly like Southdown is some impenetrable fortress, nobody is really worried about people "sneaking" in via the WOW trail, but people ARE concerned about an ugly fence. The only upside is that the fence would likely help keep the geese off the larger green areas.

[BroadHopper]

It's not exactly like Southdown is some impenetrable fortress, nobody is really worried about people "sneaking" in via the WOW trail, but people ARE concerned about an ugly fence. The only upside is that the fence would likely help keep the geese off the larger green areas.

Amen to that! Sort of like keeping the illegal immigrants at bay!

The Lake Shore railroad bed is obvious. I can't see how land owners don't see that there was a railroad bed through their property!

[thinkxingu]

Can someone explain why they would be a fence requirement? This would be along the shore, right?

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[fatlazyless]

Opinion article about the progress of the WOW Trail from last Monday, August 17:

www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/opinion/columns/88166-gretchen-gandini-are-we-there-yet

"The WOW Trail will be a treasure for the City of Laconia. It will help build community, provide a healthy opportunity for people to gather and exercise, and will also beautify an area near the tracks that would otherwise remain unkempt. We are proud to be part of such a community-based effort."

[brk-lnt]

Can someone explain why they would be a fence requirement? This would be along the shore, right?

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

Because of the worry that people are too stupid and/or self-involved to notice a giant, noisy train coming down the tracks. Also, running over a person on the tracks would be bad for business for the Winnipesaukee railroad.

[thinkxingu]

Because of the worry that people are too stupid and/or self-involved to notice a giant, noisy train coming down the tracks. Also, running over a person on the tracks would be bad for business for the Winnipesaukee railroad.
Gotcha. Sad state of affairs that Stand By Me moments are thwarted by fences!

Sent from my XT1528 using Tapatalk

[wifi]

Wait, the lawyers need feeding too :)

[SAMIAM]

Opinion article about the progress of the WOW Trail from last Monday, August 17:

www.laconiadailysun.com/index.php/opinion/columns/88166-gretchen-gandini-are-we-there-yet

"The WOW Trail will be a treasure for the City of Laconia. It will help build community, provide a healthy opportunity for people to gather and exercise, and will also beautify an area near the tracks that would otherwise remain unkempt. We are proud to be part of such a community-based effort."

Beautify with a chain link fence?
There are lots of wonderful walking trails in the lakes region...they are called sidewalks

[AC2717]

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense:rolleye2:

[dave603]

Most rail trails are also for Bikes.
Your not supposed to be riding a bike on the sidewalks.

[AC2717]

Most rail trails are also for Bikes.
Your not supposed to be riding a bike on the sidewalks.

put a trail on the sidewalk, they do on streets

[dave603]

Is there room to do that in the route described? Probably not.

Bikers along that stretch would be a nightmare if they have to stay on the road, unsafe for them and drivers.

[LongBay]

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense:rolleye2:

Or how about just posting signs pointing up to Gunstock where there are lots of under utilized walking, hiking and biking paths already funded by Belknap county taxpayer money.

Oh that idea makes too much sense also.

Now back to the original post...
How about just using the new money collected from the sale of the Lakeport property to help pay down the Laconia debt burden so that local taxes don't go up for a change. :cheers:

Oh yea, this idea also makes too much sense :idea:

[AC2717]

Is there room to do that in the route described? Probably not.

Bikers along that stretch would be a nightmare if they have to stay on the road, unsafe for them and drivers.

plenty of room on the waterfront side of weirs blvd

[BroadHopper]

now that this thread is officially hijacked why does it need to go that way
why don't they just complete the sidewalks down union ave (has lake views) then down lake st to weirs blvd sidewalks all along the waterfront down the road? SO Lakeport and down union street infront of Irwins, to the cemetery (which will give those stores business) then left at the cemetery and in front front of the margate and then bam, you are on the waterfront right after the margate and a few properties. Most of the sidewalk is already completed and then meet up with the rail over the bridge and dumps into the weirs

beautiful views and there is already a road easement and fencing down the road and it will be a lot cheaper to finish the sidewalks

oh wait it makes way too much sense:rolleye2:

I have address the issue about turning the old lake shore railroad bed between the Water works and the old burger king property and link up to the existing bike path in back of MacDonald's. You can ask the now infamous Cafula of Hathaway House fame, owner of the Dunkin Dognuts on Union Ave. why we couldn't use the old rail bed. The city has already witness almost fatal bike/pedestrian accidents along that stretch of Union Ave. How many more accidents do we need to convince the good folks to do the right thing?

[Phantom]

Looks like a new development ..... or I'm behind in the news

http://www.laconiadailysun.com/newsx/local-news



.

[8gv]

The purchase price of $528,000 is about sixty years worth of rent at $8,750/year.

I suspect that both marinas are unhappy with the deal. That means it's a good deal. :D

[Outdoorsman]

It appears that the Irwin business has won the battle. I think that really small people will rejoice in watching a hard working successful area business, get forced out of their business home.

Don't you have any appreciation at all for what has happened to a "family owned business that has been established in the area for what seems to be an eternity" ?????? And I am not talking about IRWIN

Karma is a bitch!

[fatlazyless]

Oh well ..... looks like Erica got stopped for a first time, hands-free cell phone violation by a state trooper in Laconia in September, and she is contesting it ..... live and learn? Wonder if getting stopped and cited for a violation was enough to get her to start using the 'hands on the steering wheel' blue-tooth? Her trial has been scheduled for January 25.

A first time, hands-free violation has a $124 fine, according to the article in today's Laconia Citizen.

