NH Prices!

[mikea]

Very interested in reading about the proposed 9% hike in local taxes and the possibility of Income Tax introduction. This got me thinking about comparisons with prices here in the UK, perhaps some of you kind people might like to fill in the gaps: -

UK
Income Tax rates and taxable bands
Rate
2012-13 2013-14
Starting rate for savings: 10%*
£0-£2,710 £0- £2,790 (approx $0 - $4,435)
Basic rate: 20%
£0-£34,370 £0-£32,010 (approx $0 - $50,895)
Higher rate: 40%
£34,371-£150,000 £32,011- £150,000 (approx $50,896 - $238,500)
Additional rate: 50%
Over £150,000 N/A (approx $238,500 plus
45% from 6 April 2013
Over £150,000 Over £150,000

Then we have 20% VAT (Purchase Tax) on virtually everything purchased, including services. (few exceptions)

Home owners pay local Council Rates based upon their property value band. This provides the basic local council facilities, police contribution and refuse collection
I currently pay circa £1,440 per annum (approx $2,290)

Then we have horrendous utility prices, electricity, Gas, Water (all plus VAT!)

So what about the basics: -

Gallon of Unleaded Petrol (Gas) £7.00 per gallon (approx $11.00 per Gallon)

Loaf of Standard Sliced Bread £1.70 (approx $2.70)

Pack of 20 Marlboro £7.50 (approx $12.00)

Pint of Beer £3.50 (approx $5.60)

and so it goes on....

So how do you think this compares?

[LakeSnake]

That is exactly why we like living in the USA, and why some of us are a quite upset at some of the current trends. Nothing personal but some of us don't want the USA turned into the UK.

[mikea]

That is exactly why we like living in the USA, and why some of us are a quite upset at some of the current trends. Nothing personal but some of us don't want the USA turned into the UK.

Believe me... you won't get any arguments from me on that count!

[AC2717]

Unfortunatley That is where most of us or at least 50% of us see this going and the other half amost wants this

maybe this thread should be publicized

sorry for the quick rant, but yeah you would not be paying anything close to that hear, of course it is all income related in NH would just be Federal income and then property taxes so i think form the get go there is no contest
like a GFBL boat in a race against a Kayak (oh wait can I mention that LOL:D:rolleye2::D

[songkrai]

We all elect the same people but with different names or different parties.

Then there are the unfunded mandates. Find a real or imaginary problem, pass a law to fix it. But don't fund it.

The latest thing down below is the license plate scanners. Who pays for this? Are these something we need or just want?

What about the drones that NH has acquired. Each needs a trained pilot. And no mention of selling the airplanes that state authorities already have. Who pays for these?

We all have a regional SWAT team in addition to the state SWAT team. Why do we have to pay for both?

All officers cars have a fully automatic military M-16. All. Do we really need this with associated training for such. We still have the state authorities that have same. Why more? We are all paying for the state team, and paying for a local team.

No one has fixed the adequate education issue. Still bouncing around in Concord.

One county has a new bus service paid for by a short term grant and the state and the cities and towns. Yet we have local church volunteers that will drive anyone almost anywhere almost any time to almost any destination. Why a limited bus service paid for with local, county and state funds?

The list goes on and on.

[christo1]

5.60 for a beer wow!

[LIforrelaxin]

The list does go on and on... And indeed people in this country and in NH are quite upset with the current trends. Yet despite all the complaints and the controversy The People, Yes We the People don't seem to want to do what needs to be done to start make way for change. People need to get involved with the government and their elected officials... And once in a while when there is a public hearing on an issue, show up and make their voice heard.

Until people are will to get active, the country and state governments will continue to operate in their current manor, as they never have faces to put with the complaints.

[dpg]

All officers cars have a fully automatic military M-16. All. Do we really need this with associated training for such. We still have the state authorities that have same. Why more? We are all paying for the state team, and paying for a local team.

Because when these cops go to calls that's what their being shot at with their just looking to level the playing field and I don't blame them on that one.

[Airedale1]

All officers cars have a fully automatic military M-16. All. Do we really need this with associated training for such. We still have the state authorities that have same. Why more?

