Braun Bay Rafting Bill

[Breakwater]

I agree. We need to put a stop to this. I was just on a late nite rant!

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

I'll bet that if your parents knew that you were writing such nonsense they would spank your bottom.

You are very lucky to have parents that own lake front property and that you can use it whenever you want to.
I'll bet that if you had the responsibilities that go with owning that land you would have a different attitude.

Now that I know you use your parents property and probably live miles away from it, I'll leave you alone because I thought I was talking to a person who might have worked hard to own their own water front on Lake Winni.

You had me fooled!

Time to put those guns down!

[NoBozo]

270:133 Braun Bay. No person shall form or allow the boat which he or she is operating or in charge of to be a member of a raft consisting of 3 or more boats in Braun Bay at any time when there are already 3 rafts consisting of 3 or more boats in Braun Bay. In this section, “raft” shall have the same meaning as in RSA 270:42, IV. Any person who violates this section shall be guilty of a violation.

I think the wording here is very poor. 3..OR More..boats in a raft is prohibted by the strict interpretation of the Wording. This means TWO boats Max in a raft. The wording in the proposed bill is going to lead to endless speculation as to what it means when different people read it....MPs, boaters, shoreside residents, PHDs..etc.

If the intent of the bill is to limit the number of boats in a raft to TWO boats max..lets just say so. ..it should be in PLAIN English. NB

PS: I've never been to Braun Bay before so as to notice all the Mayhem, but I intend to have a look next summer...just a LOOK, I'm not going to stop and anchor.

[BroadHopper]

It is very nice area. It's a bit crowded on weekends. But most boaters are very friendly and will help out in anchoring your boat. It is very clean, contrary to others opinion. Otherwise, I and others will not allow our children/grandchildren to swim. Sometimes on weekend you get the college crowd and they tend to get a little rowdy. Just a call to the MP usually does the trick.

I usually avoid it on weekends and holidays as I don't like crowds. It is perfect on weekdays and during the month of September.

Back in the days the sand bar in front of Ellacoya was very popular. Many of us learn to water ski there. Unfortunately the state added two spar buoys and boats are not allowed between the buoys and the beach.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by NoBozo

PS: I've never been to Braun Bay before so as to notice all the Mayhem, but I intend to have a look next summer...just a LOOK, I'm not going to stop and anchor.

Not exactly words the bills proponents want to hear You can also check out the other NRZs above as they are nice places to swim....

Drop anchor and stay awhile. You can meet some fun people out there.

[Formula]

Originally Posted by lawn psycho

Not exactly words the bills proponents want to hear You can also check out the other NRZs above as they are nice places to swim....

Drop anchor and stay awhile. You can meet some fun people out there.

I just went through Brawn Bay and i do not see what all the fuss is about...I saw no boats rafting

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Formula

I just went through Brawn Bay and i do not see what all the fuss is about...I saw no boats rafting

So what would happen if a bunch of bob houses set-up on Braun Bay and tied their places together with rope?

Originally Posted by lawn psycho

So what would happen if a bunch of bob houses set-up on Braun Bay and tied their places together with rope?

I'm sure that if you start recruiting people to gather there in large numbers, party obnoxiously all day with loud music, pee on the ice, and leave your garbage behind, then it will just be a matter of time before you excite a bill aimed at that. Then the rest of your friends on this forum will be up in arms about our "nanny" legislature passing unnecessary laws that take away your freedoms, and they'll all be overlooking the real problem...you.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by elchase

I'm sure that if you start recruiting people to gather there in large numbers, party obnoxiously all day with loud music, pee on the ice, and leave your garbage behind, then it will just be a matter of time before you excite a bill aimed at that. Then the rest of your friends on this forum will be up in arms about our "nanny" legislature passing unnecessary laws that take away your freedoms, and they'll all be overlooking the real problem...you.

I see the good in things. Someone in the bob house is spending time outdoors, enjoying the lake. Spending money at local businesses. They are also likely socializing with other ice fishermen.

You must live a miserable existence. Watch out, the boogey-man is just around the corner ready to pounce.