"If the glove don't fit, then you must acquit!" ..... or something like ..... if you get a text, then make it wait till next!

http://www.citizen.com/news/2015-12-05/Local/Blizzard_contests_handsfree_violation.html

[secondcurve]

Oh well ..... looks like Erica got stopped for a first time, hands-free cell phone violation by a state trooper in Laconia in September, and she is contesting it ..... live and learn? Wonder if getting stopped and cited for a violation was enough to get her to start using the 'hands on the steering wheel' blue-tooth? Her trial has been scheduled for January 25.

A first time, hands-free violation has a $124 fine, according to the article in today's Laconia Citizen.

"If the glove don't fit, then you must acquit!" ..... or something like ..... if you get a text, then make it wait till next!

http://www.citizen.com/news/2015-12-05/Local/Blizzard_contests_handsfree_violation.html

Your link didn't work. Below is the article:

Blizzard contests hands-free violation
By BEA LEWIS
LACONIA – A city woman convicted in 2011 of negligent driving for nearly hitting a State Trooper attempting to stop her SUV on I-93 as she fiddled with her cell phone, is challenging a ticket for violating the state's new hands free law.

Erica Blizzard, 42, 65 Gold St., Laconia, was issued a citation by New Hampshire State Trooper Russell Holmes, after he stopped her 2013 GMC Yukon on Union Avenue, Laconia on Sept. 16, at 5:18 p.m.

She pleaded not guilty on Sept. 23 and appeared in the 4th Circuit District Division Laconia Court on Dec. 2, for a pretrial conference. Her trial has been scheduled for Jan. 25 at 8:30 a.m.

Presiding Judge James Carroll has recused himself from hearing the case. Prior to being named to the bench, Carroll was Belknap County Attorney and prosecuted Blizzard for causing a speedboat accident that killed her best friend.

In 2010, she was convicted of failing to keep a proper lookout when she ran aground on Diamond Island on Lake Winnipesaukee in 2008. Stephanie Beaudoin of Meredith, was killed in the crash, and Blizzard, and another passenger Nicole Shinopulos of Burlington, MA., were seriously injured.

She was sentenced to 12 months in jail, but was freed on work release after serving 35 days.

New Hampshire's hands-free law went into effect on July 1. Conviction on a first offense is punishable by a $124 fine. Motorists are now prohibited from using hand held electronic devices while driving, or temporarily halted in traffic for a stop sign, traffic light or other temporary delay. The ban includes cellular telephones, Global Positioning Systems (GPS’s), tablets, IPADS, IPODS, or any other devices that require data entry.

In August, Blizzard who operates Lakeport Landing Marina, filed suit against the City of Laconia, challenging the legality of the City Council's decision to sell as surplus to competitor Irwin Marine, the property her late father, Paul, built a boat showroom on and had rented from the city.

Since the hands-free law went into effect, the majority of the citations that have come before Judge Carroll have been resolved by being placed on file without a finding on the condition the defendant completes a defensive driving course within 60 to 90 days with proof to the court and the state, coupled with a good behavior mandate ranging from six months to a year.

[MalibuResponse]

I thought this thread was about a business real estate transaction and not someone getting pulled over for a traffic violation? I guess this goes to show you that there isn't much going on in the lakes region this time of year if the newspapers can only find this subject to write about.

[noreast]

How much is bluetooth? I'm sure the suv has hands free. Sometimes bad things just happen to good people. Nah, just a total lack of respect.

[Just Sold]

Warring marinas to square off in court.

http://www.citizen.com/news/2016-01-29/Local/Warring_marinas_to_square_off_in_court.html?utm_so urce=getresponse&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nhbr&utm_content=NH+Business+Review+News+Browser

[AC2717]

because of Stupidity (no matter which side you are on)

ding, ding, ding, lawyers win!!!!!

[BroadHopper]

Been spending an awfully lot of money of litigation fees lately. And losing! Seems like the lawyers paying PAC to the council?

[ericnh]

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.

[DUSTOFF]

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.I thought the Lakeport Landing property was bought by Irwin's?

[upthesaukee]

I thought the Lakeport Landing property was bought by Irwin's?
Irwin has bought land owned by Laconia and had been leased by Lakeport Landing. Lease ran out and there was not any extention. Irwin's and Lakeport Landing put in a bid, and Irwins was higher.

Still in litigation the last I heard, as to the legality of the bidding process.

[TiltonBB]

Lakeport Landing will still have the waterfront location with fuel, sales, service and numerous boat houses and boat slips rented to tenants.

The property that they may lose in about 18 months is the building and land on Union Ave that they have leased from the city of Laconia for 30 years.

[sum-r breeze]

A lot of nice people work at Lakeport Landing and Erica is one of them. I don't think it is fair or nice to pick on her... I guarantee that there are people in your family that make mistakes and I bet you wouldn't appreciate them being called out in a public forum.

So sorry but I beg to differ.......When you do bad things .....Bad things happen to you.

The Breeze
Wave 'cuz I'll be wavin' back

[fatlazyless]

Is hard to believe that such a contentious, long litigated ownership argument between Lakeport Landing, the City of Laconia, and Irwin Marine seems to result with a truly win-win-win outcome for all involved ..... including the Laconia property tax payer and Laconia residents and boaters and the two marina businesses and Bike Week and the Winni Railroad .... winners all around!

There was a builder's drawing of the future re-constructed Lakeport Fire Station as new home for Lakeport Landing marina ....... anyone have any information on what Irwin's plans to do with the existing Lakeport Landing building after it takes possession on November 1, 2017. Will Irwin be using it for Sea-Doo and Ski-Doo, ...... or what? ..... like will it have 200-different kayaks on display..... and 22'-long, single rowing sculls ...... maybe start selling and re-stringing tennis racquets and turn the top floor of their new building into a yoga studio?