Folks here in NH learned the answers to your questions back in August of 1997 when a heavily armed NH resident went on a shooting rampage and killed two state troopers, a female judge, who he shot in the back and a newspaper editor and wounded three other law enforcement officers before being shot to death in a firefight with police.

[SAMIAM]

We all elect the same people but with different names or different parties.

Then there are the unfunded mandates. Find a real or imaginary problem, pass a law to fix it. But don't fund it.

The latest thing down below is the license plate scanners. Who pays for this? Are these something we need or just want?

What about the drones that NH has acquired. Each needs a trained pilot. And no mention of selling the airplanes that state authorities already have. Who pays for these?

We all have a regional SWAT team in addition to the state SWAT team. Why do we have to pay for both?

All officers cars have a fully automatic military M-16. All. Do we really need this with associated training for such. We still have the state authorities that have same. Why more? We are all paying for the state team, and paying for a local team.

No one has fixed the adequate education issue. Still bouncing around in Concord.

One county has a new bus service paid for by a short term grant and the state and the cities and towns. Yet we have local church volunteers that will drive anyone almost anywhere almost any time to almost any destination. Why a limited bus service paid for with local, county and state funds?

The list goes on and on.

You forgot to mention the air conditioned station wagon for the Moultonborough PD canine.

[wifi]

You forgot to mention the air conditioned station wagon for the Moultonborough PD canine.

We don't want the canine to get stressed and bite anyone :emb:

[Grandpa Redneck]

All officers cars have a fully automatic military M-16. All. Do we really need this with associated training for such. We still have the state authorities that have same. Why more? We are all paying for the state team, and paying for a local team.

Because when these cops go to calls that's what their being shot at with their just looking to level the playing field and I don't blame them on that one.

This is FALSE, they are NOT being shot at with AUTOMATIC rifles and certainly not with M-16s

[Waterbaby]

This is FALSE, they are NOT being shot at with AUTOMATIC rifles and certainly not with M-16s

What do you think the Chief of Police in Greenland was shot with, along with the officers who were wounded by Mutrie? That wasn't all that long ago.....

[Grandpa Redneck]

What do you think the Chief of Police in Greenland was shot with, along with the officers who were wounded by Mutrie? That wasn't all that long ago.....

According to news reports the only guns found at the scene were a 9mm pistol and a 357 revolver, and it was the 9MM pistol that was used to kill the Chief. NO automatic weapons

"Automatic" weapons (this includes M16's) are illegal for the general public to own and have been for MANY years.

[JPC]

"Automatic" weapons (this includes M16's) are illegal for the general public to own and have been for MANY years.

But semi automatic assault weapons (AK47) are not!

[Grandpa Redneck]

But semi automatic assault weapons (AK47) are not!

I am not going to get into the gun debate here, BUT The people that know little to nothing about guns should do research on them before talking about them, and I dont mean learn from hollywood movies or the ignorant media.

An Assault weapon as defined by the US military (they should know what one is) is a medium caliber weapon that is capable of full automatic /select fire. NOT a semi auto.

A semi automatic AK-47 (as sold in the US)or AR-15 are NOT assault weapons, they are simply semi automatic rifles that "LOOK LIKE" military assault rifles. they do NOT function like military assault rifles, never have never will. They are no more deadly than any huinting rifle, and in fact the rounds fired by AKs and ARs are actually ballisticly inferior to any hunting round.

calling an AR or AK an assault weapon is like calling a car a racecar because someone installed a set of shiny wheels and a hood scoop

please educate yourselves on gun facts, not misinformation and assumptions.

And with that I am done with the subject,

[mikea]

Sorry but I believe the AK-47 was actually designed by Mikhail Timofeevich Kalashnikov as an assault rifle and in it's various guises has been the weapon of choice by many armies worldwide...

http://kalashnikov.guns.ru/

Anyhow, I think maybe there has been a wee bit of thread drift here?

Any chance of returning to the original subject please. Ta muchly.

Mike A

[Grandpa Redneck]

Sorry but I believe the AK-47 was actually designed by Mikhail Timofeevich Kalashnikov as an assault rifle and in it's various guises has been the weapon of choice by many armies worldwide...

http://kalashnikov.guns.ru/

Anyhow, I think maybe there has been a wee bit of thread drift here?