Don't move to Alton. Those groupy pilots are just ruining things over there

[OCDACTIVE]

I don't know why we continue to propose legislature that is redundant. Just answer me this:

Aren't there already laws against littering?

Aren't there already disturbing the peace laws?

Aren't there already rafting laws?

Aren't there already drunk in public laws?

Why do we continue to restrict those who abide by the laws and try to enjoy our lake? Braun Bay has been a top rafting spot for decades. Generations of families have enjoyed it. Why are we trying to stop this?

Even residents of the bay who have posted here says these issues are not a problem. So why are we trying to enact a law to fix something that isn't broken... just my 2 cents.

Originally Posted by OCDACTIVE

I don't know why we continue to propose legislature that is redundant.

Because in most jurisdictions the law enforcement agencies appreciate having as many bullets in their guns as they can. We see over and over again how lawyers weasel their clients out of convictions and how over-matched our police are when they get into court. If they cite someone for drunkenness, there will be a twelve month battle over the validity of the blood sample and their proper handling of it. If they cite them for littering, they will rely on hope that they can get fingerprints off the litter that are reliable enough to withstand the lawyer's long and expensive challenge. If they cite them for urinating, they will need dna samples that are carefully kept and protected from contamination so they cannot be refuted by some Johnny Cochoran. But a simple picture of the boats tied together with the Braun Bay shore in the background will be hard for even F. Lee Bailey to refute.

In most jurisdictions, law enforcers look at laws as tools that they can selectively use if and when the need arises, and know this is a good thing. They appreciate a full palette of laws that they can use at their discretion as the circumstances warrant.

In most jurisdictions, law enforcers aren't the one's complaining about the "enforceability" or "redundancy" of laws like the perpetrators do. They recognize their duty to do their best to enforce the will of the legislature and they do their job.

Law enforcers have discretion to enforce the laws when it is appropriate and in instances where they feel the citations can be upheld, so for them, having one more option when they see a violator can only be a benefit. Having a law that is "unenforceable" or "redundant" cannot hurt them...they don't have to cite it if they don't see the need. But citing someone with five violations always gives a better chance of one sticking than citing them with four. It is always one more charge that can be used to their advantage in a plea bargain. Only in Glendale does law enforcement generally seem more concerned about the rights of the perpetrators than the rights of the rest of society. And that is not their charge.

In most jurisdictions, law enforcement works with the legislature to craft laws that can be enforced, rather than sitting back in Glendale and trying to sabotage pending public-interest legislation by telling the public why a law under consideration will be unenforceable, and telling the potential perpetrators that they need not obey the law because there will be no attempt to enforce it anyway .

We see this pattern repeating itself over and over from Glendale and have to wonder sometimes whose side they are on.

[Rattlesnake Guy]

Kind of like building a house next to Old Faithful and being P'd at all the people who come to enjoy it.

Tourism is the largest industry in NH.
Winnipesaukee is one of the largest tourist destinations in NH
Some people rafting are NH taxpayers
All people rafting are contributing to our economy.

Question: Does the propensity to rafting in front of a property area change the real estate value of that property?

[OCDACTIVE]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

Question: Does the propensity to rafting in front of a property area change the real estate value of that property?

I wouldn't think so considering there are "NO" houses next to the sandbar... I don't think the wildlife take assesments on their houses.. LOL

[NoRegrets]

I believe the reason some individuals love to have laws and control is to compensate for an unfulfillied desire to be something they are not! Instead of going forward and exploring the world, taking on challenges, or becomming constructive citizens they seem fixated on small issues and try to manuver politicians and local media to score perceived "big time" laws. I have not been impressed with by any of the control freeks that support non-essential and trival issues although it does give a good view of what is wrong with our country. These individuls must view themselves as the new breed of Danial Boones, Henry DuPonts, Fords, Mellons, or great industralists.

Keep up the good fight! Massachusett-e-s just did!

