seeking feedback on marinas

[Glove]

I’m a soon-to-be first time boater, and finalizing a choice between a new Chaparral 204ssi, Bryant 206wt, and Crownline 200ls (all 20 – 21 ft bowriders with walkthrough transoms…two are V8 carb; one is a V8 fuel injected). They each have their pros/cons, but all 3 very good quality boats. I’ve done lots of homework and have driven all three boats.

We will use valet service. As a novice, I’m most concerned about making sure my wife and young kids have a great time on the lake. Thus, it’s my conclusion that the marina can make a big difference in our experience (friendliness/helpfulness to newbies, quality of service, quality of facilities). And as a novice, I think it’s best to keep the best to keep the boat at the marina where we purchase it for servicing, problems, help, etc. Also, these marinas claim no room for winter storage unless you purchase the boat from them.

Thus, I am looking for information (positive or negative) to help me sort out if our (newbie) family experience at one of these three marinas (Paugus Bay (Bryant), Channel Marine (Crownline), Fays Boatyard (Chaparral)) will significantly impact on our experience.

I would appreciate any helpful feedback. Thanks very much.

[jrc]

I've seen a lot about Fay's here in the past, use the search. Don't remember seeing the other's here.

There is some merit, especially for new boaters, in being at the dealer's marina. They will be there when you forget to turn of the battery and it won't start, when that strange buzzer goes off, you can't remember what fluid to put in what hole and when you can't figure out how to set up the canvas.

Winter storage is not an issue, there are always plenty of places begging for boats. Summer storage either in water or on a rack can be a little tighter, but still fairly easy to find for a 20 footer.

Either Paugus bay or Channel will mean dealing with the Weirs channel every time you want to boat in the big part of the lake. Paugus bay means dealing with Laconia traffic, Channel will have traffic issues as well. Fay's won't have these issues.

Finally, I wouldn't buy a carbureted boat. At our marina, the fuel injected guys jump in, turn the key and off they go. The carb guys are always pumping the throttle, cranking the engine, pumping, cranking...
Now I'm sure a brand new carb boat will be just fine, but five years from now, you will wish you got the fuel injection.

[Fishy Cover]

I strongly recommend EFI. It is much cleaner and less polluting and much more efficient. My Volvo 5.0 gxi is 270 hp from 5 liters vs 220 for the same engine in a carburated version. Long term maintenance cost will be lower with EFI and starting is just turn the key and go.

[Woodsy]

Definitely go EFI.... the days of a carb are done..

As far as marinas go, I have had dealings with both Channel Marine and Paugus Bay. Both are GREAT when it comes to taking care of thier customers. I have had no dealings with Fay's, but they have been around forever so they must be doing something right!

Make sure you take a boater safety course, in the classroom if possible. Also, if you need actual hands on instruction using/driving/docking your boat, I have a friend who is a licensed Coast Guard Captian who teaches people.

Good Luck!

Woodsy

[Charlie T]

I can vouch for Fays. A lot has been written here both pro and con about them. The adverse postings seen to be from a select on or two people with a "axe to grind". I have been at Fay's for 4 yrs now. I have purchased 2 boats from them (used) and feel that I have always been treated fairly. Once you purchase the boat the sales people will be out of your life. Steve who runs the Valet service and handles repairs is the best! He is well liked by everyone I have spoken to and get things done. Service at Fays is fairly priced and I have never had a problem with the quality. I have seen personally that they stand 100% behind their repair service.
Fays is more of a "old time" type boat yard. It is not the pristine show place that some are on the lake, people are allowed to do their own maintence if they like ( I don't know of any other yard on the lake that allows that). If you are looking for glamor and flash Fays isn't for you. If you are looking for good work, and fair prices, I'd go to Fays
I have no hesitation in recommending them to anyone.
YMMV of course
Good Luck and enjoy the lake
Charlie

[PROPELLER]

I agree with others, I would not buy a carbureted boat. I'ved owned 2. While I've never lost a day on the lake because of them, they were very temperamental starting, they give off alot of fumes & smoke & they required more adjustments than the 2 fuel injected models I've owned.

I do not have a problem docking or valeting somewhere other than where the boat is purchased as long as its somewhere on the lake that the dealer you purchased from is willing to travel to for service. If its a good reputable marina, they should not mind traveling somewhere else to service your boat. Or if you are purchasing a trailer you can tow it to them when it needs service. I do not dock where I purchased & the dealer I purchased from will go anywhere on the lake the for service. As mentioned earlier, their are reputable establishments to winterize & store without buying a boat from them. I do not winterize & store where I purchased or where I dock.

I also would not want to be docked or valet anywhere in Paugus Bay. You will always have to boat through the Weirs Channel 2 times every outing. When you leave & when you return. Also, you mentioned your concern for making sure the family has a great time on the lake (that goes without saying, otherwise why would you boat) so Paugus Bay may not be the best place to start since the Bay & the Channel necessary to access the rest of the lake is the busiest & roughest area on the entire lake especially in a 20' bowrider. For some this may not be a problem, not sure how your family is with lots of wave action, wakes, getting wet & that size boat will get tossed quite a bit in that area. If you or they are skiddish about those things I recommend staying away from docking or valeting in that area.

I must disagree with Charlie though. Where I purchased & where I dock allow you to do your own maintenance. Where I dock also allows other marina techs that are properly insured to work on your boat.

Good luck & enjoy. There is nothing more fun than boating on beautiful summer days on the lake.

[ThePlut]

I kept my boat in Meredith Marina last year. They were great, I did not purchase my boat from them.

I'd be back there again, but unfortunately, I upsized my boat to 24' and then found out that Meredith Marina will not be allowing boats greater than 23' into thier valet service starting in '06. A huge dissappointment to myself and my family...