Any chance of returning to the original subject please. Ta muchly.

Mike A

Again the AK as sold to the general public in the USA is in SEMI-auto only, and NOT an assault weapon the AK assault weapon is FULL AUTO, big difference in function there.

[Rusty]

Any chance of returning to the original subject please. Ta muchly.

Mike A

You must remember that the majority of Americans have never been abroad.
They probably know there is a Spain but couldn’t find it on a map. The American media doesn’t speak much about Europe, or the rest of the world. The issues facing the “EU” are of absolutely no interest to most Americans. Polls show that most Americans have a negative feeling toward the UN.

Most Americans don’t know that a cookie is a Biscuit, a truck is a Lorry, potato chips are Crisps, vacation is a holiday, trunk is a boot, hood is a bonnet, diaper is a nappy, doctors office is surgery, thick sausage is a banger etc.

IMO this is the best country in the world, but we are a little out of touch with other cultures.

Cheers! :D

[songkrai]

I think the orginal post was about the cost of living with hints of taxes and fees.

Every candidate for govenor I have listened to stated to do away with waste, fraud, and abuse.

Benson was one of the better ones. Let a real business man run things and all would be done. After 2 years with little to account for he stated he needed two more years. He was booted out. So much for a business man to clean things up. Lots of blame to go around but the bottom line is that the business man Benson did zilch.

Many want all of the services and stuff that the state/cities/towns have.
Don't cut the license plate scanners as they may find some bad guys. Don't cut the drones as they may catch some speeders. Don't cut the military M-16 in every officer car as there may possibly be a shoot out even though we all have two SWAT teams. One regional - one state. Both doing exactly the same job.

Anyone who has been in the military knows the difference between military rifles and the rifles sold to civilians.

Someone brought up Carl Drega. Well go read up on that character. What caused that character to go bezerk?

All seem to want to cut but just don't cut items you want but not necessarily needed.

If this state keeps spending on items as today - this state will end up with an income tax.

Some/all have to just say no. Stop buying. No more "stuff".

[tis]

I think the orginal post was about the cost of living with hints of taxes and fees.

Every candidate for govenor I have listened to stated to do away with waste, fraud, and abuse.

Benson was one of the better ones. Let a real business man run things and all would be done. After 2 years with little to account for he stated he needed two more years. He was booted out. So much for a business man to clean things up. Lots of blame to go around but the bottom line is that the business man Benson did zilch.

Many want all of the services and stuff that the state/cities/towns have.
Don't cut the license plate scanners as they may find some bad guys. Don't cut the drones as they may catch some speeders. Don't cut the military M-16 in every officer car as there may possibly be a shoot out even though we all have two SWAT teams. One regional - one state. Both doing exactly the same job.

Anyone who has been in the military knows the difference between military rifles and the rifles sold to civilians.

Someone brought up Carl Drega. Well go read up on that character. What caused that character to go bezerk?

All seem to want to cut but just don't cut items you want but not necessarily needed.

If this state keeps spending on items as today - this state will end up with an income tax.

Some/all have to just say no. Stop buying. No more "stuff".


So true. As I recall, Benson was voted out because he wanted to cut state workers and that didn't go over big at all. They got out in force and voted him out.

[Onshore]

Someone brought up Carl Drega. Well go read up on that character. What caused that character to go bezerk?


I met with Mr. Drega for about an hour two weeks before the incident in Colebrook. He was not so angry at government as some folks would have you believe. I have read articles about him that portray him as a standard bearing constitutionalist persecuted by government officials that finally made some sort of heroic stand. That is not the man that I met. The man that I met was also not an incoherent, raving, belligerent bully. He did not "go bezerk." His actions were pre-meditated; well-thought out, cold, and calculated. To my knowledge he did not carry or use anything that would qualify as an assault rifle nor did he need any type of "high capacity" magazine. He was very efficient with his rounds. His example really should not be used in the argument against assault rifles nor for giving the police automatic weapons.

And besides, he has little to do with the current price of real maple syrup, gas on the lake, or a dozen ear of corn at the local farmstand...