[VtSteve]

Originally Posted by elchase

I'm sure that if you start recruiting people to gather there in large numbers, party obnoxiously all day with loud music, pee on the ice, and leave your garbage behind, then it will just be a matter of time before you excite a bill aimed at that. Then the rest of your friends on this forum will be up in arms about our "nanny" legislature passing unnecessary laws that take away your freedoms, and they'll all be overlooking the real problem...you.

There are plenty of laws against bad behavior as you described. Many have said your description of the bay, as usual, is way over the top. The sand bar people use is NOT in front of people's waterfront homes.

So if you're wrong about the condition of the bay, and mostly wrong about the boaters that use it, and people's waterfront is not in jeopardy from these people's activities, what's you point El? Just another Gestapo activity for you?

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Rattlesnake Guy

Question: Does the propensity to rafting in front of a property area change the real estate value of that property?

Let's suppose for a minute that it did. The sandbar has been used for many decades. If the argument were true, then the buyer got the discount up front. That discount would get passed along to the next buyer. It's no different then a person moving into a home on a busy street or near a highway.

[hazelnut]

Why is it that 2 people are allowed to derail yet another thread?

[VitaBene]

Originally Posted by lawn psycho

Let's suppose for a minute that it did. The sandbar has been used for many decades. If the argument were true, then the buyer got the discount up front. That discount would get passed along to the next buyer. It's no different then a person moving into a home on a busy street or near a highway.

Your analogy is good LP. The problem is that the proponents are trying to create Winnipesaukee's version of a highway noise mitigation wall.

[jmen24]

Originally Posted by BroadHopper

I usually avoid it on weekends and holidays as I don't like crowds. It is perfect on weekdays and during the month of September.

Wow, you are willing to "live and let live" what a concept. I hope you have kids Broadhopper so we can continue to pass on this thought process to the future generations, otherwise we are in real trouble.

Bill after bill, it just keeps coming out of the state house. Its feels like having a conversation with someone that is talking with there mouth full. A considerable amount of crap is coming out but nothing makes any sense.

Add this to the lake speed limit, trying to ban beer tents at bike week, exhaust noise testing for motorcycles requiring a tach being installed, when most bikes are manufactured without, banning access to the lake via public boat launches on a public lake. Are we really heading in this direction or am I dreaming, who would think these things are for the good of the state.

[BroadHopper]

I have kids and grandkids. I want them to enjoy the lake as much as I did, my parents did and my grandparents. The way things are going I am willing to bet my grandkids will not enjoy the lake. As with all greedy folks, they only care about today, to hell with tomorrow. "I'm not going to be here, why should I protect the future?"

[robmac]

I remember growing up my Dad telling all his children wonderful stories about his youth ( this used to cost 25 cents) and we could do this. Reading the responces about the old days and what folks did is great but I must agree that my daughter will never get to enjoy the lake like so many of us have. I am a newbie on the lake,I've been here since 74 and I've seen so much change and not for the good. Sorry Don for going astray with this.

[alsadad]

I find this business with the proposed Braun Bay rafting bill and the Gilford boat launch ordinance far too vague and, dare I say, subtle. How about we just lay all our cards on the table, pull out all the stops, say what we really mean, and unload every other cliché we can think of. I think the NH Legislature should consider the following bill:

WHEREAS owners of expensive waterfront homes pay exorbitant amounts of real estate taxes; and

WHEREAS said exorbitant real estate taxes contribute greatly to the public coffers and facilitate wasteful government spending, in addition to conferring an unwarranted sense of superiority on the owners;

Be it hereby RESOLVED that henceforth and forevermore the owners of expensive waterfront homes shall enjoy full and exclusive rights to the use of the state’s rivers, lakes and streams;

Be it hereby further RESOLVED that, except when they are working as landscapers and maids at the aforementioned expensive waterfront homes, all other people (also known as “common riff-raff”) shall be confined to their double-wides where they can kick the dog, spit tobacco juice and litter to their heart’s content.

