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Old 07-25-2012, 09:27 AM   #1
Boston Fireguy
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Default Credit Card Fraud ?

Last week CapitalOne notified me of an attempted use of our credit card account number in Russia for a train ticket here in the U.S.A. It closed the account and now I wait for the new cards. My wife recently used her card in the Lakes Region where the retailer had to make an imprint of her card due to a computer shutdown. It could be just a coincidence but I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced a similar, recent situation.
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:11 AM   #2
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I had someone charge $2,000 to my card in Italy a few years ago. Never been there and had to go through the waiting for a new card. Seems to happen often.
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:56 AM   #3
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Unfortunately, it is a common occurrence. I had my identity stolen several years ago. The short story is that someone opened an account at FreeCreditReport.com using my SS number and established an identity using security questions referring to the Lakes Region, so I know the theft occurred here. This is ironic as I am a resident of South Florida, the fraud capital of the world. Two years ago, unrelated to the identity theft described above, someone fraudulently filed my Federal Income Tax online and stole my refund.

I should add, I have always shredded documents and am quite careful in these areas. In my opinion, theft of SS numbers occurs largely as a result of ones SS # being the same as Medicare number which is needed in any interaction with the medical system.

It is a tough world out there, the Lakes Region provides no immunity.
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Old 07-25-2012, 10:57 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boston Fireguy View Post
Last week CapitalOne notified me of an attempted use of our credit card account number in Russia for a train ticket here in the U.S.A. It closed the account and now I wait for the new cards. My wife recently used her card in the Lakes Region where the retailer had to make an imprint of her card due to a computer shutdown. It could be just a coincidence but I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced a similar, recent situation.
Most places that take credit cards have a slider in case there is a computer or credit card terminal. Definitely something to keep an eye on after this happens but it is probably legit.
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Old 07-25-2012, 11:03 AM   #5
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I don't use my credit card in restaurants anymore. Cash only. I will not allow anyone to dissappear around the corner with my card. I watch everything. That's just the way it is in the computer age. NB
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Old 07-25-2012, 11:08 AM   #6
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I was wacked last year, used it during bike week. Someone kindly paid their $700 utility bill in Montana ... I've never even been to Montana...

Last week a relative was hit with $1500 of their LL Bean CC.. It's a common thing nowa days..
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Old 07-25-2012, 12:11 PM   #7
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Default Keep an eye on all bills

I use several cards for A LOT of $$$$ each month for business expenses. About every 2-3 months I have charges posted to one of my accounts that are fraudlent. My suggestion is to scour every credit card statement and don't be afraid to dispute a charge. It's a PITA to change accounts but in this world where felons simply get a slap on the wrist it is necessary.
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:33 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoBozo View Post
I don't use my credit card in restaurants anymore. Cash only. I will not allow anyone to dissappear around the corner with my card. I watch everything. That's just the way it is in the computer age. NB
My husband and I own a small restaurant and recently got a debit card reader for card transactions. Cheaper for us to have customers use their card as a debit and the card never leaves the customer's hand. I am amazed at how many people still say to put it through as a credit card and don't mind if the staff wanders away with the card, I could see if they didn't have a choice, but they do.

Not that I think our staff would do anything like that but you never know.....
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:48 PM   #9
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My husband and I own a small restaurant and recently got a debit card reader for card transactions. Cheaper for us to have customers use their card as a debit and the card never leaves the customer's hand. I am amazed at how many people still say to put it through as a credit card and don't mind if the staff wanders away with the card, I could see if they didn't have a choice, but they do.

Not that I think our staff would do anything like that but you never know.....
I have mine run as a credit card, as the machines tend to hold onto the pin numbers with each transaction.
Unless it is a local place that I know that they will get charged more with a credit card type transaction then I go debit
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:29 PM   #10
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I did find a foolproof payment but the stores are not willing to go along with it. I brought in a few furs that I trapped and tried to make a trade.
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Old 07-25-2012, 03:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GsChinadoll View Post
My husband and I own a small restaurant and recently got a debit card reader for card transactions. Cheaper for us to have customers use their card as a debit and the card never leaves the customer's hand. I am amazed at how many people still say to put it through as a credit card and don't mind if the staff wanders away with the card, I could see if they didn't have a choice, but they do.

Not that I think our staff would do anything like that but you never know.....
I don't understand why people get so worried about credit card fraud (vs. something more damaging like identity theft).

You're not liable for those charges, it's not like someone is stealing 'your' money. I get the impact of the overall problem, but frankly that is Visa's issue, not mine (and not, I don't pay more interest because of it, I'm not carrying any balances).