[Onshore]

You may find that while gas here is cheaper you spend just as much if not more money getting around because mpg is lower, you will need drive everwhere due to the lack of public transportation, and we don't have the sort of village environment that allows one to simply walk to the neighborhood butcher, baker, or convenience store to get day to day things you may need.

My experience in the UK is limited to passing through Heathrow. However, I have spent a fair amount of time in Italy (a very different country and econmy, I know). One of the biggest differences I have noticed there other than fuel ($12/gallon last year) is in construction materials. If you enjoy "do it yourself" type projects and spend time in some hardware stores you may notice some serious differences in the prices of things like lumber, stone, and concrete. Also one might think that tools such as spades, hammers, and the like are univeral in design. This is not necessarily the case.

Another area of possible difference is techonology costs. I am not a "Mac person" but my friends are and they claim that things like iPads and iPhones are approximately a third of the cost here as compared to Europe. I would be curious to know if that is true.

[ITD]

{Snip}
An Assault weapon as defined by the US military (they should know what one is) is a medium caliber weapon that is capable of full automatic /select fire. NOT a semi auto.

{Snip}



Grandpa, is this definition in print anywhere officially that can be found on the Web? If so could you post a link? Thanks in advance.

[ITD]

Back to the original topic.... The issue with these increases, such as the proposed county increase, is that once they happen, they never go away, and are never used to take the burden off of other tax streams. It's the same issue with spending, once spent it becomes part of the budget, then is added into the next year's "budget" along with COL style increases which is called the "baseline" for the next year. They basically automatically increase the spending, call it a baseline, then increase or "cut" from there. When you start really paying attention it is unbelievable how fundamentally dishonest the process and lingo are and how the process is so stacked against the tax payer.

[mikea]

You may find that while gas here is cheaper you spend just as much if not more money getting around because mpg is lower, you will need drive everwhere due to the lack of public transportation, and we don't have the sort of village environment that allows one to simply walk to the neighborhood butcher, baker, or convenience store to get day to day things you may need.

My experience in the UK is limited to passing through Heathrow. However, I have spent a fair amount of time in Italy (a very different country and econmy, I know). One of the biggest differences I have noticed there other than fuel ($12/gallon last year) is in construction materials. If you enjoy "do it yourself" type projects and spend time in some hardware stores you may notice some serious differences in the prices of things like lumber, stone, and concrete. Also one might think that tools such as spades, hammers, and the like are univeral in design. This is not necessarily the case.

Another area of possible difference is techonology costs. I am not a "Mac person" but my friends are and they claim that things like iPads and iPhones are approximately a third of the cost here as compared to Europe. I would be curious to know if that is true.

I can see your logic re gas prices but I'm sure that I'd prefer to have the choice of paying $3 to $4 a gallon and decide upon my fuel use / engine size rather than be forced to pay $11 to $12 per gallon knowing that 80% is taxes! Interesting example time? My car in the UK is a Citroen C5 Estate with a 2.2 litre straight 4 diesel which gives me an average return of circa 45 mpg and in the UK, this car is considered quite large. However, my previous car was a Land Rover Discovery 2 with a 4.6 Litre V8 petrol engine that gave me an average of 14 to 18 mpg ... Horrific cost to run...

DIY in the UK is similar to much of the rest of Europe, depends whether you buy trade or at the rip off mega stores... I have experience of UK, France and Spain in this, all as bad as each other!

Finally, Apple prices in the UK... here are a few examples (using an XR of 1.587 at todays commercial rate)

iPad Mini from base model @ £269 ($427) to Top model £529 ($839)
iPad 4 from base model @ £399 ($633) to Top model £659 ($1045)
iPhone 5 (unlocked) from £529 ($839) to £699 ($1109)
iMac from £1099 ($1745) to Fully loaded £3558 ($5645)

All prices taken from Apple store Direct.

Most of my Apple kit is actually purchased in the US by either my son or myself with the exception of my iPhone which I get for free on my cell contract... so another comparison : -

My cell contract is for 24 months and included my iPhone 4S (pre- 5 launch)
and includes 2000 mins to any UK landlines or other cellphone per month, 5000 UK SMS per month, unlimited calls to other users on my network and unlimited / unmetered 3G connectivity. For this I pay £36 ($57) per month inclusive of tax.

what else can we compare?