On a more serious note, I am perplexed about the purpose of this bill. The portion of Braun Bay designated as a “No Rafting Zone” is already off-limits to any rafts consisting of 3 or more boats. Correct? This proposed bill limits to 3 the number of rafts consisting of 3 or more boats in all of Braun Bay. So logically the three 3-boat rafts referenced in the bill would have to be located outside of the NRZ. Correct? Now, many of you spend more time there than I do, but I am hard-pressed to recall any time when I’ve seen more than a few boats anchored outside of the sandbar/NRZ area. Is this more common than I realize?

Also, does this bill as written mean that boaters could form rafts in Braun Bay, each consisting of, say, 90 boats, provided the rafts are located outside of the designated NRZ and that there are no more than 3 of the rafts? So, if I go to Braun Bay with two friends because we want to raft, and there are already three 3-boat rafts in the bay (outside of the NRZ of course), we can leave and go somewhere else, OR we can simply join up to one of the existing rafts. I’m not really that big on rafting, and I’d have to get 2 friends first, but if this is permissible under the bill, then the proposed law seems ludicrous to me.

[SIKSUKR]

I have a question that may have already been answered in the past but here goes. When are you considered in a NRZ on not in it? How far away from shore do you have to be for to not be in the NRZ?

[LakeSnake]

Originally Posted by jmen24

Bill after bill, it just keeps coming out of the state house. Its feels like having a conversation with someone that is talking with there mouth full. A considerable amount of crap is coming out but nothing makes any sense.

Add this to the lake speed limit, trying to ban beer tents at bike week, exhaust noise testing for motorcycles requiring a tach being installed, when most bikes are manufactured without, banning access to the lake via public boat launches on a public lake. Are we really heading in this direction or am I dreaming, who would think these things are for the good of the state.

That's easy - people from south of the border

[Airwaves]

Originally posted by LakeSnake

That's easy - people from south of the border

As someone from "south of the border" everyone knows where I stand on the law that must not be mentioned.

It seems foolish to me to propose this Braun Bay bill because of the complaints of two people and write it in such a manner as to contradict existing law on rafting

Ditto on the Gilford measure on public boat ramps.

All these initiatives seem to have come from people "north of the border" you know the ones that in addition to paying taxes actually get to vote on who their representatives are and on initiatives?

[jmen24]

I can tell you that not many natives can afford waterfront property in this state anymore and the ones that had it will or have had to give it up due to over inflated property value. But, typically after selling they can then afford another home on the water, but they still cannot pay the taxes on it.

South of the border is possible, most of these laws are directly targeted at the Lakes Region as a whole though. I can tell you I have been thinking longer and harder about buying a boat and keeping it on Winni, gets closer every year to being like a movie from the 90's(name escapes me) that the government posts the scofflaw's picture on a game show and everyone goes out and hunts them down to win a prize. Maybe its time for a change of scenery, as I do not like what the scenery around here is changing into.

[robmac]

jmen,I agree looking at the cost to tow my boat back to Winni or staying in FL even without thinking about the economy makes me wonder. It just doesn't seem to make sense to inact laws that further prevent boaters and families from being able to enjoy a lake where generations have been going for years. As a NH resident I call and write to my state reps and let my and other peoples feelings be known as well as write and advise they read the posts on this site. Progress is good but sometimes not for the better.

[Yosemite Sam]

Originally Posted by robmac

jmen,I agree looking at the cost to tow my boat back to Winni or staying in FL even without thinking about the economy makes me wonder. It just doesn't seem to make sense to inact laws that further prevent boaters and families from being able to enjoy a lake where generations have been going for years. As a NH resident I call and write to my state reps and let my and other peoples feelings be known as well as write and advise they read the posts on this site. Progress is good but sometimes not for the better.

What are some of the laws that keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH? Also how will any of the proposed laws keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH.

I know that there are some laws and proposed laws that will change the way some people use the Lake, but just which ones effect you.

I can’t think of any law or proposed law that will keep me from having fun on any Lake in NH.

Thank you

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

What are some of the laws that keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH? Also how will any of the proposed laws keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH.

I know that there are some laws and proposed laws that will change the way some people use the Lake, but just which ones effect you.