For your size boat however, you'd probably be fine, so I'd give them a call, whichever boat you choose.

I'm also looking for recommendations for a slip or valet elsewhere on the lake.

[Glove]

Wow. Thanks to all for the time each of you put into writing responses.

1 - Okay. I'm sold on the fuel injection. Also, I think re-sale might have a broader audience because there are certainly many folks who are certain that they DON'T want a carbeurator
2 - Great point about Paugus Bay and having to get through Weir Channel every time is we use Paugus Bay Marina or Channel Marine.
3 - Good to hear that I can purchase a boat from one dealer, but winterize/valet somewhere else on the lake (all without having to buy a trailer). For my needs, it seems that a trailer is a couple thousand dollars of wasted money, and then I have to also find someplace to store the trailer. In my first couple of years of boating, it's unlikely that I'll be towing and launching elsewhere. But I'm sure I'll need continued service/support from the dealer.
4 - I'll check out a few more marinas on the Southern half of the lake based on your comments. I have used the "search" feature for comments...candidly, my fear regarding Fays is that it seems easy to piss someone off there by doing the wrong thing....(and newbies do a lot of wrong things).
5 - I may end up ordering a boat, rather than getting one that's a bit cheaper, but "wrong" layout or "wrong" engine.

Thanks again for all on the board who have been helpful here.

[codeman671]

I am a die-hard fan of Shep Brown's, have you looked at the Monterey 214FS? I bought one this summer and referred a friend to buy one as well. Great boat! Mine is the 220hp carb (the new easy start merc) and it occasionally takes a few cranks if it has been sitting for a few weeks but always fires. I certainly do agree that efi is better though, except in times of an out of warranty fuel system problem.

As far as dealers go, I think that they are the best. I have bought 3 boats from them in the last year (2 of them Monterey) and am looking at 2 more. Bob McDermott and Bill Jr. are great to deal with and very aggresive. They do both valet and slips and usually have a slip for anyone who buys a boat from them. They always follow through and do what they say they will do.

I buy my gas at Fay's out of convenience but have had other issues there which have been previously aired. I actually tried to talk to them in August on a Chapparel (again) and once again got a bit of runaround.

[Dave R]

I have owned two carbureted boats and one Multi Port fuel Injected boat. All work fine, all occasionally stall, all run rich upon cold start, all take a few seconds of cranking to start after a long spell of sitting. I would buy a carbureted boat again in a heartbeat.

Stern drive makers deliberately put small carburetors on their carbureted engines to limit power and make the fuel injected engines seem like a good deal for the money. For instance: It's not the fuel injection that makes a 5.0 EFI or MPI engine make 50 more HP than a 5.0 carbureted engine, it's the size of the throttle orifice. If you swap the 500 cfm 2 bbl carburetor and manifold on a the 220 HP 5.0 V8 with a 650 cfm 4bbl setup, it'll make around 260 HP.

The fuel consumption difference of a carb vs. a FI boat is negligible.

Of the brands you listed, the Bryant impresses me the most. Those are very well made boats with excellent attention to detail. All three are good though.

[Dave R]

Codeman brought up a very good point. Monterrey makes a great boat that deserves a look. Have you checked out Regal, Cobalt, and Four Winns as well?

[Glove]

Again, thanks to all:

Cobalt - great boat, but perhaps for a 1st time boater it's not wise to spend the premium, but rather, first find out [i] if boating is for us [ii] what I like/dislike in a boat; [iii] perhaps save Cobalt for the upgrade in the future

Monterrey - Looks like we would need to size up to the 228 to get the walk-through transom, on which we place a high priority. I'm not completely against sizing up, but of course you end up paying more.

Four Winns - also a great boat, built well, etc based on my homework. Just didn't try it out....I think the 220 would be our size with the walkthough transom....I think the failure to try this boat simply falls into "only so many hours in a day...." and the fact that they didn't have any bowriders at the Boston boat show.

These are all great boats(well constructed, nicely appointed, value for the money), and I think we'll be happy with any of them. This is to our advantage when it comes to negotiating $$. The Bryant is the outlier....small company, very careful attention to every last detail. HOWEVER, the audience of potential buyers when it comes time to sell in a few years is much smaller (e.g. "What's a Bryant?"). I recognize that if I'm an average first time boat buyer, I'll own this boat for only 3 years....I guess I should find a few more hours in the day and test drive the Fourn Winns 220.

Again, thanks for all of the feedback. This is quite helpful to a novice.

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Glove

Again, thanks to all:

Cobalt - great boat, but perhaps for a 1st time boater it's not wise to spend the premium, but rather, first find out [i] if boating is for us [ii] what I like/dislike in a boat; [iii] perhaps save Cobalt for the upgrade in the future

Someone on this thread just traded in a gorgeous 2005 Cobalt 200. The boat was treated to the best of care and would be a sweet used boat to own. It's got a "sorta walk through transom". Cobalts hold their value nicely and are hugely respected in the industry.

[ThePlut]

Dave's talking about me, and if my trade in is at all interesting to you, e-mail me at plutnicki@mac.com and I'd be happy to tell you about it.

I found my Cobalt 200 priced right on top of what Channel wanted for a Crownline 216LS and it held it's value VERY well.

I'm trading up to a Cobalt 240 for next year, that's the reason it's being trade in.

...Jim

[DLBIV]

I have done bussiness with Meredith Marine for the past three years and they have been outstanding. Al and Mike in service ALWAYS bend over backwards to meet my needs. I purchased a new Doral in 2002 and all I can say is the qualty has been outstanding. Check them out! You are 100% correct in stating that after the purchase weather it be new or old the MOST Important thing is the service. Bad service can make for a bad lake experience. So the guys at Meredith Marine have always kept me a happy camper.