[HellRaZoR004]

I can see your logic re gas prices but I'm sure that I'd prefer to have the choice of paying $3 to $4 a gallon and decide upon my fuel use / engine size rather than be forced to pay $11 to $12 per gallon knowing that 80% is taxes! Interesting example time? My car in the UK is a Citroen C5 Estate with a 2.2 litre straight 4 diesel which gives me an average return of circa 45 mpg and in the UK, this car is considered quite large. However, my previous car was a Land Rover Discovery 2 with a 4.6 Litre V8 petrol engine that gave me an average of 14 to 18 mpg ... Horrific cost to run...

DIY in the UK is similar to much of the rest of Europe, depends whether you buy trade or at the rip off mega stores... I have experience of UK, France and Spain in this, all as bad as each other!

Finally, Apple prices in the UK... here are a few examples (using an XR of 1.587 at todays commercial rate)

iPad Mini from base model @ £269 ($427) to Top model £529 ($839)
iPad 4 from base model @ £399 ($633) to Top model £659 ($1045)
iPhone 5 (unlocked) from £529 ($839) to £699 ($1109)
iMac from £1099 ($1745) to Fully loaded £3558 ($5645)

All prices taken from Apple store Direct.

Most of my Apple kit is actually purchased in the US by either my son or myself with the exception of my iPhone which I get for free on my cell contract... so another comparison : -

My cell contract is for 24 months and included my iPhone 4S (pre- 5 launch)
and includes 2000 mins to any UK landlines or other cellphone per month, 5000 UK SMS per month, unlimited calls to other users on my network and unlimited / unmetered 3G connectivity. For this I pay £36 ($57) per month inclusive of tax.

what else can we compare?

Wow, you have a cheap cell phone plan. I pay $69.22 for my service and I'm 'lucky' to be grandfathered into my plan.

450 minutes to any US landline/cell.
Unlimited in-network cellphone calls.
500 text messages
Unlimited data (this is where I am grandfathered in, they recently changed it so you have to pay for how much you use).

o0o, and to top it off - this is with a 20% discount!

[songkrai]

I met with Mr. Drega for about an hour two weeks before the incident in Colebrook. He was not so angry at government as some folks would have you believe. I have read articles about him that portray him as a standard bearing constitutionalist persecuted by government officials that finally made some sort of heroic stand. That is not the man that I met. The man that I met was also not an incoherent, raving, belligerent bully. He did not "go bezerk." His actions were pre-meditated; well-thought out, cold, and calculated. To my knowledge he did not carry or use anything that would qualify as an assault rifle nor did he need any type of "high capacity" magazine. He was very efficient with his rounds. His example really should not be used in the argument against assault rifles nor for giving the police automatic weapons.

And besides, he has little to do with the current price of real maple syrup, gas on the lake, or a dozen ear of corn at the local farmstand...

Too many just don't wish to read up on or can comprehend that actual facts in this case.
A tragedy yes.
But what led up to this was completely unnecessary.

[Grandpa Redneck]

Grandpa, is this definition in print anywhere officially that can be found on the Web? If so could you post a link? Thanks in advance.

http://gunfax.com/aw.htm

http://www.assaultweapon.info/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_rifle

[NBR]

Most of the so called assualt rifles pictured on TV are not necessarily true assualt weapons in that they are not capable of automatic fire. Automatic Fire means you hold the trigger and the rifle continue to fire. Semiautomatic means you must release the trigger after each shot before you can shoo again.

I want hammers and the like banned or at least regulated more stringently than fire arms. Last year many more people were killed by blunt insturments than by assualt rifles

[John A. Birdsall]

When in Vietnam, we used the M-16 for fishing. but they sort of tore up them fish when the automatic was used.

Rifles, guns, do not kill people, bullets assist people in there quest to do wrong. However there is no need for the general public to have automatic weapons. Nor do they need clips that hold more than 7 rounds.

[Onshore]

what else can we compare?