I can’t think of any law or proposed law that will keep me from having fun on any Lake in NH.

Thank you

I know question was asked of another, but I feel compelled to answer from my point of view.

Here's one affects me directly:

"270:77 Squam and Conway Lakes and Silver Lake in Madison. – No person shall at any time place in or upon, or use, or operate upon, Squam Lake or Conway Lake or Silver Lake in Madison any houseboat. Whoever violates any provision of this section shall be guilty of a violation. Boards of health and health officers of towns abutting said lakes shall have power and authority to enforce the provisions of this section."

I have a trailer boat that happens to have a porta-potti and sleeping berths which makes it a "Houseboat" under 270-A:1 (see below). I'd love to take my boat on Squam Lake for a day, but I cannot because the lake front owners on that lake petitioned the legislature for this law to keep the lake off limits to the likes of people like me.

270-A:1 II. ""Houseboat'' means any ship, boat, raft, float, catamaran or marine craft of any description upon or within which are located sleeping and toilet facilities, regardless of whether such facilities are of a permanent or temporary nature.


Here's another:

270-A:3 Where Overnight Mooring Prohibited. – No houseboat shall be beached or grounded, or tied to the shore of any of the inland surface waters of the state for an overnight period or any part of an overnight period, except as permitted in RSA 270-A:2 or in cases of emergency. No houseboat shall be anchored on any of the inland surface waters of the state for an overnight period or any part of an overnight period except as permitted in RSA 270-A:2 or in cases of emergency.

No such law exists in any other state that I know of. My family and I routinely enjoy quietly anchoring overnight on inland waters in ME and MA without any problems. I also enjoyed doing so as a kid aboard my parent's boat on Winnipesaukee when the law was revoked briefly during the mid 70s. I would love to now, but I cannot.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

What are some of the laws that keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH? Also how will any of the proposed laws keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH.

I know that there are some laws and proposed laws that will change the way some people use the Lake, but just which ones effect you.

I can’t think of any law or proposed law that will keep me from having fun on any Lake in NH.

Thank you

I have two other friends who have boats and our families often tie up at the sandbar in a raft. Usually 2-3 times per year we get together on the same day on the lake when our schedules align. A rafting law on Braun Bay now means our boats would have to be 25.0000000 ft apart. Not exactly the same fun and social gathering when we are tied together separated by bumpers.

So if those same boats are tied together or anchored seperately, why should you have a care in the world???

So yes, it does impact me and it does interfere with how I enjoy the lake.

[Yosemite Sam]

House boats and rafting, thank you.

Are there anymore laws or proposed laws that keep you from having fun on any lake in NH?

[Pineedles]

Please do not lump all shorefront property owners into the same pot. We are very diverse and all have different agendas. My present agenda is contained in the site www.sbonh.org.

I see a growing trend in this thread to start blaming shorefront owners with instigating laws to restrict boater's rights. While the posted complainants are only 2 shorefront owners, please remember this, it's only 2 people! I'm sure that there are alot more people in Braun Bay then 2 who have no problem with rafting.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

House boats and rafting, thank you.

Are there anymore laws or proposed laws that keep you from having fun on any lake in NH?

1. Can't have pets at Ellacoya.
2. Speed limit
3. Rafting

And the inability to anchor overnight although it does not impact me is stupid. A LOT of people do overnights on their boats.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Pineedles

Please do not lump all shorefront property owners into the same pot. We are very diverse and all have different agendas. My present agenda is contained in the site www.sbonh.org.

I see a growing trend in this thread to start blaming shorefront owners with instigating laws to restrict boater's rights. While the posted complainants are only 2 shorefront owners, please remember this, it's only 2 people! I'm sure that there are alot more people in Braun Bay then 2 who have no problem with rafting.

Good point. I should not have implied that in my last post and I apologize.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by lawn psycho

I have two other friends who have boats and our families often tie up at the sandbar in a raft. Usually 2-3 times per year we get together on the same day on the lake when our schedules align. A rafting law on Braun Bay now means our boats would have to be 25.0000000 ft apart. Not exactly the same fun and social gathering when we are tied together separated by bumpers.