Captain Ron
Skipper of "DLB IV" Dad's last boat four! DLBV ( When it happens it will be a DORAL)

[fasttech]

Iwin Marine has been around since 1919 and has two locations in the lakes region one in Alton and one in Laconia. Valet service is available in Laconia and they have an awesome 20' Select with walk thru transom and MPI Mercury motor and drive.

[secondcurve]

Glove:

Before you buy I recommend that you consider moving up to 22 or 23 foot boat. I think anything under 22 feet is too small for Lake Winni. I was out this week and it was rough! People always tell me that they can get by with a smaller boat because they only plan to go out in ideal conditions. In theory, this approach would solve the problem. However, you must realize that weather changes quickly on the lake. You might find that after having lunch in Alton Bay, what was a calm ride down could suddenly switch and leave you faced with 2-3 foot seas and white caps as far as the eye can see on the ride back. It happens all the time to me! I saw a large cigarette boat on the lake this year and its name was "Size Matters". I'm not sure that the owner was speaking to the point I just outlined, but it is an appropriate consideration on the big lake. Do other boaters on the board agree with me?

[KevinPlante]

I have done the Valet thing at Channel Marine for a few years. I can't say enough good things about them. They have bent over backwards to help me in the past. My first time there, I pulled up with my truck and new boat on the trailer. I bought elsewhere because I got a deal I couldn't refuse. I had already coordinated to have the valet service for the year, but showed up out of nowhere to drop the boat off. When I got there, they were in the process of closing up for the night. There was only a salesman left, everyone else, including the fork lift operator, was gone for the night. My initial thought was that I would have to leave the boat and trailer there for them to take care of in the morning. Instead, the salesman (never met me, and I just pulled in with a brand new boat bought elsewhere) offered to ride with me to the ramp in Meredith and drive my truck back to Channel so I would have a chance to take the new toy for a ride. I took his offer and he never asked for anything in return.

Their location is something I like because 95% of the time it is very smooth there and it is very easy to dock there. The attendants pumping gas are easy on the eyes as well.

I definitely recommend Channel Marine. I wouldn't think twice about doing business with them.

[ThePlut]

I spent the whole year up on Winni in a 20'er. I both agree and disagree with secondcurve. I intentionally went for a 20 because I wanted something easy to tow and easy to manuver. There were definitely days where the ride was what I would call "active", but slowing down and having patience, I was still able to go everywhere on the lake, any day and any time I wanted to. I never felt unsafe or out of control even on the worst days I was out (and I was out there with the wife, 7 year old and 4 - 8 month old). That said, the Cobalt I bought was just about the heaviest and most solid (IMHO) 20' I could find and that is what drove my purchase. Plus, I could almost always find enough dock space to shoehorn a 20' boat in...

That said, when I saw the great opportunity for a 24', I went for it. Longer boat, heavier and a better ride because of it. I like to cruise around 30mph and wanted that to be a little less weather/conditions dependant...

So, I dunno, I suppose I think that it all leads to expectations. In a 20', expect to slow down, take it easy and plan to limit your distance on the worst of days (and find ways around the Governors/Weirs/Meredith area.

I put 61.5 hours on my 20' and had the best summer of my life. So, I really think it's about being realistic and setting expectations about what you will want/won't want to do.

[DLBIV]

I agree that you should consider at least a 24'. Even on the most perfect conditions the lake can be rough because on a perfect day implys a tremendous amount of boat traffic leading to rough water due to boats. I have been boating on Winni for around 16yrs and have seen the traffic increase expontentially. Ten years ago a 18'-20' would be ok but not now if you want to have a relaxing day with the family you should go for the 24'. What ever you end up with remember buying a boat is a very personal purchase. Make sure you test drive before you purchase that is the only way you will know how it rides.
Happy shopping!

Captain Ron "DLBIV"

[NHBUOY]

Hey GLOVE...Let me know when you are back in town... ...Jay

[Rinkerfam]

Glove,
I wish I had seen this post before today, but my laptop has been out for service for the last two weeks (major winni.com withdrawal). I don't know if you have made your decision(s) yet, but I thought I'd throw my two cents in anyway. First off I'd say go with a fuel injected engine. I've had both, and in my opinion fuel injection means better fuel economy and better throttle response. I know the newer carbs have a no prime feature that means instant start-up, but I still doubt that they can compare within the two categories I've mentioned.
Secondly, I think that you can get by on Winni with a 20 footer as long as it has sufficient freeboard. Simply put, greater freeboard=dryness and security (a must with little ones). The only catch here, is that with little ones you have a lot of "stuff" to bring on board and you can feel pretty cramped on a boat that size.
Third on my mind has to do with brand. All of the boats you mentioned are nice, but I'd say check out Rinker (no bias here ). Dollar for dollar they offer more features and they consistently are among the top choices in testing.
Lastly, I have to say that Paugus Bay Marina would be my pick hands down. I purchased my boat at Silver Sands and have it in valet storage at PBM and they have treated me like a v.i.p. since day one. They would even notice me pulling into the parking lot and have my boat out of the building by the time I got to the dock. They also went to bat for me with an outdrive problem that was outside of the manufacturers warranty and got it covered. Another time they fixed a fuel leak that was covered under warranty and billed Silver Sands so that I didn't have to worry about the logistics of getting the boat to the marina where I purchased it. I can't say enough good things about the guys that work the valet service. They were willing to do whatever was necessary to get us out on the lake. One time a low gear lube alarm went off when I first started my boat and the valet guys ran and got me a quart of gear lube and poured it in and had me on my way in less than five minutes. Another thing worth mentioning is that they always have a mechanic on duty on the weekends to help out with the valet customers.
Good luck, and let us all know what you decide to do.