Things like utility costs can vary significantly through the region and thus might be hard to compare.

Aside from trap shooting what are your hobbies? Do you like to cook / grill? What is the price of a good steak in the UK? Do you have pets, children, or both and what types of things might they need?

[mikea]

Shore Things, nice to hear from you and thanks for replying. I'd certainly be interested to know what sort of unit prices you have to pay for your utilities (round figure average) All ours appear to do is go up 5% here and 10% there apparently to cover inflation (that currently runs around 2 to 3% pa here)

Yep. love my clay shooting though I have to confess I prefer Sporting and Skeet to Trap but when there isn't much choice, then Trap it is! Aside from shooting I enjoy a round of golf and watching soccer (albeit my playing days are a little behind me these days) and Motor Racing of virtually any type and naturally, when I am able, to jump on a sled or quad.

However most of my time goes upon my business and whats left gets used up being bullied by my three grandchildren, which I hold my hands up and confess, is my favorite of the lot.

There you go... a potted history... hows about you guys?

[BroadHopper]

The state needs to find a way to raise revenue to finance the state budget.
As an economist I always argue throwing away all tax structures and replace it with a VAT system (Value added tax). The beauty of this is if you don't spend your money (savings), you don't get taxed. If you spend your money (buy), you pay a tax. You pay more tax when you buy a luxury item (Escalalade) then if you buy a cheap item (Sentra). It is as simple as that. You don't need all kinds of tax breaks (401K etc.) and you closed all the loopholes. Everyone pays the same precentage and the haves pay more than the have-nots. On top of this there will be a corporate tax to even out the score.
The total state budget must be a percentage of the state's GNP. Thus the income as well as the budget will follow the GNP. Simple as that.
No tax preperation, no tax auditions, etc. The general public can save money by not attending tax courts and tax preperations.
Of course goods will cost more but the govt is not garnering your pay check. It is something that we have to get use to. On the long run we won't be bickering with tax rates among the rich and famous.

The trouble is most of our law makers are lawyers and this system is going to hit them in the wallet, so I don't see this happening. :(

[mikea]

Do you know what, I agree with your sentiments completely but regrettably, the concept will not fly... VAT / IVA call it what you will as a stand alone taxation medium will not function due to the inherent greed of the people in power!

Europe introduced VAT (we currently pay 20% on virtually all purchases in the UK) but if we take gas as an example, we pay VAT not only on the petrol or diesel, but also upon the levies and other taxes already charged... So we are paying 20% tax on taxes and this same scenario applies to Beers, Wines, Spirits, Cigarettes and a number of other things.

On top of this we pay Income Taxes and National Insurance payments on our earnings, Property Taxes, Local council Taxes, Stamp duties when we purchase a property and capital gains taxes if we sell and make a profit.

We have a National Health System so called funded by our National Insurance Payments but then find when we go to the dentists we have to pay, when we go to the Doctors, we have to pay for prescriptions and so on...

No... sorry, VAT to me is a little akin to Marxism, great in theory but unworkable in practice!...

And Broadhopper, I love your last statement ...

The trouble is most of our law makers are lawyers and this system is going to hit them in the wallet, so I don't see this happening.

In the UK, change Law Makers to Politicians and Lords and then realise how we big a problem we have!...:eek2:

Mike A

[tis]

When they get a new tax, the old one never goes away or gets lower, not matter what they say. They NEVER have enough money. The more they get, the more they spend and until we as citizen stop expecting government to take care of us from birth to death, this will never change.

[SIKSUKR]

However there is no need for the general public to have automatic weapons. Nor do they need clips that hold more than 7 rounds.

I agree with the AW's but good luck with that 7 round clip when 3-4 people break in your house like what was the case in the Mont Vernon murder of Kim Cates a few years ago.

[Grandpa Redneck]

One more time, the General Public Does NOT have AUTOMATIC Weapons.
The AR-15 and the AK-47 as sold to the general public are ONLY SEMI-AUTO.

And SIKSUKR I completely agree that it is a good idea to have as many rounds available as possible for self defensive purposes.

The only person that has anything to fear from a law abiding citizen with any gun and any size magazine is a criminal intending to harm that citizen or their family.