We put literally probably 99% of what we buy on a credit card. I have one (Amex) for all my business/travel expenses (makes it easier to do expense reports when everything is segregated that way), and one (Visa) for our household stuff. Pretty much the only time I use cash is if a place doesn't accept the plastic for some reason.

Over the years I've lost count of how many times we've had new cards issued. Hell, I just got a fresh Amex last week because they think my number might have been compromised in one of the latest online hacks (I didn't have any fraudulent charges though). Amex sends the new card in advance, the old one doesn't deactivate until you get the new card. The Visa cards have gone both ways, but we usually end up with a period of a couple of days where the old one is cancelled and the new issue card hasn't shown up yet. It happens maybe once every 2 years I'd guess.

For me, it's way easier to pay 2 primary bills each month, instead of manage a bunch of things with cash, or worry about losing cash, having to go to the ATM or whatever.

I'm not going to post my Visa number on a t-shirt or anything, but I don't really care if a waiter tries to skim it, they're not going to get very far, and are very frequently caught anyway.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:09 PM   #12
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My credit card company offers to send me an email on charges over a certain amount. I set that certain amount to $0.01, and before I reach my car, after charging something, my cell phone alerts me of the charge.

It won't prevent theft, but I can jump on it and call them before having to hope the credit card company agrees that there are a fraudulent charges on the bill.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:14 PM   #13
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FRANKLY: I have no idea why anyone NEEDS more than ONE (personal) Credit Card...

I had a friend from Florida call me a few years ago and he casually mentioned he had $213,000 In Credit Card Debt. He was a Registered Pharmacist working in a local hospital..(Chief Pharmacist) and his wife was a Registered Nurse. I don't know what to say about that..I'm NOT making it up. NB

PS: I have tried to think he was just trying to impress me with BS:..But I don't know.
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:28 AM   #14
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Do a Go*gle search of yourself and see what comes up.
Doesn't take much to obtain all your personal information.
Pay a small fee and one can obtain much more.

If you want to have this information removed from these web sites you can't for the most part. In other words you for the most part cannot opt out.

Now back to the credit card.
Could have been anyplace you used your credit card in the last few years.
Information is sold by unscrupulous people or businesses.
If your computer has credit card information on it your computer could have been hacked. If you purchased something using computer again the credit card information could have been compromised.
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Old 07-26-2012, 07:42 AM   #15
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Quote:
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FRANKLY: I have no idea why anyone NEEDS more than ONE (personal) Credit Card...
How about one for internet transactions and another for real-world use? In my case, I use three - with the third tied to my PalPal account. The goal is to isolate fraud. There have also been times that the bank's anti-fraud software threw a false positive and my card was denied (for example: bought gas and then a trailer within an hour). Having a second card to eliminate one of life's little hassles (unjustified denial) is priceless.

But, for all the stories of fraud, has anyone had problems reversing the charges? The few times that my card has been misused, it only took a call to the credit card company to fix the problem and issue me a new number.
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Old 07-26-2012, 08:30 AM   #16
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I had someone hack into our checking account and make fraudulent charges in Canada. My wife often used the check card, where I would use a credit card, so someone got our accound number from the check card. It's a lot more unnerving when they hack directly into a checking account. In that case it is YOUR money. It was reimbursed without hassle but the wife is constantly reminded to use the rewards credit card and not the check card.
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Old 07-26-2012, 08:53 AM   #17
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We don't do any business or personal banking on line. Just too many hackers out there.
I do, however use a business credit card that gives me airline miles for most of my business supplies. Most vendors are glad to do it even though they lose a few 0/0 $$ because they get paid right on the spot. We, in turn pay our monthly bill in full when it comes in so we don't pay any interest.
Love to fly for free.
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Old 07-26-2012, 05:06 PM   #18
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I have owned many retail stores and merchant accounts. I have seen all sides of this. I have received chargebacks, had to file them too.

Tourist areas are high risk. Recently I was in Key West and my bank called me because they suspected my card # was leaked to a merchant in TX using a "test charge". Thinking back I used the card a lot. It may not be the merchant, but an employee taking an magnetic imprint of the card.

Yes you are protected against fraud. If you question something, just pay cash, its easier, especially with a small street merchant. Good idea to recycle the card # every 3-6 months if you use it that much.
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Old 07-26-2012, 05:32 PM   #19
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I just threw it out there to see if there was a pattern involving other card users. It might've been hacked through one of the many 'secure' web sites I frequent. Gotta keep those air miles coming, even if buying a car.