So if those same boats are tied together or anchored seperately, why should you have a care in the world???

So yes, it does impact me and it does interfere with how I enjoy the lake.

That's a good point. We've had some really fun raft-ups in places where they are legal and it would be fun to have 3-4 boats rafted in Braun Bay.

[Yosemite Sam]

House Boats
Rafting
Can't have pets at Ellacoya.
Speeeeeeeeeeee Liiiiiii I can’t say it.



Looking at those four items, I don't see a trend by our NH lawmakers that they are trying to stop anyone from having fun on NH Lakes.

[Pineedles]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

House Boats
Rafting
Can't have pets at Ellacoya.
Speeeeeeeeeeee Liiiiiii I can’t say it.



Looking at those four items, I don't see a trend by our NH lawmakers that they are trying to stop anyone from having fun on NH Lakes.

You're right Sam. As long as it is the kind of fun that THEY think we should be having. This is why I joined www.sbonh.org. Not because I have a big fast boat, but because I object to others passing judgement on what they think I should enjoy. BTY how's your cholesterol level? There are laws in effect that deny your right to buy a big juice hamburger because it's bad for you. In the past, some thought that folks with blonde hair and blue eyes were the only ones that deserved to live. I am not comparing you or anyone else to these people, but if you allow discrimination because it doesn't affect you, you will be the next one on the list.

[Yosemite Sam]

Originally Posted by Pineedles

You're right Sam. As long as it is the kind of fun that THEY think we should be having. This is why I joined www.sbonh.org. Not because I have a big fast boat, but because I object to others passing judgement on what they think I should enjoy. BTY how's your cholesterol level? There are laws in effect that deny your right to buy a big juice hamburger because it's bad for you. In the past, some thought that folks with blonde hair and blue eyes were the only ones that deserved to live. I am not comparing you or anyone else to these people, but if you allow discrimination because it doesn't affect you, you will be the next one on the list.

I know we disagree about the (I can't say it law), but I don't think that this law is the start of many more laws that will effect how we use our Lakes to have fun.

I guess time will tell won't it Pineedles.

[lawn psycho]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

I know we disagree about the (I can't say it law), but I don't think that this law is the start of many more laws that will effect how we use our Lakes to have fun.

I guess time will tell won't it Pineedles.

Then why does Moultonborough have the commanding lead in NRZ's? As soon as one area gets an exclusion or special treatment, then the snowball keeps rolling.

The proposed Gilford ordinance is yet another example. You can bet someone in another lake town will think about "what about me".

Let's put this in perspective. When people are on the beach on the seacoast do they limit how many people can lay side by side on their towels while sunbathing? It's exactly the same thing.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

House boats and rafting, thank you.

Are there anymore laws or proposed laws that keep you from having fun on any lake in NH?

Waterskiing and barefoot skiing. I cannot enjoy barefoot skiing as I cannot go over 45 mph. I need to go at least 50 to enjoy the sport. In waterskiing, I cannot take off from a dock or land near a dock. The boat must be 150' away from any other object. I have been reprimanded by the MP when I drop of my skis to ski. They claim that the waterski floating in the water is a hazard. I need to take off from a beach or dock to ski on one ski or barefoot. It is extremely difficult to teach kids to ski when they are 150' away from shore.

[BroadHopper]

Originally Posted by Yosemite Sam

I know we disagree about the (I can't say it law), but I don't think that this law is the start of many more laws that will effect how we use our Lakes to have fun.

When WinnFabs decided to enact the SL law, I was on their side. I don't have a fast boat and we do need some kind of control as the lake was getting crowded. I was with the principles of WinnFabs and NH Lake Association before one of the public hearings. They were talking to the sponsor of the bill about enacting future laws to limit size of boats and limit horsepower. They were also talking about how property values on Lake George went up after the SL law went into effect. Then I suddenly realize it is not about safety, it's about greed! I told them 'I'm outta here'. The sponsor says 'We've got to start somewhere!'