[GTO]

Haven't heard Searay mentioned yet. I am in my 4th year with my 22 foote bowrider and because of its weight, it handles even rough water well. I would also reccommend Meredith Marina for service and winterization.

[Lakewinniboater]

I will put my two cents in....... I have had a 21' Four Winns, 28' Larson and now a Sea Ray.

I will say that the Sea Ray is a heavy, sturdy boat in my opinion. I loved my last two boats. However, this new one is FANTASTIC. Not only that but Irwin Marine has been the best to deal with so far.

I can elaborate more on types, styles, issue's and what not if you would like to email me at lakewinniboater@aol.com

Good luck,
Wendy

[Glove]

Okay, again, thanks to all for your great input. I found time to check out the Four Winns 220, but not the Monterrey 228 (Sorry codeman671 and Dave R).

Regarding comments that 20.5 footer is too small for Winni, I compared a 20.5 footer and a 23 footer today in fairly windy and rough conditions. Bigger is definitely better; however, the 20.5 (8.5 beam 21 degree deadrise) was satisfactory (with moderate caution), albeit a bit of a wet ride today. Given $$ issues, I don't feel pressed to size up tgo 23 or 24 feet. I also don't know that we'll end up permanently on Winnipesaukee (rather than Winnisquam or Sunapee).

As I mentioned before, these are all good boats; although none of them are the perfect boat for us, we would be fortunate to own any of them (Bryant, Four Winns, Crownline, Chaparral). I think the fact that we'd be happy with any of them is certainly beneficial to us. Despite each having their pros/cons for our needs, I must say that I really do like the Bryant. It seems to have more freeboard, and feels a bit safer with a 3 year old in rough waters.

All that having been said, I'm still looking for a bit more feedback on marinas. Anyone with experience at Melvin Village Marina or at Wolfeboro Marina?

[Fishy Cover]

I've owned 21 boats over the years and my Four Winns from Melvin Village Marina has been both the best boat and the best customer service of all. The boat has been perfect-- only one loose screw in a hatch in over 1 year, and the marina people have been superb. I live on Meredith Neck and have had much better service from Tom & crew at Melvin Village than at the local marinas.

[jrc]

My parents slipped their Four Winns cuddy cabin there for several years. But this was about ten years ago, so I'l stick to stuff that should still be true.

They loved the ownership and staff, they were always treated with respect and friendship. The place was always clean and neat. There is a nice little beach right there. They loved their boat, a 22 footer, and never found it too small for the lake. They slept on it and in that way it was too small.

On the other side, it is a little remote, especially by car. By boat you better get a Bizer map and learn how to read the markers before you venture out between the islands

There is a huge shallow sandbar out in front of the marina. So there was always a debate on how to get over it. We would either idle out with the drive trimmed up or try to get over it on plane.

If there is any wind at all there will be chop in Melvin bay. This didn't limit the times they went out but it can be irritating.

[ThePlut]

Bryant makes a great boat, they have a very loyal following. I looked at the 200 when I was looking. Only think I don't like about the 206 was the funky rear bench seat shape...

I would still encourage you to take a ride in a Cobalt 200 though. More deadrise and heavier, very high freeboard. Pricewise, I don't think you'll find they're that far out from a Bryant, if at all.

Just $0.02.

Definitely won't be displeased with a Bryant though.

...Jim

[SAMIAM]

Glove...I encourage you to consider a 24" if you plan to bring the wife and kids out.....the first time you get caught on the broads in a 20'er with a strong northwest wind,she's not going to be happy.Over the years I've had a Seacraft,Northamerican and Donzi......all in the 20' range......they are all fun to bang around in with the guys,but wife and kiddies weren't comfortable until i got a 24'

[escaped from NJ]

Don't have much experience, having just had our boat since Aug, but Melvin Village Marina has been great so far. Their service department has twice helped me "fix" stuff by phone. Very gracious! Really nice people. We have a 21' Four Winn that we haven't had any trouble with, even in rough water and we are definitely newbies. On Oct 16 in a storm, had to travel back to Melvin Marina and it was really rough but the boat handled well.

[beaner]

If you're a complete novice, have you considered renting a few times before you buy? It's a lot less hassle...no worries about maintenance, winter storage, etc. The boat will be at the dock and ready to go when you arrive. If you don't have a lot of time to devote to boating, renting is actually less expensive per boating day. And it's a great way to test out the marina's services in the event you do end up buying. Just a thought.

[Dave R]

Since this will be boat number one for you, plan for additional expenses for things like anchors and rode (you'll need 2 if you plan to hang out at any of the popular spots), fenders, dock lines, comfortable PFDs, guest PFDs, spare prop, tools, spare parts, fuses, VHF radio, etc. It adds up quickly. Ebay is wonderful for this stuff, but it may pay in the long run to use a local supplier since good local advice has immeasurable value.

If you can afford it, a chartplotter and Bizer C-map cartridge can make the lake a vastly more forgiving place to operate a boat as a novice. Not trying to frighten you, but many folks that get around on other lakes in the US, consider Winnipesaukee one of the toughest lakes to navigate. I have been boating on it since I was a kid and use a chartplotter.

Once you have your boat, see if you can go boating with someone who knows the lake, the laws, and practices common courtesy the first few times.

[fasttech]

Check out the SeaRays at Irwin Marine their service department can not be beat, Jason the service manager is fantastic and what ever you want or need he will take care of it in a heart beat. As for the sales department they don't just sell you the new boat they will take you out and give you a lesson untill you feel comfortable. Oh and need I forget SeaRays come with lines, anchor & rope, life vests, fire X, and more.