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Old 07-26-2012, 06:07 PM   #20
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Quote:
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....But, for all the stories of fraud, has anyone had problems reversing the charges? The few times that my card has been misused, it only took a call to the credit card company to fix the problem and issue me a new number.
I have. The credit card company calls the charger, and the charger must agree to reverse the charge. In this case, they didn't want to lose the $$, and I had a choice of ruining my credit, swallowing hard, or hiring a lawyer and paying more than the charge.....
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:40 PM   #21
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I have. The credit card company calls the charger, and the charger must agree to reverse the charge. In this case, they didn't want to lose the $$, and I had a choice of ruining my credit, swallowing hard, or hiring a lawyer and paying more than the charge.....
I hope you dropped them, you should not have to pay.
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:45 PM   #22
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I did change
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Old 07-26-2012, 06:48 PM   #23
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It might've been hacked through one of the many 'secure' web sites I frequent.
A "secure" website only means that the data travelling between your computer and the server for that website is encrypted. It means nothing about how the data is handled by that remote server once it's actually received (in ANY case, the data has to be decrypted at the other end in order to process it).

It's a slightly extreme case, but that "secure" site could be taking your information over a secure link, and then posting it up to a publicly accessible webpage. This is of course not very *likely*, but entirely *possible*.

Most credit card leaks come from sites that store user information in a poorly architected database, and access to this database is then compromised from the outside. In fact, if a remote exploiter gets access to a companies customer database, they could possibly be downloading that info over another *secure* link.

The little password lock in your browser doesn't mean a whole lot at the end of the day, and frankly it covers the part of the transaction (PC to server communications) that is of the least interest overall because it's generally hard to monitor that data stream remotely in any practical way. You'd have to compromise the server (for the most part), and once you've done that, you might as well just grab the whole database, instead of information coming in dribs and drabs over the network connection.
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Old 07-27-2012, 08:14 AM   #24
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FYI:
As a credit card merchant, my terminal is not "compliant" with federal laws if it prints more than the last four digits on both customer and merchant copies.

As consumers, we should be watching for that, in addition to other precautions mentioned. If our full card info is printed, please inform the merchant....

I've had customers call saying, you have my number so charge the shipping. Have to explain that we are not allowed to keep any c/c information.
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Old 07-28-2012, 11:02 PM   #25
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I have. The credit card company calls the charger, and the charger must agree to reverse the charge. In this case, they didn't want to lose the $$, and I had a choice of ruining my credit, swallowing hard, or hiring a lawyer and paying more than the charge.....
This is only partially true. If the charge was fraud, you are not liable, period. But you need to prove this, which usually involves matching signatures or a statement from yourself. Merchant loses out. If it is a disagreement of services with the merchant, that takes on a whole new level with many variables.

On a side note, taking fraud out of the picture to give a PSA...... Merchants are responsible for getting you what you paid for. If you order something via mail / internet and it doesnt arrive, arrives broken, or not as described, you can file a claim with your card company ( or ebay/amazon ). Merchants are responsible for getting you what you paid for, as described.

Anything else is unacceptable. Dont ever let a merchant tell you that it isnt their concern because it arrived broken, lost, etc because you didnt pay for insurance, sign something, etc. Insurance is a merchants responsibility and has no direct bearing to a buyers right to receive something they paid for.
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Old 07-29-2012, 06:38 AM   #26
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We just received new cards in the mail. Apparently ours were compromised but we haven't seen any charges. This is the 4th or 5th time. The most interesting charge we had was a permit for something to a city in the midwest.
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Old 07-29-2012, 05:50 PM   #27
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Quote:
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On a side note, taking fraud out of the picture to give a PSA...... Merchants are responsible for getting you what you paid for. If you order something via mail / internet and it doesnt arrive, arrives broken, or not as described, you can file a claim with your card company ( or ebay/amazon ). Merchants are responsible for getting you what you paid for, as described. .
This is excellent advice! I buy on Amazon often, and anytime I get a defective product, and I have on several occasions, they are VERY good at getting it replaced or returned. Never any argument. I have found Discover and American Express to be the easiest to deal with on returns or defective products.
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Old 07-30-2012, 03:51 PM   #28
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This is excellent advice! I buy on Amazon often, and anytime I get a defective product, and I have on several occasions, they are VERY good at getting it replaced or returned. Never any argument. I have found Discover and American Express to be the easiest to deal with on returns or defective products.
I am an avid ebay and amazon seller and have been for over a decade. Even wrote a book about it... which I ironically sell on ebay and amazon.

Amazon is BIG on customer service and enforces its independent sellers to follow suit. The bottom line is if you use a credit card and you dont get what you paid for 100%, file a claim within a reasonable amount of time and you will win.
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Old 08-02-2012, 10:56 AM   #29
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I agree something in Wifi's post doesnt sound right. If the credit card co. was notified and told the charge was fraudulant everything should of stopped right there. Don't get how he/she was made to pay or at least given a hard time.
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Old 08-02-2012, 12:30 PM   #30
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I thinkl ther difference is dissatifcation vs fraud. If you call them and say Bob's restaurant charged me for a steak and it was burned, I told them I wouldn't pay but they charged me anyway. That's going to be a dispute.