Originally Posted by Dave R

Here's one affects me directly: "270:77 No houseboats on Squam Lake or Conway Lake or Silver Lake...
Here's another: 270-A:3 No Overnight Mooring...

I don't know exactly what caused these laws to be enacted, but I'd bet my last dollar that in every case it was not so simple as "the rich lake front owners petitioned for this law to keep the lake off limits to the likes of people like me." More likely, some obnoxious jerks continuously misbehaved and abused a freedom and ruined a good thing for everyone. If you investigate, you'll surely find a history of a problem getting worse and worse and good people exhausting all other means to contain it, and the legislature finally having to resort to a broadbrush law that inadvertently limits the freedoms of the non-jerks in order to limit the misbehavior of the jerks. As I've said over and over again about every one of these laws...Your anger should be directed at the jerks. They ruined it for you. It was not the good, passive people that simply couldn't take it anymore and just wanted some peace that ruined it for you.

[Woodsy]

Yosemite....

It is already happening.... perhaps you want to look the other way and dont want to connect the dots.... but I will! Slowly but surely the public's RIGHT to the lake is being eroded....

1. The Braun Bay Bill.... the water belongs to the PUBLIC! The water does not belong to the waterfront property owners. Thier littoral rights end at the high water mark & thier dock! Yet here we are limiting the PUBLIC use of a PUBLIC RESOURCE because some whiny *ss property owner doesnt like anyone in THIER water! Once Braun Bay becomes restricted, more & more bays & coves will petition for NRZ status because boats will be forced to look elsewhere

2. The Gilford (Ames Farm) zoning change petition.... here we have a place that has been launching and recovering boats for the PUBLIC for decades yet some wealthy jack*ss property owner found some sort of loophole forcing them to close... this legislation is written so as to put the final nail in Ames Farm... Yet another way of limiting PUBLIC ACCESS to a PUBLIC RESOURCE! I have said it before I would sell both properties for alot of $$$ to a deep pocketed developer and then see how happy these snotty waterfront people are when there are 300 condos where a comparitively peaceful farm used to be......

3. The law that shall not be mentioned.... squarely aimed at restricting the freedom of a minority of boaters... not going to get into it as this argument has been beaten to death.

4. The rumors swirling about HP limits, size restriction etc... nobody thought the speed limit would come to pass, especially given the history of Lake Winnipesaukee! Yet it has, it is being aggressively pusued in the legislature. If that can become law with little real evidence to support it what is next?

5. Its not just the lake where restrictions have been passed and yet more contemplated.... just ask the bikers if they feel welcome!!

Just keep your head buried in the sand folks... eventually there will be a law restricting or eliminating some activity that you or your family treasure....

Woodsy

PS: NH's economy derives a very large portion of its income from tourism! Make the tourists and others feel unwelcome and they will spend thier hard earnd cash elsewhere! Then see how your taxes are.....

[sunset on the dock]

Let's face it...laws come, laws go, just as society evolves. Think Blue Laws. It was once illegal in California to shoot any game from a moving vehicle unless it was a whale. It was once illegal to feed your slaves lobster more than 3 times a week. Was there this much angst on Winnipesaukee when they enacted life jacket laws ("my father never had to have life jackets in his boat when we were growing up...people are taking away my freedoms...wah wah wah")? There were origionally no laws about septic discharge from boats on the lake.
I'm against what the mega mansions are doing to the character of the lake as much as anyone and I'm glad to see new laws restricting how they can develop/destroy the shorefront....so it's not simply about new laws designed specifically to $crew the little guy. I'm happy to see new laws regarding septic system design to further protect the lake's water quality(which is deteriorating by the way). The sky is falling scenarios in this thread are getting to be a bit too much...thankyou Yosemite for injecting a little sanity into this discussion.

[DEJ]

Sunset, I think you missed the point of YS's question which was "What are some of the laws that keep you and your family from having a good time on any Lake in NH"?

Most of what you posted has nothing to do with this discussion.