[codeman671]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Since this will be boat number one for you, plan for additional expenses for things like anchors and rode (you'll need 2 if you plan to hang out at any of the popular spots), fenders, dock lines, comfortable PFDs, guest PFDs, spare prop, tools, spare parts, fuses, VHF radio, etc. It adds up quickly.

Some of the dealers will include a safety package when buying a new boat, Shep Brown's for instance includes all necessary items to satisfy marine patrol/coast guard regulations depending on if you are staying on the lake or down on the ocean. Right down to the ridiculous bell that is still necessary on larger boats...Anchor and rope, fenders and dock lines too!

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by codeman671

Some of the dealers will include a safety package when buying a new boat, Shep Brown's for instance includes all necessary items to satisfy marine patrol/coast guard regulations depending on if you are staying on the lake or down on the ocean. Right down to the ridiculous bell that is still necessary on larger boats...Anchor and rope, fenders and dock lines too!

Well, that's wonderful news. In my opinion, boats should be sold with this stuff included but with a "buyer delete" option available in case the buyer already has everything needed (my garage looks like a chandlery so I'd likely use the delete if buying new).

[ThePlut]

Originally Posted by Dave R

Once you have your boat, see if you can go boating with someone who knows the lake, the laws, and practices common courtesy the first few times.

This has proved itself to be immeasureably true! Thanks Dave!!!



Have to agree with Dave on this one. My boat came with a "coast guard kit" of fenders, lines, anchor, vests, flares, etc... I've bought more of just about everything in my first year, bigger fenders, nicer lines, longer rode, second anchor, useable vests, etc...

What they give you will get you on the water, but as you use your boat, there will be more, there's always more...

Bust
Out
Another
Thousand.

...Jim

[Will]

I would second a look at the Dorals. I think the quality is very high and the service over at meredith is top notch. Give them a look, you wont be dissapointed.

[cowisl]

Go to Bill or Jim at Channel Marine. They will steer you in the right direction.

[Glove]

Okay folks. Again, thanks to all for taking the time to provide advice and information. We are now in the midst of finalizing our purchase and marina...but more to follow on that in a later posting once the deal is "finalized."

On another website, I found a list of items that a new boat owner should consider that I'll paste here.

Also, I'll look around for some folks to show me around the lake. Here's the list I found:

Gotta haves:
- First Aid kit,
- Flares can come in handy (required in some places)
- Marine Fire Extinguisher
- Type IV PFD (this is the throwable type)
- Mooring lines (at least 2 but would recommend 4)
- Fenders (at least 2 with lines)
- Large Flashlight
- boot hook

Not required but will keep you from having a bad on the water:
A spares kit
- Extra prop with hub kit,
- Extra hull drain plug,
- Spare fuses,
- Extra light bulbs for nav lights,
- Extra engine hose clamps,
- Engine oil,
- PS fluid,
- I/O fluid,
- Power Trim fluid

Toolkit
- Prop Wrench,
- Wrenches,
- Socket set,
- screw drivers,
- Pliers,
- Grease gun with extra grease,
- Duct tape
- Any other tool that you think you might need

Nice to haves
- VHS radio
- GPS
- Fish finder

[EllyPoinster]

I bought a new Four Winns from Melvin Village Marina a few years back with no regrets. Great people to deal with, especially Tom in the sales office and Rob in the maintenance shop. They really came through when my boat broke away from its mooring in heavy winds. It wound up on some rocks - no structural damage but badly chipped, scratched and gouged. I was crushed. When I called Tom he said "I have some good news, some bad news and some more good news. Good news: we can fix it like new. Bad news: it is very expensive. More good news: your insurance company will pay for most of it (after deductable)."

He was right on all counts. Rob took the extra step to shoot 20+ digital pictures of the damage for the insurance claim. Since the work did not need to be done right away I held off until the end of the season and took advantage of the nice discount they offer on off-season labor charges. The savings covered storage and winterization.

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Glove

{snip} On another website, I found a list of items that a new boat owner should consider that I'll paste here.
Gotta haves:
- First Aid kit,
- Flares can come in handy (required in some places)
- Marine Fire Extinguisher
- Type IV PFD (this is the throwable type)
- Mooring lines (at least 2 but would recommend 4)
- Fenders (at least 2 with lines)
- Large Flashlight
- boot hook

Toolkit
- Prop Wrench,
- Wrenches,
- Socket set,
- screw drivers,
- Pliers,
- Grease gun with extra grease,
- Duct tape
- Any other tool that you think you might need

Under required you'll also have to have an anchor and rode (I'd get 150') and an approved PFD for each person aboard. I would definitely get 4 lines (double braided nylon, 3/8" is good for this size boat) for docking, you may wish to use spring lines at times. Don't skimp on fender size, get largest diameter you can reasonably store. To make things easy also get some method to attach fenders to your boat in differing locations ala clips or rail clamps or suction cups. If you're out at night I like to have small flashlights for each person on board. And don't get the the flares that are like highway flares, even if they are marine. Get the aerial flares. You don't want hot flaming stuff to drip on your fiberglass

Tool kit is good though I think the grease gun is overkill. Get some wireties/zip thingees in various sizes. They are good emergency clamps. I also have a cheapo digital multimeter to check voltages and such. Have spare batteries for any thing that runs on batteries.