But if call them and say I never went to the Bob's restaurant in Boise, as a matter of fact I've never been to Idaho. Why is there a $100 charge on my card? That's fraud, you should never have to pay more than $50.

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/cons...dit/cre07.shtm
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:49 PM   #31
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What I was trying to indicate, was that the bank said the "chargor" had to agree that the charge was fraudulent, otherwise, I needed to prove I didn't purchase the item or receive the service. To me, this is un-American, I won't prove my innocence.... well, lets not get into that

Most merchants are honest, and as mentioned Amazon whips its associates into shape. I had one that shipped me the wrong item, then denied it, one email to Amazon, and it was straightened up. Just beware if the merchant insists you got what you got charged, to preserve their bottom line, you might have a problem on your hands.
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Old 08-02-2012, 07:28 PM   #32
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What I was trying to indicate, was that the bank said the "chargor" had to agree that the charge was fraudulent, otherwise, I needed to prove I didn't purchase the item or receive the service.
Your experience is very different than most peoples. I've filed a few claims over the years (mostly disputes for wrong charges, or over items that were received damaged/not as described). In every case my cards (Visa, MC, Amex) have given an immediate provisional credit. THEN they contact the merchant, who has to produce proof that my claim is without merit. In every case after about 6-8 weeks the provisional credit became permanent.

I've also been on the other end of this as a merchant, and can tell you that things are heavily biased in the card holders favor.

I'm not disputing what you experienced, but I do think that is very very atypical.
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Old 08-03-2012, 06:29 AM   #33
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Your experience is very different than most peoples. I've filed a few claims over the years (mostly disputes for wrong charges, or over items that were received damaged/not as described). In every case my cards (Visa, MC, Amex) have given an immediate provisional credit. THEN they contact the merchant, who has to produce proof that my claim is without merit. In every case after about 6-8 weeks the provisional credit became permanent.

I've also been on the other end of this as a merchant, and can tell you that things are heavily biased in the card holders favor.

I'm not disputing what you experienced, but I do think that is very very atypical.
And it is expensive for the business to have a charge questioned. Last I knew it was 50$ but probably a lot more now.
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Old 08-03-2012, 07:31 AM   #34
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And it is expensive for the business to have a charge questioned. Last I knew it was 50$ but probably a lot more now.
It's been a while sinceI had my last business and did any volume of credit card activity, but I don't recall there being a fee associated with the chargebacks. We were mostly bigger ticket items (home theater, etc.), so a $50 fee on a $3000 chargeback wouldn't have been my primary concern
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Old 08-03-2012, 10:49 AM   #35
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It's been a while sinceI had my last business and did any volume of credit card activity, but I don't recall there being a fee associated with the chargebacks. We were mostly bigger ticket items (home theater, etc.), so a $50 fee on a $3000 chargeback wouldn't have been my primary concern
Still 50$ can add up if you get a lot of it.
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Old 08-05-2012, 08:02 AM   #36
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Two kids (young adults) and I have had our bank card numbers( Bank of America) used fraudulently. None of us lost or misplaced our cards. All cards had airline tickets, hotel rooms and even porn on them! The only lead Bank of America could find on one card was that concert tickets had been bought through Live Nation and that is where they suspected the numbers had been hacked from. The other two cards were used for purchases initiating somewhere in Eastern Europe.
Now, each of us has one specific card to use for online business so that if it's stolen it will not result in taking finds from our savings/checking accounts.
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Old 08-05-2012, 02:51 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by jsn View Post
Two kids (young adults) and I have had our bank card numbers( Bank of America) used fraudulently. None of us lost or misplaced our cards. All cards had airline tickets, hotel rooms and even porn on them! The only lead Bank of America could find on one card was that concert tickets had been bought through Live Nation and that is where they suspected the numbers had been hacked from. The other two cards were used for purchases initiating somewhere in Eastern Europe.
Now, each of us has one specific card to use for online business so that if it's stolen it will not result in taking finds from our savings/checking accounts.
Are the cards you are discussing debit cards or credit cards? If they are credit cards, I suggest you use Bank of America's "ShopSafe" service when ordering anything online. ShopSafe assigns you a different "alias" card number, expiration date, and CCV code for each purchase. You choose the maximum amount that can be charged to each "alias" number and when it will expire. Each purchase using ShopSafe actually posts to your real credit card account, but the vendor at the other end of the transaction never sees your real number. We've been using ShopSafe for several years and it works great.
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