[jrc]

Gotta haves:
A Safe Boater Education Certificate (this coming year if your under about 42)
http://www.boat-ed.com/nh/handbook/whomayoperate.htm

an anchor with line (8-12 lb danforth type)
a chart or map (I like Bizer)

Not required but will keep you from having a bad on the water:

another anchor (slightly smaller danforth ) really needed if you want to visit crowded sandbars

[Island Girl]

Paper towels
Plastic spoons and bowls.... for when you go to Wolfeboro and buy some Ben & Jerry's at the grocery store and go out into the harbor and dish it out and eat it slowly while cruising. Priceless!

IG

[Woodsy]

You guys forgot one of the most important pieces of equipment... duct tape! LOL!

The number of life jackets on board should equal or exceed the number of people your boat is rated to carry. They make some nice life jacket bags to hold them. I also have an officials whistle in case I have to signal someone. At 110 or so decibels, it tends to get some attention quick.

Anyway, if it were me, make sure you get a nice GPS with whatever boat you buy. Make sure it takes the Winni C-Map chip. It will help you to get oriented to the lake while making sure to keep you from skippering off into a hazard! You should still carry a good Bizer Map.


Woodsy

[Dave R]

Originally Posted by Island Girl

Paper towels
Plastic spoons and bowls.... for when you go to Wolfeboro and buy some Ben & Jerry's at the grocery store and go out into the harbor and dish it out and eat it slowly while cruising. Priceless!

IG

Excellent suggestion. We keep ours in a big Rubbermaid round container sized for a cake or big salad. It holds plates, napkins and plastic flatware nicely and can stay in the boat all the time.

We also bought cases of relish, ketchup, mustard and mayo packets to keep on board. They are far easier that dealing with jars and plastic bottle of stuff. We keep them in a small Rubbermaid container and replenish it as needed.

If you can mount it and store it easily, a marine gas grill is awesome. We have a Magma 17" party kettle grill and love it. Ours mounts near the transom in a fishing rod holder so that it is over water while in use. It also converts to a powerful single burner stove and is great for making coffee in a stainless steel percolator we bought at a kitchen store. Might seem like a silly little thing to have, but if you are like us, you'll find it's money well spent and will add to the amount of time you can spend on the water.

Be sure to get a bimini with the boat too. Shade is nice in July and August.

[Mee-n-Mac]

I forgot ... probably a good idea to have a manual bilge pump just in case. Also a large paddle to manually power your boat just in case. I also recommend some of those pullover rain coats in a pouch should you get caught out in a storm. OK that's 3 items, pick the 2 you like

[gtxrider]

You will also need water skis, wake board, knee board, tube, tow ropes, ski gloves, water ballon sling shot...Just remeber the list is endless. ENJOY the new TOY. There are hours of memories to be made on the lake hopefully all fond!

[Island Girl]

You will need a digital camera to record all of this fun. Windbreakers, hats and gloves to ride in the early spring and fall when the lake is incredibly beautiful.. and quiet.

.. and lots of money for gas!

[secondcurve]

Glove:

I came across this old post and thought about you and your young family. It pertains to a storm that ripped through Winnipesaukee just after the Fourth of July in 1999. I'll say it one last time....bigger is better!

I think the advice that other members have given about boating accessories is fairly comprehensive. I would add an air horn to replace the whistle requirement mandated by the state. It is much more effective in a situation where you have to alert another boater of your position.


I was in the Broads during that storm... I was never and have never been as scared as I was that day. I was in our smaller boat going from Cow Island to Wolfeboro with my husband and two sons. One of my son's was only 7 months old. The other was almost 2 years. My husband did an amazing job getting us to safety. It was sunny one moment and, then, the sky got really black and it started pouring... then came the hail (sp?). I am a spiritual-type person but, I believe more in about being a good person than about organized religion but, I can tell you that, while I was in that little boat holding my two boys, I was praying to God. We managed to get into Winter Harbor and my husband found an empty dock... I still have no idea how he found it as we could not see but 4 feet in front of us. (He was going to beach the boat and hope we did not hit a rock.) He had to keep the boat with the storm because if he tried to turn, the boat would rock and nearly capsize. The waves in the broads were at least 6 feet... maybe some more than that.... (My neighbor says they were 6-8 feet coming from Moultonboro Bay to Cow Island and were hitting his house from the water.) Well, we managed to get to a dock. My husband tells the story like this:

"I was going to try to beach it and hope we could get to shore. I happened to see an empty dock but had no idea how we were going to dock the boat with all the wind and the current, waves, etc. Then, a big wave came up behind the boat and pushed us right into the U-shaped dock. Almost as though something had lifted us, like a hand, and we landed softly at the dock."

I ran to the nearest house. Amazingly, no one was home and it looked as though no one had been up there since last year. There were sheets on the couches and other furniture. (Like the caretaker had not opened the house for the owners, yet.) I knocked but knew no one was home. I ran to the house next door and, before I could even finish my sentence, the nice, older woman came out and was running down to her neighbors dock... she heard me say my two little boys and she just said where and started running. She helped me carry them to the house while my husband tied the boat, tightly. Her husband and her kept us at her house until the storm broke. We thanked them profusely. The weird thing is that I have been trying to remember their name as I wanted to drop them off a token to let them know how thankful we are (were) but, I cannot.

I have written a post previously about this experience... and the events, etc. We sold that boat almost immediately and purchased a Grady White. Not that a bigger boat would have been any better but, I feel safer driving around in the Grady and, if a storm does kick up (as it always does on Winni) and we are out on the water, we will not capsize... the little Well Craft was a great little boat but, when water started pouring in over the side and from the open bow... I was scared to death. I prayed and sang to my children... it did not seem to bother them... as far as they could see everything was "ok". My husband said I never moved just trusted him and held my boys tightly. Now, Brian is almost 6 and Brodie is 4.5. We haven;t been in another storm like that one. Hopefully never are again.

My father knows of a family from Tewksbury who died in a storm on Winni. The boat capsized with 4 people on it and only one person survived. I believe their names were the DeCarlis' (but am not 100% sure). I believe the wife survived because her husband saved her but, then he went to save her parents and he could not do it.

I see storms coming, now, on Winni, and I watch the boats and think... I hope they get out of the water. Some seem to be headed for safety... others, who are less enlightened, seem to continue water skiing, tubing or just boating. I hope they do not learn the hard way.

[HotDog]

LAKEPORT LANDING MARINA!

[ApS]

Originally Posted by secondcurve

"...
I see storms coming, now, on Winni, and I watch the boats and think... I hope they get out of the water. Some seem to be headed for safety... others, who are less enlightened, seem to continue water skiing, tubing or just boating. I hope they do not learn the hard way.

1) This week was the 30th observation of the sinking of the Edmund Fitzgerald, a 704-foot freighter in a lake storm. Seems big enough.

On the anniversary-date, a caller to Coast2CoastAM radio program — now a truckdriver — said he just missed being a crewmember on that day 30 years ago, and that the captain had a poor record compared to the previous captain: Shortcuts were the rule.

2) I use two low-tech checks for the weather: an AM radio (for the forecast, and for "crackles"), and an observation of the upper and lower cloud-layer's movements relative to one another. (Buys Ballot's Law).

As is the case with aircraft, it is the weather that can determine one's fate, and not the size of the craft.

Originally Posted by secondcurve

"...
I came across this old post and thought about you and your young family. It pertains to a storm that ripped through Winnipesaukee just after the Fourth of July in 1999. I'll say it one last time....bigger is better!

In the same thread was this post:

"We were in anchored in Johnson cove that day and remember it quite vividly. I was in my 28 ft cruiser rafting with friends in there 41 footer. Bow and Stern firmly anchored. When the storm came visibity went down to zero and the wind got ferocious. The wind spun both boats around in circles several times and pushed us towards the rocks on shore. We had to make a choice, get washed up onto the rocks or fire up the motor and power off with the risk of tangling the anchor lines in the props. We opted to cut the anchors and fire up one engine. Visibility was zero so all we could do was try to keep the boats off the rocks but were unable to go anywhere else. When the storm finally ended we found that we had suffered very little damage. For two weeks following the storm we donned scuba gear looking for our anchors. We finally did find the anchors all twisted up about 200 yards from where we had initally anchored that day."

[secondcurve]

Aceres per Second:

I agree that one should be experienced, have a well equipped boat and watch the weather. However, sometimes you are just in the wrong place at the wrong time and it helps to have a larger, sea worthy vessel. You will note that the lady who told her story about almost sinking in the July 1999 storm upgraded to a Grady White. That boat is typically found on the ocean. Size does count and the bigger the better if you can afford the upgrade. Enough said.

[Senter Cove Guy]

You will not find a better run marina anywhere - that's anywhere as in "ANYWHERE - PERIOD".

I've been a sliprenter there since 1981 and the way it was run back then is the way it's still being run. Some of the personnel have changed but the friendliness and the service are top-notch, ALWAYS!

[Grant]

This spring, my brother and I had a problem with a REALLY old tank and fuel line for the little dingy we let the kids drive around. The guys at Melvin took the time to remove the old coupling from the original hose and re-mount it on the new hose...a very time-consuming process at a time when they were busy preparing boats for spring launching. Very helpful and friendly.

[Glove]

Okay thanks to all for your words of wisdom, which I appreciate. Needless to say, a lot of factors go into the purchase of one's first boat, and one has to accept various limitations and compromises (e.g. no "perfect boat"). That having been said, we purchased a Crownline 216LS bowrider (22 feet with swim platform), Mercruiser 5.0 MPI alpha/aluminum, and will be using Channel Marine for valet. Many of the boats we looked at were great....it's just too bad that we can only buy one of them!

Everyone's additions to the list of gotta-haves is helpful. This winter will be Ebay mania. (For now though, we'll pass on the marine gas grill.)

To JRC - Based on our age, neither my wife nor I have to pass the Safe Boater Education Certificate until January 2007, but will do so this winter anyway.

Now on to GPS navigation/chartplotter. I've decided on Navman 5500 rather than the Standard Horizon CP155 (both will take a C-MAP chip, and I'll purchase the Bizer Winni-chip). I just have to decide whether to get the one with external versus integrated antenna, and how to mount it so it doesn't obscure any of the dashboard instrument gauges.

Nonetheless, we'll see if can get someone from Channel Marine to take us out once to show us the "hidden but important" subtleties of the lake and its navigation.

Spring seems so far away...the only consolation is that I have plenty of time to work on the truck and snowblower.

Thanks for welcoming us to the forum.

[NHBUOY]

...You get a secret de-coder ring AND the magical mystery cruise too!... ...Congratulations on your fine choice of watercraft, and have a HAPPY THANKSGIVING...noweskioui?..Jay.. ...

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Glove

{snip} Nonetheless, we'll see if can get someone from Channel Marine to take us out once to show us the "hidden but important" subtleties of the lake and its navigation.

Spring seems so far away...the only consolation is that I have plenty of time to work on the truck and snowblower.

Thanks for welcoming us to the forum.

Congrats on the new toy. Come Spring I'm sure if you ask here you will find some willing "tour guides" to ease your way onto the Lake. WRT to the GPS and all else being the same, I do like the idea of an integrated (vs separate) antenna. No co-ax to run and no holes to cut Also on your winter list of things to get is a lake chart so you can commit it to memory before ice out. There will be a test !

[jrc]

Originally Posted by Glove

To JRC - Based on our age, neither my wife nor I have to pass the Safe Boater Education Certificate until January 2007, but will do so this winter anyway.

It can't hurt, I did it early too. I actually learned a few things, which is tough to imagine because my wife says I'm a know it all

Originally Posted by Glove

Now on to GPS navigation/chartplotter. I've decided on Navman 5500 rather than the Standard Horizon CP155 (both will take a C-MAP chip, and I'll purchase the Bizer Winni-chip). I just have to decide whether to get the one with external versus integrated antenna, and how to mount it so it doesn't obscure any of the dashboard instrument gauges.

Most people have found that the internal antenna works great on open boats, like yours. So why fuss with mounting an antenna. Obscuring the instruments was a problem for me as well. There is no clean answer on many boats. The GPS will have a speedometer which will be more accurate than your boats, so maybe you can block the boats speedometer. Someone on this board can up with that idea.

Originally Posted by Glove

Spring seems so far away...the only consolation is that I have plenty of time to work on the truck and snowblower.

I bought a new boat this fall as well, so I know how you feel.

[Dave R]

Congrats on the new boat! Ought to a be a sweet ride. Get the integrated antenna, I wish I had. Waste of time and money putting an external one on my boat. Oh well...

PM me if you want a "tour guide", we like to meet people and explore the lake.

[ThePlut]

Congrats, the 216LS is a great boat.

Get the 5500i (internal antenna). The internal antenna works fine on the lake, it's what I had all summer and will install in my new boat in the spring. Makes the wiring a piece of cake once you figure out how and where to mount it. Where I mounted mine last year, I obscured a few of the gauges a little when I was fully seated, but since I drive on the flip up bolster looking over the windshield most of the time, it wasn't a problem... Take that into consideration...

What other options did you end up getting? What color? I love to hear about boats, got any pics???

More reasons to look forward to next summer.

And Dave R is a great tour guide, plus his boat breaks the chop pretty well leading to a smooth ride while following

[Glove]

Here is the boat:

2005 Crownline 216LS (dealer's photos are posted...I was too much of a dufus to remember to take any photographs)

5.0L 260HP Mercruiser alpha (3 blade aluminum prop), spinale wine color (e.g. very fancy name for maroon), swim platform, depth guage, extra stereo speakers, wood dash, docking lights, key chain remote control for courtesy lightsoarding lights, forward boarding ladder, table, bimini, etc.

I didn't buy a trailer for now...we'll consider that in the future depending on our needs.

...Looking forward to spring....

...but as NHBUOY says, now its time for skiing....I just found the ski I want to demo this winter (Rossignol Zenith Z9 Oversize TPI), and then buy. ...heh heh, good thing I save *so much* money on the boat....

[jrc]

I love the color, (wine/maroon) with the bright white looks real sharp. Please tell me about the "key chain remote control for courtesy lightsoarding lights" I've never heard of that. (I'm not making fun of the typos)

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by jrc

I love the color, (wine/maroon) with the bright white looks real sharp. Please tell me about the "key chain remote control for courtesy lightsoarding lights" I've never heard of that. (I'm not making fun of the typos)

I'll guess the remote turns on/off the boarding & interior courtesy lights like a car key fob does the alarm and door locks. It's a kewl idea but I hadn't heard boat manufacturers were doing this. Kudos to Crownline if I'm correct. Now we need a blower switch that runs them for 4-5 mins and then shuts off automagically (with an indicator light to tell you the cycle is complete). Lastly I'd like somebody to do a 1 touch up/down control for the trim tabs, like the option you have on power windows. I've designed the latter for the standard Bennett trim tabs but have been too lazy to build the device.

[gtxrider]

The boat looks shnazzy! Good luck on the lake and watch for Captain Bonehead!

Mac, Patent the idea, become rich, build a big estate....

[Glove]

Yeah...sorry for the typos. I didn't mean to refer to any "lightswords." Indeed the keychain has a remote that turns on/off the courtesy lights to assist with boarding and disembarking (whoa...fancy word for a newby). I don't know yet if this neat idea will be useful for us or not..."it comes with the boat." I like the idea of auto-up or down for the trim tab. Sounds like a winner to me.

Okay gang...there are a LOT of inner tubes on Ebay. For what am I really looking? I want something that my 7 and 4 year olds will feel wild in, but their parents will feel is exceedingly safe. Here are some pictures of the offerings:

Thanks very much for your thoughts,

[Mee-n-Mac]

Originally Posted by Glove

Okay gang...there are a LOT of inner tubes on Ebay. For what am I really looking? I want something that my 7 and 4 year olds will feel wild in, but their parents will feel is exceedingly safe. Here are some pictures of the offerings:

Thanks very much for your thoughts,

Friends of ours have a 2 person Patriot Duo (? or is it Duo Patriot ?). It's a good sized ovoid inflatable with 2 separate, side by side seats. Seems to be very stable going over wakes and still can get a lot of air. I don't have a picture to post but you can view it at the link below. Look through a catalog (Overtons, West Marine, etc) and you can find a lot of these things.

http://www.sportsauthority.com/sm-sp...i-2034504.html

[jrc]

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

I'll guess the remote turns on/off the boarding & interior courtesy lights like a car key fob does the alarm and door locks. It's a kewl idea ...

That's my guess as well, sound like a good idea, wish I thought of it.

Originally Posted by Mee-n-Mac

Now we need a blower switch that runs them for 4-5 mins and then shuts off automagically...

Yes, should be standard.

[jrc]

Be carefull with any duals. You need one observer over 13 years old for each person on the tube. The boat driver can't be the observer so with two adults and two kids you really can't utilize a dual. If you get one make sure it will ride straight with just one